You see him sitting on the bollard in the parking lot eating his hoagie with the paper spread out on his lap, that is quite frankly heinous - a parking lot hoagie is properly eaten over the rubbish bins with the paper spread out across it. And you see a gatorade along with the hoagie - this would simply not be done. Coffee, iced tea (Arctic Splash if you're in Port Richmond) yes. Gatorade, no.
@@jec222 At the end of the day I don't really think any network is going to fund money into enhancing silver that a small population actually pay attention to. They'll be saving that money for all the extras in the large crowd scenes where they have to pay everyone on set.
In the first scene, I always took the footmen pouring the tea as a sign of how upset the Queen was at her. She herself wouldn’t pour the tea for her, and having footmen do it shows that she has greater power and is above her. Edit: Same for eating quickly. She didn’t want to spend much time on her.
I personally think that all the errors were intentional. For example, the reason why the footmen poured the tea for both The Queen and Jackie was because of Jackie’s comments. Jackie stated that she found Buckingham Palace dull and like a provincial hotel. So, as William said that the tea pouring was very hotel-like, it was a perfect Easter egg, pointing to the fact that the Queen knew every comment made. As for the other etiquette errors in this meeting, they all contributed to the fact that this was not a state dinner. It was an informal meeting.
I feel like the vast majority of the things pointed out here can be explained by the setting and tone of the scene. The queen didn't pour the tea or offer milk for the same reason that there were guards all over the place. She's hurt, and is snapping out in the ways she can. The quick buttering of the scone shows how she desperately wants this meeting over. Yes, faux pas. But not oversight. The etiquette consultant they employed on set was very good and definitely wouldn't have allowed it if there wasn't good cause.
What complete nonsense. The queen’s staff and the queen herself don’t get this stuff wrong. And your reference to guards is a complete joke. They’re called liveried servants. HM’s guards are big chaps with big guns and distinctive headgear. They don’t pour tea.
@@davidcockayne3381 I'm aware of the difference between the Queens Guard and Footmen. At the very beginning of this scene Jackie Kennedy almost gets run over by the Queens Guard. You should keep in mind that this is from a television show. Are liberties taken? Of course. But of you take it in context with the tone of the scene it makes a lot more sense.
The point of this video is to show correct and incorrect etiquette, NOT to explain a scene. Regardless of how you feel about a person, if she is a guest, you cannot be impolite. Even if the details of this scene were all deliberate to show what is happening, the point remains that incorrect etiquette was shown.
@@krdiaz8026 I agree. The etiquette is incorrect. I just feel like context is important as well, so you don't leave thus video thinking the Crown is a terribly made show with no regards to the truth.
@@krdiaz8026 Absolutely. It seems to be a lesson we have largely lost in the West, especially in the Anglo-Saxon world. Etiquette demonstrates politeness and politeness demonstrates a fundamental respect for the other person.
I think she was buttering the scone like that so furiously because she was pissed, so it seemed more like an acting choice. She also could have (as a character) deliberately went against etiquette because Jacqueline's criticism of her was that she was too stuffy and "middle-aged" so it was a subtle way for her to break etiquette.
@@edronc2007 actually they put a lot of thought into the details that the main audience may not really notice, just because they didn’t hire this guy doesn’t mean they don’t put lol he's not the only consultant in the world. When analyzing etiquette it is important to take context and symbolism into account, what this meant in the relationship of one character to the other, these things are consciously taken into consideration
@@jessica5497 Well Netflix obviously doesnt care about correctness. Manners and etiquette are very important - it is courtesy; something that appears to be lacking at times these days.
Oh my god william you absolute queen. "Probably produced the day before...dare i even say shop bought by netflix..." 😂😂 It is my life's mission to have afternoon tea with you one day and go for a little evening shop in harrods after 😍
Damn I love William Hanson. Absolutely riveting. Although I have to admit I would be afraid to eat anything around him and with him less I make a mistake.
'Less' you make a mistake...? I shall believe that you did of course write 'lest' and blame the bizarre whims of autocorrect for the schoolboy error ;)
With all of those detailed rules of etiquette, why would anyone join the British for tea? I always thought that the purpose for etiquette rules was to help make company feel comfortable by understanding what behavior is expected. I guess I was wrong. No one outside of British royalty would feel welcome in that demanding atmosphere.
@@edronc2007 In fact, she would in the context of this scene and the scenes before. It comes after Mrs Kennedy insulted Buckingham Palace and called it drab. In the scene directly before this, The Queen pulled out all of the stops to make sure there was an abundance of staff and guards in Windsor.
c mon you dont need to say Her Majesty.. we all know that queens and kings don´t exist, really. It´s a crazy convention in XXI century -and an expensive one for the citizens of some European countries
my 93 year old mother could not stand Downtown Abbey because she thought it was so unrealistic and rules and etiquette disregarded or poorly portrayed. She loves The Crown though. Don't we all
Totally agree with all your observations; the only thing re: the footmen - the episode shows that the Queen was trying to intimidate Jackie as a retaliation after she said several critical things in public about the run down state of the palace. My guess is that that's why she had them pour.
I think it's mostly because absolute majority of viewers know fuck all about Royal Etiquette and its intricacies, therefore such small details, while important and somewhat integral to the proper representation of the character, may simply go over our heads. Even if the consultant was there, I doubt it would make the difference for the audience. At least for the majority.
the reason the queen did NOT pour her tea; had to do with the context of their meeting. Jackie had been talking shit about her so she ha Jackie meet her in a fortress NOT the palace and paraded her military around Jackie. This was done to create distance due to huge disrespect Jackie gave.
@@joantollerton9905 Common as in many - aristocratic families used charger plates, that's why they were made. 'Common' folk often used newspaper, not tablecloths.
I think they did pretty much everything on purpose to emphasise how mad the queen actually was and how tense the whole situation was. Of course, it is unrealistic for the queen to lay all etiquette aside, even if she’s pissed asf, but guys, this is a DRAMA SERIES...of course they’ll exaggerate. This UA-cam video was still interesting please make this whole thing a series i’d binge watch it😩
She was born into it. It’s not like she has to force it. For her it comes out naturally just as it is for you to drink water from a glass instead of a bowl or holding a fork.
Always amuses me when people say regarding the Queen” She can’t do what she likes in the simplest of ways”!!!To her this is simple!This is how she was taught & raised so it is simple for her! Also we all have rules for want of a better word in our own homes don’t we? Most times they have become such a way of life we don’t even notice them anymore! I am no snob or etiquette expert but if you come to dine at my home I will have a tablecloth on the table the table will be set & I always use real napkins. Sone people have accused me of being posh no it’s not posh it’s the way I choose to live in my own home. Oh & if you notice the Queen dos not inflict her way of doing things on her guest because that would be rude & make her guest uncomfortable but in the big things yes there are standards in the Royal home just like we have in our own homes which of course is our right!!!!
Following rules of etiquette at table wouldn’t be weird or objectionable to the Queen. It’s just her life, the way she has always known it. It would be no different to her than the habits we have in our own lives.
As a complete and utter stickler for accuracy both for historical and modern day historical shows, I am enthralled and will be bingeing this channel. William, you are enchanting.
I feel like some of the actions in this scene were to do with the tension between the two because everything you see Claire Foy acting out builds tension. That said, I love these styles of videos as it is always interesting to learn more about etiquette.
I realized she was a little rough with spreading the butter but I thought the director was trying to convey that she was upset about the rumor and anxious for Jackie's explanation.
It’s funny how he’s criticizing this scene when this scene is suppose to be like this, it’s suppose to throw out the traditional way because the queen is upset and is trying to intimidate Jackie Kennedy because prior to this scene Jackie was being disrespectful to the proper ways they were doing things
Half of these choices seem like honest trivial mistakes (i.e., triangular sandwiches and waiters pouring tea) but a lot of it seems like either practical necessities for filming (dull pewter instead of bright silver that can screw up the cameras and lighting) or symbolic (a lot of passive aggressive actions by Elizabeth that this guy seems to be reading as simple goofs when actually they seem to be purposefully intended to impart tension, regardless of whether the Queen in real life would have ever engaged in such petty behavior-it communicates the mood to the audience, and that's more important than being perfectly accurate).
I agree that these things were done to show the tension. But they don't feel true to character. The real queen would have tried her best to be polite, even if glacially polite. It's part of her persona, and if you get that wrong, then what's the point to get the feeling of the scene right?
I know...the scone thing seemed quite obvious to me. They even have a convenient break through the middle to help you! No knives needed at all. Perhaps they should consult you for scenes like this . Adds a good level of detail .
There is one major point missed in this whole thing: the royal family is known to be rather naff, actually. The queen probably didn't give a Corgi's bottom for etiquette outside public displays.
Sandwiches at Buckingham Palace are served with no crusts, and a rectangular shape, I know because years ago my Mums friend had tea at the Palace, and after she reported back to Mum how the sandwiches were served, that's how our sandwiches were served thereafter :-)
They have the Queen chowing down like she hasn’t eaten in months. Never seeming to offer anything to the guest. Also mrs Kennedy hair is way too long and dishevelled. “It just won’t do.”
I fully understand and appreciate Mr. Hanson's dissection of this particular scene, however I do agree with a number of the contributors that this is a scene full of nuances and deliberate misdirection for Mrs Kennedy. If nothing more than for the drama this series wants to convey.
@@kaitlin2400 When experts are employed in film and TV production, they are not given final say over anything. The etiquette expert may have got everything right only to have been overruled by the director. William was an etiquette expert on "Red, White & Royal Blue" and they didn't follow all his advice; the makers of "The Crown" wouldn't have, either.
Sadly, few people study etiquette anymore. I remember when Prince Charles and Lady Diana became engaged. I was a young girl who was so impressed by Diana that I asked my mother for a book of etiquette for my sixteenth birthday. I memorized it, hoping to learn how to be a proper lady and never be perceived as gauche. When I watched this scene in The Crown, I cringed at how awkward and "down-home" Claire Foy portrayed the Queen at this tea and how clumsily this scene was staged. Thank you for this video commentary.
@@edenassos Why does it matter? Etiquette is about doing things in a slower way to get away from the fast pace of the outside world. The reason etiquette has dwindled, or more accurately has died in the lower classes, is because people don't know how to slow down
@@edenassos i don't think that the problem is the whole idea of ettiquette. i think it's just that what we think of as "good" etiquette is old fashioned when really times have changed and the "proper" way to behave has changed too. It isn't described in Victorian books because just as they didn't have email and social media their etiquette responded to a different society and environment. there is no point doing things "properly" if it just makes things more difficult and makes people uncomfortable
@@juliehock6059 That's pretty obvious, isn't it? It goes without saying you don't put your leg on the dinner table, I'm talking about the over-the-top ones.
For all the people who are commentating about how "if the queen was in a bad mood ...etc". Etiquette is second nature, bad mood or not. There is no other way to do things. They're all taught this the minute they can hold a knife and fork properly. The children arent allowed to eat with the queen until they have learnt proper table manners. And they don't slob out when no-ones looking. After years of seeing people in private homes eating I can tell you that it just feels wrong and very naughty to butter a whole roll or cut into a roll to add butter. It's called indoctrination.
I was an extra on a film production in a restaurant scene. The plate of pasta with white sauce and halved grape tomatoes placed in front of each us was cold and we were told it was meant for show, not eating.
I love your adamant demand that scones are light and warm... I recently obtained a recipie for buttermilk scones, and it is amazing how light and fluffy and delicious they are! I just need some clotted cream in my life.
Whenever I hear William Hanson speak I realize how many correct etiquette lessons my mother taught us by example. Sadly, some of these things I’ve neglected, becoming I’m afraid rather uncouth. 😱
Don't be to hard on the producers. It must be incredibly difficult to get all those little details right. Overall The Crown is so very beautiful and well-made.
With etiquette it's always interesting to find out if there's actually a rational, sensible reason behind the rule, or if it's "We do it because we have been doing it like this for centuries and we don't care that society is different now, and generally we are nitpickers who don't care about what's important." This is, I think, mostly the latter and... kind of ridiculous.
As someone working in film, I can tell you that producers rarely make these errors by accident. It grabs the attention of the high maintenance viewer, who is actually part of the target audience. The high maintenance viewer is a producer’s dream, because they are very proactive in expressing critique, which is basically free PR. If someone tells you: ‘They got everything wrong in these series!’, you are more inclined to watch it out of curiosity than when someone is raving about it.
One more thing to add: To the best of my knowledge, the cups used in the scene were for coffee not for tea. In all traditional sets of china there would be a difference in shape.
I appreciate that you know your stuff. But I think the main focus in this scene was the tension between Mrs Kennedy and The Queen and the emotion in the room of which Claire Foy excelled at.
With all of those detailed rules of etiquette, why would anyone join the British for tea? I always thought that the purpose for etiquette rules was to help make company feel comfortable by understanding what behavior is expected. I guess I was wrong. No one outside of British royalty would feel welcome in that demanding atmosphere.
Very interesting and informative analysis. The Queen was a masterful diplomat, I agree she wouldn’t be rude to Jaqueline Kennedy at all, as depicted in here. She was known for being very kind to guests, even the people she didn’t like (including Kennedy and Thatcher)
To be fair. We not on the Crown to watch much of the etiquette we are here to watch 2 historical fierce woman's having a tense moments. Claire Foy nailed the acting on that scene. I was feeling the tension!
This is excellent - knew most, but not all, you go through. As an American, however, I noticed another grave breach of etiquette that escaped the producers - having Mrs. Kennedy curtsey to the queen. It is a point of principle - at least, to those of us to whom etiquette still matters - that we don't bow or curtsey to foreign dignitaries, howsoever much we may admire them. (You'll remember the furor that arose when former U.S. President Obama bowed to a Saudi king at a G-20 meeting.) Mrs. Kennedy wouldn't have dreamed of curtsying to even this most wonderful of queens.
Claire Foy actually said in an interview that the *royal etiquette expert on set* told her to always pick up the saucer. Furthermore, like others have mentioned, obviously, she was ignoring a lot of etiquette due to the context of the meeting. Also, obviously, Netflix isn't going to have freshly baked scones, who knows how many hours it takes to film certain scenes!
I think the aggressive cutting and spreading of the entire scone was an indication of Elizabeth's tension and anger in the moment. I saw it as such, when I first viewed the scene. She was slapping and slathering, like she'd like to slap and slather Jackie.
It’s terrible I agree. From the ghastly dry scone, the double plates, the weird hotel style pouring, the outward knife. In fact a lot of the moves they make, for anyone who knows is often Americanized or hotel style. It’s an entertaining series but often strange. The weirdest is how often people in the court refer to The Queen this The Queen that, endlessly. In reality they just say “Her Majesty”. Well done .
Everyone commenting that there are practical or story reasons for this etiquette breach. Yes those things can all be true and he can still explain why they breach etiquette. The crown is not an etiquette guide and it doesn't have to have perfect etiquette. he can still point out breaks in etiquette and explain them. It's like reviewing a show for historical accuracy, it's not meant to be a total value judgement on it as a show as the show has more concerns then just etiquette or accuracy.
I got the impression that the faux pas in this scene were made on purpose, because they are so obvious and accentuated with closeups. It shows Queens annoyed and nervous, challenging her guest, or even condescending to her American background. Grabbing the scones and biting from them is even offensive. This is a very expressive scene, and everything there is perfect drama art.
Wonderful work! I also thought that I saw a large fork to the left of the Queen’s bread and butter plate. Surely it should be a cake fork? At boarding school we took the bread or roll onto our plates and tore off a little and dabbed some butter (which we had transported to our B & B plate) and buttered the small portion as we ate. One would have thought that the “advisors” on all things regally correct would have all these details correct - or were the advisors not British? Why didnt they ask you William?
"admittedly it didn't go very well for him after that...but he followed etiquette and that's the most important thing" HAHAHAHHA 😂😂😂
I snorted 🤣
I was shocked. Was not expecting that hahhaha
coffee came out my nose lmao
I hope he got paid extra for that joke.
That had to be the most British explanation I’ve ever heard
Me watching this video while eating a hoagie in a parking lot: “wow they’re such slobs”
lmao meeeeee.....eating a cold pancake in pjs with bare hands 🤣, got to this and said ugh how uncouth🤣🤣 in a British accent 🤦♀️
You see him sitting on the bollard in the parking lot eating his hoagie with the paper spread out on his lap, that is quite frankly heinous - a parking lot hoagie is properly eaten over the rubbish bins with the paper spread out across it. And you see a gatorade along with the hoagie - this would simply not be done. Coffee, iced tea (Arctic Splash if you're in Port Richmond) yes. Gatorade, no.
@@davidwilds8647 correct.
@@davidwilds8647😂😂😂
Please turn this into a series, could watch you all day!
CC Netflix
Yes. He feels so clean and relaxing 😅
Totally agree.
Yesss plss🙌🏼
Yes!!!!
The silver is dulled for the filming. Shiny shows the crew, background, lights.
Fourthgirl I have seen the set organisers spraying powdered deodorant on to metal to dull the shine for that reason.
Certainly a Netflix production has enough money to make the silver more silver like in post production. That's no excuse.
@@jec222 At the end of the day I don't really think any network is going to fund money into enhancing silver that a small population actually pay attention to. They'll be saving that money for all the extras in the large crowd scenes where they have to pay everyone on set.
Very cool.
Very interesting, thank you for this tidbit.
I think the hurried buttering is the actress portraying the agitation of the queen.
No butter. It’s clotted cream, and then jam.
that was some angry buttering.
The real queen would never allow herself to show her agitation that blatantly. So it didn't feel authentic at all.
@@irmar Who cares about how the Queen would behave in reality ? It’s a drama series, it’s meant to exagerate things.
jam always goes first ffs
In the first scene, I always took the footmen pouring the tea as a sign of how upset the Queen was at her. She herself wouldn’t pour the tea for her, and having footmen do it shows that she has greater power and is above her.
Edit: Same for eating quickly. She didn’t want to spend much time on her.
You can tell how professional he is by how he refers to an actress/fictional depictions as “Her Majesty”.
I personally think that all the errors were intentional. For example, the reason why the footmen poured the tea for both The Queen and Jackie was because of Jackie’s comments. Jackie stated that she found Buckingham Palace dull and like a provincial hotel. So, as William said that the tea pouring was very hotel-like, it was a perfect Easter egg, pointing to the fact that the Queen knew every comment made. As for the other etiquette errors in this meeting, they all contributed to the fact that this was not a state dinner. It was an informal meeting.
Meh plate on a plate is unheard of in such a setting, and the same applies to more small details are not common even if it serves making a statement.
I feel like the vast majority of the things pointed out here can be explained by the setting and tone of the scene. The queen didn't pour the tea or offer milk for the same reason that there were guards all over the place. She's hurt, and is snapping out in the ways she can. The quick buttering of the scone shows how she desperately wants this meeting over. Yes, faux pas. But not oversight. The etiquette consultant they employed on set was very good and definitely wouldn't have allowed it if there wasn't good cause.
What complete nonsense. The queen’s staff and the queen herself don’t get this stuff wrong. And your reference to guards is a complete joke. They’re called liveried servants. HM’s guards are big chaps with big guns and distinctive headgear. They don’t pour tea.
@@davidcockayne3381 I'm aware of the difference between the Queens Guard and Footmen. At the very beginning of this scene Jackie Kennedy almost gets run over by the Queens Guard. You should keep in mind that this is from a television show. Are liberties taken? Of course. But of you take it in context with the tone of the scene it makes a lot more sense.
The point of this video is to show correct and incorrect etiquette, NOT to explain a scene. Regardless of how you feel about a person, if she is a guest, you cannot be impolite. Even if the details of this scene were all deliberate to show what is happening, the point remains that incorrect etiquette was shown.
@@krdiaz8026 I agree. The etiquette is incorrect. I just feel like context is important as well, so you don't leave thus video thinking the Crown is a terribly made show with no regards to the truth.
@@krdiaz8026 Absolutely. It seems to be a lesson we have largely lost in the West, especially in the Anglo-Saxon world. Etiquette demonstrates politeness and politeness demonstrates a fundamental respect for the other person.
Me watching this with a mug of tea on the arm of the chair, emptying a packet of crisps in to my mouth from the air: "M'yes. Quite".
Lol loved this comment
I think she was buttering the scone like that so furiously because she was pissed, so it seemed more like an acting choice. She also could have (as a character) deliberately went against etiquette because Jacqueline's criticism of her was that she was too stuffy and "middle-aged" so it was a subtle way for her to break etiquette.
Why has the Crown not hired him as a consultant?
Because they don't care about anything that doesn't boost audience figures.
Because Queen disapproved of his etiquettes 🤪🤪🤪🤪😂😂😂😂😂😂😅😅😅😅
genlee that’s his resume
@@edronc2007 actually they put a lot of thought into the details that the main audience may not really notice, just because they didn’t hire this guy doesn’t mean they don’t put lol he's not the only consultant in the world. When analyzing etiquette it is important to take context and symbolism into account, what this meant in the relationship of one character to the other, these things are consciously taken into consideration
@@jessica5497 Well Netflix obviously doesnt care about correctness. Manners and etiquette are very important - it is courtesy; something that appears to be lacking at times these days.
"Dare I even say it, perhaps shop bought"
What have we become?
I watched this guy ages ago as I had to attend a fancy afternoon tea and needed to know how to behave. I passed with flying colours thanks to him
I'm so glad you mentioned the scone! 😂 Watching this scene I was just like "Oh Your Majesty 🙈'
And the old “correct way to eat a scone” - slathering the cream on first - oh dear! Or is that the Cornish way and not the Devon way??
@@juliehock6059 I think cream on first is the Devonshire way and jam first is Cornwall. But I could be wrong!
@@nicolahickman5551 exactly, as per my comment.
I am an ordinary working class person and I would always break, not slice my scone!
Lol
QE is known to put her jam on first and cream second, the Cornish manner, according to former royal chef Darren McGrady
Thank you. -my comment reflected this.
@@juliehock6059 me to.
That is how I do it also, because I like jam and it slides off the clotted cream otherwise.
Yes, Cream last. Far less messy!!
Oh my god william you absolute queen. "Probably produced the day before...dare i even say shop bought by netflix..." 😂😂 It is my life's mission to have afternoon tea with you one day and go for a little evening shop in harrods after 😍
Friend of Dorothy. Lmao.🤣
Was literally going to comment this as I read yours 😂
He's fabulous!
Damn I love William Hanson. Absolutely riveting. Although I have to admit I would be afraid to eat anything around him and with him less I make a mistake.
'Less' you make a mistake...? I shall believe that you did of course write 'lest' and blame the bizarre whims of autocorrect for the schoolboy error ;)
You cant be serious 🙄
With all of those detailed rules of etiquette, why would anyone join the British for tea? I always thought that the purpose for etiquette rules was to help make company feel comfortable by understanding what behavior is expected. I guess I was wrong. No one outside of British royalty would feel welcome in that demanding atmosphere.
I feel like Her Majesty might have asked the staff to pour tea to show off in a way? It makes a lot of sense considering the context of the scene.
HM would have NEVER "shown off".
@@edronc2007 In fact, she would in the context of this scene and the scenes before. It comes after Mrs Kennedy insulted Buckingham Palace and called it drab. In the scene directly before this, The Queen pulled out all of the stops to make sure there was an abundance of staff and guards in Windsor.
@@edronc2007 You're not even British. Shutup
I can’t imagine the Queen (the real one) ever feeling the need to show off. 😄
c mon you dont need to say Her Majesty.. we all know that queens and kings don´t exist, really. It´s a crazy convention in XXI century -and an expensive one for the citizens of some European countries
"Jesus broke break too, but it didn't go well for him BUT he did follow etiquette" hahahaha subsctibed!
Netflix should have hired Alistair Bruce (etiquette consultant for Downton Abbey) for The Crown. Even Her Majesty could find no fault.
my 93 year old mother could not stand Downtown Abbey because she thought it was so unrealistic and rules and etiquette disregarded or poorly portrayed. She loves The Crown though. Don't we all
Totally agree with all your observations; the only thing re: the footmen - the episode shows that the Queen was trying to intimidate Jackie as a retaliation after she said several critical things in public about the run down state of the palace. My guess is that that's why she had them pour.
Man. You’d think the show would have a consultant for this stuff.
Or they do and this is just one person's point of view and maybe its a TV drama so it doesn't matter anyway? 😂😂
I think it's mostly because absolute majority of viewers know fuck all about Royal Etiquette and its intricacies, therefore such small details, while important and somewhat integral to the proper representation of the character, may simply go over our heads.
Even if the consultant was there, I doubt it would make the difference for the audience. At least for the majority.
A Jolly Wanker it's NOT just Royal etiquette... it's for all.
they actually do he the guy that they got used to work in the palace
@@seanjonesy180 Yeah but they don’t want it to be inaccurate or overdramatized, which would not be good for the royals
the reason the queen did NOT pour her tea; had to do with the context of their meeting. Jackie had been talking shit about her so she ha Jackie meet her in a fortress NOT the palace and paraded her military around Jackie. This was done to create distance due to huge disrespect Jackie gave.
I agree - it took place in the early '60's too - charger plates were common.
Common but not correct in a royal household !
@@joantollerton9905 Common as in many - aristocratic families used charger plates, that's why they were made. 'Common' folk often used newspaper, not tablecloths.
@@pamjudge9691 but not for afternoon tea, surely! Charger plates are used at a several courses meal.
It's funny how things grate when you least expect them to - that knife pointing the wrong way at 7.58, gave me the shivers!
This was exceedingly enjoyable. I do hope that you continue to create these beautiful gems.
That was ridiculously entertaining to watch! I honestly didn't think I'd enjoy it that much. Please make more, it was interesting and hilarious!
They need to hire William for this show , so they can get things right ! Keep up the good work! You are the best !
Thank god someone has called out the cutting scone!!! I knew I could rely on you William Hanson.
I think they did pretty much everything on purpose to emphasise how mad the queen actually was and how tense the whole situation was. Of course, it is unrealistic for the queen to lay all etiquette aside, even if she’s pissed asf, but guys, this is a DRAMA SERIES...of course they’ll exaggerate. This UA-cam video was still interesting please make this whole thing a series i’d binge watch it😩
Of course! They even prepared some triangle-shaped sandwiches on purpose right???
Interesting. I’ve always been fascinated by etiquette and all the nuances within.
Please do more. I enjoyed this very much.
Thank you.
Having a great, good and nice time watching the Royal etiquette rules and manners, kinda needed that right now
It's so weird that if all those rules apply in real life, the queen can't do what she likes in the simplest of ways. I would suffocate.
Her life is so regimented and rigid I don't know how she does it.
She was born into it. It’s not like she has to force it. For her it comes out naturally just as it is for you to drink water from a glass instead of a bowl or holding a fork.
@@FFSnotagain yes that's true. Her life has ALWAYS been so rigid. That's probably why they love going to Balmoral.
Always amuses me when people say regarding the Queen” She can’t do what she likes in the simplest of ways”!!!To her this is simple!This is how she was taught & raised so it is simple for her!
Also we all have rules for want of a better word in our own homes don’t we?
Most times they have become such a way of life we don’t even notice them anymore!
I am no snob or etiquette expert but if you come to dine at my home I will have a tablecloth on the table the table will be set & I always use real napkins.
Sone people have accused me of being posh no it’s not posh it’s the way I choose to live in my own home.
Oh & if you notice the Queen dos not inflict her way of doing things on her guest because that would be rude & make her guest uncomfortable but in the big things yes there are standards in the Royal home just like we have in our own homes which of course is our right!!!!
Following rules of etiquette at table wouldn’t be weird or objectionable to the Queen. It’s just her life, the way she has always known it. It would be no different to her than the habits we have in our own lives.
As a complete and utter stickler for accuracy both for historical and modern day historical shows, I am enthralled and will be bingeing this channel. William, you are enchanting.
Fun fact: The Queen is a jam then cream person, meanwhile in the show Claire Foy puts cream then jam
ive seen recs for jam then cream so that you can taste the cream more. cream then jam kinda overpowers the cream so they say.
I remembered the same about the Queen. Personally, I find that a bit odd, but then again I’m a ‘just jam’ person.
Republicanism can't come too soon.
It’s the age old debate but should be cream then jam (cream is the butter) as it’s Devonshire cream tea, Cornwall can keep the pasties.
Can't abide cream at all, it was always butter on the scones at home.
I feel like some of the actions in this scene were to do with the tension between the two because everything you see Claire Foy acting out builds tension. That said, I love these styles of videos as it is always interesting to learn more about etiquette.
I realized she was a little rough with spreading the butter but I thought the director was trying to convey that she was upset about the rumor and anxious for Jackie's explanation.
Spreading the what ? It's clotted cream how dare you
@@Roddie62 off with her head!
@@Roddie62 How can you tell?
he went from 'charmingly british' to 'annoyingly pedantic' so quickly
maybe Netflix should just get the Queen on the show as a consultant, so they could never go wrong
It’s funny how he’s criticizing this scene when this scene is suppose to be like this, it’s suppose to throw out the traditional way because the queen is upset and is trying to intimidate Jackie Kennedy because prior to this scene Jackie was being disrespectful to the proper ways they were doing things
I doubt very much that Her Majesty would allow her annoyance at Jackie to make her forget her own standards.
@@Historian212 well duh, but this is still a show that uses dramatization for stuff sooooo again this scene makes sense with the show lol
Half of these choices seem like honest trivial mistakes (i.e., triangular sandwiches and waiters pouring tea) but a lot of it seems like either practical necessities for filming (dull pewter instead of bright silver that can screw up the cameras and lighting) or symbolic (a lot of passive aggressive actions by Elizabeth that this guy seems to be reading as simple goofs when actually they seem to be purposefully intended to impart tension, regardless of whether the Queen in real life would have ever engaged in such petty behavior-it communicates the mood to the audience, and that's more important than being perfectly accurate).
I agree that these things were done to show the tension. But they don't feel true to character. The real queen would have tried her best to be polite, even if glacially polite. It's part of her persona, and if you get that wrong, then what's the point to get the feeling of the scene right?
I have been waiting for this for a long time, thank you
I know...the scone thing seemed quite obvious to me. They even have a convenient break through the middle to help you! No knives needed at all. Perhaps they should consult you for scenes like this . Adds a good level of detail .
so many little details i would've never thought about your amazing please make more of these!
There is one major point missed in this whole thing: the royal family is known to be rather naff, actually.
The queen probably didn't give a Corgi's bottom for etiquette outside public displays.
I never had the intention to watch it. This is one proof, why I haven't missed anything.
This is so funny. As an American we don’t follow like... any of these things...
💯💯💯
This is because Brits worry about stupid stuff and think they’re better than everyone else.
Hahahahha
Wow not the time to boast lol
@@stevesteve5804 No, it's actually because we have class.
I enjoyed your video. Not only did you point out the incorrect etiquette in the movie, you also have correctly defended the queen!
That last remark was hilarious. Great job, William!
Sandwiches at Buckingham Palace are served with no crusts, and a rectangular shape, I know because years ago my Mums friend had tea at the Palace, and after she reported back to Mum how the sandwiches were served, that's how our sandwiches were served thereafter :-)
They have the Queen chowing down like she hasn’t eaten in months. Never seeming to offer anything to the guest.
Also mrs Kennedy hair is way too long and dishevelled. “It just won’t do.”
I like how you highlight the historical background of some of these small details. Very genuine, and informative!
We must protect William Hanson at all cost.
I fully understand and appreciate Mr. Hanson's dissection of this particular scene, however I do agree with a number of the contributors that this is a scene full of nuances and deliberate misdirection for Mrs Kennedy. If nothing more than for the drama this series wants to convey.
The show should have hired you to fact check and help ensure that everything was accurate in all the scenes!
They have someone who’s job that is. A lot of the stuff in this scene is deliberate given the context.
@@jpgrennanwell clearly they didn’t do a good job. 🙄
@@kaitlin2400 When experts are employed in film and TV production, they are not given final say over anything. The etiquette expert may have got everything right only to have been overruled by the director. William was an etiquette expert on "Red, White & Royal Blue" and they didn't follow all his advice; the makers of "The Crown" wouldn't have, either.
Sadly, few people study etiquette anymore. I remember when Prince Charles and Lady Diana became engaged. I was a young girl who was so impressed by Diana that I asked my mother for a book of etiquette for my sixteenth birthday. I memorized it, hoping to learn how to be a proper lady and never be perceived as gauche.
When I watched this scene in The Crown, I cringed at how awkward and "down-home" Claire Foy portrayed the Queen at this tea and how clumsily this scene was staged.
Thank you for this video commentary.
Etiquette is a waste of time in the world of technology. Do things swiftly and efficiently, that's what matters.
@@edenassos Why does it matter? Etiquette is about doing things in a slower way to get away from the fast pace of the outside world. The reason etiquette has dwindled, or more accurately has died in the lower classes, is because people don't know how to slow down
@@edenassos i don't think that the problem is the whole idea of ettiquette. i think it's just that what we think of as "good" etiquette is old fashioned when really times have changed and the "proper" way to behave has changed too. It isn't described in Victorian books because just as they didn't have email and social media their etiquette responded to a different society and environment. there is no point doing things "properly" if it just makes things more difficult and makes people uncomfortable
@@edenassos Perhaps in your world, but eating like a lout with mouth open, and feet on the table isnt attractive at all - regardless of technology.
@@juliehock6059 That's pretty obvious, isn't it? It goes without saying you don't put your leg on the dinner table, I'm talking about the over-the-top ones.
If James Villiers were with us today he would approve of Mr Hanson's accent.
The Queen's hasty preparation of her scone is intentional in this scene - she is diverting her emotional energy into slathering on the cream and jam.
For all the people who are commentating about how "if the queen was in a bad mood ...etc". Etiquette is second nature, bad mood or not. There is no other way to do things. They're all taught this the minute they can hold a knife and fork properly. The children arent allowed to eat with the queen until they have learnt proper table manners. And they don't slob out when no-ones looking. After years of seeing people in private homes eating I can tell you that it just feels wrong and very naughty to butter a whole roll or cut into a roll to add butter. It's called indoctrination.
I kind of love the idea of just whipping out my dagger to slice my bread.
I was an extra on a film production in a restaurant scene. The plate of pasta with white sauce and halved grape tomatoes placed in front of each us was cold and we were told it was meant for show, not eating.
I love your adamant demand that scones are light and warm... I recently obtained a recipie for buttermilk scones, and it is amazing how light and fluffy and delicious they are! I just need some clotted cream in my life.
Whenever I hear William Hanson speak I realize how many correct etiquette lessons my mother taught us by example. Sadly, some of these things I’ve neglected, becoming I’m afraid rather uncouth. 😱
@Sheila English my late mother also taught us. We certainly learned to always break a scone, never to cut it.
Don't be to hard on the producers. It must be incredibly difficult to get all those little details right. Overall The Crown is so very beautiful and well-made.
Actually, no US citizen is obliged to curtsey to anyone.
With etiquette it's always interesting to find out if there's actually a rational, sensible reason behind the rule, or if it's "We do it because we have been doing it like this for centuries and we don't care that society is different now, and generally we are nitpickers who don't care about what's important." This is, I think, mostly the latter and... kind of ridiculous.
She prepared her scones the Devon way, cream first then the jam. The Cornish put the jam on first then the cream.
A brilliant video! I like how diverse the knowledge of the expert is. Would love to see more of this
As someone working in film, I can tell you that producers rarely make these errors by accident. It grabs the attention of the high maintenance viewer, who is actually part of the target audience. The high maintenance viewer is a producer’s dream, because they are very proactive in expressing critique, which is basically free PR. If someone tells you: ‘They got everything wrong in these series!’, you are more inclined to watch it out of curiosity than when someone is raving about it.
dont let this guy fool you, his real name is burt pilkington and he's from a council estate in accrington
One more thing to add: To the best of my knowledge, the cups used in the scene were for coffee not for tea. In all traditional sets of china there would be a difference in shape.
I appreciate that you know your stuff. But I think the main focus in this scene was the tension between Mrs Kennedy and The Queen and the emotion in the room of which Claire Foy excelled at.
I loved the comment "Her Majesty is a bit thirsty and so would I after that dry scone." I'm still giggling.
I love that you made your face cam in the top-right a postage stamp. It's adorable, please continue doing that for your reaction videos.
With all of those detailed rules of etiquette, why would anyone join the British for tea? I always thought that the purpose for etiquette rules was to help make company feel comfortable by understanding what behavior is expected. I guess I was wrong. No one outside of British royalty would feel welcome in that demanding atmosphere.
I could legit watch this guy criticize the whole tv show, plus Downton Abbey.
Very interesting and informative analysis. The Queen was a masterful diplomat, I agree she wouldn’t be rude to Jaqueline Kennedy at all, as depicted in here. She was known for being very kind to guests, even the people she didn’t like (including Kennedy and Thatcher)
To be fair. We not on the Crown to watch much of the etiquette we are here to watch 2 historical fierce woman's having a tense moments. Claire Foy nailed the acting on that scene. I was feeling the tension!
This is excellent - knew most, but not all, you go through. As an American, however, I noticed another grave breach of etiquette that escaped the producers - having Mrs. Kennedy curtsey to the queen. It is a point of principle - at least, to those of us to whom etiquette still matters - that we don't bow or curtsey to foreign dignitaries, howsoever much we may admire them. (You'll remember the furor that arose when former U.S. President Obama bowed to a Saudi king at a G-20 meeting.) Mrs. Kennedy wouldn't have dreamed of curtsying to even this most wonderful of queens.
Sincerely, I’ve awaited this since watching this episode.
Here's what seperates you, from the Queen. The Queen can do whatever she may like, you don't govern her exact movements mr precious.
Claire Foy actually said in an interview that the *royal etiquette expert on set* told her to always pick up the saucer. Furthermore, like others have mentioned, obviously, she was ignoring a lot of etiquette due to the context of the meeting. Also, obviously, Netflix isn't going to have freshly baked scones, who knows how many hours it takes to film certain scenes!
This guy sounds like fun in parties
I think the aggressive cutting and spreading of the entire scone was an indication of Elizabeth's tension and anger in the moment. I saw it as such, when I first viewed the scene. She was slapping and slathering, like she'd like to slap and slather Jackie.
I went to a boarding school in the early 1960's -- I had to take a class in tea pouring!
@Derrick Langford Great question! No I never used my tea service skills! Never! And my mom had solid silver service...
Loved it! And William... Your expressions were worth a million!👍👍😊
I have been binge-watching your videos since I came across them and have learnt a lot from you, thanks.
Love the background information! Great work! Thank you, William!
It’s terrible I agree. From the ghastly dry scone, the double plates, the weird hotel style pouring, the outward knife. In fact a lot of the moves they make, for anyone who knows is often Americanized or hotel style. It’s an entertaining series but often strange. The weirdest is how often people in the court refer to The Queen this The Queen that, endlessly. In reality they just say “Her Majesty”. Well done .
glad that you are doing well William!
This video was nice! Since I was learning proper manners from previous videos I was able to notice several errors in the scene, it was satisfying.
Everyone commenting that there are practical or story reasons for this etiquette breach. Yes those things can all be true and he can still explain why they breach etiquette. The crown is not an etiquette guide and it doesn't have to have perfect etiquette. he can still point out breaks in etiquette and explain them. It's like reviewing a show for historical accuracy, it's not meant to be a total value judgement on it as a show as the show has more concerns then just etiquette or accuracy.
Apparently the Queen always put the jam on FIRST so they didn't get that right.
The utter shade thrown at Jesus 😱🤣🤣
“Dare I say it, not silver (cutlery)”. 😂 His delivery is spot on.
I have noticed all these errors but I thought that the English protocol could have some differences. I am from Argentina.
Please do more of this with The Crown, really enjoyed this!
I got the impression that the faux pas in this scene were made on purpose, because they are so obvious and accentuated with closeups. It shows Queens annoyed and nervous, challenging her guest, or even condescending to her American background. Grabbing the scones and biting from them is even offensive. This is a very expressive scene, and everything there is perfect drama art.
NETFLIX I HOPE YOURE LISTENING!
Wonderful work! I also thought that I saw a large fork to the left of the Queen’s bread and butter plate. Surely it should be a cake fork? At boarding school we took the bread or roll onto our plates and tore off a little and dabbed some butter (which we had transported to our B & B plate) and buttered the small portion as we ate. One would have thought that the “advisors” on all things regally correct would have all these details correct - or were the advisors not British? Why didnt they ask you William?