11:55 - Edge cases for a lot of dice in Deadzone: Sniper shooting from above at a clear target: 3+2 (scope)+2 (clear shot)+1 (hight) - 8 dice. With Command Dice and one-use ammo You can get 10 dice! Combat: Bigger model charges a wounded model that already has Your other model in the same cube. Target has Prey on them: 3+1(charge)+1(wounded target)+1(friend in a cube)+1(prey)+1(size)= 8 dice. 9 with command "extra dice" result. Is Your model had SMASH rule You get another combat dice! Again 10 dice.
Honestly? DeadZone has become my favourite miniature game. Easily, it's so absolutely fantastic and their 3rd edition starter is such CRAZY GOOD VALUE OH MY LORD!
Here I am 6 months later. I played my first game of Deadzone and i am hooked. Got a couple friends who bought in first and they let me borrow a faction and now I’m going to use my space marines for enforcers and build up Plague because I love those Mantic models
My son and I have just started playing deadzone and we LOVE it!! It's so fast paced and fun pushing models into walls, off platforms, exploding 8s it's just a blast! And there's no bloat! We read the rules and we're playing to a good standard within one evening! It's awesome
I have never played any of these types games but I just love listening to someone speak so passionately about something for a change. He is never negative about anything
DeadZone is SUCH a good game. I wish I could get more people interested in it around me. No matter how many spare armies I have and how much I'm willing to get people going or run demo events it runs up on the typical "Meh, I don't feel like learning a new game".
I have the same issue! Deadzone is so good and I have SO many extra armies. I can run a 4 person tournament by myself. Hopefully I can get people hyped about it one day.
Yaaaas deadzone is Mantic's best designed game. I say that even when I'm a Mantic Kings of War channel. Super elegant rules, very beautiful terrain because you can stack cubes to make buildings and ruins, relatively balanced yet there's super fun elements in the game with the command dice, items, and exploding 8s! Thank you for spotlighting Thi game to more people!
I'm surprised you didn't mention the price difference. While the Kill Team starter is technically cheaper ($99 US to Deadzone $140) to equal everything in the Deadzone box you would also need to buy the Compendium $50, and another terrain pack which is at least $50, and technically another 3-6 minis which pricing varies by what you are buying. So in the end the Deadzone starter at $140 has the same amount in the box as $200+ of Kill Team purchases. While I am just starting to play Deadzone, Kill Team has pretty much entirely left my table with 2nd edition. 1) It's much harder to teach to new players, and I enjoy teaching games to new players. 2) The people I have tried to introduce to Kill Team have just gone glassy eyed when I get to the terrain rules. 3) I found myself rewriting the rules a lot in order to make it more streamlined to play, at that point why don't I make my own ruleset for it? I can play 2 games of Deadzone in the time it takes to play 1 game of Kill Team. 4) I got really tired of buying the new book every year for it to play with the updated points and factions rules. Especially for a game I was already only getting to the table about 3 or 4 times a year. 5) The price is a pretty big deal for me, and getting expansions or entirely new forces for Deadzone is much more cost effective than it is for Kill Team. (If I wanted to buy the faction starter set for every single faction in Deadzone it would only cost $42.50 each, which is $467.50 for all 11 factions, and that would field an effective team for each faction, you can't do 11 factions in Kill Team for anywhere near that price.) So far Deadzone is winning for me. It has enough crunch in the list building that I find fun, while game play is fast and easy for me to teach to people. The starter box even comes with tutorial scenarios in it so you can ease people into the game.
DZ is a game where You can show the rules and play in minutes without Your nose in the rulebook. Big thing for me is that I can build an effective force using like 95% of units in the list. TK has "one good way of building a list" so there is not really any... List building.
I have to admit, Kill Team has a lot of stuff to figure out for a player, but I really like the mechanic of conceal or engage orders. It makes the models feel more dynamic than they are: is that ork running at me waving a choppa, or sneaking around low to the ground. It helps bypass the binary game-ness of line of sight in a way that inflexible figures don't allow. While I am frustrated with GW's decisions on what Kill Teams to release (you release space hulks and do not release genestealers or terminators?), I feel like the game excells by having a narrow focus on particular types of 'specialist operative' engagements. Narratively, there's a reason why dreadnoughts and airplanes and bikes and tanks don't show up. Sometimes, what you exclude from your game does a lot of heavy lifting in establishing a setting and feel for the game.
Infinity also uses the cone system for LoS. It makes the shooting phase a lot easier. Love that Deadzone also does this. Going off the minis sculpt doesn't make sense. Minis are representative of dynamic operatives in the field that are constantly moving.
Deadzone is a really good game to get new people into miniature wargaming, fun, simple and let them build their own thing without being too expensive if they decide that the one team was not for them it is also easier going with kids as the cube based movement and the USRs make it more intuitive for them
The cylinder thing was also used back in mk2 warmachine/hordes. It is so nice so you don't have models posed for gaming advantage. When playing necromunda and other things I get the other player to agree to the base cylinder for LOS. I think it's a rule that needs more support and utilization across all games.
Thank you to Brillant for sponsoring today's video! Go to brilliant.org/EonsOfBattle/ to get a 30-day free trial + the first 200 people will get 20% off their annual subscription!
If only Mantic spend some time and money to market their product. Nobody knows about those games and it's even harder to convince anyone to play. There is whole world of skirmish games and despite Matic having a good package, games without figures like Stargrave are much more popular.
Me and my flatmate have, combined, 6 different KT's and 5 different terrain sets for KT (both open and closed terrain). And most of it painted. However we have been struggling a lot with the rules, for months, and never really got fully started on the game. Too many layers, too many complex rules like the engaged/concealed LoS thing. However we've been enjoying playing Carnevale, its such a great twist, low model skirmish, absolutely unique minis and setting, a carnevale board looks amazing and the game is super dinamic and fun, you can do almost everything, there are no silly rules, and the depth is decent but not overwhelming. I'd love to see this channel cover that game
Thankfully Deadzone has finally taken off in my area because I much prefer it to Kill Team. I really liked the conceal/engage concept when I first started playing KT but 2 years in I still find my opponent doesn't fully understand it in about 75% of the games I play. So even though it is pretty simple to understand after some time with the game it's just not intuitive enough to stick with people who play on a more casual basis or for new players to grasp.
I picked up some Deadzone dooders when I saw a fat discount on the box. Made some cool kitbashes with it, and it's interesting to see you discuss it. Commenting for the algorithm.
Deadzone is such a great game. I've been playing nautical wargames for a while now, but Deadzone is absolutely one of the best. Full of memorable moments. Once, I managed to Leeroy Jenkins an enemy Mech with a Forge Father Brokkr (street engineer) and actually killed it (after 3 turns). Just the heroic sight of this guy with a hammer bonking a mech suit with a giant gun and actually winning. Of course, I've also had *my* mech suit killed in a great moment - a sniper rifle with the perfect storm. Aimed, no cover, boosted with the command dice, hit every single die, and I flubbed my survive roll. Out in one shot. Okay, so I'm talking up the mechs, and I can't lie, they're really good especially if you're playing Forge Fathers (Space Dwarves). The Iron Ancestor feels almost invincible, but it will eat up a quarter of your points. I know of other great units from the FF list, like the Bomb-bot. It's upgrade-levels of points, its role is to blow up, and somehow it always survives longer than it should. Or Cheers Brewski, that one soldier I gave a canteen of alcohol to. First one in. I've also tried branching out into the Plague, the space zombies (a lot like Dead Space), and I never completed it because of my ambition. I wanted a tourism/tropical getaway-themed force, like the Plague infected a resort planet. Bit big for my britches. Anyways, the Plague play so different. Everybody else can solve their problems at range, the Plague solve their problems with melee. So few guns and so very little accuracy, plus a more horde-styled game. Zombies are as cheap as chips but boy are they bad. I wish, though, that Deadzone had more flavors of forces. There's only 10 factions in the game, as opposed to Kill Team's sourcebook of WH40K. There's GCPS (business imperial guard), Enforcers (business space marines), Mazon Labs (space Umbrella Company), Rebs (Woo go rebels!), Forge Fathers (space dwarves), Vyr-myn(space skaven w/o backstabbing disorder), Asterians(space elves using robots), Marauders (space orks but less funny), Plague (space zombies) and Nameless (space squids. not tyranids). Forge Fathers, Asterians, and Marauders are all aliens, albeit more fantasy-in-space. Nameless are all wibbly tentacle aliens with biotech. Plague is a super-mutation that mutates almost everything into horrible monsters. Rebels are largely aliens, plus disillusioned humans. Vyr-myn are very likely super-evolved earth rats. Mazon Labs does bad things *with* aliens. It's a greater proportionality of aliens in the game than GW has, but that's because there's a fraction of factions compared to WH40k. And the Warpath Universe (the official name of the setting) has a lot of different aliens, it's just that humans have kinda taken over everything. Through business. Dreadball, Mantic's space soccer game, introduced a lot of different aliens that I'd love to see expanded into Deadzone. Also, the Deadzone backstory is a lot different than WH40K, yet has some similarities. Basically, Humanity is undergoing rapid expansion because Megacorporations rule everything and everything is done in the name of business and money. The bleeding edge of their expansion is the proverbial wild west, full of rebels unhappy with the Megacorporations' destructive expansion. Asterians are outside the bubble, using their insufferable wisdom to tell the Megacorporations to not unleash that ancient horrible Plague thingy, but they do so. Orks are immune to Plague's mutation, and are trained as super-soldiers, but they wanted the advanced tech and training for cheap and rebel successfully when they get what they want. Enforcers are human super-soldiers made to replace the Ork Marauders and serve only the 7 most powerful Megacorporations. Forge Fathers want to exploit every resource, like the Megacorporations, but are more religious about it and less business. Nameless are conquering planets and flooding them because Nameless are mostly aquatic and have gotten a bit religiously crazy lately. Ver-myn just get everywhere and will probably try to take over a planet from the inside out. More modern stuff, but definitely human-focused and with fantasy classics suddenly in space. It's like Warhammer 40K got bonked with a Serious Sci-Fi stick.
Please do a Deadzone batrep. Also, Mantic's Fire team ruleset for bigger battles seems great. Like 40k but alternating activations. Seems like with 10th coming GW may be taking some pages from Mantic's playbook for gaming. More simple more fun.
Jay, your facial expression game was on point in this video. Sean/Shawn is going down! So, what you are trying to say is that “Dead Zone is suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuper gooooooooooood??? 🤷♂️
Hex Grid is superior for an isometric tactical game, as you are able to achieve far more organic terrain shapes while maintaining stable basing and believable shapes for a wider variety of scatter terrain.
the cover system in the new killteam is 1 of the 2 issues i have with the game which led me to drop the game the second is list building the full specialist teams are boring and i wish they kept the fireteams and you could trade 2 models for a specialist but also can bring 2 different type of units for fun combos (heck you could even play with 3 fireteams and 1 team arrives in round 2 for bigger games) and than instead of releasing new versions of existing units, they could just make more new infantry units for every faction, give it 2 weapon options and it's even 2 units
I feel like this video needed some show and tell. It would have help illustrate your points and been much more entertaining. I love Deadzone, and I think it is definitely a better game than Kill Team. The terrain and cubic movement system are beautiful design.
Kill team was the first 40K game I got into and my first exposure to Warhammer and tabletop games. As a very new player, killteam wasn't super difficult to get into but was abit of a learning curve will all the key words and abilities. tbh, I got the hang of it after my second game and found it easier as I got more games in. I found Killteam pretty "new" player friendly, easier to get into trickier to master you know
From that description, I think I would enjoy Deadzone more actually. I don’t play either currently, but I am invested in 40k. I suppose I could always use 40k models in Deadzone too since the rules are more mini agnostic right? I know KoW is pretty model agnostic
DZ is the Cleanest game out there. Great story. I really like the models as well. Veer-myn especially. I am also working on my KT warband... We will if GW ruleset got... any better over lat 15 years.
Been meaning to pick up all of Mantic's stuff, actually. Its funny how Shadow War Armageddon is better than Kill Team despite being based off of 1990s Necromunda. Actually, BECAUSE its based off 1990s Necromunda. I miss those days...
I thought of a better comparison: Kill Team is Batman at his most angsty emo. Deadzone is Deadpool. Sometimes I want one one and sometimes I want the other.
I'm really into the more skirmish-style games coming out these days. I think it encourages more people to try games out and play with a variety of people!
Fun listen while I was cleaning up some prints. I gotta respectfully disagree with you on the engage/conceal orders. I think how tricky it is, and how much it changes based on your and your enemy's team adds a lot to the replay ability of the game, and having to adjust your plans for the inevitable mistake leading to a key op dying or your enemy taking control.of the board because you didn't pressure enough adds a lot to the game. I think it would feel gamey or flat if it was easy to tell which to do all the time and would just turn into another mindless min/max situation like the list building already is. To each their own, not trying to say anyone's wrong at the end of the day. Just offering a different perspective. Thanks for the fun video.
are you going to restock the xl "say no" t shirt any time soon? also have you guys ever thought about selling your old patreon terrain on you guy's merch store?
I know how much Jay does every week, I'm wondering if he could possibly have more to say? If only he could have explained that in this clip. I'm also curious if the show is filmed before a live audience.
That was one of the things that instantly turned me off KT2021, Jay, I liked that KT2018 allowed me to choose "a variety of models in my faction," rather than feeling limited to 'the contents of this single set of sprues exactly?'
The rolling more dice thing I think is one of the reason I've fallen so much in love with the Kroot Farstalker Kinband KT. They have a strategic ploy called cut-throats where all melee attacks gain 1 more dice to a maximum of 5. The killteam already has 3 pretty scary melee units in the stalker, cutskin and hounds but with cut-throats they all become just that little bit scarier. Plus it means that all your normal units go from capable in melee to pretty good. Plus it's just so satisfying to roll that extra dice.
The main thing about wysiwyg is the sillyness that some situations it puts you in. Yes it's better for roleplay (or is it ?) but it makes things way more goofier tahn they should IN A GAME ;) What I love about Malifaux and all other bases-based LoS system, is that it still allows for very subtil placement and pro tweaking for LoS, but it also do not ruin your day because, you know, the tip of the gun is visible so my model will rip a hole on the body of their target xD That's stupid ! So, to sum things up a little, I'd say "I'm all about dat base" :D
#deadzone is better than kill team... everything is better : price, book, rules..................even miniatures begin good now (mantic produce at archon studio now...)
Thank you for your passion and your work. Apparently you're the only one who really cares about #OGA. I was really hoping that we would see a lot of other games. How to play and what makes them better/different, but 3 weeks into April we have a handful of content creators with not many videos. You are the only one explaining other games in detail. The rest is "just" painting non-GW models... It feels like a missed opportunity and that nobody really cares (except you). Not even Miniac has released a video now. I'm sad :)
I liked the old Kill Team, but I really dislike the new one. The engage/conceal mechanic absolutely destroys the game. I also dislike Games Workshop rules in general. They always write tournament rules, usually using a paragraph to describe what can be expressed in a sentence. I’m a really uncompetitive player, and I’ve realised most of GW just isn’t for me. I just got my hands on an old Deadzone 2013 box, so I will be trying this game out very soon. I see a lot in this game I might like.
The problem with kill team is the totally unnecessary books and the expensive terrain. Also no matter what you tell me, conceal doesn't exist in the spacehulk gamemodes
I almost bought it when I was looking for a fun, dynamic, simple game to play with my wife. But the models are far from the quality of other brands (including GW), they kept me away from the game. Too bad because the rules look awesome!
I thought the minis looked alright but admittedly I've never held them in person so can't attest to their quality. But if you like the rules better than Kill Team couldn't you sub in other models you do like?
@@johnoneill3654 I could but to be honest I'm not a big fan of proxies, I feel like the official models are supposed to be the perfect match for both the universe and the rules of the game, and any other models are less appropriate. Nothing depicts a boltgun better than an actual boltgun. That's why I also don't like much miniature agnostic games, but it's just me. But as extreme as it sounds, when I play a game it's with the official models or not at all.
@@ThomasGallinari To each their own 👍 I will admit to being the same when I first started the hobby. I've since come to love numerous systems. Many of which are miniature agnostic. I now find that I see the minis as the secondary part and the system as the primary where as it was reversed originally.
@@samsowden I did, the most recent giant rats are pretty decent but I find they don't look as good as GW or Infinity. It may be due to the paint job though.
Deadzone... The game that took up space at the game store for years. Collecting dust, occasionally being shuffled around to make room for other games. I remember someone talking about it once. About how it "wasn't 40k" and I remember how we all laughed. It was sad to see the store close. Those Deadzone boxes sustained and nearly solid grey with dust never left the shelf until the day the store closed it's doors for good. This has become Other Hobbies April for me. Like most mini gamers, I chose.my game almost 25 years ago, I'm not going to start some other mini game that doesn't have any players anywhere within a few hundred miles.
![[Kill Team 3rd Edition] The Best Teams to Start With!](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/SND44q6uO10/mqdefault.jpg)
11:55 - Edge cases for a lot of dice in Deadzone:
Sniper shooting from above at a clear target: 3+2 (scope)+2 (clear shot)+1 (hight) - 8 dice. With Command Dice and one-use ammo You can get 10 dice!
Combat: Bigger model charges a wounded model that already has Your other model in the same cube. Target has Prey on them: 3+1(charge)+1(wounded target)+1(friend in a cube)+1(prey)+1(size)= 8 dice. 9 with command "extra dice" result. Is Your model had SMASH rule You get another combat dice! Again 10 dice.
Honestly? DeadZone has become my favourite miniature game. Easily, it's so absolutely fantastic and their 3rd edition starter is such CRAZY GOOD VALUE OH MY LORD!
Here I am 6 months later. I played my first game of Deadzone and i am hooked. Got a couple friends who bought in first and they let me borrow a faction and now I’m going to use my space marines for enforcers and build up Plague because I love those Mantic models
My son and I have just started playing deadzone and we LOVE it!! It's so fast paced and fun pushing models into walls, off platforms, exploding 8s it's just a blast! And there's no bloat! We read the rules and we're playing to a good standard within one evening! It's awesome
I have never played any of these types games but I just love listening to someone speak so passionately about something for a change. He is never negative about anything
DeadZone is SUCH a good game.
I wish I could get more people interested in it around me. No matter how many spare armies I have and how much I'm willing to get people going or run demo events it runs up on the typical "Meh, I don't feel like learning a new game".
I have the same issue! Deadzone is so good and I have SO many extra armies. I can run a 4 person tournament by myself. Hopefully I can get people hyped about it one day.
Yaaaas deadzone is Mantic's best designed game. I say that even when I'm a Mantic Kings of War channel. Super elegant rules, very beautiful terrain because you can stack cubes to make buildings and ruins, relatively balanced yet there's super fun elements in the game with the command dice, items, and exploding 8s! Thank you for spotlighting Thi game to more people!
Deadzone is such an underrated game, there is the big mass battle version too
I'm surprised you didn't mention the price difference. While the Kill Team starter is technically cheaper ($99 US to Deadzone $140) to equal everything in the Deadzone box you would also need to buy the Compendium $50, and another terrain pack which is at least $50, and technically another 3-6 minis which pricing varies by what you are buying. So in the end the Deadzone starter at $140 has the same amount in the box as $200+ of Kill Team purchases.
While I am just starting to play Deadzone, Kill Team has pretty much entirely left my table with 2nd edition. 1) It's much harder to teach to new players, and I enjoy teaching games to new players. 2) The people I have tried to introduce to Kill Team have just gone glassy eyed when I get to the terrain rules. 3) I found myself rewriting the rules a lot in order to make it more streamlined to play, at that point why don't I make my own ruleset for it? I can play 2 games of Deadzone in the time it takes to play 1 game of Kill Team. 4) I got really tired of buying the new book every year for it to play with the updated points and factions rules. Especially for a game I was already only getting to the table about 3 or 4 times a year. 5) The price is a pretty big deal for me, and getting expansions or entirely new forces for Deadzone is much more cost effective than it is for Kill Team. (If I wanted to buy the faction starter set for every single faction in Deadzone it would only cost $42.50 each, which is $467.50 for all 11 factions, and that would field an effective team for each faction, you can't do 11 factions in Kill Team for anywhere near that price.)
So far Deadzone is winning for me. It has enough crunch in the list building that I find fun, while game play is fast and easy for me to teach to people. The starter box even comes with tutorial scenarios in it so you can ease people into the game.
DZ is a game where You can show the rules and play in minutes without Your nose in the rulebook. Big thing for me is that I can build an effective force using like 95% of units in the list. TK has "one good way of building a list" so there is not really any... List building.
I have to admit, Kill Team has a lot of stuff to figure out for a player, but I really like the mechanic of conceal or engage orders. It makes the models feel more dynamic than they are: is that ork running at me waving a choppa, or sneaking around low to the ground. It helps bypass the binary game-ness of line of sight in a way that inflexible figures don't allow.
While I am frustrated with GW's decisions on what Kill Teams to release (you release space hulks and do not release genestealers or terminators?), I feel like the game excells by having a narrow focus on particular types of 'specialist operative' engagements. Narratively, there's a reason why dreadnoughts and airplanes and bikes and tanks don't show up. Sometimes, what you exclude from your game does a lot of heavy lifting in establishing a setting and feel for the game.
Infinity also uses the cone system for LoS. It makes the shooting phase a lot easier. Love that Deadzone also does this. Going off the minis sculpt doesn't make sense. Minis are representative of dynamic operatives in the field that are constantly moving.
Great job comparing these two games. Makes me want to check out Deadzone being a long time GW player.
I love that Mantic is getting some attention this month. I prefer the Warpath universe so much more than the grim dark.
Deadzone is a really good game to get new people into miniature wargaming, fun, simple and let them build their own thing without being too expensive if they decide that the one team was not for them
it is also easier going with kids as the cube based movement and the USRs make it more intuitive for them
I'd recommend checking Stargrave! Fantastic skirmish game with a lot of narrative, RPG, building your crew, leveling, finding loot, etc.
Wild monsters and bad guys to get in the way are cool as well. I picked up Side Hustle recently and I to give it a try.
@@williamings773 yeah it's such a fun way to introduce some kind of small randomness to the game! Fallout Wasteland Warfare does this great as well
DZ stand at the top of my personal list of fun wargames. Fast, cinematic, tactical, amazing!
The cylinder thing was also used back in mk2 warmachine/hordes. It is so nice so you don't have models posed for gaming advantage. When playing necromunda and other things I get the other player to agree to the base cylinder for LOS. I think it's a rule that needs more support and utilization across all games.
Thanks for sharing Deadzone on UA-cam!
Thank you to Brillant for sponsoring today's video! Go to brilliant.org/EonsOfBattle/ to get a 30-day free trial + the first 200 people will get 20% off their annual subscription!
If only Mantic spend some time and money to market their product. Nobody knows about those games and it's even harder to convince anyone to play. There is whole world of skirmish games and despite Matic having a good package, games without figures like Stargrave are much more popular.
Me and my flatmate have, combined, 6 different KT's and 5 different terrain sets for KT (both open and closed terrain). And most of it painted. However we have been struggling a lot with the rules, for months, and never really got fully started on the game. Too many layers, too many complex rules like the engaged/concealed LoS thing. However we've been enjoying playing Carnevale, its such a great twist, low model skirmish, absolutely unique minis and setting, a carnevale board looks amazing and the game is super dinamic and fun, you can do almost everything, there are no silly rules, and the depth is decent but not overwhelming. I'd love to see this channel cover that game
Thankfully Deadzone has finally taken off in my area because I much prefer it to Kill Team.
I really liked the conceal/engage concept when I first started playing KT but 2 years in I still find my opponent doesn't fully understand it in about 75% of the games I play. So even though it is pretty simple to understand after some time with the game it's just not intuitive enough to stick with people who play on a more casual basis or for new players to grasp.
I picked up some Deadzone dooders when I saw a fat discount on the box. Made some cool kitbashes with it, and it's interesting to see you discuss it. Commenting for the algorithm.
Put the 1lb kill team on the shelf.
Have you tried Infinity by Corvus Belli? It is also quite a nice skirmish game with a rather unique order pool mechanic.
Deadzone is such a great game. I've been playing nautical wargames for a while now, but Deadzone is absolutely one of the best. Full of memorable moments. Once, I managed to Leeroy Jenkins an enemy Mech with a Forge Father Brokkr (street engineer) and actually killed it (after 3 turns). Just the heroic sight of this guy with a hammer bonking a mech suit with a giant gun and actually winning. Of course, I've also had *my* mech suit killed in a great moment - a sniper rifle with the perfect storm. Aimed, no cover, boosted with the command dice, hit every single die, and I flubbed my survive roll. Out in one shot.
Okay, so I'm talking up the mechs, and I can't lie, they're really good especially if you're playing Forge Fathers (Space Dwarves). The Iron Ancestor feels almost invincible, but it will eat up a quarter of your points. I know of other great units from the FF list, like the Bomb-bot. It's upgrade-levels of points, its role is to blow up, and somehow it always survives longer than it should. Or Cheers Brewski, that one soldier I gave a canteen of alcohol to. First one in.
I've also tried branching out into the Plague, the space zombies (a lot like Dead Space), and I never completed it because of my ambition. I wanted a tourism/tropical getaway-themed force, like the Plague infected a resort planet. Bit big for my britches. Anyways, the Plague play so different. Everybody else can solve their problems at range, the Plague solve their problems with melee. So few guns and so very little accuracy, plus a more horde-styled game. Zombies are as cheap as chips but boy are they bad.
I wish, though, that Deadzone had more flavors of forces. There's only 10 factions in the game, as opposed to Kill Team's sourcebook of WH40K. There's GCPS (business imperial guard), Enforcers (business space marines), Mazon Labs (space Umbrella Company), Rebs (Woo go rebels!), Forge Fathers (space dwarves), Vyr-myn(space skaven w/o backstabbing disorder), Asterians(space elves using robots), Marauders (space orks but less funny), Plague (space zombies) and Nameless (space squids. not tyranids).
Forge Fathers, Asterians, and Marauders are all aliens, albeit more fantasy-in-space. Nameless are all wibbly tentacle aliens with biotech. Plague is a super-mutation that mutates almost everything into horrible monsters. Rebels are largely aliens, plus disillusioned humans. Vyr-myn are very likely super-evolved earth rats. Mazon Labs does bad things *with* aliens. It's a greater proportionality of aliens in the game than GW has, but that's because there's a fraction of factions compared to WH40k.
And the Warpath Universe (the official name of the setting) has a lot of different aliens, it's just that humans have kinda taken over everything. Through business. Dreadball, Mantic's space soccer game, introduced a lot of different aliens that I'd love to see expanded into Deadzone.
Also, the Deadzone backstory is a lot different than WH40K, yet has some similarities. Basically, Humanity is undergoing rapid expansion because Megacorporations rule everything and everything is done in the name of business and money. The bleeding edge of their expansion is the proverbial wild west, full of rebels unhappy with the Megacorporations' destructive expansion. Asterians are outside the bubble, using their insufferable wisdom to tell the Megacorporations to not unleash that ancient horrible Plague thingy, but they do so. Orks are immune to Plague's mutation, and are trained as super-soldiers, but they wanted the advanced tech and training for cheap and rebel successfully when they get what they want. Enforcers are human super-soldiers made to replace the Ork Marauders and serve only the 7 most powerful Megacorporations. Forge Fathers want to exploit every resource, like the Megacorporations, but are more religious about it and less business. Nameless are conquering planets and flooding them because Nameless are mostly aquatic and have gotten a bit religiously crazy lately. Ver-myn just get everywhere and will probably try to take over a planet from the inside out. More modern stuff, but definitely human-focused and with fantasy classics suddenly in space. It's like Warhammer 40K got bonked with a Serious Sci-Fi stick.
Please do a Deadzone batrep. Also, Mantic's Fire team ruleset for bigger battles seems great. Like 40k but alternating activations. Seems like with 10th coming GW may be taking some pages from Mantic's playbook for gaming. More simple more fun.
Second that. He already painted Strike teams for it in an earlier episode.
you can get up to 8 dice in a fight: 3 base+charge+size+smash+injured opponent+friend. that's not even counting the extra dice from the command pool.
Imho, GW put more effort into developing Killteam after they saw the early success of Deadzone. Deadzone wins for me, hands down. Much more enjoyable.
Killteam 2 was the system that showed me that I am fine with ditching listbuilding for a more balanced game.
You forgot to mention the "exploding 8's" in Deadzone
... and SPLATS that makes this such a great team-building experience. Each commander allows Your team to do different things!
This game has beautiful models
I see a eob video I click it’s that simple
Well... With this video i learn more about KT than deadzone
Deadzone is an amazing game, and excellent value too!
Thanks for going over both of those.
Intro : very very similar games
Me : hmm no not really
3 mins later : really different
More like it
Necromunda baby!
There is not a better feeling than getting home from University and watching a EOB video
Really? Thats Fascinating.
Informative and refreshing.
Jay, your facial expression game was on point in this video. Sean/Shawn is going down! So, what you are trying to say is that “Dead Zone is suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuper gooooooooooood??? 🤷♂️
The cube system both interests me and puts me off! Same with Kill team - like simpler list building but like idea of points in Dead zone 😂
It is great. It draws you immediately into the scene and action. And no thoughts and discussion about ranges
The cubes are great. You don’t sacrifice freedom or tactical positioning, but movement and shooting is sooooo much faster.
Hex Grid is superior for an isometric tactical game, as you are able to achieve far more organic terrain shapes while maintaining stable basing and believable shapes for a wider variety of scatter terrain.
Deadzone is superb
When Jay went from "cones… no triangles" I immediately thought "goddamn this guy knows the specifics. He is right, and smart as fuck."
I love deadzone, I have proxies for most factions and I'm working on my Plague army
Check out Black Powder Red Earth 28mm! It's so fun, and uses a d10 system!
Mantic Games is better than GW on so many levels
the cover system in the new killteam is 1 of the 2 issues i have with the game which led me to drop the game
the second is list building the full specialist teams are boring and i wish they kept the fireteams and you could trade 2 models for a specialist but also can bring 2 different type of units for fun combos (heck you could even play with 3 fireteams and 1 team arrives in round 2 for bigger games)
and than instead of releasing new versions of existing units, they could just make more new infantry units for every faction, give it 2 weapon options and it's even 2 units
I feel like this video needed some show and tell. It would have help illustrate your points and been much more entertaining. I love Deadzone, and I think it is definitely a better game than Kill Team. The terrain and cubic movement system are beautiful design.
Kill team was the first 40K game I got into and my first exposure to Warhammer and tabletop games. As a very new player, killteam wasn't super difficult to get into but was abit of a learning curve will all the key words and abilities. tbh, I got the hang of it after my second game and found it easier as I got more games in. I found Killteam pretty "new" player friendly, easier to get into trickier to master you know
From that description, I think I would enjoy Deadzone more actually. I don’t play either currently, but I am invested in 40k. I suppose I could always use 40k models in Deadzone too since the rules are more mini agnostic right? I know KoW is pretty model agnostic
It's Def mostly the same. It's not as 1-1 with fantasy as KoW is though.
Some factions will be easier to proxy than others. I’d say Orks and Squats transfer really well.
I dunno man. A lot of the minis seem VERY similar to 40k. For example the marauder commandos... Those would be perfect add ons to an ork army
DZ is the Cleanest game out there. Great story. I really like the models as well. Veer-myn especially. I am also working on my KT warband... We will if GW ruleset got... any better over lat 15 years.
What were your thoughts on Star Wars Legion special operations?
Been meaning to pick up all of Mantic's stuff, actually.
Its funny how Shadow War Armageddon is better than Kill Team despite being based off of 1990s Necromunda. Actually, BECAUSE its based off 1990s Necromunda. I miss those days...
OPR Grimdark Future Firefight for me. simpler than either, quick and fun.
Deadzone is the parkour action movie that I often wish Kill Team was.
I thought of a better comparison: Kill Team is Batman at his most angsty emo. Deadzone is Deadpool. Sometimes I want one one and sometimes I want the other.
Would love to see a let's play fallout game haven't seen it played before and find that you explain things really well
I'm really into the more skirmish-style games coming out these days. I think it encourages more people to try games out and play with a variety of people!
Deadzone is pretty much my favourite skirmish game. But as a content whore, I can't really cover it on my channel outside of a one-off video :(
I’ve been wanting to use dead zone vehicles as proxies
From my perspective, Deadzone is a better game but Kill Team has way better miniatures.
Deadzone is life ❤❤❤
Fun listen while I was cleaning up some prints. I gotta respectfully disagree with you on the engage/conceal orders. I think how tricky it is, and how much it changes based on your and your enemy's team adds a lot to the replay ability of the game, and having to adjust your plans for the inevitable mistake leading to a key op dying or your enemy taking control.of the board because you didn't pressure enough adds a lot to the game. I think it would feel gamey or flat if it was easy to tell which to do all the time and would just turn into another mindless min/max situation like the list building already is.
To each their own, not trying to say anyone's wrong at the end of the day. Just offering a different perspective. Thanks for the fun video.
are you going to restock the xl "say no" t shirt any time soon? also have you guys ever thought about selling your old patreon terrain on you guy's merch store?
I know how much Jay does every week, I'm wondering if he could possibly have more to say? If only he could have explained that in this clip. I'm also curious if the show is filmed before a live audience.
That was one of the things that instantly turned me off KT2021, Jay, I liked that KT2018 allowed me to choose "a variety of models in my faction," rather than feeling limited to 'the contents of this single set of sprues exactly?'
I think killteam having conceal and engage orders is one of the best aspects. It makes it feel more dynamic and video gamey which is really cool imo
You know you don't have to deploy they way the game tells you to right? It's called narrative gameplay.
The rolling more dice thing I think is one of the reason I've fallen so much in love with the Kroot Farstalker Kinband KT. They have a strategic ploy called cut-throats where all melee attacks gain 1 more dice to a maximum of 5. The killteam already has 3 pretty scary melee units in the stalker, cutskin and hounds but with cut-throats they all become just that little bit scarier. Plus it means that all your normal units go from capable in melee to pretty good. Plus it's just so satisfying to roll that extra dice.
got that little bit of butt sticking out problem with the old squatting orc infantry - i love those thick boys
Maybe the Rampant games?
Kill team is awesome but line of fire rules suck when dealing with terrain.
The main thing about wysiwyg is the sillyness that some situations it puts you in. Yes it's better for roleplay (or is it ?) but it makes things way more goofier tahn they should IN A GAME ;)
What I love about Malifaux and all other bases-based LoS system, is that it still allows for very subtil placement and pro tweaking for LoS, but it also do not ruin your day because, you know, the tip of the gun is visible so my model will rip a hole on the body of their target xD That's stupid !
So, to sum things up a little, I'd say "I'm all about dat base" :D
#deadzone is better than kill team... everything is better : price, book, rules..................even miniatures begin good now (mantic produce at archon studio now...)
Cool as always.
Thank you for your passion and your work. Apparently you're the only one who really cares about #OGA. I was really hoping that we would see a lot of other games. How to play and what makes them better/different, but 3 weeks into April we have a handful of content creators with not many videos. You are the only one explaining other games in detail. The rest is "just" painting non-GW models... It feels like a missed opportunity and that nobody really cares (except you). Not even Miniac has released a video now. I'm sad :)
I'll just leave this right here...
#deadzoneislife
"Warhammer Underpants"... LOL
Day one of jay to talk about battletech
I liked the old Kill Team, but I really dislike the new one. The engage/conceal mechanic absolutely destroys the game. I also dislike Games Workshop rules in general. They always write tournament rules, usually using a paragraph to describe what can be expressed in a sentence. I’m a really uncompetitive player, and I’ve realised most of GW just isn’t for me. I just got my hands on an old Deadzone 2013 box, so I will be trying this game out very soon. I see a lot in this game I might like.
I could totally be trippin’ but is the couch new? 😂
Played Kill Team until recently with a few friends but just switched to Marvel Crisis Protocol. So much easier to explain to newbies and super fun!
My Friend love you videos
The problem with kill team is the totally unnecessary books and the expensive terrain. Also no matter what you tell me, conceal doesn't exist in the spacehulk gamemodes
I almost bought it when I was looking for a fun, dynamic, simple game to play with my wife. But the models are far from the quality of other brands (including GW), they kept me away from the game. Too bad because the rules look awesome!
I thought the minis looked alright but admittedly I've never held them in person so can't attest to their quality.
But if you like the rules better than Kill Team couldn't you sub in other models you do like?
@@johnoneill3654 I could but to be honest I'm not a big fan of proxies, I feel like the official models are supposed to be the perfect match for both the universe and the rules of the game, and any other models are less appropriate. Nothing depicts a boltgun better than an actual boltgun. That's why I also don't like much miniature agnostic games, but it's just me.
But as extreme as it sounds, when I play a game it's with the official models or not at all.
@@ThomasGallinari
To each their own 👍
I will admit to being the same when I first started the hobby. I've since come to love numerous systems. Many of which are miniature agnostic.
I now find that I see the minis as the secondary part and the system as the primary where as it was reversed originally.
look at the more recent offerings, they're way better.
@@samsowden I did, the most recent giant rats are pretty decent but I find they don't look as good as GW or Infinity. It may be due to the paint job though.
I should try that website, maybe I can get some skills to beat my wife in a game!! Hahah!! Thanks gents! Fantastic as always!!!
Hello
Day 10 of asking for a Centurion Squad magnetization and green stuff conversion video.
hehe, warhammer underpants.
Killteam sounds atrocious
Deadzone... The game that took up space at the game store for years. Collecting dust, occasionally being shuffled around to make room for other games.
I remember someone talking about it once. About how it "wasn't 40k" and I remember how we all laughed.
It was sad to see the store close. Those Deadzone boxes sustained and nearly solid grey with dust never left the shelf until the day the store closed it's doors for good.
This has become Other Hobbies April for me. Like most mini gamers, I chose.my game almost 25 years ago, I'm not going to start some other mini game that doesn't have any players anywhere within a few hundred miles.
Please show don't tell
Play bushido noob
If you roll six 6s the chance of your next roll being a natural 6 is 1/6...
Whoop whoop 🎉🎉 kill team is well ace
Lol
eeeeek! first!
And ?
@@Gumball_Watterson1997 1st = Legend ( everyone knows that )
@@Gumball_Watterson1997 Do not question the first Geneseed.
Meh, Necromunda is still better.
I can't believe he still hasn't tried it. I could swear that one of his videos said he actually bought the starter set.