What is it like being an Iranian Woman in Estonia?
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- Опубліковано 29 тра 2024
- Welcome to the second episode of the Life in Estonia podcast. My guest today is Elnaz, she is from Iran and she has been in Estonia for the last 2 years.
You can find her on LinkedIn at / elisign
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My experience as an Albanian immigrant in Estonia has been everything, but what was described in this video, and I have been living here for 2 years. First thing you mentioned was having a strong passport and getting citizenship, but not even wanting to learn the language... In my opinion, that is really absurd. And there are FREE Estonian courses offered by Integration Foundation. There are Ukrainians in my group that have been displaced because of the war and they are learning Estonian, even though they speak Russian and wouldn't have any issues finding work or getting around. Personally, I haven't had it difficult because I speak Russian and English, and I have been studying Estonian for a year now. I found a work within 4 months of relocating here that didn't require me to speak any Estonian, I got my residence permit for 5 years, very little bureaucracy, and I rented an apartment 3 months after starting a job. The landlords just need to know that you are employed, a clean person and that you have a stable salary; there's no racism in the process. Also with Rendin, it is easier to apply for rent.
The electronics are affordable, and also if you have a contract with Elisa for example or any other provider, you can get a phone and pay for it up to 36 months, with no interest.
I come from a country that also has a lot of variety when it comes to food, but there are a lot of choices with all the shops around here: Prisma, Rimi, Coop, Maxima, etc. Also, there are a lot of restaurants all around Tallinn.
Estonian cuisine also has some nice recipes. I've been obsessed recently with soolaseenesalat❤I also love mulgikapsas.
The weather is something I also complain about from time to time, but you should see the positive sides and take part in winter sports, visit Estonia countryside, etc.
In the end you mentioned again that you cannot get Estonian passport, but you aren't even putting some efforts onto it. According to www.politsei.ee/en/instructions/estonian-citizenship-for-an-adult you should have lived in Estonia "for at least eight years on the ground of a residence permit or by right of residence, of which at least the last five years on a permanent basis".
Also, worth mentioning, I have received very good medical care here, my family doctor is really good and I have had surgery performed by specialists where I only had to pay a 5 EUR fee. Also the workplace and the doctors are very understandable when it comes to dealing with mental health.
As an Estonian I’m glad that your experience has been so positive!
Përshëndetje! I didn't expect to find an Albanian who lives in my county and learns my language, which is kinda funny as I've been learning Albanian for two years now.
I'm happy that so far you have enjoyed your time here and haven't experienced too many problems.
From what I understood of her story, she came here because her husband got a job here and she thought that she can get a job in IT without having official education & work experience in IT?
I graduated with specialization in IT half a decade ago and even as a native I've been unable to find a job in IT outside of a single internship I managed to get, since I lack the work experience in IT...
Big thanks. In order to understand why Estonians are the way they are, you must visit the Estonian Open Air Museum. Even 150 years ago, Estonians lived in houses without a chimney. The living room was also a room for drying grain. Due to the scarcity of wood, tree branches were used to heat the oven. Thanks to the Swedish era, Estonia had a high literacy rate, over 90%. While in the Russian Empire literacy was around 30%. Estonians were farmers. The owners of the manors were usually Germans. Equality between the sexes came from the fact that Nordic nature did not give gifts. The man was like an agronomist and the woman was like a zoo technician. Zootehnik depends on agronomist and agronomist on Zootehnik, and they are connected by children who do part of the work. Estonians have always believed in education. The smartest child in the farm was sent to school in the city.
Denying renting for foreigners is mostly because people are looking for long term tenants, nothing to do with racism. She said herself how she wanted to leave the country right away after she realised the winter keeps coming back
Do they have food from every single country in iran
As an Iranian, I do not agree with these words. I also know many Iranians who do not think this way. Personally, I have not seen racism in Estonia yet after 3 years, but I believe racism exists in all countries somehow even in my home country. However, what I experienced in Estonia was kindness. regarding renting apartment, my landlord never asked me where you are from. She trusted my words without asking me for documents and signed a long-term contract with me. I also fully appreciate her trust, because honesty and trust are the most important behavioral values for me. I have not had any problems with groceries yet. Whenever I needed something for cooking, I've usually found it in shops with a little online search. Plus, Estonia's digital government system is really efficient. Please don't generalize these personal opinions to a community.
I don't know where you're living in Estonia but maybe there is also a difference in tolerance between different cities like Tallinn and Tartu e. g. What I absolutely don't understand is that she doesn't want to learn Estonian. I can't understand how you can live in a country and don't know at least the basics of the offcial language there. I speak English and Russian and still would learn some Estonian if I moved there.
I wonder which country one would easily find a job without learning any local language?
@healthy reminder same in Estonia, she was talking about getting passport, not permanent resident card
I think it's all about the job you want as shop keeper or something like that you need Estonian language and also Russian, if you talk English Estonian and Russian then all fine. But for random jobs English is ok.
Although she was smiling all the time, her story and expressions tells me that she is sad and disappointed, maybe even depressed. Estonia wasn't her preference and she maybe is missing her previous life, family, friends. She doesn't want to be here, she really cant go back either, she is not completely free in her choices, she's victim of the circumstances. Ask her about best things in Estonia and she isn't able to mention much more than free public transport in Tallinn - my conclusion is that she had been living last 2 years indoors or in some expat bubble and hasn't really experienced Estonia.
She wants to go away, not because somewhere else is definitely better life waiting, but because she want's to escape, not to escape the country, but to escape from her sadness for what she blames Estonia she never truly lived in. There is proverb "you can take wolf out from forest, but you cant take forest out from wolf." Maybe same applies to this lady, it's difficult to change herself to accustom with living in European environment.
(All this is a lot of assumptions and guessing, but that is feeling I got after watching this).
I think she should visit both life couch and therapist, seriously. Still she should take her life into her own hands and start doing something useful with her life, start living like European woman. I propose starting from taking language lessons. There are jobs outside of IT sector, Töötukassa is financing all kinds of training and events what helps to blend in. There is no Estonian language requirement for English teachers I think.
Refusing to rent to foreigners is mainly down to having less means to hold the renter accountable. If a foreigner trashes the place and flies back to Iran or Pakistan, what avenue does a private landlord have to hunt them down and get compensated?
It's sad/funny that an aggressive sounding shop clerk is for her a proof of societal racism. What kind of commonality and society can you have with people who think this way? Like Robert Putnam noted 30 years ago already, multiculturalism creates distrust and loss of society both among natives and migrants alike. At the same time, nothing about this woman says she's least bit interested in fitting in with the local culture. She's here with her husband, fine, but frankly Estonia could also do without all the woke tech companies who import foreigners like her husband in the first place.
Putting Helsinki as a positive example of "cosmopolitanism" is also ridiculous. The city we once most looked up to now has literal ghettoes, and immigrant street gangs.
did I really understand that the question of where you are from is racism for you? Like really? I don't even know how to respond to such fear or opinion. This is such an embarrassingly wrong idea, an opinion. For us, it's a way to get to know each other, to start a conversation, and there's not nathing of racism in it. On the contrary, it is an indication that we are interested in learning more about your story and activities.
At the same time, our very small nation has had to fight for its rights and culture for centuries. Therefore, we treat strangers with great caution. Russia has brought its people in here and in this era has corrupted the essence of our nation. Not that it justifies bad behavior, but it is changed. We have our own inner humor - everything bad comes from the east. Russia and the arrogant behavior of its people are meant. Of course, today's young people travel much more and are more tolerant of different cultures, so openness improves over the years.
I myself go to Spain in the winter time and there are not the foods whitch we are used to either. You have to be resourceful or learn to give up or replace food. Besides, we think it's nice to get to know another nation through their food culture and find the part you still like. It is interesting and educational.
With the war in Syria, families from there came to our tiny hometown, and you can see the frightened, suppressed attitudes in the eyes of these women. They brought it with them from their own land and did not originate here. Submitting to your husband, petty jealousy and reproaches from him soon became public here, and this is a part that our people do not tolerate. For us, this is mental violence in the family and there is no justification for it. These are things that the people of the East should understand when they come here. You come to another culture, here are our rules. When we come to your country, we respect yours there, even if we don't like them.
Thank you for your reply! I am also an immigrant woman from a country where there is very little women's right and women face a lot of violence. When people ask me "where are you from", I don't think it is racism, but I still refuse to answer. The name of my birth country is dirty and I hate my birth country. I don't want to say its name. I only love Estonia. And I don't really like the "multi-culturalism" in many western countries. Multi-culturalism is usually used as an excuse for domestic violence, rape, etc committed by immigrants. And most victims of such crimes are immigrant women.
I live in Latvia - actually some 40km from Estonian border - and I know Renting Apartments to foreigners is here also a big problem - in particular now for Ukrainians, who are white race, but they are still not trusted so much & landlords are looking for a long term stable tenants - and they consider Ukrainians or some other foreigners may leave as they wish.... This is not particularly about racism.... But another problem in Baltic states - I think many people just are curious - they have never had any contacts with, let say, blacks or muslims or similar people - like if you would imagine a white person in Nigeria - where most people are black & haven't seen a white person often - it would be the same..
lol as estonian we love english but we hate bossy people its nothing todo with skin color
If you openly say that you don't have a plan and will to learn the Estonian language, then do not be surprised if people don't like you. We don't like bossy people who are coming to force their culture on us.
Everything is expensive here also because it's a small market. All the costs need to be earned back with smaller sales compared with Germany for example. They sell 10K memory cards, in Estonia you sell 100 memory cards etc.
Manan, these videos are so valuable to me in understanding so many aspects of Estonian culture. Thank you!
Happy to hear that!
No matter where you're from, it's really all in your own hands to start businesses selling food from your culture, especially if you want it to be authentic. If Estonians did it, it would probably never taste right to you or it would be called cultural appropriation etc.
And I think it's a problem how for Western European countries, it's always just lone examples of racist people, otherwise the countries are thought of as tolerant, yet for a country like Estonia, many have preexisting stereotypes of it being non-progressive, therefore a few examples become basis for generalization of the whole population.
By the way, if you went to Japan and they wanted a Japanese-speaking person for an internship, would that be discrimination? If I went to Iran not knowing Farsi, for example, and they were looking for a Farsi-speaking intern, if I said it was discrimination, would I not be called an entitled westerner?
I am pretty sure that here are a lot of good restaurants with Iranian food in Iran, and she already knows the language. These type of people should stay in their own country.
A bit of an awkward watch tbh.
I would suggest discussing talking points before the interview. Then as a host, it would make it easier for you to guide the interviewee through the interview.
On the subject of becoming a citizen. Is there any countries that give out cizinship without knowing national language? Unless it's some sort of a honourary thing, it doesn't really make sense.
Yes, learning and doing at the same time. Lots of room for improvement. Thank you for watching.
Off the top of my head, Sweden doesn’t require a language test.
@@MananAnwar Ok, but it still doesn't make sense to me.
Also i just want you to know that i enjoy your content.
@@veikov7766 thank you.
Sweden is rare example, and now it turns out so that immigrants who are able or willing to learn new things and to integrate with locals, settle anywhere else in Europe, whereas all those who don't want or are not able to learn new things end up in Sweden. I don't think this is good for Sweden in long term.
Reading a lot of defensive comments at the bottom of this vid. Come on guys, everyone experiences life differently.
If Estonia is not a fit for her, that is ok. I hope she finds somewhere she belongs better.
If Estonia has been good to you, awesome. I hope it continues to be so. Glad to have you, welcome home. Even if it is just one of your homes.
If not, I hope you find your place and thanks for bringing your voice to the table. You'll help us grow better.
That’s a very mature comment.
Hey manan, thanks for the video.
If you want to move away just because you don't want to learn Estonian language then good luck finding happiness somewhere else. But before you move please check that your future country doesn't have language exam, it's common around Europe.
I couldn't imagine living somewhere more than a year and not starting to learn local language.
Thank you Manan and Elnaz.
You’re welcome /Manan
Memory card ? 300?
Only super high spec or rare data devices are so expensive.
Also only buy any computer related item from an actual computer store not Euronics or other general one as they add a massive sum (Also Euronics constantly gets sued and looses as they have bad practices and do not follow law).
The funniest moment of this video is when an Eastern woman says that she never cooked b4 relocated to Estonia. It made my day 😅
I live in Latvia - actually some 40km from Estonian border - and I know Renting Apartments to foreigners is here also a big problem - in particular now for Ukrainians, who are white race, but they are still not trusted so much & landlords are looking for a long term stable tenants - and they consider Ukrainians or some other foreigners may leave as they wish.... This is not particularly about racism.... But another problem in Baltic states - I think many people just are curious - they have never had any contacts with, let say, blacks or muslims or similar people - like if you would imagine a white person in Nigeria - where most people are black & haven't seen a white person often - it would be the same..
Great funeral video Manan!
I got the sense that she wasn't entirely comfortable during the interview especially when the subject of the situation for women in Estonia vs the women of Iran.
She probably wants to be able to go back to Iran without any issues.. or keep her relatives save.
She want's to keep her Iranian passport, sounds to me like her husband plans to move back to Iran someday.
Excuse me i have question im 21 yo and i live in iran I'm software engineer student and I will be graduating in 2 years iam considering continue my studies in Estonia is it good idea?
Depends on long term goals. If you want citizenship then not a good idea.
That racism is only in her head, but if you don't like it you can always leave.
🤡 GiveMeEyeballs
Nah, racism is definitely real. And it is an issue everywhere, not only in Estonia.
@@martinkoitmae6655 racism may be real, but not the way she described it anyways.
@@emis7272 it can be real... but i don't think her skin colour is problem ... in estonia there are lot of ppl from caucasus and they look pretty much like her....
@Manan - I think you handled this interview very well, especially when trying to bring a different perspective on the 'racism experience' and then moving on with a different topic...
Thank you Ingel. Your encouragement means a lot to me. Please join our discord if you can, would be great to have you: discord.gg/C6k4ezGNRS
She is so beautiful!
Manan you have a estonian axent or im i grazy
Correct, not rasism but anti immigrants past year or 2.
Many hate the situation they are forced into due to so many immingants and refugees who get gov. support and they are also made priority in social systems and Estonians have started to have bad problems due to it.
The gov. leaders has made some demands from the systems but have not given enought support and funding so it has been taken from mostly Estonians (have lideraly seen several problems, situations and complications).
Being beautiful as a woman anywhere is not difficult
Rudeness or impoliteness towards someone who happens to be of a different race is not necessarily racism. It has usually nothing to do with race, some people are just rude. What is lately that everything is racism
I agree with your first sentence.
I've worked as software developer in 4 different companies here and not one has required Estonian as a working language.
Software and tech is a completely different field that doesn't require languge.
@@MananAnwar She's looking for work as a QA/test engineer. Most software teams have a QA in the same team as the developers.
Friend of friend rented apartment to someone from India, and later repainted walls and ceilings to get it free from strong smell of curry.
Yup as an Indian I can say that it happens in cold countries because Indian houses are airy and very openly ventilated, folks going to cold countries don't realise that. Modern kitchens with electric chimneys help a lot and I usually used to get a cleaner to clean everything every week when I was in seattle.
I sent several letters to your email address but never heard back. Was there some sort of glitch in receiving them or did you change your mind? If you simply changed your mind, it is no problem; just delete this comment and I will not bother you again.
Please check and see if you got my reply.
@@MananAnwar Yes, I did. Thanks. The delay is quite understandable.
She want Iran outside Iran...
I would ask how a Caucasian European Christian would get by in Lahore without a head scarf? Or without risk of being attacked by extremists? Please note I am focusing on belief systems ideas and thought systems NOT on the hypothetical host nation’s inmutable characteristics. Hopefully you don’t elide race and religion?
Headscarf as a requirement is unique to Iran. Lahore is a city in Pakistan where women don't have any state mandated requirements for coverings.
@@MananAnwar ooops yeah sorry I forgot what a tolerant and liberal country P is! Lmfao! most of the people have a conservative mindset regarding clothing restrictions on women and girls. But of course, no honour killings here move along…no child brides, no cousin marriage…move along nothing here ….at least nothing more than in Rotherham (check out grooming gangs 89% of them from one cultural and religious grouping). Sorry don’t come at me with this straw man argument!
Hey for food lets meet up in the hiiumaa and i make something good for you both :)
You know very well that I will take you up on this offer right ?
@@MananAnwar I think best time is "Kohvikute päevad" then all people on island will cook something good 😊 But if you come now then I will offer you best fish we can get "Tuulehaug" smoked fried dry that fish is delicious all the way :)
In Estonia if you say "I have no plan to learn the language" you will definitely not get a normal job. Actually I wonder where would you. Unless you were really irreplacable. ARE you all that irreplacable?
Even if it is not required for work, learning Estonian will open doors that you will never know existed.
Why coming into an country and not learning the language? thats rude!
She comes across as entitled and thinks she's better than Estonians.
Racism is so stupid. Sad that she had to experience that.
mukltikulti is very bad
did not cook before? wtf?