I feel like it has less to do with raw reaction time and more to do with a smooth flow of actions, if that makes sense (maybe from lower actuation force, idk). In my own experience, moving from a blue/razer green switches to a speed switch was noticeable to me in my gameplay. Actions seemed much more fluid, although it's a bit hard to describe the exact sensation.
Tbh the switches i enjoy the most for gaming are 63g linears. Slowly learned that heavy tactiles are tiring to use typing and gaming and prefer lighter tactiles such as Penguin switches and pewter switches. Personally I just found switches that are good for both gaming and typing.
You need to test the wooting keyboard and software . They have a 0.1 mm actuation distance but also have a 0.1 mm actuation on the release, so things like strafing must be noticeably quicker and more controllable . As long as the spring somewhat resistant it should be a great product
I could imagine that the heavier tactile switches are worse when you have to repeatedly tap a key with a weaker finger, like trying to press A 3 times to move some cursor left in a speedrun and only getting 2 actuations.
Can’t think of any flaw in the methodology of your testing. Seems really concise. Bummed that there’s basically no difference. I would have loved to see an apex pro at it’s lowest actuation get tested against MX blues or browns. Differences in actuation, spring weight, and method of input(hall effect vs traditional contact). The portlygamer tested optical silvers(45g) vs optical yellows(35g) and he saw vastly different numbers and switch and click did some testing like this on their website and they found only minor differences between linears and tactiles. Thanks for doing this kind of testing! I know it’s tedious, but it’s valuable info.
All I play is FPS games namely Call of Duty and as far as input, it's all about your *mouse.* The worst thing is having "fast switches" on a keyboard that you absolutely cannot stand. Personally I use Holy Pandas on a modded Drop Signature CTRL High Profile keyboard with excellent quality GMK keycaps.
Thank you for the reassurance. I had thought about this since I really like the silver smoothies and I was annoyed that I could be using a faster switch but I thought it wouldn't make a difference. I'm glad to know it doesn't mean anything.
@@DruxDiff well they are physically more reliably consistent and actuate at a closer total distance, so each time you use it, over time all the savings and responsiveness begins to add up and everything becomes smoother and cleaner, scientifically.
I really like this video, showing that human error has a bigger impact on the performance, than the tool you use. Although i want to point out, that using a mechanical keyboard (which has linear travel path) seems better to me than a membrane keyboard ( which jumps between the two ends of the press) (i tested with a cheaper membrane keyboard). Although it doesn't makes you much faster.
You should have tested Optical or hall Effect switches, like the Razer Huntsman or Steelseries Apex Pro. They are contactless and have no debounce delay, so should be more responsive, and you can also alter the actuation distance.
Here's a question to this video. If this is right, why do typists that try 3.0mm total travel switches or lower, write faster on them, than on full switches??? The testing is wrong. Typing test is best to see which switch is faster, but you need a similar layout keyboard. Shorter actuation switches are not faster. Shorter travel switches ARE. Get cherry blue and compare it with kailh choc blue. You will you pick up a little bit more speed with the kailh chocs. Dota/starcraft/mmo/moba games are ideal to test aswell. When you press the keys 5 times per second, it's completly another story.
Dude thank you so much for shining light on that topic. I can't count how often I got comments on my keyboardreviews stating the keyboard is bad because it doesn't has speed switches -.-
Sehr cool, dich auch hier zu sehen/ lesen ! :-) Lob geht raus an Dich und deine Videos. Top Job & weiter so ! Wirst du Razers neues Flagship Keyboard auch unter die Lupe nehmen ?
Interesting results. Thanks for taking the time to do the testing. I would just recommend trying to stick with 1 keyboard and changing switches to reduce the variables. Based on my own testing between 2 different keyboards, km360 with cherry red (polling rate?) and kemove 61 with kailh box silent pink (1000Hz in software), there's a pretty noticeable difference of 20-40ms when using those reaction time/scan rate testing websites. Could it be the switches? Could it be the keyboards? I don't know, but rtings shows there's latency differences between different keyboards and that seems to be consistent with my own results. All that being said, I'm not a pro but I feel like I can tell the difference of 5ms (if not lower). Maybe it's not in an overly obvious sense (maybe it's all in my head), but something will feel off in game. I don't know if it actually impacts performance but, to me, lower latency just feels better.
I can say from experiance your keyboard or how fast the switch is dooes not hold u back i went from using a custom gk61 fulled lubed foamed and tape modded with gateron optical yellow switches which have a 1mm-0.4mm travel distance to a idabao idb80 v2 crystal edition with ivory holldy panda switches which have around a 2mm actuation and there wasnt a differance in my gameplay and im a very competitive player at the end of the day how good ypu do isnt based off of your switches or the price of your keyboard it comes down to your reaction speed i used one of the fastest linear switches you can buy then switched to a tactile and my gameplay didnt change and yet again the price has nothing to do with how well you do my gk61 custom was about 120$ and my idabao idb80 crystal was around 314$ and i performed just as well im a pro fortnite player always in champs at around 18k points and a masters overwatch player, a immortal val player and a diamond apex player and i still did just as well so no ypur keyboard does not hold ypu back
People claiming that they can feel the difference between a signal flowing through the switch pins when metal contacts meet and when light an an optocoupler is involved, are the same people using aviator cables for aesthetics, when it looks basically just like a guitar jack plug while adding 2 points of failure on your keeb. Shit like these make them feel special. They'll always find a way to milk the gullible ones.
Woah I am hyped to watch this! I hate those Razer and Corsair advertisements and I always thought the same thing, it's the person that's slow, not the hardware! At least that was my opinion. Edit: I fucking knew it! Sooo many people suck up those ads for fast gaming keyboards, it's just a scam.
Not even kidding but there is a noticeable difference between the G Pro Wireless and the Viper Ultimate. Viper just feels more responsive when moving the cursor around in Windows and in games.
242 to 256 ms, You telling me a supermega hybrid between Optimus Prime and a Pro gamer (those you describe with super human whatever) will notice a difference in 14 ms? Damn... I don't know m8, but nobody in this world can notice that. The blinking average time are 100ms, that is the "time" our brain considers as the shortest snap mechanical reaction of the body (because we train our brain since born to "go with the flow" with the lid that closes on our eyes every now or then). Science, you say it often in the video and in your videos, with your testing. But that statement of "Some pros will notice" is out of your medical license or optical physics degree. Also misleading, you will create the false illusion that because Pros would notice it, if you buy it, when you get to "pro" you will have the best thing, and this is Marketing, total marketing (bs to sell).
For me my issue is trying to find a keyboard that is as quiet as my Deathstalker Chroma but or as close as possible with a mech switch or even membrane if only way. Any suggestions from anyone welcome :)
Go linear for quiet. If you want mech sw, go Logitech gl tactile. If you ask for membrane, gtfo of here. You can't just go to a supermarket to ask the cashier if you want Apple juice or Piss in a bottle. Or you want membrane, or mech. You can't have in between (because those in between sucks ballz)
Sorry, I just can't get into those 60% keyboards. They look so silly, and my brain just can't comprehend that small-ish size. The fact you didn't test TKL and Full Sized keyboards is a little bothersome. I have the SteelSeries Apex 7 with Red Linear switches, and I must say, going from membrane, to Blue clicky (the Havit K389L), to this one is like night and day. Going from membrane to mechanical was amazing, and going from blue clicky to red linear, again, AMAZING! So, my question is: What would a SteelSeries Apex 7 with OMNI-POINT switches do in this comparison? From all I've heard and read, the Omni-Point switches are as fast if not faster than opto-mechanical switches. Would this make a difference? How about comparing the Corsair K100, the Razer Huntsman, and the SteelSeries Apex 7, all with either Opto-mechanical, Analog, and/or Omni-Point switches, and see if there is a noticeable difference between the three, and if those switches can make a gamer "better". Otherwise, great video.....I always love watching these!
I totally get not liking smaller keyboards but since I was only focusing on the switches the size of the keyboard really don't matter for this test. the Omni point switches have dynamic actuation points that you could change but the main reason I didn't show more switches is that after testing a healthy range of distances there really was no reason to keep testing more boards as the result would have just been the same.
@@Brainbean Thanks for the reply.....I agree that at a certain point, it no longer comes down to the switches/keys, and is the human factor that is key here. I DO say that between membrane and mechanical, there is no contest. Mechanical wins every time. Great review, and keep 'em coming!
@@Bolasnegras They are supposed to be more resilient to double clicking but once a single important key starts acting up you still have to replace the board or desolder everything. Hot swap PCBs are probably the way to go if durability is your main concern since replacement switches are dirt cheap. Most optical gaming boards also cost twice as much as a no name gateron would so you better hope they are durable to get your moneys worth.
@@VivaLaRazsa Have you ever experienced that a Cherry or Gateron with 50.000.000 Keystrokes minimum died because of regular use? The longer durability of Optical switches is pointless. If my math is correct and you use one switch every second, 8 hours every day in a year, than you have with 50 Mill Cherry switches a Lifespan of over 4 (!) Years. You dont use every switch every second.
@@ryoken9563 Well the fact that they usually die way sooner (because of dust and debris in the environment which is not included in the rating) make sense, you basically get 4x the durability because those dust won't affect optical switches as much as mechanical
I feel like it has less to do with raw reaction time and more to do with a smooth flow of actions, if that makes sense (maybe from lower actuation force, idk). In my own experience, moving from a blue/razer green switches to a speed switch was noticeable to me in my gameplay. Actions seemed much more fluid, although it's a bit hard to describe the exact sensation.
I think because you can get tactile feedback sooner, you can move on to your next keypresses sooner?
You are seriously so underrated. Love the effort you put into this!
Tbh the switches i enjoy the most for gaming are 63g linears. Slowly learned that heavy tactiles are tiring to use typing and gaming and prefer lighter tactiles such as Penguin switches and pewter switches. Personally I just found switches that are good for both gaming and typing.
You need to test the wooting keyboard and software . They have a 0.1 mm actuation distance but also have a 0.1 mm actuation on the release, so things like strafing must be noticeably quicker and more controllable . As long as the spring somewhat resistant it should be a great product
I could imagine that the heavier tactile switches are worse when you have to repeatedly tap a key with a weaker finger, like trying to press A 3 times to move some cursor left in a speedrun and only getting 2 actuations.
Can’t think of any flaw in the methodology of your testing. Seems really concise. Bummed that there’s basically no difference. I would have loved to see an apex pro at it’s lowest actuation get tested against MX blues or browns. Differences in actuation, spring weight, and method of input(hall effect vs traditional contact).
The portlygamer tested optical silvers(45g) vs optical yellows(35g) and he saw vastly different numbers and switch and click did some testing like this on their website and they found only minor differences between linears and tactiles. Thanks for doing this kind of testing! I know it’s tedious, but it’s valuable info.
Wanted to see my personal keyboard, the Apex Pro go up against the others
Name one pro gamer who is using steel series with omni switches
All I play is FPS games namely Call of Duty and as far as input, it's all about your *mouse.* The worst thing is having "fast switches" on a keyboard that you absolutely cannot stand. Personally I use Holy Pandas on a modded Drop Signature CTRL High Profile keyboard with excellent quality GMK keycaps.
Thank you for the reassurance. I had thought about this since I really like the silver smoothies and I was annoyed that I could be using a faster switch but I thought it wouldn't make a difference. I'm glad to know it doesn't mean anything.
Ngl I did see a difference from my Razer Red's Optical vs my old Green's. They felt alot more responsive!
That could also be because they are more smooth
Or it could be a Placebo effect.
@@DruxDiff lol true dat
@@DruxDiff well they are physically more reliably consistent and actuate at a closer total distance, so each time you use it, over time all the savings and responsiveness begins to add up and everything becomes smoother and cleaner, scientifically.
How did it impact your typing experience?
Thanks for putting in the presses. You really pushed everyone's buttons on this one! =)
I really like this video, showing that human error has a bigger impact on the performance, than the tool you use. Although i want to point out, that using a mechanical keyboard (which has linear travel path) seems better to me than a membrane keyboard ( which jumps between the two ends of the press) (i tested with a cheaper membrane keyboard).
Although it doesn't makes you much faster.
Love the b-roll on the “warm up”!
Thanks for the efforts! That must be a tedious work😂
Love your energy, first video insta sub
Awesome review. I needed this lol. So what is your switch of choice to game with
You should have tested Optical or hall Effect switches, like the Razer Huntsman or Steelseries Apex Pro. They are contactless and have no debounce delay, so should be more responsive, and you can also alter the actuation distance.
Yeah I wish he included the apex pro.
It’s about the USB port, you won’t be getting these speeds with even a USB 3.1 Gen 2
@@carribean71 nope it's not. Read the title
@@Ahmmunition it’s a fact lmao
Great video!
Here's a question to this video. If this is right, why do typists that try 3.0mm total travel switches or lower, write faster on them, than on full switches???
The testing is wrong. Typing test is best to see which switch is faster, but you need a similar layout keyboard.
Shorter actuation switches are not faster. Shorter travel switches ARE. Get cherry blue and compare it with kailh choc blue. You will you pick up a little bit more speed with the kailh chocs.
Dota/starcraft/mmo/moba games are ideal to test aswell. When you press the keys 5 times per second, it's completly another story.
Dude thank you so much for shining light on that topic.
I can't count how often I got comments on my keyboardreviews stating the keyboard is bad because it doesn't has speed switches -.-
Sehr cool, dich auch hier zu sehen/ lesen ! :-) Lob geht raus an Dich und deine Videos. Top Job & weiter so ! Wirst du Razers neues Flagship Keyboard auch unter die Lupe nehmen ?
@@rottenmann6505 haha danke:) ja werde ich machen und ist auch schon bestellt allerdings steckt es irgendwo zwischen deutschland und hongkong fest -_-
As an ex competitive typist of sorts, I'd not know since I stuck with a membrane for my whole journey lol
HOWW??!!
The reason that people don't buy Black because it's tiring to use, or too noisy with Blue.
I see a big difference I used to use cherry browns and now I actually glorious pandas. My gaming is so bad now I’m not used to this slow stuff
Interesting results. Thanks for taking the time to do the testing. I would just recommend trying to stick with 1 keyboard and changing switches to reduce the variables.
Based on my own testing between 2 different keyboards, km360 with cherry red (polling rate?) and kemove 61 with kailh box silent pink (1000Hz in software), there's a pretty noticeable difference of 20-40ms when using those reaction time/scan rate testing websites. Could it be the switches? Could it be the keyboards? I don't know, but rtings shows there's latency differences between different keyboards and that seems to be consistent with my own results.
All that being said, I'm not a pro but I feel like I can tell the difference of 5ms (if not lower). Maybe it's not in an overly obvious sense (maybe it's all in my head), but something will feel off in game. I don't know if it actually impacts performance but, to me, lower latency just feels better.
Wonder if it would matter more for games that require high apm like starcraft? Suspect maybe not so much speed but force perhaps?
Going to buy the razer right now, its OP!
I can say from experiance your keyboard or how fast the switch is dooes not hold u back i went from using a custom gk61 fulled lubed foamed and tape modded with gateron optical yellow switches which have a 1mm-0.4mm travel distance to a idabao idb80 v2 crystal edition with ivory holldy panda switches which have around a 2mm actuation and there wasnt a differance in my gameplay and im a very competitive player at the end of the day how good ypu do isnt based off of your switches or the price of your keyboard it comes down to your reaction speed i used one of the fastest linear switches you can buy then switched to a tactile and my gameplay didnt change and yet again the price has nothing to do with how well you do my gk61 custom was about 120$ and my idabao idb80 crystal was around 314$ and i performed just as well im a pro fortnite player always in champs at around 18k points and a masters overwatch player, a immortal val player and a diamond apex player and i still did just as well so no ypur keyboard does not hold ypu back
BRO use paragraphs, it's so hard to read T_T
The big boss 💪🏽
No difference whatsoever, only thing that will make a difference will be 1000hz polling rate over 125 for RHYTHM GAMES, and that's about that.
Are brown switches good?
HaHa
@@cc-000 yay ok I'm gonna get gateron browns
BEAN BRAIN
ONE AMONGST THE FENCE
People claiming that they can feel the difference between a signal flowing through the switch pins when metal contacts meet and when light an an optocoupler is involved, are the same people using aviator cables for aesthetics, when it looks basically just like a guitar jack plug while adding 2 points of failure on your keeb. Shit like these make them feel special.
They'll always find a way to milk the gullible ones.
i j searched aviator cables and they look sick
The Razer red linear optical switches are really fast and improved my gaming performance
Still love my zilent 67gs
Coheed shirt!
It's funny, I was looking at the K100 from corsair. My huntsman elite is doing that double typing crap
wait what? how?
@@ItsReaxxion I have no idea, started doing it recently
@@carljohnson7 double input with optical? i thought that was impossible
@@FatTofu it's actually common on razer keyboard
Its like a 5ms monitor compared to a 1ms monitor
No difference a human blink is 100ms and higher
Woah I am hyped to watch this! I hate those Razer and Corsair advertisements and I always thought the same thing, it's the person that's slow, not the hardware! At least that was my opinion.
Edit: I fucking knew it! Sooo many people suck up those ads for fast gaming keyboards, it's just a scam.
People are too much into placebo crap. Specially with mices.
but 8000 hz dood totally gonna help you lol
Not even kidding but there is a noticeable difference between the G Pro Wireless and the Viper Ultimate. Viper just feels more responsive when moving the cursor around in Windows and in games.
@boardzy
cool
242 to 256 ms, You telling me a supermega hybrid between Optimus Prime and a Pro gamer (those you describe with super human whatever) will notice a difference in 14 ms?
Damn... I don't know m8, but nobody in this world can notice that. The blinking average time are 100ms, that is the "time" our brain considers as the shortest snap mechanical reaction of the body (because we train our brain since born to "go with the flow" with the lid that closes on our eyes every now or then).
Science, you say it often in the video and in your videos, with your testing. But that statement of "Some pros will notice" is out of your medical license or optical physics degree. Also misleading, you will create the false illusion that because Pros would notice it, if you buy it, when you get to "pro" you will have the best thing, and this is Marketing, total marketing (bs to sell).
For me my issue is trying to find a keyboard that is as quiet as my Deathstalker Chroma but or as close as possible with a mech switch or even membrane if only way. Any suggestions from anyone welcome :)
Go linear for quiet.
If you want mech sw, go Logitech gl tactile.
If you ask for membrane, gtfo of here. You can't just go to a supermarket to ask the cashier if you want Apple juice or Piss in a bottle. Or you want membrane, or mech. You can't have in between (because those in between sucks ballz)
Faaaaaacts
Sorry, I just can't get into those 60% keyboards. They look so silly, and my brain just can't comprehend that small-ish size. The fact you didn't test TKL and Full Sized keyboards is a little bothersome. I have the SteelSeries Apex 7 with Red Linear switches, and I must say, going from membrane, to Blue clicky (the Havit K389L), to this one is like night and day. Going from membrane to mechanical was amazing, and going from blue clicky to red linear, again, AMAZING! So, my question is: What would a SteelSeries Apex 7 with OMNI-POINT switches do in this comparison? From all I've heard and read, the Omni-Point switches are as fast if not faster than opto-mechanical switches. Would this make a difference? How about comparing the Corsair K100, the Razer Huntsman, and the SteelSeries Apex 7, all with either Opto-mechanical, Analog, and/or Omni-Point switches, and see if there is a noticeable difference between the three, and if those switches can make a gamer "better". Otherwise, great video.....I always love watching these!
I totally get not liking smaller keyboards but since I was only focusing on the switches the size of the keyboard really don't matter for this test. the Omni point switches have dynamic actuation points that you could change but the main reason I didn't show more switches is that after testing a healthy range of distances there really was no reason to keep testing more boards as the result would have just been the same.
@@Brainbean Thanks for the reply.....I agree that at a certain point, it no longer comes down to the switches/keys, and is the human factor that is key here. I DO say that between membrane and mechanical, there is no contest. Mechanical wins every time. Great review, and keep 'em coming!
@@CarnorJast1138 for sure 100% thanks for the kind words!
Keyboard switches are all personal preference.
opticals are placebo and reaction time is a meme
@@Bolasnegras They are supposed to be more resilient to double clicking but once a single important key starts acting up you still have to replace the board or desolder everything. Hot swap PCBs are probably the way to go if durability is your main concern since replacement switches are dirt cheap. Most optical gaming boards also cost twice as much as a no name gateron would so you better hope they are durable to get your moneys worth.
@@Bolasnegras I doubt an optical is twice as durable
@@Bolasnegras lol you said they are more durable but refuse to say how
@@VivaLaRazsa Have you ever experienced that a Cherry or Gateron with 50.000.000 Keystrokes minimum died because of regular use? The longer durability of Optical switches is pointless. If my math is correct and you use one switch every second, 8 hours every day in a year, than you have with 50 Mill Cherry switches a Lifespan of over 4 (!) Years. You dont use every switch every second.
@@ryoken9563 Well the fact that they usually die way sooner (because of dust and debris in the environment which is not included in the rating) make sense, you basically get 4x the durability because those dust won't affect optical switches as much as mechanical
Here super early
osu go brrrrr
First
no one cares if your first just enjoy the video
Cringe