Run For The Crown - 1989: Sunday Silence & Easy Goer
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- Опубліковано 27 сер 2024
- A look back at the 1989 Triple Crown rivalry between Easy Goer and Sunday Silence.. Contains commentary from Pat Day, Shug McGaughey, Dave Johnson, Charlsie Cantey, etc..
Easy Goer Had 14 Career Wins and All 14 of Them Were Very Easy Wins by 2 or More Lengths Hand Ridden to The Wire in All 14...This is Pretty Damn Impressive
Sunday Silence's trainer started training him and said , "This big black SOB can run a little bit" 😆
He knew he had a great horse on his hands.
Both the Epitome of Greatness!
Easy Goer and Sunday. An analogy I would use in comparing them but disregarding region: Easy Goer(Behemoth,massive,devastating powerhouse,explosive,bold monster bursting moves,rapid fire acceleration,catapulting,uncoiling soaring by) was like the Magic Johnson led 1980's Lakers showtime-Fast break-on the run, showoff, behind the back passes,no look passes, through the leg passes, over the shoulder etc. Sunday was the like the late 80's,early 90's Pistons-blue collar,tough,gritty. Both tremendous greats.
☝
Easy Goer was Trained by a Very Young Shug who used Easy Goer to Make a name for himself as a Trainer Trying to Win every race he could with the Horse...Going up against Whittingham the already Hall of famer Trainer Who Lightly raced Sunday Silence up to the big races and always had His horse fresh...Shug and Pat Day made the mistake of thinking Easy Goer was invincible and They both had zero respect for Sunday Silence or any other field
Shug McGaughey already had a name for himself long before Easy Goer got off the van. Ever heard of Personal Ensign? Seeking the Gold? Vanlandingham?
Easy Goer was ranked(Charles Justice study & book "Greatest horse of all") the #2 greatest 3 yr old of all time(with Secretariat #1) based on many stats involving avg times at all distances,etc etc, and ahead of many great 3 yr olds like Slew,Bid,Affirmed,Buckpasser,Damascus,etc etc. Day's start & stop, start & stop, stop & start riding were some of the many factors and circumstances(especially in Preakness & BC Classic) involved in the snout and very rapidly diminishing desperate neck decisions.
EASYGOER4LIFE Sunday Silence was the more agile horse. He simply was the better athlete as you hear Pat Day say. He got around the turns better and was able to accelerate coming gout of them. The main reason for that was his size. He was 17 hands and those tighter turns at Pimlico were tough for him to get around.
Ipowers 2927 You also hear Pat Day say, "I was on the better horse. It was completely jockey error, etc. We should have won the Preakness." Better? On the racetrack is where it matters, and having horses numbers? You mean if EG had won the Preakness by inches instead of losing by inches, you would then think EG was better SS? Both great horses but Who was better? The 'better horse'? Better, like beauty is subjective and true in the eyes of the beholder. There are numerous factors, including but not limited to : superior career, superior & better body of work, GI wins, Graded Stakes wins, wins against older horses & open company, running times, avg running times at various distances and at all distances, head to heads, records set, still standing records, weights carried & weights conceded, stakes wins & stakes wins vs. open company/older horses, varying distances won at during career, superior campaign or campaigns, durability, constitution, superiority & dominance, injuries, rider errors, training and trainer errors, win/loss %'s, trips, amount of races run, post positions, campaign & career earnings with & without bonuses, etc etc and many many more. And even after all of these numerous factors are factored in, who was better is still subjective. IMO Easy Goer was a better horse, had a superior body of work, and had a superior career than SS even though SS held the slight edge in head to head races by the inches of his Preakness win.
Were all of these other horses 'better' than these other horses because 'on the racetrack is where it matters, and these horses had these horses numbers'?: 1) Noor beat HOF champ Citation in 4 of 5 races head to head. 2) Beau Purple beat HOF champ Kelso in 3 of 4 races head to head. 3) Big Spruce & Wajima beat HOF champ Forego in 2 of 3 races head to head. 4) Damascus beat Dr Fager in 2 of 4 races head to head. Swaps and Nashua were 1 to 1 head to head. They must have exactly equal to each other. 5) Mehmet & Interco beat John Henry in 2 of 3 races. 6) Darby Creek Road also beat HOF champ John Henry in 3 of 3 races. 7) Cabrini Green also beat John Henry in 4 of 4 races. 8) Cutlass Reality beat HOY Ferdinand in 3 races. 9) Billy Kelly beat Triple Crown champ Sir Barton in 8 of 12 races. 10) Formal Gold beat HOF champ Skip Away in 4 of 6 races. 11)Star of Cozzene beat HOY Kotashaan in 3 of 4 races. 12) Pretense beat HOF champ Native Diver 5 times. 13) Summer Squall beat champion Unbridled in 4 of 6 races head to head. 13) Jewel Princess beat HOF champ Serena's Song in 3 races head to head. 14) Heritageofgold beat HOF champ Silverbulletday in 3 of 3 races. 15) Akureyri beat champion Pleasant Colony in 3 of 4 races, etc etc. Which horses were better in your opinion in all of these examples? You obviously see the point. Everybody is entitled to their opinions, but there are so many many factors, and even after those factors are factored in, who was better is still subjective.
Beating the clock isnt the same as beating horses...Easy Goer faced suspect competition in his victories and when faced against real competition, he succumbed 3 out 4 times. Stop whining and accept SS was the better of the two where it only matters......the race track.
SS NEEDED PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS and smaller tracks to very narrowly beat EG in a few races by the slimmest of margins. SS's record WITHOUT PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS and on larger tracks with a circumference larger than a mile was 5 Losses out of 6 races. Easy Goer beat SS far more handily than he beat all those other multimillionaire multiple G1 winners when SS was forced to race WITHOUT PERFORMANCE
ENHANCING DRUGS over a larger track with a circumference larger than a mile while running the classic distance for the whole world on the championship track, which is by far the fairest track. And Numerous
greats were behind or tied on the head to head, including Citation,
Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Dr Fager, Damascus, Swaps, Nashua, John Henry,
Skip Away, Sir Barton, Pleasant Colony, Shuvee and many others; and
who's better in any way is totally subjective period. There was the Test
of the Champion Belmont Stakes where Easy Goer destroyed him in the
only state in the entire country during that era that banned all drugs.
Balanced against that are two wins by Sunday Silence against Easy Goer
by the narrowest of margins, and a total of 3 wins which SS won by a
combined margin of less than two and three-quarter lengths. So SS held
the slight 3-1 edge against EG with 3 wins coming in close wins and a
loss in which he was destroyed. Easy Goer also ran the record mile one
full second faster than Secretariat's record. Easy Goer also ran a
better, faster Ragozin speed figure than Secretariat did in their
respective Belmont Stakes. Easy Goer also ran some of the greatest,
fastest all timer performances at every distance he ran - 6.5F, 7F, 8F,
9F, 10F, 12F. Easy Goer generally ran faster times than Sunday Silence
at all distances. Easy Goer more often ran faster times than Sunday
Silence at all distances, including many outstanding, perennial all
timer performances at every distance - 6.5F, 7F, 8F, 9F, 10F, 12F.
Sunday Silence lost 36% of his races, mostly to lesser horses including
Houston, Prized, Criminal Type, and Cro Lover. Better in any way is
totally subjective. Neither the Easy Goer/SS example or the other ones I
cite show that any of these horses was "better" (which is totally
subjective anyways) or was able to consistently get the better of the
other. All these examples show is the records of two horses in a VERY
MINUSCULE number of races. A few races certainly would NOT be even close
to a large enough sample size if you were trying to establish
consistency on a statistical basis; nor is it even close to a large
enough sample size to show who was "better" (which is totally subjective
anyways). SS held the slight 3 to 1 edge over EG in the races they both
ran in. Those are facts, but who's "better overall", "better in
general," or "better" in any way are all totally subjective. "Better" is
totally subjective and numerous greats were behind or tied in head to
head records vs other horses, including Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer,
Forego, Dr Fager, Damascus, Swaps, Nashua, John Henry, Skip Away, Sir
Barton, Pleasant Colony, Shuvee and many others. Citation got beat 4 out
of 5 by Noor; Kelso got beat 3 out of 4 by Beau Purple; Forego got beat
2 out of 3 by Big Spruce; Shuvee got beat 4 out of 5 by Gallant Bloom;
Dr Fager got beat 2 out of 4 by Damascus; Pleasant Colony got beat 3 out
of 4 by Akureyri; Triple Crown winner Sir Barton got beat 8 out of 12
by Billy Kelly; Skip Away got beat 4 out of 6 by Formal Gold; &
there are an endless amount of other similar examples.
Easy Goer also ran many more races in a shorter time period with much
less time between races, and at more varying distances; & he ran
mostly in the only state in the entire country at the time that banned
all drugs. SS ran significantly less races with much more time between
races, at less varying distances, & all but 1 of his races were run
in states that allowed drugs. Sunday Silence's record (Lost 4 of 6
races; Losing record on his home track losing 3 races) on bigger tracks
with a circumference of 1 1/8m or larger was very similar to Easy Goer's
record on smaller mile circumferenced tracks. However, size of tracks,
size of turns, straightaway/turn speed & acceleration, region,
rider/rider tactics, trainer/training, drugs/medications not being
allowed, etc etc, are just a few of the numerous variables, and cannot
be simplified when there are many more factors and variables. It is much
more complicated than that given the myriad of variables that determine
the outcome of races. Failing to factor the numerous other variables in
can lead to the wrong conclusions about why horses win or lose races.
It makes no sense to look at cause and effect simplistically because
other variables may have determined the outcome. Just because the Earth
looks flat based on the way we actually see it, does not mean that it is
flat. There are numerous factors, including but not limited to :
superior career, superior & better body of work, GI wins, Graded
Stakes wins, wins against older horses & open company, running
times, avg running times at various distances & at all distances,
head to heads, records set, still standing records, weights carried
& weights conceded, stakes wins & stakes wins vs. open
company/older horses, varying distances won at during career, superior
campaign or campaigns, durability, constitution, superiority &
dominance, injuries, jockeys, riding & rider errors, trainers,
training and trainer errors, win/loss %'s, trips, amount of races run,
track sizes, track circumferences, post positions, campaign & career
earnings with & without bonuses, races with drugs & medications
allowed/used, races with no drugs & medications allowed/used, etc
etc & many many more.
They were both great horses, but who's better is still totally
subjective even after factoring in the endless amount of other factors.
Easy Goer & SS were both greats. Easy Goer won 12 total stakes, 9
Grade 1 wins at distances of 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f, and 12f showing
versatility on all tracks & many distances. SS won 7 total stakes, 6
Grade 1 wins but only at distances from 9f to 10f. Both versatile
indeed, but that is a big difference in versatility. Easy Goer also
defeated older horses Six times at ages three and four while conceding a
good amount of weight in quite a few of them. SS defeated older horses
only two times at ages three and four. Many other factors would favor
Easy Goer over SS as well, including a) amount of career races able to
run - 20 to 14 ; b) amount of total career wins - 14 to 9 ; c) running
times at all distances ; d) average running times at all distances ; e)
career earnings without bonuses - about $ 4.8 million to about $ 3.8
million ; f) career winning percentage - 70% to 64% ; g) Grade 1 wins - 9
to 6 ; h) total stakes wins - 12 to 7 ; i) wins vs older
horses/open/unrestricted at ages three & four - 6 to 2 ; j) Grade 1
stakes wins at various distances - EG at 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f & 12f; SS
at only 9f to 10f ; k) Easy Goer never was defeated by more than 2 &
a half lengths in any race in a much longer career, SS never was
defeated by more than 8 lengths in any race in a much shorter career;
& other factors that would favor Easy Goer would be varying
distances won at, records set, near records set, still standing records,
running times, avg running times at all distances, campaigns,
durability, constitution, dominance & superiority in races - average
win margin and average loss margin, weights carried, weight
concessions, etc. Other than SS's slight edge in head to head races, IMO
Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if not all - these other factors
& categories. But even after all of these numerous factors are
factored in, who was better is still subjective. They were both greats,
but IMO Easy Goer was a better horse, had a superior body of work, and
had a superior career than SS even though SS held the slight edge in
head to head races by the nose of his Preakness win. There is an
infinite amount more other than head to heads.
@@Fbanz96 completely agreed!!! SS was superior
Wow, two greats slugging it out down the stretch.
"Easy Goer was positively, completely and definitely the better and faster horse. But the other variables like Pat Day's dreadful and characteristic riding making sudden, huge moves than easing up than making dramatic,enormous moves than easing up, and so on. And Whittingham's mystical training, making good horses great." Jerardi
"The use & abuse of drugs disgraced & dishonored the year of Sunday Silence. All should not bestow honors on drug-dependent horses. Even trainer Charlie Whittingham acknowledged his colt's impediments, & didn't run him in the Travers Stakes in view of the fact that he wouldn't have been able to utilize drugs there in New York. Sunday Silence, & many other horses, would never have made it minus drugs. Sunday Silence is a drug-dependent horse. ALL of his races IN 1989, EXCEPT the Belmont Stakes in New York, came with the benefit of various drugs, INCLUDING the diuretic DRUG FUROSEMIDE, which is a performance enhancer in many ways & can flush & mask the presence of many other illegal drugs in drug tests. Sunday Silence required the assistance of drugs to WIN his races, while he sustained a MONUMENTAL LOSS when he wasn't able to use the drugs. Because of Sunday Silence's advantage of drugs, all call into question his accomplishments as a horse. Sunday Silence, like Sunny's Halo, Spend a Buck, Gate Dancer & Wild Again before him, is a classic, illustrative example of why drugs & racing don't merge, especially at the sport's highest level. After his narrow drug-aided wins in the Kentucky Derby & Preakness, Sunday Silence went to New York in search of winning the Belmont Stakes & the Triple Crown. Because New York doesn't allow horses to run on any drugs -it's the only jurisdiction in America that doesn't-the suspicion was whether he could win without being given the drugs. It was a distressingly captivating matter in question, which served to remove the Triple Crown of the excitement & allure it has always had. Sunday Silence got overwhelmed in the Belmont, finishing a widening 8 lengths behind Easy Goer. Sunday Silence required the assistance of drugs to WIN his races, while he sustained a monumental loss when he wasn't able to use the drugs. Even trainer Charlie Whittingham acknowledged his colt's impediments, & didn't run him in the Travers Stakes in view of the fact that he wouldn't have been able to utilize drugs there in New York. No wonder so many in New York condemn the usage of drugs. Sunday Silence, & many other horses, would never have made it minus drugs. The use & abuse of drugs disgraced & dishonored the year of Sunday Silence. All should not bestow honors on drug-dependent horses." DRF Jan 90 Mike Watchmaker.
I do think, in my opinion, that Easy Goer showed the most raw talent and raw ability of any horse since Bid, Slew and Secretariat. He ran so many devastating and dominating and colossal performances at all distances he ran. With or without the jockey errors and trainer errors, I think SS would have given some problems to most big great horses specifically over sharp turned mile tracks with or without the jockey errors & trainer errors and post positions,etc.
Easy Goer was surely, thoroughly and fully the superior, distinguished, exceptional Thoroughbred. SS was not even close in all speed figures(Ragozins, Browne, ThoroGraph, Beyers,etc). Day's commit then uncommit, go-stop, stop-go, confusing, like a slingshot cannon then grab a hold, ease up riding cost the No. 2 graded three year old in the annals by a nostril & grave collar.
Kind of similar to Kelso, Citation, Dr. Fager, Forego, John Henry, and others.
Yeah...just like the 2015-2016 Golden State Warriors...record setting but when it came down to the moment of champions....2nd best..... Sunday Silence displayed the heart of a true champion beating Easy Goer 3 of 4 times.... Easy Goer a great horse but Sunday Silence just a bit better...accept it.
Yeah....sure...That is like saying that Citation was record setting but when it came down to the moment of champions, 2nd best. Noor displayed the heart of a true champion beating Citation 4 of 5 times..Citation a great horse but Noor just a bit better...accept it...That is also like saying that Kelso was record setting but when it came down to the moment of
champions, 2nd best. Beau Purple displayed the heart of a true champion
beating Kelso 3 of 4 times..Kelso a great horse but Beau Purple just a
bit better...accept it...Ditto Forego, Skip Away, Dr Fager, Damascus, Arts
and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient Title, John Henry,
Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song, Pleasant Colony, Sir Barton,
Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. Sorry' but if head to head is "what counts," and head to head is what
"defines champions," then Noor, Beau Purple, SS, Big Spruce,
Interco, Mehmet, Cabrini Green, Darby Creek Road, Damascus, Cutlass
Reality, Billy Kelly, Formal Gold, Pretense, Clem, Summer Squall,
Heritageofgold ,Jewel Princess, Serenas Song, Crystal Water, Ancient
Title, Akureyri etc etc would be 'better defined champions' than
Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Skip Away, Dr Fager, Damascus, Arts
and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient Title, John Henry,
Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song, Pleasant Colony, Sir Barton,
Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. After all, they all were
all either behind or tied in head to heads. Accept it!
Lol, you haven't figured out through common sense that Horse racing is totally and completely different than every other sport. Accept it. Yeah....sure...That is like saying that Citation was record setting but
when it came down to the moment of champions, 2nd best. Noor displayed
the heart of a true champion beating Citation 4 of 5 times..Citation a
great horse but Noor just a bit better...accept it...That is also like
saying that Kelso was record setting but when it came down to the
moment of champions, 2nd best. Beau Purple displayed the heart of a true champion beating Kelso 3 of 4 times..Kelso a great horse but Beau Purple just a bit better...accept it...Ditto Forego, Skip Away, Dr Fager, Damascus,
Arts and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient Title, John Henry,
Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song, Pleasant Colony, Sir Barton,
Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. 'Sorry' but if head to head is "what counts," and head to head is what
"defines champions," then Noor, Beau Purple, SS, Big Spruce,
Interco, Mehmet, Cabrini Green, Darby Creek Road, Damascus, Cutlass
Reality, Billy Kelly, Formal Gold, Pretense, Clem, Summer Squall,
Heritageofgold ,Jewel Princess, Serenas Song, Crystal Water, Ancient
Title, Akureyri etc etc would be 'better defined champions' than
Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Skip Away, Dr Fager, Damascus, Arts
and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient Title, John Henry,
Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song, Pleasant Colony, Sir Barton,
Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. After all, they all were
all either behind or tied in head to heads. Accept it!
How can a horse that is superior, greater, better, stronger and faster
(subjective) than his rival be behind 3 to 1 in head to head races? The
same way that
Citation (lost 4 of 5 to his rival Noor), Kelso (lost 3 of 4 to rival
Beau Purple), Dr Fager (lost 2 of 4 to rival Damascus), Forego (lost 2
of 3 to rivals Big Spruce and Wajima), Pleasant Colony (lost 3 of 4 to
rival Akureyri), Skip Away (lost 4 of 6 to rival Formal Gold), John
Henry (lost 3 of 3 to Darby Creek Road, lost 4 of 4 to Cabrini Green,
and lost 2 of 3 to both Mehmet and Interco), Round Table (lost 3 to
rival Clem), Native Diver (lost 5 to rival Pretense), Unbridled (lost 4
of 6 to rival Summer Squall), Sir Barton (lost 8 of 12 to Billy Kelly),
Kotashaan (lost 3 of 4 to Star of Cozzene), and many many others
are/were!!
Easy Goer is in
with some legendary all time greats who were also behind or tied on the
head to head scoreboard vs others, including legendary greats such as
Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Skip Away, Dr Fager, Damascus, Arts
and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient Title, John Henry,
Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song, Pleasant Colony, Sir Barton,
Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. He is in with some all
time great and legendary company.
Who was better? Better, like beauty, is totally subjective. They were
both greats no doubt, but IMO other than SSs slim edge in their head to
head races, Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if not all - these
other factors and categories. Both greats, but In my opinion Easy Goer
was a better horse than SS, and had a superior body of work and career
than SS. But of course, once again, better in any way is still totally
subjective. Many many greats were behind or tied on the head to head
scoreboard - Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Skip Away, Dr Fager,
Damascus, Arts and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient Title,
John Henry, Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song, Pleasant Colony,
Sir Barton, Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. Easy Goer was
much more flashy & dominant, while SS was more workmanlike. Who was
better though? Better, like beauty is subjective and true in the eyes
of the
beholder. Better is subjective, and there are numerous factors. And
even after those factors are factored in, who was better is totally
subjective. Noor beat immortal Citation 4 out of 5 races. Beau Purple
beat immortal Kelso 3 out of 4. Big Spruce beat immortal Forego 2 out
of 3. Interco and Mehmet beat lengendary champ John Henry 2 out of 3.
Cabrini Green beat John Henry 4 of 4. Darby Creek Road beat legendary
John Henry 3 of 3. HOF (Hall of Fame) champ Damascus beat HOF champ Dr
Fager 2 out of 4. Cutlass Reality beat HOY Ferdinand 3 times. Billy
Kelly beat Triple Crown winner Sir Barton 8 of 12. Formal Gold beat
HOF HOY champ Skip Away 4 out of 6. HOF champ Majestic Prince beat HOF
HOY champ Arts and Letters 2 out of 3. Pretense beat HOF champ Native
Diver 5 times. Clem beat HOF HOY champ Round Table 3 times. Summer
Squall beat Champion Unbridled 4 out of 6. Heritageofgold beat HOF
champ Silverbulletday 3 out of 3 times. Jewel Princess beat HOF
champion Serenas Song in 3 of 3 races. Crystal Water beat HOF champ
Ancient Title 4 times. Akureyri beat Champ Pleasant Colony 3 out of 4.
Who is better? That is totally subjective. There are numerous factors,
including but not limited to : superior career, superior and better
body of work, GI wins, Graded Stakes wins, wins against older horses and
open company, running times, avg running times at various distances and
at all distances, head to heads, records set, still standing records,
weights carried and weights conceded, stakes wins and stakes wins vs.
open company/older horses, varying distances won at during career,
superior campaign or campaigns, durability, constitution, superiority
and dominance, injuries, rider errors, training and trainer errors,
win/loss %s, trips, amount of races run, post positions, campaign and
career earnings with and without bonuses, races with drugs and
medications allowed/used, races with no drugs and medications
allowed/used, etc etc and many many more. But even after those factors
are factored in, who was better is still totally subjective.
Easy Goer and SS were both greats. Easy Goer won 12 total stakes, 9
Grade 1 wins at distances of 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f, and 12f showing
versatility on all tracks and many distances. SS won 7 total stakes, 6
Grade 1 wins but only at distances from 9f to 10f. Both versatile
indeed, but that is a big difference in versatility. Easy Goer also
defeated older horses Six times at ages three and four while conceding a
good amount of weight in quite a few of them. SS defeated older horses
only two times at ages three and four. Many other factors would favor
Easy Goer over SS as well, including a) amount of career races able to
run - 20 to 14 ; b) amount of total career wins - 14 to 9 ; c) running
times at all distances ; d) average running times at all distances ; e)
career earnings without bonuses - about $ 4.8 million to about $ 3. 8
million ; f) career winning percentage - 70% to 64% ; g) Grade 1 wins -
9 to 6 ; h) total stakes wins - 12 to 7 ; i) wins vs older
horses/open/unrestricted at ages three and four - 6 to 2 ; j) Grade 1
stakes wins at various distances - EG at 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f and 12f, SS at
only 9f to 10f ; k) Easy Goer never was defeated by more than 2 and a
half lengths in any race in a much longer career, SS never was defeated
by more than 8 lengths in any race in a much shorter career ; other
factors that would favor Easy Goer would be varying distances won at,
records set, near records set, still standing records, running times,
avg running times at all distances, amount of races with no drugs and
medications, campaigns, durability, constitution, dominance and
superiority in races - average win margin and average loss margin,
weights carried, weight concessions, etc. They were both greats no
doubt, but IMO other than SSs slim edge in their head to head races,
Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if not all - these other factors
and categories. Both greats, but In my
opinion Easy Goer was a better horse than SS, and had a superior body of
work and career than SS. But of course, once again, better in any way
is still totally subjective.
Too bad horse don't race for speed figures.......Like I said....all your data doesn't change what ACTUALLY, not theoretically transpired.... Sunday Silence 3 wins, Easy Goes 1 win in head to head competition.......Read em and weep buddy......acceptance is the answer.
"Racing should be filled with SUPERIOR horses like EASY GOER, who did NOT require ANY drugs to perform at his best, & NOT INFERIOR DRUG-RELIANT horses like SUNDAY SILENCE. Could Sunday Silence beat Easy Goer without drugs? Could Sunday Silence win without drugs? He gave definitive & assertive replies to the questions: NO. Sunday Silence struggled home edging Le Voyageur but was thoroughly beaten, as the splendid Easy Goer sprinted off with the Belmont Stakes. Sunday Silence had been TREATED WITH DRUGS in the Kentucky Derby, Preakness & Breeders' Cup Classic when narrowly edging Easy Goer, but couldn't for the Belmont Stakes in New York, the one state where all drugs are banned. Easy Goer was free from all of the controversies about drugs, for ALL DRUGS are prohibited in New York, as they are in the rest of the racing world outside the US. The key questions that influenced racing all year was: Could Sunday Silence beat Easy Goer without drugs? Could Sunday Silence win without drugs? He gave definitive & assertive replies to the questions: NO. Sunday Silence struggled home edging Le Voyageur but was thoroughly beaten, as the splendid Easy Goer sprinted off with the Belmont Stakes. Racing should be filled with SUPERIOR horses like EASY GOER, who did NOT require ANY drugs to perform at his best, & NOT INFERIOR DRUG-RELIANT horses like SUNDAY SILENCE, so we focus our attention on the sport instead of drugs. Racing wears drugs like festering, self-inflicted wounds on the end of its nose opened by the ax of greed & stamped with the endorsements of every racing commission in the nation except New York's. Racing's drug dependency, like any drug problem, has become a major problem & tarnished the sport. It is to New York's merit & acclaim that their major races stand as giant hurdles to drug-reliant horses. Winning major races on drugs is not what racing is about." Paul Moran of DRF, LA Times & Newsday.
Pat Day left so much in the Tank on the Track during 1989 Classic aboard Easy Goer...He did not allow Easy Goer to do ANY running in the Race until Mid stretch...Easy Goer wanted to GO at the 3/8th Pole when SS moved to Lead but Pat Day decided to WAIT and WAIT and WAIT and Cost him the race by a Neck...Easy Goer had a lot left in the Tank when the race was Over....Most TIMID ride i ever seen in a BIG race aboard a Horse and Heavy favorite with so much Talent...Easy Goer wins easy if Pat Day moves Easy Goer when SS Moved toward the Leaders....Pat day rode Easy Goer like Patience on a Monument that day
I agree with Pat Day they should have won the Preakness i believe they were interfered with .
Rider error by Patrick
Look at all the Circumstances of the races between these 2 Horses...Preakness...Pat Day made a premature move "and" was Pinned down on the rail for the ENTIRE stretch and only lost by a "Nose"....Classic...Easy Goer was coming off a grueling historic campaign that included a 1 1/2 race prior to the classic...And Pat day also left him with so much work to do and overcome in the Gulfstream stretch and came flying to lose by a "Neck"...Chris McCarron also said that was the Best ride of his career and said he stole the race from Easy Goer...All of these Circumstances and Excuses or VERY relevant during 2 Narrow losses at the wire...The "Better" Horse and certainly the more Talented Horse was on the Losing End of the Career Heads up record...That heads up record was only a "Nose/Neck" short of being 3 to 1 Easy Goer...Easy Goer was a very unfortunate horse...
u mentioned all the trouble EG had in those races but SS had his shares of problems...And if u look at the BC Chris never ever whipped the horse
patrick day he haa a fantastic skill..👍
Had it his way? Easy Goer was a Hall of Fame champion who ran a still standing (over 26 years & counting) record mile in 1:32 & change (fastest mile of all time by any 3 yr old) , ran the second fastest Belmont Stakes of all time behind only Secretariat, - ran among the fastest versions of many momentous races (Whitney, Travers, Belmont, Champagne, Suburban, Gotham, near 6 1/2 furlong record at age 2, fastest 7 furlongs of the year in Florida) at all distances. Easy Goer also ran a historic, strenuous, toilsome 3 yr old campaign (Belmont, Whitney, Travers, Woodward, Jockey Club Gold Cup etc). Who was 'better' is nonobjective & intuitive, but they both clearly were great Hall of Fame champs. Easy Goer was inches away (Preakness) from it being a level, even 2 to 2 (four races are a small sample) when opposing SS in direct competition (yes it still was 3-1 SS), no excuses from me. Easy Goer did have a superior career re'sum'e & accomplished & achieved more in his career. Easy Goer ran 1:53 4/5 for 9.5f in Maryland, and ran 2:00 1/5 for 10f in Florida, losing by inches and a neck in these races. Easy Goer also ran the fastest 7 furlongs of the year in Florida in 1989. Easy Goer ran 17 of his 20 total races in New York or Florida. His old school, old timer owner ran him mostly in the historic, prestigious Grade 1 races in New York & Florida (mostly NY). EG was a Hall of Fame champion (SS was also) who didn't have any problem at all with shipping to other states and other tracks. He did specifically despise the quirky, peanut buttery, sticky Churchill mud and seemed to flounder in it being a huge, extremely powerful horse with chronically bad, puffy ankles, though his talent, class and ability landed him 2nd's in those races. Though EG won & ran great in mud elsewhere. He was among many great horses (Skip Away, Point Given, Go For Wand, Holy Bull, etc) who hated Churchill, however he never ran over a fast track there.
I don't think it was about having it his way, the states, the adapting, the surfaces or shipping at all. They BOTH had to ship for the 3 TC races and the BC. Easy Goer ALSO had to ship & adapt to different tracks, states and surfaces as well, as his shipping schedule was- from NY to Florida for the winter, from Florida to NY, from NY to Kentucky, then back to NY in between, then from NY to Maryland, from Maryland to NY, then upstate & back downstate NY, then from NY to Florida for the BC. If my count is correct, that is the same amount of ships as SS. Easy Goer ran many more races (and ran a much more strenuous post Triple Crown campaign) and also never got beat by more than 2 lengths (also never finishing off the board) in his career. SS had a much less strenuous post Triple Crown campaign. You can also look at the timing, distance and spacing of the so called prep races. Easy Goer ran a record mile in the Gotham, then 2 weeks later won the Wood Memorial, then only 2 weeks later was the start of the Triple Crown races (total of 5 races in 9 weeks). SS ran his last Derby prep 4 weeks out. EG also ran in the 1 1/2 mile Jockey Club against older horses in his 'prep' for the BC (after the Whitney, Travers, & Woodward, and defeated older horses conceding weight in a few of them), while SS had one easy 10f prep vs three year olds in the 3 months leading into the BC. But to me, It was most likely much more about track circumferences. Easy Goer did win on ALL the major track circumferences of USA dirt tracks (1 mile, 1 1/8 mile, 1 1/2 mile). EG was an Undefeated 5 for 5 over 1 1/8 miles tracks at all distances. SS did not win over all tracks. In fact, SS lost 3 races over larger 1 1/8 tracks (at his HOME track of Hollywood) and lost his 1 race over a 1 1/2 mile track by 8 lengths. EG's record over mile tracks (4 losses though narrow losses) was very similar to SS's record over 1 1/8 or larger tracks (SS lost 3 races at his home 1 1/8mile larger track & lost 4 races over 1 1/8 or bigger tracks). Based on these facts (EG being undefeated over 1 1/8 mile tracks, while SS lost 4 races over 1 1/8 mile or larger tracks), In my opinion Easy Goer actually would have had an advantage running against SS at Hollywood Park (a larger 1 1/8 mile oval) in California. SS would have had an advantage at the smaller Santa Anita track in Cal. Easy Goer also would have had an advantage running over 1 1/8 mile tracks (or larger), regardless of state or region, in: Florida (Hialeah Park), Chicago (Arlington Park, where they were supposed to meet at age 4), Hollywood (California), Atlantic City (NJ), Saratoga (NY), Aqueduct (NY), Laurel Park (Maryland), Keeneland (KY), Ellis Park (KY), Colonial (Va.), Belmont (NY), and the current Gulfstream in Florida is also NOW a larger 1 1/8 mile oval. SS would have had an advantage of running against EG in NY if they ran at the mile oval in Finger Lakes.
I think Easy Goer did (would) have an advantage over Sunday Silence on 1 1/8 mile
tracks or larger (while SS did-would have adv. on mile sized tracks). The way we saw these two horses run around the different sized turns (not only when they ran vs. each other, but in their careers) at various distances. The fact that Easy Goer was an
undefeated 5 for 5 on 1 1/8 mile sized tracks, won 8 of 10 on the 1 1/2 mile sized track (total of 13 for 15 on larger tracks), but lost 4 of 5 on mile tracks. The fact that Sunday Silence won 7 of 8 on mile sized tracks, but lost 3 of 5 on 1 1/8 tracks and lost a total of 4 of 6 on 1 1/8 or larger tracks. Easy Goer was a robust, massive, powerful, long striding horse with club feet & oversized, puffy ankles & knees & was well suited, far more effective & excelled on 1 1/8 miles or larger tracks. Sunday Silence was a compact, short-actioned, cat like horse who was well suited , far more effective & excelled on the tighter, sharper turns of mile tracks. I think SS had (& would have) an advantage on sharper, tighter turned mile tracks vs EG, while EG had (& would have) an advantage on the moderately wide & wider turned 1 1/8m or larger tracks vs SS.
Easy goer was a more talented version of Commentator, a ny horse from a few years ago. Looked unbeatable when he had things go his way in a race. If another horse put up a fight against him, he got beat... he had no business losing the bc juvenile either.
@@saveus228 What nonsense! Using your logic of horses getting into fights and losing narrowly. If another horse put up a fight against Sunday Silence, he also got beat FOUR times. Cro Lover beat SS in a fight by a neck - SS had no business losing; Houston beat SS in a fight by a head - SS had no business losing; Criminal Type beat SS in a fight by a head - SS had no business losing; and Prized beat him in a fight by a narrow margin as well - SS had no business losing. When Seattle Slew was put in a fight against Dr Patches, Dr Patches narrowly beat him in a fight by a neck - Slew had no business losing; when Exceller put Slew in a fight, and Slew again lost narrowly in a fight by a nose. When Damascus was put into many very close fights, Damascus lost many times in fights very narrowly by noses, heads and necks to Exceedingly, Dr Fager, Fort Marcy, Most Host, Mr Right - all races Damascus had no business losing. Secretariat lost 4 races to 7 different bad horses by a combined 12 lengths carrying feathery low weights - all races Sec had no business losing. Almost ALL great Hall of Fame champions lost races in fights (narrowly and by big margins) in races they had no business losing.
Even Hall of Fame champion Easy Goer's few narrow defeats did nothing to dispel the notion that Easy Goer was one of the best of all-time; the brilliance in his performances were worthy of only a highly special racehorse. Even his scarce, slim losses were resounding; there was never any quit in Easy Goer. Even certifiable legends are allowed some transgressions and losses, and Easy Goer would summon up enough class, courage and heart even in his infrequent, tight losses. He always ran well and was right there even in his close defeats. Things go his way, etc? Wrong. Easy Goer won in very fast times in mud (drug-free Woodward Handicap
conceding weight to older horses in a very fast time, and the drug-free Gold Stage Stakes in a very fast time) on tracks he didn't fancy, and while getting into major trouble, checking, steadying, etc., and fighting with other horses. Both the 1989 Whitney and 1989 Woodward Handicap's vs. older horses with Easy Goer conceding weight and getting into major trouble in both. Hopelessly trapped and boxed in almost the entire races, then had to check on the far turns of both races; then bulled his way through exploding in between horses. Boxed in most of the way, and checked hard and stopped twice in the Woodward. There were plenty of other races Easy Goer won drug-free, with far less rest and with major trouble, running blazingly fast splits dueling on the lead from the starts and throughout the entire races (90' Suburban
in near record time, 88' Champagne in near record time, etc), or running up close to the leaders running blazingly fast fractions throughout the entire races (Belmont Stakes win in the 2nd fastest time in history, Travers win in near record time, Gotham win in still-standing record time, maiden win in very fast time, allowance win in near record time, etc). Easy Goer and Sunday Silence were both Hall of Fame champions that had major heart. But SS needed drugs, while Easy Goer did not need any drugs at all. And this is very important, fundamental and essential. Plus the fact that Easy Goer ran far more races than SS in general while drug-free and with much less rest and time between races; EG ran far more totally DRUG-FREE races than SS (with DRUGS & far more rest & time between races) at more fluctuating, different distances with far less time and rest between drug-free races. SS ran far less races with drugs and with much more rest and time in between races, in his much shorter career.
Easy Goer didnt face quality competition except Sunday Silence and lost 3 out of 4. Horse races are won by beating other horses not beating the clock. Accept it...Sunday Silence was the better of the two ....where it only matters...on the race track.
SS NEEDED PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS and smaller tracks to very
narrowly beat EG in a few races by the slimmest of margins. SS's record
WITHOUT PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS and on larger tracks with a
circumference larger than a mile was 5 Losses out of 6 races. Easy Goer
beat SS far more handily than he beat all those other multimillionaire
multiple G1 winners when SS was forced to race WITHOUT PERFORMANCE
ENHANCING DRUGS over a larger track with a circumference larger than a
mile while running the classic distance for the whole world on the
championship track, which is by far the fairest track. And Numerous
greats were behind or tied on the head to head, including Citation,
Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Dr Fager, Damascus, Swaps, Nashua, John Henry,
Skip Away, Sir Barton, Pleasant Colony, Shuvee and many others; and
who's better in any way is totally subjective period. There was the Test
of the Champion Belmont Stakes where Easy Goer destroyed him in the
only state in the entire country during that era that banned all drugs.
Balanced against that are two wins by Sunday Silence against Easy Goer
by the narrowest of margins, and a total of 3 wins which SS won by a
combined margin of less than two and three-quarter lengths. So SS held
the slight 3-1 edge against EG with 3 wins coming in close wins and a
loss in which he was destroyed. Easy Goer also ran the record mile one
full second faster than Secretariat's record. Easy Goer also ran a
better, faster Ragozin speed figure than Secretariat did in their
respective Belmont Stakes. Easy Goer also ran some of the greatest,
fastest all timer performances at every distance he ran - 6.5F, 7F, 8F,
9F, 10F, 12F. Easy Goer generally ran faster times than Sunday Silence
at all distances. Easy Goer more often ran faster times than Sunday
Silence at all distances, including many outstanding, perennial all
timer performances at every distance - 6.5F, 7F, 8F, 9F, 10F, 12F.
Sunday Silence lost 36% of his races, mostly to lesser horses including
Houston, Prized, Criminal Type, and Cro Lover. Better in any way is
totally subjective. Neither the Easy Goer/SS example or the other ones I
cite show that any of these horses was "better" (which is totally
subjective anyways) or was able to consistently get the better of the
other. All these examples show is the records of two horses in a VERY
MINUSCULE number of races. A few races certainly would NOT be even close
to a large enough sample size if you were trying to establish
consistency on a statistical basis; nor is it even close to a large
enough sample size to show who was "better" (which is totally subjective
anyways). SS held the slight 3 to 1 edge over EG in the races they both
ran in. Those are facts, but who's "better overall", "better in
general," or "better" in any way are all totally subjective. "Better" is
totally subjective and numerous greats were behind or tied in head to
head records vs other horses, including Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer,
Forego, Dr Fager, Damascus, Swaps, Nashua, John Henry, Skip Away, Sir
Barton, Pleasant Colony, Shuvee and many others. Citation got beat 4 out
of 5 by Noor; Kelso got beat 3 out of 4 by Beau Purple; Forego got beat
2 out of 3 by Big Spruce; Shuvee got beat 4 out of 5 by Gallant Bloom;
Dr Fager got beat 2 out of 4 by Damascus; Pleasant Colony got beat 3 out
of 4 by Akureyri; Triple Crown winner Sir Barton got beat 8 out of 12
by Billy Kelly; Skip Away got beat 4 out of 6 by Formal Gold; &
there are an endless amount of other similar examples.
Easy Goer also ran many more races in a shorter time period with much
less time between races, and at more varying distances; & he ran
mostly in the only state in the entire country at the time that banned
all drugs. SS ran significantly less races with much more time between
races, at less varying distances, & all but 1 of his races were run
in states that allowed drugs. Sunday Silence's record (Lost 4 of 6
races; Losing record on his home track losing 3 races) on bigger tracks
with a circumference of 1 1/8m or larger was very similar to Easy Goer's
record on smaller mile circumferenced tracks. However, size of tracks,
size of turns, straightaway/turn speed & acceleration, region,
rider/rider tactics, trainer/training, drugs/medications not being
allowed, etc etc, are just a few of the numerous variables, and cannot
be simplified when there are many more factors and variables. It is much
more complicated than that given the myriad of variables that determine
the outcome of races. Failing to factor the numerous other variables in
can lead to the wrong conclusions about why horses win or lose races.
It makes no sense to look at cause and effect simplistically because
other variables may have determined the outcome. Just because the Earth
looks flat based on the way we actually see it, does not mean that it is
flat. There are numerous factors, including but not limited to :
superior career, superior & better body of work, GI wins, Graded
Stakes wins, wins against older horses & open company, running
times, avg running times at various distances & at all distances,
head to heads, records set, still standing records, weights carried
& weights conceded, stakes wins & stakes wins vs. open
company/older horses, varying distances won at during career, superior
campaign or campaigns, durability, constitution, superiority &
dominance, injuries, jockeys, riding & rider errors, trainers,
training and trainer errors, win/loss %'s, trips, amount of races run,
track sizes, track circumferences, post positions, campaign & career
earnings with & without bonuses, races with drugs & medications
allowed/used, races with no drugs & medications allowed/used, etc
etc & many many more.
They were both great horses, but who's better is still totally
subjective even after factoring in the endless amount of other factors.
Easy Goer & SS were both greats. Easy Goer won 12 total stakes, 9
Grade 1 wins at distances of 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f, and 12f showing
versatility on all tracks & many distances. SS won 7 total stakes, 6
Grade 1 wins but only at distances from 9f to 10f. Both versatile
indeed, but that is a big difference in versatility. Easy Goer also
defeated older horses Six times at ages three and four while conceding a
good amount of weight in quite a few of them. SS defeated older horses
only two times at ages three and four. Many other factors would favor
Easy Goer over SS as well, including a) amount of career races able to
run - 20 to 14 ; b) amount of total career wins - 14 to 9 ; c) running
times at all distances ; d) average running times at all distances ; e)
career earnings without bonuses - about $ 4.8 million to about $ 3.8
million ; f) career winning percentage - 70% to 64% ; g) Grade 1 wins - 9
to 6 ; h) total stakes wins - 12 to 7 ; i) wins vs older
horses/open/unrestricted at ages three & four - 6 to 2 ; j) Grade 1
stakes wins at various distances - EG at 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f & 12f; SS
at only 9f to 10f ; k) Easy Goer never was defeated by more than 2 &
a half lengths in any race in a much longer career, SS never was
defeated by more than 8 lengths in any race in a much shorter career;
& other factors that would favor Easy Goer would be varying
distances won at, records set, near records set, still standing records,
running times, avg running times at all distances, campaigns,
durability, constitution, dominance & superiority in races - average
win margin and average loss margin, weights carried, weight
concessions, etc. Other than SS's slight edge in head to head races, IMO
Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if not all - these other factors
& categories. But even after all of these numerous factors are
factored in, who was better is still subjective. They were both greats,
but IMO Easy Goer was a better horse, had a superior body of work, and
had a superior career than SS even though SS held the slight edge in
head to head races by the nose of his Preakness win. There is an
infinite amount more other than head to heads.
You are so right! You have so aptly reminded me of his importance as a grandsire. Thank you for taking the time to list these fine horse that stemmed from Easy Goer. BRIAN
Sometimes you would ask does Pat day have a steering wheel on a horse one of the greats
Easy Goer did not lose by an inch in MD and a desperate neck in FL because of what state or track they were run over. He lost by an inch in MD and a desperate neck in FL because of Pat Day's self admitted "total rider errors costing the better horse".
Shug never rested Easy Goer coming into the Crown off 13 days rest while Whittingham gave his horse a months rest..Shug had Easy Goer on a brutal campaign leading into the Classic as well with 4 Grade 1 races from distances up to 12F against older horses and giving weight...Whittingham had his horse run in just 2 races after the Belmont against his peers along with 2 months rest before the Classic (lost to Prized in 1 of those races a horse Easy Goer beat by 20 lengths)...Sunday Silence was like a brand new horse entering the Classic against a worn out tired Easy Goer...And Easy Goer only lost by a "neck"...
Easy Goer won FIVE straight GI's coming into the Classic. Campaign for the ages that will never be deplicated. Back then, they campaigned their horses. Sunday Silence's campaign equates to how they do things today. SS had more spaced out campaign that year because he wasn't able to hold up to the rigors of training like EG was. EG thrived on racing frequently. SS did not and that likely had to do with him being a wobbler.
Well he ran Easy Goer in the same state over and over again. Easy Goer was treated like a god, Believe me Easy Goer was always well rested for his races
Sigfried sigmund The True drug-free Hall of Fame Champion Easy Goer won G1 races drug-free without any drugs at 7f, 1 mile, 9f, 10f & 12f drug-free with much less time & rest between races & ran many more career races at more fluctuating, different distances in faster times with far superior speed figures & performance ratings; while the drug-reliant & banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill-reliant sunday silence only won G1 races at 9f to 10f with the performance enhancing drugs Clenbuterol, Sublimaze, Etorphine & Furosemide/Lasix (6 length performance enhancement), & with much more time & rest between races & ran far less career races.
Sigmund sigfried They ran the drug-reliant & banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill-reliant sunday silence with performance enhancing drugs & on the one sized small 8f tracks over & over again; ss was treated like a drug-reliant horse who could not run drug-free without any drugs & who could not run on larger tracks with circumferences bigger than 8f, because that was what ss was. The drug-reliant & banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill-reliant sunday silence required performance enhancing drugs & one sized small 8f tracks to win by the slimmest of margins. ss couldn't win when forced to run drug-free without any drugs. 0 for 5 record. ss couldn't win on bigger tracks with circumferences larger than 8f. 1 for 5 record. The INFERIOR DRUG-RELIANT SUNDAY SILENCE LOST ALL races when forced to run drug-free without any drugs. The INFERIOR DRUG-RELIANT SUNDAY SILENCE LOST 4 races on bigger tracks with circumferences larger than 8f. The True Drug-Free Hall of Fame Champion Easy Goer won outside drug-free NY, & won 6 races away from his drug-free home track, & only lost by the slimmest of margins in other races to drug-reliant horses like ss who had been given Performance Enhancing Drugs. POOR sunday silence was a drug-reliant horse; POOR ss was a banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill-reliant horse; POOR ss needed to bring his one sized small 8f track with him! POOR ss needed everything perfectly set up for him; POOR ss needed the perfect run & trip set up for him, POOR ss needed FIXED races set up for him. Of course the True Drug-Free Hall of Fame Champion Easy Goer WON OUTSIDE drug-free NY (The only state in the entire country at the time which banned all drugs, & as importantly also banned ss's illegal criminal veterinarian Alex Harthill as well), & EG won 6 races away from his drug-free home track. The POOR drug-reliant & banned illegal criminal veterinarian Alex Harthill-reliant sunday silence won 0 (EG won 14 races drug-free w/o any drugs) races without all of his illegal performance enhancing drugs (Clenbuterol, Sublimaze, Etorphine, Banamine, Lasix, etc); POOR ss won 0 (EG won 14 races drug-free w/o any drugs) racing without his banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill; POOR ss LOST 4 races on bigger tracks with circumferences larger than 8f (EG won on all sized tracks - 8f, 9f & 12f sized tracks); The True drug-free Hall of Fame Champion Easy Goer won G1 races at 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f & 12f drug-free on muddy, wet, sloppy & fast tracks with much less time & rest between races & ran many more career races in faster times at all distances & with far superior speed figures & performance ratings; while the POOR drug-reliant & banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill-reliant ss only won G1 races at 9f to 10f with all of his illegal ped drugs & much more time & rest between races & ran far less career races. The POOR drug-reliant & banned illegal criminal veterinarian Alex Harthill-reliant sunday silence could ONLY win (The True Drug-Free Hall of Fame Champion Easy Goer won 14 races drug-free w/o any drugs) by the narrowest of margins with all of his illegal performance enhancing drugs (Clenbuterol, Sublimaze, Etorphine, Banamine, Furosemide, etc) administered to him by his banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill; POOR ss could ONLY win by the narrowest of margins with his banned illegal criminal vet Harthill; POOR ss also could ONLY win on smaller 8f sized tracks (ss LOST 4 races on bigger tracks with circumferences larger than 8f), meanwhile the True Drug-Free Hall of Fame Champion Easy Goer won on all 3 sized tracks of 8f, 9f & 12f; POOR ss also could ONLY win G1 races at 9f to 10f only with illegal performance enhancing drugs, & only on small 8f sized tracks with much more time & rest between races, & ran far less career races; while the True Drug-Free Hall of Fame Champion Easy Goer won G1 races at 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f & 12f drug-free w/o any drugs on all 3 sized tracks (8f, 9f & 12f) on sloppy, wet, muddy, & fast tracks with much less time & rest between races & ran far more career races, & ran faster times at all distances & ran far superior speed figures & far superior performance ratings at all distances. So much for all of that. The POOR drug-reliant & banned illegal criminal veterinarian Alex Harthill-reliant sunday silence could NOT win a race (ss got crushed) or run without all of his illegal performance enhancing drugs (Clenbuterol, Sublimaze, Etorphine, etc), while Easy Goer won 14 races drug-free w/o any drugs; POOR ss could NOT win a race (ss got demolished) or run without his banned illegal vet Alex Harthill while EG won 14 races drug-free w/o any drugs; POOR ss could NOT win a race (ss LOST 4 races on bigger tracks) or run on larger tracks with circumferences bigger than 8f, while EG won on all 3 sized tracks of 8f, 9f & 12f sized tracks. Talk about a horse that needed to bring his illegal performance enhancing drugs & banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill with him - POOR ss is just that horse, a drug-reliant horse, a banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill-reliant horse! Talk about a horse that needed to bring his one sized small 8f track with him, POOR ss is just that horse. POOR ss needed everything perfectly set up for him; POOR ss needed the perfect run & trip set up for him, POOR ss needed FIXED races set up for him. POOR ss was a drug-reliant horse; POOR ss was a banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill-reliant horse; POOR ss needed to bring his ped drugs & one sized small 8f track with him.
Sigmund The drug-reliant & banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill-reliant sunday silence was cremated by 8 widening lengths by the True Drug-Free Hall of Fame Champion Easy Goer, with ss barely beating the claimer Le Voyageur. ALL because ss was forced to run drug-free without any drugs & without his banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill. New York was the only state in the whole country during that era which banned all drugs, & as importantly NY also banned ss's illegal criminal vet Harthill as well. Easy Goer only lost by the slimmest of margins in a few races because the drug-reliant sunday silence was given the illegal performance enhancing drugs Clenbuterol (an extraordinarily powerful performance enhancing drug), Sublimaze (an extraordinarily powerful performance enhancing drug, & significantly more powerful than aspirin bute) & Etorphine (an extraordinarily powerful performance enhancing drug, & significantly more powerful than aspirin bute), plus the potent performance enhancing diuretic drug Furosemide/Lasix (6 length performance enhancement at longer, classic distances), Banamine (5 times more powerful than aspirin bute), etc.
Easy Goer liked it his way in New York. Sunday Silence adapted better to other
race tracks. Four different races at four different tracks, and Sunday Silence won
three of those four races. I'm not buying all the Easy Goer excuses.
Easy Goer simply liked larger, sweeping turns because of his momentum. SS did not, he preferred the tigher, shorter tracks. Horses can be fickle. The fact is, Easy Goer's campaign of 1989 is the stuff of legends. No horse will ever have a campaign like that again. As for excuses, it's FACT the rider cost him twice and admitted so. It's a FACT he did not like Churchill Downs (most NY based horses don't and that's been proven over the years). It's also a fact SS lost to Prized, a horse EG demolished by 20+ lengths in the JCGC. Take that as you will, but I don't see any excuses. Regardless of how you look at it, the races EG strung together are far more impressive than what SS put up. No 3yo will ever have that type of campaign again. I liked both horses, but EG's campaign will always standout more because no one else will ever be able to do it.
Easy Goer died very prematurely after siring only 133 foals. Still is sire, broodmare sire &grandsire to champion Storm Flag Flying(Breeders Cup Juv Fillies,etc),Corinthian(Breeders Cup Dirt Mile, Met Mile,etc),MY Flag(Breeders Cup Juv Fillies,CCA Oaks,etc),Will's Way(Whitney &Travers), Magical Fantasy(Yellow Ribbon,Gamely,etc),Lion Tamer(Cigar Mile,etc),Furlough(Ballerina,etc),Funny Moon(CCA Oaks,etc),Monba(Blue Grass),Relaxing Rhythm(Molly Pitcher),Astronomer Royal(French 2000 Guineas),etc.
Sorry that was Ferdinand that Whittingham said it about.
RIP Easy Goer and Sunday Silence 🙏🏻 Thanks for the great race ❤️ One of the great rivalries of all time 🙏🏻 Wish Rachel Alexandra and Zenyatta race would be awesome
Zenyatta would never have been able to catch and go by Rachel
👆
The Bald Eagle hadn´t had a runner for at least 20years before this and he always said he would only have a runner if he was going to win. He reiterated that before the race. Sunday Silence was probably the best horse to race in the US during the 80s
Not true. He had won the 1986 Derby with Ferdinand.
I loved it when Pat Valenzuela said Pat Day tried to screw him all the way around !
It is such a shame that they ended the story at the Belmont instead of showing one of the greatest Breeder's Cup Classics of all time.
That's because this segment was called the "Race for the Triple Crown". Last I checked the Classic wasn't part of the Triple Crown. ;-)
Alex Harthill told all how & why the drug-reliant & banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill-reliant sunday silence beat the True Drug-Free Hall of Fame Champion Easy Goer by the slimmest of margins in a few races. Harthill said, "You can only REVERE the horses (Easy Goer, etc) whom my horses (Sunday Silence, etc) defeated even more, to do all they (Easy Goer, etc) were asked to do, just to fall a slight bit short (Easy Goer, etc) of horses (Sunday Silence, etc) who had been given performance-enhancing drugs (Sunday Silence, etc) by myself." The True Drug-Free Hall of Fame Champion Easy Goer cremated the drug-reliant & banned illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill-reliant sunday silence when ss was forced to run drug-free without any drugs in the only state in the entire country at the time which banned all drugs, & as importantly also banned ss's illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill as well. "Kentucky Derby Doctor Alex Harthill Reveals Disgraceful Past: Harthill Reflects on Unlawful Life's Work. Harthill Discloses He Administered Forbidden Performance-Enhancing Drugs To Many American Classic Winners In The Kentucky Derby, Preakness And Breeders' Cup Classic." How about the Belmont Stakes & the enormous amount of the other major G1 stakes races in New York? How about when the Breeders Cup took place in NY? Harthill was barred in NY. NY also was the only state in the entire country during that era which banned all drugs. NY also had the most advanced out-of-competition, training & raceday testing, & tested for an enormous amount of drugs. DRF 2001 Jay Hovdey: "Alex Harthill was BOLD ENOUGH to tell me (Jay Hovdey/DRF) how he illegally gave numerous horses illegal drugs, INCLUDING Clenbuterol, Sublimaze & Etorphine TO SUNDAY SILENCE. Harthill ADMITTED to illegally breaking the laws in ENHANCING his horses PERFORMANCES. Harthill ADMITTED to illegally using the immensely effective performance enhancing Bronchodilator drug Clenbuterol REGULARLY in the 1980's on his horses, 15 years before it was approved by the FDA, INCLUDING USING IT ON SUNDAY SILENCE. Harthill introduced the incredibly effective performance enhancing drug Clenbuterol in the 1980's & illegally administered it TO SUNDAY SILENCE, who benefited immeasurably by its immensely effective performance enhancing effects. Some of Harthill's other drugs that HE ADMINISTERED TO SUNDAY SILENCE were Etorphine & Sublimaze. The drugs Harthill administered were being used to improve a horse's performance, & they were REMARKABLY EFFECTIVE. Harthill was the vet that manipulated horse races & he Publicly Acknowledged Doing So many times. Harthill said, 'I (Harthill) was used for horses (Sunday Silence, etc) pointing for, & running in, MAJOR RACES who NEEDED DRUGS & had INFIRMITIES. I earned the reputation I had. I am very proud of the horses (Sunday Silence, etc) I helped WITH DRUGS IN THEIR CAREERS. Drugs always go through changing stages of being detected on drug tests. What I focused on was what drugs enhanced performance, together with what drugs could conceal illegal drugs, along with what drugs didn't show up on drug tests. For these reasons, I gave my horses (Sunday Silence, etc) a considerable advantage. Trainers would say, Don't get me caught, but keep me worried. Even though a horse is 5 or 7 times larger than humans, the amount of dope needed to have an effect is so small. An amount on the tip of a match would be enough to flick up a horse's nose to get a spectacular result. By the time they got my horses to the starting gate they’d be leaping out of their skin. I administered illegal drugs throughout my career that INCREASED the performances of racehorses IN CLASSIC RACES, & almost all of the time I did so, my horses won. You can only revere the horses (Easy Goer, etc) whom my horses (Sunday Silence, etc) defeated even more, to do all they (Easy Goer, etc) were asked to do, just to fall a slight bit short (Easy Goer, etc) of horses (Sunday Silence, etc) who had been given performance-enhancing drugs (Sunday Silence, etc) by myself. By doing so, I acknowledge that I effectively stole a large amount of money in my career, & cheated many other horses, trainers, owners & riders I competed against. Nonetheless, I consider my extensive doping as a mark of pride.' "
cominatcha, Why is your only goal & aim to comment with an endless
barrages of trolling comments, THEN Delete & Erase ALL of them, then
more endless barrages of comments, then delete & erase all of them,
& to continue to do this endless cycle day after day after day? Why not just comment all that you want to & leave all of your endless comments on all of the videos, & not erase & delete all of them???
Both greats no doubt, but In my opinion Easy Goer was a better
horse than SS, and had a superior body of work and career than SS. But
of course, once again, better in any way is still totally subjective.
Lil better, better, much the best, etc are all totally subjective and
true in the eyes of the beholder. It certainly is NOT the end of any
story, enough said etc. Just as the head to head scoreboards are NOT
enough said or end of story for Citation (lost 4 of 5 to Noor), Kelso
(lost 3 of 4 to Beau Purple), Dr Fager (lost 2 of 4 to Damascus), Forego
(lost 2 of 3 to Big Spruce and Wajima), John Henry, Pleasant Colony,
Sir Barton, Skip Away and many many more. Lucky, lil better, now much
better lol lmao, better, versatility, states
etc. Yeah, the Hall of Fame champion Easy Goer must have got as "lucky"
as so many other immortal legendary Hall of Famers and champions did,
such as the "lucky" Citation (won only 1 of 5 vs Noor), Kelso (won only 1
of 4 vs Beau Purple), Dr Fager (won only 2 of 4 vs Damascus), Forego
(won only 1 of 3 vs both Big Spruce and Wajima), John Henry (won zero of
4 vs Cabrini Green, won zero of 3 vs Darby Creek Road, won only 1 of 3
vs both Mehmet and Interco), Skip Away (won only 2 of 6 vs Formal Gold),
Pleasant Colony (won only 1 of 4 vs Akureyri), Triple Crown champ Sir
Barton (won only 4 of 12 vs Billy Kelly), and so many many more etc etc.
All you can do is laugh your 'ass' off. You can't have an on topic
discussion. All you can also do is state numerous false statements and
denigrate EG while trying to prop up ss. The truth must be that you
think that EVERY and ALL horses who were
behind on the head to head (series) scoreboard is "better" than the
horses they were ahead of! Let's hear it. I am still waiting. Citation,
Kelso, Forego, John Henry, Sir Barton, etc etc etc etc. The truth
actually is this: Better in any way is totally subjective and true in
the eyes of the beholder. That also goes for the person who said, "Easy
Goer was a better horse. Valenzuela/McCarron were better than Pat Day.
And Charlie Whittingham was better than McGaughey." Better in any way is
totally subjective - and this is the truth. That is like stating the
'lucky' and great Forego couldn't win much outside of NY.
Easy Goer actually did, while Forego actually did NOT. That's also like
saying that SS was a good one but he just couldn't win much at his home track (losing record) at Hollywood in California - or in drug and medication free NY. A good one? Easy Goer was More like a great one
- as SS also was. Every horse who is inducted in the Hall of Fame is a
great horse. The ultimate honor for greats is to be inducted in the Hall
of Fame - and both Easy Goer and SS are. Easy Goer DID WIN outside of
New York. That's like saying that SS was a good one but he just couldn't win (or win much) at his home track of Hollywood in his home state of California - or in drug and medication free NY. Even though SS
had a losing record at his home track of Hollywood Park in California -
he still was able to win there even though he had that losing record.
Ditto Easy Goer outside of NY. Easy Goer DID WIN outside of NY, and in
the process ran a record seven furlongs in Florida in the Swale. He did
lose by inches and a neck outside of NY - but he only ran a few times
outside of NY and FL. Hall of Fame champion and Eclipse Award champion
Easy Goer won over FOUR different tracks. SS won over SIX different
tracks. He gets credit for that yes. SS had a losing record at his home
track at Hollywood Park - losing three races there. Easy Goer was
mainly run in NY and Florida in the majority of his races - seventeen
of his twenty races. The historic NY races carried and still carry a lot
of weight. Hall of Fame champion and Eclipse Award champion Easy Goer
was similar in this regard to other Hall of Fame champions like Forego,
Kelso, Arts and Letters, Tom Fool, Sword Dancer, etc. Just the same as
big races in CA - those races carried a lot of weight for champions like
Ack Ack, Native Diver, Noor, Ferdinand, Kotashaan, Zenyatta, Beholder
etc. EG won over all major track
sizes, SS did not. SS had a losing record over 9f or larger tracks. SS
also had a losing record at his home track at Hollywood in California.
EG won Grade 1 races 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f and 12f. SS won Grade 1 races only
at 9f to 10f. Better horse, better this, better that, Better overall?
Better in any way is subjective and true in the eyes of the beholder.
Many many greats were behind or tied on the head to head (series)
scoreboard, including Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Skip Away, Dr
Fager, Damascus, Arts and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient
Title, John Henry, Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song,
Pleasant Colony, Sir Barton, Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many
others. Were the horses who were ahead (or tied) on the head to head
scoreboards better or a lil better than these? Were these enough said,
or end of the story for them also? Better is subjective, and there are
numerous factors. And even after those factors are factored in, who was
better is totally subjective. Noor beat immortal Citation 4 out of 5
races. Beau Purple beat immortal Kelso 3 out of 4. Big Spruce beat
immortal Forego 2 out of 3. Interco and Mehmet beat lengendary champ
John Henry 2 out of 3. Cabrini Green beat John Henry 4 of 4. Darby Creek
Road beat legendary John Henry 3 of 3. HOF (Hall of Fame) champ
Damascus beat HOF champ Dr Fager 2 out of 4. Cutlass Reality beat HOY
Ferdinand 3 times. Billy Kelly beat Triple Crown winner Sir Barton 8 of
12. Formal Gold beat HOF HOY champ Skip Away 4 out of 6. HOF champ
Majestic Prince beat HOF HOY champ Arts and Letters 2 out of 3. Pretense
beat HOF champ Native Diver 5 times. Clem beat HOF HOY champ Round
Table 3 times. Summer Squall beat Champion Unbridled 4 out of 6.
Heritageofgold beat HOF champ Silverbulletday 3 out of 3 times. Jewel
Princess beat HOF champion Serenas Song in 3 of 3 races. Crystal Water
beat HOF champ Ancient Title 4 times. Akureyri beat Champ Pleasant
Colony 3 out of 4. And what? Who is better? That is totally subjective.
There are numerous factors, including but not limited to : superior
career, superior & better body of work, GI wins, Graded Stakes wins,
wins against older horses & open company, running times, avg
running times at various distances and at all distances, head to heads,
records set, still standing records, weights carried & weights
conceded, stakes wins & stakes wins vs. open company/older
horses, varying distances won at during career, superior campaign or
campaigns, durability, constitution, superiority & dominance,
injuries, rider errors, training and trainer errors, win/loss %s, trips,
amount of races run, post positions, campaign and career earnings with
& without bonuses, races with drugs & medications allowed/used,
races with no drugs & medications allowed/used, etc etc and many
many more. But even after those factors are factored in, who was better
is still
totally subjective.
Easy Goer and SS were both greats. Easy Goer won 12 total stakes, 9
Grade 1 wins at distances of 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f, and 12f showing
versatility on all tracks and many distances. SS won 7 total stakes, 6
Grade 1 wins but only at distances from 9f to
10f. Both versatile indeed, but that is a big difference in versatility.
Easy Goer also defeated older horses Six times at ages three and four
while conceding a good amount of weight in quite a few of them. SS
defeated older horses only two times at ages three and four. Many other
factors would favor Easy Goer over SS as well, including a) amount of
career races able to run - 20 to 14 ; b) amount of total career wins -
14 to 9 ; c) running times at all distances ; d) average running times
at all distances ; e) career earnings without bonuses - about $ 4.8
million to about $ 3. 8 million ; f) career winning percentage - 70% to
64% ; g) Grade 1 wins - 9 to 6 ; h) total stakes wins - 12 to 7 ; i)
wins vs older horses/open/unrestricted at ages three and four - 6 to 2 ;
j) Grade 1 stakes wins at various distances - EG at 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f and
12f, SS at only 9f to 10f ; and other factors that would favor Easy
Goer would be varying distances won at, records set, near records set,
still standing records, running times, avg running times at all
distances, campaigns, durability, constitution, dominance and
superiority in races - average win margin and average loss margin,
weights carried, weight concessions, etc. They were both greats no
doubt, but IMO other than SSs slim edge in their head to head races,
Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if not all - these other factors
and categories. Both greats, but In my opinion Easy Goer was a better
horse than SS, and had a superior body of work and career than SS. But
of course, once again, better in any way is still totally subjective.
DELMARCLUB1 easy goer was visually better because he was good at running up the score in races where things went his way. In a dog fight, give me Sunday silence all day every day. Remember Verrazano? Looked like secretariat in races where things went his way, but lost every time he was challenged. Easy Goer was just a more talented version of that. He had no business losing to is it true in the juvenile either. But the horse out gutted him..
@@saveus228 Nonsense. Wrong! Using your logic of horses getting into fights and losing narrowly. If another horse put up a fight against Sunday Silence, he also got beat FOUR times. Cro Lover beat SS in a fight by a neck - SS had no business
losing, and Cro Lover out gutted him; Houston beat SS in a fight by a head - SS had no business losing and Houston out gutted him; Criminal Type beat SS in a fight by a head - SS had no business losing and Criminal Type out gutted him; and Prized beat him in a fight by a narrow margin as well - SS had no business losing and Prized out gutted him. When Seattle Slew was put in a fight against Dr Patches, Dr Patches narrowly beat him in a fight by a neck - Slew had no business losing and Dr Patched out gutted him; when Exceller put Slew in a fight, and Slew again lost narrowly in a fight by a nose and Exceller out gutted him. When Damascus was put into many very close fights, Damascus lost many times in fights very narrowly by noses, heads and necks to Exceedingly, Dr Fager, Fort Marcy, Most Host, Mr Right - all races Damascus had no business losing where they all out gutted him. Secretariat lost 4 races to 7 different bad horses by a combined 12 lengths carrying feathery low weights - all races Sec had no business losing and where the other horses out gutted Sec. Almost ALL great Hall of Fame champions lost races in fights (narrowly and by big margins) in races they had no business losing getting supposedly out gutted.
Even Hall of Fame champion Easy Goer's few narrow defeats did nothing to dispel the notion that Easy Goer was one of the best of all-time; the brilliance in his performances were worthy of only a highly special racehorse. Even his scarce, slim losses were resounding; there was never any quit in Easy Goer. Even certifiable legends are allowed some transgressions and losses, and Easy Goer would summon up enough class, courage and heart even in his infrequent, tight losses. He always ran well and was right there even in his close defeats. Things go his way, etc? Wrong. Easy Goer won in very fast times in mud (drug-free Woodward Handicap
conceding weight to older horses in a very fast time, and the drug-free Gold Stage Stakes in a very fast time) on tracks he didn't fancy, and while getting into major trouble, checking, steadying, etc., and fighting with other horses. Both the 1989 Whitney and 1989 Woodward Handicap's vs. older horses with Easy Goer conceding weight and getting into major trouble in both. Hopelessly trapped and boxed in almost the
entire races, then had to check on the far turns of both races; then bulled his way through exploding in between horses. Boxed in most of the way, and checked hard and stopped twice in the Woodward. There were plenty of other races Easy Goer won drug-free, with far less rest and with major trouble, running blazingly fast splits dueling on the lead
from the starts and throughout the entire races (90' Suburban
in near record time, 88' Champagne in near record time, etc), or running up close to the leaders running blazingly fast fractions throughout the entire races (Belmont Stakes win in the 2nd fastest time in history, Travers win in near record time, Gotham win in still-standing record time, maiden win in very fast time, allowance win in near record time, etc). Easy Goer and Sunday Silence were both Hall of Fame champions
that had major heart. But SS needed drugs, while Easy Goer did not need any drugs at all. And this is very important, fundamental and essential. Plus the fact that Easy Goer ran far more races than SS in general while drug-free and with much less rest and time between races; EG ran far more totally DRUG-FREE races than SS (with DRUGS & far
more rest & time between races) at more fluctuating, different
distances with far less time and rest between drug-free races. SS ran far less races with drugs and with much more rest and time in between races, in his much shorter career.
Sunday Silence held the 3 to 1 edge...But if you were/are a fan of this sport i would assume you would feel Easy Goer was the better horse...Definitely the more talented horse...All the circumstances of those races and the Nose/Neck separation at the wire its hard to not see that Easy Goer was the better horse
Nope wrong. 9f ovals such as Arlington Park in Chicago, Hollywood Park, Hialeah Park in Florida, Atlantic City, Saratoga, Aqueduct, Laurel Park in Maryland, Keeneland,Ellis Park, Colonial Downs , the current Gulfstream Park is 9f but wasn't back then, and Belmont. There is plenty
Sunday wins derby Pat day loses Preakness and EG wins hands down in NY.
DAVE JOHNSON. EASY GOER. SUNDAY SILENCE. ABC. 💯🐎🐎🐎🐎🐎🐎🐎👏👏👏👏
I have a feeling that if Easy Goer were trained by Whittingham and rode by anyone else but Pat Day we would have had a triple crown winner that year.
Sorry but I beg to differ, Easy Goer was beaten by Sunday Silence 3 out 4 times......Easy Goer never faced any other real quality competition and thus he beat them handily but when faced with a real race horse he came up short. Horse races are not won by beating the clock but rather beating the other horses. Sunday Silence ridden by 2 different riders and still beat Easy Goer. As far as Pat Day and Shug ...these are two of the sports all time greats.
SS NEEDED PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS and smaller tracks to very narrowly beat EG in a few races by the slimmest of margins. SS's record WITHOUT PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS and on larger tracks with a circumference larger than a mile was 5 Losses out of 6 races. Easy Goer beat SS far more handily than he beat all those other multimillionaire multiple G1 winners when SS was forced to race WITHOUT PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS over a larger track with a circumference larger than a mile while running the classic distance for the whole world on the championship track, which is by far the fairest track. And Numerous greats were behind or tied on the head to head, including Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Dr Fager, Damascus, Swaps, Nashua, John Henry, Skip Away, Sir Barton, Pleasant Colony, Shuvee and many others; and who's better in any way is totally subjective period. There was the Test of the Champion Belmont Stakes where Easy Goer destroyed him in the only state in the entire country during that era that banned all drugs. Balanced against that are two wins by Sunday Silence against Easy Goer by the narrowest of margins, and a total of 3 wins which SS won by a combined margin of less than two and three-quarter lengths. So SS held the slight 3-1 edge against EG with 3 wins coming in close wins and a loss in which he was destroyed. Easy Goer also ran the record mile one full second faster than Secretariat's record. Easy Goer also ran a better, faster Ragozin speed figure than Secretariat did in their respective Belmont Stakes. Easy Goer also ran some of the greatest, fastest all timer performances at every distance he ran - 6.5F, 7F, 8F,
9F, 10F, 12F. Easy Goer generally ran faster times than Sunday Silence at all distances. Easy Goer more often ran faster times than Sunday Silence at all distances, including many outstanding, perennial all timer performances at every distance - 6.5F, 7F, 8F, 9F, 10F, 12F. Sunday Silence lost 36% of his races, mostly to lesser horses including Houston, Prized, Criminal Type, and Cro Lover. Better in any way is totally subjective. Neither the Easy Goer/SS example or the other ones I cite show that any of these horses was "better" (which is totally subjective anyways) or was able to consistently get the better of the other. All these examples show is the records of two horses in a VERY MINUSCULE number of races. A few races certainly would NOT be even close to a large enough sample size if you were trying to establish consistency on a statistical basis; nor is it even close to a large enough sample size to show who was "better" (which is totally subjective
anyways). SS held the slight 3 to 1 edge over EG in the races they both ran in. Those are facts, but who's "better overall", "better in
general," or "better" in any way are all totally subjective. "Better" is
totally subjective and numerous greats were behind or tied in head to head records vs other horses, including Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer,
Forego, Dr Fager, Damascus, Swaps, Nashua, John Henry, Skip Away, Sir Barton, Pleasant Colony, Shuvee and many others. Citation got beat 4 out of 5 by Noor; Kelso got beat 3 out of 4 by Beau Purple; Forego got beat 2 out of 3 by Big Spruce; Shuvee got beat 4 out of 5 by Gallant Bloom; Dr Fager got beat 2 out of 4 by Damascus; Pleasant Colony got beat 3 out of 4 by Akureyri; Triple Crown winner Sir Barton got beat 8 out of 12 by Billy Kelly; Skip Away got beat 4 out of 6 by Formal Gold; & there are an endless amount of other similar examples.
Easy Goer also ran many more races in a shorter time period with much
less time between races, and at more varying distances; & he ran
mostly in the only state in the entire country at the time that banned
all drugs. SS ran significantly less races with much more time between
races, at less varying distances, & all but 1 of his races were run
in states that allowed drugs. Sunday Silence's record (Lost 4 of 6
races; Losing record on his home track losing 3 races) on bigger tracks
with a circumference of 1 1/8m or larger was very similar to Easy Goer's
record on smaller mile circumferenced tracks. However, size of tracks,
size of turns, straightaway/turn speed & acceleration, region,
rider/rider tactics, trainer/training, drugs/medications not being
allowed, etc etc, are just a few of the numerous variables, and cannot
be simplified when there are many more factors and variables. It is much
more complicated than that given the myriad of variables that determine
the outcome of races. Failing to factor the numerous other variables in
can lead to the wrong conclusions about why horses win or lose races.
It makes no sense to look at cause and effect simplistically because
other variables may have determined the outcome. Just because the Earth
looks flat based on the way we actually see it, does not mean that it is
flat. There are numerous factors, including but not limited to :
superior career, superior & better body of work, GI wins, Graded
Stakes wins, wins against older horses & open company, running
times, avg running times at various distances & at all distances,
head to heads, records set, still standing records, weights carried
& weights conceded, stakes wins & stakes wins vs. open
company/older horses, varying distances won at during career, superior
campaign or campaigns, durability, constitution, superiority &
dominance, injuries, jockeys, riding & rider errors, trainers,
training and trainer errors, win/loss %'s, trips, amount of races run,
track sizes, track circumferences, post positions, campaign & career
earnings with & without bonuses, races with drugs & medications
allowed/used, races with no drugs & medications allowed/used, etc
etc & many many more.
They were both great horses, but who's better is still totally
subjective even after factoring in the endless amount of other factors.
Easy Goer & SS were both greats. Easy Goer won 12 total stakes, 9
Grade 1 wins at distances of 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f, and 12f showing
versatility on all tracks & many distances. SS won 7 total stakes, 6
Grade 1 wins but only at distances from 9f to 10f. Both versatile
indeed, but that is a big difference in versatility. Easy Goer also
defeated older horses Six times at ages three and four while conceding a
good amount of weight in quite a few of them. SS defeated older horses
only two times at ages three and four. Many other factors would favor
Easy Goer over SS as well, including a) amount of career races able to
run - 20 to 14 ; b) amount of total career wins - 14 to 9 ; c) running
times at all distances ; d) average running times at all distances ; e)
career earnings without bonuses - about $ 4.8 million to about $ 3.8
million ; f) career winning percentage - 70% to 64% ; g) Grade 1 wins - 9
to 6 ; h) total stakes wins - 12 to 7 ; i) wins vs older
horses/open/unrestricted at ages three & four - 6 to 2 ; j) Grade 1
stakes wins at various distances - EG at 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f & 12f; SS
at only 9f to 10f ; k) Easy Goer never was defeated by more than 2 &
a half lengths in any race in a much longer career, SS never was
defeated by more than 8 lengths in any race in a much shorter career;
& other factors that would favor Easy Goer would be varying
distances won at, records set, near records set, still standing records,
running times, avg running times at all distances, campaigns,
durability, constitution, dominance & superiority in races - average
win margin and average loss margin, weights carried, weight
concessions, etc. Other than SS's slight edge in head to head races, IMO
Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if not all - these other factors
& categories. But even after all of these numerous factors are
factored in, who was better is still subjective. They were both greats,
but IMO Easy Goer was a better horse, had a superior body of work, and
had a superior career than SS even though SS held the slight edge in
head to head races by the nose of his Preakness win. There is an
infinite amount more other than head to heads.
@@Fbanz96 Never faced any tough competition? He beat older horses THREE TIMES in 1989. Sunday Silence faced them only once and they had to cherry pick his races because he wasn't physically capable of handling a tough schedule. Take out Easy Goer and the Classic in 1989, and what did he beat? Not a whole lot other than fellow 3yos. Easy Goer put together a campaign in 1989 that would kill or crush every TB in America these days! His longest break that year was the 8 weeks after the Belmont until the Whitney. Other than that, he was racing every 2-3 weeks that entire year and is the ONLY horse in history to ever win the Belmont-Whitney-Travers-Woodward-Jockey Club Gold Cup in the same year. No horse will ever be able to win all five again in the same year because of how they are scheduled nowadays. Easy Goer faced and defeated far more than Sunday Silence ever did. Doesn't diminish either horse but the campaign put up by Easy Goer in 1989 was the stuff of legends. I still maintain with a rider like McCarron on him, Easy Goer turns the tables every time. Oh and Easy Goer ran without medication his entire career, whereas Sunday Silence did not.
It certainly is NOT the end of the story. And it certainly is NOT enough said!!.. ; ) Head to head scoreboard is certainly NOT enough said, or end of any story!! ; ) Better? Better or a lil better is subjective and true in the eyes of the
beholder. Many many greats were behind or tied on the head to head
scoreboard, including Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Skip Away, Dr
Fager, Damascus, Arts and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient
Title, John Henry, Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Pleasant Colony, Sir
Barton, Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. Were the horses
who were ahead (or tied) on the head to head scoreboards better or a lil
better than these? Were these enough said, or end of the story for them
also? Better is subjective, and there are numerous factors. And even
after those factors are factored in, who was better is totally
subjective. Noor beat immortal Citation 4 out of 5 races. Beau Purple
beat immortal Kelso 3 out of 4. Big Spruce beat immortal Forego 2 out
of 3. Interco and Mehmet beat lengendary champ John Henry 2 out of 3.
Cabrini Green beat John Henry 4 of 4. Darby Creek Road
beat legendary John Henry 3 of 3. HOF champ Damascus beat HOF champ Dr
Fager 2 out of 4. Cutlass Reality beat HOY Ferdinand 3 times. Billy
Kelly beat Triple Crown winner Sir Barton 8 of 12. Formal Gold beat
HOF HOY champ Skip Away 4 out of 6. HOF champ Majestic Prince beat HOF
HOY champ Arts and Letters 2 out of 3. Pretense beat HOF champ Native
Diver 5 times. Clem beat HOF HOY champ Round Table 3 times. Summer
Squall beat Champion Unbridled 4 out of 6. Heritageofgold beat HOF
champ Silverbulletday 3 out of 3 times. Crystal Water beat HOF champ
Ancient Title 4 times. Akureyri beat Champ Pleasant Colony 3 out of 4.
And what? Who is better? That is totally subjective. There are
numerous factors, including but not limited to : superior career, superior & better
body of work, GI wins, Graded Stakes wins, wins against older horses
& open company, running times, avg running times at various
distances and at all distances, head to heads, records set, still
standing records, weights carried & weights conceded, stakes wins
& stakes wins vs. open company/older horses, varying distances won
at during career, superior campaign or campaigns, durability,
constitution, superiority & dominance, injuries, rider errors,
training and trainer errors, win/loss %'s, trips, amount of races run,
post positions, campaign & career earnings with & without
bonuses, races with drugs & medications allowed/used, races with no
drugs & medications allowed/used, etc etc and many many more. But
even after those factors are factored in, who was better is still
totally subjective.
Easy Goer and SS were both greats. Easy Goer won 12 total stakes, 9
Grade 1 wins at distances of 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f, and 12f showing
versatility on all tracks and many distances. SS won 7 total stakes, 6
Grade 1 wins but only at distances from 9f to
10f. Both versatile indeed, but that is a big difference in versatility.
Easy Goer also defeated older horses Six times at ages three and four
while conceding a good amount of weight in quite a few of them. SS
defeated older horses only two times at ages three and four. Many other
factors would favor Easy Goer over SS as well, including a) amount of
career races able to run - 20 to 14 ; b) amount of total career wins -
14 to 9 ; c) running times at all distances ; d) average running times
at all distances ; e) career earnings without bonuses - about $ 4.8
million to about $ 3. 8 million ; f) career winning percentage - 70% to 64% ; g) Grade 1 wins - 9 to 6 ; h) total stakes wins - 12 to 7 ; i) wins vs older horses/open/unrestricted at ages three and four - 6 to 2 ; j) Grade 1 stakes wins at various distances - EG at 7f to 12f, SS at 9f to 10f ; and other factors that would favor Easy Goer would be records set, near records set, still standing records, running times, campaigns,
durability, constitution, dominance and superiority in races - average
win margin and average loss margin, weights carried, weight concessions,
etc. They were both greats no doubt, but IMO other than SS's slim edge
in their head to head races, Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if
not all - these other factors and categories. Both greats, but In my
opinion Easy Goer was a better horse than SS, and had a superior body of
work and career than SS. But of course, once again, better in any way
is still totally subjective.
+DELMARCLUB1 Absolutely True!
+Travis West You are really sad, desperate and pathetic. You prove this by endlessly deleting your comments. You can't even have a discussion. All you do is delete your comments repeatedly, and "LOL", ; ), etc etc.
+Travis West Wrong again - as you always are. I do NOT endlessly delete my comments. YOU DO! I can have discussions. You can NOT! I don't endlessly delete my comments repeatedly, and I don't "LOL", "lmao", ; ) etc etc. You DO!
+Travis West Is that all you can come up with. "Defamation is the last resort of non - thinkers." I do NOT endlessly delete my comments. YOU DO! I can have discussions. You can NOT! I don't endlessly delete my comments repeatedly, and I don't "LOL", "lmao", ; ) etc etc. You DO!
+Travis West Wrong nonsense. It's called a discussion of varying opinions on a comment board - NOT the nonsense etc that you state. If you endlessly repeat "end of story", "enough said", "who was better", etc etc - expect to get repeated responses back at you. Why are you using Travis Bickle's name? And you use it to endlessly delete your comments, and to endlessly repeat "LOL", "lmao", ; ) etc etc.
Yep ss held the 3 to 1 edge. Who was better? Better, like beauty, is totally subjective. They were both greats no doubt, but IMO other than SSs slim edge in their head to head races, Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if not all - these other factors and categories. Both greats, but In my opinion Easy Goer was a better horse than SS, and had a superior body of work and career than SS. But of course, once again, better in any way is still totally subjective. Many many greats were behind or tied on the head to head scoreboard - Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Skip Away, Dr Fager, Damascus, Arts and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient Title, John Henry, Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song, Pleasant Colony, Sir Barton,
Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. Easy Goer was much more
flashy & dominant, while SS was more workmanlike. Who was better though?
Better, like beauty is subjective and true in the eyes of the beholder. Better is subjective, and there are numerous factors. And even after those factors are factored in, who was better is totally subjective. Noor beat immortal Citation 4 out of 5 races. Beau Purple beat immortal Kelso 3 out of 4. Big Spruce beat immortal Forego 2 out of 3. Interco and Mehmet beat lengendary champ John Henry 2 out of 3. Cabrini Green beat John Henry 4 of 4. Darby Creek Road beat legendary John Henry 3 of 3. HOF (Hall of Fame) champ Damascus beat HOF champ Dr Fager 2 out of 4. Cutlass Reality beat HOY Ferdinand 3 times. Billy Kelly beat Triple Crown winner Sir Barton 8 of 12. Formal Gold beat HOF HOY champ Skip Away 4 out of 6. HOF champ Majestic Prince beat HOF HOY champ Arts and Letters 2 out of 3. Pretense beat HOF champ Native Diver 5 times. Clem beat HOF HOY champ Round Table 3 times. Summer Squall beat Champion Unbridled 4 out of 6. Heritageofgold beat HOF champ Silverbulletday 3 out of 3 times. Jewel Princess beat HOF champion Serenas Song in 3 of 3 races. Crystal Water
beat HOF champ Ancient Title 4 times. Akureyri beat Champ Pleasant
Colony 3 out of 4. Who is better? That is totally subjective.
There are numerous factors, including but not limited to : superior
career, superior and better body of work, GI wins, Graded Stakes
wins, wins against older horses and open company, running times, avg
running times at various distances and at all distances, head to heads,
records set, still standing records, weights carried and weights
conceded, stakes wins and stakes wins vs. open company/older
horses, varying distances won at during career, superior campaign or
campaigns, durability, constitution, superiority and dominance,
injuries, rider errors, training and trainer errors, win/loss %s, trips,
amount of races run, post positions, campaign and career earnings with
and without bonuses, races with drugs and medications allowed/used,
races with no drugs and medications allowed/used, etc etc and many
many more. But even after those factors are factored in, who was better
is still totally subjective.
Easy Goer and SS were both greats. Easy Goer won 12 total stakes, 9
Grade 1 wins at distances of 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f, and 12f showing
versatility on all tracks and many distances. SS won 7 total stakes, 6
Grade 1 wins but only at distances from 9f to 10f. Both versatile
indeed, but that is a big difference in versatility. Easy Goer also
defeated older horses Six times at ages three and four while conceding a
good amount of weight in quite a few of them. SS defeated older horses
only two times at ages three and four. Many other
factors would favor Easy Goer over SS as well, including a) amount of
career races able to run - 20 to 14 ; b) amount of total career wins -
14 to 9 ; c) running times at all distances ; d) average running times
at all distances ; e) career earnings without bonuses - about $ 4.8
million to about $ 3. 8 million ; f) career winning percentage - 70% to
64% ; g) Grade 1 wins - 9 to 6 ; h) total stakes wins - 12 to 7 ; i)
wins vs older horses/open/unrestricted at ages three and four - 6 to 2 ;
j) Grade 1 stakes wins at various distances - EG at 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f and
12f, SS at only 9f to 10f ; k) Easy Goer never was defeated by more
than 2 and a half lengths in any race in a much longer career, SS never
was defeated by more than 8 lengths in any race in a much shorter career
; other factors that would favor Easy Goer would be varying distances
won at, records set, near records set, still standing records, running
times, avg running times at all distances, amount of races with no drugs
and medications, campaigns, durability, constitution, dominance and
superiority in races - average win margin and average loss margin, weights carried, weight concessions, etc. They were both greats no doubt, but IMO other than SSs slim edge in their head to head races, Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if not all - these other factors and categories. Both greats, but In my
opinion Easy Goer was a better horse than SS, and had a superior body of
work and career than SS. But of course, once again, better in any way
is still totally subjective.
Sorry but head to head is what counts.. .... head to head competition is what defines champions ......accept it.
'Sorry' but if head to head is "what counts," and head to head is what "defines champions," then Noor, Beau Purple, SS, Big Spruce,
Interco, Mehmet, Cabrini Green, Darby Creek Road, Damascus, Cutlass Reality, Billy Kelly, Formal Gold, Pretense, Clem, Summer Squall, Heritageofgold ,Jewel Princess, Serenas Song, Crystal Water, Ancient Title, Akureyri etc etc would be 'better defined champions' than Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Skip Away, Dr Fager, Damascus, Arts and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient Title, John Henry, Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song, Pleasant Colony, Sir Barton, Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. After all, they all were all either behind or tied in head to heads. Accept it!
'Sorry' but if head to head is "what counts," and head to head is what
"defines champions," then Noor, Beau Purple, SS, Big Spruce,
Interco, Mehmet, Cabrini Green, Darby Creek Road, Damascus, Cutlass
Reality, Billy Kelly, Formal Gold, Pretense, Clem, Summer Squall,
Heritageofgold ,Jewel Princess, Serenas Song, Crystal Water, Ancient
Title, Akureyri etc etc would be 'better defined champions' than
Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Skip Away, Dr Fager, Damascus, Arts
and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient Title, John Henry,
Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song, Pleasant Colony, Sir Barton,
Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. After all, they all were
all either behind or tied in head to heads. Accept it!
How can a horse that is superior, greater, better, stronger and faster
(subjective) than his rival be behind 3 to 1 in head to head races? The
same way that
Citation (lost 4 of 5 to his rival Noor), Kelso (lost 3 of 4 to rival
Beau Purple), Dr Fager (lost 2 of 4 to rival Damascus), Forego (lost 2
of 3 to rivals Big Spruce and Wajima), Pleasant Colony (lost 3 of 4 to
rival Akureyri), Skip Away (lost 4 of 6 to rival Formal Gold), John
Henry (lost 3 of 3 to Darby Creek Road, lost 4 of 4 to Cabrini Green,
and lost 2 of 3 to both Mehmet and Interco), Round Table (lost 3 to
rival Clem), Native Diver (lost 5 to rival Pretense), Unbridled (lost 4
of 6 to rival Summer Squall), Sir Barton (lost 8 of 12 to Billy Kelly),
Kotashaan (lost 3 of 4 to Star of Cozzene), and many many others
are/were!!
Easy Goer is in
with some legendary all time greats who were also behind or tied on the
head to head scoreboard vs others, including legendary greats such as
Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Skip Away, Dr Fager, Damascus, Arts
and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient Title, John Henry,
Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song, Pleasant Colony, Sir Barton,
Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. He is in with some all
time great and legendary company.
Who was better? Better, like beauty, is totally subjective. They were
both greats no doubt, but IMO other than SSs slim edge in their head to
head races, Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if not all - these
other factors and categories. Both greats, but In my opinion Easy Goer
was a better horse than SS, and had a superior body of work and career
than SS. But of course, once again, better in any way is still totally
subjective. Many many greats were behind or tied on the head to head
scoreboard - Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Skip Away, Dr Fager,
Damascus, Arts and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient Title,
John Henry, Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song, Pleasant Colony,
Sir Barton, Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. Easy Goer was
much more flashy & dominant, while SS was more workmanlike. Who was
better though? Better, like beauty is subjective and true in the eyes
of the
beholder. Better is subjective, and there are numerous factors. And
even after those factors are factored in, who was better is totally
subjective. Noor beat immortal Citation 4 out of 5 races. Beau Purple
beat immortal Kelso 3 out of 4. Big Spruce beat immortal Forego 2 out
of 3. Interco and Mehmet beat lengendary champ John Henry 2 out of 3.
Cabrini Green beat John Henry 4 of 4. Darby Creek Road beat legendary
John Henry 3 of 3. HOF (Hall of Fame) champ Damascus beat HOF champ Dr
Fager 2 out of 4. Cutlass Reality beat HOY Ferdinand 3 times. Billy
Kelly beat Triple Crown winner Sir Barton 8 of 12. Formal Gold beat
HOF HOY champ Skip Away 4 out of 6. HOF champ Majestic Prince beat HOF
HOY champ Arts and Letters 2 out of 3. Pretense beat HOF champ Native
Diver 5 times. Clem beat HOF HOY champ Round Table 3 times. Summer
Squall beat Champion Unbridled 4 out of 6. Heritageofgold beat HOF
champ Silverbulletday 3 out of 3 times. Jewel Princess beat HOF
champion Serenas Song in 3 of 3 races. Crystal Water beat HOF champ
Ancient Title 4 times. Akureyri beat Champ Pleasant Colony 3 out of 4.
Who is better? That is totally subjective. There are numerous factors,
including but not limited to : superior career, superior and better
body of work, GI wins, Graded Stakes wins, wins against older horses and
open company, running times, avg running times at various distances and
at all distances, head to heads, records set, still standing records,
weights carried and weights conceded, stakes wins and stakes wins vs.
open company/older horses, varying distances won at during career,
superior campaign or campaigns, durability, constitution, superiority
and dominance, injuries, rider errors, training and trainer errors,
win/loss %s, trips, amount of races run, post positions, campaign and
career earnings with and without bonuses, races with drugs and
medications allowed/used, races with no drugs and medications
allowed/used, etc etc and many many more. But even after those factors
are factored in, who was better is still totally subjective.
Easy Goer and SS were both greats. Easy Goer won 12 total stakes, 9
Grade 1 wins at distances of 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f, and 12f showing
versatility on all tracks and many distances. SS won 7 total stakes, 6
Grade 1 wins but only at distances from 9f to 10f. Both versatile
indeed, but that is a big difference in versatility. Easy Goer also
defeated older horses Six times at ages three and four while conceding a
good amount of weight in quite a few of them. SS defeated older horses
only two times at ages three and four. Many other factors would favor
Easy Goer over SS as well, including a) amount of career races able to
run - 20 to 14 ; b) amount of total career wins - 14 to 9 ; c) running
times at all distances ; d) average running times at all distances ; e)
career earnings without bonuses - about $ 4.8 million to about $ 3. 8
million ; f) career winning percentage - 70% to 64% ; g) Grade 1 wins -
9 to 6 ; h) total stakes wins - 12 to 7 ; i) wins vs older
horses/open/unrestricted at ages three and four - 6 to 2 ; j) Grade 1
stakes wins at various distances - EG at 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f and 12f, SS at
only 9f to 10f ; k) Easy Goer never was defeated by more than 2 and a
half lengths in any race in a much longer career, SS never was defeated
by more than 8 lengths in any race in a much shorter career ; other
factors that would favor Easy Goer would be varying distances won at,
records set, near records set, still standing records, running times,
avg running times at all distances, amount of races with no drugs and
medications, campaigns, durability, constitution, dominance and
superiority in races - average win margin and average loss margin,
weights carried, weight concessions, etc. They were both greats no
doubt, but IMO other than SSs slim edge in their head to head races,
Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if not all - these other factors
and categories. Both greats, but In my
opinion Easy Goer was a better horse than SS, and had a superior body of
work and career than SS. But of course, once again, better in any way
is still totally subjective.
You still don't get it and you can't see the forest from the trees. Plain and simple Sunday Silence beat Easy Goer three out of four times..... Sunday Silence had Easy Goer's number and Sunday Silence had a bigger heart ...the heart of a champion that's why Sunday Silence was named 3 year old champ and Horse of the Year NOT Easy Goer.....get over it!
You seriously still don't get it and you can't see the forest from the
trees. "Better, more heart, etc' are all totally SUBJECTIVE; and head to
head is JUST ONE factor (ONE tree in the huge forest) among a numerous, endless amount of OTHER FACTORS (the entire huge forest), and even after those factors are factored in, who was 'better, more heart, etc' is STILL TOTALLY SUBJECTIVE. More subjective nonsense; bigger heart is totally subjective as I will show and prove; eclipse awards and rankings are also totally subjective as I will show and prove. You still don't get it and you can't see the forest from the trees; head to heads are ONLY ONE factor (only ONE tree) when there are numerous, endless amounts of OTHER FACTORS (the huge forest). Nobody is debating the fact that ss held the slight 3 to 1 edge over Easy Goer in head to head races. Plain and simple Noor beat Citation four out of five times; Beau Purple beat Kelso three out of four times; Wajima beat Forego two out of three times; Big Spruce beat Forego two out of three times; Darby Creek Road beat John Henry three out of three times; Cabrini Green beat John Henry four out of four times; Billy Kelly beat Sir Barton eight out of twelve times; Summer Squall beat Unbridled four out of six times; Formal Gold beat Skip Away four out of six times; Akureyri beat Pleasant Colony three out of four times; and an endless amount of others. Eclipse Awards? Been there done that; Hall of Fame champion Easy Goer already won Eclipse Award championships the year before. Who cares? Heart? Easy Goer ran MANY MANY more races at more varied distances spaced in a MUCH smaller span of time running without any drugs and medications, showing who really had more heart, constitution, durability, etc . This is also totally subjective, and just one factor (one tree) of a numerous, endless amount of other factors (huge forest).
Year end awards meaning something? That's also ike saying that Noor had Citation's number and Noor had a bigger heart than Citation...the heart of a champion that's why Noor was named champion and Horse of the Year and NOT Citation in 1950. That's like saying that Majestic Prince beat Arts and Letters two out of three times; Majestic Prince had Arts and Letters number and Majestic Prince had a bigger heart than Arts and Letters...the heart of a champion YET ARTS AND LETTERS was named 3 year old champ and Horse of the Year NOT Majestic Prince. So much for opinion based awards meaning anything. That's like saying that Summer Squall beat Unbridled four out of six times; Summer Squall had Unbridled's number and Summer Squall had a bigger heart than Unbridled...the heart of a champion YET UNBRIDLED was named 3 year old champ NOT Summer Squall. So much for opinion based awards meaning anything. That's like saying that Star of Cozzene beat Kotashaan three out of three times; Star of Cozzene had Kotashaan's number and Star of Cozzene had a bigger heart than Kotashaan...the heart of a champion YET KOTASHAAN was named Horse of the Year NOT Star of Cozzene. So much for opinion based awards meaning anything. Ditto Formal Gold/Skip Away, Billy Kelly/Sir Barton, Wajima/Forego, Big Spruce/Forego, Interco/John Henry, Mehmet/John Henry, Akureyri/Pleasant Colony, Beau Purple/Kelso, Seattle Slew/Affirmed, Nashua/Swaps, Damascus/Dr. Fager etc etc etc. So much for opinion based awards meaning anything.
What an exciting Triple Crown that was. I was a huge Easy Goer fan that year. I was at The Preakness and was standing at the infield finish line and still remember how close that finish was. The people at Pimlico were in an uproar over the crowding in the stretch. The Belmont? Ahh.. sweet vindication. How marvelous it was to see Sunday Silence's contribution to the breed, but how sad to see Easy Goer's influence be so slim. Thanks for the upload. BRIAN
Easy Goer was clearly the better horse and ran the better race in the Preakness and Classic..He was also favored in both also..Easy Goer made an early fast move in the preakness and SS rolled right next to him on the turn..Sunday Silence could not get by Easy Goer the entire length of stretch while having Easy Goer pinned on the rail..SS managed to get a "nose" victory..Easy Goer simply was the best horse..SS had the huge advantage in the Classic on 1 of the most speed/pace favoring surfaces (Gulfstream)..Easy Goer broke slow and was never comfortable at any time during the race..When he finally got comfortable he made a huge rush to lose by a neck..if Easy Goer was on the bit during this race he wins easily...Only legit race SS won was the Derby (and it was muddy)..Always felt Easy Goer would have not only won the Derby if it were on a fast track but he would have ran a VERY fast final time considering how fast and sharp he was coming into the race..Easy Goer also entered the Derby with much less rest than SS..The rest of Easy Goers brilliant career outside of these races showcased how much more talented he was over SS..The Belmont really showcased exactly how DOMINANT 1 horse could be over the other...Nose/neck wins are basically about luck and circumstance and how a bad trip or diff ride could have changed the outcome..But at 12F all of that goes out the window and the BEST horse period will prevail..8 lengths ahead of SS was simply DOMINANCE
So many excuses... Easy Goer faced suspect competition in his victories and when faced against quality competition he lost 3 out of 4. Coulda woulda and shoulda is your argument......he was beat 3 out of 4 times. Accept it....ou cant change history, true champions find ways to win in spite of whatever BS circumstances or disadvantages they are against. Easy Goer couldnt beat a high quality horse....accept it. As far as EG's 8 length victory in the Belmont, he could'nt get it done at the classic distance but SS could...on many occasions. So sit down and just accept it.
Easy Goer was a DRUG FREE true Hall of Fame champion over all track sizes. SS NEEDED PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS and smaller tracks. SS NEEDED PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS and smaller tracks to very narrowly beat EG in a few races by the slimmest of margins. SS's record WITHOUT PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS and on larger tracks with a circumference larger than a mile was 5 Losses out of 6 races. Easy Goer beat SS far more handily than he beat all those other multimillionaire multiple G1 winners when SS was forced to race WITHOUT PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS over a larger track with a circumference larger than a mile while running the classic distance for the whole world on the championship track, which is by far the fairest track. And Numerous greats were behind or tied on the head to head, including Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Dr Fager, Damascus, Swaps, Nashua, John Henry, Skip Away, Sir Barton, Pleasant Colony, Shuvee and many others; and
who's better in any way is totally subjective period.in. There is an
infinite amount more other than head to heads.
SS NEEDED PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS and smaller tracks to very
narrowly beat EG in a few races by the slimmest of margins. SS's record
WITHOUT PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS and on larger tracks with a
circumference larger than a mile was 5 Losses out of 6 races. Easy Goer
beat SS far more handily than he beat all those other multimillionaire
multiple G1 winners when SS was forced to race WITHOUT PERFORMANCE
ENHANCING DRUGS over a larger track with a circumference larger than a
mile while running the classic distance for the whole world on the
championship track, which is by far the fairest track. And Numerous
greats were behind or tied on the head to head, including Citation,
Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Dr Fager, Damascus, Swaps, Nashua, John Henry,
Skip Away, Sir Barton, Pleasant Colony, Shuvee and many others; and
who's better in any way is totally subjective period. There was the Test
of the Champion Belmont Stakes where Easy Goer destroyed him in the
only state in the entire country during that era that banned all drugs.
Balanced against that are two wins by Sunday Silence against Easy Goer
by the narrowest of margins, and a total of 3 wins which SS won by a
combined margin of less than two and three-quarter lengths. So SS held
the slight 3-1 edge against EG with 3 wins coming in close wins and a
loss in which he was destroyed. Easy Goer also ran the record mile one
full second faster than Secretariat's record. Easy Goer also ran a
better, faster Ragozin speed figure than Secretariat did in their
respective Belmont Stakes. Easy Goer also ran some of the greatest,
fastest all timer performances at every distance he ran - 6.5F, 7F, 8F,
9F, 10F, 12F. Easy Goer generally ran faster times than Sunday Silence
at all distances. Easy Goer more often ran faster times than Sunday
Silence at all distances, including many outstanding, perennial all
timer performances at every distance - 6.5F, 7F, 8F, 9F, 10F, 12F.
Sunday Silence lost 36% of his races, mostly to lesser horses including
Houston, Prized, Criminal Type, and Cro Lover. Better in any way is
totally subjective. Neither the Easy Goer/SS example or the other ones I
cite show that any of these horses was "better" (which is totally
subjective anyways) or was able to consistently get the better of the
other. All these examples show is the records of two horses in a VERY
MINUSCULE number of races. A few races certainly would NOT be even close
to a large enough sample size if you were trying to establish
consistency on a statistical basis; nor is it even close to a large
enough sample size to show who was "better" (which is totally subjective
anyways). SS held the slight 3 to 1 edge over EG in the races they both
ran in. Those are facts, but who's "better overall", "better in
general," or "better" in any way are all totally subjective. "Better" is
totally subjective and numerous greats were behind or tied in head to
head records vs other horses, including Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer,
Forego, Dr Fager, Damascus, Swaps, Nashua, John Henry, Skip Away, Sir
Barton, Pleasant Colony, Shuvee and many others. Citation got beat 4 out
of 5 by Noor; Kelso got beat 3 out of 4 by Beau Purple; Forego got beat
2 out of 3 by Big Spruce; Shuvee got beat 4 out of 5 by Gallant Bloom;
Dr Fager got beat 2 out of 4 by Damascus; Pleasant Colony got beat 3 out
of 4 by Akureyri; Triple Crown winner Sir Barton got beat 8 out of 12
by Billy Kelly; Skip Away got beat 4 out of 6 by Formal Gold; &
there are an endless amount of other similar examples.
Easy Goer also ran many more races in a shorter time period with much
less time between races, and at more varying distances; & he ran
mostly in the only state in the entire country at the time that banned
all drugs. SS ran significantly less races with much more time between
races, at less varying distances, & all but 1 of his races were run
in states that allowed drugs. Sunday Silence's record (Lost 4 of 6
races; Losing record on his home track losing 3 races) on bigger tracks
with a circumference of 1 1/8m or larger was very similar to Easy Goer's
record on smaller mile circumferenced tracks. However, size of tracks,
size of turns, straightaway/turn speed & acceleration, region,
rider/rider tactics, trainer/training, drugs/medications not being
allowed, etc etc, are just a few of the numerous variables, and cannot
be simplified when there are many more factors and variables. It is much
more complicated than that given the myriad of variables that determine
the outcome of races. Failing to factor the numerous other variables in
can lead to the wrong conclusions about why horses win or lose races.
It makes no sense to look at cause and effect simplistically because
other variables may have determined the outcome. Just because the Earth
looks flat based on the way we actually see it, does not mean that it is
flat. There are numerous factors, including but not limited to :
superior career, superior & better body of work, GI wins, Graded
Stakes wins, wins against older horses & open company, running
times, avg running times at various distances & at all distances,
head to heads, records set, still standing records, weights carried
& weights conceded, stakes wins & stakes wins vs. open
company/older horses, varying distances won at during career, superior
campaign or campaigns, durability, constitution, superiority &
dominance, injuries, jockeys, riding & rider errors, trainers,
training and trainer errors, win/loss %'s, trips, amount of races run,
track sizes, track circumferences, post positions, campaign & career
earnings with & without bonuses, races with drugs & medications
allowed/used, races with no drugs & medications allowed/used, etc
etc & many many more.
They were both great horses, but who's better is still totally
subjective even after factoring in the endless amount of other factors.
Easy Goer & SS were both greats. Easy Goer won 12 total stakes, 9
Grade 1 wins at distances of 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f, and 12f showing
versatility on all tracks & many distances. SS won 7 total stakes, 6
Grade 1 wins but only at distances from 9f to 10f. Both versatile
indeed, but that is a big difference in versatility. Easy Goer also
defeated older horses Six times at ages three and four while conceding a
good amount of weight in quite a few of them. SS defeated older horses
only two times at ages three and four. Many other factors would favor
Easy Goer over SS as well, including a) amount of career races able to
run - 20 to 14 ; b) amount of total career wins - 14 to 9 ; c) running
times at all distances ; d) average running times at all distances ; e)
career earnings without bonuses - about $ 4.8 million to about $ 3.8
million ; f) career winning percentage - 70% to 64% ; g) Grade 1 wins - 9
to 6 ; h) total stakes wins - 12 to 7 ; i) wins vs older
horses/open/unrestricted at ages three & four - 6 to 2 ; j) Grade 1
stakes wins at various distances - EG at 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f & 12f; SS
at only 9f to 10f ; k) Easy Goer never was defeated by more than 2 &
a half lengths in any race in a much longer career, SS never was
defeated by more than 8 lengths in any race in a much shorter career;
& other factors that would favor Easy Goer would be varying
distances won at, records set, near records set, still standing records,
running times, avg running times at all distances, campaigns,
durability, constitution, dominance & superiority in races - average
win margin and average loss margin, weights carried, weight
concessions, etc. Other than SS's slight edge in head to head races, IMO
Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if not all - these other factors
& categories. But even after all of these numerous factors are
factored in, who was better is still subjective. They were both greats,
but IMO Easy Goer was a better horse, had a superior body of work, and
had a superior career than SS even though SS held the slight edge in
head to head races by the nose of his Preakness win. There is an
infinite amount more other than head to heads.
at the end of the day sunday silence beat easy goer 3 of 4 times in the 4 biggest races of the year
+jimcunningham61 Yep ss held the 3 to 1 edge. Easy Goer & SS both turned out to be all time greats with great accomplishments. Many many greats were behind or tied on the head to head scoreboard - Citation, Kelso, Easy Goer, Forego, Skip Away, Dr Fager, Damascus, Arts and Letters, Swaps, Nashua, Round Table, Ancient Title, John Henry, Unbridled, Silverbulletday, Serenas Song, Pleasant Colony, Sir Barton, Ferdinand, Native Diver, and many many others. Easy Goer was much more flashy & dominant, while SS was more workmanlike. Who was better though? Better, like beauty is subjective and true in the eyes of the beholder. Better is subjective, and there are numerous factors. And even after those factors are factored in, who was better is totally subjective. Noor beat immortal Citation 4 out of 5 races. Beau Purple beat immortal Kelso 3 out of 4. Big Spruce beat immortal Forego 2 out of 3. Interco and Mehmet beat lengendary champ John Henry 2 out of 3. Cabrini Green beat John Henry 4 of 4. Darby Creek Road beat legendary John Henry 3 of 3. HOF (Hall of Fame) champ Damascus beat HOF champ Dr Fager 2 out of 4. Cutlass Reality beat HOY Ferdinand 3 times. Billy Kelly beat Triple Crown winner Sir Barton 8 of 12. Formal Gold beat HOF HOY champ Skip Away 4 out of 6. HOF champ Majestic Prince beat HOF HOY champ Arts and Letters 2 out of 3. Pretense beat HOF champ Native Diver 5 times. Clem beat HOF HOY champ Round Table 3 times. Summer Squall beat Champion Unbridled 4 out of 6. Heritageofgold beat HOF champ Silverbulletday 3 out of 3 times. Jewel Princess beat HOF champion Serenas Song in 3 of 3 races. Crystal Water beat HOF champ Ancient Title 4 times. Akureyri beat Champ Pleasant Colony 3 out of 4. Who is better? That is totally subjective. There are numerous factors, including but not limited to : superior career, superior and better body of work, GI wins, Graded Stakes
wins, wins against older horses and open company, running times, avg
running times at various distances and at all distances, head to heads,
records set, still standing records, weights carried and weights
conceded, stakes wins and stakes wins vs. open company/older
horses, varying distances won at during career, superior campaign or
campaigns, durability, constitution, superiority and dominance,
injuries, rider errors, training and trainer errors, win/loss %s, trips,
amount of races run, post positions, campaign and career earnings with
and without bonuses, races with drugs and medications allowed/used,
races with no drugs and medications allowed/used, etc etc and many
many more. But even after those factors are factored in, who was better
is still totally subjective.
Easy Goer and SS were both greats. Easy Goer won 12 total stakes, 9
Grade 1 wins at distances of 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f, and 12f showing
versatility on all tracks and many distances. SS won 7 total stakes, 6
Grade 1 wins but only at distances from 9f to 10f. Both versatile
indeed, but that is a big difference in versatility. Easy Goer also
defeated older horses Six times at ages three and four while conceding a
good amount of weight in quite a few of them. SS defeated older horses
only two times at ages three and four. Many other
factors would favor Easy Goer over SS as well, including a) amount of
career races able to run - 20 to 14 ; b) amount of total career wins -
14 to 9 ; c) running times at all distances ; d) average running times
at all distances ; e) career earnings without bonuses - about $ 4.8
million to about $ 3. 8 million ; f) career winning percentage - 70% to
64% ; g) Grade 1 wins - 9 to 6 ; h) total stakes wins - 12 to 7 ; i)
wins vs older horses/open/unrestricted at ages three and four - 6 to 2 ;
j) Grade 1 stakes wins at various distances - EG at 7f, 8f, 9f, 10f and
12f, SS at only 9f to 10f ; k) Easy Goer never was defeated by more
than 2 and a half lengths in any race in a much longer career, SS never
was defeated by more than 8 lengths in any race in a much shorter career
; other factors that would favor Easy Goer would be varying distances
won at, records set, near records set, still standing records, running
times, avg running times at all distances, amount of races with no drugs
and medications, campaigns, durability, constitution, dominance and
superiority in races - average win margin and average loss margin, weights carried, weight concessions, etc. They were both greats no doubt, but IMO other than SSs slim edge in their head to head races, Easy Goer was better than SS in most - if not all - these other factors and categories. Both greats, but In my opinion Easy Goer was a better horse than SS, and had a superior body of work and career than SS. But of course, once again, better in any way is still totally subjective.
you done your homework my friend, my problem with holy bull is he never showed up on derby day , as for easy goer he was an incredible horse no doubt , won the Belmont but not the derby or the classic
+jimcunningham61 Thanks my friend, but I never mentioned Holy Bull in my comment.
+DELMARCLUB1 yes I know , holy bull was a nice horse , in my mind great horses win big races , Sunday silence, Ferdinand, alysheba all won the derby and the classic enough said
+jimcunningham61 So did Unbridled. Enough said? The legendary, all time greats Dr. Fager, Forego, Kelso, Tom Fool, Buckpasser, Round Table, John Henry, Seabiscuit, Skip Away, Holy Bull, Ruffian, and many many many others were all time great horses who didn't win any TC races or Classic, but they all won numerous other 'big' races. That doesn't diminish them at all. Other all time greats like like Bold Ruler, Easy Goer, Swaps, Gallant Man, Sword Dancer, Arts and Letters, etc etc won only 1 TC race, but they all won numerous other 'big' races. That doesn't diminish them at all either.
Sunday silence looks like he wanted to bite off a piece of easy goers face in that stretch run at the preakness. Both were strong stretch runners but easy goer was just better that day, denying sunday silence the crown. sunday silence could win, but not that day. easy goer was not going to give him the crown.
He did something worse than just bite he ran old rubber legs to the ground
@@cominatcha6223 The only horse whose legs not only melted but were incinerated into the ground was the drug-dependent and illegal criminal veterinarian Alex Harthill-reliant sunday silence when ss was forced to run drug-free without any drugs in the only state in the whole country at the time which prohibited all drugs - and, as importantly, also banned ss's illegal criminal vet Alex Harthill as well
@@cominatcha6223 😭😭
@@cominatcha6223
Only problem i Have is that Some people look at the "3 to 1" record and Fail to even Notice that 2 of those Races were decided at the Wire by a Neck & Nose...Could have "Easily" been 3 to 1 in Easy Goers Favor...1 "Nose" Short of being Tied at 2-2...When you Put this into Perspective and are Subjective along with what Easy Goer did to Sunday Silence in The Belmont and Rest of Easy Goers resume outside of this rivalry i Would say Easy Goer was the Better Horse...He was just "Unfortunate"
"sharp turned mile tracks" = every track except Belmont
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