Part 1: Iconic turntables (which one makes it to our listening room?)
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- Опубліковано 20 тра 2024
- Harley Lovegrove's guide to his all time top 10 iconic turntables. Why they were so important, and how they shaped our industry and listening experience. (Plus the one I choose for our listening room).
Interesting links:
Garrard:
garrardturntables.co.uk/
gramophonemuseum.com/garrard-...
Acoustic Research:
The Acoustic Research 'hammer' video: • Audiophile Turntable T...
Thorens:
keithwright.ca/Thorens/Thorens...
idler-drive.com/index.php/foru...
insheepsclothinghifi.com/thor...
Lenco:
stereonomono.blogspot.com/sea...
Lenco 'Heaven' (for spareparts and advice etc.): www.lencoheaven.net/forum/ind...
Chapters:
00:00 Introduction
02:48 Garrard 301
04:55 Thorens TD-160
07:43 Acoustic Research XA
11:41 Lenco L75
13:42 Pioneer PL-12D
15:51 Transcriptors Hydraulic Reference
17:10 Technics SL-1200
19:17 Linn Sondek (LP-12)
23:30 Rega P3
25:55 Brinkmann Taurus
27:10 The big reveal
As always, if you would like to find out more about Pearl Acoustics and our Sibelius loudspeakers, please visit our website at www.pearlacoustics.com, or email us with your questions: enquiries@pearlacoustics.com.
Social media links:
/ pearlacoustics
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Just great Harley and thank you. I look forward to the rest of this series. After owning several decks from the 1970's (yes we are probably the same age), and then a long absence from LP's and perhaps music in general, I recently put together a system thinking I would go all digital. It started just fine and enjoyable. When I was then presented with the opportunity to purchase a turntable, a Nottingham Analogue 294 Space. I find it remarkable for it's philosophy of design and execution. Both aspects being focused on simplicity. Of course the game of getting the digital side up to level with the analogue side begin immediately after, A new streamer directly hard wired to a modem, a new (and expensive) DAC from Bulgaria, of course new interconnects, and I have to say it has not yet been able to catch up. Although I have a theory about why, I'm simply not knowledgeable enough to explain to present it here. But i do know what I hear and I'm astonished by the sound of analogue. As if I never heard music before.
Thanks for your comment and the mention of the Nottingham Analogue 294 Space, which I honestly didn't know! Enjoy the music.
If you have the opportunity to listen to the Nottingham, I highly recommend it. Weighing 65 lbs, it relies on mass, and is completely black (noise wise). The motor is a small asynchronous AC motor with just enough power to maintain speed. The deck has to be started by hand, and then relies on inertia mostly, a sort of flywheel.
@@jamesportrais3946 you're certainly entitled to your opinion - what you are not entitled to is a statement of absolute fact without ever hearing it. If you are in NYC you are welcome to hear my deck and system. From there you can draw your conclusion. Dribble or otherwise....We'll see.
@@smaarch1 Thanks for the scold smaarch, I'm a frightful nut at best. Your comment alerted me to a sour pile of crap that frankly, I have no memory of writing - must be this keto thing...
I would like to add a few more turntables! Pink Triangle, Ariston and Miracord! I was a distributor for Pink Triangle in the US in the 1980’s. The Miracord was an incredible changer! Ariston was beautifully made, great sounding turntable with the SME tonearm with a Denon 103C cartridge.
It's a pleasure to visit your civilized corner of the Internet.
Thanks! It's a pleasure to have you here.
I completely agree!
Amen to that Dan 🥂👍🏻
Since my born language is Spanish, my pleasure is to understand every word you say. Clear pronunciation and right speaking speed! I have a Technics SL 2000.
Thanks. Very kind. Enjoy your Technics
Exactly the same with me, only my mother's tongue is Serbian. Also have a Technics, SL1210MK2, and do enjoy it.
Nice! SL2000 was my first turntable back in the 70’s! Still have it!
I am missing a Denon turntable. They had fantastic direct drive turntables with the Denon DL103 MC cartridge. This cartridge from 1964 is still in production! But thanks, it’s a great 😊 list!
Thank you! And thanks for the tip on Denon
Looking forward to this series of presentations
I love the range of turntables you introduced here from the simple AR-XA and P3, the entry level PL-12D and Garrard 301, the slightly higher end LP-12 and Brinkman to finally some very beautiful and more complicated turntables. Excellent list and great description of the history of turntables.
Thank you Mike. You're very kind
Well done. We all expected to see a massive turntable weighing more and costing more than our daily driver. I am hooked. Looking forward to part 2.
Thanks!
As always, I appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts and knowledge.
Thank you 🙏
Thanks for an interesting video! I don't have a Thorens TD160 but I have a TD150 that I bought new in 1972 and has given me 50 years of continuous service. I recently refurbished it with a good polish and clean, new belt, acrylic arm board, new acrylic cover, new modified Rega arm and a re-veneer of the plinth. I have never considered replacing it with anything else and it will now outlive me. I'd say it was iconic 😀😍
Thank you for your appreciation. Indeed, you have a fine turntable that will last generations. definitely Iconic and ecological too.
@@PearlAcoustics
Is the Sondek LP12 just an ‘expensive copy’ of the Thorens TD150?
@@liboy9844 no it’s not a copy of the Thorens but of the Ariston
I bought a second hand P3 about 4 years ago. Absolutely no regrets, and I don't see much need to upgrade it any time soon.
P6 is fantastic, don’t listen. 😂
Harley, thank you for sharing your passion for music, music reproduction and your love for audio gear.
Enjoyable video as always.
Regards,
Brian
Thanks Brian! Much appreciated.
I'm very happy you included the Garrard.
We have had Garrard for many years.
From a cheap basic in a Dansette player to my current player a Zero 100 which I bought new in 1973. I know the Zero has known issues. A true classic in terms of being unique but not the best of kind.
I would love to hear you talk about cables a very touchy subject.
Another wonderful and informative video, I am looking forward to the other episodes, thank you for taking the time to make them.
Thank you, that is very kind!. Pt. 2 comes soon...
Thanks for another great video. I have at home the Linn LP12 and the Michell Orbe and enjoy them both. I was born in 1972 so your observation of it being a significant year wasn’t lost on me!
:-) Glad you enjoyed it.
You have both! Which do you prefer and why?
@@boydsargeant7496 I had the LP12 originally as a 40th Birthday present to myself. It was secondhand and apart from an amazing Birdseye Maple plinth, it is in terms of space close to a fairly standard Malik level equivalent. It has made its way into my second system now where I have an Auralic Altair G2.1. I chose the G2.1 as I wanted to steam wirelessly due to cabling constraints as well as play back vinyl (the G2.1 has a phono stage) and use it primarily with headphones. The G2.1 has an excellent headphone amp. That left a gap in my main system (Devialet Expert 400, Sonus Faber Olympicia 3 speaker) and I always just loved the look of the Orbe so auditioned. The Orbe has a better arm and cartridge so it’s probably not a like for like comparison but the Orbe just sound more open and produces a bigger sound. Both great though and can’t imagine getting rid of either!
Fantastic video and always very educational. Looking forward to parts 2 and 3!
Thank you. 🙏
Nice video. I like the very calm and relaxed mood. And a great walk down memory lane.. having owned Lenco L75, Pioneer pl12d, Thorens td160, and Technics sl 1300 - the automatic 1200. Thanks a lot 🙂
Thank you very much for this. I’m now going to my music room to listen to my Thorens TD 160 while I look forward to Part 2 of your three part series.
You’re welcome! (I am going to my listening to record Pt. 2! 😉
Very nice, the Lenco L75 gave me a big smile, as a student I had one and I was very proud of it 😊 it was sparkling beautiful an looked like it was double the price it costs. This was followed by a technics SL 150, which was a version with tone arm mounting plate of a SL 1500 direct drive.
I had an SME 3009/ II Improved with fluid damper mounted on it. Then came a Transrotor AC which I bought with an SME 3009/ III arm but I changed this to my old version II for the better looks. I still use ist today and had to replace the belt last year, a real scandal…. It was running only 45 years ! 😎
I am really glad you included the PL 12D .I have had one for years and I love it .
@flixtonman Still got mine! I don't use it any more but I wouldn't get rid of it, too many memories associated with it.
Another great episode. Thanks for taking the time to put these together.
You're very welcome John. Thanks!
The loudspeakers and the vinyl pickup are the most important pieces. Because changing sound from movement to electrics and back are the hard bits. The rest is from simple to trivial in comparison.
I sold Regas from 83 to 2015 and was always impressed. I'm a member of an Australian Forum now and there is a creeping mendacity towards the cancelling of the brand on this Forum. Technics is the be all and end all. Glad to see someone in the business that appreciates Rega for what it is.
I used to retail rega. Funk firm and well tempered destroy them!!
Thank you
@@scottchegg1209 yeah, how? We sold the Continuum as well but I didnt need to mention that. Sounds like you have an Agenda, boring.
"Technics is the be all and end all." - likely due to today's DJ culture. They're regarded as artists and have as much notoriety as musicians and producers. So their equipment choices gain cult status.
Technics is for people who know nothing about turntables. Safe bet but overrated and too expensive for what they offer.
Very informative and well laid out! This is going to be one of those videos I'd forward to buddies looking to get deeper into learning about the turntable histories!
Thank you. Very kind!
I just love these talks, it brings sanity to my life.
That’s very nice to hear, thanks
I came across this video yesterday, and I love your presentation I have since watched quite a few, you have a great way of explaining things, also I have a Rega RP6, so I was surprised when it was a Rega that came out on top. Looking forward to seeing parts 2 & 3
Thanks Adrian. Glad you are enjoying them. Pt.2 will come out in December 12
Fantastic show.Thanks all. So interesting and I was surprised rgat I'd heard of four of them! Your'e a great host Harley .Captivated me from start to finish.X
Thanks!
A used Planar 3 (1998) was/is my first turntable. I have a RB300 tonearm and an AT150Sa cartridge - It's amazing :)
Great and informative video. I bought a PL12D back in 1978 and apart from changing the cartridge, stylus and headshell within a few months, all I ever changed were styli, belts and acrylic lid. I serviced it regularly and finally sold it in 2018.
I replaced it with a higher end modern turntable but I really miss that wonderful Pioneer.
Thanks Geoff. There's no denying the relationship we build with machines that we appreciate.
Great upload.
Many thanks for tracing back my memory lane.
Thanks!
My first turntable when I was a teenager was a Garrard - the SP25 Mk IV. Then as a student I also upgraded to the Pioneer PL12D/Shure M75EJ. After my student years, when I had more money, this was replaced with a Rega Planar 3/AR cartridge, followed by a Linn LP12/Linn Ittok/K9 setup. I now stream music from Qobuz via an Apple Mac mini and dream about going back to vinyl! C'est la vie : )
I have a Garrard SP25 MK IV now, and I enjoy it planning my vinyl record collection, but I still prefer the sound of my CD, SCAD and digital files.
In my case, the good from using my vinyl, cassette tapes, Minidisc an any other physical media is the experience to do it, not the sound.
@@VicenteSansaloni if you were to upgrade the SP25 MK IV to something like an entry level Rega or Pro-Ject turntable you might find out why vinyl is considered to be more musical and engaging by a lot of folks who are into music rather than 'hi-fi' though... : )
In my return to vinyl 14 years ago, I purchased an entry level Rega RP1 to see if the vinyl experience was worth it. Since them, I have modified this table with an aluminum sub-plater, acrylic platter and an RB330 arm. This simple setup will be a part of my system for many years to come.
Upgrading is always amazing!
Wow your story telling really took me into the scene , Thank you for taking the time and sharing part of your Audio Journey
Hi. You’re very welcome
Very nice presentation. I purchased a SL 1200MK2 in the mid 1980’s and used it continuously for 30 years then sold it fir more than I originally paid. A fine piece of engineering. But as my other kit was upgraded… it definitely was holding back the sound. I’m super happy with my new red P3 with Ortofon Bronze. Much more detail and separation.
Thank you for your comment and kind appreciation.
I bought a (new) Thorens 160 back in the 1970s and loved it . When I got back into vinyl a few years ago I was lucky enough to get a pristine Thorens 165 for a great price. I like this 165 better as it uses just gravity for stylus presure instead of a spring like in the 160.
I have a Thorens TD126 MKII and I find the spring downforce interesting. You could use the turntable on the moon or upside down (if you could keep the table itself in place) without adjustment.
Had my Rega P3 (with the straight RB300 tonearm) since 1986 and apart from replacing the band it's been brilliant. It's probably the one component that hasn't been upgraded or will be over time. Nice round up!
Thank you.
Lovely video, very much looking forward to parts 2 and 3!
Thank you. Glad you enjoyed it.
What an excellent review of the important milestones of modern turntables. I was in Hi Fi retail in the late 60’s and early 70’s and it was the Garrard 301 and 401 and the space age Transcriptors that made a great impression on me, though I could never afford to own any of them. A superb presentation, thank you .
Had a 401. Got a transcriptors. To replace it love it
I had a 401 partnered with the Transcriptors Fluid Arm with the Shure v15mk4 cartridge. The arm whilst innovative was in my opinion a bit of a disaster. The pivot which was or seemed to be a piece of mild steel fashioned to a point one end after a period of time the point wore down. The silicon fluid used to migrate and thus everything it touched was sticky. The sound was brilliant however, but that was in the main I believe,down to the KEF transmission line speakers I built from an old Wireless World article design utilising Dr. Bailey's longhaired wool.
That was really fun! Back in the 80's when I was setting up my system, I wanted a SOTA, but ended up with a P3 (with the straight one-piece tonearm, like in the second photo). Using a sorbothane mat for a little better isolation, clamp, a mid-range cartridge (dynavector) and rewiring the back end (because of cable corrosion), I have really been quite happy for a very long time now. A while back I switched to a McIntosh pre-amp, and I think I get all the reveal I need with my older ears! From the looks of it, the P-10 has improvements on all the best parts of the P3 formula.
Thanks m! Enjoy your turntable, enjoy the music!
I picked up a Technics sl1700 mk2 semi automatic and ive paired it with an AT 150 SA cartridge and Vista phono stage and the marriage is simply awesome. This setup rivals my digital chain which costs 10x the price.
I first got into vinyl in the early 90s, I did everything in reverse - I had a cassette deck first, then I got a CD player, then I got a record deck. I plumped for the Thorens TD166 (a budget derivative of the 160) which stood me in good stead for many years. The other option at the time was the Rega and back then I think you could get a basic Rega Planar for a little over £100, incredible value.
Wonderful talk. I purchased a Dual 1216 fitted with an Empire 1000 cartridge new in ‘76. Years later it fell into disrepair due to several moves. I had it restored recently and presented it to my daughter. It’s been in daily use ever since. Thank you.
Nice! I love this continuity aspects to our hobby.
A very enjoyable trip through turntable designs.
I bought the AR XA turntable while stationed in Korea during my army service in 1969. I used it up until the late 70's when i replaced it with a Connoisseur BD2 and gave the AR to a friend. Peter Mitchell of the Boston Audio Society published and article on improving the XA and I may still have a copy of that somewhere. As I recall the arm on the later turntable was better but the suspension on the AR just worked better. i remember having a Thorens 316 that had a problem with a bouncy floor, I solved that by "floating" the Thorens on an 8" inner tube that was inflated with just a few PSI of air - i remember it taking some trial and error to find the center of mass so it was all level but it solved that floor bounce once and for all.
:-) ingenious!
Yes I was a student in the seventies and I bought a Pioneer PL12 D which I still use today. Great turntable and arm.
Now that was a good investment!
Same except I sold it :(
I enjoyed this video so much! We are of an age. I think, and your recollections and reflections on early hi-fi were great - thank you!
Thanks - very kind
I have a Technics SL-1100A which I bought in early 1974 which predates the SL-1200. The SL1100A was claimed to be the first “integrated” (with tonearm) direct drive turntable in the world. I still use it.
Agreed, I also have the SL110 version of it with an SME3009/2 on it. They came out in 1971 and are a far superior deck to the SL1200
@@ThatMicro43Guy SL-1100 is slightly better but also much bigger. Sl-1200 is better for those with limited space.
Thanks for a great video once again, Harley! Always enjoyable and informative! I agree that each turntable merits their place on the list, but I'm missing 2:
- the Ariston RD11, on wich the Linn Sondek LP12 was based (well...) - not a commercial success, but a great story....
- the Dual CS-505. Back in the 80s, they were hugely succesful, and, to me at least, they are a trough mark of the era...
Hi Kris. absolutely! On reflection, I should have mentioned both Ariston and Dual...
Good Day Kris, as a Linn owner, I would say: "on which the Linn Sondek LP12 "perfected"" 😇
My parents owned a Lenco l75. Was my first experience with a turntable. Later on bought 2 Technics SL 1200 mk2's. Because DJ. Now I own 4. 3 for the dj booth and one slightly modified for my hifi setup. In my hifi setup I only had and I only want Technics.
In 1977 I bought a barely used Sony 2251 with a Gen 2 SME 3009 and Grado Cartridge. Still play it to this day. Fantastic table/arm combo.
Nice presentation, always enjoy hearing about decks. I have a fairly high-end Linn Sondek that's evolved since I bought it back in '94, I love how it sounds. That said if I could have any deck it would be an SME model 60, that thing is a pure event in every aspect.
Thank you. I considered the SME 60 but could not fit it in and decided for Brinkmann instead. It was a close call
What a perceptive and thorough list!
Through the decades, I've owned a Garrard, a Thorens, a direct drive Technics, an LP12 and a Gyrodec. My Gyrodec sounds wonderful. My friend had a Rega P3, it was a super record player, I'll be fascinated to learn about your P10 in. Part 2!
Thank you. Very kind. It took some work 😉
I also had a Revolver Super, which was brilliant. I lost it in a burglary, otherwise I'd have kept it for ever. And a Pro-ject 6 mark 1, excellent value as a 'poor man's Gyrodec' until I could afford the Michell.
I also own a gyrodec and it was a great improvement over a very nice sounding later model AR turntable , the eb101. I wanted something which would get me into the ballpark of high end table sound without tremendous money and have been very pleased.
I became aware of the product when viewing a bunch of pictures of owners' high end expensive turntables posted from a very high end Italian Hi Fi club. There, among all these pictures of tables that cost like a small car was submitted a single picture of a gyro table.
I figured if it could hold it's own among that company , it was worth investigating, since home theatre had made a turntable listening demo impossible at the time, and I needed a very solid, buy one time and keep it, choice. When I discovered that old man Michell , as his last undertaking before his death , had voiced a hot rodded Rega arm to the table, the techno arm, that allowed for VTA adjustment on the fly, I correctly figured that the established symbiotic match would serve my limited budget well. The isolating, from external acoustics, suspension design works very well in my small living room listening space. the soundstage is incredible.
@@richardelliott8352 I find that the Gyrodec, with my Alphason Xenon arm and Goldring Excel cartridge makes every record sound like a live performance. The sense of space and life it brings from a record is fabulous. I'm glad you love yours too.
I have the AR XA turntable. It is an amazing record player, so simple and well executed. MOMA has one in their permanent collection. Compared to my Oracle/Alphason it is close in performance. Remarkably easy to use, dead accurate, silent wow & flutter and very dynamic- you must hear one! Remarkable…
I always wondered about those. I worried about how the arm didn't seem too steady at its pivot. Never got to demo one. If I had I probably would have searched for a good used one. Unsteady I had the AR The Turntable with a Linn arm on it. Before that a Braun PS 500 and before that, my first decent turntable, a Philips GA 212. Nowadays, because I wanted a table I could vary speed on so I could play along on my guitar easier, the AT 120 USB.aka the poor man's Technics 1200.
Thanks! very interesting
I have an Oracle..love it..heard a lot of tabled. Brother in law had quad esl 63's with Naim and quad electronics tied to an Alphason Sonata table..koetsu black cartridge. Phenomenal.
I've had the AR-XA since about 1969. Still works fine and is incredibly quiet and simple to use. Sorry, I'm on the West Coast of the USA, so I don't think it would be possible to loan it.
@@michaelarighi5268 hi. Indeed I wouldn’t dare borrow it from you 😉 but that’s a very nice thought!
I have a Goldirng Lenco GL70 (L70 if the original Lenco version). This one and the GL59 were earlier versions of the L72, L75 & L78. The drive systems complete with the varispeed are almost the same. The big difference is in the arm which uses a completely different bearing arrangement and is also adjustable to elimunate bearing play. The arm is spring loaded (instead of using a balance weight) which was soon regarded as outdated for a hi-fi deck. In the view of some, including me, it's a better arm than what the later decks used. It used to have a rumble problem but I managed to source a replacement idler wheel which made a huge difference. It's a very fine sounding deck now.
Thank you. Looking forward to the next ones.
you're welcome
An excellent video Harley. I grew up a few years after you and was lucky enough to have an LP12 for some years. I sold it to fund university! I never sold my LP's and stored them carefully until Covid led me to a new turntable. I chose a Michell Gyro, but the Rega P8 was also on my list. I was a hifi snob as well and Rega was sneered at, until you heard one objectively. There are a number of fine machines available now, but the huge oil rig dimension machines don't excite me at all.
Thank you. Very kind. Lovely comment. I am with you all the way.
until you heard one objectively??
I've got the Rega rp8, fantastic turntable! In skeleton mode, obviously. I particularly appreciate the setup simplicity, as well as the stellar performance
I’ve got a P8 and it’s fantastic
@@mpmcruz certainly!
Thank you for a very sober and honest video - I am looking forward to part 2 and 3.
I were there when Rega Planet and Rega Planar was fist introduced in Denmark. Also I can confirm that Technics SL-1200 is back in production and as far as I know there is even a SL-1400 now.
One of my dear old friends had both the SL-1200 and a Planar and just a few month before his pass away :-/ he asked me to find time to pick them up, together with his 400 LP's - undfortunately he was an alcoholic and just about everything of value disapeared from his home in the last two month of his life.
So - when a dear friend ask you to help take care of some of his most loved possessions - don't try find the time - take the time no matter what
Thanks for your kind words. So sorry to hear about the loss of your friend.
Brings back memories!! My pride and joy,lenco gl 75, with a shure cartridge!! Thanks
I own a Technics 1200g and its smallest brother 1500c. Glad to see 1200 in your list, Harley. Nice and well documented video! 👌
Thank you. 🙏
@@PearlAcoustics But what happened to the sl-1100 if sl-1200 was the first? Excellent video by the way :).
@@espenblom-stenersen6098 actually, the first was the SP-10. No idea about a SP1100 😉
@@PearlAcoustics True. The SP-10 was released in 1970. SL-1100 was later, from 1975, with a brushless motor. I have one of those :)
Fascinating! Thanks. I have a Dual 1009, from 1964. The first version, without a cueing lever. It sounds amazing, I find it is superior to many modern decks. The platter is very heavy indeed, and the arm is very light. And it is fully automatic of course. I rather think it will last forever!
That’s interesting. I will look it up! Sadly I overlooked Dual in my talk. Enjoy your wonderful turntable
Brilliantly presented and researched piece, thanks Harley.❤😊
Thank you! Very kind 🙏
I began my turntable history with an AR XA with a Shure M91ED. Loved it. Later a Thorens TD 160 with a Shure V15 3,. Awesome turntable. Then a Technics 1400 with Shure V15 5 (semi automatic direct drive) and it was a great table too. Then, recently I got back into vinyl with a Rega RP8 and an Apheta 2. I loved all of the tables I owned for different reasons. This combination is sonically superior and aesthetically unique when used in skeletal mode. I considered getting something vintage, but opted out after hearing story after story about turntables that arrived damaged in shipping. My own tech talked me out of it. Great video, thank you so much for the thoughtful research.
Thank you for your kind words. What an interesting journey you have had!
Glad to see the PL-12 make the list. About ten years ago I was looking for a good turntable and one day I found a PL-12 in the garbage near my home. All it needed was some TLC and now it's paired with a Pioneer SX-424 I bought for ten bucks in a thrift store, and both play absolutely great!
This is exactly what I love about our hobby. One doesn’t need to spend a fortune to enjoy music!
@@PearlAcoustics it´s true some say that i have an expensive system in my garage i ofered to buy to them(friends of mine) a 500€ system that they would spend more in a compact system and already bought three , the first was a turntable from technics fully automatic from 79 to 80 ,in grey with a good sounding but not powerfull amplifier also in grey and a tuner from the system in grey and with power meters on the slim integrated amplifier all 150€ , plus 120€ in a pair of sb-f3 also from technics and 150€ in a direct drive technics cassette deck restored (79 model)plus 90€ on a 91 restored high-end cd player from technics, 510€ ,it was a technics fan ,the first 3 components seemed to never been used ,those guys who only touch the stereo with gloves, other was a sansui from early 80´s 95€ ,a pair of mission speakers 761 at 4 ohms cost 70€ which sound fantastic and i have a pair ,only recentelly discovered they were built by Philips in Belgium ,i used to say to my friends that philips was one of the best sounding brands in the 70´s, a pioneer cd player 150€ and a minidisc deck denon for 100€, a PL-430 pioneer turntable for 70€ (83) 485€ .This are fully working systems bought in 2nd hand ,much better than a compact system from sony, we don´t have thrift stores in Portugal, we have some 2nd hand stores but normally it´s more expensive than buying new
I have a vintage Linn Lp-12 and sounds wonderful, love it.
Myself as well. ditto!!
The LP-12 was my standard for many years. You'll have to spend some real cash to better it!
Excellent talk, thank you, had a fold down Garrard turntable with attached speakers back in the 60's wore many records out on that player. My best buy was a 1976 Marantz series 6100, wish I hadn't sold it. Today I turn vinyl on a Fluance which sits on a wooden plinth.
thanks for your comment and kind remarks. Glad you enjoyed it
I had an AR XA turntable that I bought for about seventy dollars when I was about sixteen years old. I knew nothing about stereo systems, but I liked its minimalist looks. (It was perhaps TOO minimalist, because if you wanted to go from playing 33 RPMs to 45s, you had to lift the platter and then move the belt from one pulley to another).
Great guide to many of the iconic turntables of the last 60 years, Harley. My journey went from SP25 IV through Thorens TD160 / Hadcock Arm to Systemdek /SME III (the original Transcription model). The Thorens was great insofar as it was well engineered and with the Hadcock arm was consistently musical. The Systemdek was chosen for its quality engineering, suspension and SQ - it was never iconic (despite of or perhaps because of the love-it-or-loath-it Nextel finish), but I never felt tempted to change it in favour of the more hyped Linn LP12 - as much as I respect the latter. Happy days, when putting on a 12" slice of vinyl felt like an event! Looking forward to hearing more about the Rega in your listening room :)
Thank you, very kind. I love your term putting on an LP as an 'event'! That's so true. for me it still is, even though I use streaming and CD's too. Records are always special.
Excellent video. I am glad to see a couple of turntables I have owned. One of my biggest regret is selling my LP-12. However, I am back to vinyl with a VPI Scout. Looking forward to parts and 3. Well done!
I would keep my VPI over almost everything on this list.
Thanks! Pt2. is recorded and in editing. Pt3. is under construction and programmed for the New Year.
Thank you Harley! You presentation kept me glued to the screen here in the galley. I was pleased to see that your reveal was the flagship model from Rega. My regular LP spinner is the RP-6. The Exact 2 cart is a bit problematic, and I have gone through two of them and settled on an Ortofon Blue. Could not be happier 🙂, thanks again, I enjoy your no stress, relaxed style!
Thank you Gary - very kind!
I have an Technics SL-15 since 1984 and an SL-1210GR since this year. Wonderful
Nice job. My LP12 dates to 1984 but I've only owned it for 15 years. Looking forward to episodes 2 & 3.
Ditch the lp12 get a well tempered or funk firm!! Lp12 very over rated.
I have owned 9 over the years
Hi Joe, thanks for your kind words. Pt. 2 coming soon. Pt3 is in the planning for the New Year ... more videos to come for sure.
@@scottchegg1209 Why did it take 9 LP12s for you to realize how overrated they are?
Thanks. One of the best Hifi-Videos I ever saw.
Wow, thanks! that's a real honour
I have a Thorens TD 166 MK 2 I bought new back in the early 80's. Love it!
Nice video and nice turntables selection.
Despite I prefer digital sources, because I believe you can get better quality with less investment, I always keep a turntable in my system, and 3 years ago I got a Garrard SP25 MK IV that belongs to my father in law, I repeared it, build a new plinth and I am enjoying it.
Really excited about the following 2 videos in the serie.
Hi Vincente... I owned an SP25MKlV too ;-) You're right about sound quality per $. But a turntable has something special that's hard to quantify...
Thank you for this stroll down memory lane and your effort putting this video together. My list would be similar to yours although I might have added the Pink Triangle as it also caused a lot of fuss as the first possible competitor to the Linn Sondek. I spent hours and hours in the 70s auditioning equipment at Graham's HiFi in London. This was an important sales technique that they had at the time: give a potential customer lots of listening time with no pressure to buy and they will come back to you. I always wanted an LP12 but couldn't afford one. (I ended up with a Rega Planar 2 as that was as much as I could spend at the time.) However, the demos of the LP12 were not lost on me. Even when switching to cheaper amps and speakers, the Linn system often sounded better.
You’re very welcome. Glad you enjoyed it. Lovely story thanks
I did the same at Subjective Audio comparing the Pink Triangle and Linn Sondek. I think I spent from 10am to 4pm listening. In the end I felt they sounded as good as each other, just different. The sales guy said well if it helps, farting near a Linn can put it out of adjustment and if you play singles you just switch between them but a total faff on the Linn. I bought the PT and had it until two years ago due to a change of circumstance - I loved it, paired with QUAD amplification, ESL63s and an Alphason arm and an Audi Technical moving coil. Beautiful music for years.
Hi Hartley.
This is a very nice video.
Wonderfull to hear the history of turntables.
Gr André de vries.
Thank you. Very kind.
Wonderful list of turntables, happy owner of a Rega P3, so glad you chose the P10, just a wonderful machine!
Thanks!
I sometimes dream of owning a P10 so I’m looking forward to hearing your thoughts about it. My wonderful P25 is really a dressed up P3 and I love it. And I always appreciated how you could play a Rega out of the box - no tinkering required!
Pt. 2 on P10 coming soon...
I've bought two P25s over the years. I'm convinced it's that RB600 tonearm that's the real winner over the P3, etc. A great value for a great 'table.
Stumbled on by accident, and….. what a nostalgia trip. From my late teens the first “hi fi” I heard was my girlfriend uncle’s (301) which got me started. My very own starter was a TD-150, and then on. The LP12 (original) on the sideboard now in pristine condition but now ornamental (see below). Somewere along the way the LP12 was “borrowed” by my son, then Rega 3, Technics SL? (Parallel tracking) which I had till around 2009, when the LP12 was returned to me. Must be close on 1000 lps in our store room languishing, all classical save a few including Dark Side of the Moon. And then there was the rest of the varied other components from Quad 303, Stax headphones, Naim, ESL57, KEF “Daleks”(can’t remember the number), and even a pair of Leak mono valve amps refurbished by Leak themselves outside Leeds where we lived. Now……. A pair of Apple HomePods but all my listening is through Phonak P90 hearing aids 😥. The best? Naim, LP12 SME Ortofon MC, and magnificent stacked Quad ESL 57s 1975-1979. Look forward to your next instalment.
Thank you very much for your wonderful contribution to this story. Funny how this passion of ours starts. Pt. Comes out tomorrow (12 December).
Loved the episode. Very informative and enjoybale at the same time! Thanks.
Thank you.
Fantastic, insightful viewing Harley. Most enjoyable.
Thank you Mark.
I currently own three of them: Linn, Technics, and Rega. Thanks Harley.
Wow, what a collection… thanks for your kind words
I had an P3 for many years (got it in 88/89), then I got an TD160 which was not really that much better. Then I finally got an TD320mkII, which blew the P3 away, I still think that the TD320 is one of the best record players for the price (in good condition). Between all 3 players I used the same components; MC30ii, MCA10 and an GramAmp 1 ... it just worked. I then sold everything which had to do with vinyl.
Thanks for your comment and contribution to the conversation
I had an AR-XA for several years and it was excellent. The acoustic isolation was extremely good. I later purchased a Thorens TD-125 and added a Rabco SL-8E arm along with the Shure V15 type III pickup. Still have it and works beautifully.
:-)
Love your presentation, articulation, style
Thanks!!!
I'm glad you mentioned LENCO! I have 3. Great refurbished.
😀👍
Being in the US Air Force while in Germany from 1969-1974, I had the opportunity to encounter every piece of high-end audio equipment you can imagine. This was possible due the Audio clubs on various military installations across Europe. The American G.I. had money and idle time to afford the best. All the manufacturers were represented at these clubs.
I finally found the "Best Set-Up" at that time.....and this has evolved over the years......
1. Turntable: AR XA (Perfection.....I had too many issues with all other turntables to date).
2. Cartridge: Shure V-15 Type 2 (Ranked #1 at the time....a flawless sound).
3. Amplifier: McIntosh (tube version). I currently settled with a DUAL "mech-less" 4-40w channel automotive radio that runs on pure flat/clean 12vdc.
4. Speakers: AR3a (I later designed, built, tested and used my own huge enclosure (3-way) with 15-in speakers which I found far superior). I still use this in my garage where it moves a lot of air.
In the late 1990's, I designed/built my current use of four (4) satellite (2-way) surround speaker set-up with a separate dual voice coil 12-in woofer in a tuned-ported enclosure under the office desk. Sweet!
5. Headsets: Koss Pro 4A
6. Storage media: I've since transitioned from reel-to-reel to digital with no issues.
7. Musical collection: From Wagner to The Rippingtons, but no Country/Blue Grass.
Have fun!
Regards, "E.V." Norat II, USGovt DOT/FAA(Ret.)
I Miss the Audio Clubs!!!
And I worked for some of those manufactures and visited many of the PXs and Audio Clubs! Pioneer Electronics the latest one -- for about 10 years . All of that, of course, is long gone! 😪 I actually started out working at the Heidelberg Audio Club in Patton Brks which has been mostly demolished. As I recall the Wiesbaden AC and the Darmstadt AC may have been the earliest big Audio Clubs. I had to visit most of them from Bitburg to Munich to Berlin, even London and the Canadian PXs in Lahr and Baden-Baden! Pioneer's HQ was in Antwerp, Belgium which I also visited a few times. Ah, the good old days and the "Golden Years of HiFi!
What?, no jazz!???!!?
In my 45 years of being in the HiFi retail market, I agree with some of the turntables presented, however, although I know it is no longer available, in my opinion the Trio L07D is one of the best I've ever heard, back in the 80's there were many good turntables, arms, cartridges etc and we sold them all. At that time an LP12 was £248, the L07D was £1,400 and to be fair Direct Drive was not quite as good as other drives, but the L07D was different, it weighed 37 kilo and delivered all levels of music effortlessly.
I had one for 12 years, but now I use a modified Thorens 124mk 2 and I'm happy, enjoy your music chaps. (the rest is full Albarry amplification and Allison 3 speakers, Lyra Delos cartridge)
Really enjoyable and looking forward to more.
A few of my favorite developments in vinyl playback;
Once I heard really good copper center weights and periphery rings then platter matts from Larry Denham at TTW I couldn't go back. It really lowers the distortion in vinyl playback and takes care of warps. Then I bought his full table, the momentous supreme.
The next revelation was the Strain Gauge phono cartridge from Peter Lederman at Soundsmith. So low mass you can can play acetates 100 times with no loss, and sports car like precision tracing every corner of the groove to deliver master tape type sound.
The final development for me was discovering active vibration cancelling platforms. I got into them a long time ago, from labs closing, etc. Just like how they focus an electron microscope, it focuses the turntable's sound.
Thank you Johnny! Very interesting comment... thanks for sharing.
I knew that AR looked familiar. I had one in the mid to late 70s. I was living off campus with roommates. Someone they brought in liked it along with all my other gear. Never saw it again. I eventually replaced it with a B&O a few years later. It still works. Luckily, they left all my records. Some of those are irreplaceable.
Well done, thank you.
I am not an outsider looking in. I drank the Kool-Aid a long time ago. I own some very expensive equipment (Wilson and McIntosh). Having said that, I really have a problem with the pricing of the Rega P10. The Rega P10 is listed at between 7 and 11 thousand dollars. With extras, you can go even higher. Sorry, but I don't see it.
Thanks. much appreciated. I am not sure of the pricing in the US, but in EUR its 6800 including cartridge. The P8 is very similar and significantly cheaper.
Saved my money in the 80's. Bought at TD160 from a dealer in Wimbledon (intimidating!) had my SME 3009 bolted on using various cartridges from shure. Ortofon. Happy times, but my grail turntable........ One day at a bus stop in Clapham Junction and was curious looking at some fantastic looking equipment in a hifi shop. I entered, and spoke to a fantastic guy called Alan. I then listened to a Townshend Rock turntable (I can't remember the arm) with a Decca London cartridge. Incatech class A amp (50 - 60 watts approximately) via Sir Galahad speakers....... Never heard anything like this before. The following day the Incatech, and Rock turntable had pride of place in my front room later adding a Hadcock SS 220 and a Music maker 2 cartridge. Nothing looked or sounded like it. I think it deserves an honorable mention!
Absolutely! Your story painted a wonderfully deserving picture. Thanks for sharing. Max Townsend was a very special guy.
Around 8 years ago I’ve had the incredible luck of finding a used Mark 3 Oracle Delphi with an Alphason arm, for what it turned up to be a little over 1200 Canadian Dollar. With the upgraded power supply as well! This is essentially as close to perfection one can get under 10 grand, and pretty close to perfection regardless of price. Phenomenal sound and phenomenal looks. Perhaps your video should have a few honourable mention entries? The Oracle Delphi would definitely be worth mentioning. And others, like VPI or Kuzma or Sota, if I think about it.
Absolutely, so many terrible omissions!
I had an Oracle Delphi III, Well-tempered arm, Audioquest MC cartridge. I heavily modified the table to upgrade the PS, the bearing, the suspension towers, clamp.
Strengths - accuracy, neutrality, openness unmatched by any other turntable I've ever heard.
Weaknesses - PITA to get correctly set up, and maintain a proper setup; sound lacked a bit of punch, like that a Linn or Rega has. But I've never heard a Linn or Rega with the openness or neutrality of the Oracle.
@@countdebleauchamp I wonder if the slight lack of bite had something to do with a slight compliance mismatch between the arm and cartridge. Sometimes that’s the case but I’m not familiar with your combo.
Absolutely, and not even a cursory mention of the Townshend Rocks (in many guises), The Voyd, Pink Triangles, Roksans and Kuzma's plus Oracle, Basis, etc that were all very much born of the LP12's so-called 'supremacy' and all had virtues that at the very least, equalled, but very often bettered the LP12. I'm not denying that it's iconic, and worthy of its position, but if you were into music and audio from the 80's then you'll have at least given a cursory glance to the competition.
I could listen to you for hours. Congratulations, Harley. I'm impressed by your contribution - interesting and entertaining.🙃
Thank you. Very humbled
Your videos are just so interesting and educational. It was great to see a few turntables I have direct experience with, namely the TD-160, PL-12D and the P3 which I purchased in 1981. I got rid of it when the motor started running in reverse and Rega wanted £200 to replace it. What a mistake that was. I loved your reveal, was fully expecting a great big heavy beast of a turntable and it turned out to be the P10. That made laugh. I have never heard this particular turntable but of course its known to be a great piece of engineering. Looking forward to part 2 of this series. Thanks for the journey, most enjoyable.
Thank you. You are very kind. glad I made you laugh :-) Pt. 2 is coming out on the 12th. of December (I hope)!
Cool selection of tables. I used to be a Rega man myself. Had the P5 with an Ortofon Kontrapunkt A on it. Loved that sound. Now I'm using a Garrard 401 with the SME 3012 and an Ortofon Cadenza Blue. Absolutely beautiful combo.
Very cool end choice! 👍
Great video as always. Thank you.
The Technics 1200 is in fact still being produced.
The 1200G is very high on MY list of potential turntables and may very well be “the one”. Time will tell though.
Thanks again. Looking forward to parts two and three !!
Thank you. You’re very kind. I hope you get the turntable you want.
It is "the one"
Excellent, as usual. I spent significant time with the AR XA in college. It is extraordinary. Thank you again!
I had a PL12D in my college days
@@PearlAcoustics Fond memories, I'm sure!
@Nicholas that’s really interesting. I didn’t know that. It’s really logical, if you think about it. Thanks!
Great video, the only matter I have with Rega arms are their lack of height adjustment. I've owned a planar 2, two P3's, a P5, two LP12's, a Gyrodeck, a Garrard 401, a Project and now use a Technics 1210GR with an SME 309 tonearm, and I love it.
Thanks
I have a second issue with Rega arms which is the lack of a separate ground wire for the arm and instead being internally grounded to the RCA audio-cable shield which is a recipe for picking up hum and noise. I have rewired a couple of Rega arms, separating the audio from the arm ground and adding a fifth wire, but this is not for the faint heart and not something I can recommend to the fumble fingered! Having to use spacers to adjust the VTA is also a bit of a pain, And if the cartridge body is exceptionally tall sometimes you will still end up with negative VTA despite adding as many spacers is compossibly fitted onto the threaded arm-pillar.
Great video. Really looking forward to the next two videos.
Thank you! December 12 part 2
I've gone through many turntables over the past 50+ years. The only one that is still operational is my AR-XB. It is identical to the XA with an added cue lever. I've had to replace the head shell and of course the belt. It came with a plastic fulcrum and weights to adjust the tone arm tracking pressure. It's quiet and has stood the test of time.
Yep, I got one in 1968 when there was a lot of compititon from Garrad,thorens, etc. At the same time it got the Ar4 speakers too!
Don't have my XA anymore, but I've kept the fulcrum and weights all these years.