"As Found" Original Winchester 1866's
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- Опубліковано 27 сер 2020
- In this episode, we take a look at a pair of original "workhorse" yellow boys that have been on the ranch for generations. These 1866's have been stored away and unchanged since their last use and represent a time capsule into the past. We'll take a close look at these historic rifles to see just how an uncleaned brass frame Winchesters should look.
Thank you for keeping this history alive. My family settled in the 'Territory of the Dakotas' in mid-1800s. We still have a few of the old Winchesters in the family as well.
Thanks for watching. It's great that you have some of your family's Winchesters. Hopefully they are still in working order so you can shoot them. It's great fun.
That’s got to be the coolest pair of family heirlooms I’ve ever seen
Love your videos and love them old Winchesters.❤
All I can say is “capital WOW“!!!!!!!!! And crème de la crème to you I didn’t even know there was a channel like this and now I am subscribed. You have one my heart just like the West I look forward I’ve learning from your episodes. Thank you so much for taking me to school. Kudos to you.👍🌹👍🌹👍 all you do👍
Don't ever sell em or you will never find another, let alone two. Classic gun and big TY for sharing all that. If you get em shooting please record it! It can be done. There are a few custom makers for the old 44 Henry and 44-40 WCF both. Henry being harder to get of course. Light on loads if you do em but not too light you don't want a squib. And clean right after. It is one I would oil and then not shoot until you clean first vs cleaning and letting sit dry. Oil will preserve em best. Being so old I would shoot a few and then clean and put away and not do much shooting but I wouldn't hesitate shooting either. Have you checked headspace at all? I have a family member with a 1897 made 1894 with a lot of custom options I am helping research and appraise. I do gunsmith work at least in the past. Taking care of elderly family is about all I do now. Those old levers are such fun, been shooting them since I was five or six. Older I get more I love old things. Except my old Arthritis... Also can you do a video on the cleaning kit and mechanism? Even a short video if time allows?
Holy smokes! Thanks so much for sharing your family treasures! There’s really Nothing better than seeing some original Winchester 66s in great condition. Greatly Appreciate all your other videos as well. Keeping the history of old west alive and well!
You're very welcome. I enjoyed showing off those old rifles.
Looking forward to seeing the cartridge making and hearing the Ol' girls voices ring out across the countryside
Still working on it. Hope to have some cartridges by this spring. Thanks for watching
Saw this video on Facebook and had to see those beautiful guns and your beautiful ranch. Scrolled down to see you were leaving the ranch and it made me sad. What a beautiful slice of heaven👍
Thanks Larry! Not to worry. I'm only leaving temporarily while I attend gunsmithing school. I'll still try to keep a few episodes coming when I have the time.
Great family treasures Mark. Really enjoy the tutorials.
Thanks Jim!
Thanks for sharing those old beauties with us. I love lever guns. They are so true American.
You bet! Thanks for watching the channel, Doug!
I bought an old 1894 Marlin 38/40 in 1985 from a man from Indiana. The steel butylate was kinda loose, and would not be tightened up. I could tell there was dirt and such under its I removed it. After I cleaned it up, I could make out the original purchase date, and owners name marked with pencil. Date of purchase was Sept 3, or 8,,,,1897. Also could not make out the first name, but last name was clearly Bass. Good place to look for names and dates !
I love this! Literally your life is my dream! I'm young and I hope to have the knowledge you have and someday be like you!
Just love what you're doing Mark. Great tutorials of these fantastic old firearms. Thanks so much and look forward to seeing more of the ranch and those beautiful guns.
Thanks so much, Jason! We'll keep 'em coming.
Wow! Don’t know how I missed this episode.
Great to see them old 66’s and story behind them is fascinating.
Glad you like them! I hope to have one shooting soon. Keep an eye out for that episode.
Great to have history in your hands and thanks for sharing it with us.
You're very welcome Mark! I'm still planning to make some 44 rimfire ammo if I can just find the time to get back to that project.
Very nice video indeed! Of all the Winchester lever guns, the 1866 is the most beautiful. With its historic ties to the Henry, but having the King's patent side loading gate in the receiver, it is the ultimate brass frame rifle ever. Making the .44 rimfire is doable for sure. If Winchester and other companies made them one hundred and fifty some years ago, they surely can be made again.
Thanks Karl. Won't be long before I'll be posting an 1866 shooting episode. Keep an eye out.
Great video what a great two winchesters Thank Phil KY
Thanks a bunch Phil!
Great video, thanks for sharing..
You’re welcome, Ken!
Wow, just Wow! What iconic pieces of American firearms history. Thanks so much for this video.
Thanks Terry! And thanks for watching
Beautiful hardware! Honest wear! 👍🏾😀❤️🇺🇸
Thanks Jeffry!
Beautiful old American rifles, thank you for sharing these. Fairly new to your channel and being a gun enthusiast I appreciate your dedication to antique arms. I dabble in old coins a bit, mainly Morgan dollars, they were the currency of the west, the average person not trusting the greenback. I relate this to your explanation of the freckling on the receiver and the saddle wear to the old Morgan's. In old coins the more pristine coins tend to be the ones that get more dollar return, I personally like the ones with the most wear! Imagining how many, or even who might have carried it. The same seeing that old yellow boy with the saddle wear on the forearm. How much time and even who might have had that rifle on the saddle. Long explanation but I tend to ramble on. Love this, thank you.
A few years ago I found a spent 44 Henry rimfire case when I was out wandering around Cline Buttes in central Oregon
Great find! Wouldn't you love to know the story behind how it got there and what gun it was used in!
Great video Mark. Thanks for sharing. You are a wealth of knowledge on the guns of the Old West and I really enjoy your videos. Thanks! --Brad
Thanks for your videos I'm enjoying them a lot.
Thanks Alan. Glad to hear you like them!
Those are some beautiful old rifles
Another great video Mark. Family heirloom treasures. Thanks for sharing. I always look forward to your videos.
Thanks Mark!
Really enjoy your videos.
PLEASE DO tool up to make .44 rimfire cartridges and try shooting those wonderful ‘66 rifles!
I continue to work on that project when time permits. Should have some new info out soon.
Thank you. Love your videos
You're very welcome, Mike!
So cool
I got a 1866-1966 Centennial 30 30. nice rifles.
Very nice. Those are beautiful rifles!
Thank you for an excellent video on the 1866 Winchesters. My dad had an 1894 Winchester rifle in .25-35 that he carried for years across his saddle. There was wear on both sides of the forearm where it would have balanced on the saddle. Unlike what you show on the 1866, the wear was a flat spot on the sides, not so much on the bottom. I'd would offer a picture except I donated the guns to the Museum in the community were he ranched. I do firearms research for a local museum and it is very disappointing to see guns in the collection that have been "restored" with all the honest patina polished off. I did a video for the museum titled "Don't Clean Your Guns!" In one sad case, it was a museum employee in 1970s who scraped the patina off a Winchester carbine of historic provenance with a razor blade and steel wool.
Oh, that just makes a guy cringe. They're only original once and never again. Thanks for the compliments. Check out some of my other episodes. There's one called "Junkyard 1894" that stars a beat up 1894 in 25-35.
@@thecinnabar8442 Yeah, I want to time travel back and slap him. I will look at your other videos. I appreciate your approach and low key but concise and accurate presentation. My museum has a several 1874 Sharps Sporting Rifles that do have the balance point worn similar to your 1866. Those rifles weighing 15-20 pounds needed a horse to carry them.
Great content
Thanks Gregory!
They're just beautiful
Thanks, Don!
So what you're telling me is that I am not the only one who doesn't clean every gun every month whether I use it or not. That is good news for me 😁
I love your work my friend ,thanks for sharing , being fascinated with 44rf and regretfully passing on a few 66 win's and even a colt73 in 44rf years ago ,I made it a mission to look at possibilities , if you ever get your hands on a centre fire conversion of win 66 or colt 1860 you may find ammunition that was still available in South America until the 1980's , their piolice still used Nagant /Webley revolvers from the turn of the 1900's , the ammo listed as .44 Brazilian nagant revolver and .440 argentine nagant revolver both stamped on the base Eley 44 nagant and Eley 440 nagant ,if you do a search you'll find some pics and even schematic details on the inet ,cheers big ears
Thanks Bill! That's great info. I'll keep an eye out for some of that ammo and a centerfire '66. It'd sure be enjoyable to shoot one of those old Yellow Boys. Thanks for watching.
I got two 1894's great condition compared to those rifles, and they are untouched original. 30-30 made 1907. And a 25-35 made 1905. 26" octagon barrela😊
Mate , they are a couple of beautiful old lady's you've got there . And what a way to deliver the milk, gun in one hand milk in the other haha great stuff mate. I'm very interested in you making them cartridges for them . Hope you get some rain soon mate all the best . Great video mate
Thanks Dean!
You would think with the plethora of firearms around the country chambered in 44 Henry rimfire and the amount of SASS shooters wanting better Henry and 66 clones that atleast one of the myriad of rimfire manufacturers would spin up a production run of 44 Henry Rimfire.
Great video though.
You can quite easily make rim fire cartridge cases to take a .22 blank that is off centre, they work well, but obviously need to be chambered in the correct orientation. Chris B.
Yes, and a couple of companies sell these types of cartridges, but I've got my heart set on cycling and shooting a magazine load through one of these old girls. I'm actually working with a retired engineer to develop an efficient way to produce these cartridges. We have some prototype stuff in the works right now. Keep an eye out for more info on this project soon.
@@thecinnabar8442 Good luck with this project, I feel the blank pre rimmed case will have to be formed from a pellet of ductile material to allow the head/rim to be upset without problems, it can be very thin as the pressures are not high, so annealed copper would probably be OK. Chris B.
😀😮😮😲 Those Rifles are Incredible
Thanks Chris!
Very good video, thank-you! There are so many fine old guns that are shootable but for the lack of ammo. I have a .32 Stevens rimfire rifle for which I have a few rounds, haven't fired them though. The bore is very good, it should shoot fine. I did pick up 42 rounds of .41 short rimfire ammo, I have nothing to shoot it in though. Who knows what will turn up later.
I really enjoy your videos, please keep them coming.
Thanks! It really is a shame that nobody is reproducing these obsolete rimfire cartridges. I guess there just isn't a big enough market to make it interesting to the ammo manufacturers. They seem to be having enough trouble keeping up with demand for common calibers these days.
@@thecinnabar8442 You're right about that. Try finding 9mm or 5.56 ammo these days. I live in a relatively rural area of NH so things are calm here, I'd hate to be living in a more densely populated area these days.
I wonder if the frames of the modern-made replicas will age the same as the originals? The originals are actually bronze (copper and tin), not brass (copper and zinc). Maybe the "flakey", crystalline appearance is due to the tin in the alloy?
You’re right that it’s a bronze alloy that the gunmakers referred to as “gunmetal”. I forgot to mention that in the video and some of my Winchester buddies reminded me about it immediately. I really doubt that the modern alloy will age the same way or could be artificially aged to look like the originals. Thanks for watching and commenting.
The flakes are actually the “grain structure” of the alloy. Years of contact and rubbing smoothed the metal then skin acids etched the metal so that you see the visible grain structure. You can see and learn about it in books on metallurgy.
My dads got a 86 with saddle wear. Gun came from Colorado. I told him when he’s ready to sell it I want it just because of the saddle wear.
Sounds like an interesting rifle. I love guns with some history.
Picked up a colt lightning musket at a show in Minnesota, have you ever come across one? It’s in decent condition too.
@@BillyBob-yu3ri I've seen a couple of them at shows over the years and really like them. They're quite scarce. If I remember right, I read somewhere that Colt only made about 300 of them. The one's I've seen were pretty used up. You've got a really special gun!
You know your family has had the ranch a long time when
Many native acquaintance of my family worked or did time there those rifles are scraped from asbestos singling on the rifle boots on towers
That's the most beautiful country I've ever seen. Where are you located??
Thanks John. We love it here in remote Southeastern Oregon.
Did a 66 rim fire come in? Let me know. I got the rounds, 10-12 to take down. Hopefully it will work with amunotion and shoot them after reloading to get an idea how they stack up againgt
i love those winchester rifles 1866 in 44 rim tums upp
Thanks Jan!
Could you re-form 44 Russian and use a heeled bullet? Maybe with a replacement center fire bolt.
Good thinking Stan. The 44 Russian and 44 Henry are very similar and I'm sure it would work. I've just really got my heart set on making some rimfire ammo to original specs. Now, if I can just find the time to get the tooling made. 🙂
Have you trie homestead gun parts? They are located in Tucson Az
Thanks for the tip. I use them fairly regularly. Unfortunately, their reproduction parts are mostly pretty low quality.
I heard that there were a small number of ‘66s converted to center fire. Do you know anything about that?
At the very end of production, Winchester produced center fire versions of the 1866 using a center fire Henry cartridge. With that cartridge available, many of the earlier 1866’s were converted to center fire. I presently have one original center fire version and one converted version of the 1866 in the shop for repairs.
I got A 1873 n a hard time finding shells
Unfortunately, that's a pretty common problem these days. I'm hoping ammo availability improves soon.
👍
sir i like a winchester 1866 is beautiful rifle the brass receiver its not clean
That was my 3 digit phone #...i'll take my rifle now, thanks...ha ha
:) Bryant, you must be even older than me! Thanks for watching
@@thecinnabar8442 thanks for sharing everything
Have them made into center fire wall hanger's do nothing but collect dust!!!
I actually have an 1866 in the shop that's been converted to centerfire. I'm converting back to rimfire for the customer and making rimfire ammo for it. Keep an eye out for those episodes in the future.
Holy smokes first time I've seen anyone talk about making rim fire ammo. You have to do a hour at least. Turning a cup is pretty straight forward but the rim is a mystery. Hydraulic pressure forcing the rim in a die???? I've seen rim fire brass off homesteads with a number of hits from reloading, can you speak to that?
Thanks, I'm on my tippy toes.
I'm way behind on getting to the 44 Henry ammo project, but am looking forward to it. You're right that turning the cup will be easy. Getting the rim right will be a challenge and I have a couple of processes in mind to try. Going to be a lot of trial and error. The early rimfire ammo wasn't very reliable and there were a lot of misfires. If they didn't fire, the shooter would often turn them and try to fire. I once attended a presentation from a researcher who showed many Henry cartridges found on the Custer Battlefield with multiple primer strikes. Thanks for watching!
@@thecinnabar8442 Do you have any reference material or leads on the early manfactoring processes used? It's become an obsession and so far I've come up dry. I no longer have a machine shop at my disposal or I'd have made a die and tried the hydraulic method by now.
Loving reloading I see the rim fire as the ultimate challenge.
Please share anything, however small.
@@49walker44 If you research manufacturing .22 rimfire ammo it will be the same process, but with a larger case. Chris B.
@@453421abcdefg12345 if you know of any video that shows the detail I'm interested to see it. I've watched all I could find on line or elsewhere and the rim forming details are never shown but from what I've seen leads me towards the hydraulic method.
@@49walker44 As with most youtube "this is how it is done " videos they do not show the setting up of the rim/head, the early cases were copper, and there was probably a reason for that, but I think a collet type tool which holds the blank near it's closed end, then collapsing down until it is almost without a gap, (for the fulmanate), the problem with rimfire is that they can only be used once, unless they can be re primed, so the manufacture needs to be simple, they also have a headstamp, so the setting down to upset the head was probably achieved in this way, the blank case would have to be formed by extrusion as a turned case would not be ductile enough. Good luck! Chris B.
Beautiful guns I've been thinking about getting one of the reproduction I like to shoot all my guns