You're on Hwy 60 going towards Suches! :) Sure do miss that road; I've ridden it hundreds and hundreds of times on my motorcycle. Thanks for doing the video! We're looking at doing some similar upgrades to a Sprinter chassis RV that we stepping down to from a Thor Outlaw Class A toyhauler.
Excellent video! 👍 I'm about to do the same upgrades to my 2023 Thor Quantum 31ft on a Ford E450 chassis. Going to have Ford trucks do the whole thing at once and then give it an alignment at the end. I hope I'm as happy with the new suspension upgrades as you are.....will let you know! 🙂
On a different note, I notice the driver seat, is that the factory one or did you upgrade it? The one that comes with mine, after a few hundred miles you can feel very uncomfortable. Wondering if upgraded where did you get it from? Thank you in advance.
Hi Alex, I felt the same way and set out trying to find a better captain’s chair for the E450 cutaway chassis. A friend of mine had purchased a Coach House on the E450 with those chairs and when I saw them, I had to have them. After contacting Coach House, I was told those were custom made for them. Long story short, the person at Coach House didn’t want to share his sources and it was a challenge to get him to send me a set. My biggest concern was how the chair would mount to the seat base. It was not an easy task and I was fortunate to have a friend who does metal fabrication. In the end, I do like them but I wouldn’t go through the hassle again. For those wanting to upgrade, I would suggest having them upgraded by a custom auto upholstery shop to your specifications. I would also add the power adjustable base to the passenger side to. Good luck and let me know which way you went.
What size tires do you run.? When I first received my 26 ft. Class C Fleetwood tiogo it had 225 etc I needed tires on a trip and next thing ya know I have 235.75 16 I Believe. I do think I liked the wider tires. Because of less chance of a rock getting stuck between them. Yes I was a newbie. But those old 225 dually where tore up . I'm looking at 5yrs on these tires . So time for new I'm ft but only travel 300 miles a month maybe. I'm going to have all the removed and check them out and check suspension all the goods.
Hi Kathy, thanks for your reply. My E450 chassis came stock with the 225 75R 16’s. Not being a tire expert, I would think more tread on the pavement is better! Up to a point though. It can affect gas mileage, front tire clearance when turning and contact area between the dually’s. Did you have to add a spacer plate etc? I will run this by my large truck tire expert when it’s time to replace. Thanks again!
After doing some research, my recommendation is to go with the chassis manufacturers tire size which can be found on the drivers door jamb. After all, they are the experts.
I ended up with the 225, and some new shocks ( that they said are RV Shocks) smooth ride But now that is all done I've noticed that while passing truckers. I'm being sucked in!? With the wider tires I never felt that . They told my sway bars and bushings were all good. And that I may need to get an tire alignment for my back tires duallys?? This is thing?
Hi Kathy, I personally have never heard of a rear alignment. This article might help you from Forest River Group: FORD E350/E450 alignment, Wandering, Caster, Play in steering wheel The issues this author is describing never happened on my RV even before any upgrades. I have always taken my motor homes to a large truck repair center and had them do the alignment.
Hello sir. Thank you for information about the upgraded to your rv. I try to search for the front sway bar but did not have any luck of whom would sell it. Can you please let me know where did you buy the hellwig front sway bar from. Thank you in advance.
Really no reason other than it seemed more people purchased the Roadmaster. Either one would be a huge improvement from the stock one! Thanks for your question.
I'd opt for a brand name who's main focus is in suspension, most RV suppliers carry bandaid or booster parts . The source of most suspension issues is the suspension. always start at the foundation of your issues. Booster coils, bags, snobbery are all bandaid and do not address the real issues with factory Motorhome suspension Bilstein,Fox,Rancho carry suspension products for Motorhomes
Hello, I was curious how well the front sway bar helped when being passed on the highway by big rigs…? You mentioned testing this out in the video, but never came back with any answers…? My ‘06 E450 C 31 footer that only has air bags on the rear, darts off the road as soon as a big rig blows by you on the highway. Rear bags ( towing purpose mainly ) are my only upgrade so far, but curious if the Hellwig front sway would be worth the money or not…? Without getting knee deep in $$$$ upgrades to the suspension system.
Hi Kirk, Short answer, the upgraded front sway bar will improve your ride. There are many other issues related to wind and passing 18 wheelers pushing you off the road. I’m sure you have correct air pressure in tires and air bags and a balanced load. Are you towing? All I can recommend is to do the upgrades in the order I did and even add a rear sway bar if not happy. I have no issues with passing trucks. Crosswinds can always be a challenge. Good luck! Let me know what worked.
Could you give us some idea where you purchased some of the items (I know the clip is over 1 year old, But....) I can't find the items anywhere near the price you paid. Thanks
@@SafeTravelRV yes, unfortunately it seams most things were almost double the price. Enjoy your video very much, I’m a subscribed watcher now Plan to upgrade my Class C soon.
Hi Tammy, I don’t tow but carry about 150lbs of bikes on the back. I keep pressure between 75-80 psi and from what I have read, that’s what many other set their pressure to also.
Thanks for your question. First off , I was trying to stay under $1000 while also getting the most bang for the buck. My Class C is only 28’ long. I get minimal rear sway when big trucks pass or going in and out of gas stations for example. Class C’s over 30’ should see an improvement with a rear sway bar if they are experiencing a lot of rocking motion. And don’t forget, mine came with the Ride Rite rear air bags inflated to 80psi. From day one, they kept the rear end stable.
I have to agree with Lizette. I think you would indeed notice a huge improvement by adding the beefiest rear sway bar you can fit. The airbags don’t handle sway like a bar does.
@@Propelled I've installed airbags on a couple of pickups myself in the past along with being around other airbags installed on pickups and while the idea seemed good in theory and yes in some situations it was nice to have the option of inflating them for a temporary higher load, in actual practice they are far from ideal. The problem is these styles of airbags they sell for this use are nothing like a properly sized integrated airbag system on a highway tractor or motorhome. These smallish diameter bags with any amount of air in them do not allow for proper suspension travel and the bag is taking away from the spring to do its job and typically not helping the side lean or handling like the claims that are made. So having leaf springs capable of carrying the load is one aspect along with shocks that are capable of controlling the axle movements. As to side sway stability and why I am agreeing with your comment Propelled, without a doubt the largest sway bars one can buy and installed front and rear is what makes a huge difference. Pickup campers that are of the largest heaviest tallest type for example and putting a one ton dual wheeled pickup to its maximum weight capacity is a very good example. Increasing the spring pack if required as well as using those "stable loads" type wedges helps quite a bit as it puts that overload spring into action to help reduced side sway. Then replacing the factory sway bars both front and rear with the largest diameter ones that can be bought to mount up, they make a huge difference. These chassis that are bought by the motorhome manufacturers almost always seem to be pushed to their limits with spring rate and undersized swaybars, a top heavy unit that is too heavy for the chassis they use ... its all about the bottom line to the companies sadly, not about having created a well handling strong unit.
Well said Charles. I agree. That road master stabilizer mount really concerns me, I did not see any triangulation too support the load, and I'm a little lost on the reason for the spring ? I'd like to know more about that. A bilstein damper would be my choice . And yes I would have started with a rear sway bar before upgrading the front. For strictly road use a dual swaybar setup is very confidence inspiring. Keep your airbags inflated only to support extra load not for lifting beyond the natural spring height.
@@ronedelenbos272 I know what you mean by the lack of triangulation on that frame mounted steering shock mount, flat bar even if its fairly thick but has some length to it can flex although I can't claim this setup will flex, it was a question in my mind as well when I saw that assembly. I've never had anything to do with those spring style steering shocks but the theory behind them ( when adjusted correctly ) is to help hold the steering tires straight and also would assist in "return to center" of the steering wheel when coming out of a turn. I have to ask myself why is a contraption like that even required, is it helping to overcome incorrect steering geometry, after all highway tractors ( semi's if one prefers that name ) certainly do not need gizmos like that to steer properly. I believe in one of the shots you can see the motorhome does have a rear swaybar ( it would be insane not to have one from the factory ) and what is interesting is that some aftermarket swaybar installations on certain motorhomes leave the rear factory swaybar in place and add on a beefy unit on the opposite side of the axle housing. That right there tells a person just how much swaybar can be added to some units to make them what they should have been when rolled out of the factory to begin with. Always about that all mighty dollar to sell the glitz and under engineer the mechanics of a unit.
Can you give the decision making factor for choosing hellwig over roadmaster anti sway bar? Hellwig ses to be a bit more pricey and from my research is a very similar if not the same product quality. Just curious about your thoughts.
Thanks for taking the time to comment. I chose Hellwig based on what I perceived to be the more popular swaybar and the fact that Forest River installed them as a suspension upgrade on some models of their motor homes.
Hellwig is a well know Sway bar supplier. When looking for suspension upgrades or improvements the marketplace is full of gimmicky cheaply priced bandaid solutions to mask the real issue. Search for the real suppliers of upgraded or performance parts. These do cost more money but the result is usually worth every extra penny. RV companies don't know suspension they know a quick fix with a bandaid solution is a easier sell.
@@ronedelenbos272 I can honestly say I have not read anything bad about the Hellwig company. They have been in business since 1946 and and have developed many suspension improvements for trucks and cars over their history. Price point is definitely a factor when considering suspension upgrades. Suspension upgrades are just one part of the puzzle. Weight, load balance, tires, condition of other components and driving habits all play a part.
If you are having issues with your suspension on a 3500, being as it’s a 2007, I would have the shocks replaced first, check all other suspension components for wear and or damage and proceed from there. Good luck and report back!
ua-cam.com/video/Y8CbNioawt0/v-deo.html notice the stronger steering damper mount . Also the rear bolt he's replacing is something to watch. These HD hellwig swaybars are very stiff and can twist and pull on twisty roads. The hellwig mounts are actually kind of light duty
Hi Ron, thanks for bringing that to my attention. I’ll keep an eye on my setup. That’s one reason I stressed getting all of the threadlock off the old bolts and making sure you didn’t cross thread which would certainly cause pullout. It would have been nice to upgrade that bolt just for good measure. If Hellwig sees this as a common issue, I’ll upgrade for sure! Safe Travel!
@@SafeTravelRV absolutely keep an eye on the mounts, you did do a very good job of being proactive on the sway bar mount install, better safe than sorry. And while that new mount looks a little anemic Id keep an eye on the mount bolt thru the frame. A good fab shop could beef that up. You have to keep in mind how much leverage is being applied on that hanger mount under load . A good lean on yor RV while enjoying a sprited drive means the swaybar is trying to fight all that overhead weight, the taller the vehicle the more that bar is screaming to resist the twist. Hellwig should have a lighter rear bar that is slightly heavier than your original rear bar. It would help take some load off the front bar. But a better route may be to find a good old school spring shop and have them build you an additional load leaf setup or just opt for springs made specifically for your RV weight. In a Motorhome ,the suspension is generally undersized and overloaded and the result is a watered feel while driving during wind and passing trucks, it's worse when your fully loaded with family. No bandaids really correct the main suspension issues.
![CLASS A MOTORHOME SUSPENSION UPGRADES [NOT SO CHEAP HANDLING FIX]](/img/n.gif)
You're on Hwy 60 going towards Suches! :) Sure do miss that road; I've ridden it hundreds and hundreds of times on my motorcycle. Thanks for doing the video! We're looking at doing some similar upgrades to a Sprinter chassis RV that we stepping down to from a Thor Outlaw Class A toyhauler.
Excellent video! 👍 I'm about to do the same upgrades to my 2023 Thor Quantum 31ft on a Ford E450 chassis. Going to have Ford trucks do the whole thing at once and then give it an alignment at the end. I hope I'm as happy with the new suspension upgrades as you are.....will let you know! 🙂
10:30 I never got the new stabilizer bar, I just got the upgraded polyurethane bushings. The rubber ones were dry and shredded.
would love to see the road test with Big rigs passing by the RV and how the upgrades helped
I’ll see what I can do!
Thanks for Sharing!
On a different note, I notice the driver seat, is that the factory one or did you upgrade it? The one that comes with mine, after a few hundred miles you can feel very uncomfortable. Wondering if upgraded where did you get it from? Thank you in advance.
Hi Alex, I felt the same way and set out trying to find a better captain’s chair for the E450 cutaway chassis.
A friend of mine had purchased a Coach House on the E450 with those chairs and when I saw them, I had to have them.
After contacting Coach House, I was told those were custom made for them. Long story short, the person at Coach House didn’t want to share his sources and it was a challenge to get him to send me a set. My biggest concern was how the chair would mount to the seat base. It was not an easy task and I was fortunate to have a friend who does metal fabrication.
In the end, I do like them but I wouldn’t go through the hassle again.
For those wanting to upgrade, I would suggest having them upgraded by a custom auto upholstery shop to your specifications. I would also add the power adjustable base to the passenger side to. Good luck and let me know which way you went.
What size tires do you run.?
When I first received my 26 ft. Class C Fleetwood tiogo it had 225 etc I needed tires on a trip and next thing ya know I have 235.75 16
I Believe. I do think I liked the wider tires. Because of less chance of a rock getting stuck between them. Yes I was a newbie. But those old 225 dually where tore up . I'm looking at 5yrs on these tires . So time for new I'm ft but only travel 300 miles a month maybe. I'm going to have all the removed and check them out and check suspension all the goods.
Hi Kathy, thanks for your reply. My E450 chassis came stock with the 225 75R 16’s.
Not being a tire expert, I would think more tread on the pavement is better! Up to a point though. It can affect gas mileage, front tire clearance when turning and contact area between the dually’s. Did you have to add a spacer plate etc?
I will run this by my large truck tire expert when it’s time to replace.
Thanks again!
After doing some research, my recommendation is to go with the chassis manufacturers tire size which can be found on the drivers door jamb.
After all, they are the experts.
I ended up with the 225, and some new shocks ( that they said are RV Shocks) smooth ride But now that is all done I've noticed that while passing truckers. I'm being sucked in!? With the wider tires I never felt that . They told my sway bars and bushings were all good. And that I may need to get an tire alignment for my back tires duallys?? This is thing?
Hi Kathy, I personally have never heard of a rear alignment.
This article might help you from Forest River Group:
FORD E350/E450 alignment, Wandering, Caster, Play in steering wheel
The issues this author is describing never happened on my RV even before any upgrades.
I have always taken my motor homes to a large truck repair center and had them do the alignment.
Hello sir. Thank you for information about the upgraded to your rv. I try to search for the front sway bar but did not have any luck of whom would sell it. Can you please let me know where did you buy the hellwig front sway bar from. Thank you in advance.
Sorry for the delay, I had comment notifications off. Try etrailer.com, TruckSpring.com, CarParts.com
Dang...the Hellwig is about $500.
Roadmaster reflex steering stabilizer vs safe-t-plus, any comments? I have been researching for a while now...thanks for the video and opinions
Really no reason other than it seemed more people purchased the Roadmaster.
Either one would be a huge improvement from the stock one!
Thanks for your question.
I'd opt for a brand name who's main focus is in suspension, most RV suppliers carry bandaid or booster parts . The source of most suspension issues is the suspension. always start at the foundation of your issues.
Booster coils, bags, snobbery are all bandaid and do not address the real issues with factory Motorhome suspension Bilstein,Fox,Rancho carry suspension products for Motorhomes
Hello, I was curious how well the front sway bar helped when being passed on the highway by big rigs…? You mentioned testing this out in the video, but never came back with any answers…?
My ‘06 E450 C 31 footer that only has air bags on the rear, darts off the road as soon as a big rig blows by you on the highway. Rear bags ( towing purpose mainly ) are my only upgrade so far, but curious if the Hellwig front sway would be worth the money or not…?
Without getting knee deep in $$$$ upgrades to the suspension system.
Hi Kirk,
Short answer, the upgraded front sway bar will improve your ride. There are many other issues related to wind and passing 18 wheelers pushing you off the road.
I’m sure you have correct air pressure in tires and air bags and a balanced load. Are you towing?
All I can recommend is to do the upgrades in the order I did and even add a rear sway bar if not happy.
I have no issues with passing trucks. Crosswinds can always be a challenge.
Good luck! Let me know what worked.
If you have no rear sway bar, absolutely install one. I just put one on my 89 e350 Lazy Daze.
Could you give us some idea where you purchased some of the items (I know the clip is over 1 year old, But....) I can't find the items anywhere near the price you paid. Thanks
Unfortunately everything has gone up 35% or more since that airing. Do what I did, Google, Google!
@@SafeTravelRV yes, unfortunately it seams most things were almost double the price. Enjoy your video very much, I’m a subscribed watcher now
Plan to upgrade my Class C soon.
How much air do you have in the air bags when traveling and pulling a toad?
Hi Tammy, I don’t tow but carry about 150lbs of bikes on the back. I keep pressure between 75-80 psi and from what I have read, that’s what many other set their pressure to also.
Is there a hellwig part number for the e450?
Do you think it’s worth putting a hellwig sway bar on the rear?
If you are having issues back there then go for it. my class c is 28’ and the factory one is working fine.
Why didn’t you install a sway bar on the back of your vehicle?
Thanks for your question. First off , I was trying to stay under $1000 while also getting the most bang for the buck. My Class C is only 28’ long. I get minimal rear sway when big trucks pass or going in and out of gas stations for example.
Class C’s over 30’ should see an improvement with a rear sway bar if they are experiencing a lot of rocking motion.
And don’t forget, mine came with the Ride Rite rear air bags inflated to 80psi. From day one, they kept the rear end stable.
I have to agree with Lizette. I think you would indeed notice a huge improvement by adding the beefiest rear sway bar you can fit. The airbags don’t handle sway like a bar does.
@@Propelled I've installed airbags on a couple of pickups myself in the past along with being around other airbags installed on pickups and while the idea seemed good in theory and yes in some situations it was nice to have the option of inflating them for a temporary higher load, in actual practice they are far from ideal. The problem is these styles of airbags they sell for this use are nothing like a properly sized integrated airbag system on a highway tractor or motorhome. These smallish diameter bags with any amount of air in them do not allow for proper suspension travel and the bag is taking away from the spring to do its job and typically not helping the side lean or handling like the claims that are made. So having leaf springs capable of carrying the load is one aspect along with shocks that are capable of controlling the axle movements. As to side sway stability and why I am agreeing with your comment Propelled, without a doubt the largest sway bars one can buy and installed front and rear is what makes a huge difference. Pickup campers that are of the largest heaviest tallest type for example and putting a one ton dual wheeled pickup to its maximum weight capacity is a very good example. Increasing the spring pack if required as well as using those "stable loads" type wedges helps quite a bit as it puts that overload spring into action to help reduced side sway. Then replacing the factory sway bars both front and rear with the largest diameter ones that can be bought to mount up, they make a huge difference. These chassis that are bought by the motorhome manufacturers almost always seem to be pushed to their limits with spring rate and undersized swaybars, a top heavy unit that is too heavy for the chassis they use ... its all about the bottom line to the companies sadly, not about having created a well handling strong unit.
Well said Charles. I agree. That road master stabilizer mount really concerns me, I did not see any triangulation too support the load, and I'm a little lost on the reason for the spring ? I'd like to know more about that.
A bilstein damper would be my choice .
And yes I would have started with a rear sway bar before upgrading the front. For strictly road use a dual swaybar setup is very confidence inspiring.
Keep your airbags inflated only to support extra load not for lifting beyond the natural spring height.
@@ronedelenbos272 I know what you mean by the lack of triangulation on that frame mounted steering shock mount, flat bar even if its fairly thick but has some length to it can flex although I can't claim this setup will flex, it was a question in my mind as well when I saw that assembly. I've never had anything to do with those spring style steering shocks but the theory behind them ( when adjusted correctly ) is to help hold the steering tires straight and also would assist in "return to center" of the steering wheel when coming out of a turn. I have to ask myself why is a contraption like that even required, is it helping to overcome incorrect steering geometry, after all highway tractors ( semi's if one prefers that name ) certainly do not need gizmos like that to steer properly. I believe in one of the shots you can see the motorhome does have a rear swaybar ( it would be insane not to have one from the factory ) and what is interesting is that some aftermarket swaybar installations on certain motorhomes leave the rear factory swaybar in place and add on a beefy unit on the opposite side of the axle housing. That right there tells a person just how much swaybar can be added to some units to make them what they should have been when rolled out of the factory to begin with. Always about that all mighty dollar to sell the glitz and under engineer the mechanics of a unit.
Can you give the decision making factor for choosing hellwig over roadmaster anti sway bar? Hellwig ses to be a bit more pricey and from my research is a very similar if not the same product quality. Just curious about your thoughts.
Thanks for taking the time to comment. I chose Hellwig based on what I perceived to be the more popular swaybar and the fact that Forest River installed them as a suspension upgrade on some models of their motor homes.
Hellwig is a well know Sway bar supplier. When looking for suspension upgrades or improvements the marketplace is full of gimmicky cheaply priced bandaid solutions to mask the real issue.
Search for the real suppliers of upgraded or performance parts. These do cost more money but the result is usually worth every extra penny. RV companies don't know suspension they know a quick fix with a bandaid solution is a easier sell.
@@ronedelenbos272
I can honestly say I have not read anything bad about the Hellwig company. They have been in business since 1946 and and have developed many suspension improvements for trucks and cars over their history.
Price point is definitely a factor when considering suspension upgrades.
Suspension upgrades are just one part of the puzzle.
Weight, load balance, tires, condition of other components and driving habits all play a part.
Can this set up be used and put on a 2007 dodge ram 3500 dually?
If you are having issues with your suspension on a 3500, being as it’s a 2007, I would have the shocks replaced first, check all other suspension components for wear and or damage and proceed from there.
Good luck and report back!
ua-cam.com/video/Y8CbNioawt0/v-deo.html
notice the stronger steering damper mount . Also the rear bolt he's replacing is something to watch. These HD hellwig swaybars are very stiff and can twist and pull on twisty roads. The hellwig mounts are actually kind of light duty
Hi Ron,
thanks for bringing that to my attention. I’ll keep an eye on my setup.
That’s one reason I stressed getting all of the threadlock off the old bolts and making sure you didn’t cross thread which would certainly cause pullout.
It would have been nice to upgrade that bolt just for good measure.
If Hellwig sees this as a common issue, I’ll upgrade for sure!
Safe Travel!
@@SafeTravelRV absolutely keep an eye on the mounts, you did do a very good job of being proactive on the sway bar mount install, better safe than sorry. And while that new mount looks a little anemic Id keep an eye on the mount bolt thru the frame. A good fab shop could beef that up.
You have to keep in mind how much leverage is being applied on that hanger mount under load . A good lean on yor RV while enjoying a sprited drive means the swaybar is trying to fight all that overhead weight, the taller the vehicle the more that bar is screaming to resist the twist. Hellwig should have a lighter rear bar that is slightly heavier than your original rear bar. It would help take some load off the front bar.
But a better route may be to find a good old school spring shop and have them build you an additional load leaf setup or just opt for springs made specifically for your RV weight.
In a Motorhome ,the suspension is generally undersized and overloaded and the result is a watered feel while driving during wind and passing trucks, it's worse when your fully loaded with family.
No bandaids really correct the main suspension issues.
wasting your time just put the well tech design lift kit on it