Exactly and part of the difficulty of high rotation jumps is the rotation speed you need in the air. If you prolong your airtime then your average rotation speed goes down and it doesn’t simulate very well what it’d actually be like to do the jump, but I don’t like using harnesses so correct me if I’m wrong.
Harness doesn't really lift you up. It's more there to prevent drifting mid air and losing rotation speed. It's easier because the jump course is more stable but not because the skater gets to jump higher
Agreed, my friend did a quad in the harness because she's so light and her coach lifted her up too high, but in reality she can barely even land a single axel.
People probably said that about quads when they were first being attempted. Now we see quads being attempted all the time. It’s all about practice and people doing what they have to do to stay safe.
@@marley7130 easy for you to say cuz ur not doing the work, quads are already dangerous, its not about practice or staying safe, these are minors! Minors and teens whos bones still developing force to jump quads and quints. Do you even care about their ankles, bones, back and spines??? Current skaters cant even get away jumping quads without getting injured!! What more quints??
@@marley7130 Why do you think all the russian skaters are getting surgery right now ? Even the ones who don’t jumps quads. That’s because jumps are so hard on their bodies, even triples
If the ISU really cares about jumping techniques lol they wouldn’t be doing these jumps. But it’s impressive whatever they do within this system is up to them
I wouldn't be surprised if they were banned because of the risk of injury, like backflips were. Just because you CAN do something doesn't mean you SHOULD.
Boy 5T: The first 3/4 rev is eaten with the toe pick, the other 1/4 is eaten at then end. Its a 4T Blue Girl 5T: She eats 1/2 rev at the start. Girl 5S: She eats 1/4 of air time at the take-off Girl 5Lo: Correct Take-off, she lacks 1/4 at the end All of this with a harness, so dont expect any quints soon
Don't quote me on it since I'm not quite that advanced but I thought in salchows you're allowed up to 180 degree prerotation? Isn't that just how the jump works?
0:09: almost 1 full pre-rotation before take-off, 0:25: 3/4 pre-rotation and full blade on ice before take-off, 0:42: 3/4 pre-rotation, 0:59: 3/4 pre-rotation. Nothing fascination. One would wish for these skaters to first master technique before doing quads, not even to menation quintuple jumps.
welp unfortunately isu still doesn't punish for prerotation:(, all girls from tutberidze camp have a terrible technique which relies on this and using full blade
Lol. Pre-rotations and full blades are not discussed by any ISU body, and is a made up fiction by bitter fans who yearn for classic "western" technique.
Yes they are, but maybe just read the title before commenting something like that… it says “attempts”! They’re still practicing and all of them are really good especially for the age (guess they’re still under 17)
It's crazy when you think how the Russians revolutionized the figure skating in last 5 years and still continue to do it! The rest of the world just has to trail behind. Respect to those juniors, I really hope they will soon show us the quintuple jumps at the tournaments.
I see so much controversy surrounding that. On the one hand, there are these unreal technical feats. On the other hand people say a lot of it comes from cheated technique-- using the wrong edge, full blade on toe jumps, and a lot of prerotation. It goes back and forth, and I just don't know what to believe. But it worries me that younger and younger skaters are washing out because of injury.
@@sottosopravoce Unfortunately it is an incorrect technique most of the time. A large majority off the girls pulling of quads are under Eteri Tutberidze. If you really look into these girl you will realize most of them have full blade takeoffs in toe jumps. Excessive pre rotation that results in serious back injury’s and it also means they aren’t really doing quads sometimes. None of Eteri’s students have made it to 17 with a career still intact while under her. What they are doing is ambitious. However it’s not done well and highly injury inducing. That’s not even the half of it when It comes to Eteri though. I recommend looking into it.
Even with the harness, some of those jumps were clearly pre-rotated and under-rotated. If quints are encouraged and rewarded in the future but are not executed with proper technique, they could cause some serious, career- ending injuries. With knowledge of how physically demanding quads are, I don't even want to imagine the risks that can be brought about by quints...
But it is very different and difficult if try to do that quintuple jump without harness. Like yuzuru hanyu want to do a quad axel, I hope he can land it someday 🐱
they're jumping quads or even triples, with EXCESSIVE AND INSANE pre-rotation AND the "fisherman" the man that's holding and helping them is basically holding them in the air, not just like slight help, but he's like literally holding them in the air. Personally it is just disgusting to see russians do quads, all their jumps are with insane pre rotation, the only russian that ive seen that doesn't have prerotation is Mikhail Kolyada. that is just my PERSONAL OPINION.
Not in all of them. You have to lift the rotating harness when the skater jumps. On the second jump (which is a bit UR), there is enough slack in the harness to tell he isn't pulling the skater up. He's definitely giving the 3rd and 4th skaters additional lift since the harness went tight. For the first one, it's too difficult to tell since part of the harness is too high and not seen completely in the video.
Not completely. The takeoff is usually under control of the skater. It does give the skater a little extra hang time. Most of it is under control by the skater. The coach can also soften the blow when the skater falls.
Well no. If you're lifted up, yes. But the more often you spin the faster you have to turn. And with all this force going into rotation, you won't get very far or high, which is why being pulled up makes an insane difference. They wouldn't just have to get a little stronger to do this, but a lot.
@@sofiapancino no if anything this is the best way to teach kids wrong prerotation technique. They’re forcing these jumps on kids who probably have just learned triples, which messes up with their technique and they massively prerotate. Not good on the long term
Definitely!! The little kids will be able to do them, they would need a lot of gymnastics training when they are 6 till they are 12 to learn to jump higher and rotate faster. Beliavsky and those little girls could do them! Why are they not doing practicing it? Do they need different skates and new techniques.
I think we’ve reached way past the limit now. Don’t even feel okay with the quads for ladies. Too much long term strain for them when their careers are over and they’re only in their late teens and early twenties.
Most Russian athletes don't dope, and top sports federations will always put pressure on their athletes, they did not revolutionize the sport, it was the Japanese who started jumping quads and triple axels, the Russians managed to do the same but more consistently by performing certain methods of training and dieting which are stricter than most countries. @@node9691
these ones are more mega cheated than russian lutz jumps they arent even taking off forward they take off around 270 degrees already rotated and minus a quarter of rotation on lading
Those skaters are about 12-14 years old and have very thin bodys, jumps are easier because they can jump higher and turn faster. This is why every Russian skater ends his career after puberty. The body is changing and they can't do their jumps anymore with more curves.
Why i see a lot people from other country is jealous … pre-rotating , using harness bla bla2… is even not competition yet…. Why not appreciate all this kids trying so hard to chase their dream … if u all seems have more good technic then work it out and show u better than their technic than talking justify this kids and coaches that work so hard everyday for something that they want to achieve
yeah it does they also have harnesses that are attached to the rafters at rinks that your coaches go back and forth across the rink with you in. Many coaches don''t or barely use them.
Did you hear Veronika Zhilina did last month a 5axel on the ice at Plushenko's Club! It was done without a harness! She learned her first triples when she was 8.
None of the girls do the quints by themselves only the boy and Veronika Zhilina who is not there can do 1 quintuple jump. They are possible to do by some skaters. If the skaters learn it at age 14/ 15, then more quintuple jumps can be done too. It might be good to start teaching gifted young skaters triples when they are 6 and 7 , they will have to be extremely cautious and very strong athletes. Ilia should put someday a quintuple jump in his program!
At 0:08 he's got almost a full rotation on the ice before he even takes off. 5T? Hardly. It's the same thing with the girl at 0:47, too. It's just like the previous so-called Russian quad queens. Most of the time, they never completed four full rotations OFF the ice. Lots of pre-rotation and/or under-rotation.
Technique is atrocious. The judges better have learned there lesson last Olympics. The unfair grading of execution os ridiculous. Most of these jumps are almost a half turn chested. Pre-rotated ,incorrect blade edge or they switch edge right before a lutz and the judges give it good execution. It’s obvious. Everyone should go and watch how the jumps are really supposed to be done. Then they will realize how hard even a quad really and truly is if they aren’t cheated!
I don't doubt that Kamila Valieva may land a quint or quad axel some day in the near future! She can rotate fast enough to jump a triple axel with such little height, once she improves the height to Kostornaia's, boom! Quad axel! And quints? She's got the talent too.
kami is an absolute phenom, but she muscles all her takeoffs and overall has pretty bad landing technique. not to mention the excessive 270° prerotation… she needs to work on her triple-triplesf first
People who take this too seriously and who don't get that they do this either for fun either to train their other triples and quad jumps 🤡 Of course we're not gonna see quintuple jumps tomorrow
I know quads are difficult, but quints? I see severe pre-rotation starting from the blade. That, alongside the spine’s excessive twisting, is a cause for not only injury, but a short skating career. Is this what we want our younger generation to endure? Artistry is being lost over execution of jumping technique.
As a figure skater, it’s actually easy on a harness. As long as your coach lifts you up high, you can do as many rotations as you please
Exactly and part of the difficulty of high rotation jumps is the rotation speed you need in the air. If you prolong your airtime then your average rotation speed goes down and it doesn’t simulate very well what it’d actually be like to do the jump, but I don’t like using harnesses so correct me if I’m wrong.
yeah, technically on a harness/spinner, you could do probably up to 20 or 30 without having to gain more speed
Harness doesn't really lift you up. It's more there to prevent drifting mid air and losing rotation speed. It's easier because the jump course is more stable but not because the skater gets to jump higher
Agreed, my friend did a quad in the harness because she's so light and her coach lifted her up too high, but in reality she can barely even land a single axel.
Roman sadovsky has a video of his friend doing like a 7axel on a harness it’s not that difficult when something is holding you up in the air
Quints are scary, if it happens to be ratified in the future , we’ll see more skaters career shorten due to injuries..
this is my concern it's beyond irresponsible
People probably said that about quads when they were first being attempted. Now we see quads being attempted all the time. It’s all about practice and people doing what they have to do to stay safe.
@@marley7130 easy for you to say cuz ur not doing the work, quads are already dangerous, its not about practice or staying safe, these are minors! Minors and teens whos bones still developing force to jump quads and quints. Do you even care about their ankles, bones, back and spines??? Current skaters cant even get away jumping quads without getting injured!! What more quints??
@@marley7130 Why do you think all the russian skaters are getting surgery right now ? Even the ones who don’t jumps quads. That’s because jumps are so hard on their bodies, even triples
i dont think quints will be even possible
Crazy, but I love the Russian skaters' ambition.
If the ISU really cares about jumping techniques lol they wouldn’t be doing these jumps. But it’s impressive whatever they do within this system is up to them
I wouldn't be surprised if they were banned because of the risk of injury, like backflips were. Just because you CAN do something doesn't mean you SHOULD.
The barrier to doing quintuple jumps is gravity. The training device negates the impact of gravity, which is why it becomes feasible.
Boy 5T: The first 3/4 rev is eaten with the toe pick, the other 1/4 is eaten at then end. Its a 4T
Blue Girl 5T: She eats 1/2 rev at the start.
Girl 5S: She eats 1/4 of air time at the take-off
Girl 5Lo: Correct Take-off, she lacks 1/4 at the end
All of this with a harness, so dont expect any quints soon
Don't quote me on it since I'm not quite that advanced but I thought in salchows you're allowed up to 180 degree prerotation? Isn't that just how the jump works?
@@dynamatic2022 yeah, she prerrotates the jump 1/4 revolution after that 180° mark
@@ivanlavouras Ah I get what you mean now
The first kid doesn't prerotate 3/4. Your supposed to prerotate 1/2, he only prerotates 1/4. Same with the girl 5T
@@ppnexus2000 when u are supposed to have aprox 1/4 of prerrotation on the toe pick. And def that's 3/4 of prerrotation
0:09: almost 1 full pre-rotation before take-off, 0:25: 3/4 pre-rotation and full blade on ice before take-off, 0:42: 3/4 pre-rotation, 0:59: 3/4 pre-rotation. Nothing fascination. One would wish for these skaters to first master technique before doing quads, not even to menation quintuple jumps.
welp unfortunately isu still doesn't punish for prerotation:(, all girls from tutberidze camp have a terrible technique which relies on this and using full blade
Lol. Pre-rotations and full blades are not discussed by any ISU body, and is a made up fiction by bitter fans who yearn for classic "western" technique.
@@muszkapuszka if u can better, lets go prove it, and, if u dont know, many famous skaters want to train at eteri's group
Toeloop and Salchow require 0.5 pre rotation to be done with the right technique
@@DanyaKinder sure
The first one was under rotated same with the second one the third was fully rotated 👏👏👏 and the last one as full👏👏👏
yes but you can see the trainer helpöing to lift the skater up, so she wouldnt jump as high alone...
@@MigraineManX it'll probably take time, i mean no one's landed a 4A yet
@@ml2397 noone's landed a 4a in competition. tons of quad axels have been landed, just not in competition
Last one was also under rotated. Third is pre rotated.
Yes they are, but maybe just read the title before commenting something like that… it says “attempts”! They’re still practicing and all of them are really good especially for the age (guess they’re still under 17)
It's crazy when you think how the Russians revolutionized the figure skating in last 5 years and still continue to do it! The rest of the world just has to trail behind. Respect to those juniors, I really hope they will soon show us the quintuple jumps at the tournaments.
The girls yeah, but not so much in the men
I see so much controversy surrounding that. On the one hand, there are these unreal technical feats. On the other hand people say a lot of it comes from cheated technique-- using the wrong edge, full blade on toe jumps, and a lot of prerotation. It goes back and forth, and I just don't know what to believe. But it worries me that younger and younger skaters are washing out because of injury.
They are yet again under controversy in the 2022 Olympics. It’s hard to be on board on this point.
Uroboros Ha, still think that?
@@sottosopravoce Unfortunately it is an incorrect technique most of the time. A large majority off the girls pulling of quads are under Eteri Tutberidze. If you really look into these girl you will realize most of them have full blade takeoffs in toe jumps. Excessive pre rotation that results in serious back injury’s and it also means they aren’t really doing quads sometimes. None of Eteri’s students have made it to 17 with a career still intact while under her. What they are doing is ambitious. However it’s not done well and highly injury inducing. That’s not even the half of it when It comes to Eteri though. I recommend looking into it.
Even with the harness, some of those jumps were clearly pre-rotated and under-rotated. If quints are encouraged and rewarded in the future but are not executed with proper technique, they could cause some serious, career- ending injuries. With knowledge of how physically demanding quads are, I don't even want to imagine the risks that can be brought about by quints...
I dont think they will allow the guy holding them up with the pole into the competition.
I did a quint once. I was with Brian Boitano fighting bears in the Alps.
Great effort. I notice the takeoff doesn’t leave the ice after 1 rotation on the ice!!!
But it is very different and difficult if try to do that quintuple jump without harness. Like yuzuru hanyu want to do a quad axel, I hope he can land it someday 🐱
they're jumping quads or even triples, with EXCESSIVE AND INSANE pre-rotation AND the "fisherman" the man that's holding and helping them is basically holding them in the air, not just like slight help, but he's like literally holding them in the air. Personally it is just disgusting to see russians do quads, all their jumps are with insane pre rotation, the only russian that ive seen that doesn't have prerotation is Mikhail Kolyada.
that is just my PERSONAL OPINION.
Everybody's gangsta until the harness has to go. 😅
But the coach is just pulling them up
Not in all of them. You have to lift the rotating harness when the skater jumps. On the second jump (which is a bit UR), there is enough slack in the harness to tell he isn't pulling the skater up. He's definitely giving the 3rd and 4th skaters additional lift since the harness went tight. For the first one, it's too difficult to tell since part of the harness is too high and not seen completely in the video.
Not completely. The takeoff is usually under control of the skater. It does give the skater a little extra hang time. Most of it is under control by the skater. The coach can also soften the blow when the skater falls.
shorter, leaner (less weight), impacts revolutions alot. Lipinski won the gold on jumps only because of this.
this shows that its possible to do a quintuple jump. AMAZING!!!
Well no. If you're lifted up, yes. But the more often you spin the faster you have to turn. And with all this force going into rotation, you won't get very far or high, which is why being pulled up makes an insane difference. They wouldn't just have to get a little stronger to do this, but a lot.
@@97LauraLee but its a beginning
@@sofiapancino no if anything this is the best way to teach kids wrong prerotation technique. They’re forcing these jumps on kids who probably have just learned triples, which messes up with their technique and they massively prerotate. Not good on the long term
I could do a quintuple with a harness and somebody lifting me up, and I'm just a grown-up that played hockey as a kid.
Definitely!! The little kids will be able to do them, they would need a lot of gymnastics training when they are 6 till they are 12 to learn to jump higher and rotate faster. Beliavsky and those little girls could do them! Why are they not doing practicing it? Do they need different skates and new techniques.
I think we’ve reached way past the limit now. Don’t even feel okay with the quads for ladies. Too much long term strain for them when their careers are over and they’re only in their late teens and early twenties.
Yeah revolutionized skating, doping, treating their young athletes like shit. Lets applaud Russia for all of this.
This is striaght up generalizing
@@Yurito12 Is it tho?
Most Russian athletes don't dope, and top sports federations will always put pressure on their athletes, they did not revolutionize the sport, it was the Japanese who started jumping quads and triple axels, the Russians managed to do the same but more consistently by performing certain methods of training and dieting which are stricter than most countries. @@node9691
They can get as many gold medals as they want but I think they more towards aiming for the world record.
That's the opposite of any elite athletes logic. World records are always broken, gold medals are forever
these ones are more mega cheated than russian lutz jumps they arent even taking off forward they take off around 270 degrees already rotated and minus a quarter of rotation on lading
Prerotating is their big problem too, but we have to notice that kamila could had her skating skills because of 💊
I feel we’ll see it one day, from both genders.
notice the prerotating? every russian does it youre supposed to take off at 1/4 mark they take off at 1/2 always
Those skaters are about 12-14 years old and have very thin bodys, jumps are easier because they can jump higher and turn faster. This is why every Russian skater ends his career after puberty. The body is changing and they can't do their jumps anymore with more curves.
Russian fs are the best 😊
None are stronger, there are 2 russians that do 4axels.
Ну и нахрена это надо на удосчке ?
Why i see a lot people from other country is jealous … pre-rotating , using harness bla bla2… is even not competition yet…. Why not appreciate all this kids trying so hard to chase their dream … if u all seems have more good technic then work it out and show u better than their technic than talking justify this kids and coaches that work so hard everyday for something that they want to achieve
Who are the girls who did the quint jumps??
Да уж.Если русские взялись что-то делать,делать будут упорно и капитально.
TIL this weird fishing pole thing exists.
yeah it does they also have harnesses that are attached to the rafters at rinks that your coaches go back and forth across the rink with you in.
Many coaches don''t or barely use them.
Did you hear Veronika Zhilina did last month a 5axel on the ice at Plushenko's Club! It was done without a harness! She learned her first triples when she was 8.
Those kids are very young to be forced.
Russia forces kids into everything!!
Beliavsky did a quintuple jump on ice on February! It was on Instagram.
None of the girls do the quints by themselves only the boy and Veronika Zhilina who is not there can do 1 quintuple jump. They are possible to do by some skaters. If the skaters learn it at age 14/ 15, then more quintuple jumps can be done too. It might be good to start teaching gifted young skaters triples when they are 6 and 7 , they will have to be extremely cautious and very strong athletes. Ilia should put someday a quintuple jump in his program!
Who's the first skater
At 0:08 he's got almost a full rotation on the ice before he even takes off. 5T? Hardly. It's the same thing with the girl at 0:47, too. It's just like the previous so-called Russian quad queens. Most of the time, they never completed four full rotations OFF the ice. Lots of pre-rotation and/or under-rotation.
I only believe it when I see it done successfully in a competitive event.
Technique is atrocious. The judges better have learned there lesson last Olympics. The unfair grading of execution os ridiculous. Most of these jumps are almost a half turn chested. Pre-rotated ,incorrect blade edge or they switch edge right before a lutz and the judges give it good execution. It’s obvious. Everyone should go and watch how the jumps are really supposed to be done. Then they will realize how hard even a quad really and truly is if they aren’t cheated!
They’re amazing whilst I can’t do a double jump yet 🥲
Mother Russia
yes you have to weight less, jump higher and spin faster
don't show it to Sasha Trusova hahahah
I think these are crazy. I hope ISU won't ratifie these jumps
Now that ilia malin showed that quints are possible its only a matter of time
Pero son niños con un peso y estatura bajos pues, solo los estan arriesgando.
I don't doubt that Kamila Valieva may land a quint or quad axel some day in the near future! She can rotate fast enough to jump a triple axel with such little height, once she improves the height to Kostornaia's, boom! Quad axel! And quints? She's got the talent too.
kami is an absolute phenom, but she muscles all her takeoffs and overall has pretty bad landing technique. not to mention the excessive 270° prerotation… she needs to work on her triple-triplesf first
All with either full or 3/4 prerotations 😆 wtf Russia
My God! The quint now?! Russians are evolving the sport as we know it.
Yeah it could possible if russians do doping haha😏💊💉
its like ps3 then ps4 then ps5
People who take this too seriously and who don't get that they do this either for fun either to train their other triples and quad jumps 🤡 Of course we're not gonna see quintuple jumps tomorrow
Omg
I know quads are difficult, but quints? I see severe pre-rotation starting from the blade. That, alongside the spine’s excessive twisting, is a cause for not only injury, but a short skating career. Is this what we want our younger generation to endure? Artistry is being lost over execution of jumping technique.
Have they been approved by the ISU?? Can the skaters do them in competitions??
I asked canadian coaches if they can teach our 1yr old daughter quads when she turns 10, they said no. Maybe I should send her to Russia.
im kinda hoping this is satire
was wondering
those are all quads 💀🤦♂️
Unbelievable.
Are those all boys or are some of them girls?
Only the first one was a boy the rest girls
Only if…
Con estas webadas el deporte se está yendo a la mierda