What about the bad Popes?
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- Опубліковано 18 січ 2011
- www.catholic.com/library/Papal...
Does the existence of a few bad popes in history somehow negate the Catholic belief in papal infallibility? Catholic Answers Live Host Patrick Coffin and Tim Staples discuss.
Catholic Answers is one of the nation's largest lay-run apostolates of Catholic apologetics and evangelization. Its mission statement explains its purpose:
Catholic Answers is an apostolate dedicated to serving Christ by bringing the fullness of Catholic truth to the world. We help good Catholics become better Catholics, bring former Catholics "home," and lead non-Catholics into the fullness of the faith.
I keep praying that I'm Peter , not Judas. There's a quite thin line which makes a big difference
God bless the producers of this channel and the presenters. this is one questtion that has always plagued me for a long time now. i especially love the part about ' dont leave Peter because of Judas'. i dont know if its in line, but a similar concept is xpressed in Romans 3:2-4 thus ".....to begin with, the Jews are entrustedwith the oracles of God. what if some were unfaithful?does their faithlessness nullify the faithfulness of God? by no means!..."
This actually reminds me of an article I recently read about St. Ambrose using the expression "immaculata ex maculatis", which comes from a passage of St. Ambrose's commentary on the Gospel of Luke. The expression means that the Church is holy and without stain, although it welcomes within itself men who are stained with sin.
Tim Staples is awesome!
"You cant leave Peter because of Judas" You just cant beat that.
Great vids, MORE! MORE! MORE!
I love these short little youtube vids on one topic that I can hand out to people when the issue come up. The more issues you post on the better.
the words I needed to hear. not to sure about Francis..Jesus is the reason to stay.
Regardless of everything else, I TRULY respect Catholic Answers' HONESTY in stating what the Catholic Church and Catechism actually teach on nearly every question they receive.
Amen brother! Your comment reveals the complete FAILURE of Protestantism. Instead of the "One Church" that Christ prayed for, today we have 40,000+ "churches" that cannot even agree on BASIC Christian doctrine. Many of these also allow homosexuals & lesbians as "bishops."!!-? The lack of TRUE Christian UNITY, LOVE, MERCY & FORGIVENESS has allowed evil to prosper in the "post modern" age. As Jesus taught, "A house divided cannot stand." We ALL need to pray for unity in these troubled times.
I will remember this argument the next time I am confronted by a non Catholic, thank you.
May I ask, you know how they say the Pope is infallible in terms of faith and moral doctrine... How come during the crusades, the Pope could proclaim that indulgence was granted to those who joined it?
Jesus said to Peter , Satan said he would shift you , but I prayed that you would not fail . . . Now the reason behind changing Simon's name to Peter as a symbol off a Rock that cant be moved . . Meaning head of our Lords Doctrine, for all those successors through out history would sit on as head of office, and so the fact Satan had plans to destroy the Church & Jesus having to pray meant there will be a struggle between Good & evil.
The symbol of the Rock is a substance that cant be moved and so the symbol is a safe guard against Jesus doctrine through out thee ages cant be moved . . It was the Doctrine that Satan referred to as shifting to destroy it .
great channel I wish Catholics had more great apologists
Thank you
Pope Innocent was not so innocent
Good argument! This is the very reason why I converted. There are good and bad people in every organization.It's better to be a good person in a questionable organization, than abandon the organization to save face.
The Lord wouldn't allow that kind of wickedness at the head of His church. Yes, the apostles were fallible men, but fallible is one thing, wicked is another
Amen.
First video I have seen by you guys!! You're amazing!!!! Love it!
this comes up great on short wave here in the UK
AMAZING VIDEO.!
Great answers as always. I could listen to you guys talk all day.
FATHER BARRON!! Goodness gracious what a wonderful man. I just finished watching nearly all his videos and now I have been watching these guys. They offer great commentary as well!
Boccaccio wrote "The Decameron", not Dante.
Peter also established the Patriarchate (chair) of Antioch. ;) In fact, it used to be a feast on the Roman Calendar but has been taken off and mostly forgotten.
Me gustaría que los videos estuvieran subtitulados en español.
The Church says that papal teaching is infallible. This is normal infallibility when the Pope speaks on behalf of the magisterium, or church's divinely instituted teaching authority. Extraordinary infallibility is when the pope pronounces a doctrine ex cathedral, that is from the chair of Peter. In his role of teaching authority for the church, Pope Honorius wrote to an archbishop regarding the nature of Christ, as having but one will, not two---namely, a divine will and not a human will. At a later church council, an ecumenical one, the church decreed that Christ had two wills, declaring pope Honorius a heretic, denied him salvation, and excommunicated him. Now, the church also teaches that the decrees and decisions of ecumenical councils are also infallible pronouncements. So the church cannot have it both ways: either an ecumenical council erred in deposing and excommunicating pope Honorius for heresy, or Honorius erred when he infallibly declared on the nature of Christ, in contradiction to the council's infallible decree. They cannot both be true.
I pray for you guys daily. Thank you SO MUCH for educating me on the beauty of the Catholic Church! I love our Lord Jesus Christ :-)
Priests (also Popes etc...) if they go to hell they have a more horrible sentence. just a FYI
Amen,Amena, AAAAAMEN!!!!
God is great!
Great video, although I must correct you on a small detail: The Decameron was written by Giovanni Boccaccio, not by Dante Alighieri.
By the way, Boccaccio wrote Decameron, not Dante.
A very good talk.!
@TBird4490
You have to make the distinction between the Authority of the pope´s chair and the person. You have to watch this video
I will recomend you to read Matthew 23: 1-3, in case you continue having a lot of problem with "bad popes" (less than 1%).
Blesses
Protestant Christian here, I cannot agree with some of the doctrines of the Catholic Church but I hope that whatever it is, you are children of God, and truly committed to serving Jesus, which is ultimately what's most important, and not the denomination you belong to.
Hopefully a Catholic encounters this comment and responds. Just out of curiosity (no animosity intended), what do you think of some fundamentalists who strongly believe that the Antichrist in the endtimes era is the Pope, and that the Roman Catholic Church is the whore of Babylon?
+Gerald Koh we are called Sedevacantist. Sedevacantist means the throne of Peter is empty. The true popes such as Peter and Pope Pious X were infalliable teachers but popes like Francis are classified as antipopes or people who claim to be Pope and fool many people bu they are not truly the Pope.
+Alex Weiskopf
Tim Staples would disagree with you. Look up Catholics Repent. Tim Staples says even he is damned to hell if he misses mass.
+Gerald Koh ultimately what is important is that all churches that are protestant ARE and were formed from heretical nonbiblical teachings.
So you guys honestly think you somehow have to merit a place in heaven even when the Bible says we can't do that?
Craneo Bones
You mean the denominations? Yeah, I agree with you on that. They all came out of their mother harlot Rome.
Never making an error in just specific field.
Dante didn't write the Decameron :P
why would God bless the church with Alexander VI?
A tree is known by its fruits...if the tree is corrupt the fruit will be corrupt. If a man won't treat you right, what makes you believe he'll teach you right?
@xukeith33 Another to see your point is:
Why would Jesus pick Judas Knowing He was going to betray him ?
@BZentinela coz he's so perfect for the role?
um...
@hautzeng Papal infallibility means the pope is infallible in doctrinal teaching through the help of the holy spirit. it doesn't mean that the pope is sinless.
so?? if that's the case no human could ever represent Him nor speak in his name, but tha fact is that Jesus chooses the ones who are the poor and the ones who are hated to manifest His Will and Wisdom
All Catholics get the book Honey from the rock by Roy Shoeman it is wonderful conversion stories of Gods chosen people we get our faith from. Also Salvation is from the Jews is wonderful to read. You will be blessed, educated, forefilled.
Good argument.
I have nothing more to say.
The prophecy of Saint Francis of Assisi , regarding the Apostate, who will come in his name is coming true.
@hautzeng Not at all. You are confusing "Infallibility" with "impeccability." If you are interested in what the Church teaches about this, go to our web site (catholic dot com) and use the search term "Papal Infallibility."
look, I am still a 40% catholic. but it is very hard..VERY HARD to defend the arguments of the Catholic church violent history of killing people who owned a bible and read it privately. And then there is the Inquisition. I mean, is there ANY VIDEO or book at all, that helps catholics debate this powerful argument against the origins of the Church and its evil Middle Ages history. I mean, come on. Catholics would hunt down and kill bible believing Christians and even if it was just the "rulers" or Kings, where were the moral church leaders? How am I supposed to believe that my church did not have a violent history and did not want the average believer to have a bible? These questions ARE ALMOST never answered in Catholic answers online or on radio and never answered by EWTN people. Well?
If you think Peter was the least qualified Apostle to become the "rock" you do not understand Jesus or his message.....
Infallible only in regard to speaking about faith and morals in communion with the bishops.
The question is were all popes Christians? The answer to this question has an enormous significance for catholic dogma, I believe many Popes were Christians, (not perfect like me) and many Popes were not even Converted Christians? (succession?) But I let God Judge the individual person.
The bible was compiled by the Catholic Church hundred years after Jesus left Christians in apostles hands. The apostles impose their hands on their follower leaders, the bishops. The bishop of Rome was the head of the Church as he was in the place of Peter.
Jesus pray they remain as one, united in one body called Church, so the world could believe.
Nowadays, Christians divisions are used by world to remain skeptic.
Holy Spirit, bring us to your truth, and unify us in one body as Jesus left us.
So papal infallibility is false?
infalability=the quality of NEVER making an error. Only God is infalable. God's Word never changes but men can get it wrong, even Popes. Peter even got derailed from the truth as Paul pointed out to him when he was requiring circumcision. You cannot mix grace and law. If you add any requirements to grace you put yourself under the whole law again and become a slave to it (read Galatians asking Holy Spirit to reveal truth to you).
You are right. The Church cannot fail because Christ is the cornerstone. Not Peter. If you build everything on a man with faults, then the church can crumble. "for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God," "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us." Only Christ was perfect and he is the chief cornerstone. Do not put your trust in men. Why did the most recent pope quit if he was chosen by God? I guess he was saying God was wrong? Fallible.
You are not Jesus therefore you are not perfect. I would like some evidence to support your contention some Popes were not Christians. Names and what faiths did they belong to?
I don't understand. The pope is gods representative on earth supposedly. So since there have been evil popes, using catholic logic, they're implying that god is evil. This does not make sense.
Yahweh is without flaw, and the church is asserting they have divine power granted to them by Yahweh. This logically must mean that each pope is without flaw, but this is not the case. The more you look at it logically, the more absurd this looks I feel.
I personally don't think the pope represents Him.
Catholics read your Catholic Bible Matthew 6 16 18 Isaiah 22 John 20 19 23 John 6 51 55 Matthew Jesus on divorce marriage contraception abortion even those who don't follow but in scripture and teachings of Catholic Catechism has all the teachings of Jesus which our Church has all ways safeguarded throughout the years
It is said that the "...church is indestructible ....even with bad popes.." Oh yeah? What bout the blasphemous liberal Pope Francis who says Gays are okay and that there are "...other ways to God..." seriously.
You do understand that Pope Francis thinks homosexuality is a sin, don't you?