@Hexley_Vexley the redeemer used to outperform the hammerhead which is 725 bucks. An even worse disparity. The real life cost has never been a good measure of ship capability. Hell the Valkyrie is more expensive than the tac and its not useful for anything.
Counterpoint: the two ships are not even close to the same level. The Redeemer is a four man gunship, whereas the TAC is a seven man multirole attack ship. With a crew of seven, the TAC is competing with the Hammerhead, Perseus, and yes even the Polaris.
The Perseus doesn't need a crew that large to operate at full capacity though... Maybe 4 at most. It's what really puts it above a ship like the Polaris.
@@coffeefox5703 ya i’m a big fan of the Perseus. I will def be earning to buy it in game. Also, have 0 friends and i will solo the Polaris even if it kills me. And it probably will 😭
The redeemer got nerfed because component/size wise didnt make sense (pionner got +20% in size for that) and obviously TAC is made for deep space , going to missions alone for a long time . Lastly you must all understand that every ship company will have competitor ships for almost every job , you cant expect CIG to stop building gunships/dropships because you bought "the original".
@@Hexley_Vexley Costs the same right now sure. The TAC will get a price increase when it's flyable. Concept to flyable price increases are typically 10-15%
@@Hexley_Vexley Cost the same but they're different roles, different size, different maneuverability. Also the TAC will likely get a slight price increase when it becomes flyable, just like the Zeus. Also other ships with odd pricing near this bracket include the Valkyrie at $375, Glaive at $350, F8C lightning at $300
it also got nerfed because it was OP. They are balancing against cap ships not the current gameplay. They are thinking of what will the Redeemer do against a Polaris/Idris/Perseus. Not against your Connie
The Redeemer will chew this thing up like it's no one's business. First of all every shot the Redeemer fires at this thing is landing as this is a chonky ass ship and is thus a massive target to shoot at. Secondly, sure the Redeemer got a size reduction on it's manned turrets and sure it lost a shield, but it now has a flight characteristics that are more like a Vanguard than the previous flying brick feel it had before. Thirdly, those size 5 manned turrets on the TAC don't like at all like they can be pointed completely forward. They even state in the introduction video that they provide great broadside coverage. That right there tells you that the main job of those turrets is to lay down support fire for the soldiers deploying out of the drop-down jump seats it has.
@@RazSkull673it’s also a deep space ship, if it was in real life that space would be used constantly on month long voyages. Cig is just keeping with the realism, these would probably be paired with a dedicated cargo ship with more space for vehicles
The redeemer got nerfed because it was too strong. Im a redeemer fanboy. I pledged the ship, but i can still admit it punched way too high up for its size.
Crazy the TAC is the same value in the pledge store ($330) as the Redeemer. Also, cheaper than the Valkyrie ($375). I would have liked to see maybe two Furies with some unique docking, but the bay looks to have some potential.
I think the starlancer fits between categories. You could compare it to a Connie or a 600i or the larger ships like in the video. I think the TAC will be a great explorer as well.
Concering the 2x S5 turrets on the TAC... I reckon their default position is 45 to 90 degrees out the side, so they can face forward but it will be at their most extreme angle, so while yes, their point forward, it will be awkward and limit to trace targets directly ahead. They will probably perform best as broadside cannons.
@@marcuswynn89 and you're generating drama and controversy around CIG without even having the full picture. Not a quality I want from a SC content creator, not healthy for the community and game. I'm all about criticizing CIG and aome of their practices but before you do it, you better know what you're saying.
7:34 considering the turrets down there can't fire up at all pm and the tac is heavy and sluggish, it does rely on that initial damage burst in a fight
The Redeemer is closer to the size of a Vanguard so it's basically a "heavy" vanguard that now is a gunship with an anti-fighter role, a mini hammerhead. It's still a gunship and it's target role is merely different.
I am so excited to see the Misc refresh. They're finally giving the Misc brand love and providing them real value. I'm becoming a fan. That said I purchased the Max with a CCU to the TAC. The TAC gameplay and feel is where I want to be.
It's a pity we will have to wait a bit longer for the TAC, but at least we can test fly the MAX during the AEE event. Which well let us get an idea on the handling. I do like what the ships bring to the Table but the TAC is certainly more interesting. It's always hard to tell a Turrets range of motion in Star citizen. If they work like the Corsairs side turrets that should give them fairly reasonable forward, side and bottom coverage. Still even with two people 6 size 4 cannons facing forward is pretty good. Probably not the best overall design fora 'gun ship' and I would be more apt to call it an assault ship, maybe more for ground attack like the A2 but it still has enough space for loot and other fun things. TAC is certainly taking the redeemers place for the new tank at the very least, it was a tough nerf but it really had too much defense, firepower and speed for a ship its size. Having a dedicated fury is kinda neat though and I am sure you will likely be able to fit a few more in the back if you wanted to be a pocket carrier. I will be interested to see if the side loading cargo lifts on the MAX are wide enough for fury's if parked length wise. That would be pretty funny. Hidden snub carrier. :) Having a ship you can spawn in is really good no matter what because of all the accidental death that happens in this game.
The size had nothing to do with it. If you take the cargo bay and stack the habitation and engineering space of the other medium multicrew ships they will all be more or less the size of a Redeemer. The Redeemer is a specialist ship, like a Hull A. Nerfing the firepower and protection of the Redeemer is pretty much the same as nerfing the cargo space of a Hull A because it is the same size as a Nomad. Those ships are specialists that give everything in order to be able do one job. They can only do one mission, so they should be the best at it.
@@CptFugu I think it's fair to make that argument. I never really had too much of a problem with the redeemer but compared to other ships with its level of fire power it was on the small side but had twice the shields. While I can't pretend to be in CIG's head but I feel since its specialization was combat and the corsair suffered a DPS nerf too They seem to want to give larger ships more of a reason to exist. It is frustrating because they often change things before they needed to, would all of this been better after the engineering update or armor to make the larger ships more attractive to players instead of being fighter dominant rather than forcing the issue now before the changes? While a bummer it's not out of character for them.
The redeemer was always destined for gross changes since it was from TNGS TV show they put on (aka, designed by fans) and never quite fit their bill. I feel like none of these complainers even know that history, but I'm (unfortunately) an Original Backer who's been in it and waiting for 12 years. I feel for redeemer folk, but it's not nearly as bad as the disgusting switcharoo they pulled with the 'stella Phoenix, (another thing new backers have no idea about), so my sympathy is limited.
They should have made a tactical/dropship variant of starfarer. Remove the tanks in the back extend the vehicle/cargobay with private quarters and medbay along the top. The starfarer just looks like a tactical dropship where the tac seems like a planetary exploration ship.
I did the upgrade from my Corsair to it but didn’t apply it yet. I need to see it fly or at least the max before I make any decisions. I just don’t like what they did to the corsair seems weird, but I’m not completely giving up on it yet but the extra fire power from the turrets and the med beds along with the small increase in cargo capacity with a hanger for something small too is very enticing. If it was a RSI ship, it would be a no-brainer not really into MISC But this one doesn’t look too bad to me. I guess we’ll see.
Tac has jump seats on the bottom and crew habitation up top. The redeemer was a poorly laid out derp boat before the nerf. Now at least it's faster, smaller turrets can track better as well lol.
the starlancer as a series is just so freaking cool. i love all three but I think ill def get the tac and the build, I cant wait to try it out first and see how it flys
1 Redeemer has not been nerfed and is now more useful for his role. 2 The Starlancer TAC is not made for the same role as the Redeemer regardless of whether we compare it with its old or new balance. The Starlancer TAC is positioned between the Valkyrie and the A2. It is a heavy drop ship made to defend itself in big battles before arriving at its destination, it is not made to attack. 3 If you only see the usability of a ship within his fire power you have all wrong. And in a fight between a Redeemer and a Starlancer TAC, the Redeemer have more chance of winning why ? Because the Redeemer is more mobile and is close to not have any blind spot, the Starlancer TAC have a big blind spot in his bottom/back
@@artsolano6762 I don't see it like this. What's the point of having more fire power without being able to apply any damage because you are too slow to be at range from your targets ?
by next IAE, the s5 guns will be s4, and all other guns will be s3... and they'll take the med beds out. gotta make room for the new better ship they'll need to sell.
I am curious on how this thing flies and how double the shields of the corsair with downgraded to 4x size4s would do for ERTS. Trying to find something to replace my Corsair with as the way they nerfed the guns was dumb and no one wants to sit in the co pilot seat to click fire on a gun they can't really aim that is front firing.
This ship seems positioned right bellow the A2 in the ranks of firepower. I'm fortunate enough to own both the Tac and the A2. If I have to choose I would take the A2 any time of the day. I don't understand how most people don't see how useful the A2 really is. 200+ SCUs of cargo means it completes with the Starlancer Max, and all without having to split its cargo into two different bays. A crapload of S5 armed turrets in the belly makes for some seriously devastating firepower. People complain it's all in the belly, but are they aware that you can roll the ship over in and within seconds a closing in fighter will be face to face with those turrets? And then there is ability most of these people think is the only thing the A2 can do, which is bombing the crap out of Jumptown. Which just doesn't get old! The ship is like a blend between a Connie Taurus ( A2 has 200+ SCUs, Taurus have 170+), a Hammerhead (A2 has even more S5s, albeit the Hammerhead has them more evenly located), and a Retaliator (the A2 would using bombs instead of torps to nuke Jumptown). Because of these elements I can't see the Tac completing with the A2. However, it is possible the Tac will be the best multi-crew bunker/ground assault ship dethroning the mighty Valkerie of that title. It will be very good at multi-crew ERTs, and VHRT too. The Fury adds well to its firepower. And if that hangar could accommodate a Cutter Scout, the this ship would make for a great exploration ship too. A Carrack on a budget! Lets see if that turns out to be the case.
With the way the Redeemer flys now, I can't call the Redeemer a total nerf. It was actually just put into a correct class. Prior to this change, the damn ship moved stupidly slow.. And for it's size, it made 0 sense. So cutting down the weapon sizes, removing the mega shields and speeding it up puts it against the type of ships it was meant to fight in the first place. Fighters, bombers, small and medium sized ships with the capability to cause hell to large as well. I don't see this as a total loss nerf at all. In some ways, man it's a buff. But only to the people who use it right. As for the Tac and Max, man I agree with you 100% The A2 has the best of both of those ships. The cargo of the Max and the firepower "plus much more" of the Tac. That's probably the hardest thing I'm struggling with on buying a Starlancer. I own an A2. I just don't think I need a Starlancer because of that.
I like the TAC it was upgraded from my nerfed Corsair the only one thing A2 and C2 will still be useful to move the Bigger combat vehicles like the nova and anvil platforms witch is only till the ironclad assault
I would say if it flies like a 600i side turrets that can look up and down are actually pretty useful, turns SO slow its hard to stay on target even against a freelancer sized ship
ngl after flying the redeemer now i really like it. it flys like a super heavy fighter and packs a good punch. the TAC isnt an upgrade to that. the real upgrade is the Hammerhead. the TAC is a ground assault ship. it will be amazing for the worm raid. but it def isnt a competitor for the Deemer or hammerhead.
The Redeemer isn't nerfed. TAC is 4x the size, smaller cooler, less guns, required 50% more crew to be at 100% capability, and will cost nearly $100 more once it's final ready-to-fly price launches.
I ended up melting my freelancer max, vulture and andromeda. Sold all my paint. I bought the crv for the lti and ship upgraded both my atls and the crv to the starlancer max and tac. Of course, added a little bit more money to it. Oh, bought the paints to go with the starlancers. I, then, bought another crv just in case the bld version is within credit reach.
My argument is that the TAC is why the Corsair got Nerfed, the redeemer... maybe, but I think that with the maneuverability increases, it would have been AMAZING if it kept the good weapons. with the nerf it really IS an attack Helicopter. it will be pretty good as and AIr to Ground assault craft. but it won't be the mini hammerhead it could have been.
Regarding the redeemer providing, they uped the speed and maneuverability I don't think it's too bad. You can't have it as a flying tank and then have it move like a vanguard.
Btw the TAC is not in active development, what is coming next month is the MAX, and after that is the BTL, the construction version, that was highlighted in the sips for the next 12 months, so we may not see the TAC for years
It says right on the TAC's product page that it'll be out later in 2025. The BLD is the one that isn't coming out anytime soon as it needs base building and crafting to be fleshed out more and implemented before it can exist.
@@Gofr5 Tier 0 base building is coming in the early part of 2025 -- BLD, Atlas and the Argo are going to be the small/medium/large base building tools for base building tier 0.
I refunded my star citizen account 8 years ago and lost "most" of my roughly $3k ship collection. Only thing i was able to save on an alt account was my veterans upgrade and 3 mustang omega packages. So im in the process of rebuilding a more streamlined fleet. Picked up a Tac, and will grab a Perseus for my multicrew support and combat ships, the Tac fills the holes the perseus is missing for me, more cargo, and med beds. So if they are flying together will be a nice combo. My other ships are the F7A Mk1, Scorpius, Taurus (that i want to ccu to something else) and an Arrow (prob ccu this too) Id like to get a F7A Mk2 if it becomes available to go with my Mk1
Corsair still has more solo firepower then the tac, and the tac is likely going to have much worse handling and speed. why would a corsair nerf get people to by the tac. The draw of the corsair was solo power, the starlancer line does not compete with that.
Redeemer was nerfed because the community had been asking for it for a long time, wanting it to be maneuverable as the lore says, but it can't be as strong as it was and still agile, so they left it agile and nerfed the weapons, that's obvious
it can't be because the Redeemer was over powered? I bought the redeemer a couple years ago because it was unmatched, insanely so before I bought it, I thought, the two size 5 turrets should really be size 4 turrets, based on the size (profile) of the ship seems like it still has size 5s, truly nerfed... you guys will cry about anything
It really has nothing to do with tje Redeemer nerf at all. They arent similar sizes, crew capacities, or even purposed. One has NOTHING to do with the other. If you think a 7 crew subcapital troop lander whos effective firepower cannot even aim at its largest targetable surface (top rear), is comparable to a light gunship with 3 crew that can fly circles around it, you are insane. The redeemer is HALF its size, with NONE of its competing capabilities other than having turrets.
Reminder to everyone going in circles about the Redeemer vs the Starlancer: This is not a game. There is no balance, only placeholder systems to let you fly around and test the server. There is no final power management, weapons or turret tuning, systems we don't even know about, capacitors, etc. The Redeemer could very well be able to shoot more damage per minute due to power distribution and capacitors than the Starlancer in the final game. The Redeemer could also turn better. It also has better turret firing angle coverage. It could also have better armor, which doesn't exist yet. Just chill out. Enjoy the aesthetics and see what they do. Nothing in the game right now is anything but placeholder, balance and system-wise. The only thing you can count on are the visuals and style.
I think everyone can agree that Redeemer was broken as shit, but the nerf was a bit too much though. I'm fine with the shield/health degrade but at least let it keep the Size 5
no way, its cause it was overpowered. its essentially a up-gunned sentinal, a heavy fighter, and the tac is a large ship bigger than the conny series. so the heavy fighter should have less shields than a large-heavy-medical-gunboat-dropship-ship with a snub fighter hanger lol it makes total sense. i agree with you tho
Honestly I think it got nerfed cos they finally working on Perseus, I mean it was very strange that Redeemer even had the same Components as a ship that's double in size that it, gun wise well bigger ships are coming to the game with Polaris then Perseus and Idris whenever, so it's logical that smaller ships with bigger guns will get smaller in my opinion.
thanks for this video, i'm thinking of swapping my redeemer for the starlancer tac. i'm still on the fence. wonder what size ground vehicle can fit in it;s bay.
People need to realize that THIS is the game. It will be in perpetual development. Ships will be meta until a competitor is made that needs to be sold. That's it. CIG doesn't care about making ships that make sense. Tell me why 4 NDB30s create more damage than 4NDB30s with 2 Size 4 repeaters? Because the sabre with ndbs is more powerful than an f7amk2 with 4 ndbs and size 4 repeaters on the wings. The NDB 30s should be the same no matter what ship they're on. It's like saying an 62g 5.56mm round shoots harder because the mil-spec rifle brand is different. Point is, CIG just makes shit to sell. That's it.
The Corsair got nerfed to as a higher implementation of multicrew gameplay, it was to strong for you solo/no friend pilots. The TAC has most of its features designed around multicrew.
I dont feel there is much of a relative connection between these 2 ships. Redeemer nerf is just a sad situation in the short term. The Corsair nerf is way worse.
@@marcuswynn89 redeemer easily killing hammerheads one on one while having the same amount of shielding as one. They where never designed as a corvette killer they where designed as a ground attacker and now a heavy fighter killer. With more agility and stuff i actually prefer its role now than before
Could be nerfed due to the new ship. But I will say this, the size 5 guns looked way to big and stupid on the narrow redeemer. Just like the hornets, and even the vanguards. The guns just look so big and stupid.
Wouldn’t surprise me. Could be why the Corsair got nerfed. All three are Gunboats in my eyes. Tac will be cool but that’s a high crew count for a 600i sized ship, so I’ll stay away. May crew on one if a buddy needs it.
Personally, I think the Corsair was nerfed to make room for the Mirai Guardian. The Corsair was the 100% best choice for solo PVE bounty hunters which is where the Guardian will shine. The Tac is too far out, too big, too slow, and requires too much crew to be a real alternative for most Corsair owners to consider that upgrade.
@@lordsheogorath3377 i agree with you. but still the guardian wont be that good. bcus no cargo space. the corsair is still really good for that. i personally always liked the connies and used them instead. i have to say the corsair ramp is much better.
@@lordsheogorath3377 interesting. Wonder how strong the guardian will be. I bet a ton of vanguards will get melted. Wonder if it will be a solo heavy fighter or have a turret
@@eziiii3536 Many corsair owners don't use the cargo. They just go from kill to kill. I know a few people that avoided it despite the high dps because it flys like a brick and would welcome a smaller more dedicated solo ship with 3000+ dps other than the Ion and Ares, which both have their own issues.
Its probably going to fly like booty though. I actual like the Redeemer where it is now. Its not the hammer it was before but its "good" solo and can absolutely demolish fighter groups. I still miss the ild Redeemer but it flys so much better now. I dunno. The tac though is going to be more of daily driver/assault. Probably going to fly like booty though.
The Redeemer right now is a PvE ship. As soon as you find yourself in front of a real player you'll figure out how inadequate its "improved" capabilities are. And it sure as hell isn't worth its asking price anymore.
@@CptFugu So you are saying some of the ships are worth the actual asking price 😆 Dude none of them are worth anything. It's a protection ship. The old version just overwhelmed ships with firepower. No matter what they do some ship is going to be meta... Almost all ships are pve in the game. Even in the 3.18 meta there was a handful of ships that could pvp . Nothing has really changed they just moved it to another category..... At least it has a nuance to it and is probably the only fleet defense unit that can pursue. It's interesting now. It was op before...
That's ridiculous whiteknighting. If the Redeemer was "overwhelming"" at $330.00 perhaps we should erase the Starlancer Max, the Connies, and the Corsair. Some of which are about $100.00 less expensive and can deliver overwhelming firepower with a fraction of the crew.
Redeemer will get back to x1 S3 shield at some point, mark my words. It can't power x6 S2 shields. Requires 24 power pips. That's insane! 6 S2 shields are just as strong as a single S3. They'll give it a single S3 shield to fix its power issues. They have to. It's broken with 6 S2 shields right now.
they will nerf the s"$£ out of this ship , Its the latest redeemer , but this time with a medbed. Sorry to be so negative but they will use it as an "I win" ship for a while , sell a load of them and then nerf it as soon as they have a new "gunship" to sell sorry add on , The A2 is a dedicated ground assault landing craft , its why most of the guns are downward facing , drop the bomb , strafe the target area and then hotdrop the tanks . Ahh well , we'll see how it goes
Selling more hopes and dreams fomo speculative over-marketed crap. I've stopped all funding. Maybe when the money goes away they will feel like they need to buckle-down and finish the game instead of trying to have an entire career on one project.
MM is realy sad, together with the deemer nerf that made me not wana spend more on SC. nerfing ships components is the new trend now, the TAC will suffer the same fate when the next gunship goes online. if im getting a ship now its gona be for looks and with store credits. i own both a deemer and a 400i so im just done. deemer was meant to be a state of the art gunship, and it was at sales when it could fly. i lost all respect for J crewe and yoki, hole CIG tbh. hype and lies.
I get that folks have to at some point buy-in to Star Citizen just to immerse themselves in the fantasy. However, the sooner you become disgruntled and move on the better for your mental health and wallet.
Soon as we saw the Redeemer get nerfed my buddy and I both said that they were gonna do this. Mark my words that in around 6 months the Redeemer will be buffed again as soon as sales dip off.
like normal. we nerf a ship then sell you solution lol and ppl buy this shit up its funny, idk why ppl buying ships. you gonna need to save up to buy shield tokens. you will need to spend 100's a week for them
DUDEEEEE... I had no idea Chris Roberts was removed from Freelancer for the same BS we are dealing with. Holy effing shiat man. How is it possible for this to go so far?
"Look how they massacred my boy"
Someone gets the meme
i said the same thing on a redeemer video lol.
“Im the upgrade. 😎” -Starlancer probably
Tac is the size of the 600i, twice the redeemer, the redeemer had the same shields as the Hammerhead...
Dude.. that's freaking why..
It's closer to 4 times the size
The problem is the fact that the Redeemer costs the same as a TAC, that's a crazy disparity for what you are getting for your money...
@Hexley_Vexley the redeemer used to outperform the hammerhead which is 725 bucks. An even worse disparity. The real life cost has never been a good measure of ship capability. Hell the Valkyrie is more expensive than the tac and its not useful for anything.
@@andrewboyer7544 4x the volume, less guns, smaller cooler, requires more crew to have the same combat efficiency, but it has a cargo bay...
@@Tyrannus_Gaming which matters the most in a fight! 😄
Counterpoint: the two ships are not even close to the same level. The Redeemer is a four man gunship, whereas the TAC is a seven man multirole attack ship. With a crew of seven, the TAC is competing with the Hammerhead, Perseus, and yes even the Polaris.
Polaris and Perseus is a stretch but ya the M2 and other similar sizes for sure. It’s a half-sized Polaris. But not competing with the Polaris.
The Perseus doesn't need a crew that large to operate at full capacity though... Maybe 4 at most. It's what really puts it above a ship like the Polaris.
@@coffeefox5703 above is crazy. But on par, sure i guess. That said, they have 2 completely different roles.
@@Terran0va_Plays I only have two friends so the Perseus will always be above the Polaris in my heart. :(
@@coffeefox5703 ya i’m a big fan of the Perseus. I will def be earning to buy it in game. Also, have 0 friends and i will solo the Polaris even if it kills me. And it probably will 😭
The redeemer got nerfed because component/size wise didnt make sense (pionner got +20% in size for that) and obviously TAC is made for deep space , going to missions alone for a long time . Lastly you must all understand that every ship company will have competitor ships for almost every job , you cant expect CIG to stop building gunships/dropships because you bought "the original".
The problem is the fact that the Redeemer costs the same as a TAC, that's a crazy disparity for what you are getting for your money...
@@Hexley_Vexley Costs the same right now sure. The TAC will get a price increase when it's flyable. Concept to flyable price increases are typically 10-15%
@@Hexley_Vexley Cost the same but they're different roles, different size, different maneuverability. Also the TAC will likely get a slight price increase when it becomes flyable, just like the Zeus.
Also other ships with odd pricing near this bracket include the Valkyrie at $375, Glaive at $350, F8C lightning at $300
it also got nerfed because it was OP. They are balancing against cap ships not the current gameplay. They are thinking of what will the Redeemer do against a Polaris/Idris/Perseus. Not against your Connie
@@Monarch_GNSGyea, they screwed is over to protect the higher class investors. They robbed us
The Redeemer will chew this thing up like it's no one's business. First of all every shot the Redeemer fires at this thing is landing as this is a chonky ass ship and is thus a massive target to shoot at.
Secondly, sure the Redeemer got a size reduction on it's manned turrets and sure it lost a shield, but it now has a flight characteristics that are more like a Vanguard than the previous flying brick feel it had before.
Thirdly, those size 5 manned turrets on the TAC don't like at all like they can be pointed completely forward. They even state in the introduction video that they provide great broadside coverage. That right there tells you that the main job of those turrets is to lay down support fire for the soldiers deploying out of the drop-down jump seats it has.
With how big the starlancer is im suprised the bigest vehicle it can fit is an ursa.
It has a dumb liiving space with a pool table sucking up so much space it is wasted.
@@RazSkull673it’s also a deep space ship, if it was in real life that space would be used constantly on month long voyages. Cig is just keeping with the realism, these would probably be paired with a dedicated cargo ship with more space for vehicles
@@RazSkull673 Pool table is so stupid I wish they left it empty so I can put my own furniture there my wife loves the living quarters though
It has been confirmed to be able to fit a Storm
The redeemer got nerfed because it was too strong. Im a redeemer fanboy. I pledged the ship, but i can still admit it punched way too high up for its size.
Crazy the TAC is the same value in the pledge store ($330) as the Redeemer. Also, cheaper than the Valkyrie ($375). I would have liked to see maybe two Furies with some unique docking, but the bay looks to have some potential.
I think the starlancer fits between categories. You could compare it to a Connie or a 600i or the larger ships like in the video. I think the TAC will be a great explorer as well.
Concering the 2x S5 turrets on the TAC... I reckon their default position is 45 to 90 degrees out the side, so they can face forward but it will be at their most extreme angle, so while yes, their point forward, it will be awkward and limit to trace targets directly ahead. They will probably perform best as broadside cannons.
That’s true that’s why I want to fly it and check it out first
@@marcuswynn89 I'm only guessing, I could be wrong. I'm curious to find out too.
@@marcuswynn89and yet you first released a video with a controversial title like this before even knowing the real performance of the ship.
@gabzsy4924 okay and?
@@marcuswynn89 and you're generating drama and controversy around CIG without even having the full picture. Not a quality I want from a SC content creator, not healthy for the community and game. I'm all about criticizing CIG and aome of their practices but before you do it, you better know what you're saying.
7:34 considering the turrets down there can't fire up at all pm and the tac is heavy and sluggish, it does rely on that initial damage burst in a fight
The Redeemer is closer to the size of a Vanguard so it's basically a "heavy" vanguard that now is a gunship with an anti-fighter role, a mini hammerhead. It's still a gunship and it's target role is merely different.
I am so excited to see the Misc refresh. They're finally giving the Misc brand love and providing them real value. I'm becoming a fan.
That said I purchased the Max with a CCU to the TAC. The TAC gameplay and feel is where I want to be.
It's a pity we will have to wait a bit longer for the TAC, but at least we can test fly the MAX during the AEE event. Which well let us get an idea on the handling. I do like what the ships bring to the Table but the TAC is certainly more interesting. It's always hard to tell a Turrets range of motion in Star citizen. If they work like the Corsairs side turrets that should give them fairly reasonable forward, side and bottom coverage.
Still even with two people 6 size 4 cannons facing forward is pretty good. Probably not the best overall design fora 'gun ship' and I would be more apt to call it an assault ship, maybe more for ground attack like the A2 but it still has enough space for loot and other fun things. TAC is certainly taking the redeemers place for the new tank at the very least, it was a tough nerf but it really had too much defense, firepower and speed for a ship its size.
Having a dedicated fury is kinda neat though and I am sure you will likely be able to fit a few more in the back if you wanted to be a pocket carrier. I will be interested to see if the side loading cargo lifts on the MAX are wide enough for fury's if parked length wise. That would be pretty funny. Hidden snub carrier. :)
Having a ship you can spawn in is really good no matter what because of all the accidental death that happens in this game.
The size had nothing to do with it. If you take the cargo bay and stack the habitation and engineering space of the other medium multicrew ships they will all be more or less the size of a Redeemer. The Redeemer is a specialist ship, like a Hull A. Nerfing the firepower and protection of the Redeemer is pretty much the same as nerfing the cargo space of a Hull A because it is the same size as a Nomad. Those ships are specialists that give everything in order to be able do one job. They can only do one mission, so they should be the best at it.
@@CptFugu I think it's fair to make that argument. I never really had too much of a problem with the redeemer but compared to other ships with its level of fire power it was on the small side but had twice the shields.
While I can't pretend to be in CIG's head but I feel since its specialization was combat and the corsair suffered a DPS nerf too They seem to want to give larger ships more of a reason to exist. It is frustrating because they often change things before they needed to, would all of this been better after the engineering update or armor to make the larger ships more attractive to players instead of being fighter dominant rather than forcing the issue now before the changes? While a bummer it's not out of character for them.
The redeemer was always destined for gross changes since it was from TNGS TV show they put on (aka, designed by fans) and never quite fit their bill. I feel like none of these complainers even know that history, but I'm (unfortunately) an Original Backer who's been in it and waiting for 12 years.
I feel for redeemer folk, but it's not nearly as bad as the disgusting switcharoo they pulled with the 'stella Phoenix, (another thing new backers have no idea about), so my sympathy is limited.
the TAC is coming over the next 12 months, only the MAX arrives with IAE
I melted my Corsair for the Max, but depending on whether the Fury hanger can fit a C8, I think I'd get better use out of the Tac.
They should have made a tactical/dropship variant of starfarer. Remove the tanks in the back extend the vehicle/cargobay with private quarters and medbay along the top. The starfarer just looks like a tactical dropship where the tac seems like a planetary exploration ship.
the Starlancer is just shexy.
They gave us the Firefly. I am happy. Now give me my UEE environment coat that they implied would look like a browncoat plz.
I did the upgrade from my Corsair to it but didn’t apply it yet. I need to see it fly or at least the max before I make any decisions. I just don’t like what they did to the corsair seems weird, but I’m not completely giving up on it yet but the extra fire power from the turrets and the med beds along with the small increase in cargo capacity with a hanger for something small too is very enticing. If it was a RSI ship, it would be a no-brainer not really into MISC But this one doesn’t look too bad to me. I guess we’ll see.
The corsair still has more dps for the pilot than the Tac.
@@andrewboyer7544 yessir
Tac has jump seats on the bottom and crew habitation up top. The redeemer was a poorly laid out derp boat before the nerf. Now at least it's faster, smaller turrets can track better as well lol.
the starlancer as a series is just so freaking cool. i love all three but I think ill def get the tac and the build, I cant wait to try it out first and see how it flys
I think Corsair may have been nerfed for the Guardian. I suspect it will have big pilot controlled guns.
2 size 5s and 8 size 3 missiles supposedly
A fully manned A2 with an anti fighter cannons would be sick!
1 Redeemer has not been nerfed and is now more useful for his role.
2 The Starlancer TAC is not made for the same role as the Redeemer regardless of whether we compare it with its old or new balance.
The Starlancer TAC is positioned between the Valkyrie and the A2. It is a heavy drop ship made to defend itself in big battles before arriving at its destination, it is not made to attack.
3 If you only see the usability of a ship within his fire power you have all wrong. And in a fight between a Redeemer and a Starlancer TAC, the Redeemer have more chance of winning why ? Because the Redeemer is more mobile and is close to not have any blind spot, the Starlancer TAC have a big blind spot in his bottom/back
We won’t know about the starlancer tac until we actually fly it so I’m not going to say if it’s better not until then
More like m2 the a2 is like a heavy bomber once reloads are implemented you'll drop the cargo for more collosus bombs
@@Warsheep2k6 You are totally right !
The redeemer did get nerfed. It has significantly less firepower now.
@@artsolano6762 I don't see it like this. What's the point of having more fire power without being able to apply any damage because you are too slow to be at range from your targets ?
by next IAE, the s5 guns will be s4, and all other guns will be s3... and they'll take the med beds out. gotta make room for the new better ship they'll need to sell.
True 😂😂😂
but still, it would be a good ship !
I hope not the shields on all the SL ships are poo compared to others in their class. this ship would never be used again😂
I think you nailed it. We all know that this is how CIG works…
I am curious on how this thing flies and how double the shields of the corsair with downgraded to 4x size4s would do for ERTS. Trying to find something to replace my Corsair with as the way they nerfed the guns was dumb and no one wants to sit in the co pilot seat to click fire on a gun they can't really aim that is front firing.
This ship seems positioned right bellow the A2 in the ranks of firepower. I'm fortunate enough to own both the Tac and the A2. If I have to choose I would take the A2 any time of the day. I don't understand how most people don't see how useful the A2 really is. 200+ SCUs of cargo means it completes with the Starlancer Max, and all without having to split its cargo into two different bays. A crapload of S5 armed turrets in the belly makes for some seriously devastating firepower. People complain it's all in the belly, but are they aware that you can roll the ship over in and within seconds a closing in fighter will be face to face with those turrets? And then there is ability most of these people think is the only thing the A2 can do, which is bombing the crap out of Jumptown. Which just doesn't get old! The ship is like a blend between a Connie Taurus ( A2 has 200+ SCUs, Taurus have 170+), a Hammerhead (A2 has even more S5s, albeit the Hammerhead has them more evenly located), and a Retaliator (the A2 would using bombs instead of torps to nuke Jumptown).
Because of these elements I can't see the Tac completing with the A2. However, it is possible the Tac will be the best multi-crew bunker/ground assault ship dethroning the mighty Valkerie of that title. It will be very good at multi-crew ERTs, and VHRT too. The Fury adds well to its firepower. And if that hangar could accommodate a Cutter Scout, the this ship would make for a great exploration ship too. A Carrack on a budget! Lets see if that turns out to be the case.
With the way the Redeemer flys now, I can't call the Redeemer a total nerf. It was actually just put into a correct class. Prior to this change, the damn ship moved stupidly slow.. And for it's size, it made 0 sense. So cutting down the weapon sizes, removing the mega shields and speeding it up puts it against the type of ships it was meant to fight in the first place. Fighters, bombers, small and medium sized ships with the capability to cause hell to large as well. I don't see this as a total loss nerf at all. In some ways, man it's a buff. But only to the people who use it right.
As for the Tac and Max, man I agree with you 100%
The A2 has the best of both of those ships. The cargo of the Max and the firepower "plus much more" of the Tac. That's probably the hardest thing I'm struggling with on buying a Starlancer. I own an A2. I just don't think I need a Starlancer because of that.
If you have an a2 you really don't need a tac the a2 does everything better
I like the TAC it was upgraded from my nerfed Corsair the only one thing A2 and C2 will still be useful to move the Bigger combat vehicles like the nova and anvil platforms witch is only till the ironclad assault
Except the corsair wasn't nerfed it just now needs someone to man the harpoons
I dont think theres any chance that the size 5s will be able to face forward. They will be limited to broadside(borderline useless) and ground attack.
I think your right regarding ground support
I would say if it flies like a 600i side turrets that can look up and down are actually pretty useful, turns SO slow its hard to stay on target even against a freelancer sized ship
With regard to cargo, if it is a tank, can cargo for value rather than quantity.
ngl after flying the redeemer now i really like it. it flys like a super heavy fighter and packs a good punch. the TAC isnt an upgrade to that. the real upgrade is the Hammerhead. the TAC is a ground assault ship. it will be amazing for the worm raid. but it def isnt a competitor for the Deemer or hammerhead.
The Redeemer isn't nerfed.
TAC is 4x the size, smaller cooler, less guns, required 50% more crew to be at 100% capability, and will cost nearly $100 more once it's final ready-to-fly price launches.
I ended up melting my freelancer max, vulture and andromeda. Sold all my paint. I bought the crv for the lti and ship upgraded both my atls and the crv to the starlancer max and tac. Of course, added a little bit more money to it. Oh, bought the paints to go with the starlancers. I, then, bought another crv just in case the bld version is within credit reach.
My argument is that the TAC is why the Corsair got Nerfed, the redeemer... maybe, but I think that with the maneuverability increases, it would have been AMAZING if it kept the good weapons. with the nerf it really IS an attack Helicopter. it will be pretty good as and AIr to Ground assault craft. but it won't be the mini hammerhead it could have been.
Regarding the redeemer providing, they uped the speed and maneuverability I don't think it's too bad. You can't have it as a flying tank and then have it move like a vanguard.
Redeemer and Starlancer are completely different size and class of ships. Cruel to compare them.
Btw the TAC is not in active development, what is coming next month is the MAX, and after that is the BTL, the construction version, that was highlighted in the sips for the next 12 months, so we may not see the TAC for years
It says right on the TAC's product page that it'll be out later in 2025. The BLD is the one that isn't coming out anytime soon as it needs base building and crafting to be fleshed out more and implemented before it can exist.
@@Gofr5 Tier 0 base building is coming in the early part of 2025 -- BLD, Atlas and the Argo are going to be the small/medium/large base building tools for base building tier 0.
Istg this entire ship is a firefly reference.
There is only one compelling reason to get the TAC over the A2. It is rare that you sit in an A2 and say: "hey, this thing is too big to do this job".
yes i noticed this straight away as soon as i saw the stats its as clear as day
I refunded my star citizen account 8 years ago and lost "most" of my roughly $3k ship collection. Only thing i was able to save on an alt account was my veterans upgrade and 3 mustang omega packages.
So im in the process of rebuilding a more streamlined fleet.
Picked up a Tac, and will grab a Perseus for my multicrew support and combat ships, the Tac fills the holes the perseus is missing for me, more cargo, and med beds. So if they are flying together will be a nice combo.
My other ships are the F7A Mk1, Scorpius, Taurus (that i want to ccu to something else) and an Arrow (prob ccu this too)
Id like to get a F7A Mk2 if it becomes available to go with my Mk1
And the corsair... they wanted to sell a new gunship
Corsair still has more solo firepower then the tac, and the tac is likely going to have much worse handling and speed. why would a corsair nerf get people to by the tac. The draw of the corsair was solo power, the starlancer line does not compete with that.
Redeemer was nerfed because the community had been asking for it for a long time, wanting it to be maneuverable as the lore says, but it can't be as strong as it was and still agile, so they left it agile and nerfed the weapons, that's obvious
You don't need to be highly skilled pilot to slap hard with fury. Its so small yet stings like a bee.
misc ships are the most starwar-y in the game. their curvy ones look like mon calamari ships, and they've got two tie fighters, fury and guardian
it can't be because the Redeemer was over powered?
I bought the redeemer a couple years ago because it was unmatched, insanely so
before I bought it, I thought, the two size 5 turrets should really be size 4 turrets, based on the size (profile) of the ship
seems like it still has size 5s, truly nerfed... you guys will cry about anything
It really has nothing to do with tje Redeemer nerf at all. They arent similar sizes, crew capacities, or even purposed. One has NOTHING to do with the other. If you think a 7 crew subcapital troop lander whos effective firepower cannot even aim at its largest targetable surface (top rear), is comparable to a light gunship with 3 crew that can fly circles around it, you are insane. The redeemer is HALF its size, with NONE of its competing capabilities other than having turrets.
Reminder to everyone going in circles about the Redeemer vs the Starlancer: This is not a game. There is no balance, only placeholder systems to let you fly around and test the server. There is no final power management, weapons or turret tuning, systems we don't even know about, capacitors, etc.
The Redeemer could very well be able to shoot more damage per minute due to power distribution and capacitors than the Starlancer in the final game. The Redeemer could also turn better. It also has better turret firing angle coverage. It could also have better armor, which doesn't exist yet.
Just chill out. Enjoy the aesthetics and see what they do. Nothing in the game right now is anything but placeholder, balance and system-wise. The only thing you can count on are the visuals and style.
I think everyone can agree that Redeemer was broken as shit, but the nerf was a bit too much though. I'm fine with the shield/health degrade but at least let it keep the Size 5
no way, its cause it was overpowered. its essentially a up-gunned sentinal, a heavy fighter, and the tac is a large ship bigger than the conny series. so the heavy fighter should have less shields than a large-heavy-medical-gunboat-dropship-ship with a snub fighter hanger lol it makes total sense.
i agree with you tho
Honestly I think it got nerfed cos they finally working on Perseus, I mean it was very strange that Redeemer even had the same Components as a ship that's double in size that it, gun wise well bigger ships are coming to the game with Polaris then Perseus and Idris whenever, so it's logical that smaller ships with bigger guns will get smaller in my opinion.
thanks for this video, i'm thinking of swapping my redeemer for the starlancer tac. i'm still on the fence. wonder what size ground vehicle can fit in it;s bay.
Ursa is the largest size
I got the maxx cos can't stand the Taurus apparence and that's not designed for the new box sized beside 25$ from the Taurus can't say no
They didn't say the tac would be ready for IAE it's the other two variants that will be ready
There is no way they will face forward they are the same as the stupid side turrets of the corsair.
Corsair turrets face forward
@@GreatWolfBalistic They do not face forward enough to support any forward facing combat. Just to be clear I am talking about the cheek turrets.
How do you get the fleet viewer to work I have 7800x3d 64gb ram and 3080 and the site lags harder than sc for me unusable
People need to realize that THIS is the game. It will be in perpetual development. Ships will be meta until a competitor is made that needs to be sold. That's it. CIG doesn't care about making ships that make sense.
Tell me why 4 NDB30s create more damage than 4NDB30s with 2 Size 4 repeaters?
Because the sabre with ndbs is more powerful than an f7amk2 with 4 ndbs and size 4 repeaters on the wings.
The NDB 30s should be the same no matter what ship they're on. It's like saying an 62g 5.56mm round shoots harder because the mil-spec rifle brand is different.
Point is, CIG just makes shit to sell. That's it.
Basically: No.
The Redeemer is a much smaller ship. And if you look at it and at its size, you should realize that it freakin' overperformed by a lot.
TAC will get nerfed too
Tac owners will receive fury too?
Cig isn’t that nice
I'm salty because the corsair got nerfed and then they drop the starlancer with now more pilot firepower than the corsair has.
They nerfed the corsair over this for sure cause it would destroy it real quick..
I got a tac because of the medical beds.
The Corsair got nerfed to as a higher implementation of multicrew gameplay, it was to strong for you solo/no friend pilots.
The TAC has most of its features designed around multicrew.
"Too strong" the hornet mk2 would like a word with you sir. The corsair can be killed by a fury, speak not of balance here. 😂
The Corsair nerf was stupid . Multicrew in TAC operate turrets. The copilot in the Corsair pushes a button to fire a fixed weapon.
I've had seen some data mined leaks saying this ship would go at 100m/s scm speed.
If it's true that thing flies like a brick :D
but I want one though
I have had thd corsiar since launch so i have gotten use to flying a school bus
It's right in the MAX's Q&A. SCM of 115, NAV of 950.
The ironclad is why my tac got nerfed?
I dont feel there is much of a relative connection between these 2 ships. Redeemer nerf is just a sad situation in the short term. The Corsair nerf is way worse.
I upgraded my Andromeda to the Tac.
Dude, those size 5s are broadsides. They will not go forward.
The redeemer got nerfed as its overpowered. I dont see why people think otherwise
The redeemer was hardly a threat
@@marcuswynn89 redeemer easily killing hammerheads one on one while having the same amount of shielding as one. They where never designed as a corvette killer they where designed as a ground attacker and now a heavy fighter killer. With more agility and stuff i actually prefer its role now than before
and they made it the exact price of the redeemer so can't ccu the redeemer to the tac. dirty
They did you dirty
Meh the redeemer got changed because people kept whining it wasnt agile enough. Corsair was probably the one changed to allow the TAC to compete.
Could be nerfed due to the new ship. But I will say this, the size 5 guns looked way to big and stupid on the narrow redeemer.
Just like the hornets, and even the vanguards. The guns just look so big and stupid.
This thing is better than the Carrack
I feel like the Corsair got nerfed for this and wouldn't be surprised that the TAC is nerfed in 24 months
Maybe so
Wouldn’t surprise me. Could be why the Corsair got nerfed. All three are Gunboats in my eyes.
Tac will be cool but that’s a high crew count for a 600i sized ship, so I’ll stay away. May crew on one if a buddy needs it.
I can respect that
Personally, I think the Corsair was nerfed to make room for the Mirai Guardian. The Corsair was the 100% best choice for solo PVE bounty hunters which is where the Guardian will shine. The Tac is too far out, too big, too slow, and requires too much crew to be a real alternative for most Corsair owners to consider that upgrade.
@@lordsheogorath3377 i agree with you. but still the guardian wont be that good. bcus no cargo space. the corsair is still really good for that. i personally always liked the connies and used them instead. i have to say the corsair ramp is much better.
@@lordsheogorath3377 interesting. Wonder how strong the guardian will be. I bet a ton of vanguards will get melted. Wonder if it will be a solo heavy fighter or have a turret
@@eziiii3536 Many corsair owners don't use the cargo. They just go from kill to kill. I know a few people that avoided it despite the high dps because it flys like a brick and would welcome a smaller more dedicated solo ship with 3000+ dps other than the Ion and Ares, which both have their own issues.
Its probably going to fly like booty though.
I actual like the Redeemer where it is now. Its not the hammer it was before but its "good" solo and can absolutely demolish fighter groups.
I still miss the ild Redeemer but it flys so much better now.
I dunno.
The tac though is going to be more of daily driver/assault.
Probably going to fly like booty though.
The Redeemer right now is a PvE ship. As soon as you find yourself in front of a real player you'll figure out how inadequate its "improved" capabilities are.
And it sure as hell isn't worth its asking price anymore.
@@CptFugu So you are saying some of the ships are worth the actual asking price 😆 Dude none of them are worth anything. It's a protection ship. The old version just overwhelmed ships with firepower. No matter what they do some ship is going to be meta...
Almost all ships are pve in the game. Even in the 3.18 meta there was a handful of ships that could pvp . Nothing has really changed they just moved it to another category.....
At least it has a nuance to it and is probably the only fleet defense unit that can pursue. It's interesting now. It was op before...
That's ridiculous whiteknighting. If the Redeemer was "overwhelming"" at $330.00 perhaps we should erase the Starlancer Max, the Connies, and the Corsair. Some of which are about $100.00 less expensive and can deliver overwhelming firepower with a fraction of the crew.
Redeemer will get back to x1 S3 shield at some point, mark my words. It can't power x6 S2 shields. Requires 24 power pips. That's insane! 6 S2 shields are just as strong as a single S3. They'll give it a single S3 shield to fix its power issues. They have to. It's broken with 6 S2 shields right now.
@@Gofr5 6 S2 shields amount to 28,000 shield HP. The weakest S3 shield starts at 42,000 now, and the military ones range up to 60,000.
they will nerf the s"$£ out of this ship , Its the latest redeemer , but this time with a medbed. Sorry to be so negative but they will use it as an "I win" ship for a while , sell a load of them and then nerf it as soon as they have a new "gunship" to sell
sorry add on , The A2 is a dedicated ground assault landing craft , its why most of the guns are downward facing , drop the bomb , strafe the target area and then hotdrop the tanks .
Ahh well , we'll see how it goes
I agree with you, you can be honest here this isn’t a shill channel
the the MAX is why the corsair got nerfed
Im just so sick of paying hundeds for a bait and switch.
this ship doesnt really compare to the redeemer in my opinion , its a better version of a valkyrie
The Valkyrie is in a bad spot it’s not good at anything
Selling more hopes and dreams fomo speculative over-marketed crap. I've stopped all funding. Maybe when the money goes away they will feel like they need to buckle-down and finish the game instead of trying to have an entire career on one project.
And the cost the same and you can switch any ship at any time. Actually I recovered $25 going terrapin to starlancer. 😮
MM is realy sad, together with the deemer nerf that made me not wana spend more on SC. nerfing ships components is the new trend now, the TAC will suffer the same fate when the next gunship goes online. if im getting a ship now its gona be for looks and with store credits. i own both a deemer and a 400i so im just done. deemer was meant to be a state of the art gunship, and it was at sales when it could fly. i lost all respect for J crewe and yoki, hole CIG tbh. hype and lies.
Don't buy it , if you have a galaxy it does everything both starlancers do and its bigger
Galaxy cost more money
I do not agree. The Starlancer Tac seems like a pig.
It's just "the reason". "Reason why" is redundant.
Every Redeemer holder knows this. All you have to know is that RSI and MISC ships most likely won't be nerfed.
Yup, makes sense, doesn't ease the pain tho... I miss my tank Redeemer! And the S5 turrets!
Screw poopersmode!
I get that folks have to at some point buy-in to Star Citizen just to immerse themselves in the fantasy. However, the sooner you become disgruntled and move on the better for your mental health and wallet.
Soon as we saw the Redeemer get nerfed my buddy and I both said that they were gonna do this. Mark my words that in around 6 months the Redeemer will be buffed again as soon as sales dip off.
Next year, a new ship will be the reason why the Starlancer TAC got nerfed!
This is the cycle
They will nerf the Starlancer when the new best ship goes on sale. CIG is a marketing team first and a game developer second.
like normal. we nerf a ship then sell you solution lol and ppl buy this shit up its funny, idk why ppl buying ships. you gonna need to save up to buy shield tokens. you will need to spend 100's a week for them
Whatever keeps the money rolling in
The Redeemer was massacred. It is now completely incompetent for its intended role.
Well it makes a good paper weight
Tier 3 med bed is minor heals. Tier 2 and 1 are respawns
Tier 3 med beds (all medical beds) allow respawn. Tier 2 allow respawn up to, I believe 30km away, and T3 up to 20km away. I mean, at least for now.
DUDEEEEE... I had no idea Chris Roberts was removed from Freelancer for the same BS we are dealing with. Holy effing shiat man. How is it possible for this to go so far?
Look up digital anvil some time. A lot of the same names are involved, or have been involved, here.