4 mix NIGHTMARE! DON'T make this mistake 🚫
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- Опубліковано 2 жов 2024
- In another informative video Taryl goes over this Stihl 4-Mix backpack blower that if you aren't using their oil, bad things are gonna happen! A lot of the time you can get away with using other brands' oil but not when it comes to these certain model STIHL backpack blowers. Taryl's got the know-how to keep you informed on what to do in order to avoid this costly catastrophe. Happy New Year to all you Grass Rats out there and we hope you have a safe and wonderful day. Now There's Your Dinner!!
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As a Stihl dealer with many years of experience I think I can address your two main concerns regarding the 4-mix blower models plus add some insight into Stihl's reasoning you may be overlooking. I've sold hundreds of 4-mix blowers over the years ever since they were introduced following the success of their 4-mix line trimmer engines in the early 2000's. This engine design was forced out of Stihl as a result of governmental regulations and Stihl was unprepared at that time and had to source first generation RedMax strato-charged engines for a few years until their engine was ready. Stihl's 4-mix blower engine is a low RPM/high torque hybrid design combining two and four stroke technology and plain bearings are common to four stoke engines. I have never seen a caged roller bearing used in the small end of a con-rod in a Briggs, Honda or Tecumseh four stroke engine. The wrist pin bearing doesn't rotate thousands of RPM like the big end bearing. It only rocks back and forth about 30 degrees. The wrist pin bearing in Stihl's 4-mix line trimmer engines probably is some kind of needle or roller bearing because those engines are lower power and higher RPM. Now on to the cost factor, the MSRP for the 4282-030-0411 crankshaft is currently $443.99. This price does not reflect their 2.5 % bull!#*t charge which we would first add to our cost and then use a multiplier to achieve a resale price of $455.08 resale price. This is a complete rip off rendering any repair uneconomical. However there are complete engines available for all 4-mix blowers, BR600 uses part number 4282-020-0201 which has an MSRP of $199.99. Unfortunately this is not a full margin part and we would have to add 2.5% to the cost and use the same multiplier to achieve a resale price of $247.69 plus tax and about one hour labor. At this price we will make a reasonable profit and economically repair the customers blower. Stihl came out later with their version of the Strato-charged two stroke but they can't use that name because Husqvarna acquired the rights to that name by buying RedMax from Komatsu-Zenoah. Stihl instead uses the name "low emission two stroke" which they use on all their blowers smaller than the BR500. That design of engine does require a roller wrist pin bearing. Next year both of these low emission blower engines will be come obsolete in our area in favor of battery electric tools that are underpowered, heavier and double the price of their gas counterparts. Our shop is located in goo goo land where unelected eco nazis fine you for watering your lawn, ban the use of barbecues and fire places on days they deem as poor air quality, force you to use all electric (no natural gas) in new construction. And on and on, they won't be satisfied until commercial landscapers and home owners are using all hand tools like the Amish. Getting back to the main issue, Stihl 4-mix blowers will run trouble free for thousands of hard use hours if synthetic oil is used with fuel rated 89 octane or higher and it does not have to be Stihl's ultra oil it can be Echo red armor for example. I hope this clears up some questions or maybe raises more questions.
So you are blaming the gov. regulations that STIHL put a cheap ass bushing instead of a roller bearing in? I don't buy that shame on Stihl. I think Stihl is just like Mercedes Benz they are killing themselves. I do believe you that gov. regulations will force us all to use hand tools again maybe the internal combustion engine should never have been invented as in the end it might kill us all.
(Wiss) Thanks for teaching me about this one thank u.Taryl .
I can't speak for the br600 and above but I can say that my br430 has worked flawlessly for over 8 years. I also have 2 stihl backpack blowers at work (15 to 20 years old) for cleaning the parking lot and none of them have ever had a problem. We always use 89 octane with stihl or echo oil, I really believe this makes a difference. I also agree that those communist dems need to get voted out.
Please comment on Amsoil 2 stroke oil? Not affiliated, but just wanted mechanical or engineering take on it.
im sick of this eco-nazi BS. i will NOT be buying electric outdoor power equipment. i guess if my gas sthil FS90R quits and i cant source a replacement unit, i just wont be weed wacking anymore. the electric outdoor power equipment are more expensive to buy, the batteries are expensive. you WILL spend more to do the same job, the equipment wont last as long, and it wont have the same capabilities or run time. my FS90 is 14 years old but it can still clear out heavy brush. it is starting to get old though
I worked as a small engine mechanic for 10 years and 99 percent of major failures was because of cheap or improper lubrication. It amazed me everytime, that people spend good money on the equipment and then would buy the cheapest oil they could find. And then argue with you about the oil until they came back with a failure.
Yeah it's best to run what ever the manufacturer recommends the engineers that made it knows better then the people buying it always go OEM for engine components
@@davidaix5771 Or OEM equivalent that's mysteriously at least a third less in cost
Motul 800? Ester Core supposedly sticks to metal surfaces ensuring lubrication.
@@williwonti OEM equivalent lmao, do you even know what that means?? It means someone decided to slap an "OEM equivalent" label on the cheapest product they could possibly make.
@@bobbygetsbanned6049 Oh, bless your heart
A good way to break in the new year with a Taryl video.
Looks like they used old drain oil from a car for mix. Thanks for the video Taryl. Happy New Year to you and the crew!
In any case, their choice was the wrong one.
I keep repeating it over and over: Aspen or Stihl four stroke fuel in combination with Amsoil Saber. Or the Stihl mix. You get a filthy but healthy screamer with this fuel and oil.
It is also important that the engine reaches operating temperature.
And you have a beautiful engine that will continue to work cleanly for years.
Quality quality quality.
Exactly what I was thinking. The rod and crank are so sludged up it's like they were running the highest carbon oil they could find, aka used engine oil.
That's what they look like inside no matter what oil is used and why they don't last long.
@@laurapalmerTDGE I dont like Saber oil, burns dirty. I use Motul 800 offroad 32:1 mixed with the Aspen fuel for storage, and regular gas for long use. Everything is clean and burns with no smoke. The lifespan of my top ends is unmatched with this oil.
A good synthetic 2 stroke oil of any brand doesn't cost a fortune. He just lost hundreds of dollars by saving pennies on oil. I hope it was worth it for that cheap azz 🤡🤡🤣🤣
Man them Stihl guys crapped out on us.. send blade man and throttle round to open a can of whoop arse .
I've been using the Walmart super tech 2-stroke oil in all my echo equipment going on 20 years I never had any problems with any of my echo equipment I had two Stihl blowers I bought in the past and they both died within one year I will never ever buy a Stihl Blower again they are junk and designed to fail with that being said I do have a stihl power pruner that I've had for years with no problems. Thanks for all the videos best mechanic on UA-cam
15:24 I LOL'D so hard!!! I moved away from Stihl almost a decade ago when I had a couple of 4mix products. Didn't last too long so I moved to Echo. Stihl is vastly overrated even if Slippers uses the right oil and shakes it up! LOL
Is there a chance that they thought it was a four cycle and didn’t use a mix in the gas? Man, that’s a crank, piston and a new cylinder. Plus a gasket kit? That baby is toast, the hand cleaner you had to use was worth more than a Stihl backpack blower. Hard to believe until you see a plastic cam and lifters.
Thanks Taryl, I hope you and the guys and everyone watching to have a great New Years! 🎉
The lifters are not plastic and that cam gear basically never wears out. Ive seen the cam worn out once in about 1000 pieces of stihl equipment. Ive seen wrist pin bearings and bushing fail far more often. The one with worn cam had been used all day every day for years and years on a farm.
They did use some kind of oil in the gas. Just look at the sludge on the piston and crank shaft
Love watching and learning thank u👁️♥️👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
I’ve had many many of the stihl equipment over the years. Never ever ever had an issue with anything I’ve ever owned. Chainsaws, blowers ,weed wackers. Etc.
always used their 2 stroke oil. And good gas too.
Pay the extra (Pennie’s) and save later.
Also always starts better.
For ANYTHING at home, we use premium gas, treat it some wih seafoam or some other stabilizer ect, and then if its 2 stroke or 4 mix, use a quality oil. Aka Sthil stuff. If we go through 20l of gas in ayear that's it. Spend another single dollar on good oil and gas and don't have problems. Yeah its not commercial we don't run through thousands of litres of gas, but id think reliable dependable machines is worth more than breakdowns ect, expensive repairs and replacements.
@@baileyhatfield4273 I’ve only been using stihl platinum oil and recently changed to Amsoil saber since I started to use a lot more fuel. My Br600 has been flawless for the last 10 years. Apparently people don’t realize when the manufacturer says you’re supposed to use a specific grade of oil they mean it. When the cheap asses use the cheapest oil that they can find and their equipment fails. They blame the manufacturer instead of themselves, so they saved a couple pennies on their maintenance and now they have to buy an entire new unit.
I have a fs 250r 2 stroke and fs 90r 4 mix. Both are at least 16 years old maybe older bought them new. I’m not a commercial land scaper Just a home owner with a lot of acreage. I’ve used motomix or truefuel. I’ve never had any problems with starting or carburetor problems. Same with my blower and chainsaw. Use a good oil and the right mix and you will have less problems. Always enjoy your video’s Taryl .
Me either . My fs76 trimmer is 26 years old . Been used horribly hard . Runs like crazy.
@Bailey Hatfield dont use premium gas in small engines... READ YOUR MANUAL. More expensive does not mean better.
I’ve had a BR600 for over 10 years and it’s been flawless. Use the right grade of oil and mix it correctly. That’s all these need. If your gonna be cheap and use the wrong stuff this is what you get. All I’ve ever used was Stihl hp Ultra oil or amsoil saber. Good oil isn’t cheap and cheap oil isn’t good.
Lol, y is cheaper oil no good genius??
@@13panda13 cheap oil doesn't hold up and doesn't handle heat like higher quality synthetic oils can. You can see that engine was carboned up bad on the piston where all the heat is located. That's a sign the oil couldn't handle and stated to degrade and fail.
@@13panda13 you get what you pay for. If something is cheaper, there is a reason for it.
@@Boobtube. I think that's BS con the consumer, make them your DUMB-ASS mentality .... I'd say they're no longer designed in Germany, but they pull the same S*it
Yeah ive been using these br 600s for 10+ years commercially and have never seen this. Infact ive had zero issues with my blowers. The clutch on the fs 111r and 131r line trimmers i have had issues with. After 2 years of solid use the clutches start to seize up .
Having to mix oil for a 4 cycle seems dumb to start with. Why not just run an oil pan like normal 4 cycle??? Dumb.
Exactly. I thought maybe the idea was all the equipment can run the same mix but no, it needs special mix. Dumb.
Mini 4 stroke with oil sump and splash lube is the way to go! My 4 stroke troy Bilt weed wacker is still going after 15 years!
Same here. 13 years for mine.
They know that, this is designed to fail as soon as the warranty is up. Built in obsolescence
Stihls page on this engine states it has no pump or sump. I'm not a mechanic, but it seems to me if you're expecting the intake system to live the bottom end, it's not going to work for long.
@@tonysheerness2427 I’ve owned a br600 for over 10 years without fault. Good oil and the right mix is all it takes…
My Honda mini 4-srtroke weed eater is 23 years old. Run like a champ. Starts 1st pull.
long story short buy echo
It's easy to source inexpensive needle roller bearings with outer shells e.g. a HK0810. They are used in exactly this application. It avoids needing a hardened connecting rod, which allows cheaper, lighter alloys and problems with cracking. It's also possible to bore for a hardened chrome steel sleeve and plain needle bearing, but that combination tends to be larger diameter.
Hello and happy New Year my friend. The only reason I can think is that the bushing is probably about $0.23 cheaper than the bearing,go figure huh. Have a great new year and I look forward to seeing more videos
Actually my theory would be that they did this to *Force* grass rats to buy their oil.
24 cents 😲😳😂😂
The BR600 has actually been a great blower for nearly 20 years now. But they aren't bulletproof. The inside of that engine looks nasty, like they were running drain oil for the mix or what was that graphite oil from the 70's? I haven't seen that bushing as cause for failures, usually if it's worn out it's due to other factors. The BR600 is also sensitive to being over-revved for extended periods, The easiest way to kill one is to hold the nozzle too near the ground, or block the intake with leaves allowing it to over-rev by a few hundred RPM. If it doesn't slip the exhaust guide, it will eat the bushing in the small end of the con-rod.
40:1 mix with good oil designed for air-cooled two strokes, and these engines will live a LONG time.
OH, BTW, they have changed the cam gear a few times over the years. They seem to hold up fine now. There is also a compression release built into it which was occasionally failing early on.
A guy down the street does landscaping. He put 8x BR600's out on the curb. 2 I got running within a week, just carb stuff/fuel lines. the others more serious. Ebay a year ago had brand new BR600 motors for 125 dollars. it's an art just getting the blower fan off. A piston stop is the only way w/o breaking anything, never use air tools.
Good info. I'm glad my Stihl blower is a 2 stroke model. Happy New Year!
😏TOP NOTCH INFO !!! THANKS and HAPPY NEW YEAR to you all !!! 🎉😍😍😍😍😍
Needle bearing up there will wear out also if it's not getting oil. Good to know about the special oil.
The whole chain saw con rod is heat treated, it’s purple on the end from running hot. Dirt bike con rods are the same and when they are new the color is consistent.
I just wanted to say Thank You, I learned a lot from your videos. I think showing some of the homemade tools you use and how you take things apart has helped me the most. I am a machinist but I work on a lot of small engines. Happy New Year from Canada.
I've been buying Husqvarna products, Backpack Blower, Chainsaws, Weed Wacker for years with out any problems. Had one Stihl Blower,that was enough.
We use mostly Stihl equipment and their silver/grey oil. Have never had an issue with lack of oil problems. There is another channel that swears Stihl oil is junk. The stuff he pulls apart is usually all gunked up like this blower you pulled apart. I am starting to wonder myself if that could be true.
A couple of channels are against that Stihl ultra crap.
@Michael Howell that stihl ultra crap is amazing actually. It will break up carbon from valves. It has decarbonizer in it. It is actually really nice oil.
I've Been Rebuilding Motorcycle,Atv and Marine crankshafts for many years Taryl,If Stihl offers a connecting rod kit then that crankshaft could be rebuilt,you would still need to either re-plate or replace the cylinder but then ur going to be getting into another 250 or so on the re-plate cost and all the other gaskets,seals,ect so now I can see where it's just not feasible to repair,even if you can do the majority of labor yourself.its a shame these companies are producing equipment that's kinda a throwaway deal when a major repair needs to be performed.
1. Reduces production costs.
2. Sells a lot of oil.
3. Punishes those who don’t buy their oil.
4. Increases resales among those dumb enough to buy another one.
5. By the time the company’s reputation has been destroyed, those responsible will have moved on to other jobs, destroying other companies, in service to increasing short-term, bottom line gains.
Certainly plausible, except for the last point. Stihl is family-owned. The people making the decisions aren't going anywhere and probably want the company to remain successful for their kids.
I just started replacing all my Stihl with Shindaiwa/Echo. Used to run all Stihl, (3)Saws/(2)Edgers/(4)Blowers/(2)Hedge Trimmers (2) String Trimmers but this is bull$#@& and I'm never buying another Stihl product again. Just bought a $600 Shin EB910/RT today.
I have a 2 cycle motor and I've only mixed the incorrect ratio maybe once but luckily it didn't do no damage to the engine. Once I burned up the 1 gallon I mixed incorrect I went back to using the correct oil mixture. The only thing I done to it was put in a brand new autolite 2974 spark plug in it last month for the upcoming season.
Taryl, can you do an experiment with the blower? You try doing the heat treatment on the connecting rod & try to find a needle bearing that will fit. Get oversized rings & bore the cylinder out & see how long it'll last. I think that would be a GREAT experiment. Take us along for the ride.
might be easier to just find a rod that is close to fitment that needs boring out or using one from a chain saw since most manufacturers use the same parts for as many applications as they can, like john deere does with their lawn and garden stuff used in farm implements.
That rod looks like aluminum, so probably no way to modify it (as well as the cylinder, which is most likely nickasil coated).
Can't bore a Nikasel coated cylinder.
I worked small engine at a farm store that sells stihl. I thought all their new stuff was junk. We had to start every new stihl when it was sold. 20% of brand new stihl right out of the box would not run properly or not at all. I was constantly fixing brand new stihl equipment.
We also sold echo and i don't recall a single problem with any of their stuff. Rarely even had any echo stuff in for repair and echo has a much better warranty.
Thank you for saying that It was the same way at my former Shop and a good 20% came back in a few days not working rough running and the sad part all the blowers chainsaws trimmers and so on they were all had the same problems.... as for echo not one problem right out of the box they were ready to work with no issues
My buddy manages a major landscape company. I'm not even sure how many guys they're up to but it's got to be 50+ at this point, so they have a huge sample size. They switched everything (hundreds of pieces of equiptment) from Stihl to Echo and have been much happier. Far fewer repairs, less downtime, and less issues with carbs especially.
Carbs need adjusted out of the box, thats nothing unique to stihl. I have to adjust brand new echo carbs straight out the box too. If its a 2 stroke carb with removable jets than it needs to be adjusted even when brand new. It takes 30 seconds if you know what youre doing. This is not a stihl problem; this is how all 2 stroke carbs are. You do realize these are shipped everywhere in the world and geography impacts how an engine runs? More or less oxygen in the air due to elevations can make an engine run different. This is why big box stores like ace hardware should not be allowed to sell stihl equipment. Their "techs" do not know what theyre doing.
@BigBeansM3 you know whats funny? Stihl owns Zama corp. Zama makes all stihls carbs. Zama ALSO makes echos carbs. So one manufacturer (owned by stihl) makes the carbs for both echo and stihl. Yet you want to pretend like echos carbs are better? Lol. Just lol.
@@bluejene2146 yes a little adjustment out of the box is normal. What isn't normal is all the brand new Stihl that needs parts ordered to make sellable
They do this stuff so you go out and buy new Same with vehicles
Presisly
Planned obsolescence
Thank you for explaining this failure. The Four Mix oil and how they designed these engines to run efficiently on it .
Great as always. Wishing you and entire cast a healthy, prosperous, and safe new year.
What a stupid reason to run your company's reputation. If they had any sense, they would cover this under warranty.
That blower is over 500.00 at the stihl dealers where I'm at..
Glad i have a older blower..thanks for the info Taryl..
Happy New Year everyone..🍻🍻🍻🍻🍻🍻🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
Ah, glad I saw this one.
I had this happen on a BR600 in October
happy new year for 2023
As always the working men and women getting screwed again by companies excellent video taryl thanks.
That's partly true, but it still doesn't change the fact that knowledge about oil and spending the extra money for the right oil.
@@powderriver2424 that’s just an assumption.
Milwaukee did this with their best 1/2 impact at least they replaced the poor redesigned new one with the old model “A”
@@lawnmowerdude Not really an assuption, we all seen the video, no engine should look that sludged up, rather gritty looking using good oil. Bad design, plus bad oil, 2 wrongs don't make a right.
If they made them idiot proof they would be four times more expensive 😢
I have a few questions. 1. Are Stihl moving away from the 4 mix design because it is a pup? 2. Can Slippers go to the youtube site where they teach you how to say it properly. "Steel" is not it. 3. if the oil isn't getting up to the wrist pin then it would not matter what oil is used as non was getting there. Even the correct oil would not work. The design is not allowing oil to splash up. Will petrol with ethanol in it promote oil separation as water may accumulate from condensation?
Did not know that the piston wrist pin uses bushings in these larger Stihl blowers, good to know. My Still BR600 blower is running strong after 15 years.
Mines been going good for over 10 years without a single problem. Good oil and the right mix, that’s all it takes. Apparently some people don’t understand. Oil is important.
Thanks Taryl. If I see one of these Stihl units for sale dirt cheap, I'll stay far away from it. BTW: HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!!!!!!!!!!
Makita 4 strokes have oil in the crankcase, works great.
And Slippers has a Kawasaki hoodie on! Excellent dig on Stihl for going cheap.
Happy New Year Boyz- this is the first thing I did this year is watch this video and now I know the year will be great! All the the to you all!
The good people make brilliant videos thank you 👁️♥️👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Having made engines, there is nothing wrong with silicon Bronze bushes for a wrist pin. However it does have to be lubricated and as you and many others have said modern engines require the correct oil or you are gonna pay. As Scotty says oil is cheap engines are expensive. Very good advice we should all heed.
"Having made engines" Were these "engines" loaded, running at 10,000 rpm, and share the rotating weight seen here? I build engines, and I would never use bronze bushings for anything that has ANY linear movement. Physics.
@@JosephPPreston Yes and they worked for 50 years and still going today. not 10,000 RPM though. I was chief design engineer at RN Diesel Engine Company Ltd. and also at Cosworth Over the road they built 1000HP racing engines and they did 8-10,000cRPM and they also had silicon bronze gudgeon pin bushes. I also knew Fletcher Jones of FJ Engineering that had designed most of the pistons for todays engines like Toyota, Peugeot, Rolls Royce, Gardner, Lister BAE systems. Cosworth made forged pistons and put a lot of development work into design and testing. There was not much they did not know about pistons. You are probably using one of their designs and most manufacturers copied everything.
Rev up your ENGINES!!!
"Need the right oil" - said another dumb sucker...
Mixing ratios are more important than any brand of oil will be.
short block???? Have you seen the bronze bushing on thefan cracking ? never mind the bolts snapping on the muffkin..list goes on with them brs....echo has its own problems also
they did it for the same reason that everyone else is using bronze bushings, its cheaper and they want you to just throw it away and buy new.
Oh I have a BR600 so I have a bushing I guess. Well its expensive, but since all my Stihl is for home use I buy the motomix. I just need to get in the habit more of shaking it up.
4 mix, all the disadvantages of a 4 stroke , with all the disadvantages of a 2 stroke
I think the issue is people don't maintain anything. If it has an oil sump pan ect, nobody changes it, if its 2 stroke, people use horrible oil, and then well yeah the 4 mix. Problem being the user error most of the time. Don't mix it right, use the wrong oil ect. Small honda utility motors i've seen people not change the oil to the point where the dipstick (not an actual dip stick, just a cap really) melted and the motor seized. It takes all of half a litre of ANY oil at that. A motor vs a 5 dollar oil change.
@@baileyhatfield4273 nobody wants to accept that they are responsible for the problem. They want to pass the blame on to the manufacture because of their ignorance.
I run a BR 800c and ALWAYS run motomix in it for this exact reason!
Why did they even make a 4 cycle engine like that without a crankcase for motor oil
Wow learned something new today. I've never heard of the 4-Mix. Crazy. A 4 stroke that takes premix? What's the advantage? Usually the advantage of four-stroke is not having to mix gas. And a two-stroke being lighter/better power to displacment ratio.
I have had problem with Stihl oil gumming up the muffler, exhaust port and rungs really really bad especially if you mix it a bit rich. I switched to Klotz R-50 synthetic.
To much idling not enough full throttle. Which is also bad for these engines.
Interesting. I’ve noted in RC gas engines larger engines generally use roller bearings and around 50:1 oil. Smaller engines might use bushings, but might call for 20:1 synthetic oil mix.
Some of the small rc airplane engine don't even have that some just have a a ball joint which connects the Piston to the connecting rod and then on the crankshaft side there's just nothing
@@davidaix5771 Yeah back in the glow days Cox .049, 0.010 and the like used a ball on the end of the rod and a socket in the piston. More recently nitro/glow fuel has become obscenely expensive, while electronic spark ignition became smaller and gasoline engines quickly took over giant scale. Less oil all over everything, no need for a glow plug driver, no need for an electric starter. Then they started making inroads into smaller and smaller scale. Typically a 55cc engine or larger has roller wrist pin, but smaller ones down to 15 or 17cc seem to often have a bushing.
These days there are few left in the hobby in my neck of the woods, and Li-Po packs and brushless motors are becoming more common even in large scale.
@Jeff in TD yeah I have a few coxs engine laying around some baby bees and I think one or two surestarts
@@davidaix5771 Yeah, me too. I still fly glow, but not the little Cox engines. I did start one a while back, and kicked around building a vintage kit…
The whole idea of using a premix lube system on a 4 stroke design seems questionable to me…
I've been running Echo oil in mine no problems yet I hope it didn't hurt it I've been using echo in my echo machines for years
Lack of lubrication is a killer. In the automotive world they will deny you warrenty on internal engine repair if you don't have service records showing you used the correct lubrication. Happy new year guys 🎉
They deny warranty when you can't spell it and use emojis.
Slippers is quick witted!! 🤣
Engineered obsolescence for turnover and a cash grab.
Man, I´m blown away by this shit. Stihl used to be the best, at first when the 4strokes appeared I thought they made it because You don´t burn oil anymore, I thought it was to be good to the environment. Turns out it´s just good for the shareholders.
When I worked in gardening we only used Stihl 2strokes. They never broke when used proper. So now I´ll tell everyone to stay away from them 4strokers.
What a shitshow. Happy new Year, Buddy!
Happy New Year Taryl! I bought a BR600 used a few years ago from a lawn care company and have never had any problems like that and it's been used commercially and abused from commercial use. I do use premium 2 cycle oil though, only major repair I had to do on it was reseal the engine because the seals were leaking bad causing it to run like crap but after resealing the engine it runs like a champ now!
i never understand why a well known name equipment manufacturer cheapens out on parts such as this, the high paid CEO should take a pay cut. STIHL IS CRAP
what a shame. this is why I do Echo now.
Lots of engines use bronze bushings or no bushings at all in small end connecting rod but maybe not the best choice for mostly constant full load application like blower (most of the time it's running it's at full throttle). If unit runs hot, maybe Stihl needs to work on cylinder cooling air flow. Stihl probably saves a few dollars on each unit using bronze bushing vs needle bearing. Would be interesting to see engine teardown of same unit with confirmed Sthil oil used. Interesting video. Thanks
Owners just need to use good quality oil and mix it right. Ive owned a br600 for over 10 years without a single issue, Stihl platinum oil, and Amsoil saber.
what they need to do is just make a bigger version of the BR400 and forget this 4 mix cr@p...
Didn't all the early lawn boys use bronze bushings?
Ever since I first touched one of these 4 mixers I thought they were junk. Low reving vibrating junk. Give me a 2 cycle blower/trimmer/ pole saw anyday. Reminds me of early Polaris 4 stroke atv engines 425/500s cam failures. Company/ techs tried blaming it on operator and bad oil and come to find the cam and rockers were not heat treated correctly.
They sell crap
Thanks Taryl, I have that same BR600 in my shop right now making that same noise. I will give my customer the bad news. 👍
The high mix rate of gas to oil these days don't leave much room for errors. That's why I still use 40:1 or less even with good oils.
The earlier 2 stroke back pack Stihl 420? was an absolute gem .
My FS 130 brush cutter is also very reliable .
Agree the later back packs are junk
As long as I can remember I alway shake up my two stroke gas can. It really just became habit for me to make sure my oil and gas is mixed.
I've seen that oil for that backpack blower and really never knew what you would use it in. I would hope if you bought this brand new there would be some kind of warning tag to let you know what you must use.
Mine gets mixed just riding around/ sliding around in the bed of the truck, same as normal gas that gets sloshed around so its always mixed ready to go lol
When you buy stihl equipment the dealer will tell you to use stihl oil and if you buy a case of stihl oil at purchase of unit the warranty is extended by several years. People know.
Great, I just took delivery of an 800C, sidestart model, they extended the warranty to 4 years, if I purchased the stihl 4 mix oil and made me sign that I was aware the unit specifically needed that oil. Luckily, it won't be used for anything big, just wanted to have a big azz blower😂.
TARYL, The model's operation manual states; "If you mix the fuel yourself, STIHL recommends STIHL HP Ultra (2-cycle) engine oil." Under "MOTO MIX" It goes on to say that STIHL recommends using "Moto Mix" instead of user mixing the fuel and oil. In addition, it reiterates that the use of "STIHL HP Ultra 2-Cycle Engine Oil (or equivalent) designed for use in AIR COOLED engines is recommended. IMO, this information should have been listed under an instructional and operational, "WARNING!" notation in the operator's manual. Still a very piss poor design though...
It seems Stihl has stated that in every manual at least over the past 20 years.
"HP Ultra" is (AFAIK) the only oil sold by Stihl that can be used at 2% on machines that do real work all day long.
Husqvarna also sells Husqvarna HP oil which is exactly the same crap as Stihl HP, it seems that what manufacturers can't earn by selling machines they try to earn by selling cheap oils... but if people do not want to buy the expensive oil recommended by the manufacturer, they will not buy oil of the same quality and equally expensive from another manufacturer, they will look for the cheapest bottled oil they can find so they don't have to get their hands dirty with used engine oil.
Actually I don't know anyone crazy enough to put used oil in the fuel mix but I know a few who use it for the chain and when they should sharpen it by the fourth time the chain is already too stretched to be used again, but they say they're saving lots of money 🤷♂
I work at a municipality we buy two stroke oil from a box store and instead of the Stihl oil they buy this other oil, it's synthetic we have Stihl blowers when they die they just get another, they don't buy commercial versions they get the home owner ones.
Simple u said it ! Why fix it when it’s cheaper to replace it! That’s these manufacturers goal
Take the bonze bushing out and insert a hardened steel bushing of the correct size and a needle bearing. Total cost 25$ in parts and 140$ labor. Do it. I dare ya. I double dog dare ya.
Been running these for over 15 years, new plugs and filters, good oil, good fuel and adjust the valves…. Never had one quit. Same I’m with the trimmers. Also use the blower at the farm tank after tank.
@Jeff Rust or they are the same that don’t change their oil 🤣
Hey, Taryl Fixes All. Considering that the cylinder was damaged along with the busing in the connecting rod, would it make more sense to replace the whole short block? I have watched a couple other videos on these blowers, BR 600 and 700, and another thing to look out for is the engine pan on the bottom has a tendency for the bolts to back out and cause a leak. That can cause the pan to wear out. I personally own a BR600 and I only use the HP Ultra oil, and I will say that I am impressed with how it performs.
That's what happens when the engine design engineer identifies as a donkey. Lol Happy New Years Grass Rats
They sell crap
And the 4 stroke stuff Husqvarna makes actually has crank case oil on them
Encountered this 2 years ago. I work on them at my work and thought the same way. Garbage! Why they didn't put a wrist pin bearing in is beyond me. The BR 450 has the bearing in it .
Actually it is a bearing, it is called a plain bearing.
Been using Supertech full synthetic 2 cycle oil and VP full synthetic oil for 20+ years never had a problem. All full synthetic 2 cycle oils are JASO rated. My dealer said I couldn't use it because it was not good but my JASO FD rated oil is better than Stihl JASO FB rated oil and 1/4 the price.
Probably Ran on Used Motor Oil Mix out Of The Customers 1965 VW Bug 😩😩😩😩😮
That's what I told um
🙈🥴😂
You would think they would have Needle bearing bottom line still saving $$ and making you spend $$$
A lot of Stilh's are CARB compliant and run bad. Avoid ALL of those if you can. My state doesn't require it but many dealers sell them any way. Their longtime customers aren't buying from them anymore.
I'm guessing they used a bushing on this engine because it's a 4 cycle and not a 2 cycle. 4 cycles tend to run at a lower rpm. I'm just guessing, but they may have considered that. Great learning video Taryl, thanks bud
In the motorcycle world 4 cycle 600 to 1,000 cc street sportbike engines red line at as high as 17,000 rpm and higher off the stock showroom floor.
They run at the same speed. They just have an exhaust note that is exactly half of a two-cycle (because, of course, a 4 fires every other revolution).
Thanks.
Great job Taryl!
I sure hope Stihl sees this video.
NO reason to not use bearings in this.
Do you really think all that black crap would properly lube a needle bearing??? WHY did they not use a crankcase and oil, with all STEEL parts--no plastic?? Cheap to make, and expensive to repair!! Junk? YES!
Actually there is a reason Thermal expansion effects needle Bearings more than solid Bushings. Solid bushings can conduct heat better than needle Bearings. The Emisions system is designed on these blowers to burn Fuel more Quickly at higher temperatures, to reduce Carcinogens in the exaust.
Slippers snikering always cracks me up
A bean counter discovered they could save a few cents on manufacturing, thus the problem.
They sell crap
I like Slippers' bane of Taryl's existence.
From what I discovered during some research is that the Stihl ultra oil is synthetic and the older 2 cycle oil is not synthetic. The synthetic oil will not gum up inside the engine as seen in the video and because it is synthetic and very slick and very thin, it lubricates the areas as designed by Stihl...it gets to where it needs to be inside that bushing etc. Use what they recommend and save yourself the headaches of downtime and YUGE costs in repair. Thanks for the video, direct and blunt information for the thick headed.
Great info guys, Happy new year 🎉 👍🏻
Happy New Year Taryl and family !!!!! And to all my fellow grass rat !!!!!
Bummer I love my br700. Not looking forward to this issue. Also time to go stock up on the 4 mix oil
They use a bushing because it's cheaper to use and it increases their profit margin. Thank some company bean counter for that mess.
They sell crap
Economies of scale would argue against going to a completely different process than what you use for every other product your company makes.
Ive worked at 4 Stihl dealers the last 22 years and my feelings are its over rated trash these days for most of their stuff. They cut corners, its harder starting than most other brands, and unless you get high end trimmers they vibrate through hard plastic handles instead of rubber. Their commercial saws are decent but not better than Husqvarna now. Ive done dozens of short blocks on those 4 mix blowers, all with wrist pin seizure because they didnt use full synthetic oil plus one had a rocker stud break off. The BR550 was junk from the start with fans too aggressive that bogged the engine down plus they were exploding. That was a big secret when it first happened the tech dept wouldnt tell me at first. I would never own Stihl anything. My personal trimmer is an old Kawasaki KBL23A which was the best ever, and my back pack is a Shindaiwa EB802 and I have a 1995 EB240 hand held with a zillion hours on it still running great although the plastics are faded and trashed. Tarryl you have to find an old F series Briggs to get running and post a video of. Neat little engines!
I've had so much trouble with my Stihl BR800.
I bought it 2 years ago.
First issue: Hip starter/ recoil failure.
The threaded section of the engine casting snapped off.
(I had to start the blower with a drill and nut on the crank.)
Second Issue: Muffkin falling off.
It happened several times and melted all of the plastic around it including the gas tank.
Third Issue: Carburetor linkage and ignition wiring gremlins.
Fourth issue: The constant movement of the nozzle while blowing pops the handle and tube off occasionally.
Stihl is garbage.
There's yer dinner!
My br800 is fine, and my br600 I’ve had for over 10 years without fault.
I'm a high school teacher, the school district grounds keepers had 2 stroke Echo or Stihl blowers, before. Two years ago the school district bought these 4 mix Stihls. From the beginning, they sounded weird, obnoxious, louder, had a different exhaust tone, and a vibrating like noise. I can barely teach when they're working outside, even with my door closed.
Some idiot was blowing in the middle of a road at night with one of these and got hit by a car and died. Then his familys lawyers filed a lawsuit because theres no sticker on the unit that says to pay attention because its loud. What a crock.
A 4-cycle engine that uses two-cycle oil mixed in the gas sounds like a stupid idea in the first place, in my opinion. I would not buy anything with that kind of set-up.
Better fuel economy and noise. Both massively better on a 4mix that a 2 stroke and can be used in any orientation. Downside is valves need adjustment but for mid sized mini engines which are slower reving much better. Fuel has cost and in some markets it is a high cost.
I stopped buy there high price junk
I prefer 4 mix engines on string trimmers. Got rid of all the 2 stroke junk.
@@fibreguy1971 Also Less carcinogens in the exaust.
And they sound like shite