Had to reupload cause I was an idiot and forgot to fix some stuff…but in any case, there’s one thing I wanted to mention, but I cut it out because of the Remaster release! When it comes to the FSN VN, a common question is “which version should I read?”. In short, there are two* versions of Fate available. -The first is the original 2004 release. It’s the OG, complete, unabridged story, but the key thing is that FSN was originally an 18+ eroge (aka adult material) novel. From what I could research, Nasu originally didn’t want to include adult content, but Type-Moon was insistent that the market had no room for a non Eroge novel. This could be an urban legend, so feel free to let me know, I also wouldn’t be surprised if this were just baloney. -Later, Fate was re-released as Fate/Stay Night: Realta Nua, which is an updated remaster that retains all the core story elements, adds some new content, and includes voice acting along with updated music. But this version was rewritten to replace all the 18+ content with new scenes. This has some…mixed results, which I’ll explain in a bit. Now, while it’s easy to say “just read the version you want”, it should be noted that the OG VN is, for all intents and purposes, impossible to get. The Realta Nua version is the one that gets ported all the time in Japan, and while the worldwide release isn’t out yet, it’s almost certainly going to be the Realta Nua version. I’ll see for myself and update this note once it’s actually out. It’s also the reason I omitted this section from the video. But that said, Realta Nua is by all means the “canon” version of Fate; I know everything in the Nasuverse is canon, but in many of other nods and references across the Nasuverse almost always refer to the Realta Nua version. As for the OG vs Realta Nua changes, there isn’t a real consensus, and it depends on who you ask. As for my two cents, the adult content in the original is honestly written really poorly, and scenes that should be emotional or intimate just come off as comical in my humble opinion. There’s a place for adult content in the story, but I do wish it were just given proper respect and effort. However, the Realta Nua replacements have a broad range, ranging from “awkward and clumsy” to “this is actually really cute”. There is one scene in particular I vastly prefer to the original, but the rest is pretty hit and miss. …BUT, the most important change when it comes to OG vs Realta Nua is in the form of Heaven’s Feel. There’s an argument that Fate and UBW don’t really need adult content, but Heaven’s Feel has adult content as a pretty major focal point, and the Realta Nua changes make for a story that has less impact and stakes in my opinion. The story still works and is still incredible, but I think even the average reader will read the Realta Nua version of Heaven’s Feel and notice scenes that were blatantly darker or more intense. However, in the meantime, there is one option available to prospective readers right now: The Fate Stay Night Ultimate Edition. This is a fanmade version of Fate that has the best of both versions, and has many options so that you the reader can customize the experience how you see fit. If you want to experience the OG VN text with updated visuals and the Realta Nua soundtrack, it’s an option. Or if you prefer the Realta Nua text but want the OG Heaven’s Feel text, and a mix of OG and Realta Nua music, that’s a-okay too. It’s my preferred method as well. For what it’s worth, all the footage you see in the video were my recordings with the Ultimate Edition. It can run on toasters, it looks gorgeous, and it’s definitely my preferred way to experience Fate/Stay Night. I intend to buy the official version to support Type-Moon, and I encourage others to do the same, but I think the benefits of the Ultimate Edition are too good to pass up. I can’t link it here in case the Type-Moon ninjas get on my case, but I promise you the Ultimate Edition is easy to find, and easy to install. Just be sure to support the official release when the time comes. Also go read the Tsukihime Remake! It’s finally out!
BRO. I *LITERALLY* put my heart, soul, and time into that comment I left man! Oh well. Guess I'll have to do it again! Also finally got my limited edition of Tsukihime 2 days ago!
@@Angras_advocate18 I've heard he didn't even *write* the H-scenes and some of the metaphors were less Narm sounding in Japanese. Still didn't find them nearly as bad though.
I've also heard that allegedly Takeuchi was the one pushing for H-scenes, and may or may not have wrote them lol. I also wouldn't be surprised if the translation probably doesn't do them justice, and at the end of the day, it was a net positive, so can't really complain to be honest. I guess ideally I'd prefer either well written H-scenes (like Hollow Ataraxia...as I've *ahem* heard...) OR better replacement scenes with more effort, if that makes sense.
Everything Nasu writes is his Magnum Opus fr Part of what makes Heavens Feel my favorite Route (Aside from the fact I love Horror) is how it completely flips the pre-established Battle Royale formula on it's head, before revealing just how meaningless the Holy Grail War itself was from the very beginning The Fate Route establishes the Holy Grail War as a Battle Royale, it establishes a Formula where the Heroes meet and subsequently defeat a new Servant, one which is repeated through Unlimited Blade Works, albeit with some major changes Then Heavens Feel comes along, introduces Zouken, and now suddenly there's this Terrifying Shadow Monster running around and half the Servants are dead within a Week Then at the very end, you find out the Holy Grail was created NOT for the purpose of granting Wishes like we were told in the Fate Route, but for the purpose of becoming a Gateway to the Root of Akasha, and it was literally corrupted by the Concept of ALL EVILS OF THE WORLD during the Third HGW
Couldn't have said it better myself. While I'd love to give a super in-depth reply, the most I can say is I 100% agree, and once I get a few other projects sorted, I can't want to get into HF in detail. While Fate is my second favorite route, HF is where FSN really shines in my opinion, especially with the drama, psychological elements, and the way it turns literally everything we know about the Grail War on its head.
@@ViviVariety One thing that basically every Spinoff forgets is that Fate/Stay Night initially sets up the Holy Grail as an Omnipotent Wish granting machine, before pulling back that facade and revealing that initial portrayal of it to be what effectively amounts to a scam Illya says it herself during Heavens Feel, the rules are intentionally distorted and spread around to attract Magi into participating, the Einzberns basically lied to other Magi about the true purpose of the Holy Grail War Of course the Spinoffs tend to justify the Holy Grail being primarily a Wish Granting Device by being set in different Universes from Fate/Stay Night, but I think they’re still kinda missing the point
That's a really good point that illustrates something I'll likely explain in the follow-up in the future. There's a running joke that that Nasu wrote a story about heroic ideals, and then wrote the grail war afterwards, but it kinda has a point in that the HGW always seemed like a vehicle for something else. In Fate it's obviously Shirou, but you don't see a similar principle in other works besides maybe Prisma Illya. But 9/10 times, the HGW sets the stage, but it's not used as a means to explore something more interesting.
Really have to reread the VN one of these days, especially now that there is an official translation. Regarding Shirou, besides his ideal of becoming a hero of justice what drives him is guilt for being the only one saved in the Fuyuki fire. And I think each route balances them out in the end differently. For example, Fate Shirou finds those orphans in the church which reminds him of all those who died in the fire. He and Saber are then presented by Kirei with a chance to use the Grail to undo the events that shaped them into who they are. But Shirou finds his guilt similar to Artoria's where she blames herself for everything that happened to her people. So he finds strength in himself to move past his guilt so that Artoria can as well. He rejects the grail and Saber does so as well. Later on, Fate Shirou does his best to become a hero of justice, but from my understanding he no longer does that out of guilt, but purely because of his ideal. UBW Shirou never has that moment, but he is instead presented with a cruel future of his path to becoming a hero. His confrontation with Archer forces him to rethink his ideals, and Rin helps him deal with his survivor's guilt. So by the end, UBW Shirou is still driven by both his ideals and his guilt, but both were tempered by Archer and Rin. Saber, if she decides to stay, also looks for an answer along with Shirou on how to deal with that same problem since she doesn't move on from her guilt there. Heaven's Feel Shirou is a polar opposite of Fate Shirou, where he abandons his ideals but his guilt is a lot worse because of Sakura. Not only because he couldn't save her until the very end, but also because of how many people died because he decided to save Sakura. So in the end HF Shirou fully abandons his ideal, but is instead driven by enormous guilt. And love too, but that's true for all routes.
*Ladies and Gentleman, today I anounce, after more than 800 hours playing Fate Stay Night...I realize my greatest wish all along, was to be in saber's place and be boned by SHIROU EMIYA* *Stay Night meant what I wanted Shirou to do, Unlimited Blade Works is what I want IN, and Heaven's Feel is when I achieve Ataraxia, as my defenseless ceases to be hollow as he fills me* *Exaltation of the Beloved Shirou, I mean, he IS the lady of the lake, providing weapons to saber and all. He is avalon itself, lady of avalon...Arthur is the King, Long live Queen Shirou*
MASSIVE SPOILERS FOR HEAVEN'S FEEL AND HOLLOW ATARAXIA BELOW: . . . . . . . . . . . Kirei saw himself as a being incapable of being good, consisting of nothing but pure evil. He was desperate for an answer to the question why something like himself existed and what his purpose was. His reason for wanting Angra Mainyu to be born was the faint hope that maybe a being made out of all the worlds evils could show him answers to this question. "What would such a being do? What purpose would it find?" I will never not find it absolutely hilarious that Hollow Ataraxia answers Kirei's question of "what would the pesonification of all the world's evils do if it was born?" with: -Posess Shirou and try to corrupt him. -Slowly but surely become corrupted by him instead. -Rediscover your love for humantiy that made you qualify as a heroic spirit in the first place. -Fall in love with the daughter that Kirei abandoned. -Sacrifice yourself to save the woman Kirei betrayed an murdered. And last but certainly not least: -Become a hero of justice. If Kirei could have seen that this was the answer, he'd had a fucking aneurism.
That's a super cool observation I never put together! It sort of makes HA the perfect rebuttal to Kirei's whole ordeal because it shows that it's possible to be "born" evil, but still have the capacity to grow and change. I wonder if it implies that maybe Kirei wasn't beyond redemption in some way? I guess by the time we meet him it's too late, but had he met someone like Shirou (or even Claudia) at an earlier point in his life, maybe he could've let a different life.
That is the magic of Nasu writing, the way he write the routes and while you go futher get more an more lore, and have your misteries anwered all of them when you get the final ending.
I remember when I just entered college and really wanted to get into VNs…. I looked around for recommendations and landed on trying Tsukihime. Absolutely fell in love with it, then a few years later the fan translation dropped for FSN and I KNEW I had to read it. This stuff has stayed close to my heart for a decade now. I’ve read so many VNs, I think it’s hard for me to decide between FSN or Little Busters as my favorite. LB had me in tears man. Now I turn to dust lmao
I also started my Fate journey through the anime and then the vn. And I think the main issue the anime adaptations have is that, if you haven't read the vn or know someone who has, some things will be really confusing. For example, these are some questions I got when watching the animes for the first time, that the vns explain: -Watching the ending of Fate Zero, without knowing what Angra Manyu is or knowing the backstory of the Holy Grail Wat, will really add more questions than answers -What really made Saber gain strength to fight Berserker in the original anime (although it was a +18 scene so I don't blame them for skipping it) -How in the original anime Shirou defeated Berserker with just one blow even though Berserker needed to be killed several times -Why in UBW they mention that Projection is worse than Enhancement (although this is more of a nitpick, as it isn't really important to the plot)
The OG anime you can kind of hand wave some stuff as retconned/ignored because of the later release of Realta Nua, but Zero is a huge thing that needs some kind of context for sure, ESPECIALLY the ending. Look, I'll get to Zero someday, and I generally still have a positive opinion on it, but I had no idea what the hell happened at the end until I looked it up. Zero was absolutely meant to be watched after reading the VN, even Gen Urobuchi says as much lol.
At least those questions are not super important or anything, like, yeah, it's good to know, but they are not crucial to understanding what's happening. Now.. the Heaven's Feel movies? Holy S-! they rushed, ignored and even changed so much that anyone now familiar with the VN is going to be completely lost. The movies do such a bad job adapting HF that they don't even explain well what Heaven's Feel even is. Illya is basically non existent in the movies until the last one even tho HF is all about Sakura and Illya. They are the protagonists of HF. The movies are good spectacles, 10/10 animation and fight scenes, but they fail really, really hard as adaptations. Which is sad because Ufotable UBW anime, while it had issues as you pointed out, was still a really good adaptation, and their Fate/Zero anime adaptation is one of if not the best Light Novel adaptation. They blew it out of the park with that one.
I think what's also frustrating about Zero is when you look at Fate's adaptations and spin offs, it's one of the best and has no major "issues" like Stay Night's. Deen being...Deen, UBW being good but not really delving into the inner monologues, and HF being rushed. Like I understand why people say "watch Zero later", which is something I express and what Nasu and Urobochi recommend as well, but for blind anime only viewers, it's hard to ignore that Zero just seems like the superior option.
i am a bit late and i usually don't leave comments but i just wanna say that this has to be one of the best videos on fate i've ever seen! its refreshing to see someone not focus on how "convoluted" fate is or only talk about the waifus, imo these days it feels like mostly due to fgo that's all people talk about and it makes me so sad 🥹 there is a LOT to talk about when it comes to type moon and their incredible characters and stories, it's sad people only focus on certain aspects of it. thank you for shining light on one of my favorite stories of all time and i hope that with f/sn being on steam more people will give it a try!
I appreciate that considering there's a lot of Fate videos out there! And I'm in agreement, like I know Fate tends to be talked about when it comes to epic battles and whatnot, but if you go back to as early as Tsukihime, the core was always something more real. Fate was simply the next evolution.
Ever since I heard the 2012 New Dawn in your FE Franchise and Gintama videos, always asked myself when you'd do a Fate/Stay Night video. And we're *FINALLY* here! 22:58 Bazett "These Hands Are Rated E For Everyone" Fraga McRemitz. Amazing. Everytime I hear the lines "Humans can't fight Servants" I look at characters like Bazett (with others) and say "Stop the cap, Nasu." I always wanted to get into the Fate franchise but didn't know where to start. Always saw it as "That one anime series with the blonde knight in blue with the movie budget fight scenes." in the distance. My 1st step in the Fate/Nasuverse rabbit hole would be F/SN UBW Abridged by Project Mouthwash (My *CLOSE* 2nd favorite abridged). That along with Melty Blood lead me to my *real* 1st step, the Tsukihime manga (Which I read in October 2020. Fitting, no?). To say I fell in love with that manga would be an *understatement.* Basically sold my allegiance to both Shiki Tohno (favorite Nasuverse MC) and Arcueid Brunestud (Favorite Tsukihime girl). Then I found the original VN and played it. I *LOVED* that VN! Imagine my reaction when the remake was officially announced the day I finished the OG in its entirety (Then I shortly followed through Kagetsu Tohya afterward). Wasn't until July 16th 2022 that I FINALLY got the F/SN Ultimate Edition VN to work on my laptop. That VN was a *TRIP!* If I wasn't already mesmerized by the VN's budget increase from Tsukihime, then it was the cool and memorable cast, awesome moments and visuals, and the amazing OST by KATE. Followed that up with reading HA, and that was also a pretty great fandisc sequel! Wasn't until earlier this year that I watched UBW's ufotable anime for the 1st time in its entirety. I know you said that the anime can't replace the VN and all that, but Vivi you *GOTTA* admit that ufotable went *above and BEYOND* to give the VN justice and then some! If they cooked this well for my favorite route, I can't wait to see what they did with my 2nd favorite route HF! And yeah, now I'm a dude who's just got his limited edition for the Tsukihime Remake, need to read more of Mahoyo before the movie comes out, and stuck in the FGO Rabbit Hole/Trap. Now for my 3 favorite OG Servants: 1. *Archer.* 2. *Lancer.* 3. *Rider.* Can go into more detail if you wanna ask...
Well the humans can't beat servants are just the mages' rule Seevants can be beaten via magecraft but the thing is its hard as shit so its more safe to just let the servants fight each other and the masters take care of the other masters instead
May I ask why Shiki is your favorite MC? I don't know many people who would say that, and since I haven't read Tsukehime yet, I'd like to know the appeal.
@@missharpieful I'll give you two main reasons: 1. His Mystic Eyes of Death Perception. A really cool power to cut basically *ANYTHING,* but unlike Ryougi's his is a lower grade and because of that it's got a HUGE drawback when used. And yet despite that, this dude can take out the big shots of the Nasuverse with them just by being a dude with a switchblade knife. 2. His view on the fragility of life. Thanks to his eyes he feels like nothing in this world matters since in his words "the whole world could perish in an instant". Because of that, he holds on to the believe on the importance of living a good life and he does what he can to preserve and improve the lives of others. It's something I can really resonate with in a way, personally. There are other reasons, but then we'd be heading to spoilers.
This is, hands down, the best introduction to Fate I've ever seen. You said a lot of things that, while I knew them and already agreed, I'm not able to say it as well as you did. Great job!
This is a great video! Visual novels/novel games are my favourite medium for stories, and I love Fate/stay night so very much. Shirou and Saber are two of my favourite characters of all time, including a whole chunk of the rest of the cast too. It’s such a shame that the medium is so niche and hard to sell at times to people. Like you’ve said in the video, I just want to share this wonderful story (and its sequel) with everyone! Hope to see the official localisation bring in more people to the novel, and Type-Moon’s other works. Maybe the VN medium as a whole too. I’m glad to have found a high quality video to send to any friend who becomes interested in Fate, but is scared away by its ‘confusing to get into’ reputation.
I appreciate the compliments! I'm in agreement that visual novels are extremely underread compared to other mediums...which is why I absolutely intend on doing a much longer video for prospective readers in the future! I feel as if people enjoy games like Disco Elysium or any long JRPGs, they'll likely love visual novels for much the same reason. At least, I'd like to think so.
To bring you some joy i just finish the tsukihime a piece of blue glass moon remake that came a couple months back and am now questioning for my next visual novel to either fate stay night or witch of the holy night both of them i want to read through at some point but im taking a small break with visual novels for now.
I REALLY appreciate that you did not spoil who saber was at the beginning. Yes that secret is common knowledge but just like Star wars with the Darth Vader reveal, there are still people who are experiencing it for the first time.
It's definitely one of those things where 90% of people aware of Fate know who Saber is, but you gotta acknowledge that there might be someone out there who doesn't know, and oh MAN is it such a sick reveal. Seriously if I had a time machine I'd want to experience FSN blind because it must have been wild seeing the skyscraper fight for the first time. Luckily nowadays I think the build up and the way Saber's identity is treated during the Fate route still makes it a sublime experience, but still, to go in blind must have been so cool.
my experience with fate is kinda similar with yours, although my motivation to start the vn was a bit different. Started with zero then ubw back in hs since thats apparently the popular way to start the franchise. Fell in love with it and I realized the HF trilogy was in the second movie, I started the vn because I knew I couldnt contain my excitement if I have to wait for the final movie. Then I cried, alot, reading the damn thing. I hope the official localization will turn anime only people to people who fell in love with the series, just like what it did to me.
Same mate, I like that now we can actually tell people 'hey just buy the novel on steam!" instead of giving them a guide like the old days. Plus, if the official release sells well, maybe Nasu will release Red Garden already!
@@Iffyschatos sorry UA-cam doesn’t let me send links for some reason. All u have to do is go to my playlist section & save it to yours it’s next to the share button
Thanks for the video man. I was first introduced into the Nasuverse through DEEN Fate/Stay Night. The anime leave me so many question and thanks to a few interaction online, where I got schooled on the source material, I decided to jump into the visual novel. It was something else. No Ufotable adaptation or any other came close. Although I must admit because of my love for the original visual novel makes me completely avoiding the sequel, the Ataraxia. I am, for the lack of better words, are afraid. I am afraid Ataraxia will ruined Fate/Stay Night for me. You convinced me to take a step into Ataraxia. Hopefully Aniplex/Type-Moon will not take too long for Ataraxia re-release.
I hope you enjoy Hollow Ataraxia! I had the same apprehension at first, especially since I didn't think I'd like a SoL novel at all. But I'm glad I was wrong in the end, HA was such a great experience that only made me love FSN even more.
Awesome video, sending it to my friends whom I've tried to convince to start Fate for months! Maybe they'll finally cave. My first experience with Fate was the visual novel, but exclusively by watching a playthrough on yt through my small ass phone screen since I didn't have a means for downloading it otherwise (and I didn't know the Ultimate version existed). From there I got into all sorts of Type Moon works cuz honestly it's some of the most interesting premises I've ever read. Shirou remains as one of my favorite characters in all media, maybe ever, and I don't see that changing anytime soon. A few years ago I finally downloaded the Ultimate version and I was screaming everytime anything mildly hype happened, it felt so good to go through it again. Kirei says "Yorokobe Shonen"? I'm replaying that shit 10 times minimum. Kojiro and Saber square up? I'm doing high jumps of excitment. The gang's cooking it up in the kitchen? Tears in my eyes. I also experienced all the bad endings and Taiga dojos, which were new for me, so that rocked (not so much for Shirou tho rip my king). Hollow Ataraxia was also a yt walkthrough experience but I've always wanted to really play it, with the minigames and all. So I'd like to ask, how did you go about it? Is there a site or smthn where I could get it? It's unfortunetely tough for me to buy games, and while I will probably attempt to get fsn remaster off steam, ataraxia is only just announced, and it'll probably take time for it to drop. In the meantime, I would like to go over it again ("proprely" this time). So help in that regard would be very appreciated. Another question, how would you say the remaster compares to the mirror moon translation? Is there a big/evident gap between the two? I never had too many issues with the fantranslation but I have seen quite a few people saying the official is a big step up in quality (although Altria remains to haunt us smh).
So while I can't put the link here, I will say I just "legally" downloaded Hollow Ataraxia off a site that sounds like you go "Nyaaaa" like an old timey Italian mobster if you catch my drift. However, what I might recommend is waiting for HA either for the official remaster, or an "Ultimate" edition that is currently in the works, although I don't know if that changed due to the official release coming in the future. For a while, the version I played HA on was the OG 2005 one with no voice acting and all, but just before recording footage, I did find a beta version of an upcoming HA Ultimate Edition. It's perfectly readable, but its also a little buggy; like there were times when sprites would fly up to the sky, or transitions wouldn't work, and so on. I actually used the Ultimate Edition of HA for my footage, but I did have to edit around the buggy parts. I think right now I'd say it's worth waiting for a more stable version, whether that'll be in the HA Ultimate Edition, or the official release. Also, I haven't gotten a chance to read the FSN Remaster yet, but I have seen a few screenshots and it looks nice. It definitely looks more "readable" than the Mirror Moon translations, which is nice...Altria aside, thank god for that mod that changes it back lmao. I'm still in the middle of finishing the Tsukihime Remake (about halfway done!) and my plan is to read the FSN Remaster afterwards to refresh my memory for the full spoiler video next year. Anyways, I know that was a bit long and probably not super helpful, but I hope it helped somewhat!
3:00 I went from Zero to UBW, FGO, the VN Fate route (because UBW left me feeling like I was missing out on a ton), Apocrypha, some more FGO, finally restarting and finishing UBW and Heaven's Feel in the VN like 2 or 3 years ago. Hollow Ataraxia I finished last year. FSN and HA are on another level compared to all the other works, it's genuinely shocking taking a look at the other stuff after reading FSN and HA. Every time I think of the VNs I kinda lament the stuff that we get now. Outside of like 4 chapters in FGO and some events, I feel like it gets just so draining, monotonous, bland, soulless for lack of a better word. It feels too robotic, too paint-by-numbers, yet too messy. I'm hoping Lostbelt 6 will change my mind but damn man I believed in the hype and got burned so many times (Shimousa, most of the Lostbelts...). I'm not sure why I wrote all this but I've been feeling like rereading FSN for a while and this encourages me 👍
This is the crux of why I think a lot of VN fans are so passionate about the novel. I was more aggressive about it in the video, but it's coming from a place of longing for something more from the Fate series. In my mind, it's basically: 1. FSN and HA 2..... Maybe Zero and Strange Fake? 3. Literally everything else. And there's a huge gap between 1 and 2. There's just something there about the writing quality, the character writing, and the way the stories unfold that really works, and it sticks with you long after you finish it. For me, the best example I could think of was that Zero and UBW, while still quite good, were like eating at a pretty good restaurant... And the VN was like going to like the five star equivalent of that same restaurant. It leaves you wanting more in a good way, and I think a lot of the best TM novels are like that. Hell, I just finished the Tsukihime Remake and now I'm in the damn Red Garden waiting room! Come on Nasu, hurry up lol. I know not all of the Fate franchise is of very high quality, and maybe asking them to match the VNs is a little too ambitious, but it's genuinely hard to enjoy some of the others sometimes because deep down you KNOW what the series is capable of. I think many Fate fans just want more from the franchise at times, and while it's fine to have some easy to consume stories and whatnot, more quality stories is never a bad idea either.
@@ViviVariety Dude EXACTLY. While going through Hollow Ataraxia last summer there were so many moments and lore convos (especially with Back to the Night playing, I loved that and Magic Hour which I appreciate you using in the vid :D ) that made me go "God I wish we get more/info of this stuff" and I would get a little saddened because we either ended up getting more or will get more, but it's in another series or FGO. It just about never lives up to or competes with the VNs. I can't help but feel like there is a pure sense of humanity to most if not all of the VN characters despite how supernatural they and their surroundings are. That is mostly what makes Nasu's works affect me so much and helps make Type Moon my favourite franchise alongside FromSoft's Soulsborne. Most if not all characters feel real and human to their core, no matter the supernatural and magical happenings going on in and around them. I legit find myself treating the characters like real people that I've talked to and lived with. Maybe this is normal and I've just not consumed good media before, but that was a first to me. I've never felt that way before. Even putting characters aside, there's such a strong sense of atmosphere, mystery, gentle darkness, and beauty in these stories, so many beautiful moments (it's hard to describe them but I think you get what I mean) and it feels like future installments never truly captured something that lived up to or competed with that. I would actually say the Zero and UBW anime still have my heart in some of these despite feeling really sour at Zero after the VN, but those were my entries to the series and nostalgia is one hell of a thing. As for FGO I loved Camelot, Babylonia, Solomon, Summer 3, and a few events. I read Camelot-Solomon early on in my Fate journey so I wonder if they'll hold up should I ever reread. Summer 3 seems like a silly thing to include but this damn event about writing manga for comic-con in Hawaii had characters and moments that genuinely touched me harder than most main chapters. I ended up finding out Nasu wrote this event and that explains a good bit. I'm with you that it's a little(?) wrong to ask other installments to match the VNs but I feel like the other bits of Fate that I've consumed are just *soulless* in comparison, for lack of a better word. And just like you said, we know and have seen just how much better it could be. Atm I'm holding out hope for Red Garden as well 🤝I think it was exactly a year ago when I finished Tsukihime RE! On the night of the 30th or 31st of August during the Super Blue Moon (kinda happy about that coincidence). I feel like I had more issues with Tsuki RE than FSN and I really didn't like Ciel's true ending, but it was still an awesome experience and I was genuinely happy with it after all the hype and excitement since its announcement
Man I just realised just how much I typed out, sorry :p I kinda want to bring up the bit about Soulsborne and Type-Moon. A good part of what makes Soulsborne so special to me is just how unique the worlds, characters, and designs tend to be. They almost always (DS2 was my entry point and I fuckin love it, but I genuinely feel like they really messed up here and often feels generic) manage to not be generic or formulaic and have a sense of quiet and unspoken dignity to them. It feels... respectful. Instead of something being plain horrible or nasty, you kinda stop and think about just how sad the transformation of that place or creature is. It feels like there's STILL something meaningful regardless of how awful it is. I always drew unintentional parallels between that and Type-Moon's human-feeling characters. I wonder if that sense of dignity is part of Nasu's well-documented love for FromSoft games. As an added fun fact, Miyazaki actually had a special message for FSN's 15th anniversary. So there is a non-zero that Leda is a Saber reference.
Great video my friend! I watched your knk video a couple years ago and really liked it. Glad your still at it! My guess is you are an Arturia Stan like me 😂 if I guessed right happy day! I got into fate in high school almost 20 years ago now, when Deen first came out so I had to watch through fansubs before localization. Despite deens problems I still felt some of the majesty of fate route shine through enough for me to continue having warm nostalgia for it even after I read the vn. Kenji kawaiis ost and of course the voice actors we know and love so well put their all in. My first nasuverse thing was unfortunately the tsukihime anime but the less said about the better 😅 it was a long time coming but I'm glad tsuki is in a better place now. Red garden when nasu?
What's funny is I wrote the script around keeping things vague because the full Nasuverse vid is gonna be more gushing about my favorite/ships but as I was editing I thought "nah, it's super obvious" lol. You're dead on though, I'm an Arturia stan through and through! I also kind of like the atmosphere of the Deen anime. The music is SO GOOD and I also really enjoy some changes, like the Triple Crane Wing and obviously Saber's farewell. One of my ideas in the future is to give the Deen anime another shot and possibly make a video on it, I think in some ways I had different expectations and my perception was radically different, especially since it followed Fate Zero for me. What are your thoughts on the Tsukihime Remake so far? I finished the OG novel during my honeymoon and good God, I could not be more excited for Red Garden.
@@ViviVariety so far I have only finished the arc route but I really enjoyed it! Besides a few minor things like ciels original role in arc route being replaced by new characters i think it was a straight upgrade. I'm starting on ciel route soon so hopefully it's good! Before you check out the remake I'd recommend reading the tsukihime manga through and through. Not only is it a great adaption but the author of the manga sasaki shounen is helping with the remake, so a lot of the manga original contents are carried forward
I actually read the manga! That was my intro to Tsukihime and I really liked it. So much that when I read the VN, I felt the manga version was, in my opinion, the better Arc route. I felt the characters shined a lot more, plus the ending was just too good. Reading the Remake though, I definitely see manga's influence in a good way. I'm a little over halfway through Arc's route and I love the additions so far. I definitely like it a lot more than the OG Arc route, so fingers crossed it keeps it up.
Heaven's feel in general seems like a perfect adaptation to me though? Of course the issue with a proper fate route adaptation not existing is there, but i feel like anyone having issue with heaven's feel adaptation is most of the time because they didn't get to see Sparks liner high, which is just a stupid expectation.
It's great for Sakura and arguably does her justice in many ways, but cutting out the Kirei and Illya stuff is too hard to look past in my opinion. Illya especially since she plays such a pivotal role in effectively being Shirou's one link to sanity and his only healthy relationship throughout the route. Also some things weren't really elaborated on and made things really confusing for anime only watchers. You get questions like "what happened to Shirou at the end?" like once a week on the subreddit because the actual Heaven's Feel ceremony isn't really explained, plus Shirou's memory loss is barely alluded to. Those are the two things off the top of my head. It's a bummer because HF is my favorite route, and I feel like the adaptation actually did a better job at nailing Shirou compared to UBW, but the cut content just sours my perception of it. Not TOO much, like I really loved the second film, but the last one kind of drops the ball in my opinion. First film is decent too. There's some minor stuff too, like I think it's pretty lame how Ufotable decided to go all in on Rider vs Saber over Shirou vs Kirei, but that's more of a personal gripe. I also would've liked Sparks Liner High, but let's be real, that was always just wishful thinking lol no shot we'd have actually gotten that. Overall HF isn't "bad', but I really think it should've been an anime. Maybe the material is too sensitive for TV, but there was too much to cram into three films.
Great video! Love your content on Fate and Kara no Kyoukai. You think you'll ever do a video on Tsukihime? I just 100% completed the remake and it's all I can think about.
So I'm about halfway through the Remake (finished Arc's route not too long ago, kino as always), and I also finished the OG this year, so I really REALLY wanna do Tsukihime at some point. I think it's inevitable at some point because I actually do give Mahoyo it's time in the spotlight in the upcoming Visual Novel video, so I think it's only a matter of time until Tsukihime gets something. I think what I might do though is either wait until Red Garden is officially on the way, or after I finish Red Garden to cover Tsukihime. Where I got mentally stunlocked on Tsukihime now is that it feels weird to talk about it when the Remake isn't done yet, and while the OG is still really good, I think the Remake changes have largely been for the better. For example, I think the Arc route is just straight up better in the Remake, but at the same time. it's hard to say "read the Remake" when the really cool parts of Tsukihime are still locked to the OG for now. So in short, I absolutely do want to cover Tsukihime at some point! I'm also at that point where it's all I'm thinking about and I'm not even done yet. My mind is just spinning on all the changes and how Nasu will tackle Red Garden, especially because the Far Sides are where Tsukihime really shines in my opinion.
Been meaning to read the visual novel for a while now. Problem is finding the time for it and making sure I get the FULL experience with nothing left out (aka the eroge scenes). More so the former.
I can understand that, I'm in the process of reading the Tsukihime Remake and I usually try to read a bit at night, but my damn eyes get tired lol. I guess if you're patient and just chip at it a little at a time, you'll get there eventually!
I’m an anime only and I love stay night. I can’t tell u how happy I was when I heard VN was getting a remaster until I saw that it’s not coming to PlayStation for some stupid reason I’m so bummed I hope they bring it to psn soon
@@DOOMSDAY500 worse comes to worse you can still read it online like the rest of us have for a long time but yeah it sucks no psn release. It's realta nua so there should be no issue
I second this, I also recommend the Ultimate edition if funds are tight and you're worried about hardware. The older version of the "PC" edition ran very well on my toaster of a computer in college, and I tested it the Ultimate edition on that same computer and it's solid.
Funny thing is, I was among the few who was *NOT* spoiled about Saber's True Name, mostly because one day I was watching videos on Anime Figures and then I saw a video Titled "Saber Lily Figure Review" and I thought, "Oh, so her true name is some historic Figure named "Lily"", that title saved me from getting spoiled somehow lmao, I started with the Visual Novel too... Well... to a degree, let me elaborate, when I decided to get into Fate (This was arround 2016, I think), my brother told me to Read the Fate Route on the VN first (He did showed me the 1st Episode of the UBW anime, which covers the Prologue with Rin and then the 2nd one from Shirou's POV then stopped when the route diverges), then we'll watch the UBW Anime (He didn't watched it yet, as when he read the VN, the Anime wasn't finished airing) and then I'll hop back to the VN for Heaven's Feel (The HF Movies didn't released at the time), then Watched Zero once i've finished Stay Night. My issues with the Adaptations is only the fact that there is no proper adaptation of the Fate Route, as DEEN's Fate spoils UBW and HF and most Anime Only fans recommend starting with Zero (Worst Place to start, as spoils everything on Stay Night, starting from Minute 0) which lead to the eternal "Fate/Watch Order" debate. Now days, I usually go: > The Person can read VN without any issues: Read Stay Night > Watch whatever you want > The Person doesn't read many VN, but doesn't mind it that much: Read the Fate Route > Watch UBW > Watch the HF Movies > Watch whatever you want > Anime Only people who share's CDawg's Opinion on VN: Watch UBW > Watch the HF Movies > Watch whatever you want Honestly, this debate wouldn't exist at all with Anime Only People if there was a proper Fate Route Adaptation
Man that's crazy, I feel like I can count on one hand people that jump into Fate without knowing who Saber is lol. But yeah I completely agree with you, like I'll get to this when I cover Zero eventually, but literally all this nonsense about watch orders and whatnot are because of Zero. I guess Ufotable assumed that Fate didn't need an adaptation or something, but they honestly should have just made the Fate route first. It solves ALL the watch order "debates"
@@ViviVariety Takeuchi and Director Hikaru Kondo did wanted to adapt The Fate Route too iirc, but the producers at Aniplex told them no because they found DEEN's Anime serviceable enough... Despite not being the case And the things that frustrates me about the people who still recommend starting with Zero is that even telling them what Zero spoils for Stay Night, they keep saying to start with Zero, literally unreasonable
I just finished the Remake and...I kinnnnd of want to agree, but I'll hold out on an opinion due to how Red Garden turns out because the Far Sides are easily my favorite parts of Tsukihime. So as far as my editing process, I basically made overlays in OBS and let the VN run on auto mode. It's not hard at all, it's just long because of how long Fate is. Like the way I'd do it is basically just let the VN roll in the background, while I do something else and periodically check for choices. For me it was easier to just record the full VN because I do plan to have a follow up to this video in the future, but if you for example have a more specific video in mind, you could just record the parts of the VN you need.
Bro i appreciate your opinion to read the visual novel and I love to see the visual novel but I don't know what website to go and I'll do my best to that visual novel and please tell me how to website
Well nowdays you can purchase the Remaster on Steam! And if you're interested in the Ultimate Edition, Google the Fate/Stay Night Ultimate Edition...it'll turn up... (Legally I can't say what site you can 'find" a download of the Ultimate edition, but it sounds like' Nyaaa", like a cat)
Angra Maynu and Bazett elevate Hollow ataraxia greatly. Might be a hot take but I think angra is just far and away the best written servant in the entire franchise
I don't think it's that hot of a take, Angry Mango is the GOAT. I'd have to think about it more, but I'd easily slot him in the top 5, if not top 3, best written servants of all time.
How did you like the Remake? I only just finished Arc's route and I'm a few days into Ciel, but I gotta say I think the Remake's version of the Arc route is just superior to the OG in every way.
@@ViviVariety i disagree with people who says that Arc route suffers from problems which sets as an introduction to the story since i see no problems with that as long as it fleshed out Shiki’s and Arc’s character that had such a great and fun dynamic. Ciel’s route is longer and had lots of details that felt like Nasu worked a lot on it because there are many things that were tweaked and changed to the better imo. The last few chapters were horrifying, yet the normal ending wasn’t to my liking but i liked the true ending way better. A great experience that now i feel empty after finishing it
That makes sense, I admit I had a weird perception the OG Arc Route because I read the manga first, and while I liked the OG Arc Route, the manga version allowed the characters to shine more in my opinion....which is exactly what Nasu remedied in the Remake I think. He absolutely nailed the dynamic between Shiki and Arc, and I felt their conflicts were fleshed out in ways that felt more vibrant and compelling. Like by god, the heavy moments in the Remake just hit like a dang truck at times. So far I like the changes of the Ciel route, and the fact that it feels more distinct now is a huge benefit in my opinion. Definitely looking forward to finishing it asap lol.
@@ViviVariety i will wait to see you reviewing it after finishing it, i was hyped to it and it lived up to it with every measure possible. I may be overhyping it lmao but it was an experience i needed and i’m waiting for red garden
Okay so I basically blazed through the last of Ciel's route and yeah the Remake is freaking amazing. Without getting too much into it, it's definitely a solid upgrade over the original, and I'm way more excited for Red Garden now than I was originally... And I was pretty stoked for the Far Sides lol. However, I'm not sure how to approach it for a future video. I do want to cover Tsukihime eventually, but the fact that the Remake is technically incomplete does make it tricky to discuss. My gut says to wait to do a "why you should read Tsukihime" until at the very least, Red Garden is officially announced, but that could take a while knowing Nasu. I guess we'll see. It's definitely been sticking in my brain in a good way so I might want to do it sooner.
Fate/stay night is great. It probably is the most iconic and influential Work of Nasu. Yes I don't think it's TM's best work. That honor goes to Mahou Tsukai no Yoru.
Insanely fair, I think if you put Excalibur to my head, Mahoyo is Nasu's strongest work on a pure writing perspective. With me, Fate is hard to judge objectively lol. ....however, Tsukihime Remake is putting in some work. When Red Garden comes out, I can see a world where Tsukihime Remake is Nasu's best.
Tbh I dont get that UBW inner monologues issue. Ive read the vn twice and I cant think of any critical stuff that was cut in the anime. Shirou may look... Dunno how to put it, dumber or not so self-aware in the series, but the core of his character is still there. I consider UBW to be very good adaptation, unlike HF movies. Also, I love FSN, but sadly, some aspects of its writing are far from perfect. Character development is fantastic, but the ways used to get there - not so much. Im talking about things like: Why was Caliburn able to kill Berserker several times with a single strike? Why is Kirei so incompetent in UBW, not knowing his own Servant s abilities? Why did Rin use two Command Spells at the end of UBW when she was only supposed to have one? Why was Saber able to use NF only once in UBW with Rin as her Master, but goddamn three or four times in Fate with Shirou as her Master? And so on. Like I said, I adore FSN, but moments like that decrease my enjoyment significantly. Is that the case with you as well? What do you think about it? Im really curious.
I think the monologue issue can also depend on how familiar with you are with the source material, and while UBW is the most common point of contention, it's honestly a huge problem in ALL Type-Moon adaptations, from Fate Zero to Kara no Kyoukai, hence why I kept the discussion not limited to UBW in the video. There's always something missing. I've definitely seen a handful of people say Shirou is okay in the UBW anime, but I wonder if that's because VN readers can spot the details, if that makes sense. For example, with KnK, all those moments where Shiki is staring off in the distance while Yuki Kaijura music is playing are moments where she's lost in thought about her trauma or feelings, and if you read the novel, you can understand that...but if you haven't, like 90% of the Western Type-Moon fanbase, it doesn't make much sense. And I think the mixed perception of Shirou when it comes to anime only viewers kind of shows that his portrayal isn't perfect. Shirou is almost universally beloved from most VN readers, so the fact that most anime only watchers are mixed says that something must have been lost in the transition. Sure, the core is there, but most TM novels thrive on the details, so the more you have, the better, if that makes sense. I should also mention that I HATED Shirou at first because my only exposure to him was the Deen anime, and while Ufo's UBW was better in his portrayal, he still didn't really click with me until I read the VN. Now I'm a Shirou simp xD but that's my experience with how Shirou was adapted, and everyone has a different perspective based on what they experienced first. As for the rest, I think I can answer most of it. I agree that the novel explanations can be...pretty trash actually, and there's a ton of stuff that makes sense, but isn't explained well. But I'll do my best to explain with what I remember. 1. So Herc's God Hand, his NP, only applies to his skin. Caliburn pierced the skin, so it was able to bypass the protection and kill him that way. Plus having Archer and Rin take out some of Herc's lives helped. In HF Shirou is able to accomplish something similar because Herc actually loses his skin, so Shirou can kill him with Nine Lives later. 2. I chalk this up to Kirei's overconfidence tbh. He's normally a cocky little fucker, but yeah, I think that's the most logical explanation. 3. When Saber makes a contract with Rin, Rin gets a new set of command seals. It happens whenever you make a contract; Caster got some as well when she stole Saber from Shirou. So by the end of UBW, she's got three fresh ones. 4. The answer here is probably because one was all that was necessary. From a meta/narrative stand point, the focus of UBW's climax should be Shirou and Gilgamesh, so having Saber take a more active/prominent role in the finale, even if it's just spamming beams, would take away from that. Something you gotta keep in mind with Nasu is he, like a lot of other writers, tends to operate on the "Rule of Cool", or alternativly, whatever fits the story he's trying to tell. The biggest example of this is Archer somehow still being alive at the end of UBW, which makes zero sense lol. I'm not gonna defend Nasu, but I also think it's easy to get lost in the weeds with a LOT of stories; very few stories are airtight, and when you scrutinize them too much, it sort of takes away from what the author is trying to illustrate with their story. So while there's always gonna be a narrative hiccup or three, I try to look at the story from the perspective of "what is the author trying to accomplish?" So in that case, to use the earlier example, having Archer remain alive at the end of UBW doesn't make much sense...but the purpose in the narrative, which in this case, is to close out Archer's role in the story and cement Rin's promise to Archer and, ergo, Shirou, to always stay by his side...is a good enough justification that makes it easy to overlook the decision to keep Archer around. It makes for a better story and a more fulfilling resolution, even if it comes at the cost of bending a few established rules. 9/10 times that usually explains a lot of how Nasu writes I notice, from everything to Tsukihime to Kara no Kyoukai. He'll bend whatever rules or logic if it means delivering a "better" story; whether or not it's actually better or worth the trouble completely depends on the reader. Anyways, that ended up being a bit long, but I hope that all made sense lol.
@@ViviVarietyThanks for your reply. Well I dont really know about overall reception of anime Shirou. I agree, something s going to be lost in adaptation regardless, but its hard for me to accept that "majority's opinion" argument. Things like Shirou's struggle, his unbreakable will, the way he overcomes some hellish suffering with his mental force alone - there's no way its gonna be as impactful in anime as it is in VN. And yet, I dont think its hard to appreciate his complex personality as anime-only, and I ve met people who was able to do so. Scenes like Rin and Shirou's conversation after Illya's death are fantastic in the anime, but it seems they are overlooked by anime watchers or something. On the other hand, I ve met some VN readers who believe Shirou to be generic shounen protagonist, so... But I see your point. As a side note, I love info dump moments in FSN. Kirei's sermons about HGW or Rin's lectures are something I enjoy immensely. It is stuff with no reasonable explanation whatsoever that concerns me more. 3. If I remember correctly (and Im pretty sure I do), there is a line in the VN after first Rin's CS is used: "There is one Command Spell left". So there are two Cs's, not one and not three. 4. So there is no in-universe answer huh? OK, again, I see your point about "rule of cool". I agree with you about Archer's survival. Its easy for me to tolerate it because he doesnt affect the outcome of Shirou vs Gil fight in any significant way. Basically, at this point Archer is only needed for "Stay away" scene with Rin, and since this scene is a masterpiece and easily one of the best moments in FSN, Im willing to forgive Nasu here. And its critical for three main characters' relationships, so all the more so. Finally, two more questions, if I may. First, Fate Gilgamesh simply wants Saber, and doesnt seem to care what Kirei is gonna do with Grail all that much. But UBW Gilgamesh, on the opposite, is willing to use Grail himself and doesnt care about Saber. Why? It looks like connection between routes is not the most well thought out aspect of FSN anyway. Perhaps you could say its alternate realities and even starting conditions somewhat differ from route to route, but Im not sure. And second, why is Gil willing to use Ea against Shirou, but he s not trying to protect himself with his armor, shields or Chain of Heavens? Rule of cool again?
So where you're getting tripped up with Rin's seals is in the prologue, she uses one seal on Archer. She then uses another one later. But then she makes the contract with Saber, and gets 3 again. I THINK that's the case, but I'd have to double check. As for the reason Gil changed motivation from Fate to UBW, I believe technically the change is after the scene where Shinji meets Gil, and Gil then decides to take action and the whole "the worth of a human" spiel. But otherwise I agree, his motivation change isn't well explored by any means. As for Gilgamesh not using Ea, Enkidu, and the armor, it's because he's prideful. He even says as much before fighting Shirou where he says something like "you aren't worth the effort". Eventually he does double back and try to use Ea, which Shirou anticipates and cuts off the arm, and he eventually resorts to the chains as well, which ironically aren't that effective because they work better on divine targets like Herc than normal people like Shirou. The armor, I guess it's because Shirou basically gives him no time to breathe, but otherwise...yeah Gilgamesh is nerfed with pride basically every time he appears in anything lol. He's the King of Jobbers for a reason. Again, hope that makes sense! I still need to actually reread the VN (I let OBS run on the background to record footage lol) so my memory isn't perfect by any means.
There's a few scenes in Hollow Ataraxia and Carnival Phantasm, but not too much on Herc I'm afraid. I imagine he's a tough character to write as a Berserker. (but without getting into deep spoilers, I highly recommended Fate Strange Fake. You know how Berserker Herc is "technically" nerfed? Well, you get to see him flex a little in Strange Fake)
I am surprised you didnt mention the big adaptation problems in unlimited blade works real lack of inner dialouge and exposition from the character leave alot unawanswered and not understood especially when it comes to shirou who looses 70% of his entire character when his lacking all of his important inner dialouge they are a VERY crucial part and even the heavens feel movies which dont fully focus on shirou himself as they cut most of the other characters just for sakura STILL include those inner dialouge scenes because they are THAT important for the story
Oh trust me, I debated long and hard about how much to delve into Ufo's UBW issues on inner monologues. I ultimately decided against it because the very next section explored the inner monologue problem and it would've felt redundant, and to be honest it's present in ALL the Type-Moon adaptations to some degree. Even KnK suffers because Shiki and especially Mikiya get next to no inner monologues, and like Shirou, their characters suffer...although Shiki obviously still gets ample characterization, so it's less of an issue for her. UBW is unique in that it's arguably the one that suffers the most because it's essentially the Shirou route, so I'm in agreement that Ufo's handling of it is particularly bad. You know it's bad when the anime director fiat out says "yeah I didn't quite understand Shirou". BRUH that's the MAIN character lol. In any case, I share the same opinion as you, and my goal is to hopefully explore Ufo's issues later down the road because it's a genuine criticism. Sometimes I feel like I go hard on Ufotable enough as is in past videos, so at times I try to temper the critiques so it's not just "Ufo dropped the ball" ad nauseum, if that makes sense.
I mean it is sort of the nature of adaptation and it's probably a problem that it wasn't made up for in other ways rather than not having it in general.
Yeah you summed up my thoughts, which is what I was trying to illustrate. The lack of inner thoughts isn't the major issue, as some things just don't work in a movie or series. But the more damning mistake is the lack of replacement for inner thoughts. You know, for a few years I chalked it up to Fate/Shirou being hard to adapt, but what's weird is the Heaven's Trilogy DOES adapt Shirou's inner thoughts, AND has strong visuals to supplement the story, like the Wind of Steel sequence. So my hunch is that it just depends on the production staff. Clearly something didn't quite work with UBW that was rectified in HF, so I think we just got unlucky with the adaptation.
I have a question. I have the eroge visual novel of Fate Stay Night on PC. Is it the same if I buy the global version on the Switch? I do love the Fate series having watch all the anime and games but I wonder should I get new Fate Stay Night on Switch?
So the global release follows the "official" Realta Nua release, which in short, is the censored version that replaced the eroge with things like the mana dragon and whatnot. If you've read the original version, you won't find anything you haven't seen before unless you read like the old old version that doesn't even have stuff like Last Episode. However, I will say that I've generally seen more positive word of mouth on the official translation. It's a lot more readable compared to the ones you and I read back in the day. And in addition, I think as a fan of the series, it's worth getting just to support the official release. Every official Type-Moon visual novel is out in the west, so if there's enough overseas support, I imagine we might get something like Tsukihime: The Other Side of Red Garden much MUCH sooner than part 1. I also just bought it mostly for this reason, it's literally been sitting unplayed on my Switch lol. Also I personally like having FSN on Switch! I'm eventually gonna reread it for real later on in preparation for a follow up to this video, so I like having the option of reading it as I try to sleep or something.
@@ViviVariety ok then you convinced me to getting it and the Tsukihime series as well I saw as well. Yeah I do support Type Moon products they made. I just hope they make the anime version of the sequel of Fate Stay Night and also finish the Fate Illya movie because that last move is still on a cliffhanger. Again thank you for the help
Had to reupload cause I was an idiot and forgot to fix some stuff…but in any case, there’s one thing I wanted to mention, but I cut it out because of the Remaster release!
When it comes to the FSN VN, a common question is “which version should I read?”. In short, there are two* versions of Fate available.
-The first is the original 2004 release. It’s the OG, complete, unabridged story, but the key thing is that FSN was originally an 18+ eroge (aka adult material) novel. From what I could research, Nasu originally didn’t want to include adult content, but Type-Moon was insistent that the market had no room for a non Eroge novel. This could be an urban legend, so feel free to let me know, I also wouldn’t be surprised if this were just baloney.
-Later, Fate was re-released as Fate/Stay Night: Realta Nua, which is an updated remaster that retains all the core story elements, adds some new content, and includes voice acting along with updated music. But this version was rewritten to replace all the 18+ content with new scenes. This has some…mixed results, which I’ll explain in a bit.
Now, while it’s easy to say “just read the version you want”, it should be noted that the OG VN is, for all intents and purposes, impossible to get. The Realta Nua version is the one that gets ported all the time in Japan, and while the worldwide release isn’t out yet, it’s almost certainly going to be the Realta Nua version. I’ll see for myself and update this note once it’s actually out. It’s also the reason I omitted this section from the video.
But that said, Realta Nua is by all means the “canon” version of Fate; I know everything in the Nasuverse is canon, but in many of other nods and references across the Nasuverse almost always refer to the Realta Nua version.
As for the OG vs Realta Nua changes, there isn’t a real consensus, and it depends on who you ask. As for my two cents, the adult content in the original is honestly written really poorly, and scenes that should be emotional or intimate just come off as comical in my humble opinion. There’s a place for adult content in the story, but I do wish it were just given proper respect and effort.
However, the Realta Nua replacements have a broad range, ranging from “awkward and clumsy” to “this is actually really cute”. There is one scene in particular I vastly prefer to the original, but the rest is pretty hit and miss.
…BUT, the most important change when it comes to OG vs Realta Nua is in the form of Heaven’s Feel. There’s an argument that Fate and UBW don’t really need adult content, but Heaven’s Feel has adult content as a pretty major focal point, and the Realta Nua changes make for a story that has less impact and stakes in my opinion. The story still works and is still incredible, but I think even the average reader will read the Realta Nua version of Heaven’s Feel and notice scenes that were blatantly darker or more intense.
However, in the meantime, there is one option available to prospective readers right now: The Fate Stay Night Ultimate Edition. This is a fanmade version of Fate that has the best of both versions, and has many options so that you the reader can customize the experience how you see fit. If you want to experience the OG VN text with updated visuals and the Realta Nua soundtrack, it’s an option. Or if you prefer the Realta Nua text but want the OG Heaven’s Feel text, and a mix of OG and Realta Nua music, that’s a-okay too. It’s my preferred method as well.
For what it’s worth, all the footage you see in the video were my recordings with the Ultimate Edition. It can run on toasters, it looks gorgeous, and it’s definitely my preferred way to experience Fate/Stay Night. I intend to buy the official version to support Type-Moon, and I encourage others to do the same, but I think the benefits of the Ultimate Edition are too good to pass up.
I can’t link it here in case the Type-Moon ninjas get on my case, but I promise you the Ultimate Edition is easy to find, and easy to install. Just be sure to support the official release when the time comes.
Also go read the Tsukihime Remake! It’s finally out!
👍
BRO. I *LITERALLY* put my heart, soul, and time into that comment I left man! Oh well. Guess I'll have to do it again!
Also finally got my limited edition of Tsukihime 2 days ago!
Ur right nasu didn’t want to include H-scenes but had to become a sellout due to so many sleeping on the garden of sinners.
@@Angras_advocate18 I've heard he didn't even *write* the H-scenes and some of the metaphors were less Narm sounding in Japanese.
Still didn't find them nearly as bad though.
I've also heard that allegedly Takeuchi was the one pushing for H-scenes, and may or may not have wrote them lol.
I also wouldn't be surprised if the translation probably doesn't do them justice, and at the end of the day, it was a net positive, so can't really complain to be honest.
I guess ideally I'd prefer either well written H-scenes (like Hollow Ataraxia...as I've *ahem* heard...) OR better replacement scenes with more effort, if that makes sense.
Everything Nasu writes is his Magnum Opus fr
Part of what makes Heavens Feel my favorite Route (Aside from the fact I love Horror) is how it completely flips the pre-established Battle Royale formula on it's head, before revealing just how meaningless the Holy Grail War itself was from the very beginning
The Fate Route establishes the Holy Grail War as a Battle Royale, it establishes a Formula where the Heroes meet and subsequently defeat a new Servant, one which is repeated through Unlimited Blade Works, albeit with some major changes
Then Heavens Feel comes along, introduces Zouken, and now suddenly there's this Terrifying Shadow Monster running around and half the Servants are dead within a Week
Then at the very end, you find out the Holy Grail was created NOT for the purpose of granting Wishes like we were told in the Fate Route, but for the purpose of becoming a Gateway to the Root of Akasha, and it was literally corrupted by the Concept of ALL EVILS OF THE WORLD during the Third HGW
Couldn't have said it better myself. While I'd love to give a super in-depth reply, the most I can say is I 100% agree, and once I get a few other projects sorted, I can't want to get into HF in detail. While Fate is my second favorite route, HF is where FSN really shines in my opinion, especially with the drama, psychological elements, and the way it turns literally everything we know about the Grail War on its head.
@@ViviVariety One thing that basically every Spinoff forgets is that Fate/Stay Night initially sets up the Holy Grail as an Omnipotent Wish granting machine, before pulling back that facade and revealing that initial portrayal of it to be what effectively amounts to a scam
Illya says it herself during Heavens Feel, the rules are intentionally distorted and spread around to attract Magi into participating, the Einzberns basically lied to other Magi about the true purpose of the Holy Grail War
Of course the Spinoffs tend to justify the Holy Grail being primarily a Wish Granting Device by being set in different Universes from Fate/Stay Night, but I think they’re still kinda missing the point
That's a really good point that illustrates something I'll likely explain in the follow-up in the future.
There's a running joke that that Nasu wrote a story about heroic ideals, and then wrote the grail war afterwards, but it kinda has a point in that the HGW always seemed like a vehicle for something else. In Fate it's obviously Shirou, but you don't see a similar principle in other works besides maybe Prisma Illya. But 9/10 times, the HGW sets the stage, but it's not used as a means to explore something more interesting.
The Fate Stay Night vn is one of the greatest pieces of fiction that I've ever come across.
Really have to reread the VN one of these days, especially now that there is an official translation.
Regarding Shirou, besides his ideal of becoming a hero of justice what drives him is guilt for being the only one saved in the Fuyuki fire. And I think each route balances them out in the end differently.
For example, Fate Shirou finds those orphans in the church which reminds him of all those who died in the fire. He and Saber are then presented by Kirei with a chance to use the Grail to undo the events that shaped them into who they are. But Shirou finds his guilt similar to Artoria's where she blames herself for everything that happened to her people. So he finds strength in himself to move past his guilt so that Artoria can as well. He rejects the grail and Saber does so as well. Later on, Fate Shirou does his best to become a hero of justice, but from my understanding he no longer does that out of guilt, but purely because of his ideal.
UBW Shirou never has that moment, but he is instead presented with a cruel future of his path to becoming a hero. His confrontation with Archer forces him to rethink his ideals, and Rin helps him deal with his survivor's guilt. So by the end, UBW Shirou is still driven by both his ideals and his guilt, but both were tempered by Archer and Rin. Saber, if she decides to stay, also looks for an answer along with Shirou on how to deal with that same problem since she doesn't move on from her guilt there.
Heaven's Feel Shirou is a polar opposite of Fate Shirou, where he abandons his ideals but his guilt is a lot worse because of Sakura. Not only because he couldn't save her until the very end, but also because of how many people died because he decided to save Sakura. So in the end HF Shirou fully abandons his ideal, but is instead driven by enormous guilt. And love too, but that's true for all routes.
"Shirou Emiya is Fate/stay night" is really accurate
0:06 Oh nah, they forgot Caren, Bazett, Rider, Sella and Illiya from Shirou's harem.
Plus ALL the Tsukihime girls for Tohno, the lads got their work cut out for them.
Kirei too!
Luvia and Miyu too lol
*Ladies and Gentleman, today I anounce, after more than 800 hours playing Fate Stay Night...I realize my greatest wish all along, was to be in saber's place and be boned by SHIROU EMIYA*
*Stay Night meant what I wanted Shirou to do, Unlimited Blade Works is what I want IN, and Heaven's Feel is when I achieve Ataraxia, as my defenseless ceases to be hollow as he fills me*
*Exaltation of the Beloved Shirou, I mean, he IS the lady of the lake, providing weapons to saber and all. He is avalon itself, lady of avalon...Arthur is the King, Long live Queen Shirou*
Dread it, run from it, we're all joining the Emiya harem no matter what.
Cool 🗡
I am the bone of my sword🗣🗣🗣
You understand me bruzza
Really putting the 'G' in "Garcher" i see
MASSIVE SPOILERS FOR HEAVEN'S FEEL AND HOLLOW ATARAXIA BELOW:
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Kirei saw himself as a being incapable of being good, consisting of nothing but pure evil. He was desperate for an answer to the question why something like himself existed and what his purpose was. His reason for wanting Angra Mainyu to be born was the faint hope that maybe a being made out of all the worlds evils could show him answers to this question.
"What would such a being do? What purpose would it find?"
I will never not find it absolutely hilarious that Hollow Ataraxia answers Kirei's question of "what would the pesonification of all the world's evils do if it was born?" with:
-Posess Shirou and try to corrupt him.
-Slowly but surely become corrupted by him instead.
-Rediscover your love for humantiy that made you qualify as a heroic spirit in the first place.
-Fall in love with the daughter that Kirei abandoned.
-Sacrifice yourself to save the woman Kirei betrayed an murdered.
And last but certainly not least:
-Become a hero of justice.
If Kirei could have seen that this was the answer, he'd had a fucking aneurism.
That's a super cool observation I never put together! It sort of makes HA the perfect rebuttal to Kirei's whole ordeal because it shows that it's possible to be "born" evil, but still have the capacity to grow and change.
I wonder if it implies that maybe Kirei wasn't beyond redemption in some way? I guess by the time we meet him it's too late, but had he met someone like Shirou (or even Claudia) at an earlier point in his life, maybe he could've let a different life.
I love the angry mango
That is the magic of Nasu writing, the way he write the routes and while you go futher get more an more lore, and have your misteries anwered all of them when you get the final ending.
I remember when I just entered college and really wanted to get into VNs…. I looked around for recommendations and landed on trying Tsukihime. Absolutely fell in love with it, then a few years later the fan translation dropped for FSN and I KNEW I had to read it. This stuff has stayed close to my heart for a decade now. I’ve read so many VNs, I think it’s hard for me to decide between FSN or Little Busters as my favorite. LB had me in tears man. Now I turn to dust lmao
What's Little Busters about? I've heard about it here and there, but I don't know anything about it.
I also started my Fate journey through the anime and then the vn. And I think the main issue the anime adaptations have is that, if you haven't read the vn or know someone who has, some things will be really confusing.
For example, these are some questions I got when watching the animes for the first time, that the vns explain:
-Watching the ending of Fate Zero, without knowing what Angra Manyu is or knowing the backstory of the Holy Grail Wat, will really add more questions than answers
-What really made Saber gain strength to fight Berserker in the original anime (although it was a +18 scene so I don't blame them for skipping it)
-How in the original anime Shirou defeated Berserker with just one blow even though Berserker needed to be killed several times
-Why in UBW they mention that Projection is worse than Enhancement (although this is more of a nitpick, as it isn't really important to the plot)
The OG anime you can kind of hand wave some stuff as retconned/ignored because of the later release of Realta Nua, but Zero is a huge thing that needs some kind of context for sure, ESPECIALLY the ending.
Look, I'll get to Zero someday, and I generally still have a positive opinion on it, but I had no idea what the hell happened at the end until I looked it up. Zero was absolutely meant to be watched after reading the VN, even Gen Urobuchi says as much lol.
At least those questions are not super important or anything, like, yeah, it's good to know, but they are not crucial to understanding what's happening. Now.. the Heaven's Feel movies? Holy S-! they rushed, ignored and even changed so much that anyone now familiar with the VN is going to be completely lost. The movies do such a bad job adapting HF that they don't even explain well what Heaven's Feel even is. Illya is basically non existent in the movies until the last one even tho HF is all about Sakura and Illya. They are the protagonists of HF. The movies are good spectacles, 10/10 animation and fight scenes, but they fail really, really hard as adaptations. Which is sad because Ufotable UBW anime, while it had issues as you pointed out, was still a really good adaptation, and their Fate/Zero anime adaptation is one of if not the best Light Novel adaptation. They blew it out of the park with that one.
I think what's also frustrating about Zero is when you look at Fate's adaptations and spin offs, it's one of the best and has no major "issues" like Stay Night's. Deen being...Deen, UBW being good but not really delving into the inner monologues, and HF being rushed.
Like I understand why people say "watch Zero later", which is something I express and what Nasu and Urobochi recommend as well, but for blind anime only viewers, it's hard to ignore that Zero just seems like the superior option.
Holy Grail Wat sounds about right 😂
i am a bit late and i usually don't leave comments but i just wanna say that this has to be one of the best videos on fate i've ever seen! its refreshing to see someone not focus on how "convoluted" fate is or only talk about the waifus, imo these days it feels like mostly due to fgo that's all people talk about and it makes me so sad 🥹 there is a LOT to talk about when it comes to type moon and their incredible characters and stories, it's sad people only focus on certain aspects of it. thank you for shining light on one of my favorite stories of all time and i hope that with f/sn being on steam more people will give it a try!
I appreciate that considering there's a lot of Fate videos out there! And I'm in agreement, like I know Fate tends to be talked about when it comes to epic battles and whatnot, but if you go back to as early as Tsukihime, the core was always something more real. Fate was simply the next evolution.
hell yeah, rho aias pfp
After a few years uploading, you're the first to actually notice! Also based pfp yourself mate!
Ever since I heard the 2012 New Dawn in your FE Franchise and Gintama videos, always asked myself when you'd do a Fate/Stay Night video. And we're *FINALLY* here!
22:58 Bazett "These Hands Are Rated E For Everyone" Fraga McRemitz. Amazing. Everytime I hear the lines "Humans can't fight Servants" I look at characters like Bazett (with others) and say "Stop the cap, Nasu."
I always wanted to get into the Fate franchise but didn't know where to start. Always saw it as "That one anime series with the blonde knight in blue with the movie budget fight scenes." in the distance. My 1st step in the Fate/Nasuverse rabbit hole would be F/SN UBW Abridged by Project Mouthwash (My *CLOSE* 2nd favorite abridged). That along with Melty Blood lead me to my *real* 1st step, the Tsukihime manga (Which I read in October 2020. Fitting, no?). To say I fell in love with that manga would be an *understatement.* Basically sold my allegiance to both Shiki Tohno (favorite Nasuverse MC) and Arcueid Brunestud (Favorite Tsukihime girl). Then I found the original VN and played it. I *LOVED* that VN! Imagine my reaction when the remake was officially announced the day I finished the OG in its entirety (Then I shortly followed through Kagetsu Tohya afterward). Wasn't until July 16th 2022 that I FINALLY got the F/SN Ultimate Edition VN to work on my laptop. That VN was a *TRIP!* If I wasn't already mesmerized by the VN's budget increase from Tsukihime, then it was the cool and memorable cast, awesome moments and visuals, and the amazing OST by KATE. Followed that up with reading HA, and that was also a pretty great fandisc sequel! Wasn't until earlier this year that I watched UBW's ufotable anime for the 1st time in its entirety. I know you said that the anime can't replace the VN and all that, but Vivi you *GOTTA* admit that ufotable went *above and BEYOND* to give the VN justice and then some! If they cooked this well for my favorite route, I can't wait to see what they did with my 2nd favorite route HF! And yeah, now I'm a dude who's just got his limited edition for the Tsukihime Remake, need to read more of Mahoyo before the movie comes out, and stuck in the FGO Rabbit Hole/Trap. Now for my 3 favorite OG Servants:
1. *Archer.*
2. *Lancer.*
3. *Rider.*
Can go into more detail if you wanna ask...
Well the humans can't beat servants are just the mages' rule
Seevants can be beaten via magecraft but the thing is its hard as shit so its more safe to just let the servants fight each other and the masters take care of the other masters instead
@@emiyavalentine5969 This is true. But it's not *IMPOSSIBLE!*
May I ask why Shiki is your favorite MC? I don't know many people who would say that, and since I haven't read Tsukehime yet, I'd like to know the appeal.
@@emiyavalentine5969Nothing is impossible in Nasuverse
@@missharpieful I'll give you two main reasons:
1. His Mystic Eyes of Death Perception. A really cool power to cut basically *ANYTHING,* but unlike Ryougi's his is a lower grade and because of that it's got a HUGE drawback when used. And yet despite that, this dude can take out the big shots of the Nasuverse with them just by being a dude with a switchblade knife.
2. His view on the fragility of life. Thanks to his eyes he feels like nothing in this world matters since in his words "the whole world could perish in an instant". Because of that, he holds on to the believe on the importance of living a good life and he does what he can to preserve and improve the lives of others. It's something I can really resonate with in a way, personally.
There are other reasons, but then we'd be heading to spoilers.
This is, hands down, the best introduction to Fate I've ever seen. You said a lot of things that, while I knew them and already agreed, I'm not able to say it as well as you did. Great job!
This is a great video! Visual novels/novel games are my favourite medium for stories, and I love Fate/stay night so very much. Shirou and Saber are two of my favourite characters of all time, including a whole chunk of the rest of the cast too. It’s such a shame that the medium is so niche and hard to sell at times to people. Like you’ve said in the video, I just want to share this wonderful story (and its sequel) with everyone!
Hope to see the official localisation bring in more people to the novel, and Type-Moon’s other works. Maybe the VN medium as a whole too. I’m glad to have found a high quality video to send to any friend who becomes interested in Fate, but is scared away by its ‘confusing to get into’ reputation.
I appreciate the compliments! I'm in agreement that visual novels are extremely underread compared to other mediums...which is why I absolutely intend on doing a much longer video for prospective readers in the future!
I feel as if people enjoy games like Disco Elysium or any long JRPGs, they'll likely love visual novels for much the same reason. At least, I'd like to think so.
To bring you some joy i just finish the tsukihime a piece of blue glass moon remake that came a couple months back and am now questioning for my next visual novel to either fate stay night or witch of the holy night both of them i want to read through at some point but im taking a small break with visual novels for now.
Only after you read the FSN visual novel you realize that Shirou is not your average heroic idiot like he is shown in the animes.
great video man, love me some fate
I REALLY appreciate that you did not spoil who saber was at the beginning.
Yes that secret is common knowledge but just like Star wars with the Darth Vader reveal, there are still people who are experiencing it for the first time.
It's definitely one of those things where 90% of people aware of Fate know who Saber is, but you gotta acknowledge that there might be someone out there who doesn't know, and oh MAN is it such a sick reveal. Seriously if I had a time machine I'd want to experience FSN blind because it must have been wild seeing the skyscraper fight for the first time.
Luckily nowadays I think the build up and the way Saber's identity is treated during the Fate route still makes it a sublime experience, but still, to go in blind must have been so cool.
my experience with fate is kinda similar with yours, although my motivation to start the vn was a bit different. Started with zero then ubw back in hs since thats apparently the popular way to start the franchise. Fell in love with it and I realized the HF trilogy was in the second movie, I started the vn because I knew I couldnt contain my excitement if I have to wait for the final movie. Then I cried, alot, reading the damn thing. I hope the official localization will turn anime only people to people who fell in love with the series, just like what it did to me.
Same mate, I like that now we can actually tell people 'hey just buy the novel on steam!" instead of giving them a guide like the old days. Plus, if the official release sells well, maybe Nasu will release Red Garden already!
Love the vid! Definitely going to my type-moon essay playlist.
Yo got a link to that I’m trying to get some friends into type moon and I’m horrible at explaining why I like type moon
@@Iffyschatos ha I’m the same, I gotchu ua-cam.com/play/PLcVG2u5R2cCuY9Q_G9pJmi30zLUvhVo2Z.html&si=7Z6foNVbDRwK7j4b
@@Iffyschatos sorry UA-cam doesn’t let me send links for some reason. All u have to do is go to my playlist section & save it to yours it’s next to the share button
@@Angras_advocate18 ok thank you :)
For some reason I needed to manually approve this comment, so you're all good mate!
Thanks for the video man. I was first introduced into the Nasuverse through DEEN Fate/Stay Night. The anime leave me so many question and thanks to a few interaction online, where I got schooled on the source material, I decided to jump into the visual novel. It was something else. No Ufotable adaptation or any other came close.
Although I must admit because of my love for the original visual novel makes me completely avoiding the sequel, the Ataraxia. I am, for the lack of better words, are afraid. I am afraid Ataraxia will ruined Fate/Stay Night for me.
You convinced me to take a step into Ataraxia. Hopefully Aniplex/Type-Moon will not take too long for Ataraxia re-release.
I hope you enjoy Hollow Ataraxia! I had the same apprehension at first, especially since I didn't think I'd like a SoL novel at all. But I'm glad I was wrong in the end, HA was such a great experience that only made me love FSN even more.
Awesome video, sending it to my friends whom I've tried to convince to start Fate for months! Maybe they'll finally cave.
My first experience with Fate was the visual novel, but exclusively by watching a playthrough on yt through my small ass phone screen since I didn't have a means for downloading it otherwise (and I didn't know the Ultimate version existed). From there I got into all sorts of Type Moon works cuz honestly it's some of the most interesting premises I've ever read. Shirou remains as one of my favorite characters in all media, maybe ever, and I don't see that changing anytime soon.
A few years ago I finally downloaded the Ultimate version and I was screaming everytime anything mildly hype happened, it felt so good to go through it again. Kirei says "Yorokobe Shonen"? I'm replaying that shit 10 times minimum. Kojiro and Saber square up? I'm doing high jumps of excitment. The gang's cooking it up in the kitchen? Tears in my eyes. I also experienced all the bad endings and Taiga dojos, which were new for me, so that rocked (not so much for Shirou tho rip my king).
Hollow Ataraxia was also a yt walkthrough experience but I've always wanted to really play it, with the minigames and all. So I'd like to ask, how did you go about it? Is there a site or smthn where I could get it? It's unfortunetely tough for me to buy games, and while I will probably attempt to get fsn remaster off steam, ataraxia is only just announced, and it'll probably take time for it to drop. In the meantime, I would like to go over it again ("proprely" this time). So help in that regard would be very appreciated.
Another question, how would you say the remaster compares to the mirror moon translation? Is there a big/evident gap between the two? I never had too many issues with the fantranslation but I have seen quite a few people saying the official is a big step up in quality (although Altria remains to haunt us smh).
So while I can't put the link here, I will say I just "legally" downloaded Hollow Ataraxia off a site that sounds like you go "Nyaaaa" like an old timey Italian mobster if you catch my drift.
However, what I might recommend is waiting for HA either for the official remaster, or an "Ultimate" edition that is currently in the works, although I don't know if that changed due to the official release coming in the future. For a while, the version I played HA on was the OG 2005 one with no voice acting and all, but just before recording footage, I did find a beta version of an upcoming HA Ultimate Edition. It's perfectly readable, but its also a little buggy; like there were times when sprites would fly up to the sky, or transitions wouldn't work, and so on. I actually used the Ultimate Edition of HA for my footage, but I did have to edit around the buggy parts. I think right now I'd say it's worth waiting for a more stable version, whether that'll be in the HA Ultimate Edition, or the official release.
Also, I haven't gotten a chance to read the FSN Remaster yet, but I have seen a few screenshots and it looks nice. It definitely looks more "readable" than the Mirror Moon translations, which is nice...Altria aside, thank god for that mod that changes it back lmao. I'm still in the middle of finishing the Tsukihime Remake (about halfway done!) and my plan is to read the FSN Remaster afterwards to refresh my memory for the full spoiler video next year.
Anyways, I know that was a bit long and probably not super helpful, but I hope it helped somewhat!
Finally someone put into words what I couldn't for years. Amazing video.
19:06
Saber looks like Namine from Kingdom Hearts.
Huh, I never noticed that. Guess Nomura did it first lol
@@ViviVariety Yeah XD
Yeah, i agree with everything you say in this video. It's really well made, to be honest.
3:00 I went from Zero to UBW, FGO, the VN Fate route (because UBW left me feeling like I was missing out on a ton), Apocrypha, some more FGO, finally restarting and finishing UBW and Heaven's Feel in the VN like 2 or 3 years ago. Hollow Ataraxia I finished last year. FSN and HA are on another level compared to all the other works, it's genuinely shocking taking a look at the other stuff after reading FSN and HA. Every time I think of the VNs I kinda lament the stuff that we get now.
Outside of like 4 chapters in FGO and some events, I feel like it gets just so draining, monotonous, bland, soulless for lack of a better word. It feels too robotic, too paint-by-numbers, yet too messy. I'm hoping Lostbelt 6 will change my mind but damn man I believed in the hype and got burned so many times (Shimousa, most of the Lostbelts...).
I'm not sure why I wrote all this but I've been feeling like rereading FSN for a while and this encourages me 👍
This is the crux of why I think a lot of VN fans are so passionate about the novel. I was more aggressive about it in the video, but it's coming from a place of longing for something more from the Fate series.
In my mind, it's basically:
1. FSN and HA
2..... Maybe Zero and Strange Fake?
3. Literally everything else.
And there's a huge gap between 1 and 2. There's just something there about the writing quality, the character writing, and the way the stories unfold that really works, and it sticks with you long after you finish it. For me, the best example I could think of was that Zero and UBW, while still quite good, were like eating at a pretty good restaurant... And the VN was like going to like the five star equivalent of that same restaurant. It leaves you wanting more in a good way, and I think a lot of the best TM novels are like that. Hell, I just finished the Tsukihime Remake and now I'm in the damn Red Garden waiting room! Come on Nasu, hurry up lol.
I know not all of the Fate franchise is of very high quality, and maybe asking them to match the VNs is a little too ambitious, but it's genuinely hard to enjoy some of the others sometimes because deep down you KNOW what the series is capable of. I think many Fate fans just want more from the franchise at times, and while it's fine to have some easy to consume stories and whatnot, more quality stories is never a bad idea either.
@@ViviVariety
Dude EXACTLY.
While going through Hollow Ataraxia last summer there were so many moments and lore convos (especially with Back to the Night playing, I loved that and Magic Hour which I appreciate you using in the vid :D ) that made me go "God I wish we get more/info of this stuff" and I would get a little saddened because we either ended up getting more or will get more, but it's in another series or FGO. It just about never lives up to or competes with the VNs.
I can't help but feel like there is a pure sense of humanity to most if not all of the VN characters despite how supernatural they and their surroundings are. That is mostly what makes Nasu's works affect me so much and helps make Type Moon my favourite franchise alongside FromSoft's Soulsborne. Most if not all characters feel real and human to their core, no matter the supernatural and magical happenings going on in and around them.
I legit find myself treating the characters like real people that I've talked to and lived with. Maybe this is normal and I've just not consumed good media before, but that was a first to me. I've never felt that way before.
Even putting characters aside, there's such a strong sense of atmosphere, mystery, gentle darkness, and beauty in these stories, so many beautiful moments (it's hard to describe them but I think you get what I mean) and it feels like future installments never truly captured something that lived up to or competed with that.
I would actually say the Zero and UBW anime still have my heart in some of these despite feeling really sour at Zero after the VN, but those were my entries to the series and nostalgia is one hell of a thing.
As for FGO I loved Camelot, Babylonia, Solomon, Summer 3, and a few events. I read Camelot-Solomon early on in my Fate journey so I wonder if they'll hold up should I ever reread.
Summer 3 seems like a silly thing to include but this damn event about writing manga for comic-con in Hawaii had characters and moments that genuinely touched me harder than most main chapters. I ended up finding out Nasu wrote this event and that explains a good bit.
I'm with you that it's a little(?) wrong to ask other installments to match the VNs but I feel like the other bits of Fate that I've consumed are just *soulless* in comparison, for lack of a better word. And just like you said, we know and have seen just how much better it could be.
Atm I'm holding out hope for Red Garden as well 🤝I think it was exactly a year ago when I finished Tsukihime RE! On the night of the 30th or 31st of August during the Super Blue Moon (kinda happy about that coincidence).
I feel like I had more issues with Tsuki RE than FSN and I really didn't like Ciel's true ending, but it was still an awesome experience and I was genuinely happy with it after all the hype and excitement since its announcement
Man I just realised just how much I typed out, sorry :p
I kinda want to bring up the bit about Soulsborne and Type-Moon.
A good part of what makes Soulsborne so special to me is just how unique the worlds, characters, and designs tend to be. They almost always (DS2 was my entry point and I fuckin love it, but I genuinely feel like they really messed up here and often feels generic) manage to not be generic or formulaic and have a sense of quiet and unspoken dignity to them. It feels... respectful.
Instead of something being plain horrible or nasty, you kinda stop and think about just how sad the transformation of that place or creature is. It feels like there's STILL something meaningful regardless of how awful it is.
I always drew unintentional parallels between that and Type-Moon's human-feeling characters.
I wonder if that sense of dignity is part of Nasu's well-documented love for FromSoft games. As an added fun fact, Miyazaki actually had a special message for FSN's 15th anniversary. So there is a non-zero that Leda is a Saber reference.
Great video my friend! I watched your knk video a couple years ago and really liked it. Glad your still at it!
My guess is you are an Arturia Stan like me 😂 if I guessed right happy day! I got into fate in high school almost 20 years ago now, when Deen first came out so I had to watch through fansubs before localization.
Despite deens problems I still felt some of the majesty of fate route shine through enough for me to continue having warm nostalgia for it even after I read the vn. Kenji kawaiis ost and of course the voice actors we know and love so well put their all in.
My first nasuverse thing was unfortunately the tsukihime anime but the less said about the better 😅 it was a long time coming but I'm glad tsuki is in a better place now. Red garden when nasu?
What's funny is I wrote the script around keeping things vague because the full Nasuverse vid is gonna be more gushing about my favorite/ships but as I was editing I thought "nah, it's super obvious" lol. You're dead on though, I'm an Arturia stan through and through!
I also kind of like the atmosphere of the Deen anime. The music is SO GOOD and I also really enjoy some changes, like the Triple Crane Wing and obviously Saber's farewell. One of my ideas in the future is to give the Deen anime another shot and possibly make a video on it, I think in some ways I had different expectations and my perception was radically different, especially since it followed Fate Zero for me.
What are your thoughts on the Tsukihime Remake so far? I finished the OG novel during my honeymoon and good God, I could not be more excited for Red Garden.
@@ViviVariety so far I have only finished the arc route but I really enjoyed it! Besides a few minor things like ciels original role in arc route being replaced by new characters i think it was a straight upgrade. I'm starting on ciel route soon so hopefully it's good! Before you check out the remake I'd recommend reading the tsukihime manga through and through. Not only is it a great adaption but the author of the manga sasaki shounen is helping with the remake, so a lot of the manga original contents are carried forward
I actually read the manga! That was my intro to Tsukihime and I really liked it. So much that when I read the VN, I felt the manga version was, in my opinion, the better Arc route. I felt the characters shined a lot more, plus the ending was just too good.
Reading the Remake though, I definitely see manga's influence in a good way. I'm a little over halfway through Arc's route and I love the additions so far. I definitely like it a lot more than the OG Arc route, so fingers crossed it keeps it up.
They even released a Randomiser edition :p
And an officially licensed one with an Illya route! Thank you Mushroom Man :D
Heaven's feel in general seems like a perfect adaptation to me though? Of course the issue with a proper fate route adaptation not existing is there, but i feel like anyone having issue with heaven's feel adaptation is most of the time because they didn't get to see Sparks liner high, which is just a stupid expectation.
It's great for Sakura and arguably does her justice in many ways, but cutting out the Kirei and Illya stuff is too hard to look past in my opinion. Illya especially since she plays such a pivotal role in effectively being Shirou's one link to sanity and his only healthy relationship throughout the route.
Also some things weren't really elaborated on and made things really confusing for anime only watchers. You get questions like "what happened to Shirou at the end?" like once a week on the subreddit because the actual Heaven's Feel ceremony isn't really explained, plus Shirou's memory loss is barely alluded to. Those are the two things off the top of my head.
It's a bummer because HF is my favorite route, and I feel like the adaptation actually did a better job at nailing Shirou compared to UBW, but the cut content just sours my perception of it. Not TOO much, like I really loved the second film, but the last one kind of drops the ball in my opinion. First film is decent too.
There's some minor stuff too, like I think it's pretty lame how Ufotable decided to go all in on Rider vs Saber over Shirou vs Kirei, but that's more of a personal gripe. I also would've liked Sparks Liner High, but let's be real, that was always just wishful thinking lol no shot we'd have actually gotten that.
Overall HF isn't "bad', but I really think it should've been an anime. Maybe the material is too sensitive for TV, but there was too much to cram into three films.
Great video! Love your content on Fate and Kara no Kyoukai. You think you'll ever do a video on Tsukihime? I just 100% completed the remake and it's all I can think about.
So I'm about halfway through the Remake (finished Arc's route not too long ago, kino as always), and I also finished the OG this year, so I really REALLY wanna do Tsukihime at some point. I think it's inevitable at some point because I actually do give Mahoyo it's time in the spotlight in the upcoming Visual Novel video, so I think it's only a matter of time until Tsukihime gets something.
I think what I might do though is either wait until Red Garden is officially on the way, or after I finish Red Garden to cover Tsukihime. Where I got mentally stunlocked on Tsukihime now is that it feels weird to talk about it when the Remake isn't done yet, and while the OG is still really good, I think the Remake changes have largely been for the better. For example, I think the Arc route is just straight up better in the Remake, but at the same time. it's hard to say "read the Remake" when the really cool parts of Tsukihime are still locked to the OG for now.
So in short, I absolutely do want to cover Tsukihime at some point! I'm also at that point where it's all I'm thinking about and I'm not even done yet. My mind is just spinning on all the changes and how Nasu will tackle Red Garden, especially because the Far Sides are where Tsukihime really shines in my opinion.
Been meaning to read the visual novel for a while now. Problem is finding the time for it and making sure I get the FULL experience with nothing left out (aka the eroge scenes). More so the former.
I can understand that, I'm in the process of reading the Tsukihime Remake and I usually try to read a bit at night, but my damn eyes get tired lol. I guess if you're patient and just chip at it a little at a time, you'll get there eventually!
Love your video❤, hope you do one for extra an extella soon!!
I'll consider it, but I got a lot of Type-Moon stuff to cover first!
I’m an anime only and I love stay night. I can’t tell u how happy I was when I heard VN was getting a remaster until I saw that it’s not coming to PlayStation for some stupid reason I’m so bummed I hope they bring it to psn soon
@@DOOMSDAY500 worse comes to worse you can still read it online like the rest of us have for a long time but yeah it sucks no psn release. It's realta nua so there should be no issue
I second this, I also recommend the Ultimate edition if funds are tight and you're worried about hardware. The older version of the "PC" edition ran very well on my toaster of a computer in college, and I tested it the Ultimate edition on that same computer and it's solid.
Funny thing is, I was among the few who was *NOT* spoiled about Saber's True Name, mostly because one day I was watching videos on Anime Figures and then I saw a video Titled "Saber Lily Figure Review" and I thought, "Oh, so her true name is some historic Figure named "Lily"", that title saved me from getting spoiled somehow lmao, I started with the Visual Novel too... Well... to a degree, let me elaborate, when I decided to get into Fate (This was arround 2016, I think), my brother told me to Read the Fate Route on the VN first (He did showed me the 1st Episode of the UBW anime, which covers the Prologue with Rin and then the 2nd one from Shirou's POV then stopped when the route diverges), then we'll watch the UBW Anime (He didn't watched it yet, as when he read the VN, the Anime wasn't finished airing) and then I'll hop back to the VN for Heaven's Feel (The HF Movies didn't released at the time), then Watched Zero once i've finished Stay Night. My issues with the Adaptations is only the fact that there is no proper adaptation of the Fate Route, as DEEN's Fate spoils UBW and HF and most Anime Only fans recommend starting with Zero (Worst Place to start, as spoils everything on Stay Night, starting from Minute 0) which lead to the eternal "Fate/Watch Order" debate. Now days, I usually go:
> The Person can read VN without any issues: Read Stay Night > Watch whatever you want
> The Person doesn't read many VN, but doesn't mind it that much: Read the Fate Route > Watch UBW > Watch the HF Movies > Watch whatever you want
> Anime Only people who share's CDawg's Opinion on VN: Watch UBW > Watch the HF Movies > Watch whatever you want
Honestly, this debate wouldn't exist at all with Anime Only People if there was a proper Fate Route Adaptation
Man that's crazy, I feel like I can count on one hand people that jump into Fate without knowing who Saber is lol.
But yeah I completely agree with you, like I'll get to this when I cover Zero eventually, but literally all this nonsense about watch orders and whatnot are because of Zero. I guess Ufotable assumed that Fate didn't need an adaptation or something, but they honestly should have just made the Fate route first. It solves ALL the watch order "debates"
@@ViviVariety Takeuchi and Director Hikaru Kondo did wanted to adapt The Fate Route too iirc, but the producers at Aniplex told them no because they found DEEN's Anime serviceable enough... Despite not being the case
And the things that frustrates me about the people who still recommend starting with Zero is that even telling them what Zero spoils for Stay Night, they keep saying to start with Zero, literally unreasonable
Type moon’s magnum opus is Tsukihime remake if I’m keeping it real. Also what’s your editing process for getting clips?
I just finished the Remake and...I kinnnnd of want to agree, but I'll hold out on an opinion due to how Red Garden turns out because the Far Sides are easily my favorite parts of Tsukihime.
So as far as my editing process, I basically made overlays in OBS and let the VN run on auto mode. It's not hard at all, it's just long because of how long Fate is. Like the way I'd do it is basically just let the VN roll in the background, while I do something else and periodically check for choices. For me it was easier to just record the full VN because I do plan to have a follow up to this video in the future, but if you for example have a more specific video in mind, you could just record the parts of the VN you need.
Amazing Video
Seigi no Mikata.
It is top tier
Bro i appreciate your opinion to read the visual novel and I love to see the visual novel but I don't know what website to go and I'll do my best to that visual novel and please tell me how to website
Well nowdays you can purchase the Remaster on Steam! And if you're interested in the Ultimate Edition, Google the Fate/Stay Night Ultimate Edition...it'll turn up...
(Legally I can't say what site you can 'find" a download of the Ultimate edition, but it sounds like' Nyaaa", like a cat)
Angra Maynu and Bazett elevate Hollow ataraxia greatly.
Might be a hot take but I think angra is just far and away the best written servant in the entire franchise
I don't think it's that hot of a take, Angry Mango is the GOAT. I'd have to think about it more, but I'd easily slot him in the top 5, if not top 3, best written servants of all time.
awesome video
True fate stay night is peak
I just started the fate vn
Ha is so good, it's sad it's so nieche. Also Ha should have more archer
Agreed, that's like my only major complaint as well. Archer has only a handful of scenes, but at least he steals the scene every time he shows up.
@ViviVariety There is also Sasuke, who has 2 and a half scenes, probably because he stills the show too much
Me watching this as i wait for my steam deck to play it after finishing tsukihime remake
How did you like the Remake? I only just finished Arc's route and I'm a few days into Ciel, but I gotta say I think the Remake's version of the Arc route is just superior to the OG in every way.
@@ViviVariety i disagree with people who says that Arc route suffers from problems which sets as an introduction to the story since i see no problems with that as long as it fleshed out Shiki’s and Arc’s character that had such a great and fun dynamic.
Ciel’s route is longer and had lots of details that felt like Nasu worked a lot on it because there are many things that were tweaked and changed to the better imo. The last few chapters were horrifying, yet the normal ending wasn’t to my liking but i liked the true ending way better.
A great experience that now i feel empty after finishing it
That makes sense, I admit I had a weird perception the OG Arc Route because I read the manga first, and while I liked the OG Arc Route, the manga version allowed the characters to shine more in my opinion....which is exactly what Nasu remedied in the Remake I think. He absolutely nailed the dynamic between Shiki and Arc, and I felt their conflicts were fleshed out in ways that felt more vibrant and compelling. Like by god, the heavy moments in the Remake just hit like a dang truck at times.
So far I like the changes of the Ciel route, and the fact that it feels more distinct now is a huge benefit in my opinion. Definitely looking forward to finishing it asap lol.
@@ViviVariety i will wait to see you reviewing it after finishing it, i was hyped to it and it lived up to it with every measure possible. I may be overhyping it lmao but it was an experience i needed and i’m waiting for red garden
Okay so I basically blazed through the last of Ciel's route and yeah the Remake is freaking amazing. Without getting too much into it, it's definitely a solid upgrade over the original, and I'm way more excited for Red Garden now than I was originally... And I was pretty stoked for the Far Sides lol.
However, I'm not sure how to approach it for a future video. I do want to cover Tsukihime eventually, but the fact that the Remake is technically incomplete does make it tricky to discuss. My gut says to wait to do a "why you should read Tsukihime" until at the very least, Red Garden is officially announced, but that could take a while knowing Nasu. I guess we'll see. It's definitely been sticking in my brain in a good way so I might want to do it sooner.
Fate/stay night is great. It probably is the most iconic and influential Work of Nasu. Yes I don't think it's TM's best work. That honor goes to Mahou Tsukai no Yoru.
Insanely fair, I think if you put Excalibur to my head, Mahoyo is Nasu's strongest work on a pure writing perspective. With me, Fate is hard to judge objectively lol.
....however, Tsukihime Remake is putting in some work. When Red Garden comes out, I can see a world where Tsukihime Remake is Nasu's best.
I hope when they remake stay night they add an illya route because that means more hercales
Mate the Tsukihime Remake gives me hope for an Illya route in the far future
nasu can barely finish the other 3 of his main works, an fsn remake unfortunately does not seem likely at all
Sadly that's true, I look forward to reading Mahoyo 2 with my great grandkids
Tbh I dont get that UBW inner monologues issue. Ive read the vn twice and I cant think of any critical stuff that was cut in the anime. Shirou may look... Dunno how to put it, dumber or not so self-aware in the series, but the core of his character is still there. I consider UBW to be very good adaptation, unlike HF movies.
Also, I love FSN, but sadly, some aspects of its writing are far from perfect. Character development is fantastic, but the ways used to get there - not so much. Im talking about things like: Why was Caliburn able to kill Berserker several times with a single strike? Why is Kirei so incompetent in UBW, not knowing his own Servant s abilities? Why did Rin use two Command Spells at the end of UBW when she was only supposed to have one? Why was Saber able to use NF only once in UBW with Rin as her Master, but goddamn three or four times in Fate with Shirou as her Master? And so on. Like I said, I adore FSN, but moments like that decrease my enjoyment significantly. Is that the case with you as well? What do you think about it? Im really curious.
I think the monologue issue can also depend on how familiar with you are with the source material, and while UBW is the most common point of contention, it's honestly a huge problem in ALL Type-Moon adaptations, from Fate Zero to Kara no Kyoukai, hence why I kept the discussion not limited to UBW in the video. There's always something missing. I've definitely seen a handful of people say Shirou is okay in the UBW anime, but I wonder if that's because VN readers can spot the details, if that makes sense. For example, with KnK, all those moments where Shiki is staring off in the distance while Yuki Kaijura music is playing are moments where she's lost in thought about her trauma or feelings, and if you read the novel, you can understand that...but if you haven't, like 90% of the Western Type-Moon fanbase, it doesn't make much sense. And I think the mixed perception of Shirou when it comes to anime only viewers kind of shows that his portrayal isn't perfect. Shirou is almost universally beloved from most VN readers, so the fact that most anime only watchers are mixed says that something must have been lost in the transition. Sure, the core is there, but most TM novels thrive on the details, so the more you have, the better, if that makes sense.
I should also mention that I HATED Shirou at first because my only exposure to him was the Deen anime, and while Ufo's UBW was better in his portrayal, he still didn't really click with me until I read the VN. Now I'm a Shirou simp xD but that's my experience with how Shirou was adapted, and everyone has a different perspective based on what they experienced first.
As for the rest, I think I can answer most of it. I agree that the novel explanations can be...pretty trash actually, and there's a ton of stuff that makes sense, but isn't explained well. But I'll do my best to explain with what I remember.
1. So Herc's God Hand, his NP, only applies to his skin. Caliburn pierced the skin, so it was able to bypass the protection and kill him that way. Plus having Archer and Rin take out some of Herc's lives helped. In HF Shirou is able to accomplish something similar because Herc actually loses his skin, so Shirou can kill him with Nine Lives later.
2. I chalk this up to Kirei's overconfidence tbh. He's normally a cocky little fucker, but yeah, I think that's the most logical explanation.
3. When Saber makes a contract with Rin, Rin gets a new set of command seals. It happens whenever you make a contract; Caster got some as well when she stole Saber from Shirou. So by the end of UBW, she's got three fresh ones.
4. The answer here is probably because one was all that was necessary. From a meta/narrative stand point, the focus of UBW's climax should be Shirou and Gilgamesh, so having Saber take a more active/prominent role in the finale, even if it's just spamming beams, would take away from that.
Something you gotta keep in mind with Nasu is he, like a lot of other writers, tends to operate on the "Rule of Cool", or alternativly, whatever fits the story he's trying to tell. The biggest example of this is Archer somehow still being alive at the end of UBW, which makes zero sense lol. I'm not gonna defend Nasu, but I also think it's easy to get lost in the weeds with a LOT of stories; very few stories are airtight, and when you scrutinize them too much, it sort of takes away from what the author is trying to illustrate with their story. So while there's always gonna be a narrative hiccup or three, I try to look at the story from the perspective of "what is the author trying to accomplish?"
So in that case, to use the earlier example, having Archer remain alive at the end of UBW doesn't make much sense...but the purpose in the narrative, which in this case, is to close out Archer's role in the story and cement Rin's promise to Archer and, ergo, Shirou, to always stay by his side...is a good enough justification that makes it easy to overlook the decision to keep Archer around. It makes for a better story and a more fulfilling resolution, even if it comes at the cost of bending a few established rules. 9/10 times that usually explains a lot of how Nasu writes I notice, from everything to Tsukihime to Kara no Kyoukai. He'll bend whatever rules or logic if it means delivering a "better" story; whether or not it's actually better or worth the trouble completely depends on the reader.
Anyways, that ended up being a bit long, but I hope that all made sense lol.
@@ViviVarietyThanks for your reply.
Well I dont really know about overall reception of anime Shirou. I agree, something s going to be lost in adaptation regardless, but its hard for me to accept that "majority's opinion" argument. Things like Shirou's struggle, his unbreakable will, the way he overcomes some hellish suffering with his mental force alone - there's no way its gonna be as impactful in anime as it is in VN. And yet, I dont think its hard to appreciate his complex personality as anime-only, and I ve met people who was able to do so. Scenes like Rin and Shirou's conversation after Illya's death are fantastic in the anime, but it seems they are overlooked by anime watchers or something. On the other hand, I ve met some VN readers who believe Shirou to be generic shounen protagonist, so... But I see your point.
As a side note, I love info dump moments in FSN. Kirei's sermons about HGW or Rin's lectures are something I enjoy immensely. It is stuff with no reasonable explanation whatsoever that concerns me more.
3. If I remember correctly (and Im pretty sure I do), there is a line in the VN after first Rin's CS is used: "There is one Command Spell left". So there are two Cs's, not one and not three.
4. So there is no in-universe answer huh? OK, again, I see your point about "rule of cool".
I agree with you about Archer's survival. Its easy for me to tolerate it because he doesnt affect the outcome of Shirou vs Gil fight in any significant way. Basically, at this point Archer is only needed for "Stay away" scene with Rin, and since this scene is a masterpiece and easily one of the best moments in FSN, Im willing to forgive Nasu here. And its critical for three main characters' relationships, so all the more so.
Finally, two more questions, if I may. First, Fate Gilgamesh simply wants Saber, and doesnt seem to care what Kirei is gonna do with Grail all that much. But UBW Gilgamesh, on the opposite, is willing to use Grail himself and doesnt care about Saber. Why? It looks like connection between routes is not the most well thought out aspect of FSN anyway. Perhaps you could say its alternate realities and even starting conditions somewhat differ from route to route, but Im not sure.
And second, why is Gil willing to use Ea against Shirou, but he s not trying to protect himself with his armor, shields or Chain of Heavens? Rule of cool again?
So where you're getting tripped up with Rin's seals is in the prologue, she uses one seal on Archer. She then uses another one later. But then she makes the contract with Saber, and gets 3 again. I THINK that's the case, but I'd have to double check.
As for the reason Gil changed motivation from Fate to UBW, I believe technically the change is after the scene where Shinji meets Gil, and Gil then decides to take action and the whole "the worth of a human" spiel. But otherwise I agree, his motivation change isn't well explored by any means.
As for Gilgamesh not using Ea, Enkidu, and the armor, it's because he's prideful. He even says as much before fighting Shirou where he says something like "you aren't worth the effort". Eventually he does double back and try to use Ea, which Shirou anticipates and cuts off the arm, and he eventually resorts to the chains as well, which ironically aren't that effective because they work better on divine targets like Herc than normal people like Shirou. The armor, I guess it's because Shirou basically gives him no time to breathe, but otherwise...yeah Gilgamesh is nerfed with pride basically every time he appears in anything lol. He's the King of Jobbers for a reason.
Again, hope that makes sense! I still need to actually reread the VN (I let OBS run on the background to record footage lol) so my memory isn't perfect by any means.
peak
Is there any slice of life stuff with heracles?
There's a few scenes in Hollow Ataraxia and Carnival Phantasm, but not too much on Herc I'm afraid. I imagine he's a tough character to write as a Berserker.
(but without getting into deep spoilers, I highly recommended Fate Strange Fake. You know how Berserker Herc is "technically" nerfed? Well, you get to see him flex a little in Strange Fake)
I am surprised you didnt mention the big adaptation problems in unlimited blade works
real lack of inner dialouge and exposition from the character leave alot unawanswered and not understood
especially when it comes to shirou who looses 70% of his entire character when his lacking all of his important inner dialouge they are a VERY crucial part and even the heavens feel movies which dont fully focus on shirou himself as they cut most of the other characters just for sakura STILL include those inner dialouge scenes because they are THAT important for the story
Oh trust me, I debated long and hard about how much to delve into Ufo's UBW issues on inner monologues.
I ultimately decided against it because the very next section explored the inner monologue problem and it would've felt redundant, and to be honest it's present in ALL the Type-Moon adaptations to some degree. Even KnK suffers because Shiki and especially Mikiya get next to no inner monologues, and like Shirou, their characters suffer...although Shiki obviously still gets ample characterization, so it's less of an issue for her.
UBW is unique in that it's arguably the one that suffers the most because it's essentially the Shirou route, so I'm in agreement that Ufo's handling of it is particularly bad. You know it's bad when the anime director fiat out says "yeah I didn't quite understand Shirou". BRUH that's the MAIN character lol.
In any case, I share the same opinion as you, and my goal is to hopefully explore Ufo's issues later down the road because it's a genuine criticism. Sometimes I feel like I go hard on Ufotable enough as is in past videos, so at times I try to temper the critiques so it's not just "Ufo dropped the ball" ad nauseum, if that makes sense.
I mean it is sort of the nature of adaptation and it's probably a problem that it wasn't made up for in other ways rather than not having it in general.
Yeah you summed up my thoughts, which is what I was trying to illustrate. The lack of inner thoughts isn't the major issue, as some things just don't work in a movie or series.
But the more damning mistake is the lack of replacement for inner thoughts. You know, for a few years I chalked it up to Fate/Shirou being hard to adapt, but what's weird is the Heaven's Trilogy DOES adapt Shirou's inner thoughts, AND has strong visuals to supplement the story, like the Wind of Steel sequence.
So my hunch is that it just depends on the production staff. Clearly something didn't quite work with UBW that was rectified in HF, so I think we just got unlucky with the adaptation.
I have a question. I have the eroge visual novel of Fate Stay Night on PC. Is it the same if I buy the global version on the Switch? I do love the Fate series having watch all the anime and games but I wonder should I get new Fate Stay Night on Switch?
So the global release follows the "official" Realta Nua release, which in short, is the censored version that replaced the eroge with things like the mana dragon and whatnot. If you've read the original version, you won't find anything you haven't seen before unless you read like the old old version that doesn't even have stuff like Last Episode.
However, I will say that I've generally seen more positive word of mouth on the official translation. It's a lot more readable compared to the ones you and I read back in the day.
And in addition, I think as a fan of the series, it's worth getting just to support the official release. Every official Type-Moon visual novel is out in the west, so if there's enough overseas support, I imagine we might get something like Tsukihime: The Other Side of Red Garden much MUCH sooner than part 1. I also just bought it mostly for this reason, it's literally been sitting unplayed on my Switch lol.
Also I personally like having FSN on Switch! I'm eventually gonna reread it for real later on in preparation for a follow up to this video, so I like having the option of reading it as I try to sleep or something.
@@ViviVariety ok then you convinced me to getting it and the Tsukihime series as well I saw as well. Yeah I do support Type Moon products they made. I just hope they make the anime version of the sequel of Fate Stay Night and also finish the Fate Illya movie because that last move is still on a cliffhanger. Again thank you for the help