Suppressors 101: Rob's Top 3 Back Pressure Mitigation Methods for Suppressors
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- Опубліковано 14 лип 2024
- Shooting with a suppressor can drastically effect the behavior and reliability of your rifle. In this vide Rob covers his favorite 3 methods for back pressure mitigation. There are many options on the market, Rob currently prefers using adjustable gas blocks such as the Riflespeed gas control, low back pressure suppressors and the Bootleg adjustable bolt carrier group.
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00:00 - Intro
00:31 - Negative Effects of Back Pressure
04:26 - High Flow Suppressors
05:32 - Adjustable Gas Blocks or Piston
09:04 - Adjustable Bolt Carrier Group - Спорт
![[TESTED] Do "Gas Busting" AR Charging Handles Actually WORK? | Part 1](/img/n.gif)
Great video. I’m going to try to be as concise as possible. My favorite method for this is building my AR with a shorter barrel in mind. Karl Lewis of LMT explains it best but the problem is the AR was built for a 20” barrel, when they shortened the barrel they never looked at the BCG and bolt until he was requested to do so by SOCOM in the early 2000’s due to all the Colt bolts breaking.
His solution was a completely redesigned bolt and BCG system that is meant to have a ton of gas to operate like a suppressed carbine system creates. The bolt features double spring/lobster tail extractor, fully supported case (he has the patent on this now), and the bolt is made out of a crazy steel that is basically indestructible. It’s the same metal that is used on fighter planes when their hook grabs the wire to land on aircraft carriers. It’s also chrome lined. And has relief cuts around the locking lugs that more evenly distribute the force.
The BCG has an extended and delayed cam path which delays how long it takes for the bolt to open which lowers pressure, it has sand cut rails to clear debris, it’s chrome lined where it’s needed, and it has gas ports drilled into that send the gas away from the shooters face. The system went 80k rounds of XM193 and never broke in their testing. The only broken bolt they have ever had is worn out springs for the extractor.
I also like the A5 system from Vltor to help smooth out the recoil impulse but this can stack tolerances with the Enhanced BCG from LMT.
The reason I prefer these methods over an adjustable gas system is I prefer everything to be as simple as possible. I prefer more gas than less gas so I can run whatever ammo I want and so that my rifle works well when it is dirty. the extra force of the gas really helps cycle the operation. the new flow through suppressors are really neat but they come with a lot of trade offs. They are louder, the warranty on some of them like HUXWRX is BS, some of them even need cleaning and maintenance. if you use ghe wrong cleaning solution you can make a lead compound thats transdermal! thats terrifying. However the best suppressors ever made are gassy like the AEM5 from Allen engineering.
So to me its not about limiting the gas, rather utilizing the gas. the LMT EBCG and bolt is unbelievably incredible, its also a unicorn and took me 1 year of weekly searching to find in stock, when i found one I paid 549 for it.
Whoever reads this full message deserves a BJ from someone, my autism sends me down rabbitholes lol.
hahaha great intel and i love the ending hahaha Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
I patiently await the aforementioned BJ.
Love the comment. Unfortunately she's in arizona.😂
Regarding your comment regarding LMT BCG, I learned that about 18 months ago, I bought (2) LMT BCG, and yes, costly at $500 each.
Everything will need cleaning and maintenance at some point.
Great info. I love Aero adjustable gas blocks. Cheap and great adjustment. I've used them on AR10 308s 6.5 300 blackout PSA KS47 and many 556 rifles. Great results with every gun I've put them on. Just one word of caution. If you're the type of person that does not clean their guns on the regular, the adjustable gas blocks may not be for you. You need to put a drop or two of oil on them every other range trip and move them through their whole cycle of clicks. If not they have a habit of freezing up/ carbon locking on you.
Good info, thanks for sharing!
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@@SilencerSyndicateYou should set up your rifle to fire in ALL weather conditions, not seasonally. I personally use seekins precision AGB. Once I'm done with how I set mine up there is never a need to adjust further. I find that xtac 55 grain out of all the 5.56 weights is the hardest to get last round hold open. Whenever I'm setting up a new gas block I put a box of rounds in double zip locked bags in salted ice water. Go to the range and take one out at a time and test last round hold open. Cold rounds have the worst burn rate FYI so you're going to get the lowest FPS, on top of the brand being the hardest to lock back. Continuing on, I get a consistent "on the edge" lock back and then open it up 1/8th of a turn more for good measure for extreme cold situations. Test again to ensure consistent lock back. Now you've ensured enough gas is used in operation of the bolt and the rest is used to propel the bullet.
This is the problem with most adjustable gas blocks for DI guns. There are a few -- like the Riflespeed-- that are less prone to it.
@@Spushedwhat if you only use that rifle seasonally? Saying things like "you need to" implies a level of absoluteness that doesnt apply, because what is really true is "if you only have one rifle and it is your general purpose rifle possibly used for defense you should set it up to work in all weather conditions"
Obviously thats long winded, but accurate... vs saying everyone should always do something no matter what.
I'm really enjoying your channel, learning alot! You do a great job of explaining and making your point without coming across as condescending. Keep the great content coming!
Thank you, much appreciated 🍻
Love your channel. Keep the content coming. I share the same opinion of hating back pressure being a lefty. I waited for a long time to get into suppressors game because of the gas. I’m now the proud owner of both a Ventum 7.62 and Dead Air Mohave 9. I love both of these cans. Will be looking to add a dedicated 5.56 and 22 can soon. Ever consider doing a tee shirt with your logo that says I hate back pressure? 😂
Thank you for the kind words. Funny you mention it, we're working on merch right now. Hopefully we'll have some cool gear out in the near future.
hahah love it! so funny that we were just talking about that. we love doing this but we both have kids and cant feed them likes haha some killer T's could help us feed our kids. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
My deer rifle is a CMMG Resolute 350 Legend. With an Omega 36M can on front, I’ve noticed all of the back pressure symptoms you mentioned, but since I’m only shooting a few shots, the effects are minimal. That said, I noticed my buffer spring twangs a lot more than normal so I’ve upgraded to a braided spring and H2 buffer.
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Another enjoyable video, thank you. One thing that I don't think you've tried is downward gas ejecting Carrier groups,(Kak) I've used them and they make quite a difference. You can then tune them with a rubber city gaskey or adjustable gas block.
Yes, we need to test one. we have reached out to them.. well actually they commented in this vid so we are talking to them now hahah Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
@@Ertactical Very excited!! I made a differece to me.
@@johnL-xk2js awesome! thanks for supporting the channel!
Truly enjoy the open and honest reviews plut the explanations to provide us "newbies" with sufficient information to find the right suppessor for our application(s). Keep it coming and I am looking forward to your PTR review of the perfect or close to perfect, suppressor.
thank you! we love hearing that. PTR vid will likely be out in a few hours! =)
Ive always liked the idea of using buffers and springs. Adjustable gas blocks have always been finicky and extra adjustments that may be very inconvenient or even inconsistent.
Currently testing through my rifles with a suppressor, but my 13.7 i set up with an adjustable gas block and have to run it fully open unsupressed. Put an h2 buffer and carbine spring and it runs smooth and damn near perfect ejection at 4-4:30. Put a sandman s on it and it ejects at 3. Very minimal gas noticed using a raptor sd. You smell it a little more than without but not much and no teary feeling.
That is one way. For me, I still get gassed out when chancing buffer springs and buffer weights. but you can try the different Spring-co springs and an H2 or H3. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Some barrels/gas systems are already “low gas” by design so adjustable gas blocks are worthless. My Geissele 14.5 and 16 inch barrels as well as my BA 13.9 barrels with mid length gas systems are very low gas and don’t need adjustable gas blocks (even with high back pressure cans). However my Faxon 13.9” and Daniel defense 16” are higher gas and need something to tame them. My 18” BA (.308) and 18” criterion are very low gas and shoot better with some added back pressure.
Education.
And experimentations Is the key. It's a rabbit trail With a rabbit hole.You'll have to find your own perfect self.
well said! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
You guys are doing an amazing job with very informative segments related to suppressors. I feel it couldn't come at a better time, specially since it seems that lately the silenced community (no pun intended) is substantially growing. On the topic of gas mitigation, the points brought up are on top of the list. A point I feel that wasn't mentioned but, that will eventually become evident when following your processes, is factory overgassed platforms. From what little I know, I've learned that several firearms designs, are purposefully overgassed to obtain a better reliability ratio in the long run and under adverse conditions. I believe this is important to identify within your platform since thresholds are different. I've learned that if you're able identify and tune it, you'll pleasantly enjoy it, with a better experience.
Thanks for the kind words, glad we could help bring more information to the community. We appreciate your support 🍻
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What I learned about an 11.75 mid gas .078 gas port with superlative fully open bleed off….
Not just the cans design or blast chamber.
But A huge factor w/ pressure is the muzzle device and especially the muzzle device in the BC and how efficiently it can expand those gases.
Diameter, first baffle free bore, MD vent shapes locations.
The initial pressure load
In short: muzzle device (QD) can be significant when your tuning mass, gas and spring.
nice! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
I just ordered my first two suppressors. I am learning. One is integrated YHM 10 1/2 Turbo and the YHM Fat Cat.
nice!! we have some of those on the way for testing! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Thanks for the intel.
Thanks for watching 🍻
Pretty much covered it all. For your next challenge, figure out how to get the gas out of your face in a suppressed blow back design. Thanks Rob, for breaking it down. As to what I like and don't about the 3 options, functionality is more important than 3 db of sound reduction.
totally agree!!! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
I recently converted an AR 300 blk pistol into a SBR. I built it with a Ballistic Advantage 10.3 barrel with a Superlative Arms adjustable gas block. I just got Sandman S can for it. Since I heard about the gas in the face issue, I got a Lantac Enhanced BCG and a Radian Raptor-SD charging handle. I have not shot the rifle yet but am looking forward to it.
nice! sounds like a killer set up! lots of room for tuning, Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
A lot of folks on Facebook suppressor groups say gas blocks suck and to change the buffer weight
That is one way. For me, I still get gassed out when chancing buffer springs and buffer weights. but you can try the different Spring-co springs and an H2 or H3. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Adjustable gas blocks are fine if you buy the right one. Two things to consider: Bleed off vs restrictive and serviceable vs non-serviceable. Bleed off gas blocks are great as they vent the extra gas out of the gas block. Get something you can service as the parts wear over high round counts.
Changing the buffer spring and weight can work well to slow down the BCG and that makes a better shooting experience (and less wear and tear) but it does nothing for the gas coming back into the chamber.
Great information and well presented. 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
Thanks! We appreciate you.
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Good stuff, gas in the face is the worst part, thought that before and still think it after.
love it! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Superlative arms adj gas blocks for my rifles! I know adj g.b. are known to carbon lock, but haven't had issue(s) with this on f.arms (yet)
Good info, thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
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Great video - thanks for adding to the community! These are the 3 obvious/most common things to do. Future video ideas - what are the "more advanced" ways to reduce gas?
yes! agreed! there are many more options.. maybe we will make a follow on vid.. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
I have the Sharp’s Adjustable BCG, pricey but great
I need to get one of those for testing.. thanks!!
Thanks for adding to the discussion!
Huxwrx is the king if putting on a can turns a perfectly gassed rifle super overgassed.
MK18 is a perfect example since it has a big gas port and super short dwell time. Huxwrx keeps that same 3-4 o'clock without any additional gas to the face. SUPER smooth and soft shooting it's like a perfectly gassed higher end rifle. All that's left is a good CH such as Radian SD to 'patch' the hole against your nose.
Yes I tested the same setup(DD4 MK18 RIII, Super42 H2) and with even H3 on a baffled can, 1-2 o'clock and kicks almost like a blowback PCC. All using mil-ball 5.56, and tried some 223 for reliability, 100%.
Two other people at the range also tried it and are very impressed.
they def don't need tuning and i live it! you can def make a smoother gun if you do tune just a little but these low BP cans really are killer! we have much more on that topic coming soon. you are def right about the MK18. she is gassy! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Great video, keep it coming 👌🏼
Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
And here I am with an LMT so I can't swap the gas block without a function penalty. Good news is that even unsuppressed it's very mildly gassed so if you pair it with their enhanced bolt and carrier and play around with an A5 buffer, you can get a very nice shooting gun.
Oh good! yea there are some sweet gats out there but I loved My LMT 308/6,5 so much!!! but it was WAY over gas with a can.. like ejecting at the 1:00! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
I’ve always been weary of adjustable gas blocks and bolt carrier groups because of hearing about bad reliability on fighting guns so I’ve always tuned at the buffer and dealt with the gas. That’s one reason I’m excited about getting my first LBP suppressor. I should’ve got a OSS/HuxWrx years ago but never did. I’m waiting on an RC3 to pair with my RC2 but planning to buy A Flow556k and A YHM R9 once stock comes back!
Yeah I hear you. We've had mostly good experiences with the Riflespeed gas block. However a low back pressure suppressor is a good way to address the root of the problem. Thanks for watching 🍻
totally! a low BP can makes these problems go away, That is one way. For me, I still get gassed out when chancing buffer springs and buffer weights. but you can try the different Spring-co springs and an H2 or H3. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
My most recent build was also the first time I'd installed an adjustable gas block. Not the first rifle I have with an adjustable, my Ruger SR556C and PWS 308 both have them but those are piston guns and basically impossible to change out parts. As for the adjustable block on the rifle I just put together, it's the Riflespeed one. Hadn't seen your videos until after I did the build but doing some research it seemed to be a really solid item that a lot of people love. After the two range trips with the rifle I'm totally sold on it, able to use two different cans (one flow through, one not) and adjust it for both easily on the fly. Tempted to start tearing rifles apart and installing one on each but that would get expensive in a hurry.
100%! I do love that gas block, it is $ and it takes some tuning, most of the time. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
I considered an adjustable BCG briefly. My issue is that they don't reduce the amount of schmoo entering the upper and they tend to be louder at the ejection port. I got lucky on my 11.5 with just an H2. On my AR308 I use a Superlative Arms gas block and it's very nice. I've had to talk myself down from the Riflespeed block several times now lol.
hahah i hear yea. I do love mine and i have a few. But they are $$$ and it takes a good bit of tinkering. that you for staying with us and commenting on most all of our vids, man it helps! thank you
Great video!
Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Back pressure gas face may not over gas your eyes/ air to breath.
But even a quick blast can keep your attention from focusing on connecting with target.
If I am blinking or even squinting from shots I consider it intolerable.
High BP requires springs and buffers to be heavier generally .
agreed! lots of bad there. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Granular balanced eval as always.
Thank you! ❤
too kind, thanks! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
I'm sure the problems are worse as a left handed shooter but as a right handed shooter, I've never really been gassed by my Bootleg adjustable BCG. The gas definitely comes out of the ejection port but it seems it kicks the gas almost at a 90 degree angle and typically away from the face. Just my two cents for anyone considering a Bootleg. No issues so far in a couple thousand round but i take care of my stuff.
One of the ones I never hear talked about is the YHM Suppressed gas block. It's literally a regular gas block, but with a gas port that's drastically smaller than normal, and is chamfered. It has the chamfer on the gas port so it's easy for you to drill out to the size that suits your build the best. It takes way more DIY to get setup properly, and it's not really adjustable, but it's also $20 and probably the cheapest, lightest, and most reliable way to lower your gas. Perfect for guys who have a specific gun that has a specific dedicated can. I wish I had known about it a long time ago.
Thanks for the suggestion, we'll have to look into it as we will have some YHM cans coming for testing in the not too distant future.
@@SilencerSyndicate I think one of the main reasons more people don't know about it is that the description on YHM's website leaves something to be desired, and i don't think i've ever seen it be advertised.
My first can was a YHM Resonator K. Not the best performing can in any metric, but it was fairly cheap and is built like a tank. Some folks complain about the Phantom QD muzzle devices having issues, but I have 3 and they've never given me any issues. Hope you have as good of luck as I did.
Or you can use a seekins precision adjustable gas block and save days of removing drilling testing repeat.
just looked it up, smaller port by 50%. interesting ill study more! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
@@Ertactical If I remember right, out of the box it has a .055 gas hole.
I suffered what's called a PVD due to the back pressure, gas and lead particles, etc hitting my right eye while shooting my FN 545 with my Rugged Obsidian 45. I now have floaters in my right eye. I still shoot suppressed but am extra careful with my eye protection. I'm interested in replacing my older suppressors with suppressors with the newer technology. It really hurts now when I get even a small amount of gas in my right eye.
The Suppressed Setting still getting most of the way through the action cycle could also mean that your rifle is wildly overgassed on Standard, as opposed to it not cutting much gas off, yeah?
For what it's worth, my AUG will function flawlessly on Suppressed even with a HUXWRX HXQD556. I didn't think to take the can off and try it when I was at the range last, but I doubt that the HXQD is adding enough back pressure to take the rifle from malfunctioning to flawless operation, lol.
nice! yea those HUX really do well with the lack of gas BP! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
I'd love to see you try out the KAK industry K spec downward venting BCG. Especially as a fellow lefty, it looks very promising.
we have one on the way! will test soon. thank you for your positive feed back and support! =)
Sharps bros makes an adjustable bcg. I have one, and at the back of the gas key, there is a set screw you can adjust the gas with. I only have around 200 rds on it, but so far, so good.
I didn't know that, thank you! we will reach out to them, you rock! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Wish I had these videos before I started my own experimenting.
My current set up:
Harvester Evo
Bootleg BCG
Radian Raptor SD
8.5” .300 blk
Pistol gas system with no adjustable gas block (wanted to try other options first, knowing AGBs were going to have the biggest effect.)
My newest test is the PSA jakl that has a built in AGB + is piston driven. Waiting on a lower that arrives tomorrow to complete the build and and try it out.
The main problem with this, that is the same with the brn180, is there are no other gas mitigation options (that I’m aware of) like in a traditional AR. I can’t go with a bootleg BCG or a Raptor SD
you and me both hahaha the things i have learned in the years of tinkering. Id have saved tons of $ if i knew then what I know now. Our goal it to help the industry same $ and be happy with their cans. too many 8 month waits followed by disappointment. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Can you do a video on which rifle has less blowback especially for left handed shooters : DI AR with a baffled can tuned with riflespeed gas block vs short stroke piston paired with flow through can?
I have a DI 308 with a baffled can and a riflespeed GB and a Bren 2 with a flowthrough, it’d be interesting to see your results as I’m convinced both configurations are very very close minimally blowback
yes! we will def need to do some vids about good vs bad hosts for can. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Thanks for all of the content so far! One thing I'm curious about is the effects of brake vs flash hider muzzle device for QD suppressor systems. Is back pressure affected by the choice of muzzle deivce?
We'll be shooting a video on muzzle devices and adapters this week, we'll make sure to address that in the video, stay tuned!
@@SilencerSyndicate That's awesome! We are all benefiting greatly from your work
great topics! We will look into it. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
I didn’t even know an adjustable bcg existed
they are a huge help! glad we could share that info with you
Or get a primary weapons system (PWS) and there glorious long stroke piston system with bleed off holes in the tube and adjustable gas block and run a larger verity of suppressors with very very minimal gas back where you don't want it. Just my two cents with my 3 PWS rifles and suppressors.
yes they are one of a few great hosts.. we will need to do a vid on good vs bad hosts for cans. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
You ever try the KAK K-spec down venting bcg?
never herd of em, found em now that you said something and Ill reach out to them. thank you! you rock! will test Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Was gonna leave this reply if someone else hadn't already. I've been hoping to hear some more fleshed out evaluations of them before I snag one
I have only gotten about 60 rounds through mine since I just go it, on a 12.5 mid length. It definitely cut the gas to the face by about 70%. The dual ejector bolt was slinging my brass at 4:00 instead of the 2:00 I was getting before. I’m not sure if the dual ejector is why or the gas porting though.
I have an original omega that i installed the 5.56 cap and direct thread mount on, with terrible back pressure on a sig 516 even with the piston block on suppresed. Even with a Radian charging handle i still look lie rockie racon after 200 rounds. Silecerco says shouldn't be as much so i guess I have to deal with it.
ouch! hope this vid helped
Commenting just to drive up engagement.
Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Riflespeed and hux ftw
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Laughs in K-SPEC
Given all that you’re doing for the suppressor manufacturing industry the ASA should be paying for all of your ammo
😆...yeah, that would be nice. We're getting there with each new subscriber. Big players in the industry are quickly taking notice. Thanks for watching 🍻
I didn't even think to reach out to them! good call! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
@@Ertactical They’re getting a free ride on your back
@@triprack they totally are! thanks for thinking of that. we sent them an email.
@@Ertactical Need your professional advice. Looking at an LMT ION 556K but practically no real reviews on UA-cam. Will live on a LMT 12” piston shovelnose SBR (mostly) Opinion?
Any recommendations on buffer weight and spring for mitigating a high back pressure suppressor?
That's a very big question. We're looking to do an advanced back pressure mitigation video very soon.
def more of a trial and test for best results.
If you really dislike gas in your face you should try out the Keltec RDB Defender.
Not a huge fan of that brand. I have tested several of their guns and they are nifty but nothing I’d fall in love with.
I wonder if running a can without the front cap makes a difference
it can reduce BP but increase sound.
Cleaned mine a lot initially but haven’t in probably 6-8 K rounds 22 lr and 17 HMR. LAZY hahaaa
hahah lazy, imma call it efficient
Just put the huxwrx ventum on my 14.5 5.56. H2 buffer weight. Radian charging handle.
0 gas to the face
Cycles great
Last round hold open
But I have a 1:30 - 2:30 ejection pattern. Whats the correct remedy?
nice!! yeah its over gaming a bit.. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
@@Ertactical try an h3 buffer?
@0:22 ... Yeag, 'cause I''m a f*cking child bro. You already lost me. Peace!
Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Worst? Gas to the face.
Rubber City Armory BCG with adjustable gas key.
KAK K-spec BCG with down vents.
Yes! agreed.. they KAK commented on this vid so we will reach out to them to get testing.. the Ruger city i have not herd of. we will reach out. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Do piston gas systems result in less gas in the face relative to direct impingement?
it should... hahaha should.. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Dead Air Sierra 5 will kill you dead. Running one on a 11.5” carbine length gas system with .050” gas port (suppressed barrel) and A5 buffer system and still over gassed.
she is small but man that GAS!! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Curious to hear about Witt machine suppressors, they claimed minimal back pressure. Is it real?
we have reached out to them. have not herd back yet. we will keep trying. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Why not use the BRT gas tube?
its only one gas setting. Ill reach out to them for testing but it seems risky. We will know if they ship one our way. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Burning eyes. LOL
haha you like the close up haha Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Talk talk talk lol
hahaha Thank you =)
Probably the lead poisoning and cancer. Those are probably the worst parts of backpressure. Just a guess tho. 😂
big time.. scary stuff! Thank you for the positive feed back and support!
Just wear a gas mask.
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Bruh learn to pronounce "carbine" please
thanks
Get an Huxwrx/OSS, call it a day.
well said, as mentioned the best way is a Low BP can. like them.. they are not too quiet but it up to the buyer to know and choose his adventure .. Thank you for the positive feed back and support!