How to lead a trad route?
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- Опубліковано 29 бер 2017
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Great video, as far as teaching a novice like myself, this is a fantastic rough draft. I don't need to know all the expert maneuvers, I just want to know a safe way. Every experience is a learning one, once finished, look at where we can improve, look at what we did well, where can we become better. All the comments are just positive reinforcement... Or people who know too much, in which case, this video is not for you. Great job guys
I don't even climb but this was quite relaxing to watch :) Im fascinated by what goes into climbing, thats why i watched in the first place. This guy got a soothing voice haha!
This video made me feel like I could try trad climbing! Cheers legends
I hesitate to comment. Many useful tips which would have been helped by further explanation. Also when I was being taught at Glen More Lodge, they cautioned about putting all your belay gear in the same crack system- if it expands then you have nothing. They also encouraged having three pieces in for a belay. Otherwise thank you for your time and effort in sharing.
Want lots of criticism??? Just upload a trad climbing video😁
of course it doesn't hurt that he calls it "how to trad lead"
Lol, there's so many whiny little bitches in these comments.
cool i think i’m ready
That "nice finishing handhold" is slightly moving :)) at min 7:55
hahah seen it !
I nearly jumped off the sofa when that moved!
1:52
I'm detecting some sass
This was helpful. Thank you!
Lol, i climb in this quarry quite often, that route is no pushover at the grade. Not a bad video. The wobbly flake has been wobbly forever. The back clipping and Z clipping is clearly resolved by the time he tops out. Two piece anchor is fine, unless the placements are shit, which they are not. You can't really get a decent cam in as the first piece, i know because ive tried. And rope behind the leg? So what the guy clearly isn't a punter, look how he moves - a minor point, but i can see how if you are a pedant it may upset you.
PianoNoob I put the rope around the leg thing in the shit happens category. Especially when concentrating on putting in placements and talking to camera. And easy to do with a narrow foot placement.
Shoutout to him for narrating while climbing.
This is a brilliant video
Did anyone else see that flake move when he hung on it?
Yes, at 7:57 it moved a bit just as he said "nice finishing hold". I wonder if he noticed. That was weird, as it looked quite solid.
Yep
scary :O
Just saw that. Woah..
4:33 very good right foot positioning :D very proffesional!
Can we get a video of how you get back down without leaving your anchor gear at the top?
@@etherealturmoil ... the edge. 😂
They probably walk down somehow. If it was a popular climbing spot, someone would have left a rap station behind for other to use or possibly would have bolted the top.
Bolts and pythons?
We don’t bolt this stuff. They walk off the back.
We usually choose the hardest way up and there's often a way we can walk off or do an easy solo (no rope) downclimb. These days, many established routes have a permanent anchor at the top too even when the local climbing scene is otherwise opposed to bolting (drilling an anchor to clip into instead of carrying protection up with you like in this video)
4:00 leg behind rope. if you fall it would turn you upside down. watch out for this folks!
I love watching climbing videos on youtube. The best are the "my trad rack" videos with the guys who own every peice of protection by the same manufacturer and its all new, not a scratch on it... ha. (Disclaimer : This video does not in any way substitute for proper instruction nor does it cover proper belay or rope management technique.)The reality is this video is gobbs good and indeed worthy of praise from any sport climber who already knows how to climb safely. Hell, if you are the type of person to ream a group of climbers for making an excellent informative production - you sir are clearly not a climber - not with that attitude.
Pshaw
Sick vintage HIM graffiti 😂
Anyone else see the hold at 7.57 move a little when he grabs it?
Yep that's terrifying lol
It’s always like that
Hey, just a quick question. You set up an anchor at the top and attached it to you via the figure of 8 on the rope, not the harness. How do you set up a belay so the next climber can come up without detaching yourself again (cause u would need to untie that main rope to set up a belay) and if something did happen to the climber below, how can you escape the system to go and get help whilst keeping the climber on the wall. Not criticising :) just curious. Thanks. I know this vid is years old :)
No need to untie to set up the belay. at the point of the end of the video, he would pull up all the slack rope between him and his partner, then put him on belay and bring him up. No untying occurs for this to happen. I'm guessing from the configuration that he plans to belay off his harness to bring up the partner. if/when they rappel down, they'd have to untie to set up the rappel though.
What kind and size rope do you use in this video also what harness do you have?
dmm renegade harness. I own one and it's pretty lightweight for a comfy harness
what happen to achors below?
It would have been safer to clip in to the first piece of gear at the top when setting up the anchor. this would have protected a accidental fall when you are moving around adjusting the anchor.
He wasn't using a rope to build the belay so it would've been impractical
I know this is a stupid question, but how do you retrieve all the gear you placed going up once you reach the top? Does your buddy lower you back down on belay and you get it on the way back down?
Gerald Berliner Well, you climb to the top placing the gear. Then you stay at the top and the second climber climbs up afterwards, taking all the gear out. Then you either abseil or walk off together if it’s a short climb, or repeat until you get to the top.
@@teamBMCTV Thank you for clearing up that little mystery for me :)
@@teamBMCTV You placed protection at the top to create your anchor. How do you get back down without losing gear if there's no walk off?
KingKahn same question...
Bryan Mestre if there’s no walkoff, you lose whatever is at the top of the route... most well known climbs have anchors already that you can lower off of though.
I'm kinda disappointed you didn't show the belay and cleaning ...
Question: Is it not necessary to place a multi-directional piece for the first placement. Opposing nuts or Cam to help with the outward pull on the lower piece in case of fall.
That would be up to you. I find it isn't necessary most of the time with a proper extender and a well seated peice of pro. Just weigh the factors and decide if you think it is warranted
First piece should definitely be multi-directional. The angle of the rope from the belayer will have an upward component of force when the rope is pulled tight and could pull a nut right out and cause multiple nuts to pull. The dreaded Zipper effect.
My thought as well, this video not current thinking put an upward chock or a multidirectional piece to protect agains the reverse zipper (bottom up)
It only matters if your belayer is standing far enough from the bottom of the climb to cause an outward pull on the piece. Sure, do it if you feel safer that way, but it isn't always necessary, and is often not possible on harder climbs
You have it right though when I teach people to lead I would cover that as a necessary bit of education and here I would have thought it would be the case as it is how to lead trad.
But how do you retrieve all the gear you left at the top for your anchor ?
I get it if there’s a way to walk off, but if there isn’t?
Bryan Mestre down climb
Where is that ?
does anyone now exactly where this was shot? country? Specific location
Hi Noah - this was at Wilton Quarry on 'the Prow' in Lancashire - North England. You can find the crag here: www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crag.php?id=328
And here... www.rockfax.com/wp-content/uploads/intros/WG-Preview.pdf
Did he not know the rope was around his leg the entire time he was placing his 3rd piece of protection? Could have been a really bad fall due to flipping upside down. Surprised the belayer said nothing about it too... not nice
He would get flipped upside down and would probably hit his head on the ground. There is a mat and he's wearing a helmet, but could still be an injury.
Bet you're the kind of guy who comments on free soloing videos saying *this isn't safe he hasn't got any protection at all blah blah* nobody cares
I mean, this is supposed to be an informational video. I don't think that is a fair comparison to make.
It wasn't wrapped around his leg, he was just stood over it.
you've never rocked climbed and just watched a few videos on it and are criticizing this video LOL
You forgot the most important thing a flask of tea..
I have so many questions.
could you please a solo climb that demonstrates proper protection?
Third piece of gear. Is it me or is the carabiner clipped to the wire on the edge of the rock? Wouldn't a fall on that just bend/snap it?
It was probably lying flat on the ledge, which would be fine, as long as the sling is what's going over the edge. You're correct that a carabiner loaded over an edge will break much easier.
Sometimes with horizontal placements I've noticed that even if the placement is good, the carabiner will still be loaded over the edge, and finding another placement is the only safe option.
Dudeeee . I totally was looking and thinking that when I got down to your comment. OMG!.
Was about to say the same. Gate facing in the direction of the climb is asking for trouble.
Three anchor points! Much better than two! A personal anchor system for tying into the anchor is a necessary "redundant" safety precaution factor.
A personal anchor system is the marker of a true punter
Two bomber placements is sufficient but better if they are in different crack systems unless you know the rock is solid. Size of pro matters. Small placements are harder to assess as bomber. I personally would have looked for a third placement but that looked OK.
The cam on the belay at the end doesn't look good, I would have put and hex or nut instead
First bit of pro is back clipped isn't it?
Nope, the draw is just twisted. It sorts itself out while climbing past it/clipping the second pro. Good eye for safety though!
the draw is twisted because the belayer is standing awkwardly behind him with the rope running across his back.
It's z clipped
Watch closely again from 3:04. He’s not back clipped nor Z clipped :) the camera angles and rope position do make it look that way tho
The climbing community is so critical. Everyone is just picking holes in the guy. It's disgusting. If you spend time watching video's from the surf/ski/kayak & BASE communities, the viewers thank people for their helpful films, or enjoy the fun & show respect. The climbing community needs to grow up & support each other
It's important to be critical when errors can cause death
What route is this?
Dawn at Wilton Quarries somewhere in Wales i think err Lancashire
It is Dawn HVS 5b on the inside of the Prow in Wilton 1, Bolton, Lancashire.
Do the 'nuts' ever pull out due to the angle of uplift from climbing higher than the nut lodge point?
How i can get down with all my equipment??
Say a few hail Mary's and jump
Is that third carabiner getting loaded from the side? If so isn't it's strength rating severely compromised?
How does he retrieve the gear? No video ever describes it
It really depends on where you are. For this climb I bet they can walk off, so after he belays up his buddy who takes the gear off the route they can walk down
Many established climbing areas have fixed anchors with rappelling rings hanging from chains if no walk off is available. Or sometimes you can use a beefy live tree. Other times people leave slings around a tree with rap rings that serves as a rappelling station. It may be necessary to add new slings since they degrade with UV exposure. The guide book (or other climb beta) will usually tell you your options.
HIM
I thought someone had to spot that. From my home country! :)
Would anyone else put a piece in using a choke stone like he did on the second piece???
So many pros in the comment section.
Situation normal. All I know is that this guy knows waaaaaaay more than I do, so I’ll listen and learn.
i hate lead climbing i feel so much pressure, i keep thinking if a piece of gear fails its my fault
Is two pieces of trad gear adequate as an anchor?
He explained this
If the placements are really good it is fine. It meets minimum requirements.
If you have Hexs, try Incantations
One bit - I wouldn't advise placing gear above head.
Main reason is that it's harder to inspect. Much easier to pick & place the right piece in front of you, than above. I mean sometimes it's the thing to do, but ime 90% of the time it isn't. Loads of benefits to placing in front (inspection, better flow in your climb, not pulling a bunch of slack & potentially needlessly extending your fall, more efficient energy-wise...). No real benefits, other than psychological "safety" that isn't really, in place above.
Please change your intro sounds
you guys need to calm down... while I don't think this is an amazing video, he doesn't do anything catastrophically dangerous or 'wrong'
Ha ha, If he'd been on any decent instructor course he would have failed miserably!
But he hasn’t failed though has he lol
Blake Williams He’s doing a how to video and is teaching people bad habits.. That’s the problem
@@lukeaurand5722 I dont understand the second half of your comment why is above the head a high risk fall. He will climb more while falling less distance since his peice is higher.
john rusty When he pulls his rope towards the price he adds around and extra 4-6 feet of rope into his belay which would increase the fall by 4-6 feet. If he would’ve placed/clipped at the waist, there would be no extra rope in the system. I understand that some situations only allow for a high placement but he repeatedly puts protection high and clips high when it is not necessary
Wow having a hard time finding all the mistakes. This guy shouldn't be teaching people how to climb. The lack of multidirectional 1st piece, the rope around the leg, the Z clip at 3:04 which I think is caused by partly by the twisted draw on the previous piece. The third piece almost looks like his biner is over an edge (the one attached to the nut) Tops out places a nut and doesn't clip to it. A small thing but it avoids falling while setting up the belay properly. Also while 2 is a minimum 3 is a better number of pieces for the belay station particularly when 2 pieces are in the same crack. ie if the nut fails the first thing it does is slam into the cam. Anyways good on you for trying but read the comments below go back and redo the video correcting the list of errors. As a note I have made all these errors at one time or another myself, it's just I don't do it while on a video titled "how to lead a trad route" Good luck
Agree, however it's not a Z clip at 3:04 as you can see later when he climbs.
@@einSpike if you look closely around 3:20 you can see that he actually fixed it between shots.
@@JamieBenoir I thought that was the case, too, but upon closer inspection I conclude the opposite...
Still good points of criticism Brian, I was cringing all the time watching.
my dog ran up that
Would you really have this much time to place gear on a harder trad route?
No, not really. But that's why it's a harder route.
This definitely is not safe. I have never trad climbed before but if I ever decide to I would be way more conservative. I think a good principle is that you should always assume your last one is going to rip. Have enough margin that including slack, the last one ripping and everything else you are definitely not going to hit the ground. If there is a 10% chance of the last one ripping or even a 1% chance and you haven't accounted for that then the 100th fall you take might be deadly. If you account for the last one failing its at least in an ideal scenario down to 1 in 10k. (Or whatever probability you assume..)
The guys made a brave move putting his head above the parapet, as the climbing community loves to bitch and criticise videos like this. If you watch videos from other communities, like paddlers, skiers, and base jumpers, they respect each other and enjoy the experience. It's a disgraceful trait we have as a community.
I have noticed this but maybe because at the end of the day your life is on the line you will form strong opinions about your methods. Disclaimer- im not a climber
@@mikeanderson8601 Unfortunately the climbing community are very bad for this. People from other adventure sports don't do it, they just enjoy other peoples fun
Need to clip some gear at the top before building an anchor. 3 pc anchor. Slings should have overhand not fig 8 knot. Bit untidy and unsafe at top.
they hold approx the same strenght but overhand is harder to untie if not impossible sometimes.. I wouldn't use it but I rather like to know your reasons for choosing it :)
where would the third bit go? To be redundant it just needs two pieces.
in ten minutes bahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
9:58 It looks like you're clipped into your 8 knot. Figure 8 knots aren't meant to be loaded like that. (It's the same as a flat figure 8 for joining ropes when rappelling -- it can roll). You should clove hitch in to the anchor or clip to your belay loop.
Don't fix mistakes off camera and then not address them :/
Crumpets and Tea for all ya Wankers
Rob hates you, he decided to not have you on a GriGri.
For the love of god do not. Set up a belay like that!
It seems to me that stopping and placing so much gear greatly increases the chances of taking a fall. Letting go with one hand and messing with all that gear must have made the climber pumped. Also, spending that much time on a lead increases the chances of being attacked by a bird or getting hit by a nasty storm. This climber would have been far safer if he only placed two pieces. Also, he should have left behind the helmet and the crash pad, they only create a false sense of security and weight you down on the approach.
Yer may as well just free solo it mate, no distractions 100% wont hurt when you fall, promise
Buster Jesik the helmet isnt for falling... Well not directly, it prevents headinsuries from falling rocks and bumping it in a overhang. Aboutthe equipment... This isnt sportsclimbing. Its not the meaning to climbe 9a routs this stile.
This also greatly depends on the quality of the holds. If when he stops to place gear he is on a nasty crimp or sloper with bad footing, then yes you are correct, but if there is a good rest spot with good holds then you are very much wrong.
Seriously no one understood this super-obvious sarcasm ?
everything brand new, what bollox
2:51 He backcliped
no he did not, are you blind?
you are teaching?!!! spotting with all fingers spread, slack, belayer in fallarea before 3 quickdraw, leg behind rope...
The third extender is clipped with the gate to the direction of the climb. A whipper there may unclip the rope. Really sketchy and definitely not advisable. And the fact that the belayer doesn't yell the leaders ears off for it makes me question the general approach to safety on display here. It is a grave mistake in any kind of lead, much more so on trad.
3.23... are you joking.. awful mistake guys, really weakens the rest of the advice when you are unable to clip a quickdraw. mistakes happen we all get that, you should of rerecorded the video as that was a serious mistake.
it wasn't a back clip if that is what you were thinking
No it wasn't a backclip, he grabs the belayers side of the rope and clips that above the first quickdraw. watch really close and you'll see that they change it in the next shot.
i can see why it looked like that to you, but that is not the case. if he had done that you would see an obvious z clip. watch again from about 3:05 and you will see that it looked like he was grabbing the wrong side of the rope because of the belayer's position, but did in fact clip correctly.
Leon Simpkin is right, he clipped the wrong rope, they must have edited the video and cut the bit where they sorted out the ropes. Still I believe is not needed to record it all over again because you only notice it if you are very detailed with that particular scene, which doesn't defeat at all the whole purpose of the video
Nope he didn't clip the wrong rope. Look at 3:04 you can see belay rope to the right, climber rope to the left. At 3:19 you can clearly see him take the left rope.
THIS IS BAD ADVICE !! For safety sake, this video should be taken down. Within the first four minutes there are no less than 5 errors or oversights by the leader and belayer. The worst error? The leader ACTIVELY puts the rope behind his leg with his body position! AN UNFORGIVABLE MISTAKE, especially bad this close to the ground and with a high fall factor of close to .9 [falling nearly as many feet as the length of rope between a belayer and climber is roughly a .9 factor fall and very violent].....
Three separate things could be done to prevent the worst sin of a lead climber, rope behind the leader's leg.
1) The leader could move his hips back to the left.
2) The leader should have 'scooped' the rope with his right toe while he
was stepping up. The third option is the best and even a moderate level
climber would have done this instinctively.
3) The belayer could notice the rope behind his leader's leg and move to the left which would pull the rope off the back of the leaders right leg, however he may trip on the bouldering pad and pull the leader off the wall. I'm choking on irony. Bouldering pads are for bouldering.
... About belaying, sometimes the belayer can re-position and solve the problem faster than a verbally warning could. But on a multi-pitch, for example, a verbal warning is the only option.
None of these things happened. Sometimes (most times), its just better to get on with things and stop faffing = less chance of falling off in the first place
YOU SIR ARE COMPLETELY WRONG AND A DANGER TO NEW CLIMBERS TRYING TO LEARN!! AT 3:52 THE ROPE IS ACROSS THE BACK OF YOUR RIGHT LEG!! You should have been conscience that the rope was on your leg and used that as a teaching moment!! Instead you decided to say something ridiculous "I'm not conscience now" "That I'm quite away above my first bit of gear now" ANOTHER FALSEHOOD! Your gear was at the level of your foot!! STOP TRYING TO MAKE UA-cam MONEY BY TEACHING CLIMBING, YOU ARE CLEARLY VERY UNQUALIFIED TO TEACH CLIMBING AND A DANGER TO NEW CLIMBERS!
I've climbed for over 20 years. Sure, you are correct in regards to the rope. However, a climber doesn't just randomly fall off a climb for no reason! You know when you are safe,.... the best thing to do is get some gear in quickly and in well. You can faff about with where the rope is afterwards or just before you decide to let go and fall off
Having had a big whipper with the rope behind my leg I agree with Andrews on this one. My foot slipped while setting my point of safety. I will never have the rope behind my leg again!
cilmber actually doesn't fall of for no reason, but he can fall, without actually knowing he is going to fall(falling due to an exploding hold, or a slip is always an option) in that case you have to time to jump away from the rock or otherwise preppare for the fall. Never have the rope behind your fucking leg, it's the least you can do to prevent cracking your head open
A nut for a first piece? And belayer standing so far back promoting zipper on a non-multidirectional first piece? Rope behind leg in vulnerable position? TWO PIECE ANCHOR? This is poor instruction and should be taken down - can promote accidents in people trying to learn online.
You first point is absolutely correct but I'd say that if you have two top notch pieces of gear with great rock quality two is enough. That being said, when you are less experienced, having a third piece can be a good idea if you are unsure of how bomber your pro is.
Not a good instructional video
Sorry, but I started climbing in 1971. You can call this "trad climbing," but that isn't in any way "traditional climbing." Sorry.
what ever is happening to climbing?.they are just steeple jacks .might as well put a ladder up.