Glad that you've brought this up. I've been posting that Charles has been treated extremely leniently, Monza (black & white), Spain (seat belts), Spa (SC2 line) and now Sochi (Stroll crash). Great video @Marc Priestley F1 Elvis
Further to the above (and having seen last 4 minutes of the video), is Michael Masi involved in the stewarding process at any stage as he seems to explain the stewards' decisions and he is the one who would bring their attention to what he said in the notes. #AskElvis
You can add Hungary 2019 when Leclerc deliberately turned into Bottas (off the racing line). Leclerc is getting away with too many incidents.... and the seatelt incident was by far the worst! The FIA should be ashamed they’ve let him get away with such a blatant safety breach!!
I don't think Leclerc deserved penalties for either. The problem isn't that Leclerc didn't get a penalty, it's that Hamilton was so harshly penalised for a non-event. Since K D brought it up, I also think the collision with Stroll was a racing incident, but then so was the incident between Lewis and Albon in the first race. Consistency is the problem.
@Andy Clifft Even if you give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he somehow missed it. This is still a huge deal that he was so vocal about Lewis doing it so he must make a statement to explain why it was ok on his watch for Charles to do it or apologize that is was missed and condemn Leclerc in the same damming terms he condemned Lewis.
Agreed, It's always the same old very average old ex f1 drivers being flown around the world to go mad with power for a weekend....Michael Massi takes the brunt of the hit even tho its not really him calling all the shots
Johnny Herbert was the steward at Spa where he let Leclerc off the hook for the same practice start he was passionately and repeatedly condemning Lewis for in Russia so having the same stewards is not the answer. We need stewards with integrity who don't change their opinion on a penalty depending on whose driving.
The Race is the only one to bring this up and only in written form as far as I know, it would seem commentators and pundits really don't want to broach this issue and I understand why Hamilton may feel aggrieved. Marc I'm glad you are talking about it as other digital media seems to have swept it under the carpet.
I mean, F1 really loves Leclerc and they need him. A young talent with good connections and many fans. So they aren't very harsh to him. I will never understand, how he didn't get penalized in Monza last year. He pushed Lewis off on perpuse several times. Very weird, but for the race it was great of course. Not to forget the seatbelt in Spain and so on. I personally don't like this, when a driver is treated better than the others like with Hamilton the last years
The reason is all the tinfoil hat wearing fans. The fia want ferrari to win so badly they neutered their pu over the winter and then banned pu upgrades. 🙃
There has always been an implicit bias against the dominant team. Quite often its an unconscious one borne from being overly cautious to avoid being seen as favoring the person who always winning. Lewis Hamilton was 100% correct in his statement. The reaction he had was very understandable. The reaction to his reaction however, shows that there will always be a double standard applied to him from a section of the fandom
Ade Ade I think it’s fair to say Schumacher polarised opinions. Personally, I wasn’t a fan of his, especially after some of the dirty tricks he pulled. Lewis isn’t perfect, nobody is, but I think he’s generally fair and on balance a credit to f1.
I agree with most of your comment but always been a bias against the dominant team ! I can never remember that happening against Ferrari especially during the Schumacher years. And that’s what I would be concerned about is Stefano Domenicali gets the top job. It will be three ex Ferrari men running F1.
Different stewards give different opinions under the same conditions, there is a big argument for employing the same stewards for all races to maintain consistency
Having the same stewards is a recipe for disaster. Can you imagine if we for example had Mika Salo as a permanent steward? nobody would have faith that he was giving fair decisions. Its not about using the same stewards, its just using ones that are not corrupt or willing to break the rules themselves to the point where they feel its ok to leak confidential information to their broadcasting buddies. The stewards decisions should be subject to review by an independent body and if a steward is found to be making too many controversial decisions then he/she should be removed.
@@Crismans843 Same stewards yes. Who follow the rules and apply the rule when someone breaks the rule. and who are paid. Why the heck are these people not paid. This is a critical, pressurised job where a lot of knowledge is needed. Pay them!
Just typical formula one, even when hamilton highlights the inconsistency the fans claim he’s just “moaning”. Charles has gotten away with murder over the past 18 months, pushing hamilton off the track and moving suddenly in Italy,driving with severe damage that fell off and hit Hamilton’s car aswell as taking max out in japan and that wasn’t even under investigation until max complained! Now this and taking out stroll in the exact same way as hamilton did to Albon.absolute joke. Oh and leclerc and his seat belts in Spain 👌.
Golden boy rule. Leclerc drives around the track without seatbelt on for 3 laps and doesn’t even get investigated. Leclerc makes practice start outside designated area, oh Good Charles, go ahead. Leclerc crashes Stroll, ah don’t worry Charles, daddy cash will pay for it.
I'm a football referee, every match I get marked by both team's management on my performance during the game 2 days later, maybe F1 should have Team Principles mark the stewarding team on post race tuesday?
this video deserves to be shown to the merc team so that they can question FIA about the treatment that hamilton is getting from stewards. atleast it would stop any further misuse of power from stewards.
Lewis is entitled to feel a loss of trust. He will rise above it and break all the records, nothing is more certain. But he shouldn’t have to work in an atmosphere of mistrust and unfair treatment. Mika Salo hasn’t adequately answered the claim that he went outside the system and briefed the Finnish tv station. Somebody broke the rules there, what investigation is going on to determine who it was? Brushed under the carpet? Again? They’re ruining my F1 with their politics and greed. Just sayin.....
Absolutely correct! The bare minimum that should be happening right now is for the FIA to launch an investigation to establish the full facts and take the appropriate action. It seems instead that they are going to do nothing and seem to have sent out an instruction to the media to kill the story because as far as I can tell it looks like we are witnessing a coverup of this scandal.
Tony Williams they’ve penalised Mercedes and Lewis for breaking and inaccurately written rule. It seems to me that the letter of the rule wasn’t broken, even though the spirit of the rule might have been. You can’t legislate on half truths and inadequately written rules. I’m surprised that Mercedes haven’t taken this to a higher authority. In a proper court I suspect it would be thrown out. Very sporting of them if they’ve let it drop. Hopefully Lewis can get back to doing what he’s good at and smash all the records out of the park.
@@Elinor_Scott-Lester I suspect Merc and Lewis are looking at this and thinking its better to focus on winning more races as any further questionable penalties for Lewis will cause an even bigger backlash from the fans who are rejecting the F1 media's clear agenda of only focussing on the justification of Lewis' penalty whilst not talking about the inconsistent application of them. Marc at least has taken the first step of addressing this with this video.
Foil hat time; Salo is Finnish, Bottas is Finnish, Hamilton is running away with the title, FIA & FOM what a close championship, Salo says Penalise Lewis and Bottas wins lets tip off Finnish TV first
@@neilroberts2448 The point is why are the FIA not investigating this scandal and why is the F1 press trying to kill the story. They can surely see how big it is trending on social media so its becoming clear that the F1 press are controlled by the FIA.
Thanks for that explanation Marc. Johnny Herbert was the driver's steward in Belgium. Someone should ask him why the stewards didn't enforce a penalty on Charles for the same infraction. I'd be very curious to know. Also, apart from the driver's steward, how many stewards participate in a given F1 season? Do some of them travel to multiple events? Is there an oversight review for stewarding or disciplinary measures that are ever taken?
On Sky F1 after the race, when they were discussing the penalty, Herbert said the event notes were clear to see. He then goes on to say there's always been a designated place to do practice starts which is before the trigger that starts the clock on the way to the grid. Although he did reference Spa and LeClerc being 2 seconds too slow getting to the grid because he set the trigger off and that it's likely they'll speak to Hamilton after the race. He also said they (Ferrari) proved it was OK (I think those were his words - mask muffle!) and that nothing happened (with regards to being penalised). Karun said the stewards would never let you get away with it. 🤷🏾♀️
Stephen Herbert is a lovely chap clearly but has anyone ever thought he was the sharpest tool in the box? I certainly haven’t. He probably simply forgot.
No one has to ask him he knows what he is trying to do to Lewis, trying to break him down and demean that young man Johnny Herbert was a shit driver compare to Lewis . Lewis scores more points in one season than he have in his entire losing ass carrier as a driver and he is not the only one . Johnny Herbert is a loser.
Got away with driving for ages in Japan 2019 with that loose endplate too, and the team told him to stay out. Hamilton got with a ton of debris, took out his mirror. If a large chuck had hit his helmet instead of his mirror...
As it states the documents it's discretionary. Also, there seems to be way too much happening in the background for this penalisation. Broadcaster seems to know what was to happen before it happened and whispers of 3rd parties calling attention to the infraction. We go from no penalties to 2 in race penalties for a rule that states "discretionary". Odd
@@troldrik He didn't get away with it. He got a total of 15 secs over 2 separate penalties for it. What more did you want from the stewards in that instance? A public flogging?
The leclerc and belt incident still is a loose end to me, I still get angry when i think of that. Signs around the circuit says drink 0% (but drive without belt)
They also do that with some rookies. if you are new to the business people try to criticize and judge them harder. Its like they have to prove something first. If a rookie have contact with one of the big names, then its rarely the big name that is getting blamed, but the rookie. and its not always fair
@@KennCramerHanberg Why use an analogy that doesn't make sense? Business and F1 pilot? 🤦 Rookie?! Apparently you just found out about F1 and think Lewis is comparable to a rookie driver on his way to his 7th championship. Don't quit your day job 🙄😒.
No driver has been penalized more than Aryton Senna was by Jean-Marie Batestre, especially when he showed so much favoritism to his fellow Frenchman Prost when Prost and Senna were racing for championships
"Admit the mistake". Yes, but also, the fact that nobody picked up on it 3 races ago means that it's not a serious infraction. If nobody even noticed before, despite it being admitted, you can't then turn around next time and say that we have to stick in-race penalties on every single infraction this time.
Could the Ferrari have been at the front of the box & slightly over the timing line when it was preparing its practice start? Remember that this is a down hill start & it would be easy to roll forward before beginning the start process. Without seeing the footage of the incident it’s hard to judge the equality between the two incidents, was the Ferrari incident an position error or was it a planned choice?
@@LastOnSunday I think a lot of it has to do with how it looks. Obviously the practice start area is placed where it safely can be, so any practice start outside the area is technically a violation of a rule brought in for safety reasons, but doing a practice start just outside that area doesn't lóók as much of a violation as what Hamilton was doing, which frankly looked like he was doing practice starts halfway down the circuit. I think that is the main reason why it was overlooked (probably subconsciously) by the stewards in Belgium, while Hamilton's practice starts were too egregious to not notice and take action against. It's a bit like Leclerc and Hamilton driving their road cars on a road with a 120km/h speed limit, Leclerc is caught doing 135km/h and Hamilton is caught doing 200km/h. Yes, by the letter of the law they've both broken the exact same rule in the exact same way, but the extent to which the rule was broken makes Hamilton's speeding look worse. The difference is that most countries actually penalise speeding differently depending how much over the limit you are, while F1 is much more rigid in its 'offence A results in penalty B' type of rules, which leads to the kinds of criticism the stewards got.
Great vid as always Marc and a very worthy point. I also feel it was very unprofessional for Mika Salo to say 'Lewis Hamilton is Full of Sh*t'. If that isn't biased, I don't know what is. How can you make a rational judgement if you feel like that towards someone, I think he felt that before the GP!
Thank you for this. Lewis has every right to be incensed. The inconsistencies and favoritism toward the red team is just shocking. Don't forget the seat belts. It just keeps stacking up...
When I sent you the question and saw you like and not answer. I knew a video was coming. That’s consistent behaviour on your part. Predictable. Either you answer on twitter or you’ll make a video for it. 😂 But this is probably one of the best video of this topic. ‘The Race’ did a good article. But this video explanation with those kids and dogs. Funny yet informative.
@@frchip33 bullshit. For example the clip with Sergio Perez having done something wrong, talking to Charlie White and Charlie said "oh well it wasn't raised to me, it appears you got away with it" Happens. Get over it
Blunt but true. Lets face it, it's the only way Ferrari can win. They suck the most money out of the sport and all that cash certainly isnt going on engineering.
Well dome Marc. Someting I've suggested for some considerable time. Professional stewards who travel with the GP's, like the other FIA personnel/doctors etc etc., which would remove (most) of the shambolic and inconsistant rulings. Good for you.
I had no idea Leclerc got away with the same thing in Spa. As always Marc, thank you for bringing these lesser known details to my attention! Very interesting.
The Stewards are consistent. They're consistent in penalising Lewis Hamilton. Honestly Marc - sometimes you don't need to analyse a point you can just pick up the vibe. I'm still miffed at Ferrari getting away with irregular barge boards in Malaysia!
@@russ18uk Imagine if ex footballers were referees who officiated Premier League games.....sounds stupid doesn't it? If stewards are meant to enforce the rule book & parameters that have been laid out.....why do you need ex drivers & not professionals who know the job inside out??
Should use something like the review system in NFL where the fans can see exactly which camera angles the stewards are looking at. Build it into the TV coverage with a pop out box, allow the commentary analyst to fill in the rules and give their opinion before hearing the official verdict
Of course he has. Japan 2019, he was given a 5 sec penalty for the collision with Max, and an additional 10 sec penalty for driving his car in an unsafe condition due to damage from the contact. Leclerc also received a 3 place grid penalty earlier this year at Austria for blocking Kyvat's quali run. Those are just 2 of the top of my head. I'm sure there are others from his Alfa Romeo days if anyone bothered to check. This is what Marc was talking about with perception about bias.
You can only do stupid crap so long before a tragedy happens! He's fast and unsafe so the chance of surviving a stupid mistake in which you skipped out on some important safety device like a seat belt will only make you pay severely! Ask Dale Earnhardt....
As I have said in previous contributions "after" is unlimited. The Event Notes at 1:19 show that the Race Director is aware of that, therefore the assertion that "after" implied "immediately after" for Hamlton's penalty is nonsense. What is required is an *independent* arbitration system.
I thought the penalty was unfair too at first. Then in the latest mcclaren unboxed video we can see Sainz and Lando discuss Lewis' issue and they both agree that what Hamilton did was very dangerous. Maybe it's track specific. To do it in Sochi is much more dangerous than Spa.
@@thekitowl That not how it works - just because people deny does not mean you dont investigate ....it is very rare for wrong doers to confess - that is why we have to have police and the courts. ... this needs a proper investigation ASAP
@@thesnitch7 if your job is to make drivers hold themselves to the rules. Then you should know the rules! It is your job then. And if you dont know the rules expect some critisism.
When Hamilton says BLM everyone accused him for enjoying the privage he should shout up. No one talks about his struggles of bypasses he has endure during his career for been only Black man in the sport
The FIA claimed Lewis gained a sporting advantage, but the first few cars in the practice start area also gain one for using it before the rubber starts to build up. Mercedes just need to get their drivers to the front of the queue in future.
@@paulthomson9709 because he's threatening Ferrari.'s records. It can't be a coincidence that they dished out such severe penalties on the day Michael' s win record stood to fall. They're playing God because they are allowed to get away with it.
It's a little bit more than inconsistency I do believe for minor discrepancies Ferrari will be penalised less over the course of the season than other teams. I don't think there's a conspiracy against Hamilton or Mercedes but for sure there's a little bit of 'Merc can afford it' in the stewards thought process and decision making. Maybe also because it's Ferrari the stewards feel it's their historical duty to give them more leeway. We should ask Mika Salo he'll let us know via Finnish TV !!
This comes in as one of my best videos on UA-cam..... Amazing job Marc. A well thought out production: funny, engaging, informative, etc. Well done mate!
They should've at least investigated Leclerc for taking Stroll out on lap 1, we have too many very similar incidents for Ham and Lec with such a different outcome that it's only natural for people to think the worst... that said, the "Ferrari International Assistance" thing always makes me laugh when I think back to the early 2000s when the rules were changed in all sorts of way to try and stop Ferrari and Schumacher, I'm really surprised they didn't shake things a bit more during all this years! If the stewards are not the same for every race, they should at least have a team that checks a database of incidents for similar cases in order to ensure consistency or at least give a good explanation for making a seemingly contradictory decision.
99% of lap 1 accidents are not investigated, as most are seen as racing incidents as every driver is trying to get past or looking for space. Most thing's in lap 1 will never be investigated.
@@chriscollins550 yeah, I know how it is, I just don't like it. And I know there's a whole debate about intention vs consequences, but when you ruin someone else's race you should get some kind of slap so next time you're more careful...
Great video Marc - agree with all your points. Consistency and the perception of consistency should be the goal and your solution of permanent professional stewards would go a long way towards that.
It's not perception, it's fact. When Bernie was in charge he came out and said it and said it would always be that way because when he took over Ferrari stuck with him.
What you are saying is in general right. However, people are missing the point: They (the Stewards) missed it at Spa because they weren’t looking for anything. They saw it at Sotschi because they were looking for it - and this is the issue! It is not that Hamilton is innocent; it’s that he is being scrutinized at a much higher degree than many other drivers. On the other hand, as World Champion I guess you need to expect that… It’s a case of “The Emperor’s Wife” - which you quoted several time btw “To be seen to be or do” - Once all eyes are on you, then all eyes are on you, so to say.
Is it my impression, or are the discussions around following these "event notes" a lot more frequent since Michael Masi took over from Charlie Whiting? Do you know if the event notes are now a lot more detailed with Masi as race director? Are there a lot more rules to follow, recently? Or were they as detailed with Whiting, but did Charlie just had another style, more about alerting teams & drivers instead of punishing them? #askelvis
How could the stewards have mistakenly missed the Charles Leclerc incident because when Ferrari was call to the stewards Ferrari told them Charles did a practice start that's why his time was off, but they just brush it off with the Ferrari explanation " no penalty no points on licence, Lewis was correct with his explanation of the stewards
Yes.......... Marc you are right............. but I’m not confident that F1 and/or the stewards will be honourable and do the right thing..............🤔
You bring up a lot of interesting points. It will also be interesting to see if the FIA do address this issue and more importantly if they do anything about it. I did read the comments about this in the last video but I did not know what was being talked about. Now thanks to you I do and so do the rest of our community. Thanks as always.
I'm pretty sure if the FIA won't reveal the details of their deal regarding Ferrari's engine that there's little to no chance of them doing anything about this.
Are you changing you mind about the Stroll-Leclerc incident as well? I'm still pissed about it. Stroll had an amazing start, he overtook like 5 cars and his race was ruined by Leclerc's mistake (he admitted that he miscalculated the turn due to the slipstream from Perez).
@@F1Elvis but so was the lewis and albon clash, 1st lap after the sc. funny thing albon had room to its left. more proof is the verstappen overtake on bottas in the same spot buth verstappen used more of the run off. Bottas pushes him even more to the outside than lewis.
@@coesmans69 Kimi only got that penalty because of which car he hit. Otherwise it would simply have been written off as a first lap incident. If Charles had hit that same car in question last sunday it would have been a slam dunk penalty, but luckily for him, it was only Stroll........lol
Sounds like 2 things are needed to do... First - have the exact same area at all of the tracks to do test starts. Even if the track needs to build an area. Second - A set of 5 professional race stewards that go to every race. I really do think the Leclerc issue (which I did not know about) was a mistake of the stewards not knowing the notes well enough. I seriously doubt anyone connected to Ferrari went to the stewards room and said - "Don't investigate Leclerc's practice start."
At Hockenheim in 2018 Hamilton went into the pits and changed his mind at the last second to continue and not pit, crossing over the white lines and grass back onto the race track. He didn't get a penalty and went on to win the race. Kimi was handed a 5 second penalty at Mugello for going over the grass at the pit lane entry. I don't think the stewards are biased I just think they aren't consistent.
KyleEStevens the differences in both cases were clearly explained at the time. Lewis returned to the track before the pit lanes entry marker & was deemed to have done so safely & these markers are track specific .
Your videos are getting better and better Marc. Been following for a long time now and the production values have really improved. Always treat the dogs the same!!
When Lewis Hamilton stated the stewards are out to stop me. Then clearly he was 100% correct. Leclercs treatment at Spa is irrefutable proof. F1 has now backed itself into a credibility corner which has the potential to damage the Sport .
68tonyn bang on, it’s the sport that suffers. I’ve often wondered what outsiders think of F1 when they read about these incidents & all these ex Ferrari guys in positions of responsibility.
Gayle Howard the designated area varies from track to track. Lewis is not the only driver to look for fresh tarmac to do his start & it’s not been a problem before. In this case the directors notes didn’t show exactly where that area was in spa they did.
Me personally had no problem with the drive time added , but I thought it very unfair to add points to his super licences as their was no danger and no accidents involved. It did seem a bit like well now we have you. Even with all the other stuff that did not get penalized with for other drivers. But that you brought this up, it does not look good on the steward at all. But I do agree with you they should come out and say they messed up. Or make them full employee's that have to be held accountable.
F1 penalties should be black and white with respect to what punishment is applied to which rule was broken. I thought the stewards had a system that helps them with such events. The fact it was an ex Ferrari driver that was the driver steward on the day? It needs to be addressed openly by F1 to clarify the oversight or whatever it was that caused the issue.
Marc, besides consistency..where I am struggling is how can an incident that happens before the race, can lead during a penalty during the race....worsen by the rumor that Miko Salo already informed Finnish television before the start of the penalty. Shoudn't this have been a grid penalty like other incidents that happen before the race.
I think the reason it wasn't a grid drop was because the investigation started so late into the pre-race procedures. But even then it took them way too long to sort it out.
The media are trying to cover up the Salo scandal and are doing everything to avoid discussion of it hoping it will just go away and fans will forget about it but that is a massive massive miscalculation because that leak, the conflict of interests with a Fin driver benefitting and the potential for betting fraud because of the leak make this a humongous scandal of epic proportions. Trying to bury a story this big is clearly going to completely destroy the reputation of the stewards and the FIA in an unrecoverable way.
The issue with that is it would not serve their purpose. If they had not had a red flag Hamilton would have been well down the road and gapping to mitigate the extra 10- seconds he could not make up in one or even two laps.
One issue I know was mentioned is that the stewards were occupied with the actual start itself and so they could not look into the possible infraction until after the start. I am note sure if the rules speak to whether that is acceptable, or if there is any limits to this practice or not? #AskElvis However, from a practical perspective, it makes sense.
I am forced to compare F1 with Premier League football all the time right now. VAR is causing the exact things to happen in football. Controversy was meant to lessen with the video referee, but instead it has gotten worse. I totally agree. Without consistency, you lose the very thing you are meant to be protecting
Well the FIA also want reverse grids so they want Mercedes at the back and they want more interesting races....... so moving Lewis back with a 10 second penalty makes things more interesting from their perspective. Not saying this is why they applied the rule with Lewis and not to Le Clerc, but we all know the FIA want closer racing.
Idea ! Why not do a blow by blow of the FIA intervention into the Malaysian Grand Prix of 1999. The Barge board controversy is certainly one of the most inexplicable reversals of all F1 history. Once a car is placed on a conformal bridge for measure, all facts are the facts. Can you explain this obvious intervention on Ferrari's behalf? Pet both dogs for me.
Yes, there should be permant and professional stewards. In addition, there should maybe also be additional stewards, which do not see the race and only get a neutral description / neutral cgi.
Really appreciate you addressing this Marc. Thank you. Excellent assessment. Please send a link to the FIA. Seriously, if not get it done by someone who can reach them.
Could it be that none of the teams made a complaint in Belgium, but some team(s) did in Russia? And therefore the stewards had to investigate and judge it. It's been seen before that i.e. Renault F1 Team have made a complaint because they could benefit from it. Like when they made a complaint about Haas' floor, so they could gain a position in the WCC.
I think certain fans are always gonna be suspicious of bias. You see it in football too. There might be a biased official here or there, but I think most care about fairness as much as the rest of us since they are fans as well
Hi Elvis, This is a two part question that I would love your opinion on regarding the Hamilton incident. (1) Was it not a situation that was always going to be ambiguous and a race result defining decision, So ! Should it not have been one that was carried over until after the race ? After all it would have been easier to take the result away ( by handing out a 10 second penalty after) than giving the race win back if like in this case inconsistency's are found. (2) Who decides if something will be investigated after the race and how do they make that decision ?
I have been saying for years that stewards should be paid professionals. In every other professional sport, football, cricket, tennis, basketball, etc the official enforcing the rules is trained and employed to do the job. How would you feel if the umpires and referees where just invited to adjudicate these sports every game?
I'm really liking these videos from you ex F1 incumbents.....it's good to hear unbiased analysis from people like you and Peter Windsor...... A Great review with a lot of common sense, something F1 is lacking at the minute.
Great unexpected video Marc. I agree with you that we need consistency. I think we need the same stewards hired by f1 every week. Then if there was an "unusual" decision, the stewards could be held accountable. It's very hard hold someone accountable when they might only steward a couple of races a year.
The bias against Lewis Hamilton in F1 is plain to see . Drivers are getting away with far worse incidents in the sports with hardly a slap on the wrist if any , and yet Lewis is consistently been punished for all sorts of nonsense. F1 wake up the world is watching . It's Embarrassing to say the least . Be consistent with your rules for one , and leave the man alone ...Lewis that is . Say no more.....
Glad that you've brought this up. I've been posting that Charles has been treated extremely leniently, Monza (black & white), Spain (seat belts), Spa (SC2 line) and now Sochi (Stroll crash). Great video @Marc Priestley F1 Elvis
Further to the above (and having seen last 4 minutes of the video), is Michael Masi involved in the stewarding process at any stage as he seems to explain the stewards' decisions and he is the one who would bring their attention to what he said in the notes. #AskElvis
Masi can report an incident to the stewards, but they then investigate and decide the penalty or otherwise.
The lack of a penalty for the seat belt incident was shocking! PS I gave the video a like because of the little bit with the dogs at the end :)
@@jonathanoakey4745 -the black and white flag at Monza was crazy, have they ever used it since?
You can add Hungary 2019 when Leclerc deliberately turned into Bottas (off the racing line). Leclerc is getting away with too many incidents.... and the seatelt incident was by far the worst! The FIA should be ashamed they’ve let him get away with such a blatant safety breach!!
Leclerc should have received two penalties. One for the slow lap, and one for the practice start out of position.
I don't think Leclerc deserved penalties for either. The problem isn't that Leclerc didn't get a penalty, it's that Hamilton was so harshly penalised for a non-event. Since K D brought it up, I also think the collision with Stroll was a racing incident, but then so was the incident between Lewis and Albon in the first race. Consistency is the problem.
OMG this is huge, Johnny Herbert was the steward in Belgium yet he condemned Lewis on Sky after the Russian GP and said he deserved the penalty! 😲
Someone should remind him of that race :)
Jonny Herbert is a total plonker; he’s a useless pundit and obviously an even more useless Steward!
We need a statement from Herbert as to why he so vocally condemned Lewis and Merc and is quiet about Leclerc doing the same thing on his watch.
Tony Williams that needs to happen.
@Andy Clifft Even if you give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he somehow missed it. This is still a huge deal that he was so vocal about Lewis doing it so he must make a statement to explain why it was ok on his watch for Charles to do it or apologize that is was missed and condemn Leclerc in the same damming terms he condemned Lewis.
So: Best way to solve this is having the same stewards every race, and making them responsible for their decisions if needed...
Agreed, It's always the same old very average old ex f1 drivers being flown around the world to go mad with power for a weekend....Michael Massi takes the brunt of the hit even tho its not really him calling all the shots
The best way to solve this is to get rid of Hamilton in F1
@@peterv6036 Lmao the wider issue has nothing to do with Hamilton, there's a bigger fundamental issue around the FIA.
Johnny Herbert was the steward at Spa where he let Leclerc off the hook for the same practice start he was passionately and repeatedly condemning Lewis for in Russia so having the same stewards is not the answer.
We need stewards with integrity who don't change their opinion on a penalty depending on whose driving.
@@peterv6036 muppet
The Race is the only one to bring this up and only in written form as far as I know, it would seem commentators and pundits really don't want to broach this issue and I understand why Hamilton may feel aggrieved. Marc I'm glad you are talking about it as other digital media seems to have swept it under the carpet.
I would have a lot more respect for them if they came out and explain what happened even if it was a mistake
I don't buy Leclercs was a mistake. The FIA isn't called Ferrari International Assistance for no reason
I didn´t knew that....hmmm
I mean, F1 really loves Leclerc and they need him. A young talent with good connections and many fans. So they aren't very harsh to him. I will never understand, how he didn't get penalized in Monza last year. He pushed Lewis off on perpuse several times. Very weird, but for the race it was great of course. Not to forget the seatbelt in Spain and so on. I personally don't like this, when a driver is treated better than the others like with Hamilton the last years
The reason is all the tinfoil hat wearing fans. The fia want ferrari to win so badly they neutered their pu over the winter and then banned pu upgrades. 🙃
There has always been an implicit bias against the dominant team. Quite often its an unconscious one borne from being overly cautious to avoid being seen as favoring the person who always winning. Lewis Hamilton was 100% correct in his statement. The reaction he had was very understandable. The reaction to his reaction however, shows that there will always be a double standard applied to him from a section of the fandom
M
Ade Ade I think it’s fair to say Schumacher polarised opinions. Personally, I wasn’t a fan of his, especially after some of the dirty tricks he pulled. Lewis isn’t perfect, nobody is, but I think he’s generally fair and on balance a credit to f1.
I agree with most of your comment but always been a bias against the dominant team !
I can never remember that happening against Ferrari especially during the Schumacher years.
And that’s what I would be concerned about is Stefano Domenicali gets the top job. It will be three ex Ferrari men running F1.
"Open, honest and consistent". Not really 3 things anyone would use to describe how the FIA operates...
SIC66SIC66 they never really explained the Ferrari fuel scandal but Binotto says the engine rule clarification hit them hard. So your right.
Different stewards give different opinions under the same conditions, there is a big argument for employing the same stewards for all races to maintain consistency
well, the rule is there in black and white with the Charles Le Clerc incident.
Having the same stewards is a recipe for disaster. Can you imagine if we for example had Mika Salo as a permanent steward? nobody would have faith that he was giving fair decisions.
Its not about using the same stewards, its just using ones that are not corrupt or willing to break the rules themselves to the point where they feel its ok to leak confidential information to their broadcasting buddies.
The stewards decisions should be subject to review by an independent body and if a steward is found to be making too many controversial decisions then he/she should be removed.
Fire Up So...do you disagree with Rob G’ suggestion?
I agree, to compare with elvis'story......iit's the same as having different parents every weekend
@@Crismans843 Same stewards yes. Who follow the rules and apply the rule when someone breaks the rule. and who are paid. Why the heck are these people not paid. This is a critical, pressurised job where a lot of knowledge is needed. Pay them!
Just typical formula one, even when hamilton highlights the inconsistency the fans claim he’s just “moaning”. Charles has gotten away with murder over the past 18 months, pushing hamilton off the track and moving suddenly in Italy,driving with severe damage that fell off and hit Hamilton’s car aswell as taking max out in japan and that wasn’t even under investigation until max complained! Now this and taking out stroll in the exact same way as hamilton did to Albon.absolute joke. Oh and leclerc and his seat belts in Spain 👌.
Cryonic Bonkers 👍
To be fair Leclerc has been penalised.
He drives the 2020 Ferrari!!
Julian Richards haha I retract what i just wrote 😂
@@JACK305 oòjf
Golden boy rule. Leclerc drives around the track without seatbelt on for 3 laps and doesn’t even get investigated. Leclerc makes practice start outside designated area, oh Good Charles, go ahead. Leclerc crashes Stroll, ah don’t worry Charles, daddy cash will pay for it.
reck1224 yep, these incidents are building up.
I'm a football referee, every match I get marked by both team's management on my performance during the game 2 days later, maybe F1 should have Team Principles mark the stewarding team on post race tuesday?
Would need to have the same stewards for all races to make that work, but a good idea.
@@larrythompson2967 not really you would need a pool of stewards which are rotated but not as a stewarding team
this video deserves to be shown to the merc team so that they can question FIA about the treatment that hamilton is getting from stewards. atleast it would stop any further misuse of power from stewards.
Lewis is entitled to feel a loss of trust. He will rise above it and break all the records, nothing is more certain. But he shouldn’t have to work in an atmosphere of mistrust and unfair treatment. Mika Salo hasn’t adequately answered the claim that he went outside the system and briefed the Finnish tv station. Somebody broke the rules there, what investigation is going on to determine who it was? Brushed under the carpet? Again? They’re ruining my F1 with their politics and greed. Just sayin.....
Absolutely correct! The bare minimum that should be happening right now is for the FIA to launch an investigation to establish the full facts and take the appropriate action. It seems instead that they are going to do nothing and seem to have sent out an instruction to the media to kill the story because as far as I can tell it looks like we are witnessing a coverup of this scandal.
Tony Williams they’ve penalised Mercedes and Lewis for breaking and inaccurately written rule. It seems to me that the letter of the rule wasn’t broken, even though the spirit of the rule might have been. You can’t legislate on half truths and inadequately written rules. I’m surprised that Mercedes haven’t taken this to a higher authority. In a proper court I suspect it would be thrown out. Very sporting of them if they’ve let it drop. Hopefully Lewis can get back to doing what he’s good at and smash all the records out of the park.
@@Elinor_Scott-Lester I suspect Merc and Lewis are looking at this and thinking its better to focus on winning more races as any further questionable penalties for Lewis will cause an even bigger backlash from the fans who are rejecting the F1 media's clear agenda of only focussing on the justification of Lewis' penalty whilst not talking about the inconsistent application of them. Marc at least has taken the first step of addressing this with this video.
Foil hat time; Salo is Finnish, Bottas is Finnish, Hamilton is running away with the title, FIA & FOM what a close championship, Salo says Penalise Lewis and Bottas wins lets tip off Finnish TV first
@@neilroberts2448 The point is why are the FIA not investigating this scandal and why is the F1 press trying to kill the story. They can surely see how big it is trending on social media so its becoming clear that the F1 press are controlled by the FIA.
Thank you so much Marc! I've been banging on about the stewards consistency issues for months! Appreciate you addressing this problem! 👍✌
Surely the Stewards should get a 10 second penalty and points on their Licenses for missing the transgression?
Patrick Dixon or Tarred & Feathered .
Thanks for that explanation Marc. Johnny Herbert was the driver's steward in Belgium. Someone should ask him why the stewards didn't enforce a penalty on Charles for the same infraction. I'd be very curious to know. Also, apart from the driver's steward, how many stewards participate in a given F1 season? Do some of them travel to multiple events? Is there an oversight review for stewarding or disciplinary measures that are ever taken?
On Sky F1 after the race, when they were discussing the penalty, Herbert said the event notes were clear to see. He then goes on to say there's always been a designated place to do practice starts which is before the trigger that starts the clock on the way to the grid. Although he did reference Spa and LeClerc being 2 seconds too slow getting to the grid because he set the trigger off and that it's likely they'll speak to Hamilton after the race. He also said they (Ferrari) proved it was OK (I think those were his words - mask muffle!) and that nothing happened (with regards to being penalised). Karun said the stewards would never let you get away with it. 🤷🏾♀️
Not sure how many in total, but some do multiple races. They are however, just part time volunteers.
Stephen Herbert is a lovely chap clearly but has anyone ever thought he was the sharpest tool in the box? I certainly haven’t. He probably simply forgot.
Alex C 🤣🤣🤣
No one has to ask him he knows what he is trying to do to Lewis, trying to break him down and demean that young man Johnny Herbert was a shit driver compare to Lewis . Lewis scores more points in one season than he have in his entire losing ass carrier as a driver and he is not the only one . Johnny Herbert is a loser.
the stewards who differ race to race have different interperations but how leclerc got away with no belt even after race was unreal
Agreed.
Got away with driving for ages in Japan 2019 with that loose endplate too, and the team told him to stay out. Hamilton got with a ton of debris, took out his mirror. If a large chuck had hit his helmet instead of his mirror...
As it states the documents it's discretionary. Also, there seems to be way too much happening in the background for this penalisation. Broadcaster seems to know what was to happen before it happened and whispers of 3rd parties calling attention to the infraction.
We go from no penalties to 2 in race penalties for a rule that states "discretionary". Odd
@@troldrik He didn't get away with it. He got a total of 15 secs over 2 separate penalties for it. What more did you want from the stewards in that instance? A public flogging?
The leclerc and belt incident still is a loose end to me, I still get angry when i think of that. Signs around the circuit says drink 0% (but drive without belt)
This just backs up what Lewis says. They do penalise him harder than everyone else.
They also do that with some rookies. if you are new to the business people try to criticize and judge them harder. Its like they have to prove something first. If a rookie have contact with one of the big names, then its rarely the big name that is getting blamed, but the rookie. and its not always fair
@@KennCramerHanberg Why use an analogy that doesn't make sense? Business and F1 pilot? 🤦 Rookie?! Apparently you just found out about F1 and think Lewis is comparable to a rookie driver on his way to his 7th championship. Don't quit your day job 🙄😒.
@@evilformerlys4704 It´s a way of saying and you know what i want to say. You just dont like the way i say it
@@evilformerlys4704 LMAO......😁🤣😂................
No driver has been penalized more than Aryton Senna was by Jean-Marie Batestre, especially when he showed so much favoritism to his fellow Frenchman Prost when Prost and Senna were racing for championships
"Admit the mistake". Yes, but also, the fact that nobody picked up on it 3 races ago means that it's not a serious infraction. If nobody even noticed before, despite it being admitted, you can't then turn around next time and say that we have to stick in-race penalties on every single infraction this time.
Exactly, consistency is what's needed, whichever version we think is correct.
Perfect point!
Could the Ferrari have been at the front of the box & slightly over the timing line when it was preparing its practice start? Remember that this is a down hill start & it would be easy to roll forward before beginning the start process. Without seeing the footage of the incident it’s hard to judge the equality between the two incidents, was the Ferrari incident an position error or was it a planned choice?
@@LastOnSunday I think a lot of it has to do with how it looks. Obviously the practice start area is placed where it safely can be, so any practice start outside the area is technically a violation of a rule brought in for safety reasons, but doing a practice start just outside that area doesn't lóók as much of a violation as what Hamilton was doing, which frankly looked like he was doing practice starts halfway down the circuit. I think that is the main reason why it was overlooked (probably subconsciously) by the stewards in Belgium, while Hamilton's practice starts were too egregious to not notice and take action against. It's a bit like Leclerc and Hamilton driving their road cars on a road with a 120km/h speed limit, Leclerc is caught doing 135km/h and Hamilton is caught doing 200km/h. Yes, by the letter of the law they've both broken the exact same rule in the exact same way, but the extent to which the rule was broken makes Hamilton's speeding look worse. The difference is that most countries actually penalise speeding differently depending how much over the limit you are, while F1 is much more rigid in its 'offence A results in penalty B' type of rules, which leads to the kinds of criticism the stewards got.
@@rjfaber1991 this is that bullshit.
Charlie Teflon will never get a penalty. He drove without a damn seatbelt and got NOTHING for it.
He knocked Lance Stroll out of the race without any consequences.
I hope that nick sticks unlike Teflon.
Charlie Teflon...😂🤣 Good one!
And commentators seem to think he is in the top three drivers also?
He's not even close.
Pa Murf to be honest he sometimes outperforms the Ferrari to podiums
Great vid as always Marc and a very worthy point. I also feel it was very unprofessional for Mika Salo to say 'Lewis Hamilton is Full of Sh*t'. If that isn't biased, I don't know what is. How can you make a rational judgement if you feel like that towards someone, I think he felt that before the GP!
Ian McLeod some other ex drivers think the penalty was too lean . Let’s hope they don’t become stewards.
Thank you for this. Lewis has every right to be incensed. The inconsistencies and favoritism toward the red team is just shocking. Don't forget the seat belts. It just keeps stacking up...
Time to choose that’s the problem, you can brush away individual incidents but when viewed collectively it looks bad.
When I sent you the question and saw you like and not answer. I knew a video was coming. That’s consistent behaviour on your part. Predictable.
Either you answer on twitter or you’ll make a video for it. 😂
But this is probably one of the best video of this topic.
‘The Race’ did a good article. But this video explanation with those kids and dogs. Funny yet informative.
It’s like F1 is being run by Ferrari people....oh hold on..
Nobody's Fool 🤣🤣🤣
@kenny toong that's a bit much. I was hoping that maybe they suffer in business and not something fatal
@kenny toong same for your parents and kids.
Best video ever. Funny, serious, family settings, animals loved it from start to finish. Above all, factual and honestly. Respect.
Thank you❤
Either charlie boy is extremely lucky to be not investigated or something is not right
varun mishra nobody’s that lucky
Ferrari International Assistance strikes again...
@@frchip33 bullshit. For example the clip with Sergio Perez having done something wrong, talking to Charlie White and Charlie said "oh well it wasn't raised to me, it appears you got away with it"
Happens. Get over it
His manager is the son of FIA president & lifelong Ferrari man & ex ceo Jean Todt....Make of that what you will.
charlie 'no seat belts' leclerc?
Naah... Ferrari International Assistance confirmed 😂
Glad you explained this matters really clear. Thank you very much.
Blunt but true. Lets face it, it's the only way Ferrari can win. They suck the most money out of the sport and all that cash certainly isnt going on engineering.
Phil Arnold welcome their latest recruit......Johnny Herbert.
Well dome Marc. Someting I've suggested for some considerable time. Professional stewards who travel with the GP's, like the other FIA personnel/doctors etc etc., which would remove (most) of the shambolic and inconsistant rulings. Good for you.
I had no idea Leclerc got away with the same thing in Spa. As always Marc, thank you for bringing these lesser known details to my attention! Very interesting.
Luke Clayson it was his viewers who bought it to his attention.
Should have been two penalties. To slow lap to the grid, and a practice start out of position.
Mark Garcia & gaining a sporting advantage.
The Stewards are consistent. They're consistent in penalising Lewis Hamilton. Honestly Marc - sometimes you don't need to analyse a point you can just pick up the vibe.
I'm still miffed at Ferrari getting away with irregular barge boards in Malaysia!
How about issuing fines and penalties against the stewards when they get it wrong.
Issue is that the Stewards are volunteers. They should be full-time employees of the FIA and should attend every race.
Yeah. 😂
That’s uno reverse card on stewards. Stewarding the stewards. 😂
Good idea
@@russ18uk Imagine if ex footballers were referees who officiated Premier League games.....sounds stupid doesn't it? If stewards are meant to enforce the rule book & parameters that have been laid out.....why do you need ex drivers & not professionals who know the job inside out??
@@russ18uk yep it is hard to even understand why they are not professionals. its insane by itself
Should use something like the review system in NFL where the fans can see exactly which camera angles the stewards are looking at. Build it into the TV coverage with a pop out box, allow the commentary analyst to fill in the rules and give their opinion before hearing the official verdict
Has Charles Leclerc ever had a penalty? He gets away with a lot.
Of course he has. Japan 2019, he was given a 5 sec penalty for the collision with Max, and an additional 10 sec penalty for driving his car in an unsafe condition due to damage from the contact. Leclerc also received a 3 place grid penalty earlier this year at Austria for blocking Kyvat's quali run. Those are just 2 of the top of my head. I'm sure there are others from his Alfa Romeo days if anyone bothered to check. This is what Marc was talking about with perception about bias.
You can only do stupid crap so long before a tragedy happens! He's fast and unsafe so the chance of surviving a stupid mistake in which you skipped out on some important safety device like a seat belt will only make you pay severely! Ask Dale Earnhardt....
As I have said in previous contributions "after" is unlimited. The Event Notes at 1:19 show that the Race Director is aware of that, therefore the assertion that "after" implied "immediately after" for Hamlton's penalty is nonsense.
What is required is an *independent* arbitration system.
frogandspanner will that be run by an ex Ferrari guy ?
I thought the penalty was unfair too at first. Then in the latest mcclaren unboxed video we can see Sainz and Lando discuss Lewis' issue and they both agree that what Hamilton did was very dangerous. Maybe it's track specific. To do it in Sochi is much more dangerous than Spa.
Arjun if two drivers think it was dangerous it must be.
The comment from Salo after the Hamilton comments was not acceptable as he should have kept his mouth shut if he was an appropriate official.
Osprey6m certainly should have kept quite, especially as there was leaked information to a TV company ( who he works with )
Now talk about Mika Salo messaging Finish TV ....
john cale absolutely....it’s not fake news anymore.
In that case he has to go.
john paull with the TV company saying it wasn’t Salo & he himself denying it , can’t se it being investigated.
The KitOwl - Thought it went to the TV broadcaster.
@@thekitowl That not how it works - just because people deny does not mean you dont investigate ....it is very rare for wrong doers to confess - that is why we have to have police and the courts. ... this needs a proper investigation ASAP
"It's OK to admit you have made a mistake", says Marc, who made this video to admit he made a mistake!
Good man Marc!! :-)
I'm not actually saying I made a mistake, I stand by my reaction to Lewis' penalty, just that if that's the penalty, it needs to be consistent.
It's not a mistake if unaware of new information
@@thesnitch7 if your job is to make drivers hold themselves to the rules. Then you should know the rules! It is your job then. And if you dont know the rules expect some critisism.
@@JanJvG I'm talking about Elvis. That's very clear from Glenn's comment above , you dumbass.
Well said Mark let's see if sky pick up on this next race
Kevin Worrall what’s the odds they don’t.
@@thekitowl if they don't there's something wrong with sky
That is precisely how racism works...and most times it is so subtle that it is deniable.
Yet another thing that sours F1 for me. It is clear the stewards are looking for reasons to penalize some drivers and reasons to not penalize others.
Very well said. Honesty & transparency is the key. Stewards should be the same every race for consistency.
100% right. We need to have the same stewards at every race with constant opinions on driving offences
When Hamilton says BLM everyone accused him for enjoying the privage he should shout up. No one talks about his struggles of bypasses he has endure during his career for been only Black man in the sport
Sorry sir, but your race card has expired. Please provide an alternative form of argument.
@@davegilbert9314 be creative ❄
The FIA claimed Lewis gained a sporting advantage, but the first few cars in the practice start area also gain one for using it before the rubber starts to build up. Mercedes just need to get their drivers to the front of the queue in future.
We know that they want to stop Hamilton. It is clear
Yeah the fia is full of big mean racists! 🤡
So you completely missed the point of the video then. Well done. 😂
Why do they want to stop him though?
@Andy Clifft yes , exactly and all the better for it .
@@paulthomson9709 because he's threatening Ferrari.'s records. It can't be a coincidence that they dished out such severe penalties on the day Michael' s win record stood to fall. They're playing God because they are allowed to get away with it.
How about Charles Leclerc driving without belts?
Philip Khushf if we have Ferrari getting away with different offences with different stewards involved, than something stinks.
Andy Clifft spain
It's a little bit more than inconsistency I do believe for minor discrepancies Ferrari will be penalised less over the course of the season than other teams. I don't think there's a conspiracy against Hamilton or Mercedes but for sure there's a little bit of 'Merc can afford it' in the stewards thought process and decision making. Maybe also because it's Ferrari the stewards feel it's their historical duty to give them more leeway. We should ask Mika Salo he'll let us know via Finnish TV !!
indobleh worrying that we have different stewards each race but Ferrari get off lightly consistently .
This comes in as one of my best videos on UA-cam..... Amazing job Marc. A well thought out production: funny, engaging, informative, etc. Well done mate!
They should've at least investigated Leclerc for taking Stroll out on lap 1, we have too many very similar incidents for Ham and Lec with such a different outcome that it's only natural for people to think the worst... that said, the "Ferrari International Assistance" thing always makes me laugh when I think back to the early 2000s when the rules were changed in all sorts of way to try and stop Ferrari and Schumacher, I'm really surprised they didn't shake things a bit more during all this years!
If the stewards are not the same for every race, they should at least have a team that checks a database of incidents for similar cases in order to ensure consistency or at least give a good explanation for making a seemingly contradictory decision.
99% of lap 1 accidents are not investigated, as most are seen as racing incidents as every driver is trying to get past or looking for space. Most thing's in lap 1 will never be investigated.
@@chriscollins550 yeah, I know how it is, I just don't like it. And I know there's a whole debate about intention vs consequences, but when you ruin someone else's race you should get some kind of slap so next time you're more careful...
@@ale-lp they both touch wheels that's it. If none of them went of people would be calling it hard but fair racing.
Great video Marc - agree with all your points. Consistency and the perception of consistency should be the goal and your solution of permanent professional stewards would go a long way towards that.
It's not perception, it's fact. When Bernie was in charge he came out and said it and said it would always be that way because when he took over Ferrari stuck with him.
What you are saying is in general right. However, people are missing the point: They (the Stewards) missed it at Spa because they weren’t looking for anything. They saw it at Sotschi because they were looking for it - and this is the issue! It is not that Hamilton is innocent; it’s that he is being scrutinized at a much higher degree than many other drivers. On the other hand, as World Champion I guess you need to expect that… It’s a case of “The Emperor’s Wife” - which you quoted several time btw “To be seen to be or do” - Once all eyes are on you, then all eyes are on you, so to say.
Rigsby Rigged or as Mercedes suspect another team reported them.
@@thekitowl Karen Horner strikes again haha. Must have Michael Massi on speed dial.
Charlie hi Charlie 👍
Is it my impression, or are the discussions around following these "event notes" a lot more frequent since Michael Masi took over from Charlie Whiting?
Do you know if the event notes are now a lot more detailed with Masi as race director? Are there a lot more rules to follow, recently?
Or were they as detailed with Whiting, but did Charlie just had another style, more about alerting teams & drivers instead of punishing them?
#askelvis
How could the stewards have mistakenly missed the Charles Leclerc incident because when Ferrari was call to the stewards Ferrari told them Charles did a practice start that's why his time was off, but they just brush it off with the Ferrari explanation " no penalty no points on licence, Lewis was correct with his explanation of the stewards
Great debate, Marc. I still find it hard to believe you have not been snapped up by Sky to commentate for them!
So....still disagree with Lewis feeling they are trying to stop him?
"Charlie boy... " 🤣🤣🤣
Yes.......... Marc you are right............. but I’m not confident that F1 and/or the stewards will be honourable and do the right thing..............🤔
You bring up a lot of interesting points. It will also be interesting to see if the FIA do address this issue and more importantly if they do anything about it. I did read the comments about this in the last video but I did not know what was being talked about. Now thanks to you I do and so do the rest of our community. Thanks as always.
I'm pretty sure if the FIA won't reveal the details of their deal regarding Ferrari's engine that there's little to no chance of them doing anything about this.
kityhawk2000
I fear you are correct. If the governances of F1 is not totally transparent then how can anyone have faith in its judgement.
Are you changing you mind about the Stroll-Leclerc incident as well? I'm still pissed about it. Stroll had an amazing start, he overtook like 5 cars and his race was ruined by Leclerc's mistake (he admitted that he miscalculated the turn due to the slipstream from Perez).
No one is ever concerned if Stroll's race gets ruined by himself or by someone else.
Nope. Still say it was a tough call on the first lap and could have gone either way, but difficult to argue too much whichever way it ended up.
@@F1Elvis but so was the lewis and albon clash, 1st lap after the sc. funny thing albon had room to its left. more proof is the verstappen overtake on bottas in the same spot buth verstappen used more of the run off. Bottas pushes him even more to the outside than lewis.
@@F1Elvis even more so ,why did Raikkonen get a penalty in the Brit gp 18. That was even a first corner madnes.
@@coesmans69 Kimi only got that penalty because of which car he hit. Otherwise it would simply have been written off as a first lap incident. If Charles had hit that same car in question last sunday it would have been a slam dunk penalty, but luckily for him, it was only Stroll........lol
Sounds like 2 things are needed to do... First - have the exact same area at all of the tracks to do test starts. Even if the track needs to build an area. Second - A set of 5 professional race stewards that go to every race.
I really do think the Leclerc issue (which I did not know about) was a mistake of the stewards not knowing the notes well enough. I seriously doubt anyone connected to Ferrari went to the stewards room and said - "Don't investigate Leclerc's practice start."
It’s funny how they knew the notes well enough to penalise Hamilton
Brian Ganger the stewards knew Leclerc was slow ( as it was triggered ) but took Ferrari’s excuse & didn’t investigate further.
At Hockenheim in 2018 Hamilton went into the pits and changed his mind at the last second to continue and not pit, crossing over the white lines and grass back onto the race track. He didn't get a penalty and went on to win the race. Kimi was handed a 5 second penalty at Mugello for going over the grass at the pit lane entry. I don't think the stewards are biased I just think they aren't consistent.
KyleEStevens the differences in both cases were clearly explained at the time. Lewis returned to the track before the pit lanes entry marker & was deemed to have done so safely & these markers are track specific .
He got a reprimand, which is a penalty.
Extremely well put, Marc!!
Well said.
I bet there's no mention of this by any of the Sky commentators. They'll go out of their way to avoid anything controversial.
West Amesbury Farms you might be right.
Your videos are getting better and better Marc. Been following for a long time now and the production values have really improved. Always treat the dogs the same!!
Important lesson: Treat your dogs equally! We love dogs.
When Lewis Hamilton stated the stewards are out to stop me. Then clearly he was 100% correct. Leclercs treatment at Spa is irrefutable proof. F1 has now backed itself into a credibility corner which has the potential to damage the Sport .
The sad thing is they will do nothing about it ://
@@joeblack4026 But at least Hamilton is vindicated with what he has said
68tonyn bang on, it’s the sport that suffers. I’ve often wondered what outsiders think of F1 when they read about these incidents & all these ex Ferrari guys in positions of responsibility.
Only Lewis says he does it all the time. So seems he got away with it a lot.
Gayle Howard the designated area varies from track to track. Lewis is not the only driver to look for fresh tarmac to do his start & it’s not been a problem before. In this case the directors notes didn’t show exactly where that area was in spa they did.
Me personally had no problem with the drive time added , but I thought it very unfair to add points to his super licences as their was no danger and no accidents involved. It did seem a bit like well now we have you. Even with all the other stuff that did not get penalized with for other drivers. But that you brought this up, it does not look good on the steward at all.
But I do agree with you they should come out and say they messed up. Or make them full employee's that have to be held accountable.
F1 penalties should be black and white with respect to what punishment is applied to which rule was broken. I thought the stewards had a system that helps them with such events. The fact it was an ex Ferrari driver that was the driver steward on the day? It needs to be addressed openly by F1 to clarify the oversight or whatever it was that caused the issue.
Marc, besides consistency..where I am struggling is how can an incident that happens before the race, can lead during a penalty during the race....worsen by the rumor that Miko Salo already informed Finnish television before the start of the penalty. Shoudn't this have been a grid penalty like other incidents that happen before the race.
I think the reason it wasn't a grid drop was because the investigation started so late into the pre-race procedures. But even then it took them way too long to sort it out.
The media are trying to cover up the Salo scandal and are doing everything to avoid discussion of it hoping it will just go away and fans will forget about it but that is a massive massive miscalculation because that leak, the conflict of interests with a Fin driver benefitting and the potential for betting fraud because of the leak make this a humongous scandal of epic proportions.
Trying to bury a story this big is clearly going to completely destroy the reputation of the stewards and the FIA in an unrecoverable way.
The issue with that is it would not serve their purpose. If they had not had a red flag Hamilton would have been well down the road and gapping to mitigate the extra 10- seconds he could not make up in one or even two laps.
One issue I know was mentioned is that the stewards were occupied with the actual start itself and so they could not look into the possible infraction until after the start. I am note sure if the rules speak to whether that is acceptable, or if there is any limits to this practice or not? #AskElvis However, from a practical perspective, it makes sense.
If it's a pre-race infringement that gives an in-race advantage, should it not deserve an in-race penalty?
if you're talking about consistency then like Belgium and Brazil mark it on the track where practice starts should be so there is no ambiguity at all
Totally agree. Ferrari's excuse was a bit like being caught for breaking curfew and saying "sorry I was out committing a robbery".
Geoff Macey agreed .
Lewis is being targeted.
Babita Singh that’s the perception.
I told you the FIA doesn’t want to punish Leclerc.
I am forced to compare F1 with Premier League football all the time right now. VAR is causing the exact things to happen in football. Controversy was meant to lessen with the video referee, but instead it has gotten worse. I totally agree. Without consistency, you lose the very thing you are meant to be protecting
Well the FIA also want reverse grids so they want Mercedes at the back and they want more interesting races....... so moving Lewis back with a 10 second penalty makes things more interesting from their perspective. Not saying this is why they applied the rule with Lewis and not to Le Clerc, but we all know the FIA want closer racing.
Fire Up we all want closer racing, even Lewis , but the other teams need to take the fight to Mercedes, not the stewards.
Idea ! Why not do a blow by blow of the FIA intervention into the Malaysian Grand Prix of 1999. The Barge board controversy is certainly one of the most inexplicable reversals of all F1 history. Once a car is placed on a conformal bridge for measure, all facts are the facts. Can you explain this obvious intervention on Ferrari's behalf? Pet both dogs for me.
Great video Marc, you’ve highlighted some very interesting points in this video
Yes, there should be permant and professional stewards. In addition, there should maybe also be additional stewards, which do not see the race and only get a neutral description / neutral cgi.
Well done on looking carefully at this issue unlike many you have researched this and examined the notes etc good job sir
Really appreciate you addressing this Marc. Thank you. Excellent assessment. Please send a link to the FIA. Seriously, if not get it done by someone who can reach them.
FIA doesn't want Mercedes to win 🏆. So they become biased 🤬
dont be stupid.
Could it be that none of the teams made a complaint in Belgium, but some team(s) did in Russia? And therefore the stewards had to investigate and judge it.
It's been seen before that i.e. Renault F1 Team have made a complaint because they could benefit from it. Like when they made a complaint about Haas' floor, so they could gain a position in the WCC.
I think certain fans are always gonna be suspicious of bias. You see it in football too. There might be a biased official here or there, but I think most care about fairness as much as the rest of us since they are fans as well
Hi Elvis, This is a two part question that I would love your opinion on regarding the Hamilton incident. (1) Was it not a situation that was always going to be ambiguous and a race result defining decision, So ! Should it not have been one that was carried over until after the race ? After all it would have been easier to take the result away ( by handing out a 10 second penalty after) than giving the race win back if like in this case inconsistency's are found. (2) Who decides if something will be investigated after the race and how do they make that decision ?
Leclerc
1. Practice start
2. Unbuckled seat belts
3. Causing a collision with Stroll etc.
But Hamilton is being penalized for ever single thing 😠😡
Sanjay Sahadeo there adding up.
I have been watching F1 since the late 70s. I could not count the number of times Ferrari have been let off or received lesser punishments.
If Lewis were to get a race ban at a critical phase of the championship, that would be huge
I now understand why LH believes they are out to get him.
Yes, it is of paramount importance to have consistency in spaghetti sauce.
I have been saying for years that stewards should be paid professionals. In every other professional sport, football, cricket, tennis, basketball, etc the official enforcing the rules is trained and employed to do the job. How would you feel if the umpires and referees where just invited to adjudicate these sports every game?
The only black man in formula 1. He was bound to get pulled over by the cops for speeding...
I'm really liking these videos from you ex F1 incumbents.....it's good to hear unbiased analysis from people like you and Peter Windsor...... A Great review with a lot of common sense, something F1 is lacking at the minute.
Ferrari International Assistance strikes again...
Ty so much for this! Sometimes this sport could get frustrating but hearing your reasoning about the situations makes it a little better
This is your best produced video .... well done keep it up.
Great unexpected video Marc. I agree with you that we need consistency. I think we need the same stewards hired by f1 every week. Then if there was an "unusual" decision, the stewards could be held accountable. It's very hard hold someone accountable when they might only steward a couple of races a year.
The bias against Lewis Hamilton in F1 is plain to see . Drivers are getting away with far worse incidents in the sports with hardly a slap on the wrist if any , and yet Lewis is consistently been punished for all sorts of nonsense. F1 wake up the world is watching . It's Embarrassing to say the least . Be consistent with your rules for one , and leave the man alone ...Lewis that is .
Say no more.....
ABDEL HAEY DAN-OTHMAN say no more ..nudge nudge wink wink .
Video quality on point today. Also a few new editing tricks? Nice work Marc!