Hi guys Hugh here again with a quick update and some corrections to this video Unfortunately as of November 27th 2023 the class 319 has been officially retired by WMT as the new class 730s have come in link to a video here: ua-cam.com/video/vAy4RpKT6o4/v-deo.htmlsi=bUoudLenlSiYz2wQ and Northern have also retired them in early January so therefore. RIP Class 319 1988-2024 Corrections The Class 313 was the first Dual Voltage EMU in the UK as it ran on the Northern City Line and North London Line from 1976 which predates the 319 by a decade. Northern are replacing their fleet with class 331s which are being replaced on their existing routes by the 323s transferred from WMT. Sad that these iconic (yet flawed) trains are now gone but hey the 730's are fine units and defiantly worth a ride!
A bit of a shock to see a video giving a rather negative view of the Class 319 which to my mind is an iconic EMU. When I had my first ride on one in the power car I was sold by the awesome noises, it was like sitting in a loco and you could hear `engineering in action'. I didn't appear to be alone in enjoying the noise show either since others could have moved into adjacent cars if they objected but appeared content where they were. The 319s were indeed amongst the first UK EMUs to be dual voltage although the first was the Class 313. The 319 was the first British Rail unit to use modern thyristor control in place of a camshaft and resistor bank.
For a regular commuter I can completely see the complaints. From an enthusiast perspective I like them, I really like the traction motor noise, and the bumpiness makes for a very fun ride
The class 319 was groundbreaking when it was introduced for the Thameslink route between Bedford and Brighton, and yes I agree against the present Class 700s they do seem very old and noisy and cramped, like Marmite you either loved them or hated them,
The other interesting thing about the 319s is that a few of them have also been converted to bi-mode or diesel-only operation in the form of the class 769, which is in service with Northern and Transport for Wales. GWR had also ordered some but those plans have since been abandoned.
11:19 the same thing happens on our 150s up north, if you're drifting off and a passing train goes past at speed it makes a bit of a bang sound and I've seen it make passengers jump before. Must admit it makes me jump sometimes too 😂
Having a table was certainly not the usual set up on Thameslink, I went into London many times on 319s and never saw one. One of my memories is waiting amongst a full platform of people at the old Kings Cross station only for a 4 carriage train to turn up! Safe to say we were in there like sardines until we got to St Albans.
To be honest. These Class 319's are very much been neglected and they used to be great trains to ride on. If you get the right driver and a clear line. These things were fast back in the 1990's and 2000's but like with most ex-BR stock. Age is their enemy and 38 of the 86 built have been scrapped due to being too worn out to be reused as a Class 769 which some still live on to be. I would like to see at least one preserved for historical lessons of how rail travel has evolved. I was only 8 when I rode them new in 1988 from Brighton to London and back then, they could outrun the 1963 stock and were fast off the bat. They had a slightly sporty look to them and kind of reminded me of a sprinter Class 150/0 a bit at the front end but with a middle door. Northern has refurbished these as the Class 769's and they have improved reliability if you ever wanted to try them out.
They were built for the 1970s takeover of the ex-London Underground Northern City line Moorgate to Finsbury Park and beyond, which changed from 750v DC third-rail to 25kv overhead somewhere along the route.
I’m on vacation (holiday)in London this week and rode a 319 earlier, an ex-Thameslink unit. I enjoyed the loud traction motors but man was it tattered looking inside
Better or worse than the 465? Or about the same? Me personally i think they are better than the 465s with the blue poles, but about the same as the 465/9 (Orange poles)
Class 313 were dual voltage for the Northern City Line, they predate the 319s by a good decade. Along with the 350s the 319s are the only Class I know I've been on every one. Good units back in the day on the MML but the doors never liked winter or heavy rain. Good vid.
Nice. Reminds me of the class 315's that I used to commute on to Liverpool St. station. They replaced class 306 units and if you think that 319's were bad........the 306's were awful! The 315's from Shenfield were themselves replaced by the Elizabeth Line class 345. Yesterdays hi-tech is tomorrows scrap.
319s are proper nice old trains, noisy and bouncy is lovely 😅 not like these new trains hard seats and no character, 319 nice proper train like SWR class 455
What's happening with the class 769 conversions? Used to travel on the 319s in South London, and they were run down and positively pedestrian in nature even then.
Another great adventure 😎WOW those are some old manky trains ...... patch work seats 🤣 East Midlands viewer here...... i rely EMR to get into London (I think its the 360 class) would like to watch your verdict on EMR)
brilliant review of the 319s ive recently rode the Northern ones last Month & the Northern ones are quite Filthy inside but they are great trains to ride
Gunna miss the 319's for one reason only I used to take my gaming laptop & sit outside of Euston station all night playing video games then Sleep on the 319's to a random destination for lunch in a random pub I still remember getting my first telling off from the staff
I hadn't realised the 319s were still about. I thought after thameslink they had all been converted to other classes (or waiting conversion). I used to ride the regularly and my experience was always that they were slow and the seat pitch made for bad posture. Although I did sometimes ride in declassified 1st class. In one of the variants (which were rare to my line) the first class section was actually very nice - with far supirior seats. Although I later found out that on that particular journey the 1st class may not have been as declassified as I had assumed. Oops.
Surprised to see you say they were slow. The drivers seemed to drive them like sports cars in my experience .... power on, power off etc. not smoothly driven, A litle slower on 3rd rail admittedly.
Yep and soon to be replaced by the Class 730 either at the end of this year or beginning of next year and to be moved for storage. Or to be converted to Class 768 Orion logistics trains.
I used to commute on Thameslink on these in the 1990s and into the 2000s. Even then they were outdated, and were really not suited for Thameslink's boast of serving two airports (a packed commuter train, plus airport users and their luggage, and no luggage racks. Genius). I am sorry I ever had to use them and am pleased they are being got rid of.
I knew a bunch had been transferred to Northern (saw some in Manchester recently) but didn't realise they were still running into Euston. I might have a go on one before they disappear. They're not modern, but they make a good sound, and still could've been worse. Could've been a Pacer! haha
Well they're actually not good enough for the North either, they're leaving Northern soon too! (The 769 class derived from them are staying around a bit longer though AFAIK)
Back in Jan 2022, I actually rode on a 319 from Watford to Euston and my thoughts on it were pretty mixed. The seats seemed really low and unclean and the train overall made me think of breaking down. Thankfully they are getting replaced for good! Excellent video!!
What are you smoking... what do you expect they are 30 years old.. as the seats are better than most. and the "vents" are called hopper windows.. all trains have them normally they are locked so you wouldnt know what it is
They should have straight up upgraded these trains instead of convert these trains into class 769s as the class 769 has acceleration slower than the pacers
The scathing criticism (e.g. “rubbish”) of the Class 319s is excessive. Yes, they were 35 years old before their withdrawal, but back in the 1980s/1990s when I travelled on them frequently on the Thameslink or Connex’s Rugby - Gatwick routes, they were state-of-the-art. Trains are subject to speed limits, and while lines in and through London (for example) often do not allow high speeds, the 319s are permitted to run at 90mph or above elsewhere. From my travelling on sections with high line speeds, the criticism of their acceleration has no justification, and as for motor noise, why not move to a trailer car?
319s are ‘80s technology in fairness, so will look a little long in the tooth now. They along with, 318s, 320s, 321 and 322 of similar design served the rail industry very well and were the last bastion of BREL engineering from York. Only one vehicle had traction motors so acceleration was never going to be on par with the more modern stock. As for saying the 350s are superior, as someone who travellers Rugby Euston 3-4 times a week, trust me they have their flaws. At 110mph the Desiro family ride really rough especially when sat at the vehicle ends over the bogies, and the 350/2 are vile, now very filthy and cramped, at least the 350/1, /3 and /4 variants have better seating in 2+2. Let’s see what the Aventras brings, yes they will have that new car smell, and look modern, make a whirring sound, have ironing board seats, but ultimately still get you from a to b.
I've given the 319s the thumbs down for the past 30 years Noisy, unreliable, about as much power as a lawnmower, draughty when the windows are open Some enthusiasts in the North West have nicknamed the 319s "filthy buggers", and I can see why
@@bus3s just at the top of my head. They accelerate slower on diesel (impressive seeing as the 319 is already slow), they're louder, and they're less reliable with them often being out of service. They don't even improve anything about the 319 either. They have the same seats, ride quality, dingy lighting, 3+2 seating, etc. I suppose you could argue they're on par with the 319 but in my opinion they are worse
@@bus3s oh right. Sorry I must have misremembered. Regardless I still think they are worse than the 319 based on my experience and how they have been performing
You are a real moaner you should come north and the reason for your moans is because you have been spoilt with new rolling stock well I think this will be ending as more money is coming north to the northern power house to level up the transport up here with new rail lines, new rolling stock and electrification.
Lmao ok so you've made 3 comments on this channel and all of them are being negative to the owners of this channel. Can you come off the channel if you don’t like it? 👍🏽
I probably agree 👍 that class 319s must end their lease with NT - Northern and LNWR - London Northwestern Railway 🚃 because they could be tatty trains 🚆 are aging their age. Class 319s are second generation EMU - Electric ⚡️ Multiple Unit trains 🚊. Class 319 trains 🚊 are probably feeling uncomfortable 😳. No smoking 🚭 on all of these trains 🚆 because it’s prohibited 🚫 and can cause a serious 🧐 fire 🔥. Most of the other class EMU trains 🚆 are good 👍 because they are comfortable. The man 🧍♂️ 👨 said that class 319 trains 🚆 are rubbish and he’s not joking 🙃. Small world 🌍 to me. 👍
![Abandoned Stations in SCR [Part 1]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/ZXMqbCMq1_M/mqdefault.jpg)
Hi guys Hugh here again with a quick update and some corrections to this video
Unfortunately as of November 27th 2023 the class 319 has been officially retired by WMT as the new class 730s have come in link to a video here: ua-cam.com/video/vAy4RpKT6o4/v-deo.htmlsi=bUoudLenlSiYz2wQ and Northern have also retired them in early January so therefore. RIP Class 319 1988-2024
Corrections
The Class 313 was the first Dual Voltage EMU in the UK as it ran on the Northern City Line and North London Line from 1976 which predates the 319 by a decade.
Northern are replacing their fleet with class 331s which are being replaced on their existing routes by the 323s transferred from WMT.
Sad that these iconic (yet flawed) trains are now gone but hey the 730's are fine units and defiantly worth a ride!
It's sad 319s are gone
pretty clear that London Northwestern are doing the bare minimum of maintenance until the 319s are off lease
yep! They are currently running pretty much exclusively the 350s that are 3+2 (the ones that are due to move to another operator).
A bit of a shock to see a video giving a rather negative view of the Class 319 which to my mind is an iconic EMU.
When I had my first ride on one in the power car I was sold by the awesome noises, it was like sitting in a loco and you could hear `engineering in action'.
I didn't appear to be alone in enjoying the noise show either since others could have moved into adjacent cars if they objected but appeared content where they were.
The 319s were indeed amongst the first UK EMUs to be dual voltage although the first was the Class 313.
The 319 was the first British Rail unit to use modern thyristor control in place of a camshaft and resistor bank.
Weren’t the class 313s for the Northern City line the first dual voltage train?
thats what I was thinking
For a regular commuter I can completely see the complaints. From an enthusiast perspective I like them, I really like the traction motor noise, and the bumpiness makes for a very fun ride
The class 319 was groundbreaking when it was introduced for the Thameslink route between Bedford and Brighton, and yes I agree against the present Class 700s they do seem very old and noisy and cramped, like Marmite you either loved them or hated them,
The other interesting thing about the 319s is that a few of them have also been converted to bi-mode or diesel-only operation in the form of the class 769, which is in service with Northern and Transport for Wales. GWR had also ordered some but those plans have since been abandoned.
11:19 the same thing happens on our 150s up north, if you're drifting off and a passing train goes past at speed it makes a bit of a bang sound and I've seen it make passengers jump before. Must admit it makes me jump sometimes too 😂
get the same thing on 455s on SWR - I take it's how the doors are installed/secured within Mark 3 units
Having a table was certainly not the usual set up on Thameslink, I went into London many times on 319s and never saw one.
One of my memories is waiting amongst a full platform of people at the old Kings Cross station only for a 4 carriage train to turn up! Safe to say we were in there like sardines until we got to St Albans.
Brilliant old stuff. Old southern region slam doors even better
To be honest. These Class 319's are very much been neglected and they used to be great trains to ride on. If you get the right driver and a clear line. These things were fast back in the 1990's and 2000's but like with most ex-BR stock. Age is their enemy and 38 of the 86 built have been scrapped due to being too worn out to be reused as a Class 769 which some still live on to be. I would like to see at least one preserved for historical lessons of how rail travel has evolved. I was only 8 when I rode them new in 1988 from Brighton to London and back then, they could outrun the 1963 stock and were fast off the bat. They had a slightly sporty look to them and kind of reminded me of a sprinter Class 150/0 a bit at the front end but with a middle door. Northern has refurbished these as the Class 769's and they have improved reliability if you ever wanted to try them out.
No hate 319's are better than any new trains both them 455's and other BREL trains I'd go on any day than the newer ones
I miss these trains. The seats are so much more comfortable than what replaced them
No you just can't accept change 350s are way comfier learn to accept change
@@DarkLeaf theyre not tho, thats the thing, the ride quality of each is about the same
pretty sure that the class 313s were the first British dual voltage EMU design, being built in the late 1970s
They were built for the 1970s takeover of the ex-London Underground Northern City line Moorgate to Finsbury Park and beyond, which changed from 750v DC third-rail to 25kv overhead somewhere along the route.
Drayton Park@@nickcotterell1106
@@nickcotterell1106at Drayton Park I think
yes the change over voltage was operated at drayton park station @@nickcotterell1106
I’m on vacation (holiday)in London this week and rode a 319 earlier, an ex-Thameslink unit. I enjoyed the loud traction motors but man was it tattered looking inside
Better or worse than the 465? Or about the same?
Me personally i think they are better than the 465s with the blue poles, but about the same as the 465/9 (Orange poles)
11:30 nooo that's my favorite part. Love this about the 323, gives such retro vibes. I wonder if the drivers were flooring it or not?
Class 313 were dual voltage for the Northern City Line, they predate the 319s by a good decade.
Along with the 350s the 319s are the only Class I know I've been on every one. Good units back in the day on the MML but the doors never liked winter or heavy rain.
Good vid.
Nice. Reminds me of the class 315's that I used to commute on to Liverpool St. station. They replaced class 306 units and if you think that 319's were bad........the 306's were awful! The 315's from Shenfield were themselves replaced by the Elizabeth Line class 345. Yesterdays hi-tech is tomorrows scrap.
319s are proper nice old trains, noisy and bouncy is lovely 😅 not like these new trains hard seats and no character, 319 nice proper train like SWR class 455
What's happening with the class 769 conversions? Used to travel on the 319s in South London, and they were run down and positively pedestrian in nature even then.
Another great adventure 😎WOW those are some old manky trains ...... patch work seats 🤣
East Midlands viewer here...... i rely EMR to get into London (I think its the 360 class) would like to watch your verdict on EMR)
I travelled sometimes on the 319 from my southern station a good few years ago, I love the motor sounds!! Did these use to have a dinning cart?
Do the 350’s go on the Watford - St Albans shuttle because I was gonna hunt down one of these there?
The 350s are used on the Watford Junction to St Albans shuttle service
Do you remember the Citymetro and cityflyer thing they had or was it citi, I'm not sure. Even at the time I didn't think much of it.
brilliant review of the 319s ive recently rode the Northern ones last Month & the Northern ones are quite Filthy inside but they are great trains to ride
Gunna miss the 319's for one reason only I used to take my gaming laptop & sit outside of Euston station all night playing video games then Sleep on the 319's to a random destination for lunch in a random pub I still remember getting my first telling off from the staff
Not sure i understand why some class 321s were replaced with 319s when they're essentially about the same age and of a largely similarly design, no?
Now, only 8 of the 319s survive up North as converted 769s doing select services through Wigan and Manchester.
Yes, i can agree that the c2c Class 357 seats are rather comfy!
I used to ride these on tameslink I will miss the 319 and it’s 3+2 seating
I hadn't realised the 319s were still about. I thought after thameslink they had all been converted to other classes (or waiting conversion).
I used to ride the regularly and my experience was always that they were slow and the seat pitch made for bad posture.
Although I did sometimes ride in declassified 1st class. In one of the variants (which were rare to my line) the first class section was actually very nice - with far supirior seats.
Although I later found out that on that particular journey the 1st class may not have been as declassified as I had assumed. Oops.
Plenty of 319's in the North - we always get southern leftovers!
@@johnwebster3224poorly maintained leftovers as well…
Surprised to see you say they were slow. The drivers seemed to drive them like sports cars in my experience .... power on, power off etc. not smoothly driven,
A litle slower on 3rd rail admittedly.
@@Martindyna very slow on 3rd rail
@@LeeSmith-cf1vo Apparently they can be but where the 3rd rail has been upgraded (as for the old Eurostar) I understand there's not much in it.
The 730 which has the West Midland livery is only going to be a temporary measure and going from London Euston to Milton Keynes Central.
Yep and soon to be replaced by the Class 730 either at the end of this year or beginning of next year and to be moved for storage. Or to be converted to Class 768 Orion logistics trains.
What about the closure of Farringdon to Moorgate thameslink line in march 2009
313 was the first dual voltage train btw
I used to commute on Thameslink on these in the 1990s and into the 2000s. Even then they were outdated, and were really not suited for Thameslink's boast of serving two airports (a packed commuter train, plus airport users and their luggage, and no luggage racks. Genius).
I am sorry I ever had to use them and am pleased they are being got rid of.
we had am10 ( 310 ) then 317 , 312 , open your eyes young kid
I knew a bunch had been transferred to Northern (saw some in Manchester recently) but didn't realise they were still running into Euston. I might have a go on one before they disappear. They're not modern, but they make a good sound, and still could've been worse. Could've been a Pacer! haha
Oh my goodness. As I’m a food snob, this guy is a train snob! 🤔
3:51 Class 321s were newer… they were transferred to ScotRail and are still in service.
Not good enough for people in London but apparently good enough for us second class citizens in the North.
Well they're actually not good enough for the North either, they're leaving Northern soon too! (The 769 class derived from them are staying around a bit longer though AFAIK)
@@andrewholland1390 great, we are getting 323s that were made in the early 90’s to replace the 319s. More cast-offs.
@@michael_houghtonso are the CAF units - definitely not cast-offs - a figment of my imagination?
Back in Jan 2022, I actually rode on a 319 from Watford to Euston and my thoughts on it were pretty mixed. The seats seemed really low and unclean and the train overall made me think of breaking down. Thankfully they are getting replaced for good! Excellent video!!
Bushey is effectively s Watford and is a very busy commuter station.
I'll try and ride some before they go.
They only run on weekdays on lnwr
What are you smoking... what do you expect they are 30 years old.. as the seats are better than most.
and the "vents" are called hopper windows.. all trains have them normally they are locked so you wouldnt know what it is
They should have straight up upgraded these trains instead of convert these trains into class 769s as the class 769 has acceleration slower than the pacers
The 319s last day is apparently on monday the 23rd, but i guess well see
the 323s are replacing 331s, not the 319s, as the 323s will allow 331s to be transfered onto the routes 319s are currently use on
You went to Watford junction and never told me
Good video anyways
Nice video of the Flithy Buggers. The WMR Class 730 at Camden will be temporarily replacing the Class 319
nice vid
The scathing criticism (e.g. “rubbish”) of the Class 319s is excessive. Yes, they were 35 years old before their withdrawal, but back in the 1980s/1990s when I travelled on them frequently on the Thameslink or Connex’s Rugby - Gatwick routes, they were state-of-the-art. Trains are subject to speed limits, and while lines in and through London (for example) often do not allow high speeds, the 319s are permitted to run at 90mph or above elsewhere. From my travelling on sections with high line speeds, the criticism of their acceleration has no justification, and as for motor noise, why not move to a trailer car?
Nice video!
319s are ‘80s technology in fairness, so will look a little long in the tooth now. They along with, 318s, 320s, 321 and 322 of similar design served the rail industry very well and were the last bastion of BREL engineering from York. Only one vehicle had traction motors so acceleration was never going to be on par with the more modern stock. As for saying the 350s are superior, as someone who travellers Rugby Euston 3-4 times a week, trust me they have their flaws. At 110mph the Desiro family ride really rough especially when sat at the vehicle ends over the bogies, and the 350/2 are vile, now very filthy and cramped, at least the 350/1, /3 and /4 variants have better seating in 2+2. Let’s see what the Aventras brings, yes they will have that new car smell, and look modern, make a whirring sound, have ironing board seats, but ultimately still get you from a to b.
You should try and ride the last one
Skip to the riding bit 4:35
Another 2nd gen bites the dust.
The acceleration of a slug.
That's my memories of them!
I've given the 319s the thumbs down for the past 30 years
Noisy, unreliable, about as much power as a lawnmower, draughty when the windows are open
Some enthusiasts in the North West have nicknamed the 319s "filthy buggers", and I can see why
would be funny if the 769s outlasted the 319s considering they are arguably even worse trains
how are they worse? theyre the same, and they are outlasting them
@@bus3s No! The 769s are a watered down version of the 319 with terrible acceleration in all modes and has alot of faults.
@@bus3s just at the top of my head. They accelerate slower on diesel (impressive seeing as the 319 is already slow), they're louder, and they're less reliable with them often being out of service. They don't even improve anything about the 319 either. They have the same seats, ride quality, dingy lighting, 3+2 seating, etc. I suppose you could argue they're on par with the 319 but in my opinion they are worse
@@AlexanderBrassington 769s don’t have 3+2
@@bus3s oh right. Sorry I must have misremembered. Regardless I still think they are worse than the 319 based on my experience and how they have been performing
My everyday commute is on a 319 :(
Great Video. The 319s are of their time. And that's a long time ago. Lack of maintenance ( same with 465s and466s)
Nice
All 319s are ex-thameslink units.
All the 319's were ex Thameslink
This was not the last day
Welcome class 769
You are a real moaner you should come north and the reason for your moans is because you have been spoilt with new rolling stock well I think this will be ending as more money is coming north to the northern power house to level up the transport up here with new rail lines, new rolling stock and electrification.
Lmao ok so you've made 3 comments on this channel and all of them are being negative to the owners of this channel. Can you come off the channel if you don’t like it? 👍🏽
Seat covers being different, plus they're not shoddy at all. Clearly no engineering qualifications here!
I probably agree 👍 that class 319s must end their lease with NT - Northern and LNWR - London Northwestern Railway 🚃 because they could be tatty trains 🚆 are aging their age. Class 319s are second generation EMU - Electric ⚡️ Multiple Unit trains 🚊. Class 319 trains 🚊 are probably feeling uncomfortable 😳. No smoking 🚭 on all of these trains 🚆 because it’s prohibited 🚫 and can cause a serious 🧐 fire 🔥. Most of the other class EMU trains 🚆 are good 👍 because they are comfortable. The man 🧍♂️ 👨 said that class 319 trains 🚆 are rubbish and he’s not joking 🙃. Small world 🌍 to me. 👍
RIP
Please take them off this line.
Don't like these trains though I like the motor sounds
Bushy and George Michael
These are completely out of date
The Class 319s Are Decent Trains People Should Not Be Allowed To Run Against Them