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The Current Era of VR has JUST ENDED.
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- Опубліковано 20 гру 2022
- Hello and welcome to Tuesday Newsday! Your number one resource for the entre weeks worth of VR news!
This one is one of the more important TNs- of course we have fun stuff to talk about like the Contact Gloves (VR gloves coming at a consumer price early next year), HTC's new VR headset, some new games, and more.. but we have a more pressing matter to analyze. John Carmack, one of the original pioneers of this current era of VR has announced his complete departure from the VR industry and from Meta (Carmack is one of the guys that really pushed for the Quest 2). So in order to explain what's currently happening in the VR space, lets talk about hype cycles an we'll fully deconstruct what this means for the industry currently and in the near/ far future- Also some Quest 3 stuff :D
Hope you enjoyed!
My links:
Twitch:
/ thrilluwu
My discord:
/ discord
Patreon link:
/ thrillseeker
OUTRO MUSIC:
• Magic.
Contact Glove kickstarter:
www.kickstarte...
Hopefully this was an insightful episode, a lot of things may make a lot more sense. Welcome to the life-death-rebirth cycle of Virtual Reality. Also join in my discord server! Massive VR Community Christmas Party today! Discord.gg/Thrill
Its thursday at my play
You're 100% on point with the John Carmack stuff. He's one of the all time greats but he's not a god. Wasn't he completely against Oculus having tracking controllers? He's human.
Vr is alive
quest 2 is amazing. john carmack lives in a bubble
*Contesting for question of the week*
Even if this isn't question of the week I would appreciate if you answered it. Big fan btw
If there was one or two pc or console game you would wanna see in VR what would they be?
And you can't add games you can mod into vr (some of the Resident Evil games, Half Life 2, etc)
I'm mainly sad that John Carmack left because he is such an incredibly talented and smart engineer. I do wish you explained his position more, because he did not only make all those early games, *he literally pioneered new graphics technology that allows modern games to exist*. This includes raycasting (Wolfenstien 3D), adaptive tile refresh, binary space partitioning (Doom), surface caching (Quake), and many more. He also created the asynchronous spacewarp that Oculus headsets use, and Valve even licensed one of HIS engines for Half-Life. I literally consider him the god of modern games and praise him as such.
He is a seriously invaluable person and Meta effectively forcing him out is a loss for everyone. Though given his grievances (which I share as an Oculus user, pre and post meta) show that even if he stayed, he wouldn't have been able to do much. Meta really dropped the ball here and people don't seem to understand how important this is. If Meta allowed John to truly work his magic, who knows what sort of amazing VR tech we would already have.
Meta was holding back what Carmack is capable of.
no longer shackled by facebook . i don't know about you but he will create more impressive things when no longer have the out of touch heads breathe down his neck .
@@CoolSs yep, but unfortunately not in the VR space for the time being, as it seem he'll continue working toward the AI path of machine learning and such.
Recasting was pioneered by him? I literally used raycasting in Unity for my very first game in 2017 to create some very intricate puzzles... never thought about who actually invented that system
Watch the five hour interview he gave some time ago. He talked about he's been cutting back on Meta work and started to work on his next thing. I don't remember exactly. I think he was aiming for general artificial intelligence
I don’t think more people realize how big of a deal Carmack was, and arguably very much still is.
Pancakes lover
my man is literally the reason games are in 3d nowadays
that is a nice profile pic u have there friend
i am glad he left facebook .
pancakes
*Mark: we will offer you triple pay if you stay*
*John: It's not always about the money, Spiderman*
The game company I work for has lived through the entire Gartner hype cycle. It's kind of crazy looking back at it. We were one of the first developers to even get a VR headset prototype from HTC since they were our partners. Once that initial VR hype train crashed and burned, we almost didn't make it and come out from the wreckage alive, but now we are clearly in that real growth phase have have greatly expanded today since that crash.
VR never lives threw the cycle though...
Same for the company I work for! But we're on the enterprise side. It's absolutely amazing and exciting to see so many more folks get excited about the real-world usecases of VR and XR in general.
Might I ask what company?
@@lifeartstudios6207 Steel Wool. The Five Nights VR game was probably our most popular VR title, but we did a lot of early VR games before that.
You inspired me to become a VR dev, I'm working on a medical training sim right now and also make vrchat maps in my free time. Thank you!!
Heck yeah!!!! THAT'S AMAZING!
Nice one bruv
Definitely the wild west compared to traditional game development but that means opportunity, unlike the traditional game development space we are actually badly in need of more games and obviously that means more VR focused developers.
I'm a computer science major and been in VR since 2019 and I'm also using VRChat as a way to test out unity and learn more about optimization and general interaction/logic and what is actually possible when it comes to integrating existing C# code to Udon [which seems will be getting a major improvement with the upcoming update to Udon].
Thats awesome man
You’re not a developer. Just a guy with a pc lol
John Carmack is a legend. I hope he stays in the VR industry.
Maybe he should join Valve or Apple.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but he's moved onto his own startup company that will specialize in artificial intelligence. I think he's moved on.
Looks like he is all in on some AI project. Kind of disappointing...
@@fabledorchid8410 That's too bad. But AI is a field that benefits all tech as well so good luck t o him.
@@csakzozo Not some AI project. He wants to focus on AGI, so real artificial intelligence. If he can make anything happen it will be just as exciting.
Next to the hype cycle that you described. I think that we are basically in a recession where a lot of people just don't have the money for luxury products like vr.
But phones and consoles is okay
@@holorn1280 phones are necessary for most daily life. Consoles are a known source of entertainment so it's a saver purchase then a vr headset that you might not like.
@@The_oli4 Not to mention VR is hard to get into, and very finicky atm. So you got the expensive aspect, and you got the confusing aspect of what it even does, or why should they even bother when cheaper things 'do the job better'.
You beat me to it.
That means they don't have the money for anything that costs the same as VR. The only people buying consoles instead of VR headsets are 30-40yo millenials and Gen-Zers, because all the kids want now is VR. Once they try their friend's VR headset, it's game over. Ask me how I know. Hell, our neighbors' kids were coming over to play VR and eventually got their own VR headset for Xmas after 2 years, instead of a console. This is happening *everywhere* whether you know it or not. VR is what the kids want, and as history has shown, it's the kids that set the trends, not the out-of-touch adults.
I miss the old oculus but I’m ready for what Valve continues to bring to the table. They’ve definitely taken the mantle and will do right by the community and what’s best for this industry. As for the now shell of a company that used to be Oculus thank you to Palmer Luckey, Brendan Iribe, Michael Antonov, Nate Mitchell and John carmack for your work. You were the backbone VR needed early on, what made oculus great and did tremendous work that will continue to echo through this industry for years to come.
I think Valve is pretty much done. They make a wonderful living off of Steam. But one VR game in 10 years???
@@bobdouglass8010 He's not talking about their games, as Valve isn't much in the market of games anymore (that we know of), but it's their products. the Index and its new controllers were game changing back in 2019 with finger tracking. the Deckard will take it to a whole new level.
@@bobdouglass8010 @ballcast1 got it. I’m mainly talking about hardware as there’s many VR game studios creating great experiences but very few competitors in the VR hardware space. Not to mention whatever headset valve puts out next, will most likely become priority #1 for devs to optimize their game on. however, I still have high hopes for their software as well. Alyx was released less than three years ago and it’s usually everyone’s favorite game to date or at least in their top 3. I think within these next couple of years, we’re going to see a very different valve than we have for the past decade. I think the steam deck, index and Alyx are just the beginning of some big stuff to come.
Valve is more trustworthy than Facebook/Meta also the Valves first VR headset and VR game got people excited for VR.
I just hope the deckard is affordable like the quest or Pico is
Im sick of dealing with Facebook/meta bs but i cant afford to buy a $1000+ headset
"VR is dead, long live VR" is a pretty good quote, thank you for this art
Pretty sure it’s a slightly altered version of a very famous quote that already exists
@@mr.stuffdoer8483 yes, but I would've never thought to use it in the context of VR or technology use in general, you know how smooth my brain is?
People; 3d glasses and cloud gaming are the FUTURE!!! (both failed commercially)
People; VR IS DEAD!! (VR sold very well that even Jesus said VR is the true future)
@@DeadKing101 reusing quotes with slight alterations is as classic an idea as quoting things. You must have a very Smooth Brian
@@mr.stuffdoer8483 what did Smooth Brian ever did to you
From the DK1 to Quest Pro in a decade is an astonishing accomplishment.
There are no words to describe how ridiculous it actually is... i mean, we have chips, sensors, liquid crystals, oleds and lenses that let us explore virtual worlds. Even if it took them 30 years from kickstarter to the quest 1 i'd still say the same thing.
People often underestimate how exponential the progress of human technology is.
I actually view this as good thing . if he begin his own VR hardware that not focused on creating glorified online meeting room (the metaverse) that will be amazing . John Carmack is really smart guy and i felt sad that he been shackled by facebook . the guy literally made doom by going to libraries and learning coding by BOOKS (it's more complex than that . i recommend seeing interview about the guy) . VR being more for enthusiasts is good thing imo .
Sounds like he's moving on to working on artificial intelligence
He should join Sony, they are the only company that is truly invested in VR with both feet!
@@s3rv3r3rror8 yeah, with both feet planted on the PS5 while the rest of the industry makes standalone hardware or devices for PCs which are far more universal than a single console platform
unless of course their VR tech is compatible with PCs without any workarounds, to be frank I haven't done any research
would be great if he teamed up with valve or went on board with khronos and cleaned up openxr. I hear samsung is looking to make a quest competitor and I find that interesting.
@@s3rv3r3rror8 When he can work for Ellon Musk?
What I really appreciate about your videos is your ability to keep the fire alive for VR enthusiasm, regardless of what the state of VR is
ok
arent you his gf?
@@z4po325I don’t… think that really matters. Not unless you believe someone can only be complimented when in a relationship
Unless you were asking a genuine question, in which case I apologize, too much twitter recently has fried my social circuits and I did NOT mean to sound like a white knight lmao. If so, have a nice day, sorry for bothering ya.
I think VR might be undeniably developed around 2025. Who knows, maybe we can play GTA 6 in VR if Moore's law hold true and there's plenty of growth.
And Virtual Is Where We Live!
sorry got caught up in the rallying cry
I honestly can't wait to see what Carmack does next.
AGI, artificial general intelligence, an AI that is not just useful for one task
He is working on AGI
@simpson6700 General purpose computers where a huge deal, so general purpose AI will be equally as important.
Doom 3: 2
*please*
Okulus 4 😂
I am an "old guy." In the early days, I used to marvel at what people like Bill Budge, Bert Kersey, Ken & Roberta Williams, and Todd Rundgren came up with. (Yes, that Todd Rundgren. He programmed graphics tablet software back when that was hardly even a thing, and also a cool psychedelic screen saver for 8-bit graphics.) I played the original Escape from Castle Wolfenstein by Muse, then the 3D Wolfenstein by Carmack, John Romero and company (id Software) blew me away. Then Doom, Quake, etc. I got into Doom and Heretic modding and level creation. I used to read Carmack's "finger" posts (remember those?) and TRY to sort of understand what he was talking about. Dude is a technical genius. Though I no longer enjoy really violent games -- I never picked up the modern Doom titles, for example, and would much rather play PC and VR games that put me into a more peaceful, hopeful, yet interesting world with other types of challenges other than just having to kill things -- nevertheless, I still worship Carmack for the brilliant guy that he was and is. He's a legend.
I think they need to put AR on the back burner until VR is further along. There's a chance that early AR will be more like the cheap fitness watches. It's kinda cool but ultimately more of a gadget and most people will not walk around outside with any kind of dual-use HMD. I think big companies need to focus on in-home use cases and let AR be a separate device and ecosystem.
The content has been better than ever dude, keep up all the hard work!
HEY! THANK YOU :D
@@ThrillSeekerVR You're very welcome! ALSO: I have a QOTW for you -- How do you feel about location based VR like the now defunct VOID Star Wars experience? Does VR have more of a future through custom rides and experiences where immersion can be upped even more?
@@machineo12887 I think location based VR is cool.. but at least from the locations I have been to, they don’t offer anything significantly better than off the shelf solutions.. and in many situations offer worse experiences than off the shelf solutions (just buying a Quest 2 or having a PCVR setup)
The only way I can see location based VR working really well is to bring truly next level, insane VR (or XR) experiences. Also would require a really good marketing push.
It's unfortunate that so many people have, especially in recent years, come to think in terms of good/bad, yes/no, red/blue, hyped/dead. Reality (including the virtual kind) is just more complicated than that. In my case, I absolutely LOVE VR, I just don't want anything to do with Facebook's VR (no matter what they call it.)
I don't think VR is ever going to die... Pandora's box has been open! And it's not going back in!! And I do see more and more push for AR stuff?!? And I also think that can help the world of VR keep growing... Love the channel stay awesome Merry Christmas all!
Bro, I'm going to die on this hill. I live VR like crazy, I'm convinced that it will never die and that we just need to get ourselves together and finally get a steady walk going.
I think we have to face the possibility that VR may never be widely adopted in any form similar to what we're familiar with right now. No one was more excited than I was...and I sold my Quest 2 after a year. I think there is a huge cross section of the target audience for it, that just find out -- like I did -- that it's not just fun enough to overcome the downsides. Play area, headaches, nausea, the hassle of messing with the equipment (and the wireless on the quest wasn't working at the time unless you basically jailbroke the headset). I enjoyed a couple of games, but other than perhaps ALYX, maybe SAINTS AND SINNERS, there was nothing special about the games once VR novelty wore off, and to be fair I never tried the "METAVERSE." because it looked horrible. That's the real reason it never sustains any momentum. As far as Zukerberg...did anyone REALLY believe he was going to be able to come close to pulling this off? I sure as hell didn't. Until the tech is much much better, smaller, more lightweight, and generally less of a hassle...it's always going to be niche.
Honestly, this is the final nail in the coffin for the original Oculus... sure, Meta will still succeed with the Quest 2/Pro and future headsets, but at this point they're no longer what Oculus was, they've silently killed them off
I've been trying to save up for a VR headset for like 5 years, but every time I come close either something happens that takes my money, or the best headset for price changes (still pissed that the Quest 2 went up £100 the day before I was going to buy one)
the universe is saying its not worth it. i sold mine ages and and looking back at it im happy i did. i was in a very unhealthy point in my life and it did not help. Now i want one but i would limit my self to a few beat saber/pistol whip rounds or something.
Great Video mate 👍🏻 THANK YOU - VR is super cool & a lot of fun. I’m 60 and got our first VR - QUEST 2, I am finding it so much fun and it’s helping me with my arthritis and I can see it’s going to help me with my health having fun at the same time. I also live in a remote location so the social aspect will be interesting to say the least. Cheers from Western Australia 🇦🇺🤝🏻
Another banger by ThrillSeeker. Hopefully we start to see the rise of more home-grown approaches to VR like we've seen countless time before in other industries
Keep up the awesome work!
Won't happen. VR survived the hype cycle crashing becouse there was still HOPE. this time the cycle crashed with argueably the biggest person in the industry leaveing on beyond horrible terms with meta. Right after a wave of crypto scammmers where ruining VR for everyone. This is the scaryest time VR has ever had to deal with in the last few years. That's without even mentioning the VRChat EAC drama and now the VR desktop drama. This is NOT good for ANYTHING or ANYONE.
Investment for VR like tumbleweed... downside of economic hype bubble popping
@@housemouseshorts the vrchat eac thing changed nothing and the game is just as popular as it was before. We lost like 1k modders oh well.
@@Peglegkickboxer Your right and its amazingly good. I actualy have fun laughing at the cry babys. Just said it was a conterversy even if it had no effect in the long run it was super hostile for a good while. Im glad its calmed down and fizzled out now.
Finally got my first headset after years of following the industry. And even though games are pretty fun I am shocked the VR animation and 3D movies arnt hyped even more. Would love a deeper dive talking about that side of VR!
Those quill animations have been a real joy! I'm surprised we haven't seen more VR animations.
I had my first blown away experience with VR this week after playing dozens of VR games. I tried Luke Ross's Cyberpunk 2077 VR mod and it blew my mind. Its the best VR game I've ever played and it wasn't even meant to be a VR game. No tracking controllers - just a good ol' gamepad. The problem with VR is that they are all workout syms. Nobody is trying to work that hard to play a game. I think more triple-A developers need to think about story driven content that is playable seated. This is where VR should go IMO. If we additionally had higher-end and lighter headsets, everyone in the world would be in VR.
First to the Key - First to the Egg.
As a newcomer to VR, I'm glad to see updates like this. As with any platform you always get worried about how soon will it become obsolete or discontinued. I look forward to the next big thing.
VR is still in its infancy…
It will only truly be called Virtual once it centers around consciousness.
Can we take a second to appreciate how long it must take to edit these videos? Keep up the great work!
Longer than he spent researching.
Appreciate you POV and passion. ICR 💪🏼
Once my bachelor is done you'll get some sweet VR titles from me, I'm hyped for the future of VR 🥰
For a second there I got excited because I thought you said sweet VR "titties" 😞
don't know if someone will make it before you but we got to have a game similar to gta in vr
@@yrnsnagz We're far away from that yet. The man hours for developing that big a scenario in VR are staggering. We will need better development frameworks before we make it.
Such an interesting take because as someone brand new to VR, it almost feels like it's taking off and becoming more popular
I’m so thankful that you explained the whole cycle thing! I figured this must be the case, but I’m glad someone put it out in the open!
I still really want to build my own wacky worlds to explore in VR, AR, and Mixed reality! And honestly, since I don’t need any headsets to build the VR stuff, I think I know what one of my 2023 projects will be, especially while I save up for my own headset! 😁
❤WE R VR!❤
Having worked on my VR title for 6 years, this rings true, and is massively depressing.
We need some more shakeups in the industry. Millions of people have been introduced to VR and won't let it die like myself. Great video!
Nice to see the hype cycle concept pushed to the mainstream.
John Carmack leaving Meta and sending out that memo definitely sheds a bit of a bad light on the company, but hopefully it all results in better work from them there. It always seemed like a "too many cooks in the kitchen" situation there, so hopefully they can hunker down and really get a proper production pipeline there at Reality Labs.
Great video, Thrill! Hoping for big things with VR, but appreciate you having a positive outlook regarding the declining interest in VR as of late. Definitely a good time to reflect and try to get into that plateau of productivity you mentioned.
Big fan of Carmack, but I'm actually glad that he's going to be moving on. First, he's going to be free to build the next iteration of what ever has been lurking in that dark and twisted imagination of his. We've been denied this since he came onboard with Facebook / Meta. Second, he's been wrong on VR on some really critical aspects that I suspect have shaped Oculus / Meta development in negative ways. My biggest gripe has been his dismissal of room-scale experiences with VR. According to Carmack, we should all be sitting down to properly enjoy VR gaming and applications. I believe this lead directly to the deprioritization of full body mocap with quest, the lack of support for arms, legs, torso, etc in the Quest rigs, and the fact that now Meta is playing catchup in areas where it should be leading. And because of this, the areas of VR that should be the most compelling are missing -- like the full-body VRChat experience you keep referring to. Carmack's vision of VR was surely an important voice in that misdirection.
Woooow. I accually played that game at 1:36 when i was a kid visiting an amusement park in stockholm. I have thought about it many times since but seeing again sent me right back to that moment! Thanks for that!
Petition for Friday Lieday
Edit: Also thank lord for VO being back
You know i appreciate the "Meta arc" through the Thrillseeker lens, you really did your best to greet everything with as much genuine optimism you could. Meta did seem the one poised to continue their reign as the biggest hand on the VR rudder but its just kind of crumbling apart. I think once things get better economically and tech continues to improve in the background, VR will really come to life again.
I saw this coming as soon as Zuck bought Oculus and I go back to the original Rift. It's what happens when you make a deal with the devil
Carmack always was the anchor to Zuck's crazy vision. Hopefully the recent collaboration announcements and refocusing at Connect '22 means Mark is able to be more realistic even without Carmack around. Lots of "architecture astronauts" to watch out for.
i think carmack has put meta in the right direction (even valve isn't going to be making a wired PCVR-only lighthouse-tracking headset next), if zuck chooses to derail that with his hard on for being the social media guy it will be all on him
The last thing I want are architects.
I think your video make sense. Explaining all that, will keep VR enthusiasms and momentum during this down period. New VR user and lover will not be so shocked by this slow down, causing them to go on another passion. We need to keep people into this hobby this is so nice and has alot of potential and uses
Yeah man I literally purchased a meta oculus quest 2 headset 2 days ago :/ it’s supposed to come in today and I don’t know how to feel about this. Like I’m on the fence of returning it and I don’t even have it yet….
Insightful and digestible, even for someone like myself with an allergy to looking at things (including this medium we love) through the lens of commerce/business/profit necessities. I wish/hope that VR can ever be okay and alive even if it isn't ever massively mainstream.
I lately stopped using VR completely. Tere were periods when I was playing VR every day now I havent lauched it in months. The game that got me hooked was Beat Saber but nowadays I can't play anymore due to my health condition, also there's not much other interesting games so my Index is collecting dust and it makes me really sad. I hope there's something new and exciting coming so I can have that sparkle of excitement once again.
With psvr2 it would be sick to have naughty dog games in VR
The Last Of Us getting another rerelease would just fit in so well with this xD
@@ruolbu lmao
Personally, my biggest and only issues and deceptions with VR are the following:
- I get motion sickness in most games where I'm moving in 1st person view in the virtual environment, making most FPS or action games uncomfortable for me. The worst are flight simulators, which is what I was expecting to have the most fun with, but they really make me dizzy to the point they are unplayable.
- The device I'm using (Meta Quest 2) has preset IPD settings (inter-pupillary distance), and my IPD is somewhere half-way between two presets. I have a hard time to find the sweet spot and have to force it to stay off the presets (which have a physical notch that snaps when you're on it). I don't know why they didn't design it with a mechanical wheel like they have on binoculars to set the IPD very precisely.
Otherwise, I'm very pleased with my VR experience so far.
I would like to know how odd those gloves are, because I'm really interested in getting them from the short minutes you mentioned it here, I'm looking forward for your review video to decide if I shuold buy them or DIY a pair of LucidGloves whenever I can afford everything. Great video and thank you for providing us with the VR news Thrill
John Carmack, the Steve Wozniak of VR.
I'm actually glad he's fulltime into AGI now. I think that field needs more highly intelligent but sober people like him among the bridge crew, and if he couldn't make a difference at Oculus of all places, then he's much better off there. Long live VR.
He's a John Carmack of video games. You don't need to compare him to other people, you compare other people to him. He's a fricken' legend.
I will never stop making VR music videos! I have gotten so much joy out of creating and being in imaginary worlds that I will continue even if people stop watching VR altogether just for my own entertainment.
A decade ago when I got interested in VR with the Oculus dev kit 1, I both never would've expected and fully expected millions of sales in headsets. I expected the VR industry to boom and go big but at the same time it still takes me aback every now and then. I don't think newer people realize how extensive but vital VR is to the human experience, there will always be complications, the same applied to the device you're using right now...
I've had an Index for a while now. The issue is with the format. The actual control and visual format is extremely Un optimal. Its a relatively cheap way to immerse a certain percentage of your body and appendages in a virtual digital space. But its extremely uncomfortable, unnatural, and just poorly implemented and utilized. An experience like the one everyone wants with VR really needs to not have you strap something to your head. It needs to be something that surrounds you. A bubble of sorts. Perhaps an inflatable sphere with projectors all around it, and an omnidirectional tread pad. for you to walk on.
I thought I'd get used to VR eventually and get over stuff like motion effects and the headset fatigue, but im in my mid 20s and after hours and hours in many different types of VR games I still only last an hour or two at most before having to take an extended break, often dizzy and fatigued from refocusing and positioning myself in the space with a hot screen strapped to my eyeballs. Pretty much every game I try hasn't really figured out a good way move your character. besides the fact that the indexed thumbsticks are worse than the nintendo wiis, All of the movement implementations feel unnatural and disorienting. If I had to implement something, It would be a toggle for movement thats directed by your own physical movement in your space. Like a hold button to step forward and it steps or begins moving you continuously forwards, same for the other cardinal directions. Theres also the issue of precision. Consumer haptic gloves do sound like a step up, but even with body tracking nodes the sense of self is often wildly disjointed, Especially for things that have you in small spaces like at a desk or in a kitchen.
It almost feels like we're still stuck with the same technological disadvantages of the 90s implementation of VR. Until some form of holographic technology, perhaps even augmented reality like google glass is advanced. To me as an owner. It will always be a gimmick that will never live up to its promised immersion.
Thank you for the insightful content. Although I’ve fallen out of habit of using VR, your videos are able to keep me in the loop.
this is like listening to the owners of a company that you invested in trying to calm everyone after dropping 80% value
Could you elaborate? Are you talking about listening to thrill, or carmack?
@@RidgeXR_2 this video, not that thrill is doing something wrong it just is true
@@TheVRhub_ oh, yeah. Doesn't make his points bad points, but it does feel like that XD
not quite sure how else you'd say it though
More VR cafes.. I can't afford the hardware but would definitely like to try/use it now and again.
Piracy is a symptom of bad pricing. I've picked up a few VR titles recently when they went on sale, but I had a long drought of VR title purchases because of the pricing model some of these games have used. If I'm going to buy a 2-3 hour VR experience, I'm not going to spend AAA money on it. I have no issue refunding VR titles that don't deliver good gameplay or even replayability. My target for VR games in my Steam library are $20 and under. I've already spent $3000 on a pc, $1000 on VR peripherals, and now you want another $50 for a 1-2 hour "game" that has PS3(or PS2) graphics and more glitches than Cyberpunk 2077 at release? Nah I'm all set, I'll just keep using it to enjoy space/flight simulators and watch 3D movies.
Thanks for everything Mr. Carmack ♥️
I'm still disappointed, where's the face reveal Carmak?
Fun fact : John Carmack was the reason DOOM VFR was created. Back when he was at Bethesda
My family is hyped that I got us the new Oculus (just sold my PSVR). After work discount and eBay sale, upgraded only cost me $170. So used savings to get headstrap and controller grips this channel recommended and prescription glasses inserts. This is going to be the best Xmas ever. 3D movie theater theater, Wanderer, YT 360 videos, Superhot and Beat Saber (saved buying these games for Oculus). Good times!
I don't understand why anyone who is into video games would fail to prefer VR. To me VR is head and shoulders better that anything else.
Bro I love the vibes your videos give me,
they are so well-designed, you talk facts, and your intro is so chill, I love it even though I don't have a VR headset atm,
your videos are very interesting so I would say the sub was worth it
The editing is amazing!
Would've started giving some credentials, this is The John Carmack, this guy wrote assembly and C renderers for the first FPSes we ever had. You might have heard of Wolfenstein 3d, Doom and Quake. We should heed his word, he has been pushing tech since the beginning of tech, his Rage game was one of the first using the now common "streaming" techniques that allow super-game engines like Unreal to draw abusrds amount of data/textures by sending a constant flow of data to the graphics card as opposed as "baking" geometries into it and instancing.
Carmack single handedly help 3d gaming leap 10 years with quake. Every 3d game engine has dna from quake. I hope he starts his own vr company and puts meta to shame.
I noticed a little AI generated stuff in there it was a nice touch
Hey thank you!!! :D
VR is most certainly not dead. 2023 is going to be a huge year for VR.
i work in architecture and one of the things we found with vr is that it gives clients a really understanding of scale. but there are 2 main issues that vr can't (at the moment) solve. that is
1. only one person with the headset gets to experience it. sharing the experience would mean passing the headset around or having each person have one.
2. You only operate in one set of reality at a time. clients don't quite like being in 2 planes of reality at the same time. It's either you're in vr or in reality. what I mean by this is we found people don't like being talk to or guided by if the other person is not in the vr world. Or if you need to look at the vr space but also remove it to look at some drawings.
I know these are pretty much solvable but it just made vr a bit of a gimmick for us.
Why not just make your simulations server based? It would solve both problems. Is there any reason you can't just have each headset connect to a server where multiple people can view an architectural model?
Oh wait I just read the second half of your first problem. Never mind.
Despite how negative the first part of the video was, but for some reason I feel really great after watching this video. I'm hopeful for the future of VR. Your really made my day better with this video. Thanks 💜
Well looks like VR is going to be interesting
To me the main issue with VR right now is games. People love the idea of VR but when there are not a decent amount of great games that come out this slump is understandable.
Nicely said and researched. I’ve been following tech since 1982 and have seen so many waves. Poor journalism is a major factor in trend over excitement and downturns. When tech needs a while to mature the same media who hyped it starts complaining and instead of a natural development period, everyone listens to their doom and gloom and it takes a while (if and when) people start to see the potential and investors come back after being scared away.
When a tech is successful the media goes into the “well this success can’t possibly continue and they start running articles like is this the xxx killer? Which naturally scares potential buyers away and becomes a self fulfilled prophesy.
Sometimes companies abandon decent tech that if matured may not save the business but will add to its overall use and value if left unchallenged and stamped with “XXX is Dead” as you noted.
Big business is like middle school, many executives don’t understand the business’s they run and enlist the help of consultants with recent MBAs and no real work experience. Meanwhile they are so obsessed with what their competitors are doing that even if the competitors are totally misguided, they want to follow their perceived lead.
Was 3D a decent idea? I think so, but the active lens tech was cumbersome and while LGs Polaroid tech was better and less expensive , business wanted 3D to make everyone throw out their current displays and instead of stating this is an added feature, they called it a failure and moved away from the tech. (The last statement makes little difference if you like or loath 3D. It is an example about over hype and a quick abandonment of a potentially good idea).
VR has a place, AR has a place too, it needs more development and advancement as well as a killer app that even naysayers can’t ignore the value of. I have an original Oculus, Vive, PlayStation VR and reach for my Quest 2 the most often as it has less limitations. No beefy PC, no fixed base stations, no group of annoying wires. And If there isn’t enough space in one room, it is easy to take elsewhere. PSVR2 is coming and the price is decent, but do I truly wish to be tethered again?
Lastly my pet peeve, wtf is the deal with disembodied hands? If we are trying to be escaping into a world, having gloves floating in space breaks the illusion at once. Just avoid flesh tones and put sleeves and gloves and get away from that foolish implementation.
Just my 73 cents, other opinions are also respected even if I don’t agree.
nobody will be first
what i *can* do is be first on this comment
@@DarkCoatAzan touché
Question for question of the week:
In the grand scheme of things, how much do you think persistence and large scale instances are a necessity for a/the metaverse ?
Honestly, I don't know what's scarier, a genius like him working at Meta or having his own Ai company!
You know what would help stop "VR is Dead?"
No more headset exclusives, no more big companies buying up devs and killing their projects, and headsets that actually step up to the plate!
Face tracking, eye tracking, and higher resolution. Without breaking the bank.
*Looking at you Valve*
Am I the only person still ridiculously in love with VR?
I am, I guess a "super" user and so the whole artist formerly known as as facebook or "meta" side of the industry is completely not on my radar. We have wireless Index (nofio), 11 point tracking in VRChat (that's more than just legs Mr Zucks), the haptic gloves, 4090's, Varjo Aero, Eye tracking is accessible and soooo much more. Avatars and worlds are so easy to make with so many poggers tools to help make it easier. There's a huge community and if you spend a bit of time you can find some amazing people pretty easily.
Next time I see you in VRC Thrill I am expecting a Haptic High Five!!! (yes I ordered the gloves and got ronn to aswell XD)
If you're a VR Nerd now is a fun time!
I work at Reality Labs and I personally am very sad to see John go. I grew up on Doom and got interested in computer science after starting to play around with Doom modding tools in the early 90s. Joining Oculus/RL/Meta and working under Carmack (even indirectly) has really been the fulfilment of a childhood dream for me. His departure feels like a huge loss right now, but I'm sure John will go on to do great things in Artificial General Intelligence and continue innovating as he always has. Hopefully he stays involved in VR in some capacity as well. He's certainly a huge fan of the medium; I doubt he will shift his focus away from it completely. As for myself personally, I've never been more excited to work on VR!
Carmack already had a lower position of influence as a board advisor. It felt like he had already given up on vr at that point because he took his laser focus off of full time development for vr. This is similar to when facebook bought oculus there was backlash but we all knew it would eventually mean that facebook would slowly digest oculus and change the efficiency trajectory for vr development. But carmack is an OG for vr and Im glad he stuck around Facebook for as long as he did. Im sure all the corporate bureaucracy at facebook got to him though.
anaglyph in the 80s, VR in the 90s, stereoscopic glasses/tv in 2010, vr again, ... and again and again. I'm sure we'll get there, but to think that we're "finally" heading towards enlightenment is pretty optimistic.
I'm a rec room developer and going to continue to work on my projects despite the turbulence.
I never believe that it's dead when I'm playing it everyday and there's people on every game I play and lobby's maxed out
I'm glad he's moving on to AGI instead of VR. AGI will have far more impact than VR ever can. VR will eventually come around--it's a issue of other industries advancing so that VR can meet people's expectations.
Thanks for the consistency have a great christmas
Until we have some very light and small simple glasses that can do it all, VR will still be a small niche, that means lack of widespread good content and that in its turn keeps it a niche... We need 10 to 15 more years to have VR Mainstream
I played Beatsaber with John Carmack one time. I will never forget that moment.
I finally went in for a Pico 4 for Christmas, so actually the hype for me just begins!
I really hope software development in VR goes way further than it is now!
Thanks for your content as that also enticed me to go into VR!
Thank you for keeping us informed on what's happening with vr, also, what game are you playing at the end of the video...much love from halifax nova scotia🇨🇦
I backed the contact gloves a couple of days ago so I'm hoping you have good things to say about them once they arrive haha
Not to sound like a steam fan but I honestly think that if steam releases a standalone VR headset within the next year or two they could really steal the show
One thing I’ll add to the piracy conversation is that I personally do that to demo VR games. What I’ll do is play a game for maybe 10-30 minutes and determine if I like it, then buy it if I do. I do that because I spend a ton of money on VR games, and have been burnt too many times. There’s such a huge range of quality, and I’m protecting myself from wasting money.
Most people I tell that to ask me why I don’t just buy the game then refund it if I don’t like it. The reason for that is the constraints around the refund policies. I feel rushed to set up graphics, preferences, etc while the game is open. Also sometimes I pirate one and I don’t try it for a few weeks. I don’t want to feel pressured to try out a game at that very moment. I want my free trial to be just sitting there waiting on me whenever. Finally, I actually feel like I’m gonna like hurt the devs feelings or something if they are a small game and they see a refund go through. Idk why I consider factors like that but I know myself and I know I may not refund a game I should. Only VR game I’ve ever refunded was Kayak, but that was after the dev responded kinda rudely to a question of mine on Discord.
I really do buy every single one that I like and limit my time in the pirated versions. I probably own every VR game you can think of, and like to think I’m helping push the industry forward by buying so many. Im considering buying Viveport so I can try some of the leftovers without the extra effort of piracy.
I'd like to say that VR isn't dead, I feel like people are just lurking on technology, waiting for it to improve drastically enough to change the way their life works, like Elon Musk's new brain implant, if people shifted it towards VR instead of just helping people with sight issues, I think that VR would "boom" again because the lurkers (like me) would just use it and "come back" to VR again. Although the technological advances are dwindling slightly, people just need to keep the goal in their mind, that VR could change EVERYTHING eventually.
In Civilization 17 Carmack will be an unlockable Great Engineer
Playing on my Quest 2 is hands down the best experience since I first saw Mario on NES. We are at the start and I’m so glad to be experiencing it
I can't believe facebook just lost The benevolent hyper intelligent architect of the post singularity simulation we all live in, John Carmack.
I love how well the music fits in with the vibes :3
The next step in shooters is true bullet physics.
If a bullet hits a wall at an obtuse angle, it will spin and return to the wall, skipping like a stone on water but on a vertical wall.
So, a random shot down a corridor with a target in the tunnel, has a very high chance of being hit no matter where the muzzle was aimed.
13:32 Looking like headset is having a great ol time with that smile
Intelligent coverage on the reality of the XR industry that you so eloquently produced here. Much respect Thrill!
Immersive Matthew
As someone who buys everything I play and use, legitimately: I still support piracy fully. Piracy, while problematic, never killed a sustainable product. Please note, I said and mean "Sustainable" product, and it's price point is just as much a point in that sustainability as is it's features. While I don't use any adobe software, consciously at least, I still fully believe it's hostile market prices and redundant DRM ecosystem destroys hobby creationist efforts, or even up and coming creators. Therefore, since Adobe clearly doesn't care about people not paying a triple digit subscription, I support piracy efforts for the better of the end users.
Plus, everyone benefits from piracy, even the companies that are at a short term loss from it's efforts. Everyone gets a chance to experience the results of someone having their hands on something they otherwise couldn't in the creative market, for example. The company retains an inflated amount of advertisement to the product's usability, even if that's at a net loss for immediate purchases. Well and truly, DRM is a mistake, and the companies that pull it off the best end up leading to the creation of more usable tools through reverse engineering and near-peer features with much more available products: IE, photoshop against something like paint.net.
So, I don't condone virtual desktop's behavior, at all, and I'd have demanded a refund full stop if I ever bought the software anyways upon adding always on DRM. (I don't know if it's a subscription model, I don't use it, I'll admit.) It's much better for it's own usability to just accept the qualms of piracy, and better incentivize the features of the product justifying the purchase, instead of forcing people to suffer WITH the purchase, just so a few more are forced to buy it to participate at all. But in the world today, business isn't for the end user, in every market, and it's a callous practice of moronic penny chasing to fight off the need to innovate.
Great vid man, this is the best explanation of what VR has been like for, well since it started,, haha. The only constant being, a growing active community! The future will still only get better for VR! Also like virtually odd coming back, it's good to explore all that VR has to offer, especially now that the focus has been mostly on standalone headsets and their capability, pros and cons.