It’s like mental gymnastics with avoidant women. You start to make them feel safe but then it’s too vulnerable for them. You think you had a mature conversation and then you get mixed messages. Once that starts to happen you’re better off walking away.
18:18 - "Nice guys attract women who are not open - masculine forward women - who are not willing to be vulnerable - not allowing their ability to feel safe come from the relationship - nice guys date women will not be vulnerable." - you went over this really quickly, but I think that is the most well spoken explanation of this "why won't my wife let me (blank) her" dynamic that I have ever heard.
Kim Anami has multiple programs that work with this inverted dynamic, for women and men. It’s unfortunate, but true, that women need to learn how to surrender and men need to learn how to lead. I highly recommend checking her out. There is hope out there. Cheers.
@@randallslocum5137 Validate their feelings. They dont understand how to communicate feelings. They need to be heard and seen. Whats behind the scenes. Not the actual behaviour they are showing. You kinda have to look at them, like they are a 12 year old kid, that havent learned how to express what they feel, so they act out instead.
@@randallslocum5137 yes. Because it puts pressure on her. She has to be avalible for you, when you try Harder, and that makes her feel Even more pressured. To her being close = danger. You basicly need to let go and loose her before she can feel safe around you again. Its super toxic and contradictive. Its a push / Pull cycle. They fear intimacy and enmeshment. So basicly you gotta act like you dont care.. So they see they need to Come to you to get what they need.. Rather then telling then what to do.. You basicly gotta be "the bad Guy" Who treat her like shit..
No one can make an avoidant woman feel safe. If you do, you have to sacrifice accountability from her so basically she can do what she wants and give nothing in return
….yep, the only possible way you can make an avoidant woman feel ‘safe’ is to ditch her sorry arse to the curb and stay the hell away from her. Don’t play their ghastly games, don’t walk on eggshells, avoid the avoidant at all costs.
This is true! Just leave her when you see her pulling away too much. It is not someone else’s responsibility to give you mental stability. I’m so tired of this safe space talk. Most women don’t have mental stability because they make poor decisions. Most people don’t want to put in the self development work and remove all the mind virus inside of them. If people could have open and honest conversation then that would be a start but it’s not possible when a person doesn’t take accountability for their own actions.
Sounds like avoidant nature guys. Women need accountability and structured safety If you React, you're not their safe place and it's you that needs the work. This video goes into this, try listening for a change rather than driving the divide by supporting the avoidance nature
18:15 "[..] nice guys oftentimes attract women who are not open. They attract more masculine forward women who are not willing to put themselves in the vulnerable position of even allowing some of their ability to feel safe to come from the relationship and from that man" True!
I can't wait for the Beauty and the Beast episode. My wife is extremely avoidant and it was always her favorite story. Eventually she did the flip when she became a stay at home mom and now treats me like the villain and her captor. I've had to grieve the marriage over the last couple of years and I've told her that if she wants to leave I will help her. I definitely wouldn't have married her if she'd revealed herself before, but she's objectively dependent on me and I love my kids so I've left the ball in her court.
I'm in the same situation but I already had to rent a flat for her. Kids are at my place almost always. It is difficult. No normal methods work and giving spaces just increases distance between us...
It's a silly little game they play with our feeings. I married a good sort 40 years ago. Everyone loved her. Then she showed me her other side. We had these terrible disagreements every day or twice a day for the first 10 years. Then she ran home to her parents and I actually missed my abuser and the chaos so I went and got her. They call it Stockholm syndrome.
@ManTalks I really like that you not only discuss issues but solutions. Can we get a video on midlife crisis/depression? This typically involves a avoidant personality, childhood, emotional, neglect, and trauma. This is what happened to my marriage. I would give anything for suggestions on how to reconcile with my ex-wife.
We aren’t unsafe inside. We’re unsafe with other people. Other people basically will betray and it sucks. We are externally circumnavigating and intercepting threats. Because we think bad is the default. We must work to prevent the near inevitable bad ending.
If she's the right type of woman and you're the right man, this type of dynamic is a crucible for you to become a better man and learn to lead a relationship and family. Make your choice and don't play with y'alls hearts.
i’m a man who has a relationship with an avoidant partner, yesterday we tried to talk about it as she don’t really know about this attachment theory. i was explaining to her the meaning of this theory, the types etc in order to make her understand about all of this and NOT to try to make her change (ofc i do want her to change, but it’s up to her). long story short she is considered as an avoidant and now she know that she has that attachment style. i told her that it is okay to have one of the four attachment style even if it’s not the secure one. i said “i understand about your struggle to express your feelings, and i know this is hard for you to trust people. but sometimes leaning to others is okay, your needs are matter, your feelings are valid, you are loved and i love you just the way you are. the thing is, am i wrong by explaining to her about these attachment theory and make her realize that she has this specific attachment style? should have i just keep it for me and just try to understand her without telling her about all of this? any helps would be appreciated.
If I were her, I would appreciate the knowledge. I’m avoidant and only just found out. Now I’m reading about it so that I can change. I don’t want to be one. Perhaps she doesn’t want to be one either. Helping her could develop a strong bond between you.
@@jackirose5582thanks for the comment. i know many people who have a DA or even maybe every avoidant didn’t do all of those things in purpose. i know her and i do really love her, she is a good girl and that’s why i wanna give her some help. i know how hard it is when you have feelings but you can’t express it. but, am i right if i offer her some helps when she didn’t ask for it yet? since i’ve said it before that i love her just the way she is
@@w1zzy_ I am myself an avoidant woman by any means. This goes even in my family ancestry, plenty of hard working, happy to be alone widows (I couldn't wait till my husband dies so I divorced 🙈). Women like me hold to their freedom as a good reason to avoid people. It is very easy for us to feel offended by some advice we did not ask for. It's a lot easier if you pack your message in I-affirmations (it means so much for me to have your opinion on .../ I enjoy more than anything to talk with you about .../ I need to hear your opinion on... / I struggle to guess what your feelings and thoughts are on ...) Women can hardly let someone down who they care for. But: I have to tell you, as an avoidant woman, we have an animus (inner man ideal) who avoids feeling and expressing love. The whole avoidance thing is actually around not feeling safe to express negative feelings. She does not allow herself to fully let the not so nice parts of herself out, so she hides those under the avoidant mask. Think about how you can support her to let some demons out without getting scared. As an avoidant I attracted lots of men (who also didn't want to dive to deep into their feelings), and was unable to forgive myself when I lashed out on them, or on family members. But was very surprised to hear every time they were not so upset by what I have done. Some even told me, I am most beautiful when I get angry 🙈
My ex girlfriend and I broke up and one of the last things I said to her was that I couldn’t be with her because I couldn’t trust her to stay with me if we where to have a kid because she’s scared of commitment. 4 or 5 months later now she came back and has started therapy. I think it was best for you to tell her, and the fact she hasn’t left or felt like you’re accusing her of anything is a good sign. My ex still has her issues, but she instead of leaving she’s began to stay committed when problems arise and she stonewalls, she still texts first, still gives goodmornings, still call eachother our pet names, there’s just less contact as she needs space for extended periods of time. Sometimes a few hours, sometimes a week. As a man the best thing you can do is be there for her and respect her space, while also respecting your own boundaries. Best of luck
Other words for safety include reliability, predictability. Do you do what you say you’re going to do? Are you led around by your impulses? Are you willing to share power, or do you hijack or sabotage the t relationship when you start to feel fear? If so you are putting “me” over “we” and you fail the test. These are the things that I’m looking for as a woman. It goes way deeper than just not hitting me or willingness to fight off an attacker.
So how do you prevent yourself from sabotaging your relationship due to a perceived lack of excitement, once you start getting bothered by said safety, reliability and predictability?! 🤔 I've whitnessed WAY too many women killing long term relationships for the very things they set out to look for. 🎠
@@LorenzoMasterConnectorBoring is perfect. If a man is predictable, consistent, and reliable you might see it as boring, but it's also stable. What you receive as boredom is probably rather a lack of satisfaction on her part.
Thank you for understanding us ❤ to offer our hearts and bodies (child bearing is a risk of death and permanent attachement) for potentially a life time, we have to know what dynamic we are possibly going to get to! Thank you for understanding how important it is so we can choose the correct men.
@ sorry this doesn’t work with my intention to commit with a promise not left to be easily broken by how the wind changes my frequency that day. And I don’t want someone who does that to me. But I value your way for you!
Anxious women need a secure base, reassurance, and touch. It’s not asking too much unless she is with an avoidant man that doesn’t care to adapt, change, meet in the middle so both partners needs can be met.
Lots of anxious people create issues where there aren’t any and are extremely clingy to the point of suffocating even secure partners. It’s not harmless.
It’s just that my avoidant shows truly unsafe behaviors (like traveling with virtually strangers /rebounds, gives them door codes, has no lockout on computer with critical information) and is not open for a realistic safety analysis.
Dating avoidant women is kinda tough, going through that right now. Say one thing a bit too emotional and poof 😅 once I give her space, and if she comes back around, I'll apply this and try to open up that dialogue with her. Thank you sir!
@Alixir1228 I mean ideally, I'd like to create an environment of a secure attachment so that there's no toxicity formed there unintentionally. I've been in therapy for a couple months and plan to continue with it to work on my own anxious attachment tendencies, so at this point I'm most open to a woman who's willing to do the work to achieve the same as I am. Thank you for the reply though! I hope things go well with the dude that you're dating.
@Alixir1228 lol..was dating an avoidant woman until recently although she'strying to friendzone now. I agree, it's as brutal as dating a narcissist. Recently sparked a connection with a woman that identifies as anxious. Interested to see how that turns out.
@Alixir1228where you at 😅 all I find is avoidants! all I gotta is make you feel safe and special… and that’s my specialty !I ❤💐 Why is it like this why! 🤣😭
Women aren't born like this - they feel unsafe in the world for the same reasons men dont want their daughters dating and dont like moms new bf to be around. Men know Exactly how unsafe the world is but as soon as women show negative effects of it, women are the problem. Either you are For women or not. Thank you for covering this - healing women Truly appreciate you Mantalks❤😊❤😊❤
The Fearful Avoidant that I was dating was looking for sex, first and foremost, and was telling me she was looking for emotional connection. It didnt work out so well. I kept creating emotional safety for her.. The core of the problem is women looking for sex with randos that give the bad boy vibe but then treats them as such as well.
It isn't a bad thing to spend a bit of time dating these psychos. You'll learn a lot about female psychology and how to handle shit far above and beyond what should ever be necessary. It will potentially shine some light in areas where self improvement is necessary. But in the long term it is highly unlikely that avoidant women (anxious women are more reflective and thus likely to change) will ever improve. Avoidants are very, very difficult cases. They are master manipulators, and it comes from deep in the subconscious - which makes change extraordinarily difficult. And the really bad news is that if they are even remotely attractive they haven't had much trouble swapping in a fresh man when things start to get difficult with the one they are with. And why not? Thats a *far* easier option than the arduous work of self improvement, and thus you have the reason why they will be so unlikely to change. So be informed of this, men. If you're involved with one its a hard pill to swallow but being with these insecure types will result in you pissing away valuable time in life in exchange for what is almost a certainteed head/heartache.
Unbelievably true. At 64…should have known better but was totally unaware of this stuff, I have spent 18 months with what has turned out to be an avoidant in the belief that this would be my last relationship 🤦🏼. The attractive woman in question made the prelim moves when I split from my ex. She then moved in after a few months and literally took over. Criticism, control, little to no affection. I’m an anxious but actually not that incredible tactile but compared to her I’m huggy bear. Her history is one of reaching a point where she needs to escape and then bailing out on the relationship on the pretext of pressure, or the guy was a nut, lack of space, mannerisms etc etc. I don’t think her plan actually is to reconnect with anyone however for you younger guys watch out. She went from one to the next within weeks because she is and was very attractive. It’s certainly screwed with my head and I suspect the heads of several before me. She won’t be reflecting on anything other than believing it was the correct and only action to take.
DO NOT give these woman a chance. The best course of action is to simply leave. Can't have a stable relationship with someone who isn't stable in the first place. Simple as that. To be clear this goes for anyone who has this type of attachment style.
Hi, could you do also a brief generic introduction into the attachment topic? what are attachment styles, which are they and how can it help knowing about them?
@@TirianOfNarnia there are good videos here on UA-cam on how to tell. But the woman I am dating now I just straight up told her I am looking for secure attachment and she went and did the test on her own and told me.
@@TirianOfNarnia Ask them what they are looking for on a dating app right away. If they say anything like "want to go with the flow" or they put up any barriers to intimacy or connection they are avoidant or they are not serious. In either case, move on. Dont try and fix then and and dont try and win them over.
I hold women accountable for their poor decisions and if they don’t want to work on themselves then I walk away. And I let them know where they are messing up.
The issue I have with this is that many women still choose incorrectly aka abusive men. Also at what point is accountability a thing? We are adults and we should be able to talk about this without her pushing my buttons. Huge confusing topic
Is this possible that a woman can be avoidant and anxious? My partner share A LOT of both sides -_- When she is angry, she becomes avoidant, when she isn’t, she is anxious and need reassurance from my words, tone of voice, understanding, etc etc. Quite very challenging!
@@steveos5112 no sorry if it wasn't clear, i'm just french^^i've been in a relationship with a girl who had traumas that led her to have that disorganized attachment style
I'm an earned "almost" secure fearful avoidant. Here's what I have seen. When a woman shows up too available, men don't want that woman. They want the woman who is the challenge aka the avoidant woman. I can give a play by play from my teenage years up until now how anytime I have showed up slightly anxious aka extremely interested, men were all set. At one point in my 20's I got sick of this and went more into my avoidant side and low and behold, men chased like crazy. It's amazing seeing men like this on these threads now complaining that their avoidant woman continued this pattern of keeping them on their toes when this woman showed you who she was the entire time. If you have to chase, you better keep your running shoes on because you just created your destiny. The bonus of someone who is FA is that if we commit after the chase, our softer more submissive side comes out once safety and trust are established. Chances are you're not going to get that from an unhealed extreme avoidant. I have male friends who lust after this type and want to lock them down. Lol I love seeing people who admit to having a pattern of dating more avoidant say now they want anxious or secure. Lol Well no shit. Where was that mindset a decade ago? If my softer feminine side was more accepted from the get go, I likely would have never felt the need to harden up as a defense mechanism.
@@alsalazar6502 well that's good. Chasing someone implies that they are running away and the fact some want to continue the chase kind of baffles me. You have to value yourself before anything.
As an anxious person how do you avoid feeling like loving someone… puts a target on their back? Most people I feel something for get hurt somehow or leave. I feel like I have to work to prevent it. Like bad is life’s default and what can happen will happen so buckle up.
You have to stop running from yourself and take responsibility for taking care of yourself. It's YOUR job, first and foremost. Right now you're like an irresponsible mother who leaves her daughter, keeps avoiding her parent duties and is putting the parenting role entirely on her partner. Stop neglecting your inner child. Listen to what she has to say. Stop and just listen. The longer you won't take responsibility for caring for yourself and will have an _avoidant relationship with yourself,_ the more you'll keep pushing others away. Take care of yourself. It's your responsibility.
Holy shit. I'm anxious avoidant now?! I'm autistic And anxious/avoidant? Well fuck! I really have a hard time connecting or even understanding people, let alone girls. I blame religion and being lied to about being tortured for eternity if we "do bad things"
That isn't why we choose the "dangerous" guys. We don't want to tame them, we like strong men. The nice guys don't make us feel safe, it is the strong men that will fight the bear for you, the nice guy gets eaten. And in Beauty and the Beast, the beast is hurt and Bell wants to help him not tame him. I don't want my man to be tame, I want him to be my protector. I think women choose the "beast" because they have been unsafe most of their lives and often "nice" guys aren't really nice. I have had too many encounters with guys that pretend to be safe just so they could use me or feel me up while I was sleeping. And the beast is often just an avoidant that doesn't feel safe themselves.
@@steveos5112No, no she's right! Orion is very abrasive and looks like he's just looking to create a shocking effect and he talks about women like third class citizens.. Orion is out there with the other guy I forgot his name. Any time I see a podcast that has him as a guest I skip right away.. He seems more like a drifter more than anything else.
So you suggest thay as she lives in her own mind of fear that the other can take on asking her? Accountability? Expectations?? Are you willing to.. NO! NO ACCOUNTABILITY. NEGATIVITY!!! BOUNDARIES... NO!! The connection must not ask questions so yes we just have to be out here...😊
I was with you until the “beauty and the beast fantasy” section. What that actually looks like is 1) domestic abuse and 2) a society that still has many women brainwashed into believing they want to be dominated There Is No Such Thing As Gender Hierarchies In Supportive Relationships. (Or: “who leads” should be a collaboration both parties agree to that has Nothing to do with gender. And Coleading or Switching Leads are valid options as well. A woman being more “masculine” isn’t going to castrate your masculinity.)
So you thinking asking an Avoidant a question works??? Noooo That would require accountability... No questions beyond the would you like me to get some more salsa???😅 Any question is a trigger, anger and withdrawl... DWI or depart...
Nothing can make an avoidant woman feel safe. You're always a potential rapist as a man for daring to ask her out to anything with a sense of adventure. Nothing but the lamest and most tame date will do - where she's guaranteed there's no spark and therefore validates her avoidance.
Im seeing not dating an avoidant. I care for her very much. Nut she isnt going to let her drawbridge down. No one could me as protective and caring . And i believe she is caring. Just not enough to be my lady. Its too bad.akes me sad . But the reality is i e lost hope. There may be someone else. If so shes being a good actress.
Yeah predictability, too. Whenever someone does not do what he or she said they would do, I can never trust them again. I can keep the friendship but I never forget. 🥶
omg this is so true. I recall years ago assertively pushing and challenging a guy I was newly dating to see how far he could be pushed safely. He responded firmly that I needed to knock it off. I think I was wondering if hed lose it on me, when he didn't I suddenly liked him so much!
😂 If you are with an avoidant, you are the one who isn't safe. I don't play I will retaliate tho I made sure she got hers & probably made her more avoidant. Hahahaha
Such people are not ready for relationships and should seek therapy. Fix your issues with a professional rather than burdening your partner. No one is responsible for others emotions.
Bullshi_! About the beauty and beast phenomenal! We avoidant women aren’t wanting to avoid nice guys it’s just that “nice guys” can’t handle when we avoidants get the shits with them they are “too soft” and over sensitive about our reactions of being disappointed! And then that avoidant told me that it is unsafe to say how I feel! 🙈🤔🙄avoidant avoidant is the worst kind of connection
Yes go ahead RP man and rationalize and explain away women’s bad behavior “avoidant” and how its are job to “conform” because “thats how women are” no more…. “I need to make sure hes in control, so I can loose control whenever I want” and you guys are conforming😂
FREE RESOURCE THE ULTIMATE GUIDE TO ATTACHMENT training.mantalks.com/attachment-guide
It’s like mental gymnastics with avoidant women. You start to make them feel safe but then it’s too vulnerable for them. You think you had a mature conversation and then you get mixed messages. Once that starts to happen you’re better off walking away.
18:18 - "Nice guys attract women who are not open - masculine forward women - who are not willing to be vulnerable - not allowing their ability to feel safe come from the relationship - nice guys date women will not be vulnerable." - you went over this really quickly, but I think that is the most well spoken explanation of this "why won't my wife let me (blank) her" dynamic that I have ever heard.
Kim Anami has multiple programs that work with this inverted dynamic, for women and men. It’s unfortunate, but true, that women need to learn how to surrender and men need to learn how to lead. I highly recommend checking her out. There is hope out there. Cheers.
*Women with anxiety or avoidant tendencies thrive in spaces where they feel heard and understood.*
Explain how to make an avoidant feel heard. I have tried every single communication strategy.
@@randallslocum5137 Validate their feelings. They dont understand how to communicate feelings. They need to be heard and seen. Whats behind the scenes. Not the actual behaviour they are showing. You kinda have to look at them, like they are a 12 year old kid, that havent learned how to express what they feel, so they act out instead.
She actually said I’m “too devoted” when I did that. Mines long over
@@randallslocum5137 yes. Because it puts pressure on her. She has to be avalible for you, when you try Harder, and that makes her feel Even more pressured. To her being close = danger. You basicly need to let go and loose her before she can feel safe around you again. Its super toxic and contradictive. Its a push / Pull cycle. They fear intimacy and enmeshment. So basicly you gotta act like you dont care.. So they see they need to Come to you to get what they need.. Rather then telling then what to do..
You basicly gotta be "the bad Guy" Who treat her like shit..
So untrue. They can hardly express their feelings so making them "heard" basically means "reading their mind"
No one can make an avoidant woman feel safe. If you do, you have to sacrifice accountability from her so basically she can do what she wants and give nothing in return
Huge facts
….yep, the only possible way you can make an avoidant woman feel ‘safe’ is to ditch her sorry arse to the curb and stay the hell away from her.
Don’t play their ghastly games, don’t walk on eggshells, avoid the avoidant at all costs.
Man shut yo soft ahh up get yo weight up not ya hate up, scared of a little avoidant woman
This is true! Just leave her when you see her pulling away too much. It is not someone else’s responsibility to give you mental stability. I’m so tired of this safe space talk. Most women don’t have mental stability because they make poor decisions. Most people don’t want to put in the self development work and remove all the mind virus inside of them. If people could have open and honest conversation then that would be a start but it’s not possible when a person doesn’t take accountability for their own actions.
Sounds like avoidant nature guys.
Women need accountability and structured safety
If you React, you're not their safe place and it's you that needs the work.
This video goes into this, try listening for a change rather than driving the divide by supporting the avoidance nature
18:15 "[..] nice guys oftentimes attract women who are not open. They attract more masculine forward women who are not willing to put themselves in the vulnerable position of even allowing some of their ability to feel safe to come from the relationship and from that man" True!
Thank you, my brother… I was going to timestamp and offer up the same exact observation. So powerful!
I can't wait for the Beauty and the Beast episode. My wife is extremely avoidant and it was always her favorite story. Eventually she did the flip when she became a stay at home mom and now treats me like the villain and her captor. I've had to grieve the marriage over the last couple of years and I've told her that if she wants to leave I will help her. I definitely wouldn't have married her if she'd revealed herself before, but she's objectively dependent on me and I love my kids so I've left the ball in her court.
I'm in the same situation but I already had to rent a flat for her. Kids are at my place almost always. It is difficult. No normal methods work and giving spaces just increases distance between us...
So for you and your kids guys. So much bullsh*t.
@@likearollingstone007wut
Wrong move. She's content with the distance in the relationship. If you give her a financially good life, she will not repay it someday.
It's a silly little game they play with our feeings. I married a good sort 40 years ago. Everyone loved her. Then she showed me her other side. We had these terrible disagreements every day or twice a day for the first 10 years. Then she ran home to her parents and I actually missed my abuser and the chaos so I went and got her. They call it Stockholm syndrome.
@ManTalks I really like that you not only discuss issues but solutions. Can we get a video on midlife crisis/depression? This typically involves a avoidant personality, childhood, emotional, neglect, and trauma. This is what happened to my marriage. I would give anything for suggestions on how to reconcile with my ex-wife.
this video literally came in the perfect moment in my life, love you
We aren’t unsafe inside. We’re unsafe with other people. Other people basically will betray and it sucks. We are externally circumnavigating and intercepting threats. Because we think bad is the default. We must work to prevent the near inevitable bad ending.
Thanks! Please make more videos about avoidant women
If she's the right type of woman and you're the right man, this type of dynamic is a crucible for you to become a better man and learn to lead a relationship and family. Make your choice and don't play with y'alls hearts.
18:15 wow Connor, you really be cracking the uncrackable codes. How do you hit the nail on the head every time
The ‘Are you willing… ‘ idea is brilliant.
What a great episode. So much info packed in, explaining how to find the balance between Attached and Avoidant patterns. Thank you!
i’m a man who has a relationship with an avoidant partner, yesterday we tried to talk about it as she don’t really know about this attachment theory.
i was explaining to her the meaning of this theory, the types etc in order to make her understand about all of this and NOT to try to make her change (ofc i do want her to change, but it’s up to her). long story short she is considered as an avoidant and now she know that she has that attachment style.
i told her that it is okay to have one of the four attachment style even if it’s not the secure one. i said “i understand about your struggle to express your feelings, and i know this is hard for you to trust people. but sometimes leaning to others is okay, your needs are matter, your feelings are valid, you are loved and i love you just the way you are.
the thing is, am i wrong by explaining to her about these attachment theory and make her realize that she has this specific attachment style?
should have i just keep it for me and just try to understand her without telling her about all of this?
any helps would be appreciated.
If I were her, I would appreciate the knowledge. I’m avoidant and only just found out. Now I’m reading about it so that I can change. I don’t want to be one. Perhaps she doesn’t want to be one either. Helping her could develop a strong bond between you.
@@jackirose5582thanks for the comment. i know many people who have a DA or even maybe every avoidant didn’t do all of those things in purpose. i know her and i do really love her, she is a good girl and that’s why i wanna give her some help. i know how hard it is when you have feelings but you can’t express it. but, am i right if i offer her some helps when she didn’t ask for it yet? since i’ve said it before that i love her just the way she is
@@w1zzy_ I am myself an avoidant woman by any means. This goes even in my family ancestry, plenty of hard working, happy to be alone widows (I couldn't wait till my husband dies so I divorced 🙈).
Women like me hold to their freedom as a good reason to avoid people. It is very easy for us to feel offended by some advice we did not ask for.
It's a lot easier if you pack your message in I-affirmations (it means so much for me to have your opinion on .../ I enjoy more than anything to talk with you about .../ I need to hear your opinion on... / I struggle to guess what your feelings and thoughts are on ...) Women can hardly let someone down who they care for.
But: I have to tell you, as an avoidant woman, we have an animus (inner man ideal) who avoids feeling and expressing love. The whole avoidance thing is actually around not feeling safe to express negative feelings. She does not allow herself to fully let the not so nice parts of herself out, so she hides those under the avoidant mask.
Think about how you can support her to let some demons out without getting scared. As an avoidant I attracted lots of men (who also didn't want to dive to deep into their feelings), and was unable to forgive myself when I lashed out on them, or on family members. But was very surprised to hear every time they were not so upset by what I have done. Some even told me, I am most beautiful when I get angry 🙈
My ex girlfriend and I broke up and one of the last things I said to her was that I couldn’t be with her because I couldn’t trust her to stay with me if we where to have a kid because she’s scared of commitment. 4 or 5 months later now she came back and has started therapy. I think it was best for you to tell her, and the fact she hasn’t left or felt like you’re accusing her of anything is a good sign. My ex still has her issues, but she instead of leaving she’s began to stay committed when problems arise and she stonewalls, she still texts first, still gives goodmornings, still call eachother our pet names, there’s just less contact as she needs space for extended periods of time. Sometimes a few hours, sometimes a week. As a man the best thing you can do is be there for her and respect her space, while also respecting your own boundaries. Best of luck
@ thanks for the advice!
Other words for safety include reliability, predictability. Do you do what you say you’re going to do? Are you led around by your impulses? Are you willing to share power, or do you hijack or sabotage the t relationship when you start to feel fear? If so you are putting “me” over “we” and you fail the test. These are the things that I’m looking for as a woman. It goes way deeper than just not hitting me or willingness to fight off an attacker.
this is spot on
So how do you prevent yourself from sabotaging your relationship due to a perceived lack of excitement, once you start getting bothered by said safety, reliability and predictability?! 🤔
I've whitnessed WAY too many women killing long term relationships for the very things they set out to look for. 🎠
Sorry but this changes. When you get too reliable and predictable she gets bored. So don’t act like that’s what y’all only want be honest
@@LorenzoMasterConnectorBoring is perfect. If a man is predictable, consistent, and reliable you might see it as boring, but it's also stable. What you receive as boredom is probably rather a lack of satisfaction on her part.
@ that has literally NEVER been the case with ANY woman I’ve been with.
Thank you for understanding us ❤ to offer our hearts and bodies (child bearing is a risk of death and permanent attachement) for potentially a life time, we have to know what dynamic we are possibly going to get to! Thank you for understanding how important it is so we can choose the correct men.
@@sunflowerpower642 you always choose the "correct" men - it's a frequency match. And when it's not a match anymore, the relationship will end.
@ sorry this doesn’t work with my intention to commit with a promise not left to be easily broken by how the wind changes my frequency that day. And I don’t want someone who does that to me. But I value your way for you!
Anxious women need a secure base, reassurance, and touch. It’s not asking too much unless she is with an avoidant man that doesn’t care to adapt, change, meet in the middle so both partners needs can be met.
Lots of anxious people create issues where there aren’t any and are extremely clingy to the point of suffocating even secure partners. It’s not harmless.
As an anxious person who learnt taking accoutiblity we are topically clingy miss.
Yes, safety is everything for women!! Thank you for pointing that out!
Receiving yes, providing ..?
It’s just that my avoidant shows truly unsafe behaviors (like traveling with virtually strangers /rebounds, gives them door codes, has no lockout on computer with critical information) and is not open for a realistic safety analysis.
Dating avoidant women is kinda tough, going through that right now. Say one thing a bit too emotional and poof 😅 once I give her space, and if she comes back around, I'll apply this and try to open up that dialogue with her. Thank you sir!
@Alixir1228 I mean ideally, I'd like to create an environment of a secure attachment so that there's no toxicity formed there unintentionally. I've been in therapy for a couple months and plan to continue with it to work on my own anxious attachment tendencies, so at this point I'm most open to a woman who's willing to do the work to achieve the same as I am. Thank you for the reply though! I hope things go well with the dude that you're dating.
@Alixir1228 lol..was dating an avoidant woman until recently although she'strying to friendzone now. I agree, it's as brutal as dating a narcissist.
Recently sparked a connection with a woman that identifies as anxious. Interested to see how that turns out.
@Alixir1228where you at 😅 all I find is avoidants! all I gotta is make you feel safe and special… and that’s my specialty !I ❤💐
Why is it like this why! 🤣😭
Women aren't born like this - they feel unsafe in the world for the same reasons men dont want their daughters dating and dont like moms new bf to be around. Men know Exactly how unsafe the world is but as soon as women show negative effects of it, women are the problem. Either you are For women or not.
Thank you for covering this - healing women Truly appreciate you Mantalks❤😊❤😊❤
This. Needs to be the top highlighted comment. 🙌🏼🫶🏻
Spot on, great work
I can relate to your casts. Not comparing you with anyone. I glean from multiple sources.
"You don't have to subscribe"
DON'T TELL ME WHAT TO DO!
*subscribes*
Reverse psychology wins again.
Gotcha ;)
Also thanks for subscribing
The Fearful Avoidant that I was dating was looking for sex, first and foremost, and was telling me she was looking for emotional connection. It didnt work out so well. I kept creating emotional safety for her.. The core of the problem is women looking for sex with randos that give the bad boy vibe but then treats them as such as well.
I love how all people are correct about leave them 😂
It isn't a bad thing to spend a bit of time dating these psychos. You'll learn a lot about female psychology and how to handle shit far above and beyond what should ever be necessary. It will potentially shine some light in areas where self improvement is necessary. But in the long term it is highly unlikely that avoidant women (anxious women are more reflective and thus likely to change) will ever improve. Avoidants are very, very difficult cases. They are master manipulators, and it comes from deep in the subconscious - which makes change extraordinarily difficult. And the really bad news is that if they are even remotely attractive they haven't had much trouble swapping in a fresh man when things start to get difficult with the one they are with. And why not? Thats a *far* easier option than the arduous work of self improvement, and thus you have the reason why they will be so unlikely to change. So be informed of this, men. If you're involved with one its a hard pill to swallow but being with these insecure types will result in you pissing away valuable time in life in exchange for what is almost a certainteed head/heartache.
Unbelievably true. At 64…should have known better but was totally unaware of this stuff, I have spent 18 months with what has turned out to be an avoidant in the belief that this would be my last relationship 🤦🏼. The attractive woman in question made the prelim moves when I split from my ex. She then moved in after a few months and literally took over. Criticism, control, little to no affection. I’m an anxious but actually not that incredible tactile but compared to her I’m huggy bear. Her history is one of reaching a point where she needs to escape and then bailing out on the relationship on the pretext of pressure, or the guy was a nut, lack of space, mannerisms etc etc. I don’t think her plan actually is to reconnect with anyone however for you younger guys watch out. She went from one to the next within weeks because she is and was very attractive. It’s certainly screwed with my head and I suspect the heads of several before me. She won’t be reflecting on anything other than believing it was the correct and only action to take.
👏 AWESOME VIDEO!
DO NOT give these woman a chance. The best course of action is to simply leave. Can't have a stable relationship with someone who isn't stable in the first place. Simple as that. To be clear this goes for anyone who has this type of attachment style.
Hi, could you do also a brief generic introduction into the attachment topic? what are attachment styles, which are they and how can it help knowing about them?
I have learned to test women right away to see if they're secure and if they seem anxious or avoidant, I just go away.
How do you test? I want to know
@@TirianOfNarnia there are good videos here on UA-cam on how to tell. But the woman I am dating now I just straight up told her I am looking for secure attachment and she went and did the test on her own and told me.
It’s the best way! I don’t want to waste my time on woman that have issues.
@@TirianOfNarniaask her how she resolves issues and then pay attention to her actions. If there is any hypocrisy then just leave.
@@TirianOfNarnia Ask them what they are looking for on a dating app right away. If they say anything like "want to go with the flow" or they put up any barriers to intimacy or connection they are avoidant or they are not serious. In either case, move on.
Dont try and fix then and and dont try and win them over.
I hold women accountable for their poor decisions and if they don’t want to work on themselves then I walk away. And I let them know where they are messing up.
You can hold me accountable baby😂
… I’m guessing you are NOT in a relationship 😂
The issue I have with this is that many women still choose incorrectly aka abusive men.
Also at what point is accountability a thing? We are adults and we should be able to talk about this without her pushing my buttons.
Huge confusing topic
When is beauty and the beast episode coming out???
I AM the only person who has taken care of me. It's not a tactic. It's survival.
Anxious 🙋🏽♀️🥴
Is this possible that a woman can be avoidant and anxious?
My partner share A LOT of both sides -_-
When she is angry, she becomes avoidant, when she isn’t, she is anxious and need reassurance from my words, tone of voice, understanding, etc etc.
Quite very challenging!
That’s a fearful avoidant, a mix of the two, pretty use to that
Are you talking about a puppy?
That's a disorganized attachment style.
@@steveos5112 no sorry if it wasn't clear, i'm just french^^i've been in a relationship with a girl who had traumas that led her to have that disorganized attachment style
I'm an earned "almost" secure fearful avoidant. Here's what I have seen.
When a woman shows up too available, men don't want that woman. They want the woman who is the challenge aka the avoidant woman. I can give a play by play from my teenage years up until now how anytime I have showed up slightly anxious aka extremely interested, men were all set. At one point in my 20's I got sick of this and went more into my avoidant side and low and behold, men chased like crazy.
It's amazing seeing men like this on these threads now complaining that their avoidant woman continued this pattern of keeping them on their toes when this woman showed you who she was the entire time. If you have to chase, you better keep your running shoes on because you just created your destiny.
The bonus of someone who is FA is that if we commit after the chase, our softer more submissive side comes out once safety and trust are established. Chances are you're not going to get that from an unhealed extreme avoidant. I have male friends who lust after this type and want to lock them down. Lol
I love seeing people who admit to having a pattern of dating more avoidant say now they want anxious or secure. Lol Well no shit. Where was that mindset a decade ago? If my softer feminine side was more accepted from the get go, I likely would have never felt the need to harden up as a defense mechanism.
I GUESS I AM TJE EXCEPTION. I NEVER LIKED OR PICKED UP AVOUDANT WOMEN ALWAYS RAN MILES THE HELL AWAY FROL THEM. THIS ONE JUST FOOLED ME...
This right here, gosh I feel so seen❤
@@alsalazar6502 well that's good. Chasing someone implies that they are running away and the fact some want to continue the chase kind of baffles me. You have to value yourself before anything.
@@snaggythethird2013 aww good. ❤️ There are so many sides to the story that's always left out.
Yes to all this. Guess im avoidant.
As an anxious person how do you avoid feeling like loving someone… puts a target on their back? Most people I feel something for get hurt somehow or leave. I feel like I have to work to prevent it. Like bad is life’s default and what can happen will happen so buckle up.
You have to stop running from yourself and take responsibility for taking care of yourself. It's YOUR job, first and foremost. Right now you're like an irresponsible mother who leaves her daughter, keeps avoiding her parent duties and is putting the parenting role entirely on her partner. Stop neglecting your inner child. Listen to what she has to say. Stop and just listen. The longer you won't take responsibility for caring for yourself and will have an _avoidant relationship with yourself,_ the more you'll keep pushing others away. Take care of yourself. It's your responsibility.
Do you have a video like this about women with borderline personality disorder? 🆘
Your answer is to run my friend. I know it's not what you want to hear and wasn't what I wanted to do either but self preservation.
@ I know brother. Sadly I know everything about it but im holding on a last try
She can’t feel secure with herself, clinically… she can’t feel safe with you or be your GF sorry man.
@@Adam444Tv Its fine really im interested in this topic and I will see how it turns out
If someone has anything to say about it i would be interested in as many infos as possible
Holy shit. I'm anxious avoidant now?! I'm autistic And anxious/avoidant? Well fuck! I really have a hard time connecting or even understanding people, let alone girls. I blame religion and being lied to about being tortured for eternity if we "do bad things"
I gave loads of safety. No contact rule, 1,6 years…now she is for sure in safety.😂
You run !
Could it be only nature for me, if I have avoidance issues with an dependent nature to be all tangled about my crushes for years
I’ve never heard it put so well
That isn't why we choose the "dangerous" guys. We don't want to tame them, we like strong men. The nice guys don't make us feel safe, it is the strong men that will fight the bear for you, the nice guy gets eaten. And in Beauty and the Beast, the beast is hurt and Bell wants to help him not tame him. I don't want my man to be tame, I want him to be my protector. I think women choose the "beast" because they have been unsafe most of their lives and often "nice" guys aren't really nice. I have had too many encounters with guys that pretend to be safe just so they could use me or feel me up while I was sleeping. And the beast is often just an avoidant that doesn't feel safe themselves.
even in 50 shades the "beast" was deeply traumatized and didn't know how to be anything else.
If you are seeing an avoidant woman; run. Don’t look back.
Its not your job to make avoidants "feel safe". Dump them to make yourself feel safe. Only real option tbh
Avoidants do not make choices decisions. That triggers withdrawl.
What if your girl is both 😭 she’s anxious first and then after I fail she becomes the avoidant
You should interview Kim Anami!
Kim is amazing, I've met her in person a few times.
You’re smarter than Orion.
Better all around.
He’s abrasive and strangely icky.
Maybe you need to retreat to your safe space.
No woman, he's safer & has less edge.
Orion is unambiguously more intelligent. Obvious to anyone with a capacity for objectivity.
@oambitiousone7100 i agree. is it.. some overconfidence ? pretending/wanting so hard to be a "real man" ? not sure, but i cant watch his videos.
@@steveos5112No, no she's right! Orion is very abrasive and looks like he's just looking to create a shocking effect and he talks about women like third class citizens.. Orion is out there with the other guy I forgot his name. Any time I see a podcast that has him as a guest I skip right away.. He seems more like a drifter more than anything else.
@@rando9574Yeap, that's correct 💯💯
So you suggest thay as she lives in her own mind of fear that the other can take on asking her? Accountability? Expectations??
Are you willing to.. NO! NO ACCOUNTABILITY. NEGATIVITY!!! BOUNDARIES... NO!! The connection must not ask questions so yes we just have to be out here...😊
I wish you made this last year.
Why do i get so mad at my bf needing emotional closeness? 😭😭😭
I was with you until the “beauty and the beast fantasy” section. What that actually looks like is 1) domestic abuse and 2) a society that still has many women brainwashed into believing they want to be dominated
There Is No Such Thing As Gender Hierarchies In Supportive Relationships.
(Or: “who leads” should be a collaboration both parties agree to that has Nothing to do with gender. And Coleading or Switching Leads are valid options as well. A woman being more “masculine” isn’t going to castrate your masculinity.)
I dont really think you can make an avoidant woman feel safe. They dont let anyone in and they keep them at arms length
Listen. Learn..
He is speaking from knowing.
You don't know.
You are stuck in your victim paradigm.
So you thinking asking an Avoidant a question works??? Noooo That would require accountability... No questions beyond the would you like me to get some more salsa???😅 Any question is a trigger, anger and withdrawl...
DWI or depart...
Nothing can make an avoidant woman feel safe. You're always a potential rapist as a man for daring to ask her out to anything with a sense of adventure. Nothing but the lamest and most tame date will do - where she's guaranteed there's no spark and therefore validates her avoidance.
Going on an “adventure” date with a man you don’t know and trust yet is a really BAD idea! 👎 👎
Im seeing not dating an avoidant. I care for her very much. Nut she isnt going to let her drawbridge down. No one could me as protective and caring . And i believe she is caring. Just not enough to be my lady. Its too bad.akes me sad . But the reality is i e lost hope. There may be someone else. If so shes being a good actress.
Yeah predictability, too. Whenever someone does not do what he or she said they would do, I can never trust them again. I can keep the friendship but I never forget. 🥶
Some of these "tests" should be highly illegal and punishable by law
omg this is so true. I recall years ago assertively pushing and challenging a guy I was newly dating to see how far he could be pushed safely. He responded firmly that I needed to knock it off. I think I was wondering if hed lose it on me, when he didn't I suddenly liked him so much!
Why do you sound proud? Stupid behaviour isn't to be celebrated
😂 If you are with an avoidant, you are the one who isn't safe. I don't play I will retaliate tho I made sure she got hers & probably made her more avoidant. Hahahaha
Such people are not ready for relationships and should seek therapy. Fix your issues with a professional rather than burdening your partner.
No one is responsible for others emotions.
Bullshi_! About the beauty and beast phenomenal! We avoidant women aren’t wanting to avoid nice guys it’s just that “nice guys” can’t handle when we avoidants get the shits with them they are “too soft” and over sensitive about our reactions of being disappointed! And then that avoidant told me that it is unsafe to say how I feel! 🙈🤔🙄avoidant avoidant is the worst kind of connection
Yes go ahead RP man and rationalize and explain away women’s bad behavior “avoidant” and how its are job to “conform” because “thats how women are” no more…. “I need to make sure hes in control, so I can loose control whenever I want” and you guys are conforming😂
If you believe talking solves anything with women - you're still naive like a newborn baby
Connor, if I may recommend LASIK, I think you'd look far more distinguished and powerful without the glasses.
why would I? LMAO