3:25, 3:43, 4:12, 6:49, 6:56, 12:46, 13:54, 16:34, 18:03 illustrate the jet’s tendency to slip when forced left, or naturally snap to the right at high AOA. And you prefer to do your snap rolls to the right, so the alignment issue is usually helping the jet be extra agile in that direction. When you elect to flat spin to the left at 16:56, the alignment issue fights you for the first time, resulting in a lazy left spin. So I think this jet’s wing and rudder are not well aligned. Or best case, it is over-trimmed with left aileron and at the same time over-trimmed with right rudder, for a slight slip in order to go straight ahead and a tendency to dip right at high AOA as the right rudder wins over the left aileron at high AOA. So…. I’m not as in love with it as you are. It’s probably fixable, but a roller can be hard to iron out. Warped foam can be a bitch, if that’s the root cause.
@@TwoBrosRC I could see that as a plus, kind of like intentional drift, in navigation. In the old days airplanes crossing large bodies of water would intentionally miss their land target by intentionally flying a few degrees to one side of the correct heading. That way when they made landfall, they knew which direction to turn. In both cases you trade sub-optimized performance, for knowing.
Did you find that running the smc 5300 hv packs. The esc and battery leads getting decently hot or no? Mine seem to get pretty hot for a 3 minute flight and 1/2 to 3/4 throttle.
I can’t wait to get mine. I’ve seen some mods people are doing. The nozzle mod and also landing gear mod. Lengthening the front gear and shortening the rear gear to get better departures. Have you seen och tried that? 😊
Question, everything seems clear, but both your gear doors seem to be stuck open? Also, why do you check the CG with the gear down, when you're flying 99% of the time with the gear up? BTW -- The Dassault Rafale (French pronunciation: [ʁafal], literally meaning "gust of wind", or "burst of fire"
The gear doors in this version weren't sequenced in our radio, so they were opening and closing at random. When we re-shoot this jet in the future, we'll showcase the setup guide for it.
@@TwoBrosRC BTW, how do you get somebody on the phone at FMS Hobby support, other than the sushi waitress? My FMS Rafale 80mm arrived with the failed nose gear turning servo. The canard's pushrod is also detached. In order to reattach the canard pushrod, I have to disassemble way too much to get to it. It's not like my Viper 90 or my Avanti 80, very accessible. I'm by no means a surgeon, and I'm not going to poke up and scratch up a $500 plane. So much for FMS. I've 5 EDFs from Freewing, all relatively speaking, flawless.
I really wish they made TV tail for this model. It looks good with the Nav and nose gear LEDs. Unfortunately I have to buy the good old FW Su35 for the sake of 3D performance
Noticed when you were checking the As3x gyro that the surfaces stay deflected, are you using heading hold? If so can you share your gain settings please? I have mine dialed in at 25, 50, 40 but after adding 10% heading hold on ailerons the wings start to rock slowly. Thanks man! Bought mine cause of this video and loving my Rafale!
@@TwoBrosRC I think 🤔 I’ve figured it out, my elevator control needs to be set back to normal on transmitter from reversing it. Uninstall the elevator servo & arm and reinstall the servo 180 degrees and put servo arm back on. Adjust true center and throws. Jon at roughly 2:25 you explain the correct reactions of the control surfaces when being manipulated by the gyro. My Reflex 2 is reacting backwards on my elevator only. So RC Vid Reviewer suggested turning the servo around. I hope this makes sense and I’m just trying to get some help and solve my issue.
It happened with ours. It doesn't stop it from functioning, you just have to add right rudder while dropping the gear. We were annoyed by it enough that we sequenced the nose steering to do it automatically on gear drop.
Were talking about the 3d printed thrust nozzle? You said they do interfere with low end thrust and if so will pull mine off. I thought having them would help low end power. Always getting out of my comfort zone and try some of your maneuvers, definitely keeps the blood pumping. Thanks again for all of your knowledge.
It did definitely have an impact on low end thrust, but it wasn't as noticeable as we'd originally thought. We actually shot the Rafale again today for a new vid with the nozzles and they're a solid upgrade.
Great video. How much does this set up cost. The airplane the controller and the battery. What does it cost to get into this particular aircraft. I’m super interested.
You can pick up the jet from bit.ly/Rafale80 - and a transmitter that will get the most out of this model would be the NX10: bit.ly/3Qm6BSR You can fly it on an AR637TA receiver: bit.ly/3dCjiuO Batteries can be picked up via www.smc-racing.com - you'll want 6s packs. We'd recommend flying a trainer airplane like a Habu SS to get used to flying model jets with something that's relatively cheaper first. If you want a link to that, let us know.
Quick question? When you rewired it directly to your receiver did you use a y harness for elevator and canards? Love your channel by the way! Can wait to get my rafale in the air
Somebody on UA-cam did a Rafale canard mod. Used 2 360 degree servos, & cut the internal 'U' bracket in half & ran dual. The freaking 'program box' is what allows extremely limited canard movement. I've thought MANY times of cutting the servo lead TO the canard servo & putting canard on ch7!
Im digging into mine right now. Pulled up the battery try and pulled out the black box. Putting everything except the leds and retract system directly into receiever. When you said "cut the servo led" , did you mean unplug from the black box? I didnt see any reason to need to literaly cut it.
Hi, great video. One question: would you recommend this plane or the eflite 80mm f16 for smoother flight characteristics? (easier to handle and more relaxing to fly). Also may i know if the rafale is suitable for rougher grass fields?(field that is a bit more uneven than the grass fields in your video)
Both jets are relatively similar in stability. Rafale isn't suitable for rough grass, it'll tear up the foam at the base of the retracts and make them wobbly and loose.
The wing loading is high though, and it's lucky it's a delta. Any other types of wing configuration may stall easier. Btw, you may want to use a separate bec. It seems like the electronics are pulling so much amps and the esc bec can't handle it, giving you retract issues. You're going to crash this eventually when the built in BEC fails and it WILL fail.
The wing loading on this jet really isn't high at all. With regard to the BEC, that isn't the issue. It's related to the FMS control box. That's since been removed. The model flies on a 100a Avian ESC now with all servos tied into a 10ch receiver.
@@TwoBrosRC Has this eliminated the gear extension/door cycling issues then? Have others noted this with their Rafale or were you just a "lucky" one? I'm considering this model but the continuous MLG door cycling would drive me nuts.
@@brendanhartnett8201 Yeah, the door issues you're referencing come from throttle in my experience. Adding more throttle caused the doors to cycle. This only happens with the FMS mixing box. If you run the doors to the receiver and sequence it yourself, it won't happen.
I wonder if the iX20's sequencer programming could be used to apply right turn to the nosegear's servo for a few seconds, triggered by the gear down switch?
It's actually $465 which is about average for an 80mm jet that's as well built as this one is. The code FMSPFD used with the link in the description will take 10% off the jet, too.
I had 2 these and they both crashed the same way I don't know if I had it set up in my radio correct or not The roll rate was just crazy sensitive I was in the air total of 20 seconds and then crashed it was my first delta wing jet. That was about a year ago and $900 later it left a sour taste in my mouth but after seeing this I might try again
MY current Raf uses a 6ch smart (no safe) rx, no gyro, & my low (takeoff) rates are 50% & 30% expo. IF I could find the mixing board, it would be GONE too!
Have you tried those LiHV packs on any other jets? I’m thinking of ordering them for my f16 80mm but not sure how good they will get along with the smart avian esc
They'll be fine in your F-16 - just turn off low voltage cutoff (because ESCs can think that the jet is running a 7-cell battery and cut off way too early) and fly it like normal. We flew it on the Viper 90 with LVC disabled and it screamed.
Wowwwwwww👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽☺️
Check out the BVM Rafale lol.. fastest turbine I have ever seen
Cool plane love the afterburners
3:25, 3:43, 4:12, 6:49, 6:56, 12:46, 13:54, 16:34, 18:03 illustrate the jet’s tendency to slip when forced left, or naturally snap to the right at high AOA. And you prefer to do your snap rolls to the right, so the alignment issue is usually helping the jet be extra agile in that direction. When you elect to flat spin to the left at 16:56, the alignment issue fights you for the first time, resulting in a lazy left spin.
So I think this jet’s wing and rudder are not well aligned. Or best case, it is over-trimmed with left aileron and at the same time over-trimmed with right rudder, for a slight slip in order to go straight ahead and a tendency to dip right at high AOA as the right rudder wins over the left aileron at high AOA.
So…. I’m not as in love with it as you are. It’s probably fixable, but a roller can be hard to iron out. Warped foam can be a bitch, if that’s the root cause.
You might be right. Personally I don't mind a predictable slip to one direction in high AoA.
@@TwoBrosRC
I could see that as a plus, kind of like intentional drift, in navigation. In the old days airplanes crossing large bodies of water would intentionally miss their land target by intentionally flying a few degrees to one side of the correct heading. That way when they made landfall, they knew which direction to turn. In both cases you trade sub-optimized performance, for knowing.
Sweet . Nice flight God bless take care stay safe.
Just flies like the real one, great design.
Great video Jon.. Love the way you push these planes.... keep it up..
Is this easier to fly than the freewing f22 90mm?
It's a big delta wing. It's very easy to fly, even compared to the F-22.
The Rafale a great aircraft for your flying style. Great flying and set up. Can't wait to see the review of the 64mm Rafale.
AirHammer out!!
Or anyone's, honestly. It's really just all around great. We're anticipating that the 64mm will be similar.
Did you find that running the smc 5300 hv packs. The esc and battery leads getting decently hot or no? Mine seem to get pretty hot for a 3 minute flight and 1/2 to 3/4 throttle.
Batteries tend to warm up at this time of year. It's pretty common and nothing to worry about
I see that F-5E Tiger II making an appearance!
You'll see it in next week's vlog 😉
I can’t wait to get mine. I’ve seen some mods people are doing. The nozzle mod and also landing gear mod. Lengthening the front gear and shortening the rear gear to get better departures. Have you seen och tried that? 😊
We've done that nozzle mod but the gear is not necessary.
Hello I 'am french and I don't know how much is that for the jet and command please thank you ❤️ I want to buy this one
Link is in the description!
Good camera work also it's hard to do
Question, everything seems clear, but both your gear doors seem to be stuck open? Also, why do you check the CG with the gear down, when you're flying 99% of the time with the gear up?
BTW -- The Dassault Rafale (French pronunciation: [ʁafal], literally meaning "gust of wind", or "burst of fire"
The gear doors in this version weren't sequenced in our radio, so they were opening and closing at random. When we re-shoot this jet in the future, we'll showcase the setup guide for it.
@@TwoBrosRC BTW, how do you get somebody on the phone at FMS Hobby support, other than the sushi waitress? My FMS Rafale 80mm arrived with the failed nose gear turning servo. The canard's pushrod is also detached. In order to reattach the canard pushrod, I have to disassemble way too much to get to it. It's not like my Viper 90 or my Avanti 80, very accessible. I'm by no means a surgeon, and I'm not going to poke up and scratch up a $500 plane. So much for FMS. I've 5 EDFs from Freewing, all relatively speaking, flawless.
Great flying!!! High alpha landings are very impressive. Would you say the gear is a design flaw or did you just get a bad nose gear on yours?
It looks like a design flaw but is easily remedied with right rudder.
Do you think that this would be able to take off of a 150 foot runway with the SMC 5300?
A 5300 will have a hard time fitting. Try a 4400 instead. It'll take off quickly.
Man, I want this jet but I fly off grass and I doubt it could lift off of it. Dang!
I really wish they made TV tail for this model. It looks good with the Nav and nose gear LEDs. Unfortunately I have to buy the good old FW Su35 for the sake of 3D performance
7:34 coolest approach ever
Stabilized approach. Win.
Sweet jet and flying
Noticed when you were checking the As3x gyro that the surfaces stay deflected, are you using heading hold? If so can you share your gain settings please? I have mine dialed in at 25, 50, 40 but after adding 10% heading hold on ailerons the wings start to rock slowly. Thanks man! Bought mine cause of this video and loving my Rafale!
That was checking SAFE which uses the same gyro. If SAFE is correct, AS3X is too.
2:25 @RC Video Reviews Please Watch; my elevator is compensating in reverse.
Do what?
@@TwoBrosRC I think 🤔 I’ve figured it out, my elevator control needs to be set back to normal on transmitter from reversing it. Uninstall the elevator servo & arm and reinstall the servo 180 degrees and put servo arm back on. Adjust true center and throws. Jon at roughly 2:25 you explain the correct reactions of the control surfaces when being manipulated by the gyro. My Reflex 2 is reacting backwards on my elevator only. So RC Vid Reviewer suggested turning the servo around. I hope this makes sense and I’m just trying to get some help and solve my issue.
The wheels look real small, will it fly off of grass?
Yup, it will. So long as the grass is short.
Is the gear issue common amongst all of these? That’s kinda unnerving.
It happened with ours. It doesn't stop it from functioning, you just have to add right rudder while dropping the gear. We were annoyed by it enough that we sequenced the nose steering to do it automatically on gear drop.
@@TwoBrosRC Thanks for the feedback. Beautiful jet. Love your channel, honest reviews and all that you do. Thanks for sharing!
That is a very graceful Jet. Awesome flying as always 🤙🏼
Were talking about the 3d printed thrust nozzle? You said they do interfere with low end thrust and if so will pull mine off. I thought having them would help low end power. Always getting out of my comfort zone and try some of your maneuvers, definitely keeps the blood pumping. Thanks again for all of your knowledge.
It did definitely have an impact on low end thrust, but it wasn't as noticeable as we'd originally thought. We actually shot the Rafale again today for a new vid with the nozzles and they're a solid upgrade.
Very nice guys. I have enjoyed many of your recent videos.
Great video. How much does this set up cost. The airplane the controller and the battery. What does it cost to get into this particular aircraft. I’m super interested.
You can pick up the jet from bit.ly/Rafale80 - and a transmitter that will get the most out of this model would be the NX10: bit.ly/3Qm6BSR
You can fly it on an AR637TA receiver: bit.ly/3dCjiuO
Batteries can be picked up via www.smc-racing.com - you'll want 6s packs. We'd recommend flying a trainer airplane like a Habu SS to get used to flying model jets with something that's relatively cheaper first. If you want a link to that, let us know.
Quick question? When you rewired it directly to your receiver did you use a y harness for elevator and canards? Love your channel by the way! Can wait to get my rafale in the air
The canard is a single servo that needs to be on its own channel. You can't mix pitch and roll elevons with pitch-only canards.
What's up with the gear door thing
What gear door thing?
Are you ever going to buy a turbine jet??
At some point we will!
in the video, is it the version with Reflex V2 or without Reflex ?
This uses AS3X.
@@TwoBrosRC so it means NO REFLEX and you use directly the AS3X of the receptor.
and the wires are directly connected to the receptor.
Somebody on UA-cam did a Rafale canard mod. Used 2 360 degree servos, & cut the internal 'U' bracket in half & ran dual. The freaking 'program box' is what allows extremely limited canard movement. I've thought MANY times of cutting the servo lead TO the canard servo & putting canard on ch7!
That's a ton of work haha
Im digging into mine right now. Pulled up the battery try and pulled out the black box. Putting everything except the leds and retract system directly into receiever. When you said "cut the servo led" , did you mean unplug from the black box? I didnt see any reason to need to literaly cut it.
Do you only use a lipo battery in there? Or how do the back burn working?
Check fiftytwoeightyrc.com for more info.
Hi, great video. One question: would you recommend this plane or the eflite 80mm f16 for smoother flight characteristics? (easier to handle and more relaxing to fly). Also may i know if the rafale is suitable for rougher grass fields?(field that is a bit more uneven than the grass fields in your video)
Both jets are relatively similar in stability. Rafale isn't suitable for rough grass, it'll tear up the foam at the base of the retracts and make them wobbly and loose.
@Two Brothers Radio Control ok thanks!
Can’t wait to see the Rafale mini me soon.
Much better camera work.
The wing loading is high though, and it's lucky it's a delta. Any other types of wing configuration may stall easier. Btw, you may want to use a separate bec. It seems like the electronics are pulling so much amps and the esc bec can't handle it, giving you retract issues. You're going to crash this eventually when the built in BEC fails and it WILL fail.
The wing loading on this jet really isn't high at all. With regard to the BEC, that isn't the issue. It's related to the FMS control box. That's since been removed. The model flies on a 100a Avian ESC now with all servos tied into a 10ch receiver.
@@TwoBrosRC Has this eliminated the gear extension/door cycling issues then? Have others noted this with their Rafale or were you just a "lucky" one? I'm considering this model but the continuous MLG door cycling would drive me nuts.
@@brendanhartnett8201 Yeah, the door issues you're referencing come from throttle in my experience. Adding more throttle caused the doors to cycle. This only happens with the FMS mixing box. If you run the doors to the receiver and sequence it yourself, it won't happen.
I wonder if the iX20's sequencer programming could be used to apply right turn to the nosegear's servo for a few seconds, triggered by the gear down switch?
Probably! The issue is that it would kick the rudder in as well. It's best performed manually so there's no surprises.
@@TwoBrosRC Yeah...you'd have to move your nose steering to its own channel.
Which would need a 10ch receiver - probably a bit overkill for this bird.
where do you get that pull behind cart?
amzn.to/3UYOrcN
Very impressive guys
Do the doors help with high alpha XD
They actually do, most likely.
where do you buy those batteries
www.smc-racing.com
I want to order one of these, but $500
It's actually $465 which is about average for an 80mm jet that's as well built as this one is. The code FMSPFD used with the link in the description will take 10% off the jet, too.
@@TwoBrosRC no tax?
No idea, try checking out and see. I'm on mobile until Tuesday night so I can't really check at the moment.
I just bought mine for $432.00 tax and all using the 10% discount on the Fms website.
I just bought mine for $432.00 tax and all using the 10% discount on the Fms website.
I had 2 these and they both crashed the same way I don't know if I had it set up in my radio correct or not The roll rate was just crazy sensitive I was in the air total of 20 seconds and then crashed it was my first delta wing jet. That was about a year ago and $900 later it left a sour taste in my mouth but after seeing this I might try again
Try rewiring it so the surfaces are only connected to the receiver instead of the mixing board.
@@TwoBrosRC thank you for the advice it's much appreciated 🙏 keep up the great flying
@@TwoBrosRC was your set up under a delta wing configuration in your spectrum radio 📻
@@tylersrcflightschool9570 Elevon configuration.
MY current Raf uses a 6ch smart (no safe) rx, no gyro, & my low (takeoff) rates are 50% & 30% expo.
IF I could find the mixing board, it would be GONE too!
How would you compare this to the 70mm thunderbirds?
Completely different beast. The Rafale is way more capable and fun.
@@TwoBrosRC way more expensive too
Like $100 difference - not really "way more"
@@TwoBrosRC more expensive parts and batteries
You asked how we'd compare it, not what the prices would be. 😁
Have you tried those LiHV packs on any other jets? I’m thinking of ordering them for my f16 80mm but not sure how good they will get along with the smart avian esc
They'll be fine in your F-16 - just turn off low voltage cutoff (because ESCs can think that the jet is running a 7-cell battery and cut off way too early) and fly it like normal. We flew it on the Viper 90 with LVC disabled and it screamed.
@@TwoBrosRC Do you have speed telemetry set up on the viper? I'm curious how much faster it would make it.
@@stopitdad69 We hit 128 MPH with it recently.