FAT OVER LEAN EXPLAINED FOR OIL PAINTERS
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- Опубліковано 9 лип 2024
- What the heck IS 'fat over lean,' anyway, and how do I make sure I adhere to it in my oil paintings?
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I have steered away from Liquin for several reasons, the primary reason is not for how it dries, but how it may taint the color over time... I cannot predict its ultimate effects and I cannot seem to gauge if I am using too much or not till years later- that I don't want to find out if I get too settled into the technique for using it by the time I do finally notice that I am using too much in my mix.
Thank you for this. It is one of the very most informative/motivational videos I’ve ever seen, balancing archival techniques vs, “just paint”....
Thank you.
Especially in a la prima its necessecary to paint fat over lean! because you put all layers at the same time on your canvas.That means you start with your lean underpainting (Layer 1). Next you paint with your oils a little there, and a little there - everywhere on the canvas you should have the same stage of development (Layer 2) This process you make- till you are happy with your painting. At least you give your highlights on it - this is also a layer (3 or 4 - it depends from your choice). Sometimes it can be that your color doesn‘t wan‘t to get connected with the canvas anymore because there is too much oilcolor there ( because you painted too thick for instance or you have too much layers or your medium or your colors were too fat for this stage.). Than you take more fat that means you have to mix oil into your colors: than your color can connect with the canvas again. Observe it when you paint at the next time how often you return to the same position in your paint and how often you put color on this position: another color, a better color, darker, lighter, larger or smaller.... - this are all layers!! You can make this a few times but suddenly it doesn‘t work: this is the stage where you have to take more oil! But be carefull - it can crack if your painting is too thick.
Classical Painting in Layers means you take thin layers and normally you wait 3 days (or longer) before you continue painting the next layer. This type of painting cannot crack because every layer has time to dry before the next layer is added. For this technique its normally not neccesary to paint fat over lean that means one medium for the whole paint!
good! many artistic people are very good at stressing out! good pep talk for them
I paint mostly wet on wet. And mostly thick, palette and big, thick brush strokes. I recently did some retouch work on a very dark surface (with the exact same paint), and as it dried It became matt over the gloss the other parts had. Big problem. Thanks to information like yours I solved it.
Great video Chelsea. You echo so many of my thoughts and comments when teaching my classes. Bravo, I look forward to seeing your weekly paintings. Best wishes Paul🖌😃
Thank you!
I had heard this principle and had figured out it was to do with preventing cracking.
But your step-by-step explanations are more clarifying.
Excellent and thorough explanation of this concept. You do a very good job at taking the theoretical or diffuse concept and making it understandable to all. Thanks.
Thanks for the clear explanation. Also, beautiful and interesting painting!
You are an excellent teacher! I’ve learned more from watching two of your videos than years of instruction. Thank you!
I paint in two stages. I underpaint using a bit of solvent and liquin. This allows me to finish the painting in a couple days. If Im not in a hurry for the finish painting to dry, I use linseed oil for the top glaze. If I AM in a hurry I use linseed with a touch of liquin. Liquin doesn't affect the color and improves flow. If you're worried about that, just don't use as much. Thanks for the tutorial.
Great advice and great talent! I just subscribed as your content is spot on. Thanks 🇨🇦
So helpful! I have been trying to figure out to actually apply the fat over lean lesson! Thank you
Chelsea, thanks for your videos, they are very helpful and inspirational
Loved this explanation.
can you make a video copying/studying john singer sargent's painting
Thank you! Like
Thanks for the video, that really helped me! I'm just starting out with oils and trying to learn as much as I can before putting paint down. As part of that, can I ask how you're removing the paint from your canvas in this video? Is that a clean brush lifting the paint away?
Thanks
What I understand about the rule is that when you lay a layer over top of any "skin" of "dry to the touch" paint... you definitely need to worry about fat over lean. Otherwise it is a matter of how much thickness there is to any given Lean layer, vs any given Fat layer over top... if your layer above is Leaner than that of the one below, it will undoubtedly blend into the still wet layer below, and if it is fatter, then it might not sit still in the first place if you have enough lean underneath if that lean layer is still wet... so- that wet into wet pretty much takes care of itself. Again, the skin is the warning for this rule.
Alot of artists advocate against using solvent in ANY paint layers, or if they do, ONLY the wash which gets wiped off. Because it weakens the paint film and loosens the bond between pigment particles, making every subsequent layer weaker and more likely to experience issues quickly. BUT, either people use liquin and no solvent, no liquin but good amount of oil in modeling and solvent in block in, or no solvent or medium of any kind(Virgil Elliott/George O'hanlan/Michael Harding recommendation)....I try not to say one is better than the other, since I have seen great artists do ALL the above, due to preference or just doing what they've been taught. Only time will tell who was "more correct". I mean, doesn't "no solvent OR medium at all" make the most sense tho? Lol but who actually adheres to that, very few that I'm aware of. I enjoy liquin and have grown used to how it reacts when there is too much, and always add more paint accordingly. Haven't had any issues so far because I keep it under 20% liquin at MOST. oleogel/linseed oil works good as well, in the modeling/detail layers. I've used solvent-free gel from gamblin, neo mugilp, venetian medium, traditional mix of oil/solvent....so far, only one I noticed issues with was the one I used wayyyy to much oil in doing Alla prima. I also only use panels or lead primed linen on ACM panel nowadays so....I think as long as your paintings are beautiful enough to be admired in 80 years, then mediums are probably more of a concern to US than anyone else. 😉 (so far I haven't heard anyone say, "boy Rembrant really messed up on this one with his oil content, he should've used less") that's a conservator's line of thinking, not the average person. I know, ridiculously deep subject when it shouldn't be. Good luck and happy painting bud!
@@DCweldingAndArt I have read a few books, so forgive me if I skimmed yours, but I take your point well, solvents do weaken paint FILM, but that does not necessarily kill the paint or the painting's ability to take further layers of paint. I use solvents in the earliest layers just to speed up the dry times, and get base color onto the panel quickly, but this is not a final layer, nor is it something that will be influencing the look of a final layer. Being sure that this first layer has had time for the solvent to air out is key to it being able to not interfere with further layers. Normally I wait a few days for the solvent to fully evaporate and the paint to cure.
@@chrisgriffith1573 well then hey, sounds like you have your legitimate method down, which suits you at the moment. 👌 that was the point of both our "books"...there are more than a couple ways to skin this cat 🐈 i would say we have an understanding, at least I do. 😉 good luck! Thanks for sharing btw, I see not a thing wrong with your process. And I can't find any issues with what I do nowadays either. Everyone wins 🏆
I understand that some paint with acrylic paint first, and oil paint on top of it. All primers seem to be acrylic.
Not all primers. There is oil primers too, quick drying one as well. But yeah, acrylic base for oils is quite normal and prevailing today. It is generally considered acceptable. I have seen opinions that question this technique, but don't see why traditional organic based sizing would be more acceptable for instance. Acrylic should be at least that enduring as traditional base, and it is considered oil to make strong bound to it as well.
I have a question please. For the detail toward the end of the video, is the brush you’re using a dagger? Have you modified it?
What are you covering the painting with the wide brush when it’s finished?
What are you cleaning your bridges with while you’re painting ?
I use same exact method, only I use solvent just a touch in my wash. Then I wipe it off, every layer on top of it had either tiny bit of liquin or oleogel, or nothing at all.(I like glazing with no medium) also, I saw some Michael's canvases with acrylic gesso, Winton paint, and probably a ton of mistakes/0% American or handmade anything. And yet, it sells for $1000 and will be here 50 years from now lol and the customer didn't care. Whatever that's worth, MayBe worth noting lol and then, little old me, with the most expensive and handmade materials, whom NO ONE has heard of. So....lol think about THAT. Different "strokes" for different folks. I like what I like, and they like what they like. I use liquin original, impasto, and fine detail just like Andrew Tischler, Michael James Smith, Michael Chamberlain, and 4 dozen others...and I have YET to experience ANY issues. Of course I don't use a 50% ratio either. Great video!
Im allergic to solvent, so I dont know how to get around this. I mstruggling hugely with this issue... and even to tone the canvas. Can you advise? thanks
I do have a question. 🙋♀️ When do you start a applying varnish to your painting after completion? I was told at least six months which I do not have time because I am either selling it on a commissioned basis or an art contest is about a month or so for me to enter.
Look at retouch varnish
Chelsea we can't use Turpentine as oil or medium, to paint on our canvas! Can we?
how long did you have to wait before varnishing this piece?
Do you ever use acrylic as your under painting?
Is this the same with thick over thin? 👍
This is beyond talent and I just want to say that you're my inspiration in continuing my passion in art and I hope that my channel would be successful like yours
Yeah for horses! Beautiful blue color. So technically if one got too fatty, one could wait a year and then continue without any issues?
Proberbly a dum question. Should I add more and more, or less and less linseed oil in the process?
And are you using both oil / medium and solvent at the same time?
I’m using water based oils. How does this work?
Sometimes I use Cobra: I make my underpainting with water (lean). Than I start to paint without any medium (the colors are so creamy that I don‘t need medium).So this stage is mor fat than water. If I have many layers and I have problems to make my highlights than I paint them with medium from cobra: this is oily, that means it is more fat than the oilcolors alone.
It seems like you varnish your painting as soon as it is touch dry, I have heard that we should wait for about 6 months before applying varnish as oil paintings take that much time to dry completely....is it alright to varnish this early?
I learned that Gamvar varnish is safe to use after the painting is dry to the touch.
It's called Gamvar, it's a retouch varnish made by Gamblin that allows paint film to continue polymerizing underneath, so it's safe to do when touch dry. Only stuff I use, but there are others out there(Rublev, Art Spectrum, Winsor and Newton, etc)
@@DCweldingAndArt Hi Derrick, not offending but I don't think Gamvar is a retouching varnish because you can't had fresh paint over it (you have to remove it before with solvent). But it's true that you can varnish with Gamvar when the paint is dry to the touch like with a retouching varnish.
@@jeanluc5311 thanks for sharing, yes...its not "technically" a retouch varnish. And I also have never heard of a varnish where you DIDNT have to remove it first before adding paint again. (Usually I only varnish when I KNOW there's nothing else that needs painted) which retouch varnish claims you can paint on top of it? I'm interested now, if the claims are true...sounds like the ultimate retouch varnish! And I would def have to buy some. Thanks again for sharing, take care!
@@DCweldingAndArt hi again Derrick, retouching varnish is a temporary varnish that you can paint over even if some conservators don't advise it. It's different from straight varnish that you can't for sure paint over. Retouching varnish is used for "oiling out" by some painters after the painting has dried and some parts are dull/sinking in to get back the original colors and values and then you can paint over. You can't do that for sure with straigh varnish.
Also retouching varnish is used to protect your painting when it's dry to the touch because you can't varnish it so soon. But after you have to revarnish with real varnish over or clean the retouch varnish...when the paint is really dry not only to the touch (after like 1 year).
Gamvar is something different, it's a real varnish that you can apply when your painting is dry to the touch and that will be definitive unlike retouching varnish. Hope it helps, bye
If you’re painting alla prima in one session, fat over lean does not apply. It’s only relevant when painting layers over several days/weeks.
'Fat over Lean' in modern painting is confusing.
It should really be called 'Slow over Fast' (drying)
You can have high fat/oil content in underpainting, so long as it polymerizes quickly (eg, raw umber paint).
btw.. adding solvent to oil paint does not affect the ratio of oil to pigment in a layer, since the solvent merely dissolves oil, then evaporates, leaving behind exactly what was present beforehand.
It doesn't reduce oil content, and so the paint remains the same fatness or lean-ness, unless you subsequently 'suck out' the more fluid dissolved oil with an absorbent ground..
Originally, in early oil painting, genuinely lean underlayers were provided by water-soluble tempera/emulsion paint, which dry very quickly, and had very low, or no, oil content.
These layers were then covered by fatter oil/varnish paint.
So maybe 'fat over lean' had actual meaning back in the day.
Just not true. Adding too much solvent and making the layer thin - breaks the polimer bonds that oil make with the pigment. (by making them too distant to bound properly) Since there are no effective bonds formed - the pigment of the image can be scraped by hand, and will never fix to the canvas, especially if the ground is smooth, oil primed or special not absorbent gesso.
Maybe painting on top of it will fix it - by impregnating it with oil, but usually in alla prima or genuinely depending on the style - there will be patches left from the first layer, and this can be a problem.
This apply to acrylic paints too - adding too much water will make the layer unstable and you can scrape it off later by hand.
@@LyubomirIko what?
oil molecules bond with each other, using O2, to form polymer.. not to the pigment.
and... in solvation, there is chemical association, but ''Solvation does not cause a chemical reaction or chemical configuration changes in the solute.'' (wiki)
@@deegee8645 when oil particles are spaced too far apart due to solvent dispersing the mixture - the dispersed oil can't form as much strong bound to hold between neither - the other pigment, itself or the canvas.
The solvent act to divide/diluted the two. The oil in such mixture will also flow with different speed from the pigment so you can observe dispersing of the mixture uneven and you can observe drips (especially if the painting is upright) where the pigment becomes nearly completely deprived from the oil and is flotation just in pure solvent and will form clumbs. This is how you clean your brushes off from the paint essentially - and you can always find completely deprived of oil - pigment on the bottom of the jar with solvent. Pigment that just can't adhere.
But just test it yourself. Deluge very generously an oil paint with a solvent on smooth base. Wait till it completely dried up. Rub it.
@@LyubomirIko if you evaporate all the solvent from your jar, you will be left with oil paint which then dries.
@@deegee8645 perhaps, but we are talking about very deluded mix that is spread across in very thin wash. It will just rub away. This is why white spirit is never used alone in glazing, but always you add additional oil. btw I have done this mistake so I know that first handed - Its all about proportion of course, but if you intend thin glazes this is very bad idea. Such layer just won't adhere properly. Depending on the thickness - you can rub it after months with little additional white spirit or just with hand. If you use oil in the glazing medium however - you can rub as much as you want - and won't just scrub off.
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