The NEWLY Redesigned Pathfinder School Alcohol Stove - Did They FIX the Issues?
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- Опубліковано 29 чер 2024
- There are few things I enjoy more than a good alcohol stove...so years ago when I bought the Pathfinder Alcohol stove I was very excited to see how it worked. Unfortunately I could never get it to work correctly and that was very frustrating. When I saw that they had redesigned it I decided to give it another chance. So, did they fix the issues?
#pathfinder #selfrelianceoutfitters #alcoholstove
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Pathfinder recently lowered their prices on many items. Dave C. explained that the store is doing so well they are able to get a better deal through more volume and are passing the savings on to the consumer. WHO DOES THAT???? So even though most is made in China (he has an excellent video explaining modern manufacturing economics) the products are made to HIS specs. I have no problem giving him my money.
Same!
I have the first version and had no trouble with getting it started (I use denatured alcohol) my issue is that I haven't found a way to keep it from leaking.
When your prices are too high nobody buys them, the logical thing to do is lower the price. As a result sales pick up. Don’t confuse basic business practice with thinking someone is doing you a favor. If the manufacturer had that kind of mentality then they would produce their products in the USA in the first place, not communist China. Manufacturers produce in communist China because the labor is dirt cheap which means their profit margins are higher. Obviously they care more about the money they make than “doing you a favor”.🤦🏽♂️
That's not one of the items!!!
I agree with you, there is a lot of R&D that goes into everything that he puts his logo on.
I went through an Alcohol Stove Crazz for a bit, and still hand's down the simple Fancy Feast is the best.
@mitch5077 you are absolutely right
What pot stand do you use?
Will this burner fit in the firebox nano?
I've been using this stove & the pathfinder Stove Stand Multi-Tool daily ever since they hit the market. The Self Reliance Outfitter's Stove Stand Multi-Tool is a well designed pot stand that works best with this stainless steel stove's inherent design flaws you encountered using other pot stands. I use this system every day to make my morning coffee with no problem. Part of this morning ritual also includes using the rim as the primer pan to get a trouble free & efficient alcohol bloom right off the bat. For my coffee, I heat 20-22 ounces of water to a rolling boil in a time that is comparable to the Trangia or Esbit stoves I used in the past. The best part of this stove/pot stand version is since it's stainless steel, it's the most bullet proof I've used! No regrets whatsoever with this system.
What type fuel are you using?
@@allendelarosa7891 I've been using denatured alcohol in the 1 gallon metal cans in the paint solvent section at Lowes.
I have the old design and loving it. It has worked consistently over the years and is my favourite alcohol stove.
Thank you, Dr. Garcia. Suspected oxygen deprivation, based on the orange flame color. In the second configuration, there was more blue in the flame pattern. Another informative video.
Future Video Idea: Many beginners are unsure of the priming process for an alcohol stove. Can you do a video on all the different ways there are to prime all kinds of alcohol stoves, and what works well, and what doesn't?
Tuna can lid under the stove w tiny bit of alcohol works like champ,within seconds
@@brian1674 I'd say he knows that. He didn't say "Many beginners. like me...." lol
IMO your first stand is the first issue to look at. It may be that the incoming air and combustion product exhaust gas are in counterflow. The hottest gas should FLOW up and around your cup. It appears hot gas collects in the ring and warms the cup, but there is reduced convective heat transfer. The flame appears starved for air and fuel is not used efficiently. Second set up has too much distance between burner and pot.
The first setup was like shutting the damper on a wood stove, basically causing a smolder.
Operator Headspace as we used to call it …once you get your procedure down it works not a jet boil but it works. Sure you must have had a problem with the older one most people don’t and love them . Keep making videos have fun stay safe.
I don't think there was anything inherently bad about the original Pathfinder alcohol stove. I have one and I really like it. I like it better than my Trangia or my Trangia knock-offs. I believe the reason for the re-design is because the original is too large to fit under the Pathfinder canteen stove. Maybe I'm wrong. Who knows? But mine works just fine. Glad you're back with us!
I have the old version. Haven't used it a ton, but when I have it worked just fine. Thanks for sharing my friend 🤠
It weighs a ton
Nice, honest, and appreciated. Thanks Ernie ✊🤓
Great video Ernie.
My 2 favorite alcohol burners are my Trangia and my cat can stove.
Looking forward to your next video.
Cheers
I've watched many of your stove videos and have enjoyed them and learned a lot. I bought my trangia set and my solo stove because of the things you and others showed about them. I'm getting the stove bug too, because I purchased the Evernew DX set and a base camp Kelly Kettle. I live on the VA coast and these things come in handy when the power is out because of storms or hurricanes. Thanks for all you do and show. Take Care and Stay Safe.
Even the flame on #2 looked better. Great video as always.
You had me worried for a minute there , my new Pathfinder stove is on it,s way to me but all's well that ends well , thanks for the review , helped alot , just hope all's well that ends well with mine when it arrives , Cheers Mate , 👍🙂
Thanks Doc.
Well, I'm glad you did this video. I was going to order a few of the old ones, when they went on sale, before they did away with those. But, I didn't. Got lucky on that, I have a lot of other Pathfinder gear. Thanks
I got the larger/older stove in November 2019. It didn't burn well at first. I saw someone else's video that recommended rinsing the stove. so I rinsed the inside with alcohol to remove oils from the production process. It worked better, but occasionally the stove doesn't perform as well as I would like. I recently picked up a Trangia, but haven't used it yet. Thanks for the video on the new stove
First! The problem I see is so many things are made with the Trangia design or copycats in mind. It ultimately makes the different items, ie twig stoves, etc much more versatile. I mean I can see it having a place with the larger fuel capacity. Although it doesnt burn any longer then a standard Trangia so the point is moot.
Thanks, Ernie, for another informative video. I do have the new pathfinder stove and I like the size and performance. I did find that if you leave alcohol in it, it will leak. At least mine does no matter how tight the top. That is unfortunate, so I usually just burn it out.
Trangia
"often imitate never equal"
I was given the older version by a friend yesterday. I stumbled onto your video trying to figure out how to use it. It worked very well for me. 15 minutes from cold to boil.
Good review , thanks for sharing , God bless !
Hey Ernie. I was an enlisted guy at England AFB 1974-78. Came back to and went to NYMC and am IM in Greenwich CT for a few decades now. Love camping and your stove reviews. Odd connection. Anyway just happened to get this stove today with Pathfinders stainless steel version of the Swiss mess kit setup that I also have in stainless steel. Can’t wait to take it to Bear Mountain but I’ll bring the Trangia just in case. Keep up the great work!
I was looking at that stove a while back and my inner voice keep telling me no. Glad I listened! I don’t know I like my stainless steel bushpot but I wondered how well a alcohol stove would do made of stainless steel.
I think the first stand would perform better if you turned it over, so the holes are at the bottom and placed a couple tent stakes on the top, so the pot sits a bit higher.
Hard to beat homemade catfood stove for boiling water. My Trangia kit has been my goto cookset for years and years
A catfood stove can get crushed. This stove is over designed for ruggedness.
I was gifted my dad's childhood trangia and it still works great!
Thanks for the video.
I've both . Never had a problem! I like their new stove because it not as heavy. But all in all you need to try the multi fuel stove of Pathfinder. Thank of sharing, Your channel has always been a reliable, stay safe, thanks
Greetings, I enjoy your reviews... I have the original version for the last year and I been using it on the weekends in home cooking for breakfast and lunch, and I am watching this video I finish making breakfast and coffee... I only have positive experiences. The only complaint I have is the bottom as you showed in video but I don't leave the stove an attendant..
Thank you for this review. I really like my alcohol stoves (trangia, stainless and titanium) but don’t believe I’d buy this stove. I was prefer my titanium stove over all due lower weight and faster cooling after use. I’ve often wished I could find a titanium trangia but I’ve not ever heard of one.
Thanks Doc for the review. I did not purchase the old stove because of the negative reviews on UA-cam describing the inability of the burner to bloom. This stove does seem to be better, but I'm not sure it is as efficient as my Toaks Titanium Siphon burner. Plus it is heavier and uses more fuel to boil two cups of water.
I wish you had done a video on the first model. I have one that I really like! Never timed it to boil, but I know I've burned it for close to two hours straight and still had fuel. Plus I like how it came with a stand that nests around the base. I think they made this model to work with their PFM40 cook set maybe.
I too had trouble with Pathfinder’s original stove. Same problem that you experienced, it would never bring the water to a boil. Pathfinder replaced my stove and the new improved version is greatly improved.
Cat food can is always more efficient, economical, and superior in every way. No need to ration it and save the fuel for later as I'm wise and aware of how much fuel it takes to prepare my meals.
I had one of the old stoves which I had received as a Father’s Day gift. Couldn’t ever get it to boil the water for my freeze dried meals so I put it in my “extra gear” box and bought a trangia spirit burner(I now own 11 Trangias located in 72 Hr. Emergency “Bug Out” kits-one for each family member. Each has a set of Basic items, then personalized with foods that each likes, and extra clothing and accessories. ) Maybe the next kit will get a “Pathfinder Stove”, after about a dozen uses (checking reliability). Thanks Ernie, We’re STILL BOILING WATER-ONE POT AT A TIME!
I got the original, the big one, and like it. Never tested it though, but it doesn't take long to heat water.
It really is tough to beat the trangia and evernew spirit burners. I stopped buying new stoves trying to beat them.
I agree, my old Evernew is hard to beat. However, my GOAT stove is the Toaks with their pot stand, it is bombproof and is very lightweight. Isn’t it interesting though, if you want to throw a alcohol stove in your daypack for a quick cup of coffee on the trail or a freeze dried meal the Trangia is still most convenient since it holds the alcohol.
Yeap. I tilted the jet holes in my trangia and I’ve yet to find a faster more fuel efficient stove. Not the lightest though. My aluminum can stoves are faster to bloom but too fast though.
Good video Ernie, personally I think the Trangia still remains king of the hill. I have many SRO/Pathfinder products including the old style alcohol stove. I have never timed the old stove but I only use it to boil water for coffee during power outages. Trangia with a Firebox Nano for a pot stand is my best setup for hiking/camping.
I know you have tested a ton of alcohol stoves over the years Ernie so when you give your opinion on a stove I know it’s honest.
I believe you are right about the pot fitting too tight on the support. The same process happens to wood stoves if you don't have open air flow at the top and the pot is not elevated enough to allow the heat and escape velocity of the burned gasses to flow out. This is why it smokes so much in a wood stove and your cook time was so long. I'm surprised Dave doesn't include a pot stand that would fit over the alcohol stove like the Swiss Army M-71 stoves. They cling to the side of the stove canister for storage.
I suspect the original PF stove with its size and volume of fuel they acted as a heat sink effecting performance.
Exactly, especially as stainless steel, which Ernie says stats hot for a long time (so will stay cooler at the start)
Yellow flame equals low heat and usually oxygen. My cat can And stealth alcy home made stoves work faster and lasts as long and are lighter. Appreciate the video🎉
Glad to see they fixed the issues. I returned two of the old high volume stoves - great idea, shame it didn’t work, but it was an excellent idea nevertheless. I don’t think stainless steel is well suited for these types of stove, I have an Evernew stainless one, which is a thing of beauty and perfection, but also performs sluggishly.
The Origional Pathfinder had a few issues allright but if you prime it Properly and add a bit more fuel granted you may have to light it a few times but once it's going it will boil 2 to 3 cups of water !!
Hey Ernie, thanks for another great video. I bought this stove along with the Pathfinder's stainless steel m40 version. Maybe you could do a review for that Cookset with this stove and do a boil test? Cheers!
I use the original one. It fits in my solo stove titan. I never had a problem with mine but it does take a minute to warm up. I did order the new one to try out with my bottle stove kit.
Hiram had trouble with that type of stand. If you put a couple tent stakes under the opt acrossthe stove, the function is better. It needs to flow.
I just tested mine using the Pathfinder Stainless Swedish Army Mess Kit, 12C inside temp, no wind, 1 ounce alcohol, 2 cups of water, pot put on after bloom. No lid.
Rolling boil in 14:30, didn't seem to hold the bloom properly. I can see some kind of internal wick that is blocking some of the holes but not others. Yellow flame even with pot on.
Cooled everything back down to room temp using cold water and replaced the stove with my Fancee Feast stove and sat the pot directly on the stove with everything else the same (basically just not using the internal folding pot stand but still using as wind break)
Rolling boil in 8:00.
I also was not impressed with the first version of this stove. Glad you were impressed with this “new & improved” version.
I’m still not blown away.
Was the difference simply the stand OR did the titanium pot play a role? Several unknowns in my mind.
I’m not seeing any reason why I would replace the Trangia stove I acquired through FireBox Stoves.
My Trangia is not too finicky about either stand or pot.
Certainly not as bad as the original; but, next to the Trangia, “if it ain’t’ broke why fix it”.
Physics.
Fire needs oxygen. Out in the field, where there'd be a constant breeze 9 times out of 10, you'd actually need a windbreak to keep it from burning out too quickly because of how much oxygen it was being fed. In a static environment (aka indoors), it'd definitely need "no" windbreak and in fact, the more you'd close it off, the slower it'd burn.
Dave went into detail about what distance the redesigned stove works at best and they figured this out through a lot of trial & error when using it for what it was designed to be used with in the first place; a Swedish Mess Kit.
It just has to be sorted out with it's specific design for one to figure out what's the best configuration for it to be used in.
Hiram Cook's review of the taller PF Stove had a very telling result. Even though it and the Trangia that was running against it both had 2oz of fuel, the Trangia burned more yellow (less efficient) and the PF more blue and the end, the PF flame lasted for about 20 minutes LONGER than the Trangia for the same 2oz of fuel. I'm thinking that it's taller body burned more on fuel than on flame.
This redesigned PF stove was supposed to be a happy medium of compromises between that taller version and the standard Trangia.
Check out their "Stove stand multi-tool" that goes on the alcohol stove. I got one and tried it on the Trangia, and it fits it quite well, but I see where it could be a little unstable if on an uneven surface. But, it's a neat, cheap and useful gadget.
I bought one for around 10 bucks that has a cross bar that sits on top of it and doesn't hold much more fuel than I saw you putting in that stove of about the same size. Mine burns close to an hour and I can boil eggs in a ceramic pot with a lid on it. You have to put a lid on it or you lose the heat and waste the alcohol which is higher than gasoline by around 5 times.
A lot of places i go can't have a open camp fire . So i still use my Sterno folding stove with
Pathfinder with it
When firewood is wet use alcohol stove with everclear for fuel
Boils in 3 minutes
30° outdoors
I put a SVEA Swedish military burner in a regular sized bushbuddy type stove and got a rolling boil in 4 minutes. Cup was a British Army stainless crusader, filled up 90% to the top.
I have 1 of the old ones, bought it on sale and glad I didn't pay full price, very sooty , hard to light and doesn't want to stay lit. If you want it I'd gladly send it to you. I'll stick with my Trangia.
Funny the original Pathfinder didn’t work and this one still seems to have some issues (that possibly could have been addressed with the manufacturer including instructions on the best set-up).
I bought a reasonable “name” Alcohol stove a while back (can’t remember the name) but the “flame pattern” never happened no matter how I set it up. A stove I made with basic hand tools out of a couple of Coca Cola cans had.a 10x better flame pattern and boiled water twice as fast - maybe I should have marketed that one 🤣. Love your very educational videos.
Hey Ernie! Great video as always. :)
Would be neat to see the carbon monoxide output of these various stoves especially to judge if they're starved for oxygen like you suspected! I've got the Sensorcon digital CO meter and it never leaves my side (at home, in my backpack around town, camping, etc.) and it's been fascinating to watch the readout over the years. Wonder if they'd send you one if you reached out to 'em.
Always remember that the hottest part of a flame is towards the tip. Can't have pot right on top of flame.
I sticking witg my trangia with a Chinese no name fold out handle simmer cap. That's the trangias only shortcoming is not having a fold out handle on the simmer cap
I would guess one reason is STAINLESS STEEL
it just does not conduct heat like brass, aluminum, or titanium
so the alcohol does not get hot enough quick enough
works well with stove stand mulit tool
The old large pathfinder stove was a horrible, and a waste of money. I lost confidence in Pathfinder products. They should give the new stove with a discount if you have the old stove. the old stove took 15 mins to light, and long time to boil water. Thank you for being honest in this video.
I’m here because I was trying to figure out why I was struggling with mine to find someone else that also struggles with it. If nothing else the belly laugh I got from a friend saying “making an ice brew eh?” on a particular dreary morning was worth the investment.
This is an improvement over their original offering, but the Trangia beats it by quite a bit.
I have the stove and multi tool burner. I use it as a last resort. Fire first when we’re no restricted (Arizona) then my iso stove then the pathfinder
Btw, Stainless Steel take a bit longer to heat up than a copper/ brass Alcohol stove
Is it still too big to fit in the Firebox Nano? After the fact that the original was a mediocre spirit burner to begin with, that was my main gripe with it. Thanks for the look, Ernie. I hope you have a good weekend down there.
I have the new pathfinder stove and been trying to use it with with the pathfinder bottle stove stand and nesting cup. Takes 15 min to boil 500ml of water. Would love to see your results. Can’t get heet where I am but. Been using 100% bio-ethanol as fuel. Might try a couple of mods to the stand to see if I get better results.
Another good video. In your opinion what's the best alcohol stove?
You are generous to fault. My takeaway was that it is more finicky than other alcohol stoves in your collection, it's heavy, requires just the right pot stand, and does not perform as well as a Trangia. Sounds like back to the drawing board, Pathfinder (or just sell Trangia stoves).
I wonder if all these alcohol stoves would benefit in burn time and alcohol usage with a solid medium added to the alcohol well to absorb the fuel and lessen evaporation. Hydroponic rockwool perhaps? It's relatively cheap and widely available. Would make a neat experiment.
The new stove does work better than the older one
I used the old pathfinder Alcohol stove with the Solo Stove Lite. no issues. I had issues with the Tatonka Alcohol burner. and the Evernew stainless steel Alcohol burner. They leaked a the fold where the top joins at the cup. They never leaked at the screw top.
The magical spot from the flame to the pot is 4cm
That was redesigned for Pathfinder M40 cook set. I have the older version I've used both and never had a issue.
You know, Earnie tries and had tried over the years to give alcohol stoves a chance. But never does anything ever beat the trangia. And if you have to have titanium, the toaks.
They redesigned it to be shorter so it would work better with their cooking systems. I have the old one and have never had a problem with it, I purchased the new one to work with their canteen cook system but haven't used it yet.
Self-Reliance Outfitters has a so-called 'Stove-Stand Multi-Tool' device that should work well w/ this alcohol stove.
I used to use my jetboil while in training as these stoves weren’t out yet but this is a good stove but I noticed that the flame is huge on this thing like I made one from a can and the flame stays blue and small like a real stove but these types the flame is almost a foot tall for some reason and the flames engulf the pot. Is there a reason why or maybe the fuel?
There is a drop-down titled, *"How to Use The Pathfinder Alcohol Stove,"* and #2 under it says,
_"2. Add _*_at least two ounces_*_ of fuel. We recommend you use denatured alcohol because it’s inexpensive and does the job well."_
I don't know if that would have made a difference, probably not.
I've noticed that every stainless steel burner I have ever used burns cooler, cooks slower, and burns a long while.
Doctor, respectfully, I will stick to my Coleman 530, My Optimus 8R and Optimus 111. There are more BTUs per unit volume of Coleman fuel, there is less waste in terms of canisters. But, I have the major in convenience of being able to see the flame and having to wait for a minute to get a blue (visible) flame.
Original stove worked for me when full but second lighting was a no so long burn time from start was great but relighting didn’t work also mine leaked fuel until I changed sealing for trangia, have never looked at the company since
The flame colour is so orange. I don't think it is burning as hot as Tangier.
Stainless steel is a very bad heat conductor, so I suspect that not enough heat is being conducted from the flame down to the alcohol to evaporate it up to the jets. Brass conducts heat far better. Titanium is also a bad heat conductor, but at least it has a low enough specific heat that it would heat up faster. Maybe if they switched to aluminum or improved internal wicking it wouldn't be so picky on pot stands.
It's hard to tell what the major factor was, because you didn't let the stove cool down before using it for the test, so it was alright primed from the test before; you used a different stand, so you can't tell if it was the stand;, and finally you used a different cup, which could change the amount of time that is required to boil the water.
When you are doing tests, you need to eliminate 1 factor at a time for it to be an accurate test. Otherwise, it's not a fair comparison. Hopefully, next time you take this into account.
If the stainless steel stays hot for a long time, then it will have a large heat capacity and eill also take longer to*get* hot, which might affect how much meths vapour (and thus powe) it produces early on
The flame is yellow/orange meaning it's an inefficient flame. The better stoves burn an efficient blue flame.
I could be wrong but I seem to recall Pathfinder sells a cross (X) pot stand to use with their stoves. Could it be that you would have better results with that type of set-up? Just guessing.
My go-to pot stand for the Trangia is the Bushbox UL. Is this going to fit?
Which is better do reckon the army trangia or pathfinder thanks for u efforts
From South Africa would that starving, not be a better way to simmer by having a second, outer, sliding ring ? I like the catch channel ring round the top. I would like it if it could hold more fuel, with the Trangia I've run out, so I have a second burner, be nice to be able to cook finished without swopping burners
There are times when you just can't make a fire. I carry a few of these in my pack for emergencies when you need a fire, but can't
How odd! I bought the original stove after it got heavily marked down. It works ever time. I assume they went to shorter for more stability and less weight. It definitely isn't an ultra light item. It is really rugged stainless steel. You thousands of times more experience than I do, so I wonder how i can light it and you could not? I did notice it takes a moment to light it. You have to hold your match there for a short time to light it. Could your stove be defective? Did you reach out to the company. I'm sure they would have replaced it.
I got one and thought u could store fuel in it in my backpack. It was leaking so I called customer service and they said its not designed for long term storage of fuel. He said you can fill it up then go to the woods and it shouldn't leak.
Is the screw of better quality? I have the older (and bigger) version and often when I grabbed the simmer ring, the lid went off as well with it :-D (and it had been as much tightened as possible). So the Chinese somehow screwed up the screw on the older version. :-)
1:48
~4.5 x 8.5 centimeters
142 grams weight
134 milliliters capacity.
i think you also had the pot too high above the stove. the pathfinder stand made for the stove doesn't elevate the pot that much. i thought i read/heard in one of Dave's videos that they redesigned the stove to give the proper height when used with their bush pot stand or their swedish mess kit...or both.
EDIT
found the video
ua-cam.com/video/c_w7X2hyVUs/v-deo.html
TBH I think they only redesigned it to fit with their stainless version of the Swedish mess kit, purely my opinion