BG3 | Astarion's vampire bride: A comparison of in-game scenes to Van Richten's Guide to Vampires
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- Опубліковано 19 чер 2024
- The turning process for the player doesn't match the description from Astarion when he describes how he was turned into a vampire by Cazador... begging the question, what kind of vampire is the player after being turned by a romanced ascended Astarion? In this video, I've compared in-game scenes between AA and dark urge with text from Van Richten's Guide to Vampires [freely available online]. Other potential evidence not shown: the player still has their reflection in a mirror, the player doesn't burn in the sun once the tadpoles are destroyed [compare to UA], the player doesn't wake up in a grave [there is a NPC that you can find in a grave in Act 3 - so this capability already exists in-game if the goal was to show similarities between how Astarion was turned and how Astarion turns the player].
Special thanks to the wonderfully supportive AA fandom & all of his dark consorts for the long, nerdy, discussions about Vampires in Baldur's Gate, the Forgotten Realms, D&D broadly, and actual vampire lore [not whatever Twilight is] throughout history! ily!
Song from the video is here:
• Can't Help Falling in ... - Ігри
Good or evil Astarion is always a fan favorite. Neil did such an amazing job voicing him😊
This video illustrates what I believe was the original intention for Ascended Astarion, before the patch 6 kisses travesty dropped. Thank you, for me this is ascended Astarion cannon for the Tavs who choose to give him everything and want eternity with him.
Methinks all this is a little too on the nose for the devs to be oblivious to what they were protraying. 😮 Thank you for the wonderful compilation. 💝
Oh 10000% I think they left all of these clues in there without stating anything explicitly so that people could still freely roleplay their own headcanons for their Tavs/Durges.
@@LegallyBoopy they did it this way cause they couldn't use this book as a part of the lore. Copyright and stuff.
I’m not personally an AA enjoyer, but i think how one views him can DEFINITELY be subjective. It all depends on the story you are telling through your tav, and while I have my own opinions about the morality of letting him ascend, becoming a spawn esc: that’s all they are. opinions! People need to be more open to how others see things, even if u don’t agree. On another note, SUCH A PRETTY TAV!! Aesthetic, but not to the point where they look like every other basic tav with cc I’ve seen. Cool vid :D
Yep, people can enjoy whichever version of Astarion they like, or no version! And they can tell their own Tav/DU RP story with him, thats the entire point of an RPG
This^^
I am personally not a fan of spawn route. But I would never expect people who like it to share my opinions and feelings over it. I can totally see why the route is appealing to others and that's great
No judgment on my end! I like both paths because that means I have more Astarion content in Astarion's Gate 3 😆. But seriously, I can absolutely understand how people may not like one path or another. Thanks!
This is the correct take. Also, both routes are predicted by the writing, which is to say both routes you can take have seeds and hints at them throughout the character’s story. None of those routes is “truer” to who Astarion is, so debating it is pointless anyway. It all comes down to which version of him the player prefers. That’s it.
You did a great job putting all the info together. Also the choice of the soundtracks is just too perfect! I applause!
Who needs heros when you can have the villain 😈 this is great. Thank you for the side by sides with text. Very compelling.
Villains also make better lovers imo. ❤️🔥
@@MizuMing Lovers that are selfish for you, will burn the world for you. And hold dedication above morality...I'm inclined to agree with you >;)
Being the villan yea, being his slave meat puppet nooo 😂 ppl that see is a happy ending are so naive, he himself tells how he was going to use you if you break up with him before getting turned, he would never made you a full vampire and as a demonic vampire he has 0 emotions at that point he becomes pure evil and accepting his power is just being ok I'll be a slave forever now and be a toy until he gets tired and do whatever tf he wants with me 😂 no thanks
@@JuliaWAE He tells you mean and hurtful things 'IF' you break his heart. That is a generally normal reaction, if you've ever deeply emotionally wounded someone. He's just trying to hurt you back in that case.
Otherwise, you and he share a romance several thousands of years long. What makes me say that? We get told by one of the future seeing blood echos in the Murder Trial area. Astarion and his consort die in eachothers arms, thousands of years later, while the stars blink out and Toril is obliterated.
If Astarion had 0 emotions, he wouldn't be so hurt, and he is hurt. You assumed he had no emotions, but you are incorrect. He had an adjustment period. Six months later, he's definitely adjusted. 🤷
@@JuliaWAE gross dude. No. He has massive copium if Tav dumps him. Which, just like when he lies in act 1, the PC can tell him he's spouting bs and they don't believe him. Think it's a bit silly to say "suddenly nothing he says is true until it's his breakup dialogue then he's the perfect example of honesty!" He's hurt so he says hurtful things. Pretty on track for his character.
If you want to RP that he doesn't give Tav his blood and Tav can't see themselves in mirrors or stand in the sun or have the freedoms a spawn can't, you do you! But those things are in the game lol it's silly to just ignore them. People get to RP how they want. That's the whole point of the game. Imagine whatever you want! But don't tell me what to imagine? Lol big silly.
Love this! Finally someone has put almost all the Dark Kiss related info together in one video. I will be referring to this video if I ever end up in a discussion again regarding the topic, A-Astarion's ending deserves more appreciation.😌 Also the way he says "hmmgh...she's a vampire" at the end is so funny (and kinda hot).😂👀
You did such an amazing job compiling everything and linking it all together! Van Richten's guide is a personal favorite for my own DnD campaigns and lore nerdery 🥰 I can't wait to ascend him again in my current playthrough 🥹
I wish the devs stick to this and the "My treasure~", just let us enjoy being villains together 😩
"Together" you mean, you just become his slave and fell for a lie dear, he is fully evil at that point and is playing you he says so himself if you reject him 😂
@@JuliaWAE Vampire brides are not slaves, did you watch the video? Unacended Astarion isn't kind if you try to break up with him at the end of the game either, and it's called self soothing. He convinces himself that he was just going to use you, to decide it was 'what is best' to make it hurt less. Kind of like how he pretends that supporting his goal is the same as not thinking he's good enough AND that he really is happy to be a 'hero' (epilogue dialogue if not romanced) because he just never realized he could murder people and it would be okay if it's the right people (as if the double standard wasn't his issue with heros since act 1, and therefore he always knew it). As a matter of fact, if he is broken up with at the end of the game he will even say he gave up so much 'for you'. That sure sounds like he never actually wanted to stay a spawn. It seems he only does so because he sees that the PC won't help him, and since he can't get acension without that help, he has to pick to either walk away with nothing, or at least try to salavage keeping the person he loves at his side by giving in to what he/she wants, and acting like the person he/she demands that he become.
Now, I would not assert that's true. I think Astarion can be happy with either end (depending on how it's played out), but let's just be clear, this 'I'm going to be an a** and rain on your parade' nonsense can go both ways with equally valid points.
i never realized how close Astarion looks to Neil himself, the haircut definitely brought it out. ive preferred spawn route, but this definitely makes it more intriguing. ill try this in a future durge run. i interpret it as manipulation to keep tav close, but carefully researched so hed get it right. he still has an underlying deep love for tav, but its shrouded by his vampirism, leading him to be manipulative and feel the need to be secretive in order to keep tav. his love becoming warped and possessive and him needing tav because of that deep possessive urge. he made tav a bride rather than a spawn because if tav died hed want to feel the pain of their loss. just my interpretation btw, i like the darker interpretations of AA personally and having the bride aspect rather than him forcing a spawn to be with him sweetens it for me. ultimately ill do spawn runs more but ill feel better about doing AA with this info.
Astarion with that alternative haircut… nnngh I can’t wait to get the mod tools on ps5, it’s gonna be WILD!!
I love Ascended Astarion. He's got that old school Disney villain vibe. 😄
I love him so much. I hate that I can't hear all the banter with AA and certain companions about my character being turned 😭 it doesn't work for xbox for some reason. I've run all over the place with the ones that are supposed to have dialog and nothing 😢 love this sooo much btw❤ thanks for this awesome vid😊
yeah, the banter not triggering is :( same as the Minsc / AA dialogue
sadly, a lot of the Act 3 banter is bugged on PC, too. It's all in the game files though, so hopefully the next update will fix it!
@@RPG_NoMeDiga there's updates still?
@@violetgomez3740 Patch 7 [coming in September], in addition to the new content and mod support, there will hopefully be bug fixes.
I love the hand holding so much 😢
Thank you so much for this beautiful video! ❤ Perfect job - you pulled together all of Astarion's lines and plot points that prove the "vampire bride" theory. The song you chose fits our story so wonderfully, and the final shots speak volumes too. 💕Thank you!!! 💯
Your Tav/Durge and Astarion are both deliciously gorgeous~
It's such a great research, I just can physically feel how much work is behind this vid. And yes, AA loves Tav/Durge, objectively, period. Everyone sees what they want to to see (as e.g. people in Middleages seriously thought that beaver is an art of fish), but there are some things wich actually just need a little more attention to detail to see them for what they really are. AA's love to the protagonist is one of them.
Love Astarion both SA and AA. And also love the music!
the Bishop of Quebec approached his superiors in the Church and asked whether his flock would be permitted to eat beaver meat on Fridays during Lent, despite the fact that meat-eating was forbidden. Since the semi-aquatic rodent was a skilled swimmer, the Church declared that the beaver was a fish. I wouldn´t say they seriously thought this, just wanted to find some loophole to eat meat on fridays as well. This also reminds me of "Herrgottsbescheißerle" a kind of swabian ravioli, they were filled with a lot of herbs, so it´s very green, but actually has meat in them. The name basically translates to "God screw over" which is funny af.
@@Tropicanine it's a total offtop of my original post, but in my eyes, the reason, that beaver was declaired fish and was allowed to be eaten for his talents in swimming, because people wanted to cheat on the system they themselves created upon them, doesn't make it better.
The name of the raviolli is funny, and something tells me, in times it was invented, not the best meat was used for it.
Your tav is so pretty!! I love all the information on this video. It is to show how well written and acted this character is.
The traditional hairstyle suits him better. With a fashionable hairstyle, he is too big-eared
This is a really excellent video essay. I've watched it a few times now pausing it to read all the information you provided. Thanks for widening my understanding of dnd vampire lore ✅
Thank you, this was very interesting. You did a wonderful job.
Excellent work! ❣💫❤🔥
This video's quality is truly amazing!
Really well done!😍
I love this so much info that i wanted to know so bad but could never find! Thank you! Also your tav is so gorgeous!!!! ❤🥰
Thank you for this video! :)
that hair is gorgeous
You mean, we got MARRIED?! 😂❤
yes! [there's enough info there to HC it at least ] now, you should ascend him again and enjoy your honeymoon with a side of world domination!!😇
Your character so pretty!
So many people keep saying 'No because it wasn't written in a book I could find and read about in game' or 'That's from an old book, if it's not newly and freshly printed then it doesn't count, I can't hear you'. 🙄
Thank you!
Kind of related to your point, I often wonder how much of the "Astarion discourse" is actually a result of there not being more in-game lore and a general unfamiliarity with vampires within the fandom? Sometimes it seems as though people aren't even aware of the fact that he's undead and classified as a monster tbh.
@@RPG_NoMeDiga I remember one guy from about 4 months ago arguing his head off, because he was adamant that the bride HAD to bite Astarion and he needed to succeed on a 18 Strength check to get her off of him. He completely ignored the fact that an Ascendant Vampire was a whole new creature with rules we didn't know yet, because it was a Larian homebrew. You can still be on the same page, but get wildly different reactions to the same information. 😅
Another thing that I see over and over is people talking about Astarion's humanity, but forgetting he has never BEEN human. I get that it's *our* only frame of reference personally, but there is a lot on the subject of elves available for them to see how they may be correct/incorrect on certain topics. I mean humans were literally snapped into existence, but elves- they were literally born from the fallen blood of a god. We aren't the same type of creature, we are different on so many levels, so human-centric focus is silly as far as I think about it. 😅
@@MizuMing jajaja, oh... yeah, you're right. I think many of us are saying, "this is possibly where the idea came from" and others are saying, "well, if it's not identically created in the game, then it can't be the case" while ignoring all of the similarities. It's this desire to play the "right" way and get the "right" ending and pick the "right" dialogue options that I find so bizarre. It's not a standardized test, there are no "perfect scores", the "goal" is to have fun. Then again, they even ignore the in-game evidence. He describes how to create a "true vampire" and people ignore that, too. Even though Astarion repeats multiple times that the player has had his blood and at the end of the game, after the tadpoles are destroyed, a vampire player doesn't catch on fire unlike UA.
Yes, very good point! It's always fun to dive into lore, but somehow many people are armchair diagnosing and incorrectly using mental health terminology to describe behavior that can be summed up as "vampire". For example, instead of an interesting discussion on "would it be possible to dissolve the creator/creation bond" between AA and his spawn, the conversation is instead "you can't break up with him, this is evidence of xyz in real life." No, it's evidence that you have two vampires, one that created the other, and it is not unusual in any vampire lore for vampires to not dissolve a blood-bond willingly/easily. And a lot of the information is freely available online, all they have to do is google it, lol.
@@RPG_NoMeDiga Right, they often see it as 'not 1 to 1' so it must be wrong. Right also in that it's not a standardized test, it's a personal journey for your character, yourself and the relationships that you fostered along the way in game, but for some reason if you don't do it exactly like X individual did it, then you 'failed' or got the 'bad' endings. That's not true in the slightest! 🙅
As of patch 7, we'll cross over 17,000 variant endings. They aren't all good and they aren't all bad. Calling my ending bad because I didn't do what you did is silly and vice versa. 🤷
If you are satisfied at the end of the day, that's all that matters, that's all that *should* matter. The random hate from parts of the community and even some Larian staff is baffling. There was someone working on Gale animations talking about the AA kisses we got back in February, they said the most baffling thing I think. The kiss animations needed to be made for the 'Majority'. The majority of who? Players? Of 1 million players, over 80% aren't going to see said kisses! Only the people going out of their way to Ascend Astarion and romance him at the same time will likely see it, and of the Astarion community, those who really like AA are around 20% give or take, so why the majority? Only a minority of dedicated people will reach that point and most of us hate the animations. 👀
Gawd~ yes the armchair diagnosis is crazy. Then you have people telling you to 'go get therapy' or get mad at you for not having trauma, so you CAN'T possibly understand something. 🙄
@@MizuMing Yes, agreed, I hear "bad ending" and think about Mass Effect 3 where the original endings were all the same, except highlighted either red, blue, or green. But, if each person is able to craft a story that makes sense for their character, then, the ending was good for that story that they created.
I agree, somehow the passion of some parts of the fanbase has turned into, well, hate, as you've mentioned. Across nearly all socials I have witnessed personal attacks, and insults, and even doxxing of fans who dare mention that they enjoy AA without 100 caveats attached. How very peculiar that it's impossible to create a Venn Diagram between the fanbase members who are the loudest about the "AA bad ending" and those who feel entitled to follow people across social media and tell them that their RP is wrong, because it is simply a circle. In what universe does someone think it's okay to force a stranger to publicly disclose trauma in order to have a conversation about a video game character??? And why, are the loudest people who want to engage in trauma competitions so completely devoid of empathy towards the very real people they're engaging in discussion with?
re: the animations, I hadn't heard about that, but I'm not really surprised. I was on my first blind playthrough as the Patch 6 changes happened and yeah, I don't have any positive comments so it's better to just have no comments, jajaja. Only to say, I do hope the Patch 7 changes will reflect whoever the companions were designed to be initially as opposed to being more fan-service for the "majority". Like, I really hope Larian sticks to their original vision and let modders focus on fan-service, lol.
Absolutely love how you compiled dark kiss here! I’m not a fan of AA but I’ve owned Dark Kiss for a long time now and did a run with it and did a deep dive so I always thought Tav was a bride!!!
If / when someone has questions about it I’ll just send them to this video 😂
In other news does anyone know what mod pack Astarion’s long ears and the short haircut and clothes are from? I’m in love with the look
His race is high-elf; those are his default ears!
The short hair mod:
www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/1420
Ok, that's it, second playthrough Astarion will ascend and Dark Urge will accept Bhaal. Though I kinda want to try AA and Durge that resisted Bhaal (or the other way around).
You can do AA & resist Durge now, and wait for AA & accept Durge when the new evil endings drop in September!
@@Esiaa AA and resist Durge is my favorite pairing!!! If you like a little wicked, dark love while taking your power back >;) AA and the game itself has some very sweet dialogue for it
@@wolficer-66 It's a good pairing for sure. I'd prefer AA and accept Durge... but Bhaal's stupid ultimatum gets in the way when I've managed to get other new companion endings. Though, seeing the exchange between the two of them when becoming the Absolute is quite satisfying for me. No offense to Minty, but it feels so much more... right with AA.
Your Tav is so pretty I literally gasped. I also never realized how big Astarion's ears are😂 They're cute though.
This is why I love ascended Astarion, thank you for putting this together is such a beautiful package. I hope more people can see this and hopefully be swayed to the dark side. ❤😊
Bravo 👏🏻
I don't get why people read too harsh on ascended Astarion. In general for a power drunk vampire he is not even that bad to you :D Maybe it's because I'm too familiar with vampire nature (although I'm more familiar with WoD vampires), no matter spawn or true vampire, vampires are always about power and manipulation. As a spawn Asterion lover you take advantage of his fears and vulnerability to keep him this tame, you don't know what would become of him if he overcomes these disadvantages one day. It's also obvious that AA is full of shit most of the time and you'll need your creator desperately as a newly turned vampire anyway. I'm tired of seeing people policing around about AA, what they expect from him is completely out of his nature. At the end of the day it's literally an RPG, it's all about fantasy whether it's bad or good. Thank you for the video it was quite enlightening actually!
Completely agree 👍 ❤ AA is evil, but not so bad))
I mean, Larian openly notes that they put huge emphasis on being lore accurate n shit, and they genuinely were. The method at which they slowly paint the picture until the crescendo is perfect. Gotta say though, the updated more fearful kisses with your high approval astarion one all seem kinda... out of the general vibe? Like, by that point you both have already established the relationship, and even yes if he manipulates you up to that point, why would your tav ever be proper afraid? He's certainly ominous, and some of his more vicious expressions fit well for AA when he kisses tav, but it really didnt make sense why even if tav is meant to be a spawn and not a bride despite being step by step made into a bride D&D lore wise... why would the tav be terrified and not enticed?
It really doesn't make much sense as the player literally has the option of making it so their character finds enjoyment in pain.
In the scene where Astarion turns the player into a vampire, they can tell him to either be gentle or to make it hurt. The dev notes for that scene state that the pc is enjoying it in both scenarios yet they forced frightened/angry expressions for these new kisses.
Spawn Astarion got dragged through the mud too apparently as from what I've seen he only has one new kiss and the angle from which it's shown isn't the best.
It feels like the animators for the kisses were biased against Astarion in spite of his popularity as a character.
omg drop the mod list for him, I am in LOVE
omg I love your Tav! What are your Mods? Also brilliant video :)
thank you! I have so many of them, jajaja! Is there any mod[s] in particular?
me encantó!
what mod hair is your durge using at 2:21?? I've been trying to look for it on nexus but I cant find it 😭
What is the mod for the short hair? I've seen it before, it's so perfect for him. ❤
www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/1420
What is the mod for the open chest ruby dragon jacket?
Это ВЕЛИКОЛЕПНО!
Outfit: www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/6919
Dyes: www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/9094
@@RPG_NoMeDiga Благодарю :3
What mod gets you that alternate hair for him? For the life of me I cannot find it on Nexusmods lol
www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/1420
@@RPG_NoMeDiga Ah, I see, you did something manually in the codes yourself to add that style to Astarion, yeah? I appreciate the link though, just not sure how to take it from there to Astarion's head lol
@@vicariousxiv2436 Oooh, I understand, you don't have to manually set it in the code [you can if you want].
Alternatively, you can use this: www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/899
That mod allows you to edit the appearance of any Origin character [and yourself]. You do need to have the script extender installed for it to work. Let me know if you have any other questions!
@@RPG_NoMeDiga Ah, interesting! I have individual mods changing the hair of all of the companions (except Karlach, have a mod that gives her facial scars instead) but could never find one I liked for Astarion, I never thought about mods that just let you customize them all though lol Thanks for the info!
Which mod are Astarion Clothes from 2:05 ? Its soo cool :0
www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/9274
huh. it is interesting to know that you are not Astarion's slave when he makes you a spawn. and you're not really a spawn.
where did you get or wich mod did you used for the earrings in 1:25 ?
www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/5317
@@RPG_NoMeDiga thank you so much (ﾉ◕ヮ◕)ﾉ*.✧
Hair mod name? Making notes for when console mod support comes out
I'm not sure which one you're asking about, but the short hair on him is this mod:
www.nexusmods.com/baldursgate3/mods/1420
@@RPG_NoMeDiga thank you very much!
I ❤ Astarion but i HATE the short hair n the bowling shirt look. Same face, same voice but totally different vibe. If he looked like this from the start i woukdve romanced Wyll or Gale or even Shadowheart.
normal astarion : Oh God, he's hot
ascended astarion : *wet myself*
Cool video. If only 15yo tiktokers spawning "media literacy is dead" videos could actually read and process information 😢
Im sorry but the shorter hairstyle is horrendous on him imo 😅
Fr I can’t look at it 🤣
it's better than the long hair mods that get rid of his beautiful curls💔
@@princessmiaxo hmm idk those are just as bad imo. The only hairstyle I've seen that looks good if not even better than the curls in the mid length slicked back hair, that one does things to me 😩
Consort, beloved, right hand
The only truth and the word he meant but "forgot" to mention is slave, he is not a vampire he is a demonic creature made by a huge murder ritual, none of the vampire lore serves him he is just an fully evil monster at that point
You dont become a full vampire ans you never will he doesn't care at that point you're just a spawn meat puppet until he gets tired of you 😂 bride 😂 sure
I love the head canons other people spend a lot of time coming up with. Not my thing to spend hours thinking about, but, its always fun to hear.
Vampires are monsters in D&D. They are described in the monster manual. He is ALWAYS a monster.
Astarion is ALWAYS evil-aligned. Astarion is never good-aligned as good-aligned characters do not derive enjoyment from harming people. In fact, epilogue UA is still discussing murder ["as long as you kill the right people"] while AA is "charming dignitaries up and down the sword coast".
If you're into RP'ing as a "meat puppet" or "slave", I'm glad you've found a way to connect with the source material that brings you enjoyment. I try not to kink-shame! Happy gaming!
He also shared some of his blood with his consort which normal spawn don't get. Doing so would apparently protect them from the sun the same as Astarion along with potentially granting them other immunities. There isn't enough information about Ascendant vampires to really make a definitive statement about their lives after the game ends that isn't just fan speculation.
The pc might not be a true vampire but I don't really mind. Not to be sympathetic to the monster, but Cazador himself was miserable even as a true vampire which is the entire reason he wanted to perform the ritual.
If one believes the theory that Astarion made the player his vampire bride/groom then that is actually a better outcome as they would share the benefits of the ritual. Also according to the lore involving vampire brides, they keep their free will from the start and share a telepathic and life bond with their creator. This is potentially dangerous for both the vampire lord and his bride as if one suffers damage/is destroyed the other will be affected. Why would Astarion risk something like that unless he genuinely loved the pc?
I never got it for my own character as I made it so she was completely faithful to Astarion the whole game but there is a line from Astarion where if the pc sleeps with a certain incubus he says "Gods. Though I've become untouchable, my precious treasure has been violated still." He then shows sympathy about the pc having their body being used by someone else. This makes me think he actually doesn't want to control his consort if he is even able to.
These are just some observations I made about his character after his ascension. If you want to believe he is a completely horrid monster then go right ahead. I'm not denying that he is evil, but I certainly don't think he is as terrible as those with similar opinions as you make him out to be.
@@britt6184 and "And you will drink mine. I cant wait to taste your lips after you have tasted me"
Tav having freewill is pretty definitely debunked by picking dialogue options that challenge ascended Astarion. Telling him that you want to go your separate ways at the end of the game will have him laughing and reminding you that without the tadpole’s protection, you are his to control. It’s a pretty ironic fate considering his story was about ensuring his own freedom once the tadpoles are gone.
At the party, you can ask when he’ll free you and he’ll be annoyed as if you’re throwing some sort of tantrum.
And going a bit off topic, but to show he has fallen from being our consent king, there’s a disturbing dialogue if you refuse to become his spawn. The next day, if you pick the right dialogue options, he’ll say that he can do anything he wants. And that he should have turned you into a spawn just to prove that he could. There is no doubt in my mind that regardless of how submissive Tav is, Astarion will eventually cross their boundaries. Sure, you are his love. But above all, he needs to prove that you are *his.*
Dude just let people enjoy what they enjoy. Not everyone is going to judge an entire romance path based off of a few copium breakup lines.
Tav has free will. He directly shows that by asking what they want. If Tav is his spawn and they break up with him, he never controls them to come back. And when you try to dump him in the epilogue, he never compels Tav. Just denies them. He's an evil vampire. He's not going to give Tav a daisy. Can't break up with Minthara then either.
There's dialogue options for each way someone wants to RP. That's what RP games do. If you want to RP a victim you can. If you don't want to, the game has dialogue for that too.
Unless you want to say we all have to take every dialogue option as canon. In which case, we've all broken up with him, he's both spawn and ascended, and we all forced him to feed on Araj.
I really wish people would stop busting in Kool aid man style to repeat the same three talking points on why players can't have fun their own way.
Here, I’m presenting a specific available path and how that relates to some D&D lore. Your comments are about an alternative path, one that is mutually exclusive of the one I’ve referenced as they cannot both occur at the same time. i.e., for the path I’ve chosen to discuss they’re not applicable.
In a game that has a multi-branching narrative, not all of the choices are valid all at once. They represent an option, a choice, if you will, as to how you would like that game to play out in your own imagination. If someone IRL asks how your day is going, you can reply positively "it's going well" or negatively "it was going better until you arrived" both will alter the direction the conversation then takes. It's the same in the game - this isn't a novel concept.
To be clear, if your enjoyment of the game ultimately comes from RP'ing as arguing and fighting with your LI and being unhappy after the game ends, you should absolutely do that! However, as someone who appears to care greatly about consent and boundaries, certainly your expectation could not be that as an adult player of this game, I must consider your selected RP options and the "disturbing" scenarios that you've imagined for yourself, as a part of my own personal RP on my single-player game, on my computer, in my own home? That wouldn’t be very cash-money of you. It would, however, be a curious display of self-righteous entitlement, and you would never dream of doing that, would you? Happy Gaming!!!
I do enjoy hearing other peoples takes on lines. It is good to see how other people hear the same deliveries and interpret them.
@@wolficer-66 My initial comment was a bit rambly, so let me try again so I can be more concise
- When ascended Astarion turns Tav, it is with the intent of making them a spawn he can compel. This is why you can't break up with him after the tadpoles are destroyed.
- Ascended Astarion has an unhealthy view on love and power. He's able to put up a mask it if you never challenge his authority, but that doesn't make these thoughts any less canon. If you never trigger Astarion's bite scene, that doesn't mean he's unwilling to bite his companions, just that the opportunity never arose.
I like to think the other lines are for immersion purposes for whatever people want to see or for how they interpret things it’s all about how everyone sees their own play through if people see their tav as a slave that is what they will be it’s all about choice and each play through