Because it's sounds jazzy, i used this progression almost in every gigs i've played. If you want a pop song to sound a little bit jazzy, than using this progression is a must.
I've always called this the "just the two of us" progression or VI v i (in the relative minor). It and its variations are extremely popular and I was wondering why nobody ever talked about it.
@@jalock It's not talked about enough in the English sphere. But if you follow Japanese music tube I've seen good coverage by this one channel I follow on the Just the Two of Us progression (and others... not just the Royal Road... he is clearly following the English side too, because he hits up on popular topics like the Blackadder chord from a while back). This one video (ua-cam.com/video/RdQC3A8RqPc/v-deo.html ) goes over the top five modern progressions, and has a chart at the start to show their primary eras... starting with the Komuro progression in the 90s (peak-TK), the Canon in the 00s, the Royal Road in the 10s (and also uses the vertical to show that that was more centered in the anime sphere), and Just the Two of Us recently (he has other videos on it discussing things like the Major vs Minor uses). The Pop Punk runs across the top through the entire period.
I'm away working in a foreign country and your explanation makes me miss home so much I cried as it's just so beautiful. That 1-chord gives me hope that one day I'll be home to see my family again
Easier to think of the third chord of the progression, the "vi chord" as you call it, as the i. All of these songs are in that minor key. Original is VI-V-i, then a ii-V-I based on the relative major (the VI in our original key) which loops it around. It's a modulation which is common in jazz. So you arrive at the i, then the ii-V pulls you away to the relative major. Those Japanese examples follow that, and the second chord is a dominant seventh chord (usually with a #9), not a minor. I always find that with music theory, the simplest analysis (and the one that conforms most to what is traditional and familiar) is best, because when people write songs they are usually influenced by the same familiar chord motions. Also it is the "Just The Two of Us" progression. That is where it originally came from, also "My Boo" and "Body Party". That's where JPOP and KPOP got it in the first place- they pulled from Jazz and R&B.
Haha finally I see a video about this chord progression. It's such a satisfying one to use. I noticed this chord progression in many many songs from the past few years as well and wondered why there was basically nothing online about it. The chord progression however actually has a major III chord instead of an IIIm.
Love the video and music! Here's a dumb and quick breakdown for anyone curious: Dominant Chord: Major triad + minor 7th, root note = V of the key. (e.g., Key is C Major, Dominant of C is G7) Secondary Dominant: Same, but root not =/= V of the key (e.g., Key is C Major, Secondary Dominant of F is C7). How to add a Secondary Dominant to Am in F-Am-Gm-C7 (Key of C Major): 1. Find Am's dominant: E7. 2. Insert it before Am. 3. Result: F-E7-Am-Gm-C7 (IV-III7-vi-v-I7). A dominant chord has a minor 7th because its linked to the Mixolydian Mode (but that's for another day 😁). Would love to see you make a video on "Anticipation", when the first beat of the a measure is placed on the "and" of the 4th beat of the measure before it (a staple in japanese music).
Great video!! If i could give one suggestion, is that you clarify the 'sevens' in the chords - the v7 and the I7-, I know you have them explained in the video, but the visual makes it easier to "anticipate it"
Instead of thinking of it as minor V to the I turnaround, I like to think of it as a modulated in ii-V-I in the key of the IV. u can even play I as a dominant chord to for a stronger pull back to the IV.
This. Having the minor third in the v (which would be the natural seventh of the major scale), it lingers into what he refers to as the I, making it effectively a dominant transition into the IV. This whole thing is much easier understood in the key of IV with the only non-diatonic being the second chord (it would now be a minor seventh instead of a minor seventh flat five). But outside of that aberration it'll be a very simple and natural progression from root to root (including the mandatory ii-V-I). tl;dr - he plays a Gm just before the C, so it reads like a C7 which wants to return to the F. The whole thing is really in Fmaj, not in Cmaj.
I don't know why people are always so obsessed with fitting music that is not CPP music into CPP. It's a Mixolydian progression, no need to complicate it. Many rock and r&b songs are in Mixolydian, which these jrock songs are clearly drawing from.
I was thinking the same thing. The "IV" sounds more tonic than the "I" to me, and that "v - I - IV" sounds a lot like a "ii - V - I" to me. Rewriting it this way, it becomes: I - vii - iii - ii - V - I In this way of writing it, the vii chord establishes a Lydian sound by having a sharp 4 in it, which is then contradicted when the ii chord uses a normal 4. Even though this ii chord is just from a normal major (Ionian) scale, it still makes sense that this ii is the chord where it starts to sound jazzy, because, up until that point, we were in only one diatonic mode (Lydian), and this is the first chord that makes it so the progression can't fit into a single diatonic scale. It actually makes even more sense that it suddenly sounds "jazzy" instead of just chromatic, because ii - V - I is a staple of jazz, especially ii - V - I with some kind of twist to it. The twist in this case is that it emphasizes that first chord (which would be a IV in a normal major scale) as the root, proving that the progression isn't just in a normal major scale. Alternatively, you could say that it's not clear the first chord is the tonic until they do a ii - V - I to it, although I actually think the first chord played always has some feeling of being the tonic as long as it's consonant.
I loved this video, fairly interesting!! As an european musician I am not familiar with what makes music from Japan sound japanese, and now I'm even more curious. Keep doing videos like this one
Thanks man! Just uploaded a new video today on iconic Japanese guitar riffs: ua-cam.com/video/Z8hlANFfQ7U/v-deo.htmlsi=nIZRhNLfA-Pe-BUz Check it out if you're interested and uploading weekly so come back next week too!
I love this progression and hear it a lot in Japanese music specifically. It has so much emotion and I just love to hear and also play it. Also a lot of the time I hear the iii and a III (with the added 7) acting as a secondary dominant to the vi, which I think makes the journey from the 3 to the 6 feel so much more emotional, making it feel like it’s reached a home that’s just more unfulfilled than anything. Great vid tho!
Yup what i've noticed is that a lot of times they'd do the vanilla versions (3 minor and without 7th) then the second time around they'd do the 3 major with added 7 for emphasis. Super cool run
Congratulations on going full time with music and having a channel like this to test yourself and reach out to musicians!! That's how I interpret your channel at least. I want to be on that side one day with my art and music.
Thanks man! I'm not completely full time yet since I still have a part-time job but definitely been good having more time for this channel and music. And totally encourage anyone to pursue their art more since I want more companions haha
I appreciated the insight on the qualities of each chord individually, but I'm a bit surprised that you didn't mention secondary dominants at all. Having taken music theory classes in college and also having learned a ton of jazz progressions, I quickly noticed that the "I" chord is almost always a dominant 7th chord in this progression, which is indicative that it could actually be considered a secondary dominant of IV (V7/IV). That is, if we're in C, then the C7 pivots back to F since it's the V7 chord in the key of F. This is actually accentuated by the "minor v" chord preceding it, because then you can actually consider it as a ii chord in the key of IV. Thus, the last two chords of the progression are a "ii-V7" in the key of IV, which is an *incredibly* common progression in jazz (think of the song Misty, which does it immediately after establishing the I). This also explains why "I" doesn't feel like home at all, because it just wants to go back to IV. It's such a great way to create a loop that pulls harder than most others.
Haha thanks man. Japan is my other big passion so really wanted to make a video on Japanese music. Currently editing my next video and about to post it in like half an hour so stay tuned...
I don't often watch those type of videos about progressions and other common structural points of riffs (and it appears I maybe really should watch more), but hearing you describe what you feel playing those chords made me feel it too, and it was so comfy and nice... I should definetely pay more attention to what I feel when I make art
A cool trick is to make the iii into a dominant 7 chord. Which you may notice in some examples of this chord progression. While you're at it, if you want, you could even make all the minor chords into dominant 7 chords or even pick and choose which ones you want as such. Play the F as a Fmaj7 or an F6. Mess around with the extensions and chord qualities and you can come up with a totally different sound.
They all use the major III, not minor iii. Which is what "Just the two of us" also does. But still, you explained very well what the progression does and why it works!
Thanks man! I think major 3 definitely makes it sound jazzier but in J-Pop I hear both and many times hear them playing a minor 3 first the first time around, then the second time doing the major 3 for emphasis
I interpret these chords completely differently. The starting IV is what I hear as the tonic, making the progression a I-vii-iii-ii-V which leads back to I. It ends in a ii-V-I progression (a common jazz progression) which is why the ii7 works there, given ii7-V-I is just a IV/2-V-I. And there are other examples where I hear entirely different chord progressions, for example at 4:37, I hear bVII-V-i-bIII (D-Db-Gbm-A). An extremely common classical chord progression in minor keys. The example after that, I actually hear the exact same thing, but without the bIII (what you call the I). Music theory can be strange like that sometimes.
Yea totally fair. Some others commented the same. On most Japanese sites I see it written as 4-3-6-5-1 and I suspect that's cause' in a Japanese song the progression is usually coupled with other progressions before and after this in the key of the "1" chord
That v I sounds more like a ii V to the IV to me, and I see the iii there more as a (minor) v to the vi. So to me the "home" chords in the progression would be the IV and the vi, the rest of the chords are there just to lead to them.
Yup. Good point. Following the v I, it’s common to resolve to the iv like the Marty Friedman progression here: ua-cam.com/video/7Saoay8Ki2g/v-deo.htmlsi=-Cg43brx54MTOoNz&t=20
I think this could be said to be in A minor. If we try to say it is in F major how would we describe the vii? (Em). Because of this difficulty someone could decide it is in C major. I think all these are true because composing a chord progression is a process. As they are all related i think that the rhythmic drive is what will name the center. F is indeed the final.
@@marcelotai1055 To me even if the F chord is the first one and the one the secondary ii V is resolving to, the key is still C major, just that the C chord never actually shows up properly as a tonic, it's being used as a secondary dominant and using it as a secondary dominant to the IV gives the progression a permanent sense of movement, perfect for a loop progression.
Another thing about the minor v is that it (at least to me) sounds like a ii-V-I leading back to the IV chord (instead of the I), since the flat 3 of the minor v becomes a flat 7 in the I chord
duuuude i’m so glad you made this video talking about this chord progression, i produce jpop/jrock/anime beats and sometimes make videos talking about how I do it, and I always bring up the 4 5 6 (IV V VI) chords and how they’re a staple of Japanese music, but not really knowing why. This video helped me better my understanding of these chords and why I hear it so much in Japanese music, thank you so much 🙏🙏 that’s a sub from me to you!
As others have already said, Vm - I - IV is just a II-V of IV, and for the examples where we could hear it, IIIm is actually III (V of VIm), so if we're in major we really we have ||: IV | (V) of | VIm | (II V) of IV :|| However, we're much more likely in the relative minor (no relative major tonic chord, and the melodies are almost always in minor or supporting the relative minor tonic), where the aforementioned VIm is actually the tonic. Recontextualising, ||: bVI | V | Im | (II V) of :|| That's the Just the Two of Us progression. So, nothing new.
Most music tutorials are hard to follow or become too much to handle quickly... but this was the perfect amount of info presented in a super easy way to understand and internalize. Subed and saved the video for my next playing and learning session.
I think this also works because the v - I back to IV is like doing a 2 -5 -1 in the key of the IV chord. It's also almost the same as in Joe Hisaishi's One Summer's Day at 1:05 (IV - V - vi - v - I - IV)
I like to sometimes add a chromatic passing chord between the vi and v- chord. I'm glad people are talking about this progression again, because I remember hearing it in some anisongs back in 2018 and in jazz standards it was used to modulate to the IV chord in the bridge. J-pop tends to use it for a quick modulation though since the IV chord gives a sense of longing(imo) especially if you include the #11 of the chord in the melody.
Great points yea. In J-Pop they also occasionally add a chromatic passing chord between the vi and v and I just love the resolution to the IV chord. Sense of longing is a great way to put it
This video was very helpful from a music theory point of view - how you broke down the chords and what they represented in the progression. Honestly not that specific about japanse music, can you do some music theory tuts?
I'll definitely consider it! Not the biggest music theory expert but if it's a topic I"m interested in like Japanese music, I'd be willing to do some research and make a video on it
as someone who doesnt much knowledge in music theory but mostly listen to japanese music, this progression gives a bit new tension and flavour as if you listen to jpop for the first time coming from the western music. so since our ear used to hear 4536 it becomes so dominant(like 1564) that hearing this progression pulls you back to the classic japanese music cliche where they always find ways to spice their chord progressions. atleast thats why i understandt it.
Yea this cool Japanese video going over popular J-Pop progressions throughout the years calls it the "Just the Two of Us" progression too lol ua-cam.com/video/RdQC3A8RqPc/v-deo.htmlsi=2EQnlpK85sFOirrH&t=95
Thank you for demystifying these chord progressions for me. I would hear these wonderfully complex songs at the end of anime videos and shake my head wondering what the heck was going on music theory-wise.
I've noticed that lyrically, some japanese songs express themes or messages through some sort of narrative. But with the way you describe the meaning of each chord in this progression, it seems like even the chords of j pop/j rock contribute to that narrative, through emotive moods and tones!
For sure. Marty Friedman from Megadeth pointed out how Western pop tends to repeat the same four chords in a progression whereas J-pop progressions are usually way longer, almost like a journey/story
Yeah, some comments here are saying the chord progression sounds "jazzy" and I agree. I've always thought this particular progression was ultimately descended from "Bird Changes" or the jazz blues chord progression used by Charlie Parker on songs like Confirmation.
Ahh that's a great song. And yea, super borrowed from jazz for sure. In this video I go more in-depth into the jazz tendencies of J-pop: ua-cam.com/video/7Saoay8Ki2g/v-deo.html
0:47 What key/ chords are you thinking of here? I'm thinking Dbmaj7 -> C7 -> Fmin7 -> Emin7 -> Ebmin7. You labeled a dominant 7th as a minor chord (what you called the iii) and a minor 7 chord as tonic major (I). Those last three chords are just a minor7 shape moving down chromatically (you can hear by the chromatic baseline)
to me it sounds very clear that the tonic chord is the first one, both harmonically and rhythmicly. So yeah, its just a : I - vii - iii - ii - V with the vii being some kind of modal interchange or something
So, few things to add: Just the two of us doesn't exaclty use the same progression. Instead of IV iii vi v I, it uses IV III7 vi v# v I7. Pretty close tho, but it is important to aknowledge those minor 7ths on the chords, aswll in the progression you're using, since the C at the end is a C7. The progression in general works well due other hidden things, such as the movements between grades are considered strong (movements between grades are classified as weak, strong, and very strong. Weak when it's a 3rd or 5th way up, strong when it's a 4th or 6th up, and very strong when it's a 2nd or 7th up. If we position in C major just to show an example, F e a g C7, the movements are 2nd up, 4th up, 7th up and 4th up) which enhance the sound of the progression. Also little details like C7 being the secondary dominant of F (and g being the ii, allowing for a ii-V7-I). It's a very good take on the topic, great video.
@@jalock talking about the feelings the chords caused is the best of takes tho! The "not feeling at home" quote for example with the C7 and other things, it probably is the best way to approach it for a video and explain it to an audience that may not be familiar with theory but can listen and relate to the topic you're showing.
This reminds me of that Adam Neely vid and his exploration into J-Pop and it being inspired by American blues. There is always an inherent nostalgia or sadness in Japanese popular music that I have always found refreshing.
I think it would be more accurate to say the progression is I vii iii ii V7 In this specific chord progression, the first chord sounds like the tonic, not the subdominant. The only reason why it could be justified that the first chord is the subdominant is because of the vii chord, which would indicate that it’s the iii following the IV from a strictly major/ionian perspective. I think that’s inaccurate, because the supposed I in your version IV iii vi v I has a dominant function to restart the chord progression. I think it would be important to indicate that the last chord will most likely always have the flat seven included, making it a dominant seven chord. The last two chords in the progression are unabashedly a two five, which makes sense given JPop’s borrowing of jazz idioms. I think vii is purely just modal interchange, borrowing from parallel Lydian, which sets us up to feel surprised by the two five turnaround, as you don’t expect to hear the natural four as opposed to expecting the sharp four that’s present in the vii. Also side note, while this chord progression rings very true to “Just the Two of Us” as it follows the same inherent bass motion, there are stark differences, with the second chord acting as the dominant in the progression, meaning that “Just the Two of Us” would actually be bVI V7 i bvii bIII7 bVI V7 i I’m omitting the chromatic passing chord between the i and bvii and upper extensions because I’m showing basic harmonic motion to show the similarities but also point out how it functions in a completely different modality/tonality. You could say that “Just the Two of Us” is the relative minor version of the chord progression in question here if the chord progression in question was as you portrayed (with the first chord being subdominant) which explains why they sound very very similar. All love btw, i think you did a great job with this video, just wanted to point out that it’s important to indicate what feels tonic and the proper notation to convey that.
tbh IV-ii-vi-v-I kinda sounds more like I-vi-iv-ii-V.. is that because most of the examples in this vid are given are out of context of their respective songs, where the tonic is more obvious and established? like the v-I-IV is the same as ii-V-I
I agree - I absolutely cannot hear this Major I chord as listed in the video as anything but a V chord resolving back to the tonic. I'd love to see a follow-up on why the creator chose to list the final chord of the progression - one with so much tension - as a I instead of a V. Very odd choice to my ears, but my backgrounds are not in jazz, rather extreme heavy metal, blues rock, folk, and classical music.
I'd like to correct the chords in your example at 0:44. There is an chromatic passing chord inserted between vi and the v which your visualization does not show, putting you one chord change ahead of the song. Your marker arrives at the I when the song is playing the v.
In most of the examples, they use the secondary dominant: V7/vi, however you still put iii. The chord progression is actually VI, III7 or V7/vi, vi, v, I
Yea forgot to mention but this progression started as early as city pop. It’s just that in recent years, it’s been more associated with Maru no uchi sadistic, hence the “Marusa progression”
Dude I first noticed this in the song Kamado Tanjiro No Uta from S1E19 of the anime Demon Slayer - the whole song is in D minor, and instead of where one would expect a C major they've played a C minor there And yeah since then I've noticed it in so many songs lol
Thank you for this! So typically all chords in the progression would be a 7th chord? Currently learning how to make videogame music and this can be helpful for JRPG music!
Maybe not typical but a trick that's done a lot, especially on the last "I" chord. A lot of times the first time through J-Pop songs would play them all straight then the second time, they'd make them 7th for emphasis. Have fun :)
I love your ear, Jack. You were right to point Japanese did not invent extensions or ambiguities, but they love to play with them in all aspects of life, so it really is Japanese.
I’ve considered making this video myself. By the way, I have a correction for you. It’s actually IV III vi v I The second chord of the progression is major. Also if you add the 7ths, IV should be a major 7th, but III and I should be a dominant 7th
@pokohoko9575 You’re right about the secondary dominance. However the IV is not the real tonic. At least, not as far as I can tell. Is the I really the tonic though? It’s kinda hard to say. Some people in the comments are saying they think of this chord progression as being in the relative minor key. I get that. However, to me it “sounds”major. So, I generally treat it as such I recommend playing it in the key of C/Am and trying to use different scales to improv over it. By the way, in the key of C/Am the chords are | Fmaj7 | E7 | Am7 | Gm7 C7 | That should give you a good feel for where and what the tonic is.
@@figtree.englsh I'm curious as to which chord is the tonic here. Following traditional music theory, it only makes sense for the Fmaj7 - in this case - to be the tonic as the dominant chords don't have tones that belong in their respective key.
@@pokohoko9575to me the 2-5 at the end has the distinct ‘2-5 to the IV’ feeling, so id say its just C major/A minor, as most of the progression is spent resolving to this place
Haha. A lot of people pointed it out in the comments but another way to look at this progression is from the IV (F major key) so the IV would be the I in that case
The v, I, then back to IV, is really just a ii-V-I in IV.
Exactly 🤷♂️
That's the real reason why it works
Yup, I hear the first chord as I
@@rfv618 it’s still a lydian chord, so technically, the the bVI of Am. Most of the examples he gives are in a minor key.
wait aren't you...THE PIANO GUY?!!
Because it's sounds jazzy, i used this progression almost in every gigs i've played. If you want a pop song to sound a little bit jazzy, than using this progression is a must.
And mixing it with some rock makes it sound awesome 😬
@@jalockno, it isn't just awesome it's super awesome
@@Recchan Yeaa. I'm not a super big jazz guy but when I hear jazzy sounds in pop context like on Japanese music, they just really catch my ears
@@jalock ikr, even with the same chord progressions, but how they arrange each melody in their songs is beautiful to hear.
Nobody cares what u used in a gig nobody knows who you are
0:52 bro I can't unhear rickroll in this
😂
SAME HAHAHAHAHA
Same🤣🤣🤣
I've always called this the "just the two of us" progression or VI v i (in the relative minor). It and its variations are extremely popular and I was wondering why nobody ever talked about it.
Ikr. That's what made me wanna make the video since everyone talks about the royal road progression but not this
@@jalock It's not talked about enough in the English sphere. But if you follow Japanese music tube I've seen good coverage by this one channel I follow on the Just the Two of Us progression (and others... not just the Royal Road... he is clearly following the English side too, because he hits up on popular topics like the Blackadder chord from a while back).
This one video (ua-cam.com/video/RdQC3A8RqPc/v-deo.html ) goes over the top five modern progressions, and has a chart at the start to show their primary eras... starting with the Komuro progression in the 90s (peak-TK), the Canon in the 00s, the Royal Road in the 10s (and also uses the vertical to show that that was more centered in the anime sphere), and Just the Two of Us recently (he has other videos on it discussing things like the Major vs Minor uses). The Pop Punk runs across the top through the entire period.
@ Wow. Super sick video. Super cool seeing the evolution. Thanks for sharing!
I appreciate how bro explained this in both an abstract and logical way AWHYEAH
haha thanks!
The way you explain how the chords feel to you is genius. I really enjoyed this.
Haha. Just trying my best 😂
I'm away working in a foreign country and your explanation makes me miss home so much I cried as it's just so beautiful. That 1-chord gives me hope that one day I'll be home to see my family again
You’ll see them again man. Stay safe till then ❤️
Gay
@@GooseGumlizzard Wearing your insecurity on your sleeve so obviously is wylin
You explained the chord progression very well. Thanks for that! Helped me make a connection/relate to each chord in the progression.
Thanks for watching :)
Easier to think of the third chord of the progression, the "vi chord" as you call it, as the i. All of these songs are in that minor key. Original is VI-V-i, then a ii-V-I based on the relative major (the VI in our original key) which loops it around. It's a modulation which is common in jazz. So you arrive at the i, then the ii-V pulls you away to the relative major. Those Japanese examples follow that, and the second chord is a dominant seventh chord (usually with a #9), not a minor. I always find that with music theory, the simplest analysis (and the one that conforms most to what is traditional and familiar) is best, because when people write songs they are usually influenced by the same familiar chord motions.
Also it is the "Just The Two of Us" progression. That is where it originally came from, also "My Boo" and "Body Party". That's where JPOP and KPOP got it in the first place- they pulled from Jazz and R&B.
Haha finally I see a video about this chord progression. It's such a satisfying one to use. I noticed this chord progression in many many songs from the past few years as well and wondered why there was basically nothing online about it. The chord progression however actually has a major III chord instead of an IIIm.
Yea not sure why I don't see much videos in English on it. I do see plenty of Japanese people talking about it though.
Love the video and music! Here's a dumb and quick breakdown for anyone curious:
Dominant Chord: Major triad + minor 7th, root note = V of the key. (e.g., Key is C Major, Dominant of C is G7)
Secondary Dominant: Same, but root not =/= V of the key (e.g., Key is C Major, Secondary Dominant of F is C7).
How to add a Secondary Dominant to Am in F-Am-Gm-C7 (Key of C Major):
1. Find Am's dominant: E7.
2. Insert it before Am.
3. Result: F-E7-Am-Gm-C7 (IV-III7-vi-v-I7).
A dominant chord has a minor 7th because its linked to the Mixolydian Mode (but that's for another day 😁).
Would love to see you make a video on "Anticipation", when the first beat of the a measure is placed on the "and" of the 4th beat of the measure before it (a staple in japanese music).
Great video!! If i could give one suggestion, is that you clarify the 'sevens' in the chords - the v7 and the I7-, I know you have them explained in the video, but the visual makes it easier to "anticipate it"
Instead of thinking of it as minor V to the I turnaround, I like to think of it as a modulated in ii-V-I in the key of the IV. u can even play I as a dominant chord to for a stronger pull back to the IV.
Ahh good way to think about it.
This. Having the minor third in the v (which would be the natural seventh of the major scale), it lingers into what he refers to as the I, making it effectively a dominant transition into the IV. This whole thing is much easier understood in the key of IV with the only non-diatonic being the second chord (it would now be a minor seventh instead of a minor seventh flat five). But outside of that aberration it'll be a very simple and natural progression from root to root (including the mandatory ii-V-I).
tl;dr - he plays a Gm just before the C, so it reads like a C7 which wants to return to the F. The whole thing is really in Fmaj, not in Cmaj.
Yes this is the correct interpretation imo. "Just the two of us" especially is a known progression
I don't know why people are always so obsessed with fitting music that is not CPP music into CPP. It's a Mixolydian progression, no need to complicate it. Many rock and r&b songs are in Mixolydian, which these jrock songs are clearly drawing from.
I was thinking the same thing. The "IV" sounds more tonic than the "I" to me, and that "v - I - IV" sounds a lot like a "ii - V - I" to me. Rewriting it this way, it becomes:
I - vii - iii - ii - V - I
In this way of writing it, the vii chord establishes a Lydian sound by having a sharp 4 in it, which is then contradicted when the ii chord uses a normal 4. Even though this ii chord is just from a normal major (Ionian) scale, it still makes sense that this ii is the chord where it starts to sound jazzy, because, up until that point, we were in only one diatonic mode (Lydian), and this is the first chord that makes it so the progression can't fit into a single diatonic scale. It actually makes even more sense that it suddenly sounds "jazzy" instead of just chromatic, because ii - V - I is a staple of jazz, especially ii - V - I with some kind of twist to it. The twist in this case is that it emphasizes that first chord (which would be a IV in a normal major scale) as the root, proving that the progression isn't just in a normal major scale. Alternatively, you could say that it's not clear the first chord is the tonic until they do a ii - V - I to it, although I actually think the first chord played always has some feeling of being the tonic as long as it's consonant.
I loved this video, fairly interesting!! As an european musician I am not familiar with what makes music from Japan sound japanese, and now I'm even more curious. Keep doing videos like this one
Thanks man! Just uploaded a new video today on iconic Japanese guitar riffs: ua-cam.com/video/Z8hlANFfQ7U/v-deo.htmlsi=nIZRhNLfA-Pe-BUz
Check it out if you're interested and uploading weekly so come back next week too!
Sure, alredy subscribed
@ 😎
I love this progression and hear it a lot in Japanese music specifically. It has so much emotion and I just love to hear and also play it. Also a lot of the time I hear the iii and a III (with the added 7) acting as a secondary dominant to the vi, which I think makes the journey from the 3 to the 6 feel so much more emotional, making it feel like it’s reached a home that’s just more unfulfilled than anything. Great vid tho!
Yup what i've noticed is that a lot of times they'd do the vanilla versions (3 minor and without 7th) then the second time around they'd do the 3 major with added 7 for emphasis. Super cool run
Congratulations on going full time with music and having a channel like this to test yourself and reach out to musicians!! That's how I interpret your channel at least. I want to be on that side one day with my art and music.
Thanks man! I'm not completely full time yet since I still have a part-time job but definitely been good having more time for this channel and music. And totally encourage anyone to pursue their art more since I want more companions haha
“New” progression?
Silly title, but informative video. Thank you.
Love that "Where the light is'" in the back! ❤
Ayy!
Thanks for clear explanation of progression and chords within it! Nice that you've added variations too.
Thanks for watching!
props for the shena ringo reference! that's where i learned this progression first as well
Just such a great song
Thank You for the video man!! The V → v change feels like the spice I was missing for a long time.
Haha. I love the 4 and 5 minor chords they use in J-Pop.
Awesome video and great explanation. 😊
Thanks for watching :)
I appreciated the insight on the qualities of each chord individually, but I'm a bit surprised that you didn't mention secondary dominants at all.
Having taken music theory classes in college and also having learned a ton of jazz progressions, I quickly noticed that the "I" chord is almost always a dominant 7th chord in this progression, which is indicative that it could actually be considered a secondary dominant of IV (V7/IV).
That is, if we're in C, then the C7 pivots back to F since it's the V7 chord in the key of F. This is actually accentuated by the "minor v" chord preceding it, because then you can actually consider it as a ii chord in the key of IV.
Thus, the last two chords of the progression are a "ii-V7" in the key of IV, which is an *incredibly* common progression in jazz (think of the song Misty, which does it immediately after establishing the I).
This also explains why "I" doesn't feel like home at all, because it just wants to go back to IV. It's such a great way to create a loop that pulls harder than most others.
I came back to your channel for more... This is a great video as well! I really like this sound 🔥
Haha thanks man. Japan is my other big passion so really wanted to make a video on Japanese music. Currently editing my next video and about to post it in like half an hour so stay tuned...
Absolutely stellar explanations
Thanks for watching :)
I don't often watch those type of videos about progressions and other common structural points of riffs (and it appears I maybe really should watch more), but hearing you describe what you feel playing those chords made me feel it too, and it was so comfy and nice... I should definetely pay more attention to what I feel when I make art
Thanks man! This means a lot. Was super fun trying to explain what each chord meant to me :)
Very cool. Thanks for the insight into this. I just started learning guitar and I love Japanese music
Ayy!
A cool trick is to make the iii into a dominant 7 chord. Which you may notice in some examples of this chord progression. While you're at it, if you want, you could even make all the minor chords into dominant 7 chords or even pick and choose which ones you want as such. Play the F as a Fmaj7 or an F6. Mess around with the extensions and chord qualities and you can come up with a totally different sound.
For sure. Thanks for the additional tip!
Loved this. Thanks
What a beautiful video. I cannot wait for work to be over so I can pick up my guitar and try this progression.
Haha yea super fun. Try playing it in different styles (funk clean tone, distorted power chords, etc.)!
Great video man!
Thanks for watching!
Thanks for the quick lesson! Will mess around with it at the next jam!
They all use the major III, not minor iii. Which is what "Just the two of us" also does. But still, you explained very well what the progression does and why it works!
Thanks man! I think major 3 definitely makes it sound jazzier but in J-Pop I hear both and many times hear them playing a minor 3 first the first time around, then the second time doing the major 3 for emphasis
I interpret these chords completely differently. The starting IV is what I hear as the tonic, making the progression a I-vii-iii-ii-V which leads back to I. It ends in a ii-V-I progression (a common jazz progression) which is why the ii7 works there, given ii7-V-I is just a IV/2-V-I.
And there are other examples where I hear entirely different chord progressions, for example at 4:37, I hear bVII-V-i-bIII (D-Db-Gbm-A). An extremely common classical chord progression in minor keys. The example after that, I actually hear the exact same thing, but without the bIII (what you call the I).
Music theory can be strange like that sometimes.
Yea totally fair. Some others commented the same. On most Japanese sites I see it written as 4-3-6-5-1 and I suspect that's cause' in a Japanese song the progression is usually coupled with other progressions before and after this in the key of the "1" chord
Yep, although interestingly the second chord of Em7 makes it momentarily be in F Lydian, until the Bb in Gm7 changes it back to Ionian.
@ Interesting :O
awesome stuff man thank you for sharing
Thanks for watching!
I havr always loved this chord progression its so colorful fr
That v I sounds more like a ii V to the IV to me, and I see the iii there more as a (minor) v to the vi. So to me the "home" chords in the progression would be the IV and the vi, the rest of the chords are there just to lead to them.
Yup. Good point. Following the v I, it’s common to resolve to the iv like the Marty Friedman progression here: ua-cam.com/video/7Saoay8Ki2g/v-deo.htmlsi=-Cg43brx54MTOoNz&t=20
like secondary dominant?
Yep. His analysis is pretty atrocious.
I think this could be said to be in A minor. If we try to say it is in F major how would we describe the vii? (Em). Because of this difficulty someone could decide it is in C major. I think all these are true because composing a chord progression is a process.
As they are all related i think that the rhythmic drive is what will name the center. F is indeed the final.
@@marcelotai1055 To me even if the F chord is the first one and the one the secondary ii V is resolving to, the key is still C major, just that the C chord never actually shows up properly as a tonic, it's being used as a secondary dominant and using it as a secondary dominant to the IV gives the progression a permanent sense of movement, perfect for a loop progression.
Another thing about the minor v is that it (at least to me) sounds like a ii-V-I leading back to the IV chord (instead of the I), since the flat 3 of the minor v becomes a flat 7 in the I chord
Yup for sure. If you look at the 4 chord as the 1 chord, the 5 1 4 becomes 2 5 1
"why are you being minor" sure is a sentence
😂
duuuude i’m so glad you made this video talking about this chord progression, i produce jpop/jrock/anime beats and sometimes make videos talking about how I do it, and I always bring up the 4 5 6 (IV V VI) chords and how they’re a staple of Japanese music, but not really knowing why. This video helped me better my understanding of these chords and why I hear it so much in Japanese music, thank you so much 🙏🙏 that’s a sub from me to you!
Thanks man! Really cool seeing how many others love Japanese music through the comment section!
As others have already said, Vm - I - IV is just a II-V of IV, and for the examples where we could hear it, IIIm is actually III (V of VIm), so if we're in major we really we have
||: IV | (V) of | VIm | (II V) of IV :||
However, we're much more likely in the relative minor (no relative major tonic chord, and the melodies are almost always in minor or supporting the relative minor tonic), where the aforementioned VIm is actually the tonic.
Recontextualising,
||: bVI | V | Im | (II V) of :||
That's the Just the Two of Us progression. So, nothing new.
Most music tutorials are hard to follow or become too much to handle quickly... but this was the perfect amount of info presented in a super easy way to understand and internalize. Subed and saved the video for my next playing and learning session.
Appreciate the kind words and thanks for watching!
Love this episod， wish to watch more this kind of analysis contents.
Subscribe for more! Posting weekly :)
Was expecting yet another vanilla royal road video, but was pleasantly surprised! 🙂
haha. Yea for some reason, I don't see much videos on this progression
I think this also works because the v - I back to IV is like doing a 2 -5 -1 in the key of the IV chord. It's also almost the same as in Joe Hisaishi's One Summer's Day at 1:05 (IV - V - vi - v - I - IV)
Yep, the v-I sounds exactly like a ii-V to my ears.
You explain what the chords are doing so elegantly
Thank you!
i usually find that the royal road progression is played after the I chord, which makes a lot of sense really
Just the two of us is simply the circle of 5ths, the most common jazz cadence
My brain just clicked and i litterally just understood chord notation thanks to this video. thank you!!
this will help me with When The Moon Reaches the Stars as well as every other Persona song ever; lol; thank you.
I like to sometimes add a chromatic passing chord between the vi and v- chord.
I'm glad people are talking about this progression again, because I remember hearing it in some anisongs back in 2018 and in jazz standards it was used to modulate to the IV chord in the bridge. J-pop tends to use it for a quick modulation though since the IV chord gives a sense of longing(imo) especially if you include the #11 of the chord in the melody.
Great points yea. In J-Pop they also occasionally add a chromatic passing chord between the vi and v and I just love the resolution to the IV chord. Sense of longing is a great way to put it
i see it as a simple variation on IV V iii vi. skip the V and insert a secondary ii V over IV at the end
Interesting way to look at it. So in some ways, it's still the royal road
that works I guess
This video was very helpful from a music theory point of view - how you broke down the chords and what they represented in the progression. Honestly not that specific about japanse music, can you do some music theory tuts?
I'll definitely consider it! Not the biggest music theory expert but if it's a topic I"m interested in like Japanese music, I'd be willing to do some research and make a video on it
as someone who doesnt much knowledge in music theory but mostly listen to japanese music, this progression gives a bit new tension and flavour as if you listen to jpop for the first time coming from the western music. so since our ear used to hear 4536 it becomes so dominant(like 1564) that hearing this progression pulls you back to the classic japanese music cliche where they always find ways to spice their chord progressions. atleast thats why i understandt it.
Yea someone else mentioned it but this is almost like a cooler version of the 4 5 3 6 progression. Take away the 5, add the 5 1 at the end
Buen vídeo, suscrito!
Gracias :)
I've notices this progression in SO many songs I always call it the Just the Two of Us progression lol
Yea this cool Japanese video going over popular J-Pop progressions throughout the years calls it the "Just the Two of Us" progression too lol
ua-cam.com/video/RdQC3A8RqPc/v-deo.htmlsi=2EQnlpK85sFOirrH&t=95
Thank you for demystifying these chord progressions for me. I would hear these wonderfully complex songs at the end of anime videos and shake my head wondering what the heck was going on music theory-wise.
Haha same until I found out about these progressions
what a beautiful strat
Haha thank you. It's a Jet guitar. Super well-built strat for just $250 :)
I've noticed that lyrically, some japanese songs express themes or messages through some sort of narrative. But with the way you describe the meaning of each chord in this progression, it seems like even the chords of j pop/j rock contribute to that narrative, through emotive moods and tones!
For sure. Marty Friedman from Megadeth pointed out how Western pop tends to repeat the same four chords in a progression whereas J-pop progressions are usually way longer, almost like a journey/story
Yeah, some comments here are saying the chord progression sounds "jazzy" and I agree. I've always thought this particular progression was ultimately descended from "Bird Changes" or the jazz blues chord progression used by Charlie Parker on songs like Confirmation.
Ahh that's a great song. And yea, super borrowed from jazz for sure. In this video I go more in-depth into the jazz tendencies of J-pop: ua-cam.com/video/7Saoay8Ki2g/v-deo.html
I love to see the evolution of music through different cultures.
0:47 What key/ chords are you thinking of here? I'm thinking Dbmaj7 -> C7 -> Fmin7 -> Emin7 -> Ebmin7. You labeled a dominant 7th as a minor chord (what you called the iii) and a minor 7 chord as tonic major (I). Those last three chords are just a minor7 shape moving down chromatically (you can hear by the chromatic baseline)
Yea you're right. Good catch. It should just be the vi moving down to the v
YES I FINALLY FOUND A VIDEO TALKING ABOUT THIS PROGRESSION
(pro tip - the minor iii is usually a III7)
Ayy
I don't even play guitar anymore but this was a pleasure to watch and vicariously learn from. I LOVE Japanese culture. ~a Californian
Haha. Thanks for watching :) I'm a Seattleite
to me it sounds very clear that the tonic chord is the first one, both harmonically and rhythmicly. So yeah, its just a : I - vii - iii - ii - V with the vii being some kind of modal interchange or something
So, few things to add:
Just the two of us doesn't exaclty use the same progression. Instead of IV iii vi v I, it uses IV III7 vi v# v I7. Pretty close tho, but it is important to aknowledge those minor 7ths on the chords, aswll in the progression you're using, since the C at the end is a C7.
The progression in general works well due other hidden things, such as the movements between grades are considered strong (movements between grades are classified as weak, strong, and very strong. Weak when it's a 3rd or 5th way up, strong when it's a 4th or 6th up, and very strong when it's a 2nd or 7th up. If we position in C major just to show an example, F e a g C7, the movements are 2nd up, 4th up, 7th up and 4th up) which enhance the sound of the progression. Also little details like C7 being the secondary dominant of F (and g being the ii, allowing for a ii-V7-I). It's a very good take on the topic, great video.
Thanks for the detailed breakdown! Not a music theory expert so this helps a lot. I more just explained how the chords felt to me haha
@@jalock talking about the feelings the chords caused is the best of takes tho! The "not feeling at home" quote for example with the C7 and other things, it probably is the best way to approach it for a video and explain it to an audience that may not be familiar with theory but can listen and relate to the topic you're showing.
This reminds me of that Adam Neely vid and his exploration into J-Pop and it being inspired by American blues. There is always an inherent nostalgia or sadness in Japanese popular music that I have always found refreshing.
Oh never seen that video. You mind linking it?
@@jalock ua-cam.com/video/gFXcwv9XISc/v-deo.htmlsi=66yIaRuVWE0j-MCN
@@schuylersimmons4424 Damn cowboy bebop. So iconic. Thanks for the link!
I think it would be more accurate to say the progression is
I vii iii ii V7
In this specific chord progression, the first chord sounds like the tonic, not the subdominant. The only reason why it could be justified that the first chord is the subdominant is because of the vii chord, which would indicate that it’s the iii following the IV from a strictly major/ionian perspective. I think that’s inaccurate, because the supposed I in your version
IV iii vi v I
has a dominant function to restart the chord progression. I think it would be important to indicate that the last chord will most likely always have the flat seven included, making it a dominant seven chord. The last two chords in the progression are unabashedly a two five, which makes sense given JPop’s borrowing of jazz idioms. I think vii is purely just modal interchange, borrowing from parallel Lydian, which sets us up to feel surprised by the two five turnaround, as you don’t expect to hear the natural four as opposed to expecting the sharp four that’s present in the vii.
Also side note, while this chord progression rings very true to “Just the Two of Us” as it follows the same inherent bass motion, there are stark differences, with the second chord acting as the dominant in the progression, meaning that “Just the Two of Us” would actually be
bVI V7 i bvii bIII7
bVI V7 i
I’m omitting the chromatic passing chord between the i and bvii and upper extensions because I’m showing basic harmonic motion to show the similarities but also point out how it functions in a completely different modality/tonality. You could say that “Just the Two of Us” is the relative minor version of the chord progression in question here if the chord progression in question was as you portrayed (with the first chord being subdominant) which explains why they sound very very similar.
All love btw, i think you did a great job with this video, just wanted to point out that it’s important to indicate what feels tonic and the proper notation to convey that.
"Do you actually want to go home, then why are you being minor?"
That made me laugh quite a bit, lol. Great video man.
Lmao. 😂
tbh IV-ii-vi-v-I kinda sounds more like I-vi-iv-ii-V.. is that because most of the examples in this vid are given are out of context of their respective songs, where the tonic is more obvious and established? like the v-I-IV is the same as ii-V-I
100%! The whole roman numeral analysis is useless if we start out wrong about the tonic. I'm hearing a lot of 2-5's here...
I agree - I absolutely cannot hear this Major I chord as listed in the video as anything but a V chord resolving back to the tonic. I'd love to see a follow-up on why the creator chose to list the final chord of the progression - one with so much tension - as a I instead of a V. Very odd choice to my ears, but my backgrounds are not in jazz, rather extreme heavy metal, blues rock, folk, and classical music.
@@gamegeek1995 yeah honestly with all of the discussion and disagreement in the comments at this point, I'd just delete and reevaluate.
It's absolutely a I vi iii ii V
trick 7 the chords dictate a minor ii V i to a minor
Yup. It's the same interval as 2-5
I'd like to correct the chords in your example at 0:44. There is an chromatic passing chord inserted between vi and the v which your visualization does not show, putting you one chord change ahead of the song. Your marker arrives at the I when the song is playing the v.
Thanks yea. Someone else pointed it out too. You're right. Appreciate the comment!
In most of the examples, they use the secondary dominant: V7/vi, however you still put iii. The chord progression is actually VI, III7 or V7/vi, vi, v, I
the way he explains is so funny i love it 😂❤
I'll take that as a compliment 😂
2-5-1 is so beatiful man
Yeaa. Anything jazzy is just so beautiful
very inspiring
this chord progression is my favorite
Yeaa
It's like the sound of city pop mixed with a modern style of jpop and jrock
Yea forgot to mention but this progression started as early as city pop. It’s just that in recent years, it’s been more associated with Maru no uchi sadistic, hence the “Marusa progression”
I landed on this progression after watching an Ichika Nito video. Later, I realized I was playing it like “My Boo” by Ghost Town DJs. 🔥
Isn’t there a II-V in the turnaround? Am I just hearing things?
Yup, the final 5-1-4 is actually the same interval as a 2-5-1. If you treat the 4 chord as a 1, the 5 1 4 is a 2 5 1
"Do you actualy want to go back home? then why are you minor"
😂
Dude I first noticed this in the song Kamado Tanjiro No Uta from S1E19 of the anime Demon Slayer - the whole song is in D minor, and instead of where one would expect a C major they've played a C minor there
And yeah since then I've noticed it in so many songs lol
oh damn didn't notice yea. That's the episode where he started wielding fire right? So good
Subscribing right now.
Thank you :)
I need more videos of this... Please cover AOT's "Shogeki" 🥺
Haha maybe. I love AOT too!
@jalock noice XD
Thank you for this! So typically all chords in the progression would be a 7th chord? Currently learning how to make videogame music and this can be helpful for JRPG music!
Maybe not typical but a trick that's done a lot, especially on the last "I" chord. A lot of times the first time through J-Pop songs would play them all straight then the second time, they'd make them 7th for emphasis. Have fun :)
cuz it works like a charm
5:06 blew my musical noob mind. It was like an instant transformation at 5:16. Like yes, I am now listening to Eve or something.
Haha. It blew my mind when I first heard it too
This is a great video explaining this progression. A good modern day western example that uses this progression would be ABC by Polyphia!
Hell yea. Love that song.
And it's also gotta Japanese lyrics lol
whoa dude, just a few weeks ago I was in karaoke, and I sung 丸の内サディスティック, and after that got this urge to sing Just the two of us. Now I know why. :D
Haha. This made my day
It's super common in city pop from the 70s and 80s too
Yea forgot to mention but for sure
Yoasobi's Ayase is a HUGE Sheena Ringo fan! Ado too.
Nice. That makes sense then
Shiina Ringo is my inpiration to study music
I love your ear, Jack. You were right to point Japanese did not invent extensions or ambiguities, but they love to play with them in all aspects of life, so it really is Japanese.
Thanks for the kind words :)
You're the music teacher the world needs lol
Haha thanks!
sheena ringo is such a god 🔥
Yeaa. Love her work with Tokyo Jihen too like Toumei Ningen
I know right! It sounds so rich. I like Killer - Tune too because it sounds so unique for me!
@@marxd3529 Damn. Just listened to it. Another great song by them. The bass is just so awesome
Exactlyyy! Hahaha
Can you do a series of chord progression?
What do you mean a series?
I’ve considered making this video myself.
By the way, I have a correction for you.
It’s actually IV III vi v I
The second chord of the progression is major.
Also if you add the 7ths, IV should be a major 7th, but III and I should be a dominant 7th
So the 'IV' is the real tonic here, right? the 'III' and 'I' are secondary dominants and the 'v' is part of a 251 with 'I'.
@pokohoko9575 You’re right about the secondary dominance.
However the IV is not the real tonic. At least, not as far as I can tell.
Is the I really the tonic though? It’s kinda hard to say. Some people in the comments are saying they think of this chord progression as being in the relative minor key. I get that. However, to me it “sounds”major. So, I generally treat it as such
I recommend playing it in the key of C/Am and trying to use different scales to improv over it.
By the way, in the key of C/Am the chords are
| Fmaj7 | E7 | Am7 | Gm7 C7 |
That should give you a good feel for where and what the tonic is.
@@figtree.englsh I'm curious as to which chord is the tonic here. Following traditional music theory, it only makes sense for the Fmaj7 - in this case - to be the tonic as the dominant chords don't have tones that belong in their respective key.
@@pokohoko9575to me the 2-5 at the end has the distinct ‘2-5 to the IV’ feeling, so id say its just C major/A minor, as most of the progression is spent resolving to this place
temporarily the mind is being tricked into thinking that the key center is the IV because of the 251 at the end.
omg my ears trick me into thing the four is the tonic and the V I IV is just a 251 cadence xD
Haha. A lot of people pointed it out in the comments but another way to look at this progression is from the IV (F major key) so the IV would be the I in that case
first chord progression is Acenda o Farol do Tim Maia but the key is in F instead of C