That is actually brilliant on Jaehaerys' part. Viserys would have had the Iron Throne anyway after the king's death and if he had rejected the succesion, there would be a war. Old man solved everything with a fucking vote.
@@confused4971 to be fair... it's not like Daemon was the most popular and accepted member of the family. The simple fact there even was a discussion despite the precedent said a lot.
@@maxi1ification even if daemon is hated, who else is there to challenge his claim ? (not considering viserys's son, and by that point daemon would just be replaced with viserys's son)
@@confused4971 actually to be fair he didn't just do it to punish Daemon or because he was scared his brother would kill him. He just knew his brother was too reckless to be King and would possibly make many ruinous decisions leaving the realm at war with itself as Maegor once did.
I suppose the first season of the show jumps around so much that they thought the TV audience would need to start off with a main character that would act as throughline (Rhaenyra). The main thing they wanted from this scene was to show the uphill battle in store for Rhaenyra that Rhaenys could not overcome.
Would really love to watch a series completely about Jaehaerys that centers around his entire life. He was the best king Westeros ever had and his wife Alysanne was the best queen. So many interesting things happened in his time including the reign of Maegor the Cruel and the Poor Fellow rebellion, Alysanne's tour of the North and her dragon's refusal to fly past the Wall, Princess Aerea's disappearance with Balerion and her return from Valyria with a Giger-like infestation of horrors in her body, etc
@@hrishabkumarsharma1355 it was largely peaceful during his reign but there were wars and battles, but they were smaller. There was however tonnes of politicking which is when the original series was at it's best. Plus the fight against the faith militant and Jaehaerys and his fight against Maegor was hella bloody, could do a mini series of him gaining his throne then fighting to keep it together. It would set up HoTD as a pre-sequel... but If the rumours of a conquest series is true then we would see it anyways as Jaehaerys is the one who knit the real together after Aegon conquered it (and maegor bled it) so itd be the end of that series
@@jakarhess7129 Probably a series about the Conquest would end up with Jaehaerys being crowned king at 14 and that's all. We wont be seeing much of his reign cause not much happens and its far between. It is adaptable if we run up of storylines to adapt but there are more interesting things to adapt before than Jaehaerys reign. I would love everything to be adapted? Yes, but from a comercial point of view, the Conquest previous to his reign, the Blackfyre Rebellions, etc... are better adaptable material.
Fun fact, jahaerys when he sentenced a man to become a cripple he instead opted for a trial by combat and demanded which old man will fight him. Jahaerys who was turning 50 rather then naming a sworn sword to fight on his behalf decided to fight them himself and won
Earlier in Fire and Blood, a younger Jaeherys had fought a trial by combat himself. The guy who challenged the Old King must've forgotten that either side can name a champion in a trial by combat, whereas Jaeherys was FAR from stupid.
@@alioneal8711exactly. What did he do exactly to secure her position? He named her heir and put a huge burden on her shoulders that he didn't properly prepare her for, then left her vulnerable. Apart from him standing up for her son's claim as Lord of the Tides, and settling some arguments, there was nothing more done to shut people up and secure her position.
@@alioneal8711 yeah this is it. The show likes to present him keeping Rhaenyra the heir because of the prince that was promised prophecy. But even using that reasoning it still reeks of arrogance.
@@SilvX610exactly the issue isn't with her being a woman at all as we seen she was actually widely accepted and people choose death than betray her, however viserys should've made it a law so whatever alicent said wouldn't have held any strength at all
Choosing a Velaryon means literally ending the Targaryen line to put the Velaryon dynasty in charge. Of course it was a lost cause for Rhaenys and Laenor.
Not really. In the show, Corlys and Viserys agreed that any children they had would take the Targaryen name when they took the throne. That seems to be the norm in Westeros for whenever a ruling lady leads a household. So, for instance, had Daemon and Rhea Royce had kids, at least the heir would have taken the Royce name.
@@jde-jj1lu Yes, it would have. The child would have had Royce blood, lived in Runestone, and had the Royce name. Nothing could make them more of a Royce.
Originally Rhaenys was not even considered but her son Leanor Jaeherys great grandchild and Viserys.Rhaenys was passed as heir when her uncle took title of heir when her father Crowned Prince died that is why she is called Queen who never was because she was never even considered
As much as I love Rhaenys, I think her Queenship would've caused problems of it's own. I sincerely doubt that the Targaryens would want to lose their name in the crown and I strongly doubt the Velaryons would just let it go had Laenor maintained the Targaryen name.
I feel like that would be part of the reason, on top of all of those things it would then set a precedent that elder daughters of minor and major houses now had legitimacy to their families seats. And the men in power and heirs did not want that to happen.
This has happend before in westerosi history, you don't loose the name you change it to the seat you take. House Lannister comes from the female line because one king didn't have a son, so his son in law changed his last name to Lannister upon marriage. In asoiaf we also meet Harry the heir, who's heir to the Eerie after Robert Arryn who'd take on the name Arryn if he succeded him.
Rhaenys being considered is a show only thing it was between Laenor and Viserys. Apparently Viserys won overwhelmingly despite Laenor/Rhaenys having house velaryon, celtigar,Dustin,Manderly,Blackwood,Stark, and Baratheon support which makes you wonder how the voting was actually done
Jaehaerys gave the chance to all the lords of Westeros a chance to choose their new ruler, not only for the highest houses like Starks and Baratheons but for the lowest houses. That is how the voting was made
No it doesn't. There are over 600 houses in Westeros. Just because Rhaenys had 10 houses supporting her doesn't mean she was going to win. And there's nothing to say that vassal lords have to vote the same as their liege. The support of House Stark is worth just as much as house Corbray since all their votes are equal.
The king makes the laws and rules you didn’t see Dorne Having this problem if they had more of a society like Dorne, it doesn’t matter your gender. It’s whoever is first born.
The maesters can totally be trusted not to fudge the number from the vote Their motives totally aren’t compromised by their allegiance to House Hightower
My fcking gods jaehaerys had way too many fcking kids dude. I realized viserys and rhaenys are his grandchildren. This bloodline got me confused. Jaehaerys in this case his son aemon had rhaenys and his other son baelon had viserys….bruh took me a while to figure this sht out
Thrones in the earlier days was always for kings ....but queens on the other hand had a preferred diplomatic role... After all at the times of war it came down to the males to defend the kingdom...
funny you say that men defend the kingdom in times of war yet it was visenya and rhaenys who helped the conqueror and had a very big part in winning the kingdom...
Ancient rules and council are more important than the personal decisions of the kings. According to ancient rules, if the king has a son, his daughter cannot ascend to the throne. The line that the daughter marries automatically becomes the owner of the throne, and the patrilineage is destroyed. So, Greens are right.
It was set in the Council aswell that Male lines would prevail over female lines. Viserys went against this council and put her daughter on the throne causing the riff with his male son that ended in a war.
That's not quite true. The greens certainly looked at the Great Council and argued that the precedent was set that no woman could inherit, but the council didn't actually say that. All the council said was that Viserys should be king over Rhaenys and her seven-year-old son, Laenor (who was the claimant they were arguing over in the book). But there are plenty of other precedents that would argue against that. The thing about succession is that it is a very nebulous concept. Ultimately, it comes back to claims and who has the "stronger" claim is often a matter of opinion. Most would agree that a legitimate first-born son has the strongest claim, but most would also agree that a king/lord can name whoever they want as their heir. So, in the case where the Lord of Winterfell disinherits his eldest son and names his second son his heir, who has the stronger claim is up for debate. Keep in mind, everyone agreed that Viserys had the right to name Rhaenyra his heir; that's why Otto suggested it and no one fought against it. If the Council had really said, "No, Girls can't inherit anything," then someone would have absolutely protested when Viserys asked them to swear fealty to her. Now, if asked, most would agree that Aegon has a very strong claim, that is true. However, most would also agree that Viserys has the right to name whoever he wants his heir. If her were to have named Aemond his heir, no one would have questioned it because that is the king's right; he can choose any of his children to be his heir. The reason that Rhaenyra was facing trouble was because the greens want the throne for themselves and see her gender as cause to steal it. That doesn't mean that she didn't have a claim. Nor does it mean she is not the rightful heir. Succession is complicated, but that just makes the greens' actions even worse, because the onus for rebellion was on them (we can argue about the precedents all we want, but if Otto and Alicent hadn't staged a coup, their would have been no war; they were the ones that chose a course that was clearly going to lead to violence).
@@seanp2871 They chose the course that mean House Targaryen would live on thanks to the true blood male heir inheriting the throne and continuing the blood line by siring more sons. Because thats actually how a bloodline doesnt cease to exist.
If the passing on of blood was what really mattered, female lines would've been preferred. Paternity can always be questioned but maternity isn't. It is the best and most fool-proof way to proceed and make sure the bloodline is being passed on. But it seems that the world of HOTD also followed what Engels mentioned in the Origin of the Family, where private property and ownership is tied to the development of a patriarchal state. Princess Rhaenys' Targaryen blood is undermined because she is a married woman and by status quo took upon her husband's name. It supposedly is only a name and what constitutes her lineage is far complex than what a couple of letters can capture, but the name is what allows someone to belong in that society. Traditionally, the privilege of being able to give your name to someone stems from males having more chances of defending their property, the extreme of this being shown in how wives used to be (unfortunately still are in some parts of the world) treated as properties of their husbands, BUT if a woman has a dragon that logic totally must definitely be thrown out the window.
Rhaenys trust me you wouldn't want it anyway, the iron throne is always surrounded by drama backstabbers war discourse murder torture etc etc (and the etc is worse)
@@levia9349 thanks to the greens, not Rhaenyra. more than half the realm supported Rhaenyra (56 houses) while the Aegon only had the support of house Hightower, lannister and baratheon (and other 20+ small houses). house Stark, Tully, Arryn, Velaryon, Greyjoys, they all fought for the dragon queen caring little about what's between her legs
@@Nihilanth exactly as a ruler you solve problems before it becomes a problem Viserys was fool to think some people would fallow his law because he said it lool.
And she shouldn't have. The King was just! The King made piece for the common folk! The King left his Throne on a pile of Gold! Everyone after him effed it all up!
Jaehaerys Died aged 69 I think and if he had the vitality of Maester Aemon and died aged 101 I doubt Alicent would have become queen he would have married Rhaenrya and Daemon
In Indian epic Mahabharata...the whole war wouldn't have happened if Vishma(Debabrata) had become king..same here..if Rhaenys had become the queen..none of this would have happened
I’m still a big believer even to this day that the Curse of Harrenhall and that the Great Council of 101 at Harrenhal itself set things in motion the Dance of the Dragons and the eventual downfall of House Targaryen. no one noticed it, but i think they were cursed.
I blame Otto Hightower for the mess that's going on. He's the one who told the king to make Rhaenyra heir to the throne, just because he didn't want Daemon to be king. And now that his grandson is the king's first son he wants everyone to ignore the fact he helped change the line of succession.
Anyone find it weird how he had 14 kids and they predeceased him? I have a theory that the faith and maesters were helping the downfall of the Targaryen’s and dragons. May explain why poor Aemma had issues having kids, how Rhaenys only had the twins etc
Ever seen the videos about the Grand Maester Conspiracy? Check them out, the maesters have long planned the fall of house Targaryen, probably since Aegon conquered Westeros
Only if you don't consider how they died. Aegon, Gaemon and Valerion all died stillborn/infancy. Gael committed suicide, Maegelle caught greyscale, and Daenerys died of the shivers. Daella and Alyssa died in childbirth, and Viserra died in what amounted to a drunk driving incident. That just leaves Aemon (who got a crossbow bolt in the throat whilst fighting on Tarth), and Baelon who died of appendicitis. It's hardly suspicious circumstances.
The civil war but mainly because aegon witnessed the dance of dragons and his mothers death. He had no interest in dragons after the civil war and stopped breeding them. The few the dragon keepers did try to breed were small and sickly. I haven't read the book in a long time but basically that's why they died out. Edit: the aegon I'm talking about was rhaenys son aegon not alicent.
Ive always felt bad Jaehaerys for having to make this decision. I think deep down he wanted to and probably realized that picking Rhaeyns was the right choice for the long run in terms of stability for the realm. But I think his only main goal was avoiding a civil war within his own family in the present or near future, he failed lol. But my guess is he was probably hoping Viserys would actually be able to make the right choices to appease the Valerions but Visery’s only ever makes things worse lol. Kinda like most Targaryens, they only make bad decisions, very few of them make ALL the right choices shit I mean even Jaehaerys didn’t manage to accomplish that he gave it a really good shot tho.
He never wanted to make Rhaenys, or any woman, the heir. Even when he was young, Princess Daenerys was older than Prince Aemon and he named Aemon his heir. When Queen Alysanne pointed that out he said "oh they're gonna marry anyway, so it's the same thing". When Aemon died, he named Baelon his heir and that caused a major argument between Jae and Aly. And when Baelon too died, he held the council(Aly too was dead by then).
They’re trying to show you how they pass over the women heirs just because they are women, despite it would usually be their birth right. This is supposed to be set back when women didn’t necessarily have rights. Yes, its fantasy show but it still draws a little bit of our real life history where similar stuff like this happened to women.🤨
@@nobodyknows1015 actually sorry, inheritance always goes to the first male son, regardless of children birthed before him. That's where the entire conflict arises.
He become king because he is male , he benefited from the tradition then he broke it named his daughter as heir, while still have 3 sons. This never work in any dynasty when males line still exist. Just look at British empire, all the queen ascend to the thrones because there are no male left.
Visery broke tradition, dance of dragon won’t happen if he publicly announced Aegon as ruler, Deamond and his daughter will be angry but them will honour his legacy, visery was too soft and emotional to be a king. Aegon is not mad king, he turn out quite merciful at the end. The facts he lose everyone and he still spare deamond children.
Viserys was a good king, people blame him for the civil war but it happened after his death. Yes he made some mistakes but he couldn't control everything, I think it was bound to happen at some point anyway.
Nope, the war happened largely because of him, some other characters like Daemon and Otto are also to blame but Viserys holds a large part in it. The reason is because he didn't pick a side. He was neither on the Black side or the Green side, he tried playing both. Because he loved both. He reinstalled Otto as hand and also married his daughter Alicent beforehand giving the greens a lot of power (they also became his regents whilst he was too sickly to govern). For the Black's he made Rhaenyra heir and didn't strip her of the position after Aegon ii was born and he kept allowing Daemon to do whatever he wants with little repercussion, also allowing Daemon and Rhaenyra to marry eachother. Plus he favoured the blacks on the succession crises of Driftmark (even though it was evident Lucerys was not the true heir to House Valeryon). All he had to do was pick a side. If he favoured the Blacks he should of named someone like Corlys or Daemon as his hand after Lyonels death, he should of made the Lords re swear their oaths to Rhaenyra, he should have made his green children (Aegon, Haleana, Aemond and Daeron) swear oaths to Rhaenyra. He also should have named her regent (instead of Otto and Alicent) whilst he was too sickly so that the change of rulership would pass over easily to Rhaenyra. If he preferred the Greens he should of never got rid of Otto for his spying of Rhaenyra. He should of named Aegon his heir right after his birth or when he was a teen (if he feared the child's assassination). He should of groomed Aegon ii to be a ruler instead of letting him be a drunkard. He should of recognised Rhaenyra's first children as bastards. He should have never let Rhaenyra and Daemon marry. There is still a large chance war could break out after his death. Both the Greens and Black's wouldn't be happy if the king had preferred the other in his decisions, however if he did pick a side the other would he greatly handicapped from it leading to a quick end to any war. But he didn't because he was a good man, bad father, and a terrible king.
@Raylan Givens My answer on how Viserys could've avoided war was from the point of the timeskip (episode 6) so from where I'm writing from this was the ways he could of avoided war. However he could've avoided it even further back, as you stated. He could've named Aegon heir as soon as he was born. Also about King Viserys remarriage. It was sort of necessary and sort of not. Yes he did need more Targaryens as the house had now dwindled to him, Rhaenyra,Daemon and if you want to count the cousins Rhaenys and her two children ( Vaegon may also still be alive but he's a maester and can't inherit). And if he had wanted to keep Daemon from being closer to the throne in the line of succession then having his male children was a great idea. But to prevent Rhaenyra being pushed aside for another heir there is an even better idea. Have her marry and birth heirs as soon as her naming as heir. In the books this isn't possible as I believe Rhaenyra is about 6 when this happens but in the show she is at least 13. Her and Alicent are the same age and she was able to give the King a son and daughter even before Rhaenyra was betrothed. Yes Rhaenyra would be unhappy being forced to marry so early and without any say but it would be for her benefit (she would probably end up marrying Leanor as she did by the end of her search for a consort). If Rhaenyra was the one to marry and birth children then there would be no need for Alicent and her side of the family. Rhaenyra and her children would of filled in the task of populating house Targaryen and her sons would have a better claim than Daemon and would not rebel against her (like her brothers did). If she decided to have her children secretly with Ser Harwin Strong then there would be no greens to contest her. Daemon may use it to lay a better claim but he was already disinherited by Viserys and would probably have little backing.
This is from an appendix, *"It was held at the enormous, half-ruined castle Harrenhal because it was the only location big enough to fit such a large and unprecedented gathering of all the lords in Westeros."*
How ironic is that men build an empire of dragons and 2 women became the reason for the destruction of both the dragons and the empire! but I still like both the women - it is all a game of perspective of narration
@@Emy-fv5ny No I didnot just like I said Men Build it by 'MEN' I mean Aegon and Rhaenys and Visenya were there every step to help him buid it. They didnot build it to be the Empress of the 7KDs by that i mean Sole Ruler themselves. I love both Daenarys and Rhaenera's Chracter. Its just a 3rd person perspective of the story and the fate of HOTD
@@Emy-fv5ny Yes just like every other queen did BESIDE their Husband "The lord of the 7 Kingdoms, Proector of the Realm + + +" etc. #TheKING. but I aknowledge that they were very powerful queens
@@ASXTech No, most queens didn't have much influence on the ruling. Visenya and Rhaenys did, they took decision by their own, apart from their husband, meaning they didn't have to ask for his permission.
Because it's too expesive to adapt the conquest. They will need a huge budget on FX alone, imagine to animate Aegon's dragon. I hear they will planning in doing an animation of the conquest.
Technically Rheanys would never have sat the throne officially anyways. Fire and blood stipulates this stating it would pass to Laenor when he came of age
@@perun6318 Because Viserys was a lovely person, but ultimately too weak to be king. His errors and his inability to deal with the consequences are largely to blame for the Dance. Rhaenys, on the other hand, is shown to have a much more decisive and firm personality, and is also more cunning. Chances are she would’ve been a better monarch than Viserys.
@@bebelc2l And don’t you think if Rhaenys was queen we wouldn’t have Aegon II and illegitimate children fighting over succession he became weak after Aemmas passing
@@bebelc2l You are forgetting one key thing here; Rhaenys was a woman. She could be the Conqueror reborn, but it wouldn’t matter, because the only thing the Lords of the Realm would see was woman trying to order them around, and they wouldn’t stand for it. Jaehaerys knew that because, unlike his grandson, he was blessed with the gift of good sense and foresight. He knew that naming a woman as heir to Iron Throne would cause the Realm to implode into civil war, much like it did decades later because Viserys couldn’t follow his grandfather’s footsteps.
Seriously, there's "democratic legitimacy" for Aegon II. If Viserys truly wants Rhaenyra to inherit his throne, he should hsve made another vote. Instead he just made the lords swear an oath to Rhaenyra. Got a good heart, but a terrible king
In a medieval and male centric world when there are wars to fight, who would want a woman who couldn't even use a sword. Most women in that era were submissive to men, so who would respect the authority of a woman. Besides, Rhaenyra didn't even fight in the dance of dragons (if I am not mistaken), but Aegon ( a drunk whore) did, she would have made a horrible queen. Daenerys went crazy, and what about Cercei? Bad examples for queens.
@@aravindmohan5507 in the books, it was explained that Harrenhall is very large to host a huge gathering of people and during the vote at least 1000 lords arrived. Bonus that Harrenhall is the largest of all castles in Westeros.
GODS I wish we get a show with Robert's rebellion so we can see more targaryens biting the dust.Thats what we needed from the start not some lame Targaryen show
Yeah Robert's Rebellion would be epic. Too much this franchise is becoming The Dragon show. I'm even up for the Blackfyre Rebellion with Daeron/Baelor/Maekar and Bloodraven vs Daemon Blackfyre and Bittersteel.
@@siran424 And Jahearys is too old. And Vicery that time no longer have dragon that time since Balerion is dead if i am not mistaken so it eill only be Caraxes vs Meleys and Queen Aemma don't know if she did claim a dragon. But both Meleys and Caraxes were stated if one on one they can defeat Vhagar which Caraxes did due to Meleys died because of unfair fight.
@@whitesage2066 Meleys is just fast that's about it. Caraxes alone is enough to rip apart Meleys, let alone Caraxes and Vermithor together. Queen Aemma ?? You mean Alysanne ?? She was dead already at that point. And nope neither Caraxes nor Melys can defeat Vhagar alone and come out alive. It was never stated as such anywhere in the source material.
@@siran424 I am talking Rhaenyra's mother and no Meleys is too fast to Caraxes and let alone that Caraxes is an inch large than Meleys. But it was already stated duhhhhh search and look for more and besides ehen Vhagar and Caraxes fight and even both of them died. Caraxes was consider the winner. And yeah during the battle of Meleys, Sunfyre and Vhagar it stated that Meleys can easily finish Sunfyre and also Meleys also have a high chance of winning agaisnt Vhagar.
@@Emy-fv5ny the only reason I think Aegon was like that was that he wasn’t shaped to rule and if he was named he would have been more prepared and been a better person overall
@@Mrprince4245 Aegon didn't have to wait to be named it was his duty to prepare himself just in case he was named by his father or Rhaenyra died, like Aemond did.
@@Emy-fv5ny yea I see your point but like if he was the uncontested heir and he wasn’t passed over for Rhaenyra he would’ve been trained to be king and not expected to be king
I don't think Old Valaryan cared abut gender. When Aegon and his sisters conquered they basically had to deal with Westeros trying to get them to conform to their standards. Among that was male only heirs.
If Valyrians had equal gender traditions, then Visenya would've been the lady of Dragonstone at the time of the Conquest. But she wasn't, and they didn't. The Rhoynar have gender equality and the Lengi have females only succession. They're pretty much the only exceptions.
Many people here claim that Great Council was a way to prevent war. Firstly, Rhaenys is and was heir in accordance to Andal law. Yes, she is a woman, but women come before their uncles in terms of succesion. Starks for example married nieces to their uncles one time due to girls being the heirs. Alys Karstark is regarded as heir instead of her uncle. Of course, these women often struggle and many times people ignore the law. Yes, the succession was muddied a bit because Rhaenys' father Aemon died before he became the king. But he was prince of Dragonstone, rightful heir. And yet, king names his son Baelon, Viserys' and Daemon's father... because council makes a decision. When its member, Corlys Velaryon, is away, and another member, Aemon, suspiciously died because they apparently they shot him in place of someone else. But Baelon dies too. And puppet's show known as Great Council happens. Rhaenys and Corlys overpower Viserys' faction. Yes, both parties have a dragon on their side, Laenor has little Seasmoke. But if we do not count dragons... then it would be Rhaenys' victory. How did the Great Council untimately voted? The numbers were not revealed, convinientely. We know though that Rhaenys' side was supported by Baratheons (who shared Rhaenys blood), Velaryon's bannermen and... Starks and most/all their bannermen with house Blackwood. We are told that Viserys won by the score of 20:1. But apart from masters we have no mention of any house publicly declating for him. Why would not lords want Rhaenys? Rhaenys is an adult, dragonrider, with two children and married to one of the most powerful lord in the kingdom. She has two heir, daughter and son, who is even a dragonrider. But most importanly... Rhaenys is heir according to rules followed by most lords. You want Rhaenys to be queen so no futute succession of any house in the realm is questioned (or at least not in most of the houses. It was a big scheme by a Citadel, and this is not just a Blacks' propaganda 😅
So the precedent for selecting the oldest male heir over the oldest descendant is already there but this idiot Viserys couldn't simply stick to what made him King in the first place?
They really try to push the 'The only reason she didn't get the throne is because she's a woman' narrative, when in the books thats not even the main reason Viserys is chosen over her. The first and most important reason she's looked over despite her stronger claim, is because she's married to a Valaryon, and her would be heir is also a Valaryon, which would in name, end the 'Targaryen' rule.
That is actually brilliant on Jaehaerys' part. Viserys would have had the Iron Throne anyway after the king's death and if he had rejected the succesion, there would be a war. Old man solved everything with a fucking vote.
Exactly. He's the absolute opposite of Viserys, who broke tradition and named Rhaenyra heir over Daemon over a quarrel.
@@confused4971 to be fair... it's not like Daemon was the most popular and accepted member of the family.
The simple fact there even was a discussion despite the precedent said a lot.
@@maxi1ification even if daemon is hated, who else is there to challenge his claim ? (not considering viserys's son, and by that point daemon would just be replaced with viserys's son)
@@confused4971 actually to be fair he didn't just do it to punish Daemon or because he was scared his brother would kill him. He just knew his brother was too reckless to be King and would possibly make many ruinous decisions leaving the realm at war with itself as Maegor once did.
@@spearshake4771That's ironic.
Because that's exactly what Rheanyra did, leaving westeros in war and utter chaos ...
I wish we saw more of Jaeharyes GRRM originally wanted the show to cover the last years of his reign before the ascension of Viserys
That would’ve been so coolio
Would love to see him riding vermithor
Should have been included IMO, atleast as a first episode.
I suppose the first season of the show jumps around so much that they thought the TV audience would need to start off with a main character that would act as throughline (Rhaenyra).
The main thing they wanted from this scene was to show the uphill battle in store for Rhaenyra that Rhaenys could not overcome.
It’s irrelevant to the current plot though. It’s prologue info, we don’t need 3 time skips to get that times were good and now they’re not.
Would really love to watch a series completely about Jaehaerys that centers around his entire life. He was the best king Westeros ever had and his wife Alysanne was the best queen. So many interesting things happened in his time including the reign of Maegor the Cruel and the Poor Fellow rebellion, Alysanne's tour of the North and her dragon's refusal to fly past the Wall, Princess Aerea's disappearance with Balerion and her return from Valyria with a Giger-like infestation of horrors in her body, etc
A good king governing well in peacetime would make for a boring show
They can use flashbacks during the current show... they can tie in lots of things from the past
@@hrishabkumarsharma1355 it was largely peaceful during his reign but there were wars and battles, but they were smaller. There was however tonnes of politicking which is when the original series was at it's best.
Plus the fight against the faith militant and Jaehaerys and his fight against Maegor was hella bloody, could do a mini series of him gaining his throne then fighting to keep it together. It would set up HoTD as a pre-sequel... but If the rumours of a conquest series is true then we would see it anyways as Jaehaerys is the one who knit the real together after Aegon conquered it (and maegor bled it) so itd be the end of that series
@@jakarhess7129 I hope those rumors are true, I think that would make a really good show
@@jakarhess7129 Probably a series about the Conquest would end up with Jaehaerys being crowned king at 14 and that's all. We wont be seeing much of his reign cause not much happens and its far between. It is adaptable if we run up of storylines to adapt but there are more interesting things to adapt before than Jaehaerys reign. I would love everything to be adapted? Yes, but from a comercial point of view, the Conquest previous to his reign, the Blackfyre Rebellions, etc... are better adaptable material.
Fun fact, jahaerys when he sentenced a man to become a cripple he instead opted for a trial by combat and demanded which old man will fight him. Jahaerys who was turning 50 rather then naming a sworn sword to fight on his behalf decided to fight them himself and won
“This old man. The one whose daughter you seduced and despoiled” he replied to ser Beesbury……Who ended up getting stabbed in the skull be the Old King
Jaehaerys had that dawg in him
Earlier in Fire and Blood, a younger Jaeherys had fought a trial by combat himself. The guy who challenged the Old King must've forgotten that either side can name a champion in a trial by combat, whereas Jaeherys was FAR from stupid.
They put a piece of paper in a heavy ass chest that required 2 people to carry instead of just putting it in a small box in front of the King?
Imagine if the dude just pulled out a piece of crumbled paper from his pocket.
@@TheTruthIsGonnaHurt Cut to Pycelle deliberately dropping important papers so Tyrion has to pick it up.
@@TheTruthIsGonnaHurt they would've accused him of election fraud and send
#notmyking on ravens to all the 6.5 kingdoms 😆
@@HOTD108_ Nah! Cut to Cersei ripping up the piece of paper and delivering one of her defiant lines. What a marvelous bitch!
@@TheTruthIsGonnaHurt😂
If only Viserys had followed this trend, this vote possibly prevented a war over succession
Yes, he should do the same. On the other hand, knowing how a jerk his oldest son is, he may have wanted hit daughter to succeed.
@@alioneal8711exactly. What did he do exactly to secure her position? He named her heir and put a huge burden on her shoulders that he didn't properly prepare her for, then left her vulnerable. Apart from him standing up for her son's claim as Lord of the Tides, and settling some arguments, there was nothing more done to shut people up and secure her position.
@@alioneal8711 yeah this is it. The show likes to present him keeping Rhaenyra the heir because of the prince that was promised prophecy. But even using that reasoning it still reeks of arrogance.
@@SilvX610exactly the issue isn't with her being a woman at all as we seen she was actually widely accepted and people choose death than betray her, however viserys should've made it a law so whatever alicent said wouldn't have held any strength at all
If he couldn’t see the obvious (that Otto was a snake), then he was never going to take steps to curtail the war that was brewing in his family
Fun fact for all you Star Wars fans. Thats Michael Carter the man who played Bib Fortuna as Jaehaery’s.
Choosing a Velaryon means literally ending the Targaryen line to put the Velaryon dynasty in charge. Of course it was a lost cause for Rhaenys and Laenor.
Not really. In the show, Corlys and Viserys agreed that any children they had would take the Targaryen name when they took the throne. That seems to be the norm in Westeros for whenever a ruling lady leads a household. So, for instance, had Daemon and Rhea Royce had kids, at least the heir would have taken the Royce name.
@@seanp2871 still wouldn't really be a real Royce though would it?
@@jde-jj1lu Yes, it would have. The child would have had Royce blood, lived in Runestone, and had the Royce name. Nothing could make them more of a Royce.
@@seanp2871 Do you understand how the passing of genes works?
@@jde-jj1ludo you? 😂
Originally Rhaenys was not even considered but her son Leanor Jaeherys great grandchild and Viserys.Rhaenys was passed as heir when her uncle took title of heir when her father Crowned Prince died that is why she is called Queen who never was because she was never even considered
This should have been done everytime there were any doubts about the succession when there was no obvious heir.
As much as I love Rhaenys, I think her Queenship would've caused problems of it's own. I sincerely doubt that the Targaryens would want to lose their name in the crown and I strongly doubt the Velaryons would just let it go had Laenor maintained the Targaryen name.
Yeah true. I wonder why Rhaenys was surprised she didn’t get picked since the last 4 Rulers of Westeros were males.
I feel like that would be part of the reason, on top of all of those things it would then set a precedent that elder daughters of minor and major houses now had legitimacy to their families seats. And the men in power and heirs did not want that to happen.
This has happend before in westerosi history, you don't loose the name you change it to the seat you take.
House Lannister comes from the female line because one king didn't have a son, so his son in law changed his last name to Lannister upon marriage.
In asoiaf we also meet Harry the heir, who's heir to the Eerie after Robert Arryn who'd take on the name Arryn if he succeded him.
That and she's a civilian killing lunatic who'll kill them just to intimate her rivals.
This is why he is called the Old King.
The Conciliator
Christopher Lee would have been a good choice
He’s dead
So what? If he was still alive he would have been a perfect casting
It is such a shame that he is gone after all the memorable work he did
We actually needed an anthology show about the history of house Targaryen. A season per king. I could watch it forever.
Rhaenys being considered is a show only thing it was between Laenor and Viserys.
Apparently Viserys won overwhelmingly despite Laenor/Rhaenys having house velaryon, celtigar,Dustin,Manderly,Blackwood,Stark,
and Baratheon support which makes you wonder how the voting was actually done
Jaehaerys gave the chance to all the lords of Westeros a chance to choose their new ruler, not only for the highest houses like Starks and Baratheons but for the lowest houses. That is how the voting was made
No it doesn't. There are over 600 houses in Westeros. Just because Rhaenys had 10 houses supporting her doesn't mean she was going to win. And there's nothing to say that vassal lords have to vote the same as their liege. The support of House Stark is worth just as much as house Corbray since all their votes are equal.
The king makes the laws and rules you didn’t see Dorne Having this problem if they had more of a society like Dorne, it doesn’t matter your gender. It’s whoever is first born.
Those boy lovers? No dorne should have no social influence over westros
@@attiepollard7847 bro is doing westorosi homophobia 💀💀💀
@@attiepollard7847 those boy lovers should rule all of Westeros
@@brandonrooney5106 and watch your whole population go down because you want more boy lovers. How nice
@@attiepollard7847 boy lovers are great, love ‘em
The maesters can totally be trusted not to fudge the number from the vote
Their motives totally aren’t compromised by their allegiance to House Hightower
Keep coping. The woman lost the vote.
@@liamjm9278 I think you missed the point….
@@mpalfadel2008 No.
@@liamjm9278 yup
You really missed the point
It’s ok, a lot of people who have read the books still missed this small but important detail
@@mpalfadel2008 No.
KING VISERYS the true heir 💯💯
I wish we had seen more of Jaeharys rule. He was the most sane Targaryen lmao
I love the black and silver targaryen banner it looks so good 😍
The look on his face. Like he's not sure if this'll be enough to save this family.
My fcking gods jaehaerys had way too many fcking kids dude. I realized viserys and rhaenys are his grandchildren. This bloodline got me confused. Jaehaerys in this case his son aemon had rhaenys and his other son baelon had viserys….bruh took me a while to figure this sht out
Thrones in the earlier days was always for kings ....but queens on the other hand had a preferred diplomatic role... After all at the times of war it came down to the males to defend the kingdom...
funny you say that men defend the kingdom in times of war yet it was visenya and rhaenys who helped the conqueror and had a very big part in winning the kingdom...
Even so, Rhaenys would still have the throne over Viserys if we followed normal inheritance. She was the daughter of the eldest son.
I guess you don’t know about aegons the conqueror sisters?
@@taviontaylor5742 yes I know ...they are one of the few exceptions
The king did not defend anyone his army did besides she is much better than puppet aegon
Jaehaerys is the GOAT
That is my son's throne.
Ancient rules and council are more important than the personal decisions of the kings. According to ancient rules, if the king has a son, his daughter cannot ascend to the throne. The line that the daughter marries automatically becomes the owner of the throne, and the patrilineage is destroyed. So, Greens are right.
It was set in the Council aswell that Male lines would prevail over female lines. Viserys went against this council and put her daughter on the throne causing the riff with his male son that ended in a war.
That's not quite true. The greens certainly looked at the Great Council and argued that the precedent was set that no woman could inherit, but the council didn't actually say that. All the council said was that Viserys should be king over Rhaenys and her seven-year-old son, Laenor (who was the claimant they were arguing over in the book). But there are plenty of other precedents that would argue against that.
The thing about succession is that it is a very nebulous concept. Ultimately, it comes back to claims and who has the "stronger" claim is often a matter of opinion. Most would agree that a legitimate first-born son has the strongest claim, but most would also agree that a king/lord can name whoever they want as their heir. So, in the case where the Lord of Winterfell disinherits his eldest son and names his second son his heir, who has the stronger claim is up for debate.
Keep in mind, everyone agreed that Viserys had the right to name Rhaenyra his heir; that's why Otto suggested it and no one fought against it. If the Council had really said, "No, Girls can't inherit anything," then someone would have absolutely protested when Viserys asked them to swear fealty to her.
Now, if asked, most would agree that Aegon has a very strong claim, that is true. However, most would also agree that Viserys has the right to name whoever he wants his heir. If her were to have named Aemond his heir, no one would have questioned it because that is the king's right; he can choose any of his children to be his heir. The reason that Rhaenyra was facing trouble was because the greens want the throne for themselves and see her gender as cause to steal it. That doesn't mean that she didn't have a claim. Nor does it mean she is not the rightful heir. Succession is complicated, but that just makes the greens' actions even worse, because the onus for rebellion was on them (we can argue about the precedents all we want, but if Otto and Alicent hadn't staged a coup, their would have been no war; they were the ones that chose a course that was clearly going to lead to violence).
@@seanp2871 They chose the course that mean House Targaryen would live on thanks to the true blood male heir inheriting the throne and continuing the blood line by siring more sons. Because thats actually how a bloodline doesnt cease to exist.
If the passing on of blood was what really mattered, female lines would've been preferred. Paternity can always be questioned but maternity isn't. It is the best and most fool-proof way to proceed and make sure the bloodline is being passed on. But it seems that the world of HOTD also followed what Engels mentioned in the Origin of the Family, where private property and ownership is tied to the development of a patriarchal state. Princess Rhaenys' Targaryen blood is undermined because she is a married woman and by status quo took upon her husband's name. It supposedly is only a name and what constitutes her lineage is far complex than what a couple of letters can capture, but the name is what allows someone to belong in that society. Traditionally, the privilege of being able to give your name to someone stems from males having more chances of defending their property, the extreme of this being shown in how wives used to be (unfortunately still are in some parts of the world) treated as properties of their husbands, BUT if a woman has a dragon that logic totally must definitely be thrown out the window.
@@aurora_bae No. Obviously you know a child is from the mother it's born from, but thats not how genes and dominant genes pass down.
why is there a summer islander in a wig there?
💀🤣🤣😭 Bro that's corlys
That's not even the bad Velaryon wig. The women look absolutely ridiculous. Could've at least given them the same hair as Corlys.
Rhaenys trust me you wouldn't want it anyway, the iron throne is always surrounded by drama backstabbers war discourse murder torture etc etc (and the etc is worse)
This alone mean that Rhaenyra can't inherit the iron throne.
it doesn't.
this is absolute monarchy, the king's words are the law.
@@Nihilanth yaah and look how things went lool
@@levia9349 thanks to the greens, not Rhaenyra.
more than half the realm supported Rhaenyra (56 houses) while the Aegon only had the support of house Hightower, lannister and baratheon (and other 20+ small houses).
house Stark, Tully, Arryn, Velaryon, Greyjoys, they all fought for the dragon queen caring little about what's between her legs
@@Nihilanth exactly as a ruler you solve problems before it becomes a problem Viserys was fool to think some people would fallow his law because he said it lool.
@@Nihilanth she had all these allies but she still couldn't stop her brother from usurping her lool
And she shouldn't have.
The King was just!
The King made piece for the common folk!
The King left his Throne on a pile of Gold!
Everyone after him effed it all up!
Jaehaerys Died aged 69 I think and if he had the vitality of Maester Aemon and died aged 101 I doubt Alicent would have become queen he would have married Rhaenrya and Daemon
Nice
In Indian epic Mahabharata...the whole war wouldn't have happened if Vishma(Debabrata) had become king..same here..if Rhaenys had become the queen..none of this would have happened
No.
Rhaenys Targaryen, the queen who should've been.
The Queen who had no chance in hell 😂😂😂
The civilian killing lunatic? Hell no.
The girlboss who never was. Rest in piss, Rhaenys Targaryen.
All of them
It was really between Viserys and Laenor, son of Raenys. She was never a candidate.
and then viserys named ryaenyra heir, hypocrisy at its finest
Someone didn't learn from the previous ruler lol
Viserys never became king to spite Rhaenys, he was literally elected as king.
Well he didn’t really chose to be king now did he the lords voted him in so how is it hypocritical if he had nothing to do with the choice?
That’s not what hypocrisy means lol
You don't know what hypocrisy even is, do you? I'm assuming English isn't your first language?
I’m still a big believer even to this day that the Curse of Harrenhall and that the Great Council of 101 at Harrenhal itself set things in motion the Dance of the Dragons and the eventual downfall of House Targaryen. no one noticed it, but i think they were cursed.
Supporting Rhaenys and Rhaenyra means supporting Velaryons and Strongs to overthrow the Targaryens, completely stupid.
Same as how supporting Aegon the drunkard meant having the hightowers overthrow the Targaryens, just subtly.
I blame Otto Hightower for the mess that's going on. He's the one who told the king to make Rhaenyra heir to the throne, just because he didn't want Daemon to be king. And now that his grandson is the king's first son he wants everyone to ignore the fact he helped change the line of succession.
Şu sahne gerçekten inanılmaz güzeldi açıp açıp izliyorum Daenerys Targaryen ından 172 sene öncesi yazdığında kalbimi bıraktım.
Anyone find it weird how he had 14 kids and they predeceased him? I have a theory that the faith and maesters were helping the downfall of the Targaryen’s and dragons. May explain why poor Aemma had issues having kids, how Rhaenys only had the twins etc
I agree. It's something fishy. They definitely conspired with the Hightowers.
Ever seen the videos about the Grand Maester Conspiracy? Check them out, the maesters have long planned the fall of house Targaryen, probably since Aegon conquered Westeros
Only if you don't consider how they died. Aegon, Gaemon and Valerion all died stillborn/infancy. Gael committed suicide, Maegelle caught greyscale, and Daenerys died of the shivers. Daella and Alyssa died in childbirth, and Viserra died in what amounted to a drunk driving incident. That just leaves Aemon (who got a crossbow bolt in the throat whilst fighting on Tarth), and Baelon who died of appendicitis. It's hardly suspicious circumstances.
@@matthewhart9610what do you mean driving 😂😂😂
If There Was This Many Dragons And This Many Targarians How Did They Fall
Because like they said after this scene, the fall of House Targaryen can only happen with inside conflict
The civil war but mainly because aegon witnessed the dance of dragons and his mothers death. He had no interest in dragons after the civil war and stopped breeding them. The few the dragon keepers did try to breed were small and sickly. I haven't read the book in a long time but basically that's why they died out. Edit: the aegon I'm talking about was rhaenys son aegon not alicent.
Old king joe
Wow
Rhaenyra actor is doing the narration yes?
With some added voice effects
Ive always felt bad Jaehaerys for having to make this decision. I think deep down he wanted to and probably realized that picking Rhaeyns was the right choice for the long run in terms of stability for the realm. But I think his only main goal was avoiding a civil war within his own family in the present or near future, he failed lol. But my guess is he was probably hoping Viserys would actually be able to make the right choices to appease the Valerions but Visery’s only ever makes things worse lol.
Kinda like most Targaryens, they only make bad decisions, very few of them make ALL the right choices shit I mean even Jaehaerys didn’t manage to accomplish that he gave it a really good shot tho.
He never wanted to make Rhaenys, or any woman, the heir. Even when he was young, Princess Daenerys was older than Prince Aemon and he named Aemon his heir. When Queen Alysanne pointed that out he said "oh they're gonna marry anyway, so it's the same thing".
When Aemon died, he named Baelon his heir and that caused a major argument between Jae and Aly. And when Baelon too died, he held the council(Aly too was dead by then).
@@AxeDharmeyea he always passed over his daughters for his son's it's half the reason his relationship with allysane went bad .
@@AxeDharme amazing king, terrible father
How did you come to this conclusion you are speaking as if you knew Jaehaerys in person lool.
Well, the only reason Jaehaerys became king was because his neices were skipped
I hate how it's portrayed as such a terrible weird thing that a woman wasn't chosen. That's not how it works in royal succession at all
Well good thing this is a fantasy world with dragons and other unrealistic nonsense. You must be fun at parties
That’s Hollywoke for you😒not very realistic
@@LordWyatt that's fantasy for you
They’re trying to show you how they pass over the women heirs just because they are women, despite it would usually be their birth right. This is supposed to be set back when women didn’t necessarily have rights. Yes, its fantasy show but it still draws a little bit of our real life history where similar stuff like this happened to women.🤨
@@nobodyknows1015 actually sorry, inheritance always goes to the first male son, regardless of children birthed before him. That's where the entire conflict arises.
he didn't want to give throne to a black dude😂
Thats corlys
why would he give the throne to a Velaryon?
@@qwertyuiopasdfghjklzxcvbnm.... actually in the books it was Laenor vs Viserys in book though Leanor and Corlys are white.
@@levia9349 clearly he is not talking about the book because as you said the Velaryons are not black
Viserys become king only because he was a male. He later made his daughter as his heir is not just.
He become king because he is male , he benefited from the tradition then he broke it named his daughter as heir, while still have 3 sons. This never work in any dynasty when males line still exist. Just look at British empire, all the queen ascend to the thrones because there are no male left.
Rhaenys would've only be queen if she had married a Targaryen in the first place.
Jaeharys would have married Rhaenys to Viserys after the death of Rhaenys’ dad Aemon… Then Corlys would have been wed to Aemma
Visery broke tradition, dance of dragon won’t happen if he publicly announced Aegon as ruler, Deamond and his daughter will be angry but them will honour his legacy, visery was too soft and emotional to be a king. Aegon is not mad king, he turn out quite merciful at the end. The facts he lose everyone and he still spare deamond children.
His beard isn't long enough to touch the floor!
Worse scene ever 0/10
Do not watch
I dunno man, maybe he just shaved earlier
Baelor probably celebrating somewhere
Viserys was a good king, people blame him for the civil war but it happened after his death. Yes he made some mistakes but he couldn't control everything, I think it was bound to happen at some point anyway.
Nope, the war happened largely because of him, some other characters like Daemon and Otto are also to blame but Viserys holds a large part in it. The reason is because he didn't pick a side. He was neither on the Black side or the Green side, he tried playing both. Because he loved both. He reinstalled Otto as hand and also married his daughter Alicent beforehand giving the greens a lot of power (they also became his regents whilst he was too sickly to govern). For the Black's he made Rhaenyra heir and didn't strip her of the position after Aegon ii was born and he kept allowing Daemon to do whatever he wants with little repercussion, also allowing Daemon and Rhaenyra to marry eachother. Plus he favoured the blacks on the succession crises of Driftmark (even though it was evident Lucerys was not the true heir to House Valeryon).
All he had to do was pick a side. If he favoured the Blacks he should of named someone like Corlys or Daemon as his hand after Lyonels death, he should of made the Lords re swear their oaths to Rhaenyra, he should have made his green children (Aegon, Haleana, Aemond and Daeron) swear oaths to Rhaenyra. He also should have named her regent (instead of Otto and Alicent) whilst he was too sickly so that the change of rulership would pass over easily to Rhaenyra.
If he preferred the Greens he should of never got rid of Otto for his spying of Rhaenyra. He should of named Aegon his heir right after his birth or when he was a teen (if he feared the child's assassination). He should of groomed Aegon ii to be a ruler instead of letting him be a drunkard. He should of recognised Rhaenyra's first children as bastards. He should have never let Rhaenyra and Daemon marry.
There is still a large chance war could break out after his death. Both the Greens and Black's wouldn't be happy if the king had preferred the other in his decisions, however if he did pick a side the other would he greatly handicapped from it leading to a quick end to any war.
But he didn't because he was a good man, bad father, and a terrible king.
@Raylan Givens My answer on how Viserys could've avoided war was from the point of the timeskip (episode 6) so from where I'm writing from this was the ways he could of avoided war. However he could've avoided it even further back, as you stated. He could've named Aegon heir as soon as he was born.
Also about King Viserys remarriage. It was sort of necessary and sort of not. Yes he did need more Targaryens as the house had now dwindled to him, Rhaenyra,Daemon and if you want to count the cousins Rhaenys and her two children ( Vaegon may also still be alive but he's a maester and can't inherit). And if he had wanted to keep Daemon from being closer to the throne in the line of succession then having his male children was a great idea. But to prevent Rhaenyra being pushed aside for another heir there is an even better idea. Have her marry and birth heirs as soon as her naming as heir. In the books this isn't possible as I believe Rhaenyra is about 6 when this happens but in the show she is at least 13. Her and Alicent are the same age and she was able to give the King a son and daughter even before Rhaenyra was betrothed. Yes Rhaenyra would be unhappy being forced to marry so early and without any say but it would be for her benefit (she would probably end up marrying Leanor as she did by the end of her search for a consort). If Rhaenyra was the one to marry and birth children then there would be no need for Alicent and her side of the family. Rhaenyra and her children would of filled in the task of populating house Targaryen and her sons would have a better claim than Daemon and would not rebel against her (like her brothers did). If she decided to have her children secretly with Ser Harwin Strong then there would be no greens to contest her. Daemon may use it to lay a better claim but he was already disinherited by Viserys and would probably have little backing.
@@amanimckenzie32 The war happened because of Viserys lool Jaehaerys has nothing to do with it.
Great Council in the final of Game of Thrones 🤡
My only question is is why the hell did they hold the ceremony in Heron Hall?
This is from an appendix, *"It was held at the enormous, half-ruined castle Harrenhal because it was the only location big enough to fit such a large and unprecedented gathering of all the lords in Westeros."*
How ironic is that men build an empire of dragons and 2 women became the reason for the destruction of both the dragons and the empire! but I still like both the women - it is all a game of perspective of narration
Men? You certainly are forgetting Rhaenys and Visenya.
@@Emy-fv5ny No I didnot just like I said Men Build it by 'MEN' I mean Aegon and Rhaenys and Visenya were there every step to help him buid it. They didnot build it to be the Empress of the 7KDs by that i mean Sole Ruler themselves. I love both Daenarys and Rhaenera's Chracter. Its just a 3rd person perspective of the story and the fate of HOTD
@@ASXTech They both reigned with him.
@@Emy-fv5ny Yes just like every other queen did BESIDE their Husband "The lord of the 7 Kingdoms, Proector of the Realm + + +" etc. #TheKING. but I aknowledge that they were very powerful queens
@@ASXTech No, most queens didn't have much influence on the ruling. Visenya and Rhaenys did, they took decision by their own, apart from their husband, meaning they didn't have to ask for his permission.
Pain in rhaenys eyes but who cares 🤣🤣
I don't understand why they didn't start the series with Targaryens how they start and this kingdom was build
Because it's too expesive to adapt the conquest. They will need a huge budget on FX alone, imagine to animate Aegon's dragon.
I hear they will planning in doing an animation of the conquest.
Technically Rheanys would never have sat the throne officially anyways. Fire and blood stipulates this stating it would pass to Laenor when he came of age
Yes, but she still wouod have several years of ruling in his name...Now that we know how thing ended that idea didn't sound so bad.
How are they cousins but have the same father
King had a younger brother...and Viserys is his son
She is the son of the eldest son. Viserys is the grandson.
@@pushpamurthy962no. Theybare both grandchildren.
Their fathers were brothers. Rhaenys from the elder, Viserys from the younger.
I read all the comments here to try and figure it out, yet left with more questions than answers.
What episode was this?
1st
@@TheSeriesLover444 I dont remember that at all haha
The first part of the first episode.
No grand speech? No display of wealth and strength? What kind of kingsmoot is this? Drowned priests been shaking their heads rn
Rhaenys… you are NOT the father.
That would be the biggest mistake that would be made
And why is that?
@@perun6318 Because Viserys was a lovely person, but ultimately too weak to be king. His errors and his inability to deal with the consequences are largely to blame for the Dance. Rhaenys, on the other hand, is shown to have a much more decisive and firm personality, and is also more cunning. Chances are she would’ve been a better monarch than Viserys.
@@bebelc2l And don’t you think if Rhaenys was queen we wouldn’t have Aegon II and illegitimate children fighting over succession he became weak after Aemmas passing
@@bebelc2l agreed
@@bebelc2l You are forgetting one key thing here; Rhaenys was a woman. She could be the Conqueror reborn, but it wouldn’t matter, because the only thing the Lords of the Realm would see was woman trying to order them around, and they wouldn’t stand for it. Jaehaerys knew that because, unlike his grandson, he was blessed with the gift of good sense and foresight. He knew that naming a woman as heir to Iron Throne would cause the Realm to implode into civil war, much like it did decades later because Viserys couldn’t follow his grandfather’s footsteps.
🙂
wait i don’t remember this scene from HOTD
It was literally the first scene.
@@corbans5796 😂
House of the Sexism 🤣🤣🤣
Of course
Who narrates this scene? Rhaenys?
I think it was Aemma
Rhaenyra targaryen
@@julialima3951 yes Rhaenyra, sorry I'm getting the names mixed up with Queen Aemma and Emma D'Arcy lol
rhaeneyra narrated that.
@@Deepak__MehtaIs her crispy fried ghost narrating? The whole premise makes Zero sense because she gets killed in the end.
What was the reason for saying "a women" at the end we can tell lol
that the women where not fitt to rule in the civilains and councils eyes
Couldn’t they marry Viserys to Rhanys?
They were both already married, and Rhaeys had kids with Corlys.
Seriously, there's "democratic legitimacy" for Aegon II. If Viserys truly wants Rhaenyra to inherit his throne, he should hsve made another vote. Instead he just made the lords swear an oath to Rhaenyra. Got a good heart, but a terrible king
This proves men of the realm will not allow a woman to rule
And rigthly so.
In a medieval and male centric world when there are wars to fight, who would want a woman who couldn't even use a sword. Most women in that era were submissive to men, so who would respect the authority of a woman.
Besides, Rhaenyra didn't even fight in the dance of dragons (if I am not mistaken), but Aegon ( a drunk whore) did, she would have made a horrible queen. Daenerys went crazy, and what about Cercei? Bad examples for queens.
cant blame them
Sexism is everywhere what can u expect???
@@Piotr12396 somethings are just for good
Which is this place
Harrenhall
Why are they meetting in harrenhall instead of kings landing
@@aravindmohan5507 in the books, it was explained that Harrenhall is very large to host a huge gathering of people and during the vote at least 1000 lords arrived. Bonus that Harrenhall is the largest of all castles in Westeros.
Isn't it Jaehaerys giving the announcement? Not a Maester or the Grandmaester?
GODS I wish we get a show with Robert's rebellion so we can see more targaryens biting the dust.Thats what we needed from the start not some lame Targaryen show
Yeah Robert's Rebellion would be epic. Too much this franchise is becoming The Dragon show.
I'm even up for the Blackfyre Rebellion with Daeron/Baelor/Maekar and Bloodraven vs Daemon Blackfyre and Bittersteel.
@@gerardjagrooThen stop watching.
If i was Rhaenys i will ride Meleys and burn them all. I won't let my cousin or father will have a chance to ride their dragons.😂😂😂😂😂
Mm..
Jeaherys had Vermithor at that time.
And Daemon who supported Viserys had Caraxes.
Rheanys and Meleys would have been dead of they tried that...
@@siran424 well Meleys is too fast for both two dragons.
@@siran424 And Jahearys is too old. And Vicery that time no longer have dragon that time since Balerion is dead if i am not mistaken so it eill only be Caraxes vs Meleys and Queen Aemma don't know if she did claim a dragon. But both Meleys and Caraxes were stated if one on one they can defeat Vhagar which Caraxes did due to Meleys died because of unfair fight.
@@whitesage2066
Meleys is just fast that's about it.
Caraxes alone is enough to rip apart Meleys, let alone Caraxes and Vermithor together.
Queen Aemma ?? You mean Alysanne ?? She was dead already at that point.
And nope neither Caraxes nor Melys can defeat Vhagar alone and come out alive. It was never stated as such anywhere in the source material.
@@siran424 I am talking Rhaenyra's mother and no Meleys is too fast to Caraxes and let alone that Caraxes is an inch large than Meleys. But it was already stated duhhhhh search and look for more and besides ehen Vhagar and Caraxes fight and even both of them died. Caraxes was consider the winner. And yeah during the battle of Meleys, Sunfyre and Vhagar it stated that Meleys can easily finish Sunfyre and also Meleys also have a high chance of winning agaisnt Vhagar.
I think viserys should have named aegon heir it would have solved the succession and stoped the dance of dragons
I think Viserys should not have remarried. Happy ending for everyone and no one would be cheated of their birthright.
He already named Rhaenyra. Also I bet as he Aegon grew Viserys saw he was an idiot unfit to rule.
@@Emy-fv5ny the only reason I think Aegon was like that was that he wasn’t shaped to rule and if he was named he would have been more prepared and been a better person overall
@@Mrprince4245 Aegon didn't have to wait to be named it was his duty to prepare himself just in case he was named by his father or Rhaenyra died, like Aemond did.
@@Emy-fv5ny yea I see your point but like if he was the uncontested heir and he wasn’t passed over for Rhaenyra he would’ve been trained to be king and not expected to be king
I don't think Old Valaryan cared abut gender. When Aegon and his sisters conquered they basically had to deal with Westeros trying to get them to conform to their standards. Among that was male only heirs.
If Valyrians had equal gender traditions, then Visenya would've been the lady of Dragonstone at the time of the Conquest. But she wasn't, and they didn't.
The Rhoynar have gender equality and the Lengi have females only succession. They're pretty much the only exceptions.
Democracy sucks huh? Lol
democracy only works when it favors the winning side if not, Fuck Democracy Go Dictatorship!
FYI this was the choice of Hundred of Lords and not the Jaehers' choice
What exactly do you mean?
No traitors suck.
@@leahwhiteley5164
Viserys was the biggest traitor of that time.
Many people here claim that Great Council was a way to prevent war.
Firstly, Rhaenys is and was heir in accordance to Andal law. Yes, she is a woman, but women come before their uncles in terms of succesion.
Starks for example married nieces to their uncles one time due to girls being the heirs. Alys Karstark is regarded as heir instead of her uncle. Of course, these women often struggle and many times people ignore the law.
Yes, the succession was muddied a bit because Rhaenys' father Aemon died before he became the king. But he was prince of Dragonstone, rightful heir.
And yet, king names his son Baelon, Viserys' and Daemon's father... because council makes a decision. When its member, Corlys Velaryon, is away, and another member, Aemon, suspiciously died because they apparently they shot him in place of someone else.
But Baelon dies too. And puppet's show known as Great Council happens.
Rhaenys and Corlys overpower Viserys' faction. Yes, both parties have a dragon on their side, Laenor has little Seasmoke.
But if we do not count dragons... then it would be Rhaenys' victory.
How did the Great Council untimately voted? The numbers were not revealed, convinientely.
We know though that Rhaenys' side was supported by Baratheons (who shared Rhaenys blood), Velaryon's bannermen and... Starks and most/all their bannermen with house Blackwood.
We are told that Viserys won by the score of 20:1. But apart from masters we have no mention of any house publicly declating for him.
Why would not lords want Rhaenys? Rhaenys is an adult, dragonrider, with two children and married to one of the most powerful lord in the kingdom. She has two heir, daughter and son, who is even a dragonrider. But most importanly... Rhaenys is heir according to rules followed by most lords. You want Rhaenys to be queen so no futute succession of any house in the realm is questioned (or at least not in most of the houses.
It was a big scheme by a Citadel, and this is not just a Blacks' propaganda 😅
No.
Misogyny at its finest
Definitely. And Jaehaerys that old f..cker refused to recognized Rhaenys right even when that cost him the relation with his wife.
Biggest mistake.
So the precedent for selecting the oldest male heir over the oldest descendant is already there but this idiot Viserys couldn't simply stick to what made him King in the first place?
They really try to push the 'The only reason she didn't get the throne is because she's a woman' narrative, when in the books thats not even the main reason Viserys is chosen over her. The first and most important reason she's looked over despite her stronger claim, is because she's married to a Valaryon, and her would be heir is also a Valaryon, which would in name, end the 'Targaryen' rule.
What episode was this?
this was the very first scene of the series.