Debunking the 10-core Ryzen 7800X
Вставка
- Опубліковано 1 чер 2024
- Is the 10-core AMD Ryzen 7 7800X CPU real or fake? Does such a processor even make sense in AMD's line-up? Could the "7800" name be reserved for a upcoming 7800X3D with 3D V-Cache? Let's talk about it!
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Chapters
0:00 7800X Geekbench "leak"
1:00 Chips & Cheese fake
2:08 Is a 10-core possible?
5:49 Just a higher clocked 8-core?
7:25 7800X3D / Zen 4 3D V-Cache
Links:
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chipsandcheese.com/2022/10/27...
• AMD Ryzen 7 7700X Revi...
• AMD Needs To Cut Price... - Наука та технологія
Disabling 3 out of 8 cores in each CCD to get a 10c CPU is quite wasteful. Assuming these chiplets have high yield, I suspect most of them are going to go to higher end SKUs or server. But I think you're right about the X3D - that would make the 7800X3D quite different from the rest of the lineup and not have the pricing pressure that a "normal" 7800X would have.
If we get a 10C Zen 4, I think 5+5 or maybe 6+4 are most likely. But then again, I dont think the "7800" will be a 10C CPU. Lets see what AMD does, because if its combined with a reduction in MSRP, it might just work for a new line-up. $250 = 6-cores, $350 = 8-cores, $450 = 10-cores, $550 = 12-cores and $700 = 16-cores.
If we saw this happen no doubt about it we would get a 20 core cpu most likely called the Ryzen 9 7970X or 7990X. But honestly I would like to see them fix the Ryzen 9 X3D CPUs by adding X3D on both dies instead of one.
70s and 90s are actually used for Threadripper line up, the Ryzen namings are up to x950X like 3950X, 5950X. So it could be a 7950X or 7955X
@@jcgongavoe337 That makes a bit more sense.
AMD brought revolution in CPUs by offering "more cores" products with great cost value - as it is now Intel even having an inferior manufacturing process is doing the exact same thing and remains highly competitive. They already knew about the big/little approach of Intel but I believe their reaction was short-sighted. They should have upped the CCDs to 10 cores per chip and push aggressively with more competitive prices. That would give them a clear edge over Intel and would allow for even greater market share. Derbauer posted a video deliding a 7600x only to find it was a '2 CCD'. Given that each 7950X has a production cost of around 70 USD tells a lot. I believe we will soon evidence this economic bubble in high tech products starting to burst.
The think is, if you are primarily a gamer and otherwise only do light productivity, 6- & 8-core CPUs are still plenty fast. You wont really benefit from the E-cores on Raptor Lake.
But since Raptor Lake also competes (and even wins) in gaming, its a no brainer. A 13600K gives you 7600X levels of gaming performance, but 7700X+ levels of productivity.
AMD prices Zen 4 too high, they need to react imho.
Would someone please explain to me how the embedded 5900n10core was configured. as that was not faked . was it 6,4? also is the 4-core 7300 also faked.
Good question, but I dont know the answer. I think 5+5 is most likely, but 6+4 also could work. Anything else (like 7+4 or 8+2 ) isnt really feasible.
Lets see if I cant find out what they actually used.
@@HighYield MLID thinks the 10c 7800x is real and is being widely tested. Its in his latest video. btw, I think its a good idea if you reach out and guest star in one of his podcasts. I imagine most of his followers would be interested in your videos.
I was thinking a 7-core Ryzen 5 or a 14-core Ryzen 9 was going to be more likely. A 10-core would be binned relatively hard compared to what we saw in Zen 3 and I expected in Zen 4.
Ryzen 9 5900E embedded was a 10 core Zen 3 chip.
Yeah, especially this close to the launch I dont think we will see a 10-core, but since AM5 and Zen 4 isnt selling well, AMD might have to change the line-up. A new 10-core, combined with price cuts, could work.
3:50 I am pretty sure you know about this guy and maybe you even saw his todays vid: ua-cam.com/video/YAWZd6kfVV8/v-deo.html
I am confused, but if AMD has so many defective Yields, even the early annoucement of "7300X" is possible...
( but I still didnt get, why they let the CCX in the package just disabled and not remowed it at all )
Yeah, I saw the video from der8auer. We've had things like this in the past with Zen 3 too. My guess is this was supposed to become a 7900X, but then one chiplet died during packaging and AMD turned it into a 7600X.
AMD badly need the 7800X3D to push back against Raptor Lake. Use binning to drop the price on the 7600X where Intel is clearly winning the $$ to performance battle with the 13600. This would also maintain a degree of sense in the product stack. 7900/7950 for productivity. 7800X3D for gamers and 7600ish for budget (if the price drops along with cheaper motherboards).
I think AMD knows this and thats why we will see a 7700 non-X soon-ish. And a 7600 non-X could also be a good idea, at $200-250 maybe.
Another reason higher clocked 7800X doesn’t make sense is AMD is actively marketing different CPU bios mode, eco mode aside, the all core OC is basically overclock it till it’s thermal throttling, but as shameless as a big company also they might do it since selling basically the same CPU for higher price
AMD made a OEM only 10 core Ryzen 5000 CPU.
You are right! Probably the same model as the 5900E.
Zen4c with half L3, reduced frequencies and voltage allowing compact cores, probably really is possible though.
The 10c/20t rumours never made sense, except in the embedded space where they may be competing against Intel SKUs and/or scavenging old chiplets.
Lower price on Ry9 7900x makes more sense to compete with i7 13th gen.
The Zen 3 10-core CPUs (for OEM and embedded only) came almost two years after the Zen 3 launch, so AMD had time to collect dies with more than two defective chips. I dont think there are many Zen 4 chiplets with that kind of binning requirement, so it has to be a conscious decision from AMD, for example combined with a price cut, just like I theorized in the video. I dont think we will see Zen4c on AM5, Threadripper is something else tho.
Do you think we will get a 10-core Ryzen 7000 in the coming month?
@@HighYield I think they are considering the options.
10c/20t dual chiplet seems like a bitter pill to swallow outside of the embedded space.
Cut done Zen4c is probably the only way AMD would release a 10 core cpu this generation.
Ryzen 9 5900E was a 10 core Zen 3.
I dont think we will see Zen4c on AM5, maybe for Zen 4 Threadripper?
it would not make sense, because the chiplets are 6 and 8 core? Just guessing here.
I expect the 3D chip to be an 8 core with that extra layer of cache, and sit between the 7700x and 7900x in the lineup.
TL;DR I want to buy a Ryzen for AV production, but prices have to come down a bit. Other options are a 13600K and Mac Mini M2.
No, not exactly. Each CCD is 8 cores. The r5 x600(x) uses a single CCD where 2 cores are disabled (probably because they were damaged or with defects) , while the r9 x900(X) uses two of these CCDs with two disabled cores.
Chiplets are 8-cores only, the 7600X and 7900X use partially disabled chiplets with only 6-cores active.
And I agree, I think the 7800X3D will be 8-cores + 3D V-Cache, but be priced closer to the 7900X.
With zen 2 / zen 3 we saw that the two chiplet designs often outperformed even in gaming workloads that didn't need all the threads because the dual chiplet SKU's have higher memory bandwidth. That outlier case with the 7700x winning, and the idea of less latency with a single die, in reality just doesn't play a determinative role very often, in comparison to the higher memory bandwidth of having 2 CCD's, which frequently offered an advantage.
But I don't like the idea of a 10 core it seems wasteful, and I hate artificially disabling working parts of products to sell for less money, because I know they could have given me the fully working product for the same money and it wouldn't have cost them more to make. I'd be happy with an 8 core 3d cache cpu for gaming, at 400 bucks. they should get rid of their non 3d cache 8 cores for 350 and just not even make them anymore unless they can sell them for close to 300 bucks and the 6 core for 250 or less. why make both versions unless the non 3d cache version can be a way cheaper per core budget option? otherwise, all the CPU's should simply be the best design they can produce, which is the 3d cache variant.
I think most of the cases where single-CCD > dual-CCD are due to bad scheduling, not the chiplet architecture itself. And I agree, I dont really like the idea of a 10-core 7800X, aside from a possible integration with an overall price adjustment. I don't think we will see a 10C Zen 4 CPU anytime soon (at least not as a non OEM/embedded part).
Both the 7700 and 7600 non-X are on the way and they can be integrated into AMDs line-up without lowering the MSRP of existing parts too soon.
I'm pretty Sure 7800x3d will be very fast
Cant lose with this statement ;)
7800X3D with slightly higher clockes would be sick
Even with slightly lower clocks it would still rule gaming by a long shot. 200-300MHz less than a 7700X would be 4-5% less max. clk speed, but also better efficiency. Then add 20%+ more IPC due to the 3D V-Cache on top and you are still plenty fast. It will be interesting to see, if AMD's 2nd gen X3D CPUs can manage the same clk speeds as non-X3D parts.
I dont think it is really doable today with zen4 because from what I heard the zen4 uses two ccx per ccx compared to with zen3 when it was 1 ccx per ccd, and it would introduce perf issues as the cpu is now a heterogenous solution/design so to speak.
I'm pretty sure the CCX/CCD config is the same with Zen 3 and Zen 4. Both have an 8-core CCX on each CCD, only Zen 2 had two CCX on a CCD.
AMD most definitely has ccds that have only 4 or 5 cores working. There is not likely many of them but I assure you there are some. 7800x is 10c and 7800x3d is 8c + vcache. 💥💥💥
For sure, there also have to be chiplets with all cores non-functional. The question is, are there enough "natural" 5-core chiplets for a 7800X or would AMD have to disable working cores? And a 10-core 7800X plus a 8-core 7800X3D seems off to me.
If they wanted to do something they should put out 7600 / 7700 non-X sooner to go for that value customer, and V-Cache models for the enthusiast gaming customer. And adjust prices after that if they're still not happy with the sales. 7600X and 7700X are for early adopters (?), I don't think they'll sell so well going forward.
There is a lot of room to cut price of the small one. Its BOM is $49 according to TechTechPotato. BOM of the big 2 CCD models is $69 per the same source, but no need to cut prices on those because they compete unlike the small ones.
I agree, AMD needs to act on pricing, especially since B650 is still pretty expensive atm. A $200-250 "7600 non-X" and a $300-350 "7700 non-X" would be a good start. Then add the 7800X3D early next year, and AM5 is back on track.
We know this 6 + 4 just 2 good from Intel...pls stop it, better give us a 7800x3D
I'm not too sure, since AMD doesnt use different cores (big.LITTLE) like Intel does. 5+5 could also work.
I will try to find out how AMD solved the 10-core Zen 3 CPUs, maybe that would indicate what they might use for Zen 4.
I dont know if i will be viewing this channel for much longer for some reason you think NVIDIA is not scamming the people who buy from them but wait EVGA so we know that they are a trash corp. but you defended them in your last video so i will give you a month to redeem yourself LETS GO