Alan Moore & H.P. Lovecraft: The Courtyard, Neonomicon and Providence
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- Опубліковано 5 жов 2024
- A look at three Lovecraft inspired miniseries published by Avatar Press. Entirely written by Alan Moore and illustrated by Jacen Burrows.
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#Comics #ModernAge #AvatarPress #AlanMoore #Lovecraft #Cthulhu
"Without humans, Cthulhu wouldn't be born" - Yes, that's exactly what happened in the real world, you see
Providence is really just an example of Alan Moore's shift from more traditional storytelling into psychogeography writing. His friend and author Iain Sinclair is one of the best in this genre, and I think Moore has stated before that Sinclair is one of his favorite living authors in general. The main character in his 1,000+ page book Jerusalem is essentially the city of Northampton itself. In psychogeography, the writer is more concerned with bringing out the essence and importance of a particular place, and its effect on people, than they are with characters or plot. The characters really only exist to help flesh out the idea of the location being written about.
Also, Moore's views on reality don't lend themselves well to adapting Lovecraft. He considers himself a practicing wizard and believes that real magic is synonymous with art because both involve the manipulation of symbols to alter human perception. For him, human perception is the focal point of reality and any significant change in the world really reflects a change in human perception (i.e. we are the center of our universe). For Lovecraft, as rightly pointed out towards the end of the video, the horror lies in the fact that humans are not the center of anything but are instead powerless observers to the inscrutable workings of a strange and uncaring universe.
@Heartattack 77 People often have this confusion about the double slit experiment. The experiment shows that observation has an effect on the outcome but "observation" refers to the measuring device one uses and not to us just looking. It isn't about our will. Here is a more thorough explanation I found:
"The observer is a black-box type of description of a more involved physical concept behind, namely that of interactions and measurements."
"I guess you already know that we cannot visually see say an electron as that would imply probing the electron with the visible part of the light spectrum and in this range the wavelengths are too large compared to the system size to be probed."
"But more generally, when we observe something experimentally, some form of interaction takes place, for example a scattering between the electron and a photon coming from a detector. In doing so we inevitably change the state of our system, and this is hidden behind that experimental act of observation."
"To give you more intuition, take a particle under a microscope. The precision of position measurements of the particle is limited by the resolution of our microscope which itself is limited by the wavelength λ of the light used. In order to improve this, λ has to be made as small as possible, which results in using more energetic photons. The scattering that results between the photon and our system will jolt the system, and cause its momentum to change. All this process can be labeled as observing the position of a particle."
A deep dive into Grant Morrison's NAMELESS might provide an interesting comparison. His version of mind-melting, cosmic madness is a total trip. Moore and Morrison, those two crazy kids...
It's strange that you expect Moore to be Lovecraft. Why do we need two Lovecrafts?
I loved them all but then I love anything and everything that Alan Moore has done.
I loved them all too...though providence was my favorite.
Pretty sure this critique completely misses the point of Providence. Anyone who's not familiar with Moore's views on magic and its relationship to fiction isn't getting the whole picture.
(Spoilers.)
Providence isn't an attempt to subvert Lovecraft's work: it's a meta-story that enfolds Lovecraft's canon. It's theorizing that the stories in the Cthulu Mythos wanted to be written, and chose Lovecraft as their vehicle/host. Robert Black comes across like a typical Lovecraftian protagonist because he's the original-the template on which all Lovecraft protagonists are based. Providence is positing that the Mythos was not Lovecraft's invention: according to this interpretation, Lovecraft plagiarized the stories in the Cthulu mythos directly from Black's experiences-and Black was pushed along the path of those experiences in order to transmit them to Lovecraft. The stories wanted to be plagiarized, published, and popularized in order to change the nature of our reality. It's got some really interesting things to say about fiction and authorship (notice how the protagonist was essentially writing his own story without realizing it?) and the nature of reality itself, as well as the unlikely and uncannily outsized role that a dime-novel crank like Lovecraft would have on Western culture.
Moore, with his understanding of how magic works, believes that influential narratives don't "just" happen by chance, nor are they entirely the product of their authors: they're the projections of forces from within the Immaterial that are deliberately inserting themselves into our dimension.
Exactly, there's a sense of inevitability to Robert's story. He's been set on this path by transcendental forces which don't care about him at all. He's tortured and abused and ultimately discarded just so that some incel can write some short stories that will, 100 years later, alter collective human perception
I agree, this review of Providence is problematic. It doesn't seem like the reviewer read the same comics I did.
@Heartattack 77 I don't have my copy of Providence at hand right now, and didn't even realize at the time that Neonomicon and Courtyard were connected stories, so my interpretation might be incomplete.
I think the ending is Moore's fulfillment of this question: What is it about the Mythos that has proved to be so appealing to a mainstream audience, and so durable over time? The panel montage in Providence as the story jumps forward from Black's/Lovecraft's time to the present day is a reflection of what we see happening in our own culture: something about these lurid, pulpy stories took hold of our collective imagination and spread their influence much wider than would be expected. You or I can drop into any Barnes & Noble in the country and pick up a plush doll or a board game featuring Cthulhu. The influence of these ideas and these figures have spread far beyond what Lovecraft could have imagined in his wildest dreams. So what's driving that?
If you're inclined to a materialist understanding, you could hand-wave it away as just coincidence, or just irony, or just an appealing idea. Moore doesn't see it that way. There's no such thing as *just* an appealing idea in Moore's universe. If ideas are essentially magic, then the idea of the Elder Gods has its own magic, and is spreading as a result of its own power.
The Necronomicon is a good example of this: the book itself never existed to begin with. But there was an idea that such a book should exist, and so people "discovered" bits and pieces of something that eventually amounted to a real Necronomicon. The book began as an idea, spread, and essentially willed itself into being.
The end of Providence is this same process on a planetary scale. The Lovecraft Mythos was the toehold that the Elder Gods used to push their way out of the dream reality-the Immaterial-and to bring their reality to our dimension. The material world is something that we created as a prison for these ancient, immaterial powers: by not thinking about the true nature of reality, i.e. their reality, we were able to keep them locked up, and allowed our own more tolerable version of reality to take over. The end of Providence is that more ancient reality reasserting itself over the narrow reality that we've constructed for ourselves.
The real head-tripper is that, in Moore's formulation of these ideas, he's essentially casting himself and his work as literally serving the Elder Gods. Providence makes us imagine them; imagining them makes them more real; the more people for whom they become real, the stronger they become, and the easier it is for those ideas to reshape our reality. If you look at how our collective understanding of the universe and our place in it has changed via Lovecraft, this is already happening. These ideas are literally changing our reality.
Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn.
@@ryan00miga This is a very through analysis of the series. I was inclined to think that the review is onto something but now I want to reread Providence for myself.
This is an excellent analysis. I feel Moore's interpretation of the Mythos and the nature of the narrative until its ending fits quite well along other presentations in some of his works, such as Promethea or even the penultimate and last installments of the League of Extraordinary Gentlemen in regards to this perceived intertwining of Magic (as Art) and Fiction.
I think you’re forgetting that Lovecraft encouraged authors to take and twist the mytho’s, he created. I always kinda roll my eyes when people criticize Lovecraft inspired works for not adhering to the “canon”. The canon was meant to be fluid. Do Moore’s work differ fro, the underpinning philosophy’s of Lovecraft’s writing. Sure, but that;s not entirely a bad thing.
That wasn't even just a Lovecraft thing, pulp fiction authors were just like that. Also Alan Moore wrote this to pay off taxes so he didn't actually give a fuck lol
It honestly makes sense that Moore would put humanity into such a big focus, considering his Hermiticist and magical beliefs place human imagination as the source of magic. Since humans are beings capable of imagination and creativity, they are portals to "divine" places, and thus have that importance within them.
I read all of it. I think you are right in that Moore was trying to subvert Lovecraft. It is exactly what he always does, to be fair: Take something that is popular and rearrange it in a way that changes it's original perspective. I am not surprised that he did the same here, although i think it whould have been more interesting to see him create a cosmic horror story unbound by the conventions of other writers.
Good morning to all of you.
And a good morning to you!
This sounds more graphic than Garth Ennis's stories on the Boys and Punisher MAX.
Ennis’s work on Crossed on the other hand...
Johnny Carcosa...Ha! King in yellow reference
Great series I bought them all when I collected a bunch of comics in bulk and was pleasantly surprised at how engaging the story was and how detailed the occult references
I think you missed with Neonomicon the craft and skill Moore had used to lay a foundation of clues from the Courtyard to Neonomicon #3 that let you translate the confusing conversations and understand what was happening before Neonomicon #4 came out - the effect is much more pronounced in serialised format (and it was many months before #4 came out) than when its in a collected graphic novel. But the conspiracy theories and forum chats we had on it back then were fascinating: www.bleedingcool.com/2011/01/05/rereading-and-translating-neonomicon-3/
When talking about this series
The obnoxious term “problematic” actually fits perfectly
_Providence_ is Alan Moore putting Lovecraft through the same deconstruction as he did superheroes with _Watchmen_ and it shows both Moore's inherent strengths and weaknesses as a writer. Deconstruction and references only work good and proper if you know what it references, and Lovecraft is not mainstream enough for everyone to pick up on these subtleties. That leaves Moore as a storyteller. And as far as storytellers go, he is rather weak. He always was. He is a great writer, but not a great storyteller.
I say this as someone who does love reading him, but if you take away Moore's highly intellectual crutches, he will often stumble
He is the quintessential Pop-Post-Modernist-Grandpappy, which is why his impact on pop culture has been mostly negative, since everybody after him took the deconstruction bit but were not equipped with the obsession in research that manufactures Moore's crutches. _Providence_ is also a very well written commentary on homosexuality in the early 20th century, and I did thoroughly - enjoy is the wrong word - I appreciated it. Considering the dissolution of anything real in today's times, to be replaced by an ever more delusional "reality" in which everything is or isn't real, depending on what you choose to see, the ending to is even more poignant than it was a few years ago
_Neonomicon_ was probably one of the few horror books I found genuinely terrifying. I find the complete "oh mah gawd, how awful must his mind be" to be unintentionally funny. Moore essentially deconstructs the Virgin Mary mythology through the lense of Lovecraftian horror. It is genuinely creepy and terrifying, to be "chosen", innit?
I've never read any Lovecraft stories (that I know of) but I still found the series interesting. Providence was similar to From Hell for me because while I wasn't too familar with the source details (who hasn't heard of Cthulhu?) reading about and discovering the stories' inspirations was part of the fun.
12 minutes of review and not a single mention of the man most responsible for creating the book, artist JACEN BURROWS. Sad.
They mention him at the beginning
As someone worth a deep irrational phobia of sea creatures, I love this so much. I'm half joking because maybe that terror is what Lovecraft's characters feel at the abominations. That's an interesting insight, to me personally.
The illuminatus trilogy by Robert A. Wilson talks about a conspiracy about Lovecraft, I think that is where he took that idea since he is fan of R. A. W.
The Courtyard was good as a self-contained story. I wasn't able to put my finger on what exactly rubbed me the wrong way about Neonomicon and Providence, but this definitely helped clarify it.
Your video about these particular comics is of much more interest to me than actually reading them myself.
As stated in the video, considering the content, it's hard to recommend the work. But I'm glad the video was interesting. Thanks!
The "sex addict" thing about Brears is that she is the inverse of the Virgin Mary character. It isnt some cheap gimmick either but rather impels the reader to re-consider the virgin/god rape sexuality implicit in all of our world mythologys. I dont get where people and lit study undergrads are objecting to the fiction for the monster/god/rape as if it is a subtle element that has escaped the authors control and execution. This is not RCRUMB depicting his fantasies or some dumb Red Sonja depicting fantasy. Its a horror story written to disturb. Moore is one of our times greatest writers. His monster rape is fucking brutal and horrific. Are you upset with being horrified by his cartoon? I dont get it. If you were horrified and provoked it worked. Ive never thought "This SHUD NOT EXIST" as if it were a Statue of a Confederate Slaver in the middle of a southern town square. Wtf?
“You’ll know them by their fruits”.
I disagree on a few of your points but I appreciate the thought and effort you put into making them.
I’d rather not get into a debate or long winded discussion but I’d like to point out a couple of things that you may have missed (or may not have thought were important) but I think have some value.
As you rightly pointed out, Lovecraft often alludes to unspeakable acts in his stories - yet he leaves it up to the reader to determine what those unspeakable acts may be. He implies but rarely delves further than a passing mention as to what they may be. In a world where acts that would have been seen as vile during Lovecraft’s era can be easily accessed on devices in the palm of our hands, Moore had to figure out how he could be shocking and horrifying yet still in Lovecraft’s milieu. Give the neonomicon another look and notice how he accomplished this by showing the “orgy” (which is the magical rite used to summon the “fish man”) via description and implication (given that the victim doesn’t have her glasses and can truly visualize what’s happening to her). It’s a new spin on Lovecraft that is indeed shocking and repulsive- that was Moore’s intention and, given that your reaction (and mine!) was discomfort and revulsion, he definitely succeeded in that regard.
You were also remiss in not mention Jacen Burrows’ fantastic artwork on Providence. It’s understated where it should be and horrific when it needs to be. He accomplishes everything Moore asks of him and is a valuable contributor to the story.
Thanks for your vids. I enjoy them even when I don’t always agree!
True Detective ! I like some of the monsters depicted like the ball of mouths and tentacles. Very HPL, as well as the fish people. That always reminds me of Shadow over Innsmouth.
Literally the only quality review of this series from Alan Moore. Maybe even the only review on youtube I've enjoyed watching. Thanks for reviewing one of my favorite comics dude. Totally appreciate your take on it, and comics in general.
you are making the best and most interesting comic book videos on the youtube
Thank you! Spread the word. :)
While you’re not wrong about Lovecraft’s intent, I would argue it is extremely evident in Providence that subverting this was Moore’s intention. Lovecraft’s stories were hopeless because his world view was hopeless, and Moore is saying fuck that. If your world view is hopeless and you wish he would have stuck to Lovecraft’s intentions, that’s your opinion. But what Moore is ultimately saying is that art (writing) changes consciousness, and writing with a world view of hopelessness will only perpetuate hopelessness in the audiences world views. A more responsible use of creativity is to use it to create hope. I tend to agree with him.
I disagree. I find this trilogy quite engaging and meaningful. Specially Providence. Alan Moore at his best.
I don't think the Deep One sex in Neonomicon is problematic at all, I think anglo sensibilities have been taken slightly off mark by an obsessive and unaccurate -and strangely puritan- preocupation on so-called gender issues. Moore's output has taken a few jabs out of that gender fad, and that Neonomicon little controversy is an example of it.
Being against rape or caring about gender issues isn't exclusively an "anglo sensibility" you dolt. Saying this as an Indonesian.
@@Kriskazam
Jeff Fudesco
4 months ago (edited)
The "sex addict" thing about Brears is that she is the inverse of the Virgin Mary character. It isnt some cheap gimmick either but rather impels the reader to re-consider the virgin/god rape sexuality implicit in all of our world mythologys. I dont get where people and lit study undergrads are objecting to the fiction for the monster/god/rape as if it is a subtle element that has escaped the authors control and execution. This is not RCRUMB depicting his fantasies or some dumb Red Sonja depicting fantasy. Its a horror story written to disturb. Moore is one of our times greatest writers. His monster rape is fucking brutal and horrific. Are you upset with being horrified by his cartoon? Its a fiction. I dont get it. If you were horrified and provoked it worked. Ive never thought "This SHUD NOT EXIST" as if it were a Statue of a Confederate Slaver in the middle of a southern town square. Wtf?
I'm born and raised in Providence Rhode island.. still live here..✌️✌️
This channel has the dopest thumbnails!
I still need to read these books. Oddly enough, the last story reminds me of a comic my cousin told me about about Lovecraft meeting all of the beings he wrote about.
Moore's Avatar era is truly a strange beast. I just recently ordered the box set of Cinema Purgatorio, and don't really know what to expect.
That series is a rather odd mix of material from a variety of talent. Results vary, one could say. I'm still reading it, so my opinion is developing.
All the stories different from each other. And of course Alan's weird af. Loved it.
I love Avatar Press
Loved the Machen reference, one of my favourite authors 😊
You've now got me interested in your thoughts on Moore's Fashion Beast limited series.
I'm glad Moore was able to finish the series before Avatar went on their current pause cycle. I don't think we'll ever see those last few issues of Uber Invasion. :(
Please tell me what is with Avatar. I love a lot of their stories because of freedom authors have but many of them are unfinished. Ferals, Dan the unharmable, Uber atc. I know they had some problems because of covid but are they planning some comeback or new issues?
Even Alan Moore seems dismissive of this series. It's not one he's super proud of, as I've read.
That was my interpretation of his opinion concerning Neonomicon.
Interesting
“One can easily argue that rape isn’t sex”?? Only if one is a gender studies “academic” or certain kind of feminist activist and certainly not “easily” or more to the point, convincingly. The top-down attempt to redefine rape and assert that “rape isn’t about sex it’s about power” is the kind of semantic sophistry that leads to gender studies types being unable to define what a woman is. You yourself describe the character as being used as an unwilling “sex” toy. I can only imagine the mental and verbal gymnastics required to believe that rape has nothing to do with sex. I’m normally a fan of your channel by the way. Was the Neomicon rape scene one of the most disturbing and horrific things I’ve ever seen in my life? Yes, mission accomplished, Alan Moore.
Good analysis. I thought the similarly and made the same stylistic link to the later Promethea stories.
Despite his contributions to literary arc, Lovecraft wasn't a practitioner of the occult, and yet there are occultists who stem their work from him, i.e. The Simon Necronomicon
I have to disagree with you. Providence is amazing and one of Moore’s best work in my opinion
Compared to the editorial meddling of dc I rather take Avatar Press. They don't have editors who think they're writers as Linkara puts it.
You really should have qualified your OPINION that Providence was "less than interesting." Frankly, I found every single panel to be absolutely captivating and your repeated droning-on of how uninteresting YOU found it to be the uninteresting bit.
Also, maybe you could have used the word "problematic" a few *more* times. That would have really driven the point home...
Mmm. I liked Providence more than Neonomicon, though I think that reading Neonomicon does add a little bit extra to reading Providence. I guess, while I would agree with some of your criticisms, I think it comes down to taste, ultimately. And I don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with a take on lovecraftian themes that make them arrive at a different point than what Lovecraft's fiction did.
My experience with reading Providence was that it was a work that somewhat rewards careful examination. Often, things happen in the background or in otherwise subtle ways that are not spelled out. I think this holds true for much of Moore's work. But besides this, I do agree that it's a bit dry, bordering on being boring. And it has the problem of other postmodern fiction that it often references stories much more than it tells them.
But overall, I wouldn't discourage people who are interested in Lovecraft's or Moore's work to read it. I don't regret having spend the time to read it.
I love both books.
I recommend Providence to every Lovecraft reader I know or meet or even brush up against on the internet. I warn them that the mini-novel diary entries at the end of every issue are SUPER IMPORTANT, too.
EDIT: Oh another slept on COMPLETELY Lovecraftian work is "Strange Eons" by Robert Bloch.
I agree. I stumbled on Strange Eons in the 90's when I was just starting to read Lovecraft. It's a killer read.
I know that I reply to a very old comment but I find it weird that you recommend this to so many lovecraft readers as it in my opinion fails to capture what lovecraftian horror is.
@@augustfreij9162 You sound like someone who 'knows of' Providence but did not actually READ it, including the Journal the protaganist was writing in. I LITERALLY **JUST** Re-read it, finishing last week. And yes it's EVERYTHING LOVECRAFT EVER FUCKING WROTE ABOUT.
@@AxeMan808 You sound like someone who "knows of" Lovecraft but did not actually READ any of his work, including his letters. I disagree with your opinion and replying by saying that I have not read it is a weak argument. I only returned the favor.
@@augustfreij9162 Homeboy I have had "The Complete Works" for like 20 years.
Interesting video!
what an amazing video , happy to discover you're content!
Arthur Machen wrote the best Occult horror stories, imo. The White People is chilling. It is too bad there are not more authors that incorporate references to it and the Novel of the Black Seal.
Yeah, the whole nonconsensual sex with H.P. Lovecraftian monsters kinda threw me for a loop. It would be like Pinhead from Hellraiser saying, _"Yo, Honey how about you get your knees and..."_ when Pinhead is on about another type of kink. But yeah, I think the series was on its time. Overall, I liked that story the most at the time I read it, I was in my 20's so that explains that!
"How do we update Lovecraft for a modern audience? I know! Just add some rape!"
I'm so tired of this, bro.
Can you make a video about another possibly problematic Alan Moore work: Lost Girls?
In the 2013 documentary Jodorowsky's Dune, J. said that you can't make a baby without raping the bride. That's why the movie is called what it's called because it was not going to be Herbert's Dune. Moore is an artist which means he has a vision and want's to make it manifest. Lovecraft's contribution to literary theory was cosmicism but not even every story he wrote conformed to that. And by the way cosmicism is not nihilism.
Sorry to sound like a complaining twit. I actually am quite a big fan of your channel.
I tried reading Neonomicon and found that particular scene that everyone knows to be so blatant and in my face that it overshadowed everything else about the book. Never mind that I didn't click with the characters or the story.
Sometimes Providence hit too close to home. It was a difficult read.
Providence's conclusion is somewhat disappointing to me, if not just for the reason of it being too heavily foreshadowed as well as it connected back to those two works that I didn't particularly like and found to be a little bit tacky. It is actually rather refreshing to see criticism. However, I would disagree with your analysis about its theme deviating from Lovecraft. The fact that humans were involved in the transformation of the world and the coming of Cthulhu does not necessarily bestow any significance to humans. Your argument about how human body form might not be unique to human race and it shouldn't be deemed as evidence of Cthulhu having any relations with humans is equally applicable here. The fact that humans were used could be entirely unremarkable, the part of humans played in this conspiracy could easily be given to any other sentient species. It could be entirely happenstance that Cthulhu was to be born on earth. And since humans are the sentient being on this planet, the gods used humans. It's not that humans are special so the gods used humans, rather, the gods used humans so humans became special in the reader's eyes. This impression, however, is entirely retrospective.
A comic that makes you uncomfortable while reading? Curious.
I'm reading Lovecraft right now. Perhaps I'll move to Moore's take on the mythos afterward...
I had to stop watching when you called Providence boring again. It was gripping.
I can live without any of these.
I wonder why writers always seem to come back to Lovecraft? I mean the series sounds well a bit unsettling especially with the rape scenes but it I like the idea of subversion. My problem is that with gore and violence, I mean if you want to use it, that’s fine but what’s the point with it? I guess another question is why do writers use violence and hire in their work sometimes? I get the shock factor but do you think there’s a limit?
The Courtyard is quite disturbing but I can still enjoy its horror and story, but after the rapings happened in Neonomicon I can't stomach continuing it so I stopped. Maybe I'm just too soft lol.
Had trouble getting through Providence. Not because of the dry plot, the rape scene(s), nor the association of the people of Innsmouth with Jews in the Holocaust (that's a thing). No, what stopped me from getting through Providence was the 10 pages of handwritten, cursive "research notes" included at the back of every issue. I honestly had forgotten that I had mild Dyslexia as a child until I saw that shit.
I'm so glad I subscribed. I haven't been into comics since the early 90's ... but when I was I liked the generic superhero stuff. That is, until, I found this place called the Gian Comic Warehouse, in Longwood Florida. They have, well, a warehouse full of just tons of collections that people sold them at a pittance and then resold. Lots of great odd black and white wired comics like from Eclipse, others that were like self printed photocopied comics, and just plain obscure crazy shit. Then after a while later ... I had bought a bunch of that, stopped the superheroes stuff, got into book reading, then became a sixteen year old wit a car, a love for tits and fucking, smoking pot, and never went back to comics. Until just recently. Your stuff, your tastes and videos, are my serious new addiction! Thanks for sharing this .., well, this was smut ... but I really enjoy how you present these videos! Great work!
Thank you very much! I appreciate the kind words. And I hope you continue to enjoy the comic book smut I regularly post.
could you review of gods and men and how do you make your video.
Sure, I'll look into that title. How do I make my videos? Is there a specific, technical question you have? Or do you want a rundown of the entire process?
@@StrangeBrainPartsthank you and a rundown of the entire process. again thank you I love your reviews their insightful and objective.
Okay, the short version is: I read the comics, make notes and research the topic. Interviews by the creators, as an example of research. Next is writing the script, check it for factual errors and then recording it once it's complete. After that I design the background image and locate images I intend to use in the video. The final part is editing all images together into a (hopefully) organic and visually interesting manner. Like I said, that's the short version. There is a much longer, more technical version that would be intensely uninteresting to read.
@@StrangeBrainParts thanks
I found your review very cogent and reflected my own experience while reading them. Although I've read Lovecraft in the past, his stories mostly did not stick with me, so Moore's albeit clever inclusion of so many references required so much research on my part to understand that it became somewhat laborious. Which is too bad; I really wanted to love Providence.
Seriously though, what’s with Alan Moore and rape?
Personal trauma.
I'm a huge Lovecraft fan and have enjoyed most of Moore's work. I've been curious about these and I thank you for the (as always) excellent synopsis. Hard pass for me now.
On a related note - just saw the trailer for THE COLOUR OUT OF SPACE. A story that actually frightened the bejeebers out of me when I first read it. Not optimistic.
Adaptations of Lovecraft's material just don't seem to work. I'm more interested in those that are inspired by the material and do their own thing.
I know, right? They've gone and just turned it to purple!
@@StrangeBrainParts then you really should look into Caitlin R. Kiernan. Mainly the short story collections. Her comics work, while readable, is a little basic. Her prose on the other hand is pure elegance. Also, Thomas Ligotti is worth looking into, if you don't mind some heavy nihilism.
Ah, going to look up that trailer. My son just recently borrowed one of my Lovecraft books to read that specific story. He will be interested to hear this.
@edward lightbringer : Thanks for the recommendations. I have read Ligotti, but Kiernan I've never gotten around to. I'll have to look into both her prose and comic work.
Moore's later work is kinda strange, don't really know what to make of it honestly
Indeed. It's very detailed and borderline self-indulgent, generally speaking. It's hard to dislike because of the attention he puts into his work...at the same time, it's somewhat dry.
disturbing review of disturbing comic line
Neonomicon doesn't make much sense to me, are you telling me Cthulhu and his entire home was...inside the sperm of a Deep One? it wasn't a ritual, as Moore wanted to "explore", just a bunch of assholes who left a person be raped by a animal, that is it, no religious significance, nothing about summoning, praying or the like, so how the hell did she became pregnant with Cthulhu? it just sounds disparate and nonsensical for the sake of edginess. I feel the ending really ruined everything for the Neonomicon series, just unsubtle and nonsensical.
That chapter of From Hell made me sick. I guess Alan Moore mixes his writing with magic words. It was really a strange experience.
I thought Neonomicon was fun in an exploitation, grindhouse kinda way. Providence was way to self-indulgent and meandering, only tried to read one or two issue of it but couldn't get through them.
I read it for you, so you don't have to. Heh.
"pRoBlEmAtIc!!!"
PROBLEMATIC
I loved this series, but it is maybe not for everybody. I remember thumbing through a copy of Neonomicon at Barnes and Noble and suddenly feeling like I was reading weird hardcore porn in the graphic novel section. Definitely NSFW, but otherwise pretty scary and insidious. The art alone is amazing, if not kinda grotesque at parts. If you don't have a passing familiarity with Lovecraft's body of work, this series will not make much sense though.
Neonomicon is my favourite of the three, exactly because of those aspects you describe as "disturbing". But you forgot to mention what to me is absolutely the best part, which I suspect is the most disturbing for you: the girl falls in love with the creature after repeated rapings because of its stamina and skill as a lover.
"Implied"!?!
These look awful
An immensely distasteful series of stories, and deeply disrespectful of the source material. Moore seems to be ashamed of them, and well he should be. Rape is a sensitive topic he doesn't handle at all well, he hasn't got a clue what cosmic horror is, and Providence ends with what is obviously a thinly veiled personal fantasy of his - fiction taking over reality. I wonder how he'd like that if it really happened and he found his world and his work overwritten by the mass of fan fiction that sprawls across the internet these days. I'll also point out that any attempt to justify this tripe by claiming Lovecraft wrote Cthulhu as being somehow related to humans is confounded by the facts. "A monster of vaguely anthropoid outline, but with an octopus-like head whose face was a mass of feelers, a scaly, rubbery-looking body, prodigious claws on hind and fore feet, and long, narrow wings behind." That's not a creature with a bipedal upright stance or even four limbs, and scales are a reptilian or ichthyoid feature, not mammalian. Moore's concept of Cthulhu comes from headcanon and a multitude of crappy artistic interpretations, not Lovecraft's writings. In the end, this was hackwork written solely for a paycheck, not any sort of creative muse or actual desire to laud the source material.
@@xombiekat13 Which assertion, that he handled the rape with all the nuance and subtlety of a perverted thirteen year old? The fact that he's grossly misused the source material he claimed to be such a fan of? His utter inability to grasp that cosmic horror is ultimately about humanity being meaningless and insignificant, not distant cousins to the horrors of the universe? If he thinks it's the Watchmen of horror that's fine, I agree - I didn't like Watchmen much either. Ineptly plotted, thoroughly hateful, abuses the vastly superior source material. By that standard, sure, Neonomicon can be likened to Watchmen.
@@richmcgee434 Cmon. Watchmen ineptly plotted? Wtf? What is your standard of comix book plot excellence then? Please! Have I missed someting over the last 60years?
@@richmcgee434 wow, such a shame...i was actually with you until you cussed watchmen. i was thinking "at last! a bold and vigorous critique! a little strong but i go along with it!" but you cant touch watchmen. its reponsible for my intellectual awakening (aside from the silly dr manhattan stuff, but that kind of nonsense was ignorable in the early days, a mere hairline crack as opposed to the full blown subsidence you see now, grotesque lecturing etc)
@@xombiekat13 i think you mean that its providence that was the watchmen of horror. its the blurb on the back of the book. but are you saying he wrote his own blurb himself? if so, then hes out of control
Is it possible to view Lovecraft's worldview within his fiction, as a fear of non-whites? Especially since he was a racist?
99% of every writer in history was racist.
@@DeltaAssaultGaming To be clear, I would say that Cuthulu is a stand-in for non-whites.
please stop calling things problematic ,
I'm pretty sure people can do what they please.
Why are you afraid of a word?
TheBd62 why do you people insist on devaluing literature for its contents . Its made up story that deals with rape. Rapes a real thing , hell ive even been raped as a child but i would never ever think to call alan moores writing problematic regardless of subject
MrPoop1000000 Having rape in a story isn’t always a bad thing, but here it’s unnecessarily graphic, indulgent, and borderline snuff. There’s nothing thoughtful about it’s inclusion/depiction, which tends to be important when creating art that deals with heavy subjects. Or creating art in general.
Lacy Holleman as a dude whose dealt with it for a time as a child i can tell you for a fact real rape is graphic , violent , indulgent and thats exactly what is shown here, there things that wont leave my mind about what happened to me but you want to know something ? I love this book and its prequel and sequel , in the context of the book and its themes, it fits . If you think other wise and are still bent out of shape over fiction then heres a idea ..... read something else