Mass Effect - What Happens If You Save The Council???
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- Опубліковано 9 лип 2024
- In this video I’m going to show you what happens if you save The Council at the end of Mass Effect, including the consequences for Mass Effect 2 and 3.
MASS EFFECT - WHAT HAPPENS IF THE COUNCIL DIES
• Mass Effect - What Hap...
MASS EFFECT - WHAT HAPPENS IF YOU DON'T RECRUIT WREX
• Mass Effect - What Hap...
MASS EFFECT - WHAT HAPPENS IF YOU DON'T RECRUIT GARRUS
• Mass Effect - What Hap...
0:00 Introduction
0:57 Choosing to Save The Council
2:38 Meeting with The Council After Saving Them
4:40 Mass Effect 2 Consequences
6:22 Mass Effect 3 Consequences
8:18 Conclusion
During Sovereign’s attack on The Citadel, The Council is evacuated aboard the Destiny Ascension. Unfortunately their escape attempt is thwarted as they are pursued and fired upon by Geth ships. Without additional support to counterattack the Geth, it looks certain that the Council will die.
Joker contacts Shepard and lets him know that the Normandy and the Alliance Arcturus Fleet can respond to the distress call and save the Destiny Ascension… if Shepard orders him to do so.
The Arcturus Fleet manages to save the Destiny Ascension and The Council. After the battle with Saren and Sovereign is complete, The Council meets with Shepard, Udina and Anderson.
Mass Effect 2 takes place two years after the events of the first game. While The Council does not play a major role in the story it does come up in several conversations. Early in the game, Anderson will invite Shepard to The Citadel to meet with The Council. By now, the Turian Councilor’s response to the Reaper threat is legendary amongst Mass Effect fans: "AH YES, 'REAPERS' "
The Council does not take the Reaper or Collector threat seriously and won’t commit any resources to help Shepard’s mission. However, they will offer to reinstate Shepard’s spectre status, which you can either accept or refuse.
By the time Mass Effect 3 begins, The Council is still made up of four members - Human, Asari, Turian and Salarian. Udina will be the human Councilor, even if Anderson served in that post in Mass Effect 2.
The Council plays a much bigger role in the story of Mass Effect 3, with Shepard receiving missions from the Turian, Salarian and Asari councilors at multiple points throughout the game… and saving the Salarian councilor’s life if Thane or Major Kirrahe are still alive.
Shepard’s rescue of The Council in Mass Effect 1 can also positively influence Kaidan or Ashey’s opinion of Shepard during the armed standoff near the conclusion of Priority: The Citadel II.
The decision Shepard made regarding The Council in Mass Effect 1 comes up in conversation from time to time, but otherwise the core story is relatively unchanged.
The only other real gameplay impact comes in the form of war assets, but the differences are negligible. If you saved The Council, you gain The Destiny Ascension, but the Alliance Fleets (First, Third and Fifth) are all weaker and Admiral Mikhailovich died as well. So saving The Council nets you 30 less war assets overall… again, not a huge difference either way.
However, it's pretty cool to see The Destiny Ascension fly in as part of the Victory Fleet at the end of the game. - Ігри
“We’ve mistrusted Shepard in the past and it did not go well for us.” The Asari councilor is the only one with common sense.
She's the ONLY ONE with ANY sense. Even when the other 2 were quick to dismiss your claims about the reapers, she'd at least give you the benefit of the doubt, however reluctantly. As with the other 2, i have no liking for the dalatrass, & i sure as hell wished i can shoot that asshole of a turian in the face.
It's because she's an Asari
Says the Councilor who refused to join the other races until Thessia was under threat.
Say what you want, but Ashley Williams was 100% right about the Asari. The moment someone else needs their help, their whole talk about "cooperation and coexistence" goes out the window and they only care about themselves.
She refuses to help Humanity when Earth was invaded, stating that "the cruel reality is that while Earth is under attack, we can prepare our defenses" (I bet the 3rd Fleet survivors REALLY appreciate that comment). And even when Shepard expresses a desire to create a Turian/Krogan alliance (AND SUCCEEDS), she still refuses to help.
The Asari Councilor is the worst of the lot. All talk and no action, a true politician. Even the Salarian and Turian Councilors offered Shepard SOME support, even if they couldn't act directly (Turian Councilor telling Shepard about the Primarch to sidestep the politics, Salarian Councilor directing Salarian support for the War Effort, despite the Dalatrass's wishes).
@@LAZERAK47V2 thats just how asari are. They should stick to stripping and dancing instead of politics.
@@LAZERAK47V2and I'm sure Ashley made a metaphor of the Hunter sending their dog against a bear once their backs are against the wall.
Saving the council is the hardest decision in the game.
Literally like
Trying to NOT choose just letting them die is truly an exercise.
“I want to press the button...but the Destiny Ascension...GAH!”
Agree, but personally the conversation about it you got with the punching reporter in ME2 is one of my favorite paragon moments (Shepard recite from memory the name of each fallen ship) so it normally takes the edge for me
It´s not that hard actually. Would you rather let 3 politicians on a ship which is evacuating 10.000 civilians die or let a fleet of military trained military go to waste? Both has their pros and cons, but sacrificing 10.000 civilians vs. 3000 Military personal? Yeah, that is not a hard choice based on the numbers, and I say that as someone who lets civilians die to stop a Batarian terrorist from escaping to same countless more.
Not taking vs liara?
The truly hard choice is making Udina councilor.
I swear the one thing I want from Legendary Edition is the prompt “Ah yes, Reapers, we have dismissed that claim.” to any of the councilors in 3.
The one thing that frustrated me more than anything other than the endings in ME3, is that we NEVER got a chance, not even ONE, to stick a middle finger at the council's faces & tell them 'i fucking told you so!'.
You get to say "I warned you" when the turian councillor speaks to you in mass effect 3 if that counts
He just says they can talk about it later but never does
I hated how In Mass Effect 1
That every squad mate was programmed to play devils advocate to the other in choices like this. Like in some versions garrus is very pro saving the council instead. It should’ve been based on their actual character and what they would support instead of just giving exposition for consequences of a choice
Garrus is very malleable in ME1. The things you do determine if he has a more paragon or renegade bent.
@@Madlib7 Same with the other games.
I don't understand how you can say that
In my recent playthrough, I got renegade Tali at that part, and it was kinda jarring lol
@@Medicesca Play your cards right and you can have Kaiden be the renegade and Wrex actually be the paragon in the situation despite him being literally programmed to almost always be the renegade score wise
I always save the Destiny Ascension not because of the council, but because of the Destiny Ascension, in the beggining of the game, Ashley states that "it's guns could tear through any ship in the Alliance fleet" i save it because it sounds more logical to save the strongest ship to take out Soverign.
That and plus the crew of the Destiny Ascension don’t deserve to be killed.
I understand your logic with bigger gun the better but as history as shown example Nazi Germany bigger and more powerful usually doesn't dictate victory its only 1 ship a larger and more maneuverable fleet of human ships is more affective vs a reaper the tiger tank was amongst the best of ww2 while it could easily beat most tanks 1v1 it was usually 1 tiger vs 5 Sherman's.
@@jamesbutson7051 yet there are situations that happened after stalingrad where a single tiger would knock out up to 40 to 50 tanks till running out of ammo and having to retreat.
Or getting knocked out itself
@@borderreaver4615 easy to do in a defensive position against an enemy unaware of said vehicle and tbe doctron of charge the enemy until the line breaks which in the end it did
I always choose Anderson. Choosing the other guy you practially asking not to get your Specrtre position back.
I personally choose udina cause I wouldn't want anderson to deal with the dumb politics. Political distortion was pretty much the reason anderson left the council anyway.
I just wish that by choosing Anderson, we got access to the Spectre weaponry from ME1, even the initial weaponry was absurdly good, I never saw the performance of the Tier 10 equipment because I had no idea it existed.
@@decimation9780 The Tier 10 Master Specter gear basically shreds anything that exists anywhere in the galaxy and turns any playthrough’s combat difficulty into easy regardless of the other factors.
@@jaydenshepard7928 Eh, depends. On easy difficulty, yeah. But on the hardest, the enemies can take a punch, especially the damn biotic ones. Also Primes could take a serious beating even from a full mag dump into their lightbulb with the Tier X Spectre assault rifle. Point being, you being a Spectre should come with more benefits than just a few situations where you can use that Spectre rank to get out of situations, it should unlock new weapons for you.
@@decimation9780 Well yes ofc the enemies will still be beefier against an X tier gearset if you turn up the difficulty level…I meant relatively. Like those enemies will be at an easy level of resistance for more normal weapons against the X at higher levels.
As for the last part I agree ofc, but its too late for any of that.
If you save the council as a renegade the meeting at the end is different aswell.
The meeting is in the council chambers instead of the presidium and the music is more sinister. They mention your ruthless pursuit of Saren and say that they need humanity and its strength.
Woah, word? I’ve never gone full renegade so I’ve probably would never know about this
@@RAY296 yea it's a pretty cool detail
ua-cam.com/video/AlVL19grTBc/v-deo.html
And I assume that if you renegade and save the Council, they will be more grateful.
One of those no one likes the rough man until the enemy is at the gates kind of thing.
Am going to have to do this
"Are you really gonna sacrifice human lives to save the council" Coming from a turian i never realized how much of a fucking bro garrus was.
Sadly that's not really Garrus, it depends on the characters you bring, the more renegade character will say the renegade suggestion while the more paragon character will say the other one, I brought Wrex and Garrus and in my case Wrex was the one asking if I would sacrifice humans to save the council.
The biggest difference in ME2 is the Turian shop owner. If you save the Council he will want to name his firstborn after you. If you didn't, he will just greet you with "Human..."
He also tells you to "go to hell!" if you poke and prod him for a store discount haha
To put it simply, he’s a nice guy when you save the council but if you sacrifice the council he ends up becoming a jerk and a racist towards humans.
@Gabriel Tejada you also hear a more negative attitude towards humans on the Citadel. Both during NPCs conversations and News.
honestly, the council in mass effect one did everything right, they waited until impartial evidence to convict Saren and Shephard sounds like a late night history channel conspiracy theorist when talking about the reapers. But come mass effect two I can understand the hatred
The council became cartoonishly incompetent and inept in the sequels, all sort of boiling in ME3 where the reapers finally invade the galaxy like Shepard has been warning them and when he now asks them for aid, they go "lol, reapers are too busy fucking over earth so we have some time to prepare!"
And you never had the option to at least rub in their bureaucratic faces that you were right and the galaxy lost precious prep time because of their incompetence.
I would say the council is a parody of modern politics and things like the UN that never actually do anything until it's far too late but given how much modern politics has taken a parodic turn, its horrifying accurate
@@guilhermehank4938 You can say to Sparatus (Turian councillor) that you warned them years ago, and he just says something like “that’s the past, let’s focus on the here and now”
@@Glamuel Yeah but that barely counts to me. Its just handwaving a scene that should have them at least all admitting they should have listened.
@@guilhermehank4938 Fair
@Sowneyy 7.62 they are incompetent at best and malicious at worst and when caught they are able to bullshit their way through the court system.
“It’s the Alliance, thank the Goddess!”
This part and the music always gets me in the feels. It’s just such a noble sacrifice and to see humanity fighting for other races is heartwarming.
Then you ignore them lol and joker even cuts his radio off lol
@@cameronweaver4313 Ya that part is brutal lol
>Spilling human blood for ungrateful alien scum.
>heartwarming.
Pick one.
@@megakillerx Chill Ashley Williams.
@@cameronweaver4313 I never saw, we sacrificed several ships to save them… every time.
Even if you hate the Council, the 10,000 Asari aboard the Destiny Ascension don’t deserve to die.
Neither do the Alliance soldiers whose lives will be sacrificed if the Destiny Ascension is saved...
@@darth_dan8886 I mean far less soldiers tho
Solid thinking
Asari those who kept secret to themself and keep acting like they are better oh yes surely they deserve to die.
gotta save the blue babes
There is actually another difference in War Assets beyond the human fleets and Destiny Ascension. If you save the Council, the Salarian Third Fleet war asset becomes available if the Salarian Councilor survives Kai Leng, worth 125 War assets (increased by 8 via a sidequest), but if you sacrifice the Council, you do not get the Salarian Third Fleet, but instead the "STG Task Force" worth only 70 points. The new Salarian Councilor must still survive in this case.
As a result, saving the Council is, in fact, worth more War Assets than sacrificing them.
Not Really, the difference is just the points from the side quest. Done the math. Max is +3 points
Saving the useless council:
-75 fleets -25 Ad Mikhailovic.
+70 Ascension +125 SalThirdFl
= +95 (+8 with sidequest)
Doing the right thing:
(Humanity takes few losses)
+75 fleets +25 Miki
-70 Asce + 70Stg
= 100 points
3 Points are worth letting the council burn with the stupid ascension and not sacrificing human lives.
Also humanity stronger, galaxy stronger.
If that's your viewpoint, I can't be bothered to try to change it. However, the question here is a matter of pure numbers. 3 more points is 3 more points, and from a matter of absolute pure numbers, that 3 point difference makes saving the Council the numerically superior option.
Besides, it means that douchebag Mikhailovic dies. The nicest thing he can ever say to Shepard is that his report "Will not be as negative as I had planned." That is the *nicest* thing he says. Fucker can burn, I'll happily trade him to keep the Council alive. At least Sparatus ends up telling us how to get what we need.
@@Blazieth Ehh I wouldn't consider him a douchebag. It's easy to see why something like the Normandy could be considered a waste of resources from his point of view. I can't exactly recall what he said, but the cost of the Normandy was equivalent to a heavy ship of a larger class and/or a sizeable unit of frigates. It's a point of view you could agree with. Would you rather have 50 small conventional tanks, a larger conventional tank with greater firepower + durability, or a single small experimental tank that has stealth capabilities?
The only off comments I can really recall from him is his reluctance of your alien crew members as he wants to protect Alliance secrets. This is off putting considering the threat you're up against as it is no time for a lack of cooperation, but if he's guilty of that, the whole damn galaxy is way more guilty of being unprepared uncooperative goat scrotum suckers despite Shepard's warnings of the Reaper threat.
@@Blazieth 3 points dont matter in this game lmao, the council are absolute shit bags…the epitome of career politicians in every way. Their replacements are notably more competent and less of incompetent dickheads, especially when you compare the replacement for the dickhead in chief…the old Turian council member.
If anything you’re doing the other races a favor because it forces them to wake the fuck up and realize they arent all that. They have to become better. It cleans out the drainage pipes a fair bit as does any crisis. Seeing themselves going from leading the galaxy to playing second fiddle to the humans would realistically shock the hell out of everyone else, forcing them to get their shit together or be left behind.
The Roman empire had this happen a several different times, where having a crisis or having important figures killed forced them out of their complacency and they had to cast that shit aside, cut out the fat, cleanse out the corruption and bureaucracy, etc etc to deal with it.
Things only got worse again when peace and stability returned and remained for too long, which eventually led to stagnation and decadence returning.
The same patterns can be observed in our own world, in the current time. Weve had it easy for so long, no real threats, no large scale wars. Nothing but bullshit basically, and because of that decadence and complacency has continued to rise unchecked.
Compare that to WW2, or even in brief period following 9/11 and its a stark difference. Sadly the latter didn’t last because we werent facing much of a true threat, and it quickly just became normalized and for the most part didn’t even affect the vast majority of the populace anyways.
@@andrews.5212 sounds like you have some issues.
I always save The Council. Despite them actively refusing to listen to Shepard and the Reaper threat, they are the foundation of galactic stability. They are politicians, but as easy as it is to hate them, you can’t just randomly replace them with someone else and go “Hey look! Everything is the exact same now!”
Yeah while they might not respond best to large threats they seem to be doing a good job as a un type of substitute
Which is why it’s annoying how in Mass Effect 3, everything is basically the same, plus or minus a few points that you won’t need if you play all the game’s content before the ending. It’s another case showing why Mass Effect 3 need a couple more year of dev time IMO.
@@JurzGarz Imagine what could ME3 have been like if it came out at like 2014 instead. Typical case of EA soiling everything they touched for the past decade & a half or so.
@@JurzGarz the problem was the time ME3 was released. In that time companys only thought about multiplayer, especially EA. Look at the other great space game of that time, Dead Space 3. Besides, the franchises followed the same path almost in the same years: good first game, awsome second game, dissppointing third game, because of the same reasons. At least Biowere survived that shit years, not the same about Visceral Games...
Yeah exactly, that's how Prothean fell. Saving council is good optics.
Always loved Garrus, he choose humanity over the council even though he’s a turian.
He asked Shepard to join them because he was tired of their burocracy. Garrus is actually a renegade soldier who you can convince to be nicer.
Actually if you bring a more renegade character along like Wrex or Ashley, Garrus argues for saving the council.
Liara is always pure paragon I think.
@@Glamuel Yeah. The good angel and bad devil must always be there to give players hints of the Paragon path and the Renegade path.
@@Kiwijr2579 True. It would be nice if all the squad members were a bit more consistent with their morals, but I get why they need to explain both choices.
@@Glamuel Agreed.
i wish there had been more consequences to this choice.
I love the trilogy, but i wish choices had a bigger impact.
Even if all the ME2 crew dies during the suicide mission, it doesnt affect me3 as much as it could. They just have substitutes instead...
@@supervegito2277 it prevents certain better endings..though that’s about it
@@hyhena-gaming9986 There are several smaller impacts, just not much in the aspect of big impacts
A big impact would be stuff like unavailable missions.
Like if Legion died during the suicide mission, so you cant do the geth fighter mission in 3, and such.
@@supervegito2277 The choices in Mass Effect look MUCH more impactful when you compare them to those TellTale games, where none of the choices matter.
@@HOTD108_ Ahh yeah If my memory serves me right that does sound about right.
Ive only played The Walking Dead one, and still havent done final season yet.
You put a lot of videos recently, and I appreciate it
I don't. He caused me to replay it right now. Just weeks before Legendary Edition. I am weak.
@@oliverguennewig1894 same haha
One of the Alliance Cruisers destroyed while saving the Destiny Ascension was SSV Emden, named after a relatively small German Port City. However SMS Emden was also the name of a light Cruiser that served in the German East Asian Squadron and was left behind to go on a campaign of Commerce Raiding - and succeded in doing that quite impressively until she eventually encountered and Australian Heavy Cruiser off the Coast of New Geuinea and was sunk in the ensuing battle.
I always loved how Mass Effect paid tribute to this. Also left me wondering if the Cruiser still had a WW1 Iron Cross 1st class painted on her hull as the original Emden was rewarded one and according to German Naval customs that award had been handed down to each and every subsequent namesake ever since.
the biggest difference is the reporter, should had showed that as well.
I'd like, but I'll leave a comment. 69 ehehehhehe
What reporter the one I always choose to punch?
@@Colorless_Reaper yep its The same one
*have
I've lost count of how many playthroughs I've done of the trilogy and I never once even considered saving the council. Now watching this video and seeing the ME2 consequences part, I think I never will.
I'm surprised how many people save the council. In the moment I always found it more important to make sure you stop Sovereign. I didnt know till this video that both could be done.
@@justsomeguy4099 Sovereign will be stopped one way or another. It's just a matter of how many bodies pile up before he's taken down. When the dust settles however, that's when things go back to the mundane stage of preparing for the actual threat there's to come, a stage where political aftermath has very real effects. Not saving the council would only make humanity look like selfish, unruly, & overly ambitious gits who care for no one other than themselves. Every other species would resent humanity even more & make rallying the races together harder.
Look from their perspective Shepard was dead for 2 years and suddenly came and started to say about Reapers and joining Cerberus a known terrorist group, acknowledging him means people will join terrorist group and that happened in ME3 when Volus Ambassador started to support Cerberus because Shepard was with them.
One of my main points of reasoning in ME1 of saving the council was that having their lives personally in jeopardy by sovereign they are going to take the threat serious......
And then ME2 comes and they double down on their disbelief. What the!!! What sort of real person does that?
yeah that's why letting them die is more consistent, at least the new council has a reason not to believe you if you let the old council die.If you save them I can't understand well enough why they still believe the reapers aren't a threat.
I actually prefer the original council to the new one. A lot. Tevos seems like a genuine person. Sparatus can be a jerk but gets better in ME3. Valorn needs more credit for being a male salarian politician which is rare in the lore. Also, it’s nice not having most aliens on the Citadel hate you in 2.
I chose to save the council for a different reason, I felt that doing so would cause anger in many of the races when I need them to be united against a real threat, pissing off everyone else and putting humans in charge would have made it harder to gain support from others imo when I first played.
I made the choice to show them humanity has their backs and is willing to sacrifice for their allies and prove their place among them, my hatred of the council had no sway in my decision, it was the public I was after.
Indeed. Saving the council is the correct thematic choice. The whole game is about newcomer humanity proving themselves a worthy part of the community.
The reason why I choose to always save the council is to prove to the other races that humans are not always selfish and that good can come from humanity. The underdog story is just incredible.
A big appreciation to Big D for all of those vids. They help a lot to find the most fitting decision in "best" walkthrough, not just playing democratic hero/cold-blood warrior.
Man, I didn't think Legendary Edition improved as much as it did on the graphics. The difference is legitimately like night and day now that I'm looking back
5:04 I remember that when I first saw this, it reassured me that I made the right choice in letting the "old"/previous council die.
Note: I was specifically referring to when the Turian Councilor said "We have dismissed that claim".
I mean, "Just like when the Alliance bailed your a--es?" (dismissing their sacrifices)
I guess a lot more people didn't save the counsel than I thought. :/ I almost always save them tbh.
I save them so they can live long enough for me to tell them I told them so.
@@bgill6623 petty, I like that.
I never save them. It's ridiculous, no matter how many reapers appeared, they always find excuses to not help you. Besides, all squadmates had a point: Why sacrifice so many ships and lives for the council? I mean, if things were different, the council wouldn't help humanity.
@@matiascamposaliaga8681 Like it or not, the council is the very embodiment of galactic cohesion, & the reapers are indeed a very inconvenient & unpleasant truth. They serve as the will of galactic society as a whole, & their denial of the reapers' existence, however frustrating ad it may be, is simply a display of the galactic society's unwillingness to face one such dooming truth. Humanity is already seen as an unruly, overly ambitious upstart way before the events of the games. Not saving the council is equivalent to sticking your middle finger at the rest of the galaxy, declaring once & for all, that humanity really doesn't deserve to be on the council.
I chose : Focus on the sovereign. Does this count as let them die :P? Iit was the most pragmatic and rational approach as a soldier. Eliminating the threat to biological life outweighed the potential loss of the council, which can be replaced. By choosing to "focus on the enemy," it signifies a rational and unemotional decision, unaffected by any antipathy towards the council.
Actually saving the council also gives you a Salarian fleet war asset worth 125 if you save the original salarian councillor again in me3
Which is worth 55 more points than the stg task force you get for saving the new councillor after letting them die in me1
I thought saving the council gives you more war assets. It's been probably close to years since I've played any of the mass effect games and that's what I thought too. Plus, being reinstated as a spectre only happens if you save the council. It's not a very huge thing in Mass Effect 2 but it does help out.
@@danielgroeling4750 You can be reinstated as a spectre even if you don't save them, if you choose Anderson as the human councilor. In fact, you wont be reinstated as a spectre only if you BOTH choose Udina and not save the Council.
@@DannySleepwalker You wont get your spectra status back only if you "let the council die." Ive chosen "concentrate on sovereign" a few times and except first playthrough choose Udina as councilor and always got mine back.
Yeah, that's kinda endemic of a problem that Mass Effect developed over time. In the first ME, Paragon and Renegade were both options that made sense and just had different outcomes and/or costs. The paragon is the diplomat, but ready to fight if necessary, appealing to people's better natures and inspiring people to try to be like them, but at personal cost in some way. Paragon was more humane, but less efficient. The renegade, on the other hand, is the guy you send in when a mission HAS to get done, no matter what. He'd intimidate, bribe, brutalize and kill his way to his objective. Renegade was cold hard efficiency, with some asshole flavoring on the side.
The problem starts in ME2, where you pretty much HAVE to pick a side and stick with it, unless you're importing a save, and even then, you're still incentivized to be be pure Paragon or Renegade. Add on to that, that the personal cost for being Paragon has been massively reduced, if not removed entirely, and Renegade options start becoming more straight-up evil. First big moral choice you get to make in ME2-SPOILERS-has you decide whether to take a traumatized, sick Quarian who has compiled some data you need into Cerberus custody for a while, or let Tali take him back to the flotilla and she'll give you the data anyway. The ONLY way this would even slightly make sense is if you didn't trust Tali to actually give you the data, but they take every chance they can to show the inherent trust that there is between Tali and Shephard.
In ME1, you get to decide who Shephard is, but from ME2 onwards, Bioware has decided who Shephard is and you just get penalized for not staying in character as the big damn hero as opposed to the necessary evil.
Big Dan, keep em coming. I think I've watched every ME related video on your channel and will continue to watch.
Awesome, thank you!
Big ups for adding time stamps!
Just like general Shepherd said once: "Same Shit, Diferent Day"
*Garrus is great, but if I had a credit for every time he says: "I hope you know what you're doing", I could buy my own Destiny Ascension.*
I appreciate your work Dan
Thanks! Glad you're enjoying the vids
Going through these videos now that you did before LE released, it's so significant to see just how improved the graphics and game play are now! So cool. :-)
Really enjoying your content keep it up
Finally, I video I can watch. You know, when I'm saving the council on this playthrough for the first time
This is just one of the outcomes you can get by saving the council. IIRC, you can in ME2 if they agree to meet with you say "I was resurrected by the Cerberus, but I have no allegiance to them." and then offer to forward any information on Cerberus´s information and operations to either the Alliance or the Council as a double agent. This choice actually makes the council realize what a fucking asset they just got and accepts your offer by "publicly denouncing your actions, but privately acting on your information" and I think the Alliance basically says the same. However, I don´t remember how to get that choice but I think it requires that you proactively refuse to cooperate with Cerberus and have a carry over file were you have encountered a few of their operations in ME1 - but don´t quote me on that because I haven´t played these games since they came out. Also, I don´t think it came too much into play in ME3 if you did this choice.
Love these videos man!
Glad you like them! Thanks!
Thank you for doing this video, because even as a hardcore paragon player I always leave them die and I'm not planning on saving them anytime soon or ever.
Another great video, big dan. I hope you’re doing well ^^
Hey, thanks!
Whatever you think of the Council, saving the Ascension is one of my favourite scenes in the whole series. It feels good saving that big beautiful ship, but it's also incredibly sad watching some of the Alliance ships go down. And the music that plays is perfect.
I can NEVER bring myself to save the council. I only wish I could kill them off in every game. Make it an achievement in Mass Effect 1-3. "Time to Hit Refresh" 1, 2, 3.
Council: Saved
Textures: RIP
Seeing all those fleets come in through the Charon Relay makes me feel feels, but once you see the Destiny Ascension appear to help you, out of absolute respect for saving them, it's a whole other ball game. I just cry lmao
It is WORTH to save the Council. After all, in Mass Effect 3, you get the Destiny Ascension as War Asset. And it also appears in the scene, where you go back to Earth. :)
But you lose one third of the assets of three of the Alliance fleets.
@@billsutherby but if you keep the salarian councilor from being assassinated in me3, his reward is a fleet thay more than offsets the point difference compared to his replacement who gives you and STG unit.
@@benjaminsimmons5356 You can sacrifice the whole council in ME1 and still save the salarian councilor in ME3. Whether or not you get the salarian fleet is based completely on if you sabotage the genophage or not.
@@billsutherby the fleet you get from sabatoging the genophage is the Salarian 1st fleet for 150 points. The fleet you you get for saving the original Salarian councior from assasination is the Salarian 3rd fleet for 125 points. 2 completely different war assets.
@@benjaminsimmons5356 You're probably right. It's been a few years since I played the games.
1:43 starting "Battle for Coruscant" theme NOW!
I didn't save the council, I saved the the giant gun. The council just so happened to be on said gun.
I've watched a few of your videos now and the only thing I'd really like is a tabulation of the results per game as an end-slate.
You did similar with the Genophage but not completely. You showed the difference between the ways you could sabotage it but not compared against letting it happen.
I think a tree-lile structure would be best especially for choices that start in ME1.
04:02 min this writing is makes the story so good; thanks for the editing
As long as Udina isn't councilor for ME 1 and 2, I can go either way with saving the council or not. All I care about is my spectre status.
Can u still save ur Spectre status even if u kill the council?
@@peti8155 yes, but you have to choose Anderson instead of Udina for the council
Oo
@@peti8155 You can't even if you choose Anderson. The new Council will refuse to communicate with Shepard and Anderson will not be able to regain the spectre status. Since the Council vetoes all Anderson's decisions and does not listen to him especially.
@@nicolaus22 Strange, I sacrificed council but regain my Spectre status... maybe because I was playing as a Paragon in ME1?
I just wished. You got to see what the destiny Ascension could do in me3 and if the council survived
I believe you do in one cutscene toward the end.
In the big victory, when you lauch the assault video to attack to re-take Earth, what i don't get it, it's in the year when the dlc from LEVIATHANS came out, you can see them, after that since then, you NEVER see them like here when you show the Destiny Ascension...anyone else have noticed yet?
05:35 You can make a video about the Spectre status in ME2 and 3.
I can’t wait to play the legendary edition
Doing the lords work with these mass effect videos xD
Just finished ME1 and chose to not save the council. Given the dire circumstances, it seemed much more appropriate to concentrate all efforts in destroying Sovereign.
I Did the same. Besides, the council could be replaced at any point, but losing a powerful ship like that was a shame.
I always wondering why the alliance change their color scheme from red to blue?
The Asari sent blue bodacious beauties to many humans in positions of power, this eventually led to a psychological obsession with the color blue.
Thanks.
Honestly I think it’s a no brainier, an entire alliance fleet or a council of 3 people which is easily replaced? I sacrificed the council every time in 10 or so play throughs 😂
Minus the 10,000 innocents on board being evacuated.
I subscribed last month because your videos bring me back to my old highschool days. And the content is nostalgic. Very well done. I hope you go big!
Thanks!
So surprisingly little actually changes despite the massive moral impact of the decision in the moment you have to make it.
Thanks
I always struggle with this decision and I've no clue which way I'll decide in the legendary edition
"RAMIREZ TAKE OUT SOVEREIGN USING YOUR KNIFE"
It always cracks me up that Udina is upset about picking Anderson.
He's literally the only one that believed us.
what i miss in later games is nuisance.
i picked ' focus on sovereign'.
that gave me equal paragon/renegade points.
they always say i let the council die to push humanity when in truth i made a tactical decision in the heat of the moment based on the best chance of success.
in ME2 and ME3 you're either a good person of a jerk for it. no nuisance.
Nuisance? I think the word you're looking for is nuance.
One complaint I must say. That Asari ship they show in the fleet cutscene isnt the DA. I had that play in my recent run where I killed the council.
There is one other war assets difference. If you saved the council and you save the salaran councilor in ME3, you get the third Salarian Fleet which is worth more than the STG team you get if you saved the salarian councilor but let the original council die.
In my opinion you dont just save the council and the Destiny, you also show humanity can put the good of the galaxy above the itself. And from gameplay perspective its almost imposible to change the narative of the council, imagine if in ME2 council is like yeah take all the spectre assets you need, that would be such a drastic change to either lore or gameplay.
Make your own decisions - the guy that shot the conduit
I’m more pissed off about the council not believing Shepard after what they went through. They knew by the end that saren was working with a reaper and that they exist but instead decide to not believe the person who saved their ass from 2 seperate things both actively threatening their survival 😡
Would you consider doing one of these for undina or Anderson as the human chancellor
Me I pick anderson he is a good man.
i kinda hoped when the Alliance saved the council, they split the fleet instead of stalling to destroy sovereign. paragon views between saving the council and destroying sovereign is equally important. at leqst it would be more realistic. (but i love the scene of letting the council die tho)
*Evil laughter* Karma, BITCHES
No point in holding back anything then. The Citadel hadn't opened up yet and wouldn't until either the 'Ascension dies first or you spend lives destroying the geth fleet first. Pragmatically, even without the politics involved it represents a huge investment of time, materials and personnel trained to use it. Pragmatically thinking, I'd have thought the Alliance fleet would have the advantage of surprise to keep from wasting ships and crew, that should have kept the casualties and loss of ships to a severe minimum. Yet we get a 1\3rd loss or something like that.
"I love letting a ship of 10,000 evacuees get blown up"
I didn't realise so many people didn't save the council.
If they started from ME2, the council is automatically dead.
I always saved the council
Regardless of in-game consequences, it never seemed right to sacrifice thousands of human lives for those who always mistreated you.
why? they're elected officials right? what happens when one dies? they put another one in their place.
it's not like they stick around long enough to be likeable characters. your spectre status is only relevant in ME1. it's an empty title in the second game and given back regardless in the third game.
@@JudgeSpektre some people just love the boot
The funny part about people who go all in on "tactical analysis of the situation" regarding saving the Destiny Ascension and loosing Alliance ships is that they never takes into account the entire Geth Fleet that is now at the rear of your fleet while you engage Sovereign. I know it never plays out in actual cutscene, Bioware I guess just has them fly away after killing the Ascension....however, if you are trying to ad hoc justify killing the council out of spite, maybe consider that flying past an enemy fleet, leaving your entire flank exposed to the geth fleet is actually significantly worse than attacking sovereign with less ships. And in addition, since we go to war with the geth to push them back after Sovereign dies, taking out the consolidated fleet while it is distracted should speed up the end of the war dramatically.
From a political stand point saving them is much better because it is essential the difference between a hostile take over (killing the council and taking its place) versus doing what the Turians did with the Krogan, swooping in and saving the day. In one case we are the heroes saving the galaxy and cementing that we are to be trusted as a species to the broader galaxy and getting a place on the council. On the other we are opportunists ready to take control when presented the opportunity. Its honestly silly how Bioware handled that setting. There is no world in which they did not just elect new members. Surely there was a chain of succession. For us to claim full control is essentially a coup, and one that would surely end in another Turian/human war. I mean imagine us trying to get assistance in ME3 from the council races after launching a Coup the last time an attack happened? They would never trust or help us. And then Cerberus does another Coup while reapers are attacking, using the same councilor that did it the first time? We would have nobody pushing back against the reapers and we would have all been harvested.
I know none of this matters in the games because the outcome is the same, but if we are trying to argue as if this is some real life scenario, saving the council shouldn't even be an option. I mean really Sheppard shouldn't even be able to make that call, Hackett should be the one deciding. And the above reasons are precisely why.
I think I've only ever sacrificed the council...mainly owing to the framing of the choice as if the fight against Soveriegn's forces will be worse if you don't. About to hit Ilos in the LE playthrough so I guess I may do things a little differently this time.
I love your videos its great to see this stuff I'll never see with my playing style.
You want to try to cure the age old ME3 "checking downloading content" bug? I've seen MANY ideas but still not found a solution so I can play ME3 without being offline, meaning no DLCs. 😭😭😭
Next one if you made to Udina the human councilor it sounds like something interesting
Saving the Council is never a choice about actually saving them, it's always about the grander implications.
It's a real shame that the writing didn't allow for a truly diverging narrative if you made either choice, the end result is the same, the only difference is how the other races interact with humans.
Udina talked a big game about installing what were essentially "Puppet Councilors" who would kowtow to Humanity, giving them more galactic authority, but that never actually happens. Would've been really cool if that decision had a much larger scale impact and humanity actually became the dominant voice on the Council.
nice
Cool just saw the destiny ascension scene. Time to sacrifice the council.
I think it'd be a really cool thing that if your shepard either romanced and stayed loyal or was just a really good friend to the Virmire survivor then the trust mechanic would work differently and Kaiden / Ashley wouldn't say "I hope I don't regret this" and instead they'd immediately turn on Udina because they know Shepard better than that.
Big Dan, why do you record all your vids with very low graphic settings?
No matter what you are labeled as a rogue spectre and the council wont listen to you until their lives are endangered. Literally I threw a bone to council 3 times (me1:warns and proves the reapers are really, me2: the collectors are found out to be the ones making ships and people disappear and are working on a way of being the reapers over, me3: Reapers are attack everyone and as shepherd warned and told people to prep the shepherd is ignored knowing the inevitable invasion) and they continued to be pricks. But that's how politicians do their thing. They'll thank you for a second than airlock you into space within the hour. Plus when the harvest is happening it's more of "hey shepherd help is do this and maybe we'll help".
It's such a facepalm.
The difference in what Avina says in ME3 is more impactful than any of the differences in council members' dialogue.
Mass effect trilogy sales went up
Yeah... the courage to stand up for what he believes in... that will age well.
I did notice when Garrus is the squadmate that supports saving the council and chose not to, he refers to Shepard as human rather than by name. Something along the lines of "i hope you know what you're doing human".
So its interesting here he supports sacrificing them here and refers to the Commander by name for saving them instead.
Is this effected by your talks on the Normandy and how you handle Dr. Saeleon?
I love Mass Effect 1.
Saving the council is strategically irresponsible. Regardless of my character's morality, I never save them. I always concentrate on Sovereign.
But if they die, there's no leaders for their people. New elections will waste time, racial tensions will increase, humans will be seen as racists and Cerberus will gain more of a foothold due to descent among species. It's a matter of hearts and minds: It's wise to focus on the enemy but, if there's millions of enemies just like them coming, you need an army of everyone you can get.
@@WolfyFancyLads You are fighting a Reaper. At the time Shepard doesn't even know what they are capable of, only that they have wiped out numerous civilizations. The Destiny Ascension is damaged and out of the fight. Wasting assets to save some politicians is a terrible move strategically. You win the battle regardless, but I don't play like that. I don't meta game, I make decisons based on the information Shepard has at the time. Shepard knows that if Sovereign is not destroyed and is allowed to take control of the Citadel, the Reapers will invade and all advanced civilizations in the galaxy will be destroyed, not just humans. The battle of the Citadel must be won, regardless of the cost. With the fate of the galaxy on the line, I don't think Shepard is concerned with Council elections. And risking defeat so someone doesn't call Shep a racist is insane.
@@frankwalsh1916 It's not meta gaming and have you SEEN the racial tensions in society in reality? Guns draw, people stabbed, shit goes down fast. Now imagine that on a galactic scale, with races willing to go to war, not just post comments online. Imagine if all out war started between races because extremists of one or more species refused to believe in reapers and rallied others to resent humans as "they clearly hate our kind!". You'd be dead, everyone would think of themselves and be wiped out by the reapers as a result, all because they see humans as racists. And that's just ONE of the issues caused by letting them die. As for meta gaming, you gotta remember it took the *entire* fleet and killing robo-Saren to destroy a single reaper. If everyone distrusts humans, they won't send ships to help. Just ten reapers could wipe out every member of the alliance, then they waltz onto their next species to harvest.
Just look at how ME3 plays out even IF you save everyone. All that death, all that chaos, and that's with a massive army. Now imagine that without any other race helping you, looking out for themself, just humans. No Priority: Earth. No Crucible. Just death. The Council are assholes but saving them shows the galaxy they matter to humanity, that you'll save them when shit goes south, which means they'll listen when you need them.
Hearts and minds wins wars, it's a rule of engagement used for centuries. A massive army won't change anything if everyone you pissed off is looking to destroy it instead of join it.
@@WolfyFancyLads Sovereign is minutes away from taking control of the Citadel, and unleashing the Reaper invasion. In a similar situation in the Arrival DLC, Shep sacrifices 300 thousand Batarians, to stop the Reaper invasion, an act much more difficult to justify. He is not worried about his reputation, he is trying to save the galaxy. He would rather people be alive to judge him harshly, then be dead. Sacrificing the Council to concentrate on Sovereign is totally justifiable strategically. The Council races could never declare war on humanity in that scenario. In fact, I would argue the leaders of a militaristic, pragmatic society like the Turians would probably criticize shep if he didn't sacrifice the Council.
@@WolfyFancyLads I brought up meta-gaming because all of your justifications for saving the council are assuming the Battle of the Citadel is won. You as a player know the outcome is predetermined, but the character Shepard does not. Saving the council does not help destroy Sovereign, it is a political decison, not a military one. That is why I believe Concentrating on Sovereign is the only justifiable decision strategically.
How many actual differences are there in ME2 if you are reinstated as Spectre. I only know of a couple.
is it a bug with the game or why do the textures in me1 in your videos look WAY worse than they do even on the xbox 360. I remember hearing something about a bug regarding low res textures but never encountered it even when playing on pc
The real reason to save the council: to get the "ah yes reapers" meme
2:45 Oof those textures look really bad. Is this your own footage? If so is it from console or PC? If PC, are the settings maxed out?
I'm curious about this as I've seen a ton of ME1 footage here on youtube that is certainly from the PC version and it looked like puke as well. Don't know why's that though, mine always looked good on max settings.
What up big Dan?
Saving the council or letting them die while it doesn’t have a huge war asset difference it does have a huge difference in reputation I.e paragon and renegade same with destroying the collector base or not
Weird I think in all my play throughs, I’ve only not saved them once
For anyone who’s looking for additional Mass Effect content, I have a full Mass Effect 1 playthrough up on my channel, I’m in the process of uploading the first few parts of 2, but I’ll be streaming and uploading the Legendary Edition as well for those interested. Any support would be much appreciated.
6:46 ..or Thane if he is alive.
The biggest difference is the turian arms dealer in ME2. If you save the council he is very friendly, if you let the council die, then he has a strong dislike for humans, and humans are generally not liked by other species.
Yes also Joram Talid (politician in Thane loyalty) has some different dialogue too
Same with those two Asari on the citadel and all the news reports