It still blows my mind how far the iGPUs have evolved over the last 5 years because of the Ryzen's development. Who would've thought that one could actually game contemporary titles in 1080p with an iGPU back in 2015... Excellent job, AMD, you fully deserve to be #1
... and I am going to. For a mini desktop as well as for a HTPC. I just cannot decide if I should go "all in" and buy stuff new and kinda expensive, or if it would be fast enough to look after used parts. From Ryzen 2200G, 3400G, 4300G, 4600G, 5600H all the way up to 5700G ... everything looks promising! But I just cant decide.
Another great video! Thanks for doing these. They are really very practical and easy to follow. Love your choices on hardware as well. Please keep up the great work!
Second this, the iGPU on the 11th Gen Intel CPUs might not be as Powerful but they still do pack quite a Punch for their price range and showing what it can do might be good for people who just want a stop gap until a decent GPU shows up.
@@unbeatable3d Iris Xe is more or less comparable to Vega 8 just with Intel drivers which are usually always worse than Radeons, seems like we have a plateau until we get DDR5 and either RDNA2 or larger Xe
The jump to DDR5 and the IPC increase of RDNA 2 will make next-gen APUs even better. Combined with the GPU market being essentially a fuckfest at all turns, the fact that GPU power is not as necessary as it was in the past (720p 30fps was the norm on 360 and PS3...they rendered below 1080p and upscaled, while some people prefer high resolutions or high refresh rate, gaming is doable without it, so now GPU power is used more for headroom than necessity) and the cost effectiveness of APUs make me think we'll see another class of PC gamers come to exist. People who aren't settings elitists, making awesome SFF builds. I, personally, want to make an RDNA 2 Chopin build, with a motherboard that supports Thunderbolt, and an external GPU enclosure with an RDNA 2 dedicated GPU. The steam deck also gives developers a new performance target - get their games running well at 720p on an APU. An APU which, at 15w, will be even lower performing than the desktop models. At home, I get a full gaming experience. But I can leave the GPU and take the Chopin with me, and have an ultra-tiny LAN box that can handle any game. Thanks to APUs and Thunderbolt, a 2-piece gaming desktop consisting of an ultra small tower and external GPU is a very really possibility.
DDR5 will help a lot because it is dual channel per stick so when you dual channel the PC you will have an effective quad channel config. When AM5 launches and you have RDNA2 or 3 cores active I think the upgrade will be substantial. One of those with a fast NVMe drive in it would make a pretty nice all round PC by any standards I reckon, all it's PC stuff would be lightning fast and it can game as a bonus.
@Gonçalo Amaro Also worth mentioning, things like DLSS, Fidelity FX, frame rate target control, and resolution scale, are allowing us to render in lower resolutions while upscaling, or keep a sharp GUI while gaming in a lower scale, or adjust resolution to meet a certain performance criteria. We've been seeing a shift towards software-based solutions for gaming in lower than native res and making it look good, largely driven by 1440p and 4k monitors, but this opens up a can of worms for the possibility of reducing the requirements for a good gaming experience on 1080p monitors. With graphics cards now targeting high res and high refresh rate gaming, 1080p 60fps is no longer the target. If you're comfortable gaming there, combined with ongoing software progression...there will be a strong future where graphics cards aren't needed. APU development and software development has been progressing significantly, and that's in a world where GPU power is already progressing far faster than games are utilizing it, with modern GPUs no longer targeting 1080p 60fps gaming. We're starting to reach a point where the power of integrated graphics and the minimum to have a good gaming experience are converging, and I think within the next decade, we'll see more and more gamers dropping dedicated graphics altogether. They'll still have a place for professional workloads, high-end gaming, 3D animation...but the 1080p gamer just won't see a need for them within the next couple APU generations. Oh, and the Steam Deck supposedly puts out about 1.6 TFLOPS, using 8 CUs. RDNA 2 desktop parts are rumored to use 12, which lands it somewhere in the 2.4 range. Probably a little higher given the TDP increase allowing for higher clock rate. The 1050ti puts out 2.1. And the Series S has 4 TFLOPS of GPU performance, but aims for a 1440p performance target. At 1080p, somewhere around 2.25ish should provide equivalent performance. So I'm expecting RDNA 2 desktop APUs to best the 1050ti, and at 1080p with equivalent video quality settings, perform on par with the Series S. Not quite PS5/Series X/3060ti good. But certainly a capable gaming experience.
can we plz get some fps charts comparing all the ryzen apu's you've tested recently?? I'd love to see how the 5600g vs 5700g stack up to each other in games.
yeah, I really appreciate the numbers, but I prefer the comparisons. Like geek bench and 3dmark numbers never mean much to me, I always have to go to comparison charts. if these videos just had like, the APUs vs one R5 and one i5 or something, it'd be so much easier to understand relative performance. Charts can be a lot of work, so even just putting the numbers on the screen. Most other reviewers are testing with R7s and R9s, so even if it's not a fair comparison for purchasing, I like seeing where they fit in relation to each other. Is the extra $50 or $100 or however much worth it. I understand that if you have a strict budget and can only spend a fixed amount looking at the $300-$400 CPUs doesn't make sense. But seeing an APU get 60% or 80% of the higher end CPUs in gaming really helps put things in perspective. Very rarely are the more expensive parts actually that much more performance. 50% more cost doesn't mean 50% more fps. But I still like to see exactly how they compare
They're virtually identical, maybe 4-6% gains, 10 if you're lucky in a FEW games. All for nearly half again as much money. It's not worth it. Just buy the 5600g, it's plenty powerful. 5700G's niche is people who want to squeeze a couple more minutes off long renders when they're not gaming.
I'm using the exact same combination of motherboard, cpu and cooler. My case is a little bit different but using a 1u 300w psu. My problem is just my memories that are 3200mhz. Will try to upgrade it to 4400mhz because it seems you got a good extra fps in gaming. Loved to see this setup here
That upgrade is huge, and even 3600 or 4000 would be so much better than 3200mhz. APUs share RAM with the rest of the system, rather than having dedicated video memory, and that sharing leads to the RAM being heavily abused...it only has so much bandwidth to feed both the CPU and graphics. So dual-channel, high-speed RAM is a must. Which is too bad, considering HP had literally made APU builds with single-channel RAM, running even slower than yours. Which is generally...not too terrible, and a common practice in cheap prebuilts. But had no place, at all, in any APU-based rig.
I am actually impressed how well it runs for an apu.I can't wait for when they change apu's from vega over to rdna2.AMD has been quiet about there new products but pretty sure they change gpu's to prepare for the intel igpu's.
@@ETAPRIME Yeah exactly alongside say the Asrock X300 it's about as simple as it comes... This one just wins for being able to take proper ram and still not be all that big.
I'm so excited for ryzen 6000 APUs. I'm also hoping intel's Xe GPUs hold up to their claims. Imagine if both iGPUs are actually pretty capable in next gen. That would be awesome.
I'd prefer the In-Win BQ656 personally, its the exact same case but with a different cosmetic look to the outside, but you get the slim reversable optical drive bay caddy that can double as an extra 2.5 drive bay for more storage, and has an SD card reader and has stand that doubles as a vesa mount. Only downside is that it comes with a 120w PSU at the moment, though I did replace mine with a 180W one.
Ryzen 5000 (Cezanne/Vermeer) isn't meant to be overclocked in the traditional sense. You just enable PBO +200MHz then tweak the power limits along with curve optimizer and scalar. Zen 3 has an incredible boost algorithm. All core overclock on Ryzen 5000 is ill advised. Also, buying RAM that fast is a waste. Ryzen loves tight timings and lowest latency possible. Best to get 3600 CL14 than super fast RAM like 4400MHz with god awful timings. For as many Ryzen Cezanne video's you've done, I thought you would know this by now.
Really liked your comment, I did not know that new Ryzen 5000 (Cezanne/Vermeer) are not meant to be overclocked, can I enable PBO +200MHz in the Radeon Software? Just wondering the reason why we should not overclock Ryzen 5000 CPUs, is it because it reduces their life expectancy or is it because 'Zen 3 has an incredible boost algorithm?'
@@rsupp it's because, with enough thermal and power headroom, the CPU will overclock itself - on a per core basis - which will give you better performance then a simple all core overclock. The way the guy above explained is simple, for something more in depth you can use ClockTuner.
Close to $750 after tax in NY, and it can't run 1080p comfortably. For the money you can easily get an used or even new mid range gaming laptop (like the one from HP) with a dedicated graphics card for a lot less.. This isn't particularly small either.. Meh.
Note that the economics of CPUs and discrete GPUs mean that most sub-thousand dollar gaming laptops have some serious compromises that make them less desirable to use as laptops. Usually with build quality and input devices, often with storage and RAM too.
Looking great for low power gaming! How's the noise with this new PSU? I think people were complaining about the noise. Also, may I know what's the keyboard you use?
I made a similar one myself using the ASRock X300 miniPC and a 5700G. OC the GPU and RAM. Does great and is actually cheaper than this option and smaller!
you should test drauger os on this! its gaming oriented linux distro aimed at the lowest latency possible, it performs great on most systems ive tested with!
It'll be nice to see a redo of the tests with lock frames at 30 for the more demanding games and up the quality and have a console like experience in a super small form factor.
I think that's awesome as I'm an emulation junkie. I wouldn't want it for any modern gaming though. I'll stick to the 3080 Ti. Pretty impressive for a lil machine.
The original Chopin 150W is still going for $150+ (like 50% over MSRP) and the 200W Pro model is nowhere to be found. Good luck finding those deals! :D
I did like the Inwin Chopin case when it came out but I am still disappointed they did not put a regular standard TFX PSU in the case. Even though they are hard to find at least you could upgrade to a more powerful one if you needed to. I dislike the 1U PSU because they often create to much noise with the small 40mm fan. Nice review.
Hahaha I find it so funny how we are so nitpicky about fps and graphics when we used to literally play quake in software mod in a postage stamp sized window. Amazing how far gaming has come
@@marriondsouza3678 Eventually, yes. AM5 socket should allow this as it has a lot more pins compared to AM4. It's not unreasonable to expect considering the consoles have RDNA2 APUs. That, and DDR5 would help with the memory speed uplift compared to DDR4. Consoles have GDDR6 but at least DDR5 is double the bandwidth of DDR4 which is better than nothing.
I didnt realize thermalright was still around...when ryzen first came out, my true 120 black was the only cooler that would fit on my 1700x for about a month
great video in the middle of the graphics card shortage, wondering how much more that it costs to build something like this. at least its a solid pc that can handle some medium work loads and a beast with a proper graphics card. I feel like this may be a route that some people may take in the near future and install a graphics card if the shortage ever ends.
Got the original for my Dad's build. This case is by far my favorite productivity mini-itx case. It screams quality and functionality. Nice to see they updated it to output more wattage and that there are some capable coolers available that will fit it. Cooler clearance when I built with it back in 2017 was a bit of an issue. Luckily I was just building a general purpose computer for browsing and video watching, so I just went with the intel stock cooler at the time. I just wish they had something like this just a bit bigger with more PSU options that maintained the aesthetic of this and the original. Like.. Something between this and an older case called the In Win 901. My wife has her PC in the 901 case.. .Exact same look and materials as the Chopin, but with tempered glass.. Not a great PC for thermals though. Ventilation was limited and was more intended for water cooling. If they has something like Chopin with like 2/3 size of the 901....MAN!!! Take my money now! lol
You should try using Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut liquid metal compound between the copper heatsink and CPU spreader and see what kind of temps you get. I’m building something similar and was thinking of doing this. Thanks for the upload.
I have NO IDEA how to OVERCLOCK :( I have Precision Overboost turned on with some automatic overclocking, but my Ryzen 5 3600 seems to lag a little once in a while. I've got 16GB of of G.Skillz 3200 RAM but if I try to take that up any higher the system won't boot. I really don't know what to do. I was thinking of upgrading the ram to some higher speeds like 4000 at 32GB but idk how much that will help. I've only got a Radeon RX 580 8GB but I just don't have the money to step that up. I was thinking of getting at 6600XT when they came out, but I just didn't have the money in time before they ran out. I wish you could do a quick overclocking video, but I'm pretty sure you already have one of those done lol.. I'll have to look. I do have to give you credit for getting me into the retro gaming world and I picked up one of the add-on controllers for your phone that you did a quick review on, the Gamersir X2 - and I enjoy it a LOT!! THANK YOU for making your vids, I get A LOT of enjoyment every time you release and I look forward to seeing them nearly every day :D
great content, but I would highly suggest waiting for the next gen of APUs with RDNA2 graphics technology. This will make APU gaming ACTUALLY worth it.
Really cool form factor, but sadly here in Australia after looking around this would cost almost $1200+ after looking at your links. Getting a gaming laptop with either a 1660ti or a 2060 for that price here would be a better solution to a low powered high performance set up sadly, as you have to account for a monitor and keyboard mouse set up too.. And laptops here in AUS already cost way more compared to the US and EU. You could shop around and get second hand or cheaper equivalent parts but.. Loving the small form factor desktops as of late though.
if they did a mirror version of this a single slot GPU like the RX 6400 could have fans facing ceiling with great air intake without increasing is size at all
"If you could get it up to 4600mhz..." These APUs are VERY unbalanced, weighing CPU performance heavily over GPU. So I'd imagine even if it was slower, it wouldn't be CPU bottlenecked. Have you considered for a small, air-cooled APU build such as this, underclocking the CPU to grant more thermal and power headroom to the GPU?
Waiting for the case to come back in stock so I can build this for myself. One change I plan on making is to go with a 2TB SSD. Should be fun having in the living room on the TV as a mini console.
Oh well, I would have built one. Case doesn't seem to be available. Of course my other two, giant tower, ryzens are liquid cooled because they run 100% 24X7, so that would have been a problem.
This is the pc that I want to build. Now if we can have a more powerful built-in gpu, e.g. rnda2 based with 8 or more compute units, it would be awesome.
I'm trying to understand why InWin didn't put 1 PCIe mounting bracket on the case? I realise you will be limited to single slot peripherals most likely without power connections, but it would have added so much utility to the case - like being able to add a 2.5G ethernet port for older motherboards or even a single slot gpu
A bit late for this question... I am building the same PC but I am using the stock wraith stealth cooler. When enabling 4400 for the ram the temps go above 90 Celsius. I took the mobo from the case to get more air and the same issue. Lost on what is happening? Changed thermal paste and backplate and made sure the cooler is well set.. the weird thing is that the CPU works perfectly no fps lost but those temps are just crazy 😧
If Steam Deck can pull out similar pefrormance to this Igpu (Vega 8 in Desktop), it is more than enough for 720p High Setting (except for abnormal Cyberpunk). Mine using Vega 7 4750u, can get all game running 720p medium-ultra depending on the game, older game canbe played at 1080p High.
*XBox Series X and slim PC design...* How big will an amazing, and inexpensive gaming PC be in three to five years? The XBSX uses roughly 170 Watts average when gaming. There's a LOT of untapped potential that future software can make use of so we'll get near-photo realism at 60FPS in a few years (not that every game needs that). Unreal 5 Nanite, other AI upscaling, VRS, SSD asset streaming etc... in a couple years they'll be able to get the SIZE of that down to closer to HALF if they wanted to. So my POINT is that a really great gaming system can come in a CUBE that's only about 6" on each side (after removing BluRay reader etc) while still going with a cheaper heatsink approach... I'm just excited to see how much Gaming/Computing performance can be packed into a small, quiet space... sure, PC hardware will continue to improve but there's also rapidly DIMINISHING RETURNS visually so again let's fast forward to 2025 and imagine how great games will look (and run). We may even see VRAM or shared CPU/GPU memory being added to the SoC/APU as multi-chip improves. It's not justifiable for monolithic chips due to cost but if you can make an APU with or without the added memory by simply leaving space to ADD the memory chips if desired that becomes very feasible. *Maybe we'll see a shift in OS design towards having a local, super large cache with DDR5 being an OPTIONAL, slower (but larger) cache. Apple's shown a more integrated cache makes a huge difference if you design for it (in the new M1 chips)... so to SUMMARIZE maybe we'll see future AMD AM5 APU's around 2025 that have the following: 1) CPU chiplet 2) GPU chiplet(s) 3) 8GB or more fast, local memory chips? (the main PROBLEM of course is that putting so much into a single SoC/APU often doesn't make sense for a high-end desktop system. Thus it usually makes more sense in mobile devices that have space concerns and are not upgradeable. But again, with multi-chip the costs go way down so adding the better GPU and/or memory chips will be doable with a far smaller demand.)
No USB-C on the front panel is sad. This little case is kinda amazing otherwise, but USB-C thumbdrives and C-to-C USB cables for stuff like external harddrives and USB peripherals are starting to become fairly common now, and making a revision to the case without that little bit of futureproofing is... disappointing
@@stickboy8219 oh I have several PCs. A good spec for gaming, a spare for whatever and a couple running Batocera etc. I get that PC is king. But convenience and no messing with settings certainly appeals when talking about a Series S.
@@stuartleckie yeah mate I moved from console a couple years ago and feel like ive wasted half my life as I love pc so much now I still have my ps4 pro, switch and abox one x but after getting a 3080 and 5900X nothing compairs
@@stickboy8219 I guess my first ‘PC’ was a ZX Spectrum in 1983 😆 So I’m not stranger to computer gaming. Also have a PS4 pro and Xbox 1 X. But I find I game most on my Switch. But back to my original question, this specific build, what makes it a better choice for 1080 gaming than a series s ??
since Ryzen 3000, is it really necessary to manually overclock the CPU? shouldn't performance scale based on available cooling? it seems that for better gaming performance, you'd want to manually overclock the GPU clocks as high as possible while leaving CPU clocks stock so they can scale as needed. considering your CPU usage never seemed to really approach 100%, I'd have used all that APU overhead for GPU performance.
Great video. I's assuming bios overclocking. could you do a video comparing bios oc vs. one click OC with new adreneline software/ ryzen master? because giving a bleeding edge tuned pc to a non-techy sibling is frustration waiting to happen.
It still blows my mind how far the iGPUs have evolved over the last 5 years because of the Ryzen's development.
Who would've thought that one could actually game contemporary titles in 1080p with an iGPU back in 2015...
Excellent job, AMD, you fully deserve to be #1
Man even without a GPU PCs are still costing 500$
still better than like 1k build plus the 2k Nvidia GPU....
i bought a Ryzen APU just because of your videos. KEEP IT UP!
... and I am going to. For a mini desktop as well as for a HTPC. I just cannot decide if I should go "all in" and buy stuff new and kinda expensive, or if it would be fast enough to look after used parts.
From Ryzen 2200G, 3400G, 4300G, 4600G, 5600H all the way up to 5700G ... everything looks promising!
But I just cant decide.
i am saving $ for the DDR5-12600 gen
Another great video! Thanks for doing these. They are really very practical and easy to follow. Love your choices on hardware as well. Please keep up the great work!
If you haven’t already I think you should a budget intel one and maybe even ryzen 3000
Agree, would love to the the capabilities of a cheap intel CPU only emulation build, like the Pentium g6400 or i3 10100
Second this, the iGPU on the 11th Gen Intel CPUs might not be as Powerful but they still do pack quite a Punch for their price range and showing what it can do might be good for people who just want a stop gap until a decent GPU shows up.
@@BeefiusGravius is it better than vega 8?
@@unbeatable3d Iris Xe is more or less comparable to Vega 8 just with Intel drivers which are usually always worse than Radeons, seems like we have a plateau until we get DDR5 and either RDNA2 or larger Xe
The jump to DDR5 and the IPC increase of RDNA 2 will make next-gen APUs even better. Combined with the GPU market being essentially a fuckfest at all turns, the fact that GPU power is not as necessary as it was in the past (720p 30fps was the norm on 360 and PS3...they rendered below 1080p and upscaled, while some people prefer high resolutions or high refresh rate, gaming is doable without it, so now GPU power is used more for headroom than necessity) and the cost effectiveness of APUs make me think we'll see another class of PC gamers come to exist. People who aren't settings elitists, making awesome SFF builds.
I, personally, want to make an RDNA 2 Chopin build, with a motherboard that supports Thunderbolt, and an external GPU enclosure with an RDNA 2 dedicated GPU.
The steam deck also gives developers a new performance target - get their games running well at 720p on an APU. An APU which, at 15w, will be even lower performing than the desktop models.
At home, I get a full gaming experience. But I can leave the GPU and take the Chopin with me, and have an ultra-tiny LAN box that can handle any game. Thanks to APUs and Thunderbolt, a 2-piece gaming desktop consisting of an ultra small tower and external GPU is a very really possibility.
DDR5 will help a lot because it is dual channel per stick so when you dual channel the PC you will have an effective quad channel config. When AM5 launches and you have RDNA2 or 3 cores active I think the upgrade will be substantial. One of those with a fast NVMe drive in it would make a pretty nice all round PC by any standards I reckon, all it's PC stuff would be lightning fast and it can game as a bonus.
@Gonçalo Amaro Also worth mentioning, things like DLSS, Fidelity FX, frame rate target control, and resolution scale, are allowing us to render in lower resolutions while upscaling, or keep a sharp GUI while gaming in a lower scale, or adjust resolution to meet a certain performance criteria. We've been seeing a shift towards software-based solutions for gaming in lower than native res and making it look good, largely driven by 1440p and 4k monitors, but this opens up a can of worms for the possibility of reducing the requirements for a good gaming experience on 1080p monitors.
With graphics cards now targeting high res and high refresh rate gaming, 1080p 60fps is no longer the target. If you're comfortable gaming there, combined with ongoing software progression...there will be a strong future where graphics cards aren't needed.
APU development and software development has been progressing significantly, and that's in a world where GPU power is already progressing far faster than games are utilizing it, with modern GPUs no longer targeting 1080p 60fps gaming. We're starting to reach a point where the power of integrated graphics and the minimum to have a good gaming experience are converging, and I think within the next decade, we'll see more and more gamers dropping dedicated graphics altogether. They'll still have a place for professional workloads, high-end gaming, 3D animation...but the 1080p gamer just won't see a need for them within the next couple APU generations.
Oh, and the Steam Deck supposedly puts out about 1.6 TFLOPS, using 8 CUs. RDNA 2 desktop parts are rumored to use 12, which lands it somewhere in the 2.4 range. Probably a little higher given the TDP increase allowing for higher clock rate. The 1050ti puts out 2.1. And the Series S has 4 TFLOPS of GPU performance, but aims for a 1440p performance target. At 1080p, somewhere around 2.25ish should provide equivalent performance. So I'm expecting RDNA 2 desktop APUs to best the 1050ti, and at 1080p with equivalent video quality settings, perform on par with the Series S. Not quite PS5/Series X/3060ti good. But certainly a capable gaming experience.
Asrock Fatality x570 has thunder port. It's what I'm using with a 5600g I was cheating on the cpu cause I have a gpu.
That's a gorgeous keyboard and cap-set. Skimmed through and didn't hear/see the make/model mentioned?
Seconded I'd love to get one of those I prefer low profile keys.
He said it’s the the nuphy air75!
Nuphy air75 if I am correct... Very close to ordering this thing 😛
I thought I recognized that keyboard. I already preordered it since I was really happy with their first keyboard the Nuphy F1.
Thanks guys, absolutely love that keyboard and was interested myself :)
I am in love with that tiny keyboard!
can we plz get some fps charts comparing all the ryzen apu's you've tested recently?? I'd love to see how the 5600g vs 5700g stack up to each other in games.
yeah, I really appreciate the numbers, but I prefer the comparisons. Like geek bench and 3dmark numbers never mean much to me, I always have to go to comparison charts. if these videos just had like, the APUs vs one R5 and one i5 or something, it'd be so much easier to understand relative performance. Charts can be a lot of work, so even just putting the numbers on the screen. Most other reviewers are testing with R7s and R9s, so even if it's not a fair comparison for purchasing, I like seeing where they fit in relation to each other. Is the extra $50 or $100 or however much worth it.
I understand that if you have a strict budget and can only spend a fixed amount looking at the $300-$400 CPUs doesn't make sense. But seeing an APU get 60% or 80% of the higher end CPUs in gaming really helps put things in perspective. Very rarely are the more expensive parts actually that much more performance. 50% more cost doesn't mean 50% more fps. But I still like to see exactly how they compare
They're virtually identical, maybe 4-6% gains, 10 if you're lucky in a FEW games. All for nearly half again as much money. It's not worth it. Just buy the 5600g, it's plenty powerful. 5700G's niche is people who want to squeeze a couple more minutes off long renders when they're not gaming.
Watch the hardware unboxed video
OJT
@@zekezander pap
I'm using the exact same combination of motherboard, cpu and cooler. My case is a little bit different but using a 1u 300w psu. My problem is just my memories that are 3200mhz. Will try to upgrade it to 4400mhz because it seems you got a good extra fps in gaming. Loved to see this setup here
That upgrade is huge, and even 3600 or 4000 would be so much better than 3200mhz. APUs share RAM with the rest of the system, rather than having dedicated video memory, and that sharing leads to the RAM being heavily abused...it only has so much bandwidth to feed both the CPU and graphics. So dual-channel, high-speed RAM is a must.
Which is too bad, considering HP had literally made APU builds with single-channel RAM, running even slower than yours. Which is generally...not too terrible, and a common practice in cheap prebuilts. But had no place, at all, in any APU-based rig.
@@bluesy92 convinced. just bought a pair of 16gb 4000mhz. Just waiting for it to arrive and test. Thanks for the reply!
I am actually impressed how well it runs for an apu.I can't wait for when they change apu's from vega over to rdna2.AMD has been quiet about there new products but pretty sure they change gpu's to prepare for the intel igpu's.
Still by far my favourite SFF case...
Yeah it hard to beat, You dont have to mess with a Pico PSU and its still tiny
@@ETAPRIME Yeah exactly alongside say the Asrock X300 it's about as simple as it comes... This one just wins for being able to take proper ram and still not be all that big.
@@ETAPRIME Downside: The PSU is totally proprietary. I mean you can get another for ~$60+shipping, but it's non-standard so not competitively priced.
I would love to see how this runs with a Linux load maybe Pop! or MInt.
6700g with rdna cu will be amazing in the future
I am excited for RDNA APUs 🤩🤩
I'm so excited for ryzen 6000 APUs. I'm also hoping intel's Xe GPUs hold up to their claims. Imagine if both iGPUs are actually pretty capable in next gen. That would be awesome.
I'd prefer the In-Win BQ656 personally, its the exact same case but with a different cosmetic look to the outside, but you get the slim reversable optical drive bay caddy that can double as an extra 2.5 drive bay for more storage, and has an SD card reader and has stand that doubles as a vesa mount. Only downside is that it comes with a 120w PSU at the moment, though I did replace mine with a 180W one.
@8:28 LOOK AT THAT CAR TEXTURE! Lmfao
Ryzen 5000 (Cezanne/Vermeer) isn't meant to be overclocked in the traditional sense. You just enable PBO +200MHz then tweak the power limits along with curve optimizer and scalar. Zen 3 has an incredible boost algorithm. All core overclock on Ryzen 5000 is ill advised. Also, buying RAM that fast is a waste. Ryzen loves tight timings and lowest latency possible. Best to get 3600 CL14 than super fast RAM like 4400MHz with god awful timings. For as many Ryzen Cezanne video's you've done, I thought you would know this by now.
Really liked your comment, I did not know that new Ryzen 5000 (Cezanne/Vermeer) are not meant to be overclocked, can I enable PBO +200MHz in the Radeon Software? Just wondering the reason why we should not overclock Ryzen 5000 CPUs, is it because it reduces their life expectancy or is it because 'Zen 3 has an incredible boost algorithm?'
@@rsupp it's because, with enough thermal and power headroom, the CPU will overclock itself - on a per core basis - which will give you better performance then a simple all core overclock. The way the guy above explained is simple, for something more in depth you can use ClockTuner.
Close to $750 after tax in NY, and it can't run 1080p comfortably. For the money you can easily get an used or even new mid range gaming laptop (like the one from HP) with a dedicated graphics card for a lot less.. This isn't particularly small either.. Meh.
Note that the economics of CPUs and discrete GPUs mean that most sub-thousand dollar gaming laptops have some serious compromises that make them less desirable to use as laptops. Usually with build quality and input devices, often with storage and RAM too.
Looking great for low power gaming! How's the noise with this new PSU? I think people were complaining about the noise. Also, may I know what's the keyboard you use?
they say 47mm but when you measure the actual height after installing the cooler you'll see it's actually 54~56 mm
I made a similar one myself using the ASRock X300 miniPC and a 5700G. OC the GPU and RAM. Does great and is actually cheaper than this option and smaller!
You're the man! I just found this case and looking to build a 5700G mini PC.
you should test drauger os on this! its gaming oriented linux distro aimed at the lowest latency possible, it performs great on most systems ive tested with!
The next gen of APU will run mostly on 1080P medium....not bad, not bad.
Dude what keyboard are you using? Looks really cool
Hey ETA, can you please use genshin impact for the test?
It would be really appreciated if you did!!
exactly I have asked for the past 10 or so videos yet he never he only does games he likes I guess
i was just about to comment the same thing I'm looking to build one of this little bad boys for genshin
His older videos have genshin impact benchmarks. IIRC, the 5700g can run it at 1080p 60fps. Can’t remember if it was on medium or low settings though.
@@philipjoh5131 only like 2 or 3 😢
genshin impact is a very easy game to run on pc's, so that's why he doesn't try genshin on it.
It'll be nice to see a redo of the tests with lock frames at 30 for the more demanding games and up the quality and have a console like experience in a super small form factor.
I'm a bit of Chopin fan myself... my go to sffpc case, I just love its design.
What is that nice colorful keyboard you use?
Nice little rig, but a link to the keyboard would be nice. :-)
I think that's awesome as I'm an emulation junkie. I wouldn't want it for any modern gaming though. I'll stick to the 3080 Ti. Pretty impressive for a lil machine.
Can you tell me what is your keyboard on the desk? It looks really good.
Little machines like this Id recommend doing light testing of mainstream pc games like e sports titles.
The original Chopin 150W is still going for $150+ (like 50% over MSRP) and the 200W Pro model is nowhere to be found. Good luck finding those deals! :D
I did like the Inwin Chopin case when it came out but I am still disappointed they did not put a regular standard TFX PSU in the case. Even though they are hard to find at least you could upgrade to a more powerful one if you needed to. I dislike the 1U PSU because they often create to much noise with the small 40mm fan. Nice review.
Hahaha I find it so funny how we are so nitpicky about fps and graphics when we used to literally play quake in software mod in a postage stamp sized window. Amazing how far gaming has come
I can't wait to see RDNA2 APUs. Come on AM5!
Are APUs going to launch with rdna2??
@@marriondsouza3678 Eventually, yes. AM5 socket should allow this as it has a lot more pins compared to AM4. It's not unreasonable to expect considering the consoles have RDNA2 APUs. That, and DDR5 would help with the memory speed uplift compared to DDR4. Consoles have GDDR6 but at least DDR5 is double the bandwidth of DDR4 which is better than nothing.
I really want one of these with a big external HDD for movie watching on my 4K TV.
Great video, as always.....but why do you not include the $ price? My apologies if you did and I missed it.
I didnt realize thermalright was still around...when ryzen first came out, my true 120 black was the only cooler that would fit on my 1700x for about a month
Wow That's 5700G Is Right Up There With 3700X But Has A Built In GPU !
Thank you for the review, we would like to share this video on our social media platform, ok ?
How are the noise levels with the PSU in the Chopin Pro? Noise is the main complaint I’ve read online about this case and the regular Chopin.
Wondering how this would handle WOW. Thanks
Apus have come a long way!
great video in the middle of the graphics card shortage, wondering how much more that it costs to build something like this. at least its a solid pc that can handle some medium work loads and a beast with a proper graphics card. I feel like this may be a route that some people may take in the near future and install a graphics card if the shortage ever ends.
Got the original for my Dad's build. This case is by far my favorite productivity mini-itx case. It screams quality and functionality. Nice to see they updated it to output more wattage and that there are some capable coolers available that will fit it. Cooler clearance when I built with it back in 2017 was a bit of an issue. Luckily I was just building a general purpose computer for browsing and video watching, so I just went with the intel stock cooler at the time.
I just wish they had something like this just a bit bigger with more PSU options that maintained the aesthetic of this and the original. Like.. Something between this and an older case called the In Win 901. My wife has her PC in the 901 case.. .Exact same look and materials as the Chopin, but with tempered glass.. Not a great PC for thermals though. Ventilation was limited and was more intended for water cooling.
If they has something like Chopin with like 2/3 size of the 901....MAN!!! Take my money now! lol
APUs are becoming so incredible. I can't believe this is still Vega.
You should try using Thermal Grizzly Conductonaut liquid metal compound between the copper heatsink and CPU spreader and see what kind of temps you get. I’m building something similar and was thinking of doing this. Thanks for the upload.
That case looks like it would be great for a little HTPC!
I have NO IDEA how to OVERCLOCK :( I have Precision Overboost turned on with some automatic overclocking, but my Ryzen 5 3600 seems to lag a little once in a while. I've got 16GB of of G.Skillz 3200 RAM but if I try to take that up any higher the system won't boot. I really don't know what to do. I was thinking of upgrading the ram to some higher speeds like 4000 at 32GB but idk how much that will help. I've only got a Radeon RX 580 8GB but I just don't have the money to step that up. I was thinking of getting at 6600XT when they came out, but I just didn't have the money in time before they ran out.
I wish you could do a quick overclocking video, but I'm pretty sure you already have one of those done lol.. I'll have to look. I do have to give you credit for getting me into the retro gaming world and I picked up one of the add-on controllers for your phone that you did a quick review on, the Gamersir X2 - and I enjoy it a LOT!!
THANK YOU for making your vids, I get A LOT of enjoyment every time you release and I look forward to seeing them nearly every day :D
4000 and 32G is gonna be a big boost
what keyboard is that? looks so damn cool🥺
Hi. What is the keyboard called in the thumbnail?
that case is quite nice, always liked it
great content, but I would highly suggest waiting for the next gen of APUs with RDNA2 graphics technology. This will make APU gaming ACTUALLY worth it.
That's what I plan to do, or even better, RDNA3. Right now I've put a 7600 into one and it's working great (even slightly OCd).
Very impressive performance on that 5700G!
little over 700 bucks its a smart build
Really cool form factor, but sadly here in Australia after looking around this would cost almost $1200+ after looking at your links. Getting a gaming laptop with either a 1660ti or a 2060 for that price here would be a better solution to a low powered high performance set up sadly, as you have to account for a monitor and keyboard mouse set up too.. And laptops here in AUS already cost way more compared to the US and EU.
You could shop around and get second hand or cheaper equivalent parts but..
Loving the small form factor desktops as of late though.
Is there any place where the Chopin Pro is available? It's sold out in the USA e-store.
Love your keeb! Mind sharing model and keycaps?
It looks like its a NuPhy Air75
if they did a mirror version of this a single slot GPU like the RX 6400 could have fans facing ceiling with great air intake without increasing is size at all
I love these tiny PC's.
Keep up reviewing these APUs, gonna be even harder to get, had to wait 10days for my 5600G. i better order a 5700 before they dissappear.
"If you could get it up to 4600mhz..."
These APUs are VERY unbalanced, weighing CPU performance heavily over GPU. So I'd imagine even if it was slower, it wouldn't be CPU bottlenecked. Have you considered for a small, air-cooled APU build such as this, underclocking the CPU to grant more thermal and power headroom to the GPU?
We'll never be able to get a graphics card ever again. 😥
Waiting for the case to come back in stock so I can build this for myself. One change I plan on making is to go with a 2TB SSD. Should be fun having in the living room on the TV as a mini console.
Wonder if there's alternatives to the case.
Oh well, I would have built one. Case doesn't seem to be available. Of course my other two, giant tower, ryzens are liquid cooled because they run 100% 24X7, so that would have been a problem.
This is the pc that I want to build. Now if we can have a more powerful built-in gpu, e.g. rnda2 based with 8 or more compute units, it would be awesome.
I'm trying to understand why InWin didn't put 1 PCIe mounting bracket on the case? I realise you will be limited to single slot peripherals most likely without power connections, but it would have added so much utility to the case - like being able to add a 2.5G ethernet port for older motherboards or even a single slot gpu
Could you please name the keyboard model?
That is freaking awesome what you can do something that small
I built this same exact config, only with a noctua NH-L9a-AM4 and only 3200 MHz RAM
Dude how many PCs you got?!
A bit late for this question... I am building the same PC but I am using the stock wraith stealth cooler. When enabling 4400 for the ram the temps go above 90 Celsius. I took the mobo from the case to get more air and the same issue. Lost on what is happening? Changed thermal paste and backplate and made sure the cooler is well set.. the weird thing is that the CPU works perfectly no fps lost but those temps are just crazy 😧
you can use the stock AMD cooler that comes with 5700G on Chopin with no problem.
Lol. Thank you for pronouncing it correctly this time.
Chopin? Thats my machine!! ;)
Exactly what i need, for my parents, thx!
If Steam Deck can pull out similar pefrormance to this Igpu (Vega 8 in Desktop), it is more than enough for 720p High Setting (except for abnormal Cyberpunk). Mine using Vega 7 4750u, can get all game running 720p medium-ultra depending on the game, older game canbe played at 1080p High.
These minis are so cool. I'm bummed this case is currently sold out, but it looks like the 150w version is still available.
*XBox Series X and slim PC design...*
How big will an amazing, and inexpensive gaming PC be in three to five years?
The XBSX uses roughly 170 Watts average when gaming. There's a LOT of untapped potential that future software can make use of so we'll get near-photo realism at 60FPS in a few years (not that every game needs that). Unreal 5 Nanite, other AI upscaling, VRS, SSD asset streaming etc... in a couple years they'll be able to get the SIZE of that down to closer to HALF if they wanted to. So my POINT is that a really great gaming system can come in a CUBE that's only about 6" on each side (after removing BluRay reader etc) while still going with a cheaper heatsink approach... I'm just excited to see how much Gaming/Computing performance can be packed into a small, quiet space... sure, PC hardware will continue to improve but there's also rapidly DIMINISHING RETURNS visually so again let's fast forward to 2025 and imagine how great games will look (and run).
We may even see VRAM or shared CPU/GPU memory being added to the SoC/APU as multi-chip improves. It's not justifiable for monolithic chips due to cost but if you can make an APU with or without the added memory by simply leaving space to ADD the memory chips if desired that becomes very feasible.
*Maybe we'll see a shift in OS design towards having a local, super large cache with DDR5 being an OPTIONAL, slower (but larger) cache. Apple's shown a more integrated cache makes a huge difference if you design for it (in the new M1 chips)... so to SUMMARIZE maybe we'll see future AMD AM5 APU's around 2025 that have the following:
1) CPU chiplet
2) GPU chiplet(s)
3) 8GB or more fast, local memory chips?
(the main PROBLEM of course is that putting so much into a single SoC/APU often doesn't make sense for a high-end desktop system. Thus it usually makes more sense in mobile devices that have space concerns and are not upgradeable. But again, with multi-chip the costs go way down so adding the better GPU and/or memory chips will be doable with a far smaller demand.)
No USB-C on the front panel is sad. This little case is kinda amazing otherwise, but USB-C thumbdrives and C-to-C USB cables for stuff like external harddrives and USB peripherals are starting to become fairly common now, and making a revision to the case without that little bit of futureproofing is... disappointing
Exactly!
Absolutely. I connect my pc to monitor by type c and my keyboard and mouse connected to monitor.
Just use the usb c from the back panel ...
Seems it'll work great along with a passive capture card to fill the empty pcie slot.
That’s a nice looking build.
But I have to ask, if it’s only for gaming, especially 1080, why would I not just buy an Xbox Series S ?
Because PC is more versatile consoles are shit
@@stickboy8219 oh I have several PCs. A good spec for gaming, a spare for whatever and a couple running Batocera etc.
I get that PC is king.
But convenience and no messing with settings certainly appeals when talking about a Series S.
@@stuartleckie yeah mate I moved from console a couple years ago and feel like ive wasted half my life as I love pc so much now I still have my ps4 pro, switch and abox one x but after getting a 3080 and 5900X nothing compairs
@@stickboy8219 I guess my first ‘PC’ was a ZX Spectrum in 1983 😆
So I’m not stranger to computer gaming.
Also have a PS4 pro and Xbox 1 X. But I find I game most on my Switch.
But back to my original question, this specific build, what makes it a better choice for 1080 gaming than a series s ??
Nice keyboard :)
You´ve to turn 180 degrees that cooler man
can you scale the pc after building? next time you make small pc like this. just for shipping purposes. would help alot. thanksss
What's that keyboard?
Awesome review...
they really need to make a case like this just for ipd porpuse but for atx and micro atx
What would you recommend for the best Ryzen based machine for emulation at around $500-600? Something smallish for an arcade cabinet.
Finally I can get rid of all the copper in my minecraft chest LOL.
Nice little build!
dunno if youll see this, but yesterday i bought a gaming desktop from walmart with a ryzen 5 3500 and a 1650 super for only $115.
that keyboard on the thumbnail tho... what's that it looks cool
since Ryzen 3000, is it really necessary to manually overclock the CPU? shouldn't performance scale based on available cooling? it seems that for better gaming performance, you'd want to manually overclock the GPU clocks as high as possible while leaving CPU clocks stock so they can scale as needed. considering your CPU usage never seemed to really approach 100%, I'd have used all that APU overhead for GPU performance.
OMG! 😍 That cpu cooler is hot 🔥🥵
I wonder if the Rx6400 would fit in there
Love when my heatsink's got a lot of meat to it
Great video. I's assuming bios overclocking. could you do a video comparing bios oc vs. one click OC with new adreneline software/ ryzen master? because giving a bleeding edge tuned pc to a non-techy sibling is frustration waiting to happen.
We need a 35usd RaspberryPI 5, like yesterday's, to emulate Sega Rally (Saturn) 60fps. The thing is: When? :')
Anyone knows the model of the keyboard he's using in this vid? Thanks!