Have you considered checking out the 20th anniversary edition of the Thrawn trilogy? Marc Thompson's portrayal of all the characters are all spot on in their presentation and coupled with excellent use of the movie soundtrack it's freaking incredible. I would love you to death if you checked them out once in a while.
Have you ever listened to the audiobook versions and heard Marc Thompsons portrayal? To me, it puts the scene in my head like I can actually see it like a movie. His voices are amazing especially for Lando imo. The books read by him might actually surpass the OT for me. To be fair, that's like 40 hours of content compared to 7 or 8.
One of my favorite characters from the Thrawn Trilogy was pilot Pash Cracken. I believe he was the first 'ace' introduced that was not one of Luke or Wedge's wingmen. I have loved the Rebel starfighters since the original film, and Pash was a great new addition, a badass tactically, really innovative strategically, and a good illustration of how the Rebellion/New Republic had heroes beyond the filmed characters.
I've been "reading" up on the New Republic Era Audiobooks up to this point, since i'd always heard about the Thrawn story, and figured now that this Rumination was up, it was a good time to get into it. Of the 3 versions out there, i picked the 20th anniversary edition, and man, it's a thing of beauty. Marc Thompson puts out such a performance, i had a hard time believing it was only one dude doing all the voices - Han, Luke, Lando and even characters that have only a few lines like Yoda and Palpatine sound nearly perfect. Not just how many different voices he can make, the man has some genuine acting talent - i could totally feel Mara and Karrde and Thrawn and Pellaeon and C'baoth and Ruhk, you name it. Most addicting 45 hours of audio storytelling i've listened to in as long as i can remember. No, i did not get paid to say this, i'm just gushing. And yes, i am a moron and a sucker for the "now what". I want to know what happened the second after the cast lined up for the group shot at the last frame of ROTJ. Did they go to for drinks? Did they all get a room and spread a Monopoly board on the floor and then laughed when Luke ended up owning the Death Star, and Lando had to pay 3PO 3000 credits for landing at Cloud City for a turn? Did they all jump when some Rebel pilot got drunk and started running around the village wearing a Stormtrooper helmet? I got some of that with the Truce at Bakura, but then they all had to get serious and solve some alien problem from outer space when the story kicked in. Still nice, though. As for interpretations, they can change as i get into more of the EU, which only now i've begun to get into in earnest (and mostly just the Audiobooks, since i can listen to them as i work (they help me concentrate)), but i'll try. Now, contrary to what a lot of people seem to prefer, i don't usually take the greatest liking to intellectually fascinating characters like Thrawn - amazing as he still is nonetheless. I can't really define very well what kind of characters i do like the most, but if i had to nutshell it, i think i usually go for the humanity. Now again, mega-props to Marc Thompson for all his portrayals of all the major characters in this book; he brought them all to life for me - even the females, which his voice is obviously not cut out for, which brings me to Mara Jade. I'm not much for naming favorites, but if i were, there's a good chance Mara would be it. Granted, a good part of it is i know what she'll be in the future, and she's probably the character i was anticipating the most, so maybe my goggles are a bit tinted. If you just put Mara on paper, she'd probably be a character i'd despise at first glance. Here we have a former agent of the Emperor himself - that monster of a man we all know and love, all angry at a person for having failed to die when she wanted him to, and then daring to confront Palpatine and winning. It's an old and beat up "bad guy's revenge" concept, and normally only serves to underline that the person striving for it really is an evil immoral bastard. Fortunately, it became apparent to me from early on that that really wasn't her nature, by and large. Both her attitude and her actions betrayed someone who was quite different from that background, and i always felt inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt until her story fully unraveled (and it never felt as bad or inconsistent writing either). It was one of the most engaging aspects of the story, to try and connect the black burning hatred she felt for Luke with the actual person feeling it, and all the sparring and scraping she did with him and herself and the final command that had been burned into her mind. Also, her annoyance at Luke's unshakable ironclad kindness is almost hilarious (in a good way), and a pretty good tension breaker from the horrible doom and gloom of her situation. Her effect on Luke is also a good breakout for his character in turn, especially when he goes semi-berserk whenever she's in danger. Not many things can get that out of him anymore, ever since he became a Jedi. Speaking of tension-breaking, i never expected to get comic relief from the Nohgri until they started interacting with the Consort of the Lady Vader; that was priceless. Karrde was an awesome character, and one that kept me guessing until almost the end of Book 1. By Book 2, it could be reasonably assumed he was a good guy, but with so many layers of pragmatism to him that you could still wonder which way he'd go if the wind blew badly. He has a kind of cunning not normally seen outside of villains, is not afraid of playing both sides to their full effect, has frigging guard hounds who hunt through the Force, but then he has a team of fairly developed characters who seem to fully trust him, has the composure to handle a situation that's barely hanging on by a thread, bluffing his way through it while breaking nary a sweat, and finally shows genuine concern for the well-being of the people around him - which for our benefit, always masks with what could be reasonably be interpreted as self interest throughout most of the story. And the frigging voice acting. C'baoth, i've little to say about, really. He's insane, arrogant, and power-hungry. And he's a force to be reckoned with, the only person who can seriously annoy Thrawn, which is almost funny to watch, and he's a great enemy, and a great way to cement the bond between Mara and Luke. One could feel sympathy for his situation, as Luke does, but there's little in the way of redeeming qualities to him, or even insight into the obvious tragedy of his circumstance. All in all, i felt myself siding more with Mara's approach, in that it would have been better to just put him out of his misery, and save a lot of people a lot of grief in doing so - and i don't say that often. To his credit, his performance in being what he is is pretty powerful. You can very much believe this man is every bit as crazy and determined and unsalvageable as he's meant to be. And all the while, still very dangerous. At the end of the day, though, i guess i see him as a very well put together device, more than a character we're supposed to care for. Pellaeon, i very much liked. I remember you saying once that this trilogy made the Emperor seem stupid. I personally thought it made the Emperor seem like a power-hungry, world-devouring monster - which i had guessed at a long time ago, really. And Pellaeon seemed to make that distinction very early on. He was also, along with Thrawn, one of the first characters in the Empire i could really care about. He wasn't a genius like Thrawn, nor really had any extraordinary traits about him, but what he had was Character. He was a decent man and a good commander, and maybe the first sign that this really isn't a tyrant Empire anymore - which is both good and tragic, considering. As for Thrawn, i don't think he was utterly uncaring so much as Machiavellian. He had such a concept of the big picture, it was kind of inevitable that he viewed people as expendable, thought not necessarily insignificant. The calm way that he faced his own end makes it seem like he simply thought in different terms than simple ruthlessness for self-gain. It's telling that he didn't seem to have begrudged being relegated to Frontier duty, when i get the distinct feeling he could very well have successfully argued for a more noteworthy station in the empire. It seems like the Frontier is where he'd want to be; where the action would be. And when he congratulated his fleet on a job well-done, i rather think he meant it. I think this is where he lived - the game, so to speak, and when he had the satisfaction of seeing it through, i think he really did like to share it with the people he felt deserved it. I wonder if he would have eventually rebelled, as Palpatine centralized his power more and more and started phasing out people like him who were the tip of the spear, in favor of wasteful megalomaniacal genocide machines like the Death Star. Heck, maybe he let himself stay on the Frontier so he could have nothing to do with it. All in all, though, this cemented a feeling i started getting with Gara Petothel back in X-Wing, of how great would be if the two sides were just able to stop fighting and make up. With the Emperor gone, i do believe the Empire would start levelling out, especially with Thrawn and Pellaeon in command. The war that was so critical in the movies now seems more like a tragic loss of life, and i found it really regretful when it came to a close. Or rather when that part of the story came to a close, because then we go right back to the characters on the palace rooftop, and the personal conclusion to Mara's ordeal, tying the knot on what was probably the most important journey in the story. I'm a little dumbfounded as to why we never saw an animated adaptation of this trilogy, honestly.
Boba Fett has the same kind of growth and expansion in the EU as Lando. I mean, in the movies, Boba Fett is a guy who shows up in a handful of scenes and then gets killed off by a blind man. In the books? He was thrown out of the Mandalorian navy when he was young after killing an officer who raped his wife; he carried on a decades-long feud with the Solo clan; Boba Fett became the Mandalore and lead the Mandalorians back to some of their pre-empire glory, reuniting a scattered and ruined people.
1. Interestingly enough because of your thoughts on Thrawn I'd have to disagree on your statement of his villainy. Thrawn's intentions as stated are to bring order back to the chaos. Order that is needed in view of the Vong. If a non racist or sexist empire ruled was it possible that billions of lives could have been saved? I would argue that means Thrawn had good intentions, and because of his almost robotic level of detachment we can assume he had no malice or cruelty in his methods. Thrawn isn't really a villain as a antagonist, very rarely does he do anything "evil" (nor good) Thrawn is more of a order versus chaos person who was so "law" orientated that he followed the letter of the law and not the heart of it. (Which is good considering Palp's heart was a black hole of malice and evil) 2. I've always thought it was interesting that Thrawn was fighting for the same thing as the heroes, to bring the galaxy together. The line of how far one is willing to do to achieve that goal was just different. Looking forward to watching your KOTOR loreruns Arch. Merry Day after New Years :P
I myself am also a huge fan of the "Now What?" storyline. I desperately want for that to happen to the Song of Ice and Fire series; i know your no fan but that series is really deserves and needs the type of extended canon that Star Wars has. It also a series that the question of "What Now" is something that might seriously need answering at the end everything.
Awesome pseudomation! I'm actually reading the Thrawn Trilogy myself right now, at about halfway through Dark Force Rising, and I gotta say that it's just blown me away. And I agree, these are probably the best place start the EU.
I'm gonna have to save up and see if you would be willing to do a "proper remake" of this rumination. Or even on the books individually. They ar probably my favorite star wars thing period. Seeing your growth as a reviewer over the years itd be interesting to see your renewed perspective.
i've always loved the thrawn books, they're basically what got me into star wars beyond the movies and the games. i had a friend who had basically every star wars book that was released, and upon seeing that i asked for recommendations. he passed me thrawn, and i consumed a lot of really great books until i moved away.
That's what pisses me of like crazy. Thrawn never happened but those books hold the franchise together. The whole EU just thrown/Thrawn ahahaha away by Disney. After decades of George just saying "Yes...okay...you can do that." to those authors who hold his universe together. Yes those trailers are awesome and the movies will be good. But after learning more and more about those new characters I have the feeling they will just do the same all over again with different names. The Empire is the First Order now. The Darth is the Ren now.
Canon is subjective. People don't HAVE to take Disney's line on things. They can believe whatever they wish. They SHOULD believe whatever they wish. Fuck Lucas and fuck disney.
Yes, Thrawn was based on Sherlock Holmes, and you can see a bit of Holmes' view of people as data points and disregard for the value of others and their opinions. It was fascinating seeing Thrawn work. Edit: I also saw a lot of Watson in Captain Pallaeon, especially as witness to their respective counterpart's antics.
Great video, excellent analysis. I agree with most of your points. I always saw Thrawn as a glory hound, akin to a Caesar. I'd be curious what you thought about Timothy Zahn's (canon) new Thrawn novel. I thought unfortunately he missed much of what made the original Thrawn trilogy so great. In particular, Zahn overused Thrawn's point of view; seeing what went on inside his head made Thrawn less mysterious and meant that the book left less room for me to interpret the character. Zahn also seems intent on making Thrawn a sympathetic character, which isn't how I saw him (like you, I saw him as a cold villain). Any thoughts?
Nice rumination, even if i have't read the books. I have two points enyway: 1) The entiere "Books are intrepative / reflexive of the reader" thing realy got in to my mind as i read years ago the first few books of the "Dark Tower" series. Roland of tschain, last of the gunslingers, was always a small griddy and ugly guy for me. So you can imagin my suprise as i saw some of the official illustrations of Roland and he looked nothing like that. And he will always be always that small guy for me, no mather what the pictures say. 2) In my oppinion one of the most famous examples of a "How does he catch him" plot (the viewer knows the killer, and the plot is waching the inspector findig it out) is Columbo. I tried to find out why that works that well and i found Two points. First Columbo is a very interssting Character to watch, a guy that plays stupid (and is in some areas) to hide his briliance or as the killer in the first ever Columbo statet: "for everyone you look like a litte man in a raincoat digging useless little holes in the backyard, but everyone that pays attention will soon find out that you actually lay out a minefilde." The second point is, that we usually see Columbo from the point of view of the Killer or other people, so we never actually know what he thinks. We see why they fall for Columbos play till the point that there own doings bring them down. The arrogance and the feelings of superity towards him, even if the viewer knew what Columbo actually can do. Just some thoughts
Also in the Future, would you consider doing one of your Analysis on the Original 2 hour pilot movie for the TV show "Battlestar Galactica" from 1978. And the Pilot movie for the TV show "Buck Rogers in the 25th Century" from 1979 (((both of which were actually shown in Movie Theaters when they were new despite the fact that they had already been shown on TV for free(which in itself is interesting and unique. Both were produced by Glen A. Larson as a Network TV response to the success of Star Wars. Both TV shows were short lived, however Battlestar Galctica has been kept alive in Novels and Comic books and then was Re-imagined as a new TV show again in the 2000's. Another interesting note is that Glen A. Larson worked with George Lucas in the very Early development of the Original Star Wars movie in 1975 before the two men had creative differences and Lucas fired Larson. (( Would love to get your take on that
Holy smokes, the quality of this video's discussion and how it's structured is absurdly good. Not just as a Star Wars talk, but as... heck, as an academic lecture. I haven't read the Thrawn books, but man if this isn't great stuff. Are you planning on doing any more Star Wars related ruminations? Or is this pretty much it?
Favorite character is Mara Jade, out of the whole of the expanded universe. Just love her personality and story arc (which is also why I absolutely hate Karen Traviss as a writer). That said, what's your opinion on all of the post-Vision of the Future books and comics?
Overall tremendously net-negative. There's some good stuff there, but it got so bad that I finally made the conscious effort to 'call' the end of the Star Wars canon at Vision of the Future (which is also in many ways the thematic end to Star Wars as a whole).
I like NJO because of the introduction of Ben Skywalker and the continuation of Mara's story, but I definitely see what you mean. I stopped reading practically after LOTF and only went through FOTJ sparingly (though I do find it amusing that they reintroduced Mara back into Star Wars by way of Vestara Khai
Happy new year!!! looking forward to the kotor stream (and hoping to get a better internet before it starts). On the topic of Thrawn while I do thoroughly enjoy him and some of the scenes he's in there are two aspects of him that I take issue with to some degree. - I don't find the concept of Thrawn (A grand admiral that is as smart as palpatine but is not as stupendously evil) as interesting as other characters (for example Kreia, a nihilist that wants to remove the force entirely). - As you said, Zahn wrote a villan that shouldn't lose and the books as well as other depictions show that, Thrawn sometimes borders on being a Mary Sue specifically when he outright guesses Ackbars plan almost immediately. It's also arguable that he hasn't made any real mistakes other than sending down the spy droid that Leia used to convince the nogri, With all other failures occurring because of unexpected circumstance. I think he even pointed out to the emperor prior to RotJ that the ewoks posed a serious threat. He's a character that can too easily be depicted as perfect, which is why it might be a good thing that the new trilogy is not the Thrawn trilogy. I really enjoyed Mara's character arc, I especially found it humourous how she would constantly threaten Luke and yet he would still help her in a heartbeat. She's a little pathetic at times (seriously you couldn't go after Luke just because Jabba said no?) but I like her and I want see how her romance with luke starts. Karrde was great, he was resourceful and smart despite being outmatched in not just power but also intelligence, I really liked his little outburst in front of Leia when they took off to the cloning facility, It charmingly illustrated his loyalty to his crew and Mara. I think Bel Iblis's character arc with Mon Mothma needed more attention, he starts off with a grudge against her and then later on he (out of nowhere) realises her reasoning for taking charge, there should be a scene that explains Mon Mothma's motivations. (Disclosure: the audiobook I was listening to seemed to omit one or two chapters including finding Delta Source and Farriers attempt to turn the smugglers against Karrde, so I may have missed a scene similar to what I'm describing).
Kotor lorerun... I've gotta catch that. :) Although I would have liked to see a play through too, in the style of your Oblivion one, with you "in character".
In the future, would you ever consider doing a Rumination on either Clone Wars show (the 2003 Micro series or the CGI 2008 show)? I'd love to hear your take on either one of those because they both enhance the Prequel movies in different ways.
adrianarmy39 I tend to agree that the Clone Wars series (especially the CGI one) really adds to the prequels, so I wouldn't be opposed to looking at it sometime in the future when my schedule clears up a bit.
Why do EU fans have such a strong hatred for the Yuuzhan Vong? Is it something with the concept or did the writing team just drag out the conflict for too long?
The length may not have been the problem in-and-of itself, but it certainly highlighted the ones it had. I don't really have a problem with the invasion as a concept, and there were several novels that were actually pretty decent, but the period had its fair share of less than stellar entries. The arc would have benefited greatly if they could have limited it to six books at the absolute most. As it is, it's about 23 including novellas, which just causes the whole conflict to feel like it's dragging on forever. Another problem was that authors were writing books that were supposed to continue the story for books that hadn't finished being written yet. Just look at the release schedule for the New Jedi Order: they were practically released one after another, some with only a few weeks between releases. They were working from an overarching plan, but the fact that the past had often not been entirely set when the authors began writing the present is evident throughout the series. I can't really think of any major continuity errors, but much of it didn't really feel like it fit together properly.
I'm a guy who bashed the eu for years because the stuff my library had was always awful. Upon reading this, the hand of thrawn, amd the NJO books I love them all. Lotf is where it starts to lose me.
Hey Lorerunner, love your videos man. Subscribed a few days ago. So, I'm a writer and this was the last video I watched of your Star Wars related ruminations. I'm a writer for fun and your videos have help me a lot in story direction. So my question for you is do you believe that being force sensitive on any level, Jedi or not, is the mark of sentience in the galaxy and why? Also what is your thought of a with lord that is from a species rancor class in scale or higher. Literally asked my brother his thought on a sigh lord who is literally a planet. Not in force scale like visciate.
I imagine you've received requests for this before (if you haven't, first time for everything, I guess), but if you do more pseudo-ruminations, would you do one on Shadows of the Empire? Yes, I'm talking about the book, but the game was good as well.
Based on this rumination I decided to pick up the Thrawn-trilogy, but it turned out I bought a comic book adaptation of the books instead. Yeah I know, I should have read the cover more carefully. However I still intend to get my hands on the books. There was probably a lot of characterization lost in translation from the book into a comic, but I think I agree with you concerning Palleon, Lorerunner. I got the impression that he was someone who wanted to change what the Empire had been, from this oppressive force into something that might do just the opposite. A very interesting character from that perspective alone. My impression of Thrawn however, as it is now, was that he basically could not fail. I do not know if its touched upon in the books, but in the adaptation I read he just `seems to know` what the Alliance is planning and he already has a plan in motion for just that event. But my view will most certainly change once I read the books, which I do look even more forward to now than I did before.
The intellectual cannibalism of Disney Wars is abhorrent, not something to be celebrated. They are plagiarising. I know they own the rights, but that's just a legal thing. Artistically, it IS plagium.
Great talk about a great series, establishing the Extended Universe. Hmm, I often thought that anything that came out, outside of the main films, could be considered part f the EU. Ewok Christmas? I hope the SW Christmas Special isn't part of the EU! Seriously, though, we did see Wookiees living up in trees in the Xmas Special, so we got to see *some* kind of society then...even if it was pretty ridiculous in tone, setting, etc. At first, I thought 'Splinter of the Mind's Eye' could be considered part of, or the first part of, the EU, but it's still within the timeframe of the first three films, so I don't know how well that holds up. I read the three books when they came out, and recently listened to the audiobooks (with the 20th anniversary having passed and all) from Audible. In one regard, the audio versions have already made an impact on me: When I think of Talon Karrde, he now always sounds like Antonio Banderas to me (as the voice actor/reader seemed to portray him in the book). Interesting example about Lando in the books and I wonder if you'd ever read his series of books 'The Adventures of Lando Calrissian' trilogy? I believe it came out just after Jedi in '83. Very true about KotOR! I felt like I was part of a real SW story, even after the Jedi Knight series. I always said Bel Iblis as 'Iblee'...and yes, that was due to a similarly named character from the original BSG. =) Why the shrug as to Mara Jade's popularity waning in the recent years? Palleon was someone I had to read about several times because I expected him to be bad somewhere in the book. When you read he is just an officer trying to do his job, and not be a sadist about it, it was a breath of fresh air to me. I believe it was LucasFilm who told Zahn to give a buffer of 5 years before writing his trilogy. 'Now What?'...great question. They won the war, now they had to fight and build for the peace. The fact the the Noghri could tell Leia was a daughter of Vader ('Lady Vader') did help in getting them to turn away from Thrawn. Hope you had a great New Year, Arch!
Great Stuff! Always interesting to hear your thoughts… What did you think of Joruus C'Baoth, he's one new character you did not mention in the video? Interesting trivia: In the beginning he was supposed to be an insane clone of Obi-Wan… Do you think that would have been better or worse???
I'm aware of what you refer to and personally I think that would have been worse. Interesting yes, but ultimately serves no real narrative purpose other than to have the gut punch of the realization of whom it is. Personally I think Joruus (insane or no) serves better given his small but crucial insight into the Jedi Order (also the first time... ever, really... that the Jedi are portrayed in any kind of negative light)
I love the Thrawn trilogy, my favourite actually being Dark Force Rising (which surprises most for some reason). Could you perhaps do a video on your thoughts on Episode VII- The Force Awakens and the direction the characters and story are going, as in your videos you come across a little negative about Disney and the new trilogy. Forgive me if I have percieved this wrongly. I would love to hear your thoughts.
I did a brief video about the teaser but honestly as of now I have no real thoughts about the new movie. I'm going out of my way to not pre-judge, the movie will have to stand or fall on its own.
Arch your such an awesome individual! due all the struggles and hardships you had during your live, you kept going with the hand you still had..and claimt it in youtube greatness. Go positive mindset! on topic...really like the raw emotion you use in your ruminations..listened to what you said and watched Empire strikes back without 4 and 6..Like you said its an movie you can watch separate...seemed way shorter than it was in my memories 10 years ago..Question: did you notice how Lando started out with being an pseudo villian..with a soft hart(V)..to an undoubting goodguy like .. (VI) It felt forced in my opinion.anyway..keep it up! with respect.. Q
i still dont understand why they decided to totally skip luke training jedi and just went right to him being old as shit. To me thats a bad choice and i bet almost everyone would have liked it if they made the thrawn triligy into a movie.
I know you've got tons of requests and things on your backlog to cover, but just thought I'd throw my hat in the ring and request a Pokemon rumination...maybe? Please? ^_^
Mass Effect is inspired by Star Wars, yes, but there's a difference between what you are saying. There's a difference between being hyped for something (like Mass Effect 3, a game which I personally maintain is a great game) and saying that Star Wars: The Force Awakens will only be good but nothing more. Yes, it may be good, it could be bad, it could easily be great. You don't have to get caught in the hype but you could be more open minded about the film.
I'm going to message my opinions of this. Especially since you call me out by name in this video. Mostly especially since I repeatedly and insistent on a Thrawn Trilogy Rumination. Sincerely, ShadowLink108 (Extainhaln, Lich Astrophysicist of the Imperium)
Ponaru Me making references to astronomy and physics is like Archengeia making reference to his love of Final Fantasy 6. You've come to expect it ;) :P
You blame Disney for the dismissal of the Extended Universe but it was actually George Lucas himself who dismissed it when he wrote the story for Episode 7, 8 and 9.
In reality Lucas wanted episode 7, 8 and even 9 take place way beyond the future after the EU books. In that way the EU universe could have been protected for the fans who had follow it for years. But no Disney so arrogant wanted to reboot this universe and cashing out this franchise by bringing the old cast and make A new hope 2.0
Hand of Thrawn duology was the end of the EU for me. What came later was pure and utter trash. Yeah, looking at you NJO. That said, I wouldn't have minded at all if this better slice of the EU had survived Disney's purge.
I am Grand Admiral Thrawn, Warlord of the Empire, servant of the Emperor.
Man I loved this series.
Have you considered checking out the 20th anniversary edition of the Thrawn trilogy? Marc Thompson's portrayal of all the characters are all spot on in their presentation and coupled with excellent use of the movie soundtrack it's freaking incredible. I would love you to death if you checked them out once in a while.
Have you ever listened to the audiobook versions and heard Marc Thompsons portrayal? To me, it puts the scene in my head like I can actually see it like a movie. His voices are amazing especially for Lando imo. The books read by him might actually surpass the OT for me. To be fair, that's like 40 hours of content compared to 7 or 8.
One of my favorite characters from the Thrawn Trilogy was pilot Pash Cracken. I believe he was the first 'ace' introduced that was not one of Luke or Wedge's wingmen. I have loved the Rebel starfighters since the original film, and Pash was a great new addition, a badass tactically, really innovative strategically, and a good illustration of how the Rebellion/New Republic had heroes beyond the filmed characters.
I'm surprised and disappointed you didn't talk about C'baoth, Luuke and the cloning debacle.
I've been "reading" up on the New Republic Era Audiobooks up to this point, since i'd always heard about the Thrawn story, and figured now that this Rumination was up, it was a good time to get into it. Of the 3 versions out there, i picked the 20th anniversary edition, and man, it's a thing of beauty. Marc Thompson puts out such a performance, i had a hard time believing it was only one dude doing all the voices - Han, Luke, Lando and even characters that have only a few lines like Yoda and Palpatine sound nearly perfect. Not just how many different voices he can make, the man has some genuine acting talent - i could totally feel Mara and Karrde and Thrawn and Pellaeon and C'baoth and Ruhk, you name it. Most addicting 45 hours of audio storytelling i've listened to in as long as i can remember. No, i did not get paid to say this, i'm just gushing.
And yes, i am a moron and a sucker for the "now what". I want to know what happened the second after the cast lined up for the group shot at the last frame of ROTJ. Did they go to for drinks? Did they all get a room and spread a Monopoly board on the floor and then laughed when Luke ended up owning the Death Star, and Lando had to pay 3PO 3000 credits for landing at Cloud City for a turn? Did they all jump when some Rebel pilot got drunk and started running around the village wearing a Stormtrooper helmet? I got some of that with the Truce at Bakura, but then they all had to get serious and solve some alien problem from outer space when the story kicked in. Still nice, though.
As for interpretations, they can change as i get into more of the EU, which only now i've begun to get into in earnest (and mostly just the Audiobooks, since i can listen to them as i work (they help me concentrate)), but i'll try.
Now, contrary to what a lot of people seem to prefer, i don't usually take the greatest liking to intellectually fascinating characters like Thrawn - amazing as he still is nonetheless. I can't really define very well what kind of characters i do like the most, but if i had to nutshell it, i think i usually go for the humanity. Now again, mega-props to Marc Thompson for all his portrayals of all the major characters in this book; he brought them all to life for me - even the females, which his voice is obviously not cut out for, which brings me to Mara Jade.
I'm not much for naming favorites, but if i were, there's a good chance Mara would be it. Granted, a good part of it is i know what she'll be in the future, and she's probably the character i was anticipating the most, so maybe my goggles are a bit tinted. If you just put Mara on paper, she'd probably be a character i'd despise at first glance. Here we have a former agent of the Emperor himself - that monster of a man we all know and love, all angry at a person for having failed to die when she wanted him to, and then daring to confront Palpatine and winning. It's an old and beat up "bad guy's revenge" concept, and normally only serves to underline that the person striving for it really is an evil immoral bastard.
Fortunately, it became apparent to me from early on that that really wasn't her nature, by and large. Both her attitude and her actions betrayed someone who was quite different from that background, and i always felt inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt until her story fully unraveled (and it never felt as bad or inconsistent writing either). It was one of the most engaging aspects of the story, to try and connect the black burning hatred she felt for Luke with the actual person feeling it, and all the sparring and scraping she did with him and herself and the final command that had been burned into her mind.
Also, her annoyance at Luke's unshakable ironclad kindness is almost hilarious (in a good way), and a pretty good tension breaker from the horrible doom and gloom of her situation. Her effect on Luke is also a good breakout for his character in turn, especially when he goes semi-berserk whenever she's in danger. Not many things can get that out of him anymore, ever since he became a Jedi.
Speaking of tension-breaking, i never expected to get comic relief from the Nohgri until they started interacting with the Consort of the Lady Vader; that was priceless.
Karrde was an awesome character, and one that kept me guessing until almost the end of Book 1. By Book 2, it could be reasonably assumed he was a good guy, but with so many layers of pragmatism to him that you could still wonder which way he'd go if the wind blew badly. He has a kind of cunning not normally seen outside of villains, is not afraid of playing both sides to their full effect, has frigging guard hounds who hunt through the Force, but then he has a team of fairly developed characters who seem to fully trust him, has the composure to handle a situation that's barely hanging on by a thread, bluffing his way through it while breaking nary a sweat, and finally shows genuine concern for the well-being of the people around him - which for our benefit, always masks with what could be reasonably be interpreted as self interest throughout most of the story. And the frigging voice acting.
C'baoth, i've little to say about, really. He's insane, arrogant, and power-hungry. And he's a force to be reckoned with, the only person who can seriously annoy Thrawn, which is almost funny to watch, and he's a great enemy, and a great way to cement the bond between Mara and Luke. One could feel sympathy for his situation, as Luke does, but there's little in the way of redeeming qualities to him, or even insight into the obvious tragedy of his circumstance. All in all, i felt myself siding more with Mara's approach, in that it would have been better to just put him out of his misery, and save a lot of people a lot of grief in doing so - and i don't say that often. To his credit, his performance in being what he is is pretty powerful. You can very much believe this man is every bit as crazy and determined and unsalvageable as he's meant to be. And all the while, still very dangerous. At the end of the day, though, i guess i see him as a very well put together device, more than a character we're supposed to care for.
Pellaeon, i very much liked. I remember you saying once that this trilogy made the Emperor seem stupid. I personally thought it made the Emperor seem like a power-hungry, world-devouring monster - which i had guessed at a long time ago, really. And Pellaeon seemed to make that distinction very early on. He was also, along with Thrawn, one of the first characters in the Empire i could really care about. He wasn't a genius like Thrawn, nor really had any extraordinary traits about him, but what he had was Character. He was a decent man and a good commander, and maybe the first sign that this really isn't a tyrant Empire anymore - which is both good and tragic, considering.
As for Thrawn, i don't think he was utterly uncaring so much as Machiavellian. He had such a concept of the big picture, it was kind of inevitable that he viewed people as expendable, thought not necessarily insignificant. The calm way that he faced his own end makes it seem like he simply thought in different terms than simple ruthlessness for self-gain.
It's telling that he didn't seem to have begrudged being relegated to Frontier duty, when i get the distinct feeling he could very well have successfully argued for a more noteworthy station in the empire. It seems like the Frontier is where he'd want to be; where the action would be. And when he congratulated his fleet on a job well-done, i rather think he meant it. I think this is where he lived - the game, so to speak, and when he had the satisfaction of seeing it through, i think he really did like to share it with the people he felt deserved it.
I wonder if he would have eventually rebelled, as Palpatine centralized his power more and more and started phasing out people like him who were the tip of the spear, in favor of wasteful megalomaniacal genocide machines like the Death Star. Heck, maybe he let himself stay on the Frontier so he could have nothing to do with it.
All in all, though, this cemented a feeling i started getting with Gara Petothel back in X-Wing, of how great would be if the two sides were just able to stop fighting and make up. With the Emperor gone, i do believe the Empire would start levelling out, especially with Thrawn and Pellaeon in command. The war that was so critical in the movies now seems more like a tragic loss of life, and i found it really regretful when it came to a close.
Or rather when that part of the story came to a close, because then we go right back to the characters on the palace rooftop, and the personal conclusion to Mara's ordeal, tying the knot on what was probably the most important journey in the story.
I'm a little dumbfounded as to why we never saw an animated adaptation of this trilogy, honestly.
Am I the only one who was CONVINCED that Winter was Delta Source?
Thank you for listening to us who wanted you to extend your Star Wars ruminations. Always a pleasure to listen.
Came for the analysis of some Star Wars books.
Stayed for the philosophy of how we perceive books in different ways.
Boba Fett has the same kind of growth and expansion in the EU as Lando.
I mean, in the movies, Boba Fett is a guy who shows up in a handful of scenes and then gets killed off by a blind man. In the books? He was thrown out of the Mandalorian navy when he was young after killing an officer who raped his wife; he carried on a decades-long feud with the Solo clan; Boba Fett became the Mandalore and lead the Mandalorians back to some of their pre-empire glory, reuniting a scattered and ruined people.
After getting my hands on the books and reading them, I will try to edit them to fit into the new (but pre-TFA continuity).
1. Interestingly enough because of your thoughts on Thrawn I'd have to disagree on your statement of his villainy. Thrawn's intentions as stated are to bring order back to the chaos. Order that is needed in view of the Vong. If a non racist or sexist empire ruled was it possible that billions of lives could have been saved? I would argue that means Thrawn had good intentions, and because of his almost robotic level of detachment we can assume he had no malice or cruelty in his methods. Thrawn isn't really a villain as a antagonist, very rarely does he do anything "evil" (nor good) Thrawn is more of a order versus chaos person who was so "law" orientated that he followed the letter of the law and not the heart of it. (Which is good considering Palp's heart was a black hole of malice and evil)
2. I've always thought it was interesting that Thrawn was fighting for the same thing as the heroes, to bring the galaxy together. The line of how far one is willing to do to achieve that goal was just different.
Looking forward to watching your KOTOR loreruns Arch. Merry Day after New Years :P
I myself am also a huge fan of the "Now What?" storyline. I desperately want for that to happen to the Song of Ice and Fire series; i know your no fan but that series is really deserves and needs the type of extended canon that Star Wars has. It also a series that the question of "What Now" is something that might seriously need answering at the end everything.
Awesome pseudomation! I'm actually reading the Thrawn Trilogy myself right now, at about halfway through Dark Force Rising, and I gotta say that it's just blown me away. And I agree, these are probably the best place start the EU.
I'm gonna have to save up and see if you would be willing to do a "proper remake" of this rumination. Or even on the books individually. They ar probably my favorite star wars thing period. Seeing your growth as a reviewer over the years itd be interesting to see your renewed perspective.
i've always loved the thrawn books, they're basically what got me into star wars beyond the movies and the games. i had a friend who had basically every star wars book that was released, and upon seeing that i asked for recommendations. he passed me thrawn, and i consumed a lot of really great books until i moved away.
That's what pisses me of like crazy. Thrawn never happened but those books hold the franchise together. The whole EU just thrown/Thrawn ahahaha away by Disney. After decades of George just saying "Yes...okay...you can do that." to those authors who hold his universe together. Yes those trailers are awesome and the movies will be good. But after learning more and more about those new characters I have the feeling they will just do the same all over again with different names. The Empire is the First Order now. The Darth is the Ren now.
Canon is subjective. People don't HAVE to take Disney's line on things. They can believe whatever they wish. They SHOULD believe whatever they wish. Fuck Lucas and fuck disney.
Love this video, and the expanded universe. Going to check more of your videos.
Yes, Thrawn was based on Sherlock Holmes, and you can see a bit of Holmes' view of people as data points and disregard for the value of others and their opinions. It was fascinating seeing Thrawn work.
Edit: I also saw a lot of Watson in Captain Pallaeon, especially as witness to their respective counterpart's antics.
got a huge smile on my face from the Frasier ref. me and my dad used to watch the show daily:)
Great video, excellent analysis. I agree with most of your points. I always saw Thrawn as a glory hound, akin to a Caesar. I'd be curious what you thought about Timothy Zahn's (canon) new Thrawn novel. I thought unfortunately he missed much of what made the original Thrawn trilogy so great. In particular, Zahn overused Thrawn's point of view; seeing what went on inside his head made Thrawn less mysterious and meant that the book left less room for me to interpret the character. Zahn also seems intent on making Thrawn a sympathetic character, which isn't how I saw him (like you, I saw him as a cold villain). Any thoughts?
The Archengeia Drinking Game: Take a shot every time he says "Let me explain" or "You're going to hate me for this."
Will you survive?
Nice rumination, even if i have't read the books.
I have two points enyway:
1) The entiere "Books are intrepative / reflexive of the reader" thing realy got in to my mind as i read years ago the first few books of the "Dark Tower" series. Roland of tschain, last of the gunslingers, was always a small griddy and ugly guy for me. So you can imagin my suprise as i saw some of the official illustrations of Roland and he looked nothing like that. And he will always be always that small guy for me, no mather what the pictures say.
2) In my oppinion one of the most famous examples of a "How does he catch him" plot (the viewer knows the killer, and the plot is waching the inspector findig it out) is Columbo. I tried to find out why that works that well and i found Two points. First Columbo is a very interssting Character to watch, a guy that plays stupid (and is in some areas) to hide his briliance or as the killer in the first ever Columbo statet: "for everyone you look like a litte man in a raincoat digging useless little holes in the backyard, but everyone that pays attention will soon find out that you actually lay out a minefilde." The second point is, that we usually see Columbo from the point of view of the Killer or other people, so we never actually know what he thinks. We see why they fall for Columbos play till the point that there own doings bring them down. The arrogance and the feelings of superity towards him, even if the viewer knew what Columbo actually can do.
Just some thoughts
Also in the Future, would you consider doing one of your Analysis on the Original 2 hour pilot movie for the TV show "Battlestar Galactica" from 1978. And the Pilot movie for the TV show "Buck Rogers in the 25th Century" from 1979 (((both of which were actually shown in Movie Theaters when they were new despite the fact that they had already been shown on TV for free(which in itself is interesting and unique. Both were produced by Glen A. Larson as a Network TV response to the success of Star Wars. Both TV shows were short lived, however Battlestar Galctica has been kept alive in Novels and Comic books and then was Re-imagined as a new TV show again in the 2000's. Another interesting note is that Glen A. Larson worked with George Lucas in the very Early development of the Original Star Wars movie in 1975 before the two men had creative differences and Lucas fired Larson. (( Would love to get your take on that
yes, I loved the original Battlestar Galactica
Ive heared it said that Thrawn has the philosophy of the perfect Jedy completly bereft of attachments and emotions.
Holy smokes, the quality of this video's discussion and how it's structured is absurdly good. Not just as a Star Wars talk, but as... heck, as an academic lecture. I haven't read the Thrawn books, but man if this isn't great stuff. Are you planning on doing any more Star Wars related ruminations? Or is this pretty much it?
For the moment the 7 videos are it for Star Wars. Though schedule permitting I'll be doing a Lorerun of the KotORs.
Favorite character is Mara Jade, out of the whole of the expanded universe. Just love her personality and story arc (which is also why I absolutely hate Karen Traviss as a writer).
That said, what's your opinion on all of the post-Vision of the Future books and comics?
Overall tremendously net-negative. There's some good stuff there, but it got so bad that I finally made the conscious effort to 'call' the end of the Star Wars canon at Vision of the Future (which is also in many ways the thematic end to Star Wars as a whole).
I like NJO because of the introduction of Ben Skywalker and the continuation of Mara's story, but I definitely see what you mean. I stopped reading practically after LOTF and only went through FOTJ sparingly (though I do find it amusing that they reintroduced Mara back into Star Wars by way of Vestara Khai
Lmar daggerwolf Yes.
Lmar daggerwolf To repeat: Overall net negative with some good stuff.
Whats the song in the end of the video? Amazing stuff :)
Happy new year!!! looking forward to the kotor stream (and hoping to get a better internet before it starts).
On the topic of Thrawn while I do thoroughly enjoy him and some of the scenes he's in there are two aspects of him that I take issue with to some degree.
- I don't find the concept of Thrawn (A grand admiral that is as smart as palpatine but is not as stupendously evil) as interesting as other characters (for example Kreia, a nihilist that wants to remove the force entirely).
- As you said, Zahn wrote a villan that shouldn't lose and the books as well as other depictions show that, Thrawn sometimes borders on being a Mary Sue specifically when he outright guesses Ackbars plan almost immediately.
It's also arguable that he hasn't made any real mistakes other than sending down the spy droid that Leia used to convince the nogri, With all other failures occurring because of unexpected circumstance.
I think he even pointed out to the emperor prior to RotJ that the ewoks posed a serious threat. He's a character that can too easily be depicted as perfect, which is why it might be a good thing that the new trilogy is not the Thrawn trilogy.
I really enjoyed Mara's character arc, I especially found it humourous how she would constantly threaten Luke and yet he would still help her in a heartbeat. She's a little pathetic at times (seriously you couldn't go after Luke just because Jabba said no?) but I like her and I want see how her romance with luke starts.
Karrde was great, he was resourceful and smart despite being outmatched in not just power but also intelligence, I really liked his little outburst in front of Leia when they took off to the cloning facility, It charmingly illustrated his loyalty to his crew and Mara.
I think Bel Iblis's character arc with Mon Mothma needed more attention, he starts off with a grudge against her and then later on he (out of nowhere) realises her reasoning for taking charge, there should be a scene that explains Mon Mothma's motivations. (Disclosure: the audiobook I was listening to seemed to omit one or two chapters including finding Delta Source and Farriers attempt to turn the smugglers against Karrde, so I may have missed a scene similar to what I'm describing).
Kotor lorerun... I've gotta catch that. :) Although I would have liked to see a play through too, in the style of your Oblivion one, with you "in character".
In the future, would you ever consider doing a Rumination on either Clone Wars show (the 2003 Micro series or the CGI 2008 show)? I'd love to hear your take on either one of those because they both enhance the Prequel movies in different ways.
adrianarmy39 I tend to agree that the Clone Wars series (especially the CGI one) really adds to the prequels, so I wouldn't be opposed to looking at it sometime in the future when my schedule clears up a bit.
Why do EU fans have such a strong hatred for the Yuuzhan Vong? Is it something with the concept or did the writing team just drag out the conflict for too long?
The length may not have been the problem in-and-of itself, but it certainly highlighted the ones it had. I don't really have a problem with the invasion as a concept, and there were several novels that were actually pretty decent, but the period had its fair share of less than stellar entries. The arc would have benefited greatly if they could have limited it to six books at the absolute most. As it is, it's about 23 including novellas, which just causes the whole conflict to feel like it's dragging on forever.
Another problem was that authors were writing books that were supposed to continue the story for books that hadn't finished being written yet. Just look at the release schedule for the New Jedi Order: they were practically released one after another, some with only a few weeks between releases. They were working from an overarching plan, but the fact that the past had often not been entirely set when the authors began writing the present is evident throughout the series. I can't really think of any major continuity errors, but much of it didn't really feel like it fit together properly.
EU fans or at least most of them love the Vong including me. Its the EU haters that hate the vong.
I'm a guy who bashed the eu for years because the stuff my library had was always awful. Upon reading this, the hand of thrawn, amd the NJO books I love them all. Lotf is where it starts to lose me.
I was so sure you were going to pop up at the start of the video like the start of the new Star Wars trailer :P
Hey Lorerunner, love your videos man. Subscribed a few days ago. So, I'm a writer and this was the last video I watched of your Star Wars related ruminations. I'm a writer for fun and your videos have help me a lot in story direction. So my question for you is do you believe that being force sensitive on any level, Jedi or not, is the mark of sentience in the galaxy and why? Also what is your thought of a with lord that is from a species rancor class in scale or higher. Literally asked my brother his thought on a sigh lord who is literally a planet. Not in force scale like visciate.
I imagine you've received requests for this before (if you haven't, first time for everything, I guess), but if you do more pseudo-ruminations, would you do one on Shadows of the Empire? Yes, I'm talking about the book, but the game was good as well.
Based on this rumination I decided to pick up the Thrawn-trilogy, but it turned out I bought a comic book adaptation of the books instead. Yeah I know, I should have read the cover more carefully. However I still intend to get my hands on the books.
There was probably a lot of characterization lost in translation from the book into a comic, but I think I agree with you concerning Palleon, Lorerunner. I got the impression that he was someone who wanted to change what the Empire had been, from this oppressive force into something that might do just the opposite. A very interesting character from that perspective alone.
My impression of Thrawn however, as it is now, was that he basically could not fail. I do not know if its touched upon in the books, but in the adaptation I read he just `seems to know` what the Alliance is planning and he already has a plan in motion for just that event.
But my view will most certainly change once I read the books, which I do look even more forward to now than I did before.
Shoutout to Thrawn being in Rebels.
The intellectual cannibalism of Disney Wars is abhorrent, not something to be celebrated. They are plagiarising. I know they own the rights, but that's just a legal thing. Artistically, it IS plagium.
Great talk about a great series, establishing the Extended Universe. Hmm, I often thought that anything that came out, outside of the main films, could be considered part f the EU.
Ewok Christmas? I hope the SW Christmas Special isn't part of the EU! Seriously, though, we did see Wookiees living up in trees in the Xmas Special, so we got to see *some* kind of society then...even if it was pretty ridiculous in tone, setting, etc.
At first, I thought 'Splinter of the Mind's Eye' could be considered part of, or the first part of, the EU, but it's still within the timeframe of the first three films, so I don't know how well that holds up.
I read the three books when they came out, and recently listened to the audiobooks (with the 20th anniversary having passed and all) from Audible. In one regard, the audio versions have already made an impact on me: When I think of Talon Karrde, he now always sounds like Antonio Banderas to me (as the voice actor/reader seemed to portray him in the book).
Interesting example about Lando in the books and I wonder if you'd ever read his series of books 'The Adventures of Lando Calrissian' trilogy? I believe it came out just after Jedi in '83.
Very true about KotOR! I felt like I was part of a real SW story, even after the Jedi Knight series.
I always said Bel Iblis as 'Iblee'...and yes, that was due to a similarly named character from the original BSG. =)
Why the shrug as to Mara Jade's popularity waning in the recent years?
Palleon was someone I had to read about several times because I expected him to be bad somewhere in the book. When you read he is just an officer trying to do his job, and not be a sadist about it, it was a breath of fresh air to me.
I believe it was LucasFilm who told Zahn to give a buffer of 5 years before writing his trilogy.
'Now What?'...great question. They won the war, now they had to fight and build for the peace.
The fact the the Noghri could tell Leia was a daughter of Vader ('Lady Vader') did help in getting them to turn away from Thrawn.
Hope you had a great New Year, Arch!
Great Stuff! Always interesting to hear your thoughts… What did you think of Joruus C'Baoth, he's one new character you did not mention in the video? Interesting trivia: In the beginning he was supposed to be an insane clone of Obi-Wan… Do you think that would have been better or worse???
I'm aware of what you refer to and personally I think that would have been worse. Interesting yes, but ultimately serves no real narrative purpose other than to have the gut punch of the realization of whom it is. Personally I think Joruus (insane or no) serves better given his small but crucial insight into the Jedi Order (also the first time... ever, really... that the Jedi are portrayed in any kind of negative light)
I love the Thrawn trilogy, my favourite actually being Dark Force Rising (which surprises most for some reason).
Could you perhaps do a video on your thoughts on Episode VII- The Force Awakens and the direction the characters and story are going, as in your videos you come across a little negative about Disney and the new trilogy. Forgive me if I have percieved this wrongly. I would love to hear your thoughts.
I did a brief video about the teaser but honestly as of now I have no real thoughts about the new movie. I'm going out of my way to not pre-judge, the movie will have to stand or fall on its own.
Have you by chance read any of the new books, such as A New Dawn or Tarkin?
is Mitth'raw'nuruodo a force Senstive?
fjook As far as everyone's aware, no. Thrawn had not a lick of Force power in him. Lotta willpower though.
Arch your such an awesome individual! due all the struggles and hardships you had during your live, you kept going with the hand you still had..and claimt it in youtube greatness. Go positive mindset! on topic...really like the raw emotion you use in your ruminations..listened to what you said and watched Empire strikes back without 4 and 6..Like you said its an movie you can watch separate...seemed way shorter than it was in my memories 10 years ago..Question: did you notice how Lando started out with being an pseudo villian..with a soft hart(V)..to an undoubting goodguy like .. (VI) It felt forced in my opinion.anyway..keep it up!
with respect.. Q
i still dont understand why they decided to totally skip luke training jedi and just went right to him being old as shit. To me thats a bad choice and i bet almost everyone would have liked it if they made the thrawn triligy into a movie.
I still don’t understand why they did a prequel in the 90’s -the actors could have revised their roles during the Thrawn era
As much as I loved episode 7 and 8
Gimme a thrawn trilogy on the big screen anyway
4:44
What look I just sat down.
I know you've got tons of requests and things on your backlog to cover, but just thought I'd throw my hat in the ring and request a Pokemon rumination...maybe? Please? ^_^
I should read this...
Great video
So, Lando is a entrepreneur :P
let's hope star wars 7 does as good of a job!
*****
you can't just assume that from what we have seen so far
No offence to Mass Effect (I love it), but Mass Effect is not Star Wars. Star Wars is superior in most regards to Mass Effect (and to most things).
Mass Effect is inspired by Star Wars, yes, but there's a difference between what you are saying. There's a difference between being hyped for something (like Mass Effect 3, a game which I personally maintain is a great game) and saying that Star Wars: The Force Awakens will only be good but nothing more. Yes, it may be good, it could be bad, it could easily be great. You don't have to get caught in the hype but you could be more open minded about the film.
I'm going to message my opinions of this. Especially since you call me out by name in this video. Mostly especially since I repeatedly and insistent on a Thrawn Trilogy Rumination.
Sincerely, ShadowLink108 (Extainhaln, Lich Astrophysicist of the Imperium)
Whoa...shadowlink threw in a reference to physics?! I'm shocked...
Ponaru Me making references to astronomy and physics is like Archengeia making reference to his love of Final Fantasy 6. You've come to expect it ;) :P
1 know I'm just picking on you. Cheers mate. Hope you have a great new year. :)
Happy New Year to you buddy! By "Cheers mate", are you an Aussie?
Nope, just a filthy plagiarist.
Why did you lose that awesome hair you used to have? I think you were badass but now its just the military buzz cut.. ;(
hes channeling johnny klebbitz
star trek destiny effect the new star trek voyager
You blame Disney for the dismissal of the Extended Universe but it was actually George Lucas himself who dismissed it when he wrote the story for Episode 7, 8 and 9.
In reality Lucas wanted episode 7, 8 and even 9 take place way beyond the future after the EU books. In that way the EU universe could have been protected for the fans who had follow it for years. But no Disney so arrogant wanted to reboot this universe and cashing out this franchise by bringing the old cast and make A new hope 2.0
+James Bond George Lucas didn't dismiss anything.
You need to watch some matt wilkins
Hand of Thrawn duology was the end of the EU for me. What came later was pure and utter trash. Yeah, looking at you NJO. That said, I wouldn't have minded at all if this better slice of the EU had survived Disney's purge.
1st of tr vids i find boring