The paddle shift system has a return to centre function really, if you rebuild it from the instructions and work it, it’ll rotate 90 degrees and then go back 90 again, return to centre system. I saw that and realised the only reason the double engagement problem happens is because the 8 tooth gear meshing with the other one on the shifting output isn’t strong enough to keep it in a perfect position. All it really needed was an additional stepper for the shaft shifting the gearbox. I did that and it now completes a perfect 90 degree rotation so I used a different approach ;) Great video and very helpful for other builders!
Hey man, thanks so much for the useful and easy to implement fix. It worked greatly for me when I was so frustrated over why with ever gear change I had two gears engaged.
I think that 8T gear w/ friction pin definitely created a lot of backlash in the gearbox. The solution I used was adding an additional stepper system on the main cranks that shifted the clutches so they were locked into place, and well of course removed the 8T gears. Shifting the gears was so much better afterwards. Also managed to include a speed indicator for my convertible version ;) LEGO should really give such models a thorough test run through all its functions before releasing them.. Great job btw. I also realised I commented twice now 😂
Thanks for uploading this video. I tried this solution but it didn't work very well. I noticed this issue when I was building the first part too and got stuck for awhile trying to figure out if I did anything wrong in the previous steps (or maybe come up with a solution). Though, I realized later on that you just have to pull the paddle hard enough in order to have it shifted to the correct position. Try pulling the paddle until you think it's reached the limit then pull it harder, you will notice that it can actually be pulled even further. Release the paddle, and the shifter is right at the correct position. Give it a try.
Very interesting video! I currently don't own the set yet, but i have been reading alot of reviews on it and none of them mentioned this problem. It was nice to learn about. Thanks you =)
My thoughts on the matter are that I was very lucky that I decided to get a good look at how everything worked while I would still be able to see it, so I did some research while taking out the paddle assembly did not require removing much else (step 214, pg 154). The shifts all had an over shoot followed by a pullback past the desired position. On two of those positions, both clutches were engaged. After removing the steering column and paddle assembly, reversing "shifting fork" blocks [of course the block are not forks, but they do the same thing as the shifting forks in much heavier duty gearboxes], going back over the instructions to put it back together, the positioning error of crank position was small enough that there was no double engagement (which will cause just the sort of issues The_Vay23_gaming described). I suspect that this issue plagued the early builds, but the fix caused a different issue with the later builds, after the part list was finalized, but before the instruction set had been approved (Yes, it is done with and stored on computers, but once something is approved, it may as well be carved in stone). With the production sets, there is a larger variation in the parts, so (as it seems) it works or it doesn't and the fix works, or it doesn't. Thank you.
Ik I’m late but I think it kind of varies with what the half axle/pin piece you use for it. I had this problem and so I added a locking system on the main shifting clutches
I build everything from the first box and noticed the same issue as well I tried your suggestion, but for me the flippers wouldn't work all the time because the pin on the other end of the red block is just a bit too small and will get pushed to the side too easy while pulling one of the flippers. But when it worked everything worked like in your video. But I changed it back to the original state for now. When going through the book I did notice one small piece that doesn't seem to fit the way like it does in the image. Step 106 to be precise, the grey piece will never fit the way it does with the gaps on the side while the yellow piece it slides into is turned 45 degrees. So I do wonder if this is the design flaw. Another idea might be to try to create more friction near the gearbox itself, maybe I can think of something, but I do want to try to keep it to the original car as most as possible. This issue still keeps me from opening box 2 at this moment.
Sorry for the late reply. You should check out the eurobricks forum on this subject. One thing is sure: this model is really depends on the quality of assembly, yet there are problems with the original design too.
Mine doesn’t drive at all and rear wheels don’t spin except when i put the gear in neutral. I noticed i have this problem, could double engagement be the reason for this? In other words,could my problem be caused by the orange parts not in exactly 90% angles? Or is it something else? I tried to turn the rear wheels and snapped the differentials, can double gear engagement prevent wheels from rotating? Hope i am clear , thanks in advance
Yep, the angles are important. I'm afraid, you got to take it apart, at least partially and find the problem yourself. It can be a million things causing this
When my paddles catch on that red piece you said to flip, the paddle jams when I try to shift down. It was working fine before. Should this fix the problem?
Probably it will, however that kind of problem shouldn't be there at the first place. You may try to rebuild that mechanism too. It is way too sensitive to the quality of assembly.
Any ideas on the step 5 fix after the model is 260 steps in? I totally missed that issue and now am screwed unless I tear it down. Legos response to this 300 dollar model has left a lot to be desired.
As I see it there isn't much hope to fix that problem without disassembling. All you can do at this stage to reach that part with a pointy item (like a knife) and make sure there is a small gap between and those two axles sideways. Also go trough the whole drivetrain and loose up stiff axles and connection. Bottom line is every moving part should move as easy as possible. If you need more please have a look at the eurobricks forum and ask Didumos69. He is the master of this topic.
+Attika Thanks for the quick reply....it is looking like full full disassemble at this point as you said. I poked and prodded but it is solid as a rock in there. lesson learned I guess, check for major issues from folks like yourself first next time. Thanks again!
My problem is the opposite. When I shift the xo piece doesn't turn a full 90 degrees. I've tried your trick but the yellow gear thing doesn't engage with the red gear bit. Also Two of my gears have SERIOUS engine braking, the wheels really don't want to turn and make a horrible clicking sound. If you want I could post a video on my UA-cam channel for you. Please supply me with some tips and tricks :)
If you post a video, make sure the body is removed and show around all the mechanics, every bit of moving parts please. Did you go trough the mechanism? Probably some assembling mistake? The "symptoms" as you described sound too serious to be fixed just by a minor adjustment.
Attika, I've used a bit of grease in the gears and all my gears work wonderfully but I know have the double engagement problem. I've tried the solution again but the catch doesn't click back into place
I'd love to help, but without seeing it I don't know what is causing the problem. I still recommend to tear it down and build it again if you didn't do it yet. If you read the other comments you can see that for some people it works without this mod, for others it works with the mod, but yours doesn't work either way, so there must be something like a missplaced part in the background I guess.
Attika, don't worry :) I seem to have fixed it with some hammering and tinkering. Thank you again for your amazing engineering ingenuity ;) Keep the good stuff coming :D
Sorry to hear that. If it doesn't work either way, I suppose you should rebuild at least the stepper box and check if all the moving parts (axles in the drivetrain, etc) are loose enough to move without friction. Hope you get it working.
worth it. Not because what it is, but more for what it can be. Dispite the dissapointment I felt watching the reviews on the first days, in this very moments we building it with a friend of mine, and I'm not just enjoying it for the building itself, but for how many possibilities it offers. There are good ideas in the original you can salvage and use on your own way. I'll build a chassis under the body from the scratch, keeping the dummie engine (in the non motorized version at least), and do something that this "ultimate" mean to be. ;-) Remember my 8880 evo? I love working between limits. In both cases that is the body.
:-D Dull mistake... I have no idea how could I manage, I was in the hurry when I made the video ... As long as english is my second language I won't jump off the cliff for a glitch like this. ;-)
Sorry to hear that. Best advice I can give is to rebuild it, at least the stepper. This model is really sensitive about building quality. A minor dissalignment can cause malfunction. Wish the best.
Attika thanks. I disassembled the shifter and now it works reasonably well. Only 4th gear grinds very badly. I changed some gears to make the gears run sequential but lego says that makes the gears grind more. Should i switch the gears back so that 2nd and 3rd gear are reversed?
Imho if it grinds it is due to some additional friction in the system. You wanna go trough the whole drivetrain, making sure that all (!) gears are free to rotate and aren't forced against frame elements or each other. Just grab them one by one and give a little shake to make them settle comfy on their axle. Also check around a framework, make sure there is no twist in it caused by let say a sliped out pin or something.
Back when I've built mine, I did it with the corrected gear order straight without building the original, so I don't know about the difference, but smooth performance can be achieved. Due to the high number of runing gears it requires flawless mechanics. Eats up time and nerve maybe but don't give up, there is a light at the end of the tunnel. :-)
The paddle shift system has a return to centre function really, if you rebuild it from the instructions and work it, it’ll rotate 90 degrees and then go back 90 again, return to centre system. I saw that and realised the only reason the double engagement problem happens is because the 8 tooth gear meshing with the other one on the shifting output isn’t strong enough to keep it in a perfect position. All it really needed was an additional stepper for the shaft shifting the gearbox. I did that and it now completes a perfect 90 degree rotation so I used a different approach ;)
Great video and very helpful for other builders!
is there a video of your solution?
Balthasar Keks I have multiple videos of many modifications I made to this model on my channel ;)
Hey man, thanks so much for the useful and easy to implement fix. It worked greatly for me when I was so frustrated over why with ever gear change I had two gears engaged.
I think that 8T gear w/ friction pin definitely created a lot of backlash in the gearbox. The solution I used was adding an additional stepper system on the main cranks that shifted the clutches so they were locked into place, and well of course removed the 8T gears. Shifting the gears was so much better afterwards. Also managed to include a speed indicator for my convertible version ;)
LEGO should really give such models a thorough test run through all its functions before releasing them..
Great job btw. I also realised I commented twice now 😂
Thanks for uploading this video. I tried this solution but it didn't work very well. I noticed this issue when I was building the first part too and got stuck for awhile trying to figure out if I did anything wrong in the previous steps (or maybe come up with a solution). Though, I realized later on that you just have to pull the paddle hard enough in order to have it shifted to the correct position. Try pulling the paddle until you think it's reached the limit then pull it harder, you will notice that it can actually be pulled even further. Release the paddle, and the shifter is right at the correct position. Give it a try.
Very interesting video! I currently don't own the set yet, but i have been reading alot of reviews on it and none of them mentioned this problem. It was nice to learn about. Thanks you =)
My thoughts on the matter are that I was very lucky that I decided to get a good look at how everything worked while I would still be able to see it, so I did some research while taking out the paddle assembly did not require removing much else (step 214, pg 154).
The shifts all had an over shoot followed by a pullback past the desired position. On two of those positions, both clutches were engaged. After removing the steering column and paddle assembly, reversing "shifting fork" blocks [of course the block are not forks, but they do the same thing as the shifting forks in much heavier duty gearboxes], going back over the instructions to put it back together, the positioning error of crank position was small enough that there was no double engagement (which will cause just the sort of issues The_Vay23_gaming described).
I suspect that this issue plagued the early builds, but the fix caused a different issue with the later builds, after the part list was finalized, but before the instruction set had been approved (Yes, it is done with and stored on computers, but once something is approved, it may as well be carved in stone). With the production sets, there is a larger variation in the parts, so (as it seems) it works or it doesn't and the fix works, or it doesn't.
Thank you.
Thank you Sir, awesome fix! 👏🏻
I had the same problem. With your solution it works much better. Now its ok for me. Thank you! :)
Cool, buddy, glad to hear that.
It seems to be working for me. Thank you very much.
Brilliant, thanks for sharing this fix, it really bugged me and works well now 👍
You're welcome. Enjoy it! :-)
Oh yeah I changed something inside to have it click in at exactly 90 degree angles
No problem for me, gearbox works perfect, didnt change anything.
ulgn1964 same :-)
Ik I’m late but I think it kind of varies with what the half axle/pin piece you use for it. I had this problem and so I added a locking system on the main shifting clutches
the XO part is really +o and is called 1x2 liftarm, thick with single crosshole. bright orange
and I've spelled the torque wrong too. double shame on me. :-)
it works for me !!! thank you so much
Happy to hear that. :-)
Tks, its helpful for me! :)
Worked like a charm. Thanks.
I build everything from the first box and noticed the same issue as well
I tried your suggestion, but for me the flippers wouldn't work all the time because the pin on the other end of the red block is just a bit too small and will get pushed to the side too easy while pulling one of the flippers. But when it worked everything worked like in your video. But I changed it back to the original state for now.
When going through the book I did notice one small piece that doesn't seem to fit the way like it does in the image. Step 106 to be precise, the grey piece will never fit the way it does with the gaps on the side while the yellow piece it slides into is turned 45 degrees. So I do wonder if this is the design flaw.
Another idea might be to try to create more friction near the gearbox itself, maybe I can think of something, but I do want to try to keep it to the original car as most as possible. This issue still keeps me from opening box 2 at this moment.
Sorry for the late reply. You should check out the eurobricks forum on this subject. One thing is sure: this model is really depends on the quality of assembly, yet there are problems with the original design too.
Omg so nice, I had the same problem and now it's fixe!
Cool, I'm happy for that
Attika Huge thanks, I subscribe!
Yes it helped a lot
Worked for me thanks
Great, you're welcome. :-)
Thanks, it works :)
Mine doesn’t drive at all and rear wheels don’t spin except when i put the gear in neutral. I noticed i have this problem, could double engagement be the reason for this? In other words,could my problem be caused by the orange parts not in exactly 90% angles? Or is it something else? I tried to turn the rear wheels and snapped the differentials, can double gear engagement prevent wheels from rotating? Hope i am clear , thanks in advance
Yep, the angles are important. I'm afraid, you got to take it apart, at least partially and find the problem yourself. It can be a million things causing this
the problem is no problem there is right
Working. great. Thank you a lot.
Thx for this very helpfull video
It works well. Thanks.
I'm glad it was helpfull. ;-)
When my paddles catch on that red piece you said to flip, the paddle jams when I try to shift down. It was working fine before. Should this fix the problem?
Probably it will, however that kind of problem shouldn't be there at the first place. You may try to rebuild that mechanism too. It is way too sensitive to the quality of assembly.
Seems to me like this was a mistake in building instructions, why else would they use such a part there.
Then you get my point... It is a bit comforting now. I guess you have it. Please let me know if you find better this way. Thanks for getting back.
Sadly I dont own this set...or cant afford it ATM... But if I ever do I will look into it.
Any ideas on the step 5 fix after the model is 260 steps in? I totally missed that issue and now am screwed unless I tear it down. Legos response to this 300 dollar model has left a lot to be desired.
As I see it there isn't much hope to fix that problem without disassembling. All you can do at this stage to reach that part with a pointy item (like a knife) and make sure there is a small gap between and those two axles sideways. Also go trough the whole drivetrain and loose up stiff axles and connection. Bottom line is every moving part should move as easy as possible. If you need more please have a look at the eurobricks forum and ask Didumos69. He is the master of this topic.
+Attika Thanks for the quick reply....it is looking like full full disassemble at this point as you said. I poked and prodded but it is solid as a rock in there. lesson learned I guess, check for major issues from folks like yourself first next time. Thanks again!
Umm do I have to do it for it to work?
Sorry for the late reply. If you built it according the instructions and doesn't do the shift properly then it is worth to try this trick.
Attika I did the instructions way of the gearshift thing and I aligned a little space in between each gear and it works fine thanks
My problem is the opposite. When I shift the xo piece doesn't turn a full 90 degrees. I've tried your trick but the yellow gear thing doesn't engage with the red gear bit. Also Two of my gears have SERIOUS engine braking, the wheels really don't want to turn and make a horrible clicking sound. If you want I could post a video on my UA-cam channel for you. Please supply me with some tips and tricks :)
If you post a video, make sure the body is removed and show around all the mechanics, every bit of moving parts please. Did you go trough the mechanism? Probably some assembling mistake? The "symptoms" as you described sound too serious to be fixed just by a minor adjustment.
Attika, I've used a bit of grease in the gears and all my gears work wonderfully but I know have the double engagement problem. I've tried the solution again but the catch doesn't click back into place
I'd love to help, but without seeing it I don't know what is causing the problem. I still recommend to tear it down and build it again if you didn't do it yet. If you read the other comments you can see that for some people it works without this mod, for others it works with the mod, but yours doesn't work either way, so there must be something like a missplaced part in the background I guess.
Attika, don't worry :) I seem to have fixed it with some hammering and tinkering. Thank you again for your amazing engineering ingenuity ;) Keep the good stuff coming :D
I'm glad it is sorted. Catch u later. :-)
Thx thank youu!:-)
I did it and my gearbox keeps getting stuck
Well, if it didn't stuck before, then undo it.
I tried the fix but my paddle shifters kept getting stuck! :(
Sorry to hear that. If it doesn't work either way, I suppose you should rebuild at least the stepper box and check if all the moving parts (axles in the drivetrain, etc) are loose enough to move without friction. Hope you get it working.
Attika ok I'll try that. Thanks for the reply
So is the consensus now that this fix is a "hit or miss"?
Yep, I've got many feedback as it was helpfull and just as many saying there was no need of it.
Just installed your method on my model and it worked like a charm, thanks!
:-) Cool, I'm glad. That makes this a "hit" then?
Indeed!
cool :-) but no way i will get this set
worth it. Not because what it is, but more for what it can be. Dispite the dissapointment I felt watching the reviews on the first days, in this very moments we building it with a friend of mine, and I'm not just enjoying it for the building itself, but for how many possibilities it offers. There are good ideas in the original you can salvage and use on your own way. I'll build a chassis under the body from the scratch, keeping the dummie engine (in the non motorized version at least), and do something that this "ultimate" mean to be. ;-) Remember my 8880 evo? I love working between limits. In both cases that is the body.
+Attika cool :) good luck
'tork'
:-D Dull mistake... I have no idea how could I manage, I was in the hurry when I made the video ... As long as english is my second language I won't jump off the cliff for a glitch like this. ;-)
I have the problem. But sadly, this doesnt fix it for me
If i could find a custom yellow gear with the hole shifted 45' that would help it
Sorry to hear that. Best advice I can give is to rebuild it, at least the stepper. This model is really sensitive about building quality. A minor dissalignment can cause malfunction. Wish the best.
Attika thanks. I disassembled the shifter and now it works reasonably well. Only 4th gear grinds very badly. I changed some gears to make the gears run sequential but lego says that makes the gears grind more. Should i switch the gears back so that 2nd and 3rd gear are reversed?
Imho if it grinds it is due to some additional friction in the system. You wanna go trough the whole drivetrain, making sure that all (!) gears are free to rotate and aren't forced against frame elements or each other. Just grab them one by one and give a little shake to make them settle comfy on their axle. Also check around a framework, make sure there is no twist in it caused by let say a sliped out pin or something.
Back when I've built mine, I did it with the corrected gear order straight without building the original, so I don't know about the difference, but smooth performance can be achieved. Due to the high number of runing gears it requires flawless mechanics. Eats up time and nerve maybe but don't give up, there is a light at the end of the tunnel. :-)