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Hopefully Skip's Music in Sacramento doesn't also fail after Skip passed away as they shutdown the 1st store and went to a huge store. No idea if they kept the other stores open or not.
End of an era but I can’t say I’ll miss it; I used to love going to music row on 48 street in NYC but my experience was that the people who worked the stores there were always rude. It was never a nice experience. So when I found that great customer experience with a smaller store (that is still around) I just started shopping there. Then the internet came along and Sam Ash just didn’t adapt.
I am glad you did. Sam Ash and GC just can't compete with the smaller stores on a human level. TBH I saw so many people come and go on my SamAsh years that it became clear that we were all replaceable. The pay was not something to write home about either but on smaller stores you might get paid the same (or maybe even less) but if you feel valued and a part of something, you do it with a smile on your face...
@@PatPosseI live in NYC, and I went to Mannys pretty regularly from the late 80's, until they "closed". Back then it was a great experience to goto 48th Street Music Row. Eventually Sam Ash bought up most of the music stores on that block - including Mannys. From 99' until Mannys "closed" (09') they were under Sam Ash ownership. When they moved from 48th to 34th street, that block looked desolate for years. Even though they are family run, they still shared that same corporate mentality of buying up all the competition. Ironically, now they can't make enough profit to justify keeping that flagship Manhattan "super store" on 34th street open. Btw, I worked for both GC (07'-09') and Sam Ash (09'-11'). By then, music instrument sales were slumping, but GC and Sam Ash were too slow too adapt to the realities of on line competition, and ever increasing rents.
All the problems you experienced at Sam Ash are the same problems that Guitar Center has been going through for at least the last 15 years or longer. Their biggest problem was screwing their sales people and the customers. Which created a huge turn over in employees. Most people didn't stay more than a few months once they got tired of the managements excuses for the corporations crooked operations.
Yeah. And it didn't help that at most locations they only hired brain dead morons who can't answer basic questions, don't play an instrument, and have zero interest in music.
Brick and mortar shops are always about having things in stock. If they say to me we can get it for you, I walk and say I can get it for myself. Their main value will always be in having it today.
I am patient enough to wait for things. Better to order something and pick it up at a store where I can take it back if I don't like it than to deal with getting stuff shipped to my house, having to make sure I am there when it gets delivered and shipping stuff back if I have a problem or I don't like something.
@@MrChopsticktech Valid point for sure, very rare these days for me that I have to ship "anything" back delivered. It is not that I would never order from a Brick and Mortar, just far more rare these days.
Sad I got my first “real” guitar (Martin D18) in 1969 from Sam Ash in NYC on music row. Still have it and play it also have the hand written receipt $250 case included.
Great insight Pat, thanks man. My parents purchased my first guitar in 1983 at the 48th St store in Manhattan. It was the Japanese made Aria Pro II ZZ Deluxe in white; I was 13yrs old. Imagine waking in to church with this insane guitar in the 80's when heavy metal was considered the devils' s music. It was hilarious. I still have it. Thanks again for this post.
Thank you for that comment and for sharing that story! That rules!! Reminds me of when I used to wear cannibal corpse shirts in the 00s to a mostly hip-hop/reggeaton school in Miami lol. I’m sure we both got the same sorts of looks hahaha. That rules!
I worked there many years in 86-90 2000-2003 lots going on back then too. Pro audio never worked, stores were mess. But The Ash family were very kind, nice family.
Nice, yeah the Ash family was great. I only met one of the "kids" on the fourth generation but Sammy, Jerry and Richard were super cool. What location were you in?
I never had issues as a customer, and I had purchased a decent amount of Pro Audio gear (for a 1-person company anyway) around 1999-2002. I guess it was location-dependent.
Companies end up creating their own demise by bloated, inefficient, out of touch policies. I went into Sam Ash my first time a couple months ago just to pick up a set of guitar strings. 2 sales guys hanging around talking never once acknowledged me or asked to help. Then the Sales Mgr came out and started a sales meeting 10 ft away and I didn't want to interrupt and waited patiently while he tried to motivate his staff to make sales. Meanwhile, I'm still standing there and no one approached me or offered to help. Finally, after the meeting finished i had to go up and ASK a sales person for help so I could check out. One of the worst customer service experiences I've ever had.
Sounds like the Clearwater location. We purposely went to that store to keep them going even when SW was cheaper BUT their staff were just Not Cool and it made us sad.
Very informative & appreciated view of the retail music industry. Sam Ash is Music history (48th st) nyc. Always sad to see things that were end up things that are real in these days . However everyone needs to keep up with the times otherwise this is what can happen. Hope to hear they resurrect. Btw. Nice backdrop Florida rain & I'm sure that wasn't editing ?? software.
Thank you very much!! Haha it was not added on post. It was pouring! Alas, I am in Buenos Aires at the moment (hence the newly acquired accent from listening and speaking Spanish 24/7 lol) but yeah I did remind me of rainstorms back home
I've been going to the Sam Ash on Sunset in Hollywood since 1986. I'm sad to hear it's closing. It was a happening store at the height of hair metal. I bought a lot of gear there and had my guitars worked on by some great techs.
I would have LOVED to visit the stores back then when metal was booming!! It’s hard to even find videos of that time online but I can’t help but wonder what it would’ve been like to walk the strip and just absorbe the energy and bump elbows with so many axe men!
I worked at Sam Ash store 02 in NY and you hit the nail on the head entirely. The “commission” structure was completely a sham. Most people in my store never made any commission. The people that did only ever saw it 1 or 2 months out of the year. They sold it to you during the job interview as “minimum wage plus commission”, but it was really minimum wage with extra steps. We also had mad issues with stock. A purchasing manager once told me “don’t order any PRS guitars, we owe them a lot of money. Try selling people on Epiphones and Gibsons” There’s so much more i could say. How the extended service plans screwed over technicians, how the “family owned” nature led to nepotism, management just simply not listening, etc.
Exactly.. I see it wasn't really a matter of distance since you experienced the same issues back at store 02! I remember not stocking Gibsons for some contractual BS and the PRS shortage as well... that's not a good look on a store as big as SamAsh...
I lived within walking distance of 48th Street and shopped all the music stores on “music row”. 48th Street was convenient to a lot of the subway lines which made stopping by on my way home from work easy. The new location on 32nd street all the way over on the west side was far less convenient, so I only went there occasionally. It is hard to overstate the scale of the disastrous destruction of “music row” by the powers that be be in NYC. The cultural heart of the entire NYC band scene was cut out in the pursuit of real estate profits. Bloody shame….
This was a really amazing discussion of business strategies and KPI. I would love for corporate to engage all of the managers who think like you, and get them in an advisory committe to prevent this kind of stuff from repeating and growing out of control. They seem to have too many people in the wrong places, and not enough people in the right places. Keep up the updates. And good luck with that rain! Was that a hurricane? It sounded like you were in a car wash.
Thank you brother!! I appreciate the support and the positive comment... made my day! I doubt Sam Ash will come crawling back looking for old Pat but I do with them the best and I hope this is the beginning of a new plan moving forward. I'm gonna try to get in touch with some of my old peers and see what they think about this and if they have any updates to hook me up with! Thanks for watching and commenting and nope, it was not a hurricane, just heavy rain lol the water drops were huge , at least the house and car got cleaned hahaha!!!
In Florida, when it rains, it pours. Litteraly! It happens almost every day at about 2pm in the summer months. Huge raindrops! But it doesn't last long. I live very very close to Sam Ash in Margate. He mentioned that store in this video. There is also a GC very near by too. In Coconut Creek. It's not far from Sam Ash. 10 minutes apart by car. Even faster on a motorcycle! I shop at both very often. Peace.
Thank you so much for your brilliant autopsy, and analysis of the situation. As an independent promotor, Sam Ash, as well as GC have always remained supportive of my equipment expos. Any company would be lucky to have you in their employ! Loni Specter AMP SHOW, LA GUITAR SHOW- PEACE OUT!
I just heard that all the stores are closing and the first video that comes up is from the perspective of the stores in my city 😂. This clears up a lot I've always wondered about how the stores were operated. I was at the miami lakes store about a month ago when they started the closing sales and im sad to see the brand go but I can't say I've had too many good times there. Trading something in was a whole day event for some reason and the guitars at dolphin mall were always tied down, and there was never anyone around in the guitar section. This also explains why when i bought an acoustic guitar there i had no choice but to buy the display model. Guitar center was always a better experience anyway and good riddance to that POS website.
I am sad to see it go but I’ve left Ash 10 years ago and from the comment section here I’ve found it’s only gotten worse… I guess it was a long time coming…
I worked sales for Ash from 1987 through 2000. In that time I worked in the Queens, NY store and I have noticed the store closing sign which is there as of today 3/23/'24. We ultimately went to full commissioned sales and I have to say, it was like giving yourself a raise as the business flourished. Ash also bought out Manny's Music on W.48th. I also worked as a buyer and we were in the offices on W.48th Street (Music row). Ultimately we were moved to corporate in Hicksville, NY. I knew Jerry, Paul, David, Sammy, Richie and Bernice (Jerry's Wife and head of sheet music). Those were wonderful days and now three of them are gone. I can understand closing some stores and consolidating their holdings. I got plenty of gigs over the years through my association with Ash and it's a shame that the Manhattan store is scheduled for closing.
That's awesome! Is Bernice still around? (probably not...) she was also in charge of Lessons if I'm not mistaken. She was very opinionated (and mostly wrong) but I know she had our best interest at heart... same with most of the Ash family tbh. It's sad to see stores close but it might be time to condense down...
@@PatPosse Bernice passed some time before Jerry but I'm not sure exactly when. And yes, she was challenging though not in the stores much. Hey Pat, do you know Steve Price? He was the guitar manager in Queens but he went to Florida when it first opened. One last thing, my Brother in law owns property in California and he and his partners rent out space to Ash. I think it's the store in Torrance, CA. I mentioned to him about the closings and he said they were called to renegotiate the price of Ash's store rental lease.
Wow that’s cool! As far as Steve Price… I’ve heard of him, it sounds very familiar.. he might have been the Store Manager at the Margate location, store 32 I believe… if that’s the case then yes! I’ve talked to him several times.
Thanks for sharing this post I was a dept manager at store 4 Forest Hills NY 04-09. I bought a Godin Multiac for myself Christmas 2023 from store 7 Manhattan. Very light traffic in both stores for the last few years. I think Bklyn is still open for now. Sad to see my favorite music stores close.
Thank you for watching and commenting!! Glad to see at least Brooklyn survive. I am surprised at the Manhattan store closing but no business + sky high rent prices = failure.
Fantastic observations and assessment of the Sam Ash business. Everything you reviewed is applicable to every retailer in the country, musical or not. Should be used as a case study. I think you have a future career in consulting. Great job.
Miami Lakes was my shopping store too 😢. Thank you for all your help when working there and also for all this information. I didn't know there was so much burocracy behind the scenes.
As an ex-employee of Guitar Center, everything you have mentioned is going on at GC as well! The smaller stores are hurting with employees that are only there to earn a paycheck but have zero knowledge of gear. They try to up-sale shit that you have no need for and also...employees that seem to have recently graduated from highschool.🤣🤣🤣
That also happens and will hurt their credibility big time… remember Best Buy trying to pull that shit? How’d that go for them? You need to have knowledgeable staff to help out and get the customer the service they need, otherwise, what’s the advantage over buying online?
True. And it seems like their stores are always short staffed. It takes forever to get anyone to help you. I have walked out a couple of times because I couldn't find someone to help me. And yeah, you are right, GC used to have knowledgeable staff. Now it seems like they hire anyone to work there.
@@nerychristian it’s hard to hire people with knowledge when the pay sucks! Another issue I had was for example: if I sold a Black Les Paul Studio, it would get replaced with exactly the same guitar. They wouldn’t send something else instead.
Dude you nailed it!! I had that same convo with my then Manager Dave. They would just refill the same order over and over. Always the same guitars because they were “proven to sell” but that drove people away… there was never anything new or exciting
(Lord, I had to watch this twice.) Wow. This explains sooooooo much. I'm close to the Miani Lakes store. I asked myself all those questions. Thanks for finally clearing it up. If the 4th gen doesn't understand that you can use the internet to your benefit, it's going to be tough. Resolve to make that happen.
@PatPosse No worries. I've passed it on to a few friends because we all had, over the years, the same questions 🤣🤣 You couldn't recommend a local guitar luthier or tech that adjusts necks, do you? I figure it couldn't hurt to ask. The best for you.
Thank you very much for sharing!! The good luthiers I knew are gone now… maybe check out the one on Walt Grace, I’ve heard good things but I have no experience with his work personally
I used to shop at Sam Ash in Forest Hills NY from 1992-1994. Store was filled with angry hair metal musicians that were upset because their bands were failing because grunge was taking over.I turned 18 in 1994 and got $10,000 from a lawsuit when I was a kid. I was more than happy to drop every penny at Sam Ash. I wanted a Black Tama Artstar 2, a bunch of Zildians, heavy duty stands and hard cases for everything. The prick salesman actually said " Oh, another Dave Grohl wanna be" After a few choice words back to him, me and my 10 Grand left and went to Long Island Drum Center in Flushing and made them very happy.
Good for you!! I have a similar story were I went to GC and asked for the guitar Brian May was holding on a picture (little did I know there weren't very many replicas around) and the salesman scoffed at me and said "you'll never have a guitar like that". I've had 4 and kept the best one. I hope he reads this one day lol
Pat!! Great video! Good to see you doing what you do. Just found out that Sam Ash is completely going bankrupt. Very sad but we all new it was inevitable. All stores are closing. And just to put the nail in the coffin, GC just opened up a new store in Hialeah. What a kick in the ass! Take care brother!
Steve-O!!!!!!! Dude, no way!! First of all, I never thought I’d get a comment from you, that rules!! Thanks for that… I would love to catch up! I heard you left a while back and I was surprised to find that out. I know how hard you worked to get to the top and I also know that once you got there it was a crap fest beyond repair… (and that you had no backing from corporate). That really sucks that SamAsh is going under… I suspected it might be but I guess I didn’t want to believe it. Apparently carrying on the legacy and its heritage wasn’t worth the effort at this point… sad times indeed. Anyways, hit me up on IG like a man if you want! I’d love to know what you are up to nowadays!
My friend and I use to go to Sam Ash in Brooklyn in the 90s and when I got into rock music I wanted to learn how to play guitar..so Sam Ash was the place I went to get my first guitar. It was a cool place to be just to learn music and just watch other people jam. Fast forward I work right by the Manhattan location and I was shocked to see the store closing sign. I hate seeing that especially when these stores has been around for years…but yeah Manhattan rents are high as hell and I’m not sure if the high demand for instruments are the same as in the early days…still sad to see them go but I hope they still find away to keep the name around and continue to sell and be a resource to those coming into wanting to learn music and play instruments. Every now and then I love to go in and walk around play the piano or pick up a guitar…definitely sad to hear they closing stores…
Hey man... I would just love to have seen the stores back then!! Yeah it's pretty sad but at least I don't think they are entirely away (for a while...).
Fascinating inside view--thanks for sharing. I bought both my guitars online from Sam Ash, but bought plenty of strings and accessories from the local brick-and-mortar store, which is now closing. The one bright spot for me is that I have my eye on a couple of guitars on the wall and am hoping prices drop as the store gets closer to closing.
Hey man! Thanks for watching and commenting! A lot got edited out in the interest of keeping it concise and interesting lol. 😂 sad so many are closing 🤦🏻♂️
Great overview Pat....thank you...your in the loop and I appreciate the inside info. You answered many questions that I wondered about. For what it's worth I hope they see your channel ! and they will learn how easy it is to be disconnected from hands on to corporate level ! For the record most of my Big purchases have been from Sam Ash and their is a reason why. MD
Thank you very much Michael ! I am glad you enjoyed it. I hope they don’t take offense if they ever do what it lol. I’m glad to finally read about someone who really enjoys shopping at SamAsh!
Hi there... totally! I think it got too big too fast and they just couldn't keep up. It got out of hand... AND... our Regional Manager (cool dude I suppose) was NOT even from our region, he just moved down there for the gig...
Excellent Information and Presentation. The Local Sam Ash (Edison, NJ) is closing and that makes Guitar Center the best choice for my future Music Needs. You sound like you have a great understanding of the Sam Ash Business, I hope you are still in the Music Industry, as you appear to care as much about the Customer as the Business, which is a balance that few commit to and then it hurts both.
Thank you!!! I am not. I managed another store after in which the owner cared even less about what I had to say and gave up lol. I started focusing on my studio, my band and session work and then covid hit. While on quarantine I started doing zoom lessons and this channel. And that’s pretty much where I’m at now. Hoping to make a move at the end of the year. Having my own Music Store is a dream of mine but it’s far ahead still… Thanks for watching and commenting!
I believe you would do well running your own Store. I know it is a large undertaking and it takes resources, but some people have a good perspective and knowledge, and that combination is quite rare and should be encouraged.
All corporations are working hard to disconnect the consumer from both their money and the ability to get accountability from the company. They want a computer screen between you and their business.
Great video! I worked for Guitar Center when it was privately owned and only a dozen or so stores in the early 90s. I worked in their advertising department. I always like Sam Ash more. The used gear part is the hardest blow. If you buy new gear, you don't necessarily need to play it first, but used gear its pretty critical.
Nice!! I'm, sure you got a thing or two to add to my video! I've always wondered how the Advertising Department worked on other (better advertised) music companies... At Ash it was next to null and pretty bad when they did run ads... Used Gear is definitely overlooked at Ash and from what I've gathered, they haven't gotten any better (and might not)
It would have been cool if I met you while I was at Sam Ash, I'm 100% sure I'd get the help I need. So sad that you cared too much, but not the business you worked in.
Excellent job! You have cleared up the situation for me. I have been a bit anxious since the announcement because I placed an order for a back-ordered amp right before the news came out.
Hey man! Thanks for watching and commenting! Glad you enjoyed it. Don’t worry, your amp will get to you safe and sound! Which store location did you order it in? Do you happen to know if that particular one is closing?
Had an awful interaction at the Charlotte NC store. Was using the enclosed music room to play a half stack with cash in my pocket to potentially buy. A sales person on the floor trying to sell to two parents a starter guitar and amp told me to turn it down so much it might as well be turned off. The doors were closed to the room. I bought nothing and walked out and never returned again. They favored introduction lessons and cheap gear and the quality of gear declined as did their customer service for gigging pros. I can’t say I’ll miss Sam ash.
Wow, that blows. They probably assumed that sale was a sure sale and yours wasn't. We didn't have those isolated booths but we always told people to blast it for a few minutes then turn it down. Also, we would tell everyone else to brace themselves cause it was about to get noisy!. Let 'er rip and then back to business as usual... One thing was always stressed though, don't ever assume someone is NOT buying!!
I worked at the Franklin Mills (Philadelphia) location over a decade ago. Sales associates get paid commission, and we got paid more commission to sell the cheaper house brand drum kits and whatnot vs a Pearl, Tama or Yamaha kit. We would get our eardrums beat up daily for not selling, meanwhile the foot traffic was mainly people who had no cash or desire to buy anything musical. It was far from an ideal situation or location.
Yeah cause it was based off of GP (gross profit) and the cheap house brands had huge margins. I think GC actually paid commission on the sale total and not the items…
@@PatPosse that would have been a more reasonable way of doing things. Sell a $2000 Pearl kit and get $10 commission. Sell a Groove Percussion kit for $399 and I’d get $35 commission. I believe electronic kits like Roland had decent commission pay, but that was about it, and we didn’t get ANYONE looking to buy a $5000 electronic kit. All we got was kids wanting to come in and make a ruckus.
Yeah I remember that and having arguments with staff that was pushing the $60 Carlo Robelli Classicals (at 20 dollar commission) instead of the $99 Ibanez (that made us $4)...
I really wanted to like Sam Ash as its closer, but the one by me gets destroyed in every way by Guitar Center. The Sam's here never has any good Rhoads, or good Vs or any guitar that they might think could get damaged. Its prob the customers fault but I have seen very few guitars above low-mid budget here for most brands except for Gibson that are very high on the wall. If you ask them for help they just tell you to grab it yourself. I almost fumbled one of the guitars but luckily no accident happened as it was too high for me. The one or two people there just don't care about helping anyone and they have such poor selection and not very competitive prices. I don't know this might be why its shutting stores. Reverb and and online buying is also always available.
Thanks for noticing… a lot of details were left out in the interest of keeping it short and concise. Especially because there was no script or even bullet points 😅 lol
Great job man. This was very informative. I used to frequent the Garden City one quite often when I was in HS, but that was many moons ago, and I’m now in N. Florida. Sadly they are closing the one closest to so we’ll only be left with Guitar Center. The customer service was always top notch at Sam Ash so I’ll miss that, but as you pointed out in this video their website is God awful. Now that I won’t have a local shop to visit I’m hoping they address that issue so I can still support them.
Hey man that’s awesome thanks for supporting Ash! (Or at least thinking about it lol). I wonder, is there any mom and pop stores around? Where in N FL are you located? I’m hoping to move back and I am looking for a city that’s NOT Miami! Too expensive and way too hot all the time… Ps, awesome Live at Pompeii Gilmour Shot!
I brought a Cannonball Sax from that location. About 17 yrs ago. Class act back then. Sad too see the business model go under. Check out Nashville, I’m relocating this summer. Btw still have that sax as well.
@@PatPossecome to ST PETE. I grew up here and it is the PLACE TO BE. Not Tampa, not Clearwater but St. Petersburg. Lots of momsnpop stores hanging around for years.
Very well done & concise Lifetime Full Time Music Person Here This analysis should be required viewing for anyone in the music sales division of any & all companies Suerte por todas Good Luck to all!!
Thank you very much bro! you are too kind! I'm surprised at how many people enjoyed the video and took the time to comment on it to let me know they did. It exceeded all my expectations!
What Pat's saying makes 100% sense. I have worked in similar situations throughout my career and know exactly what he's talking about. Family owned businesses can have there upsides, but a lot of them seem to suffer from the same issues. They dont listen to their employees and tend to micro manage everything. They are also out of touch with their own business and clientele, running it like they did 30 years ago. Hopefully the next generation does the right thing.
Thanks man! Definitely... it's a shame but I understand it, it's hard to give up your baby, more so if your family name is attached to it... but yeah, they need to realize that some times they just don't know better... especially when they are so out of their element. They have the means... they should hire people who know what they are doing and focus on just that instead of hiring one guy and stretching him thin with different responsibilities...
My brother told me about Sam Ash. It sounded like a cool place to window shop. It’s sad but hopefully, like you said, they’ll open doors somewhere else!
Great job, Pat in explaining it all. Liked the history of SA too. Well done. I always enjoyed the warmer vibe at the SA stores in Manhattan, Miami and Sarasota . Sorry to see them go. Hopefully the online store will modernize and prosper. Again, very well done presentation.
Thank you very much Ken! Glad you enjoyed it 😁. Sadly, a month after I recorded this video SamAsh announced they will be closing all stores and website unless someone buys the company and name out as far as I know, that hasn’t happened yet but 🤞… I’ll definitely record something if that does happen!! Thanks for watching and commenting 😁🤘🏻
An interesting story of a company adopting business practices unsuited to its industry, and failing to keep up with the times. Thanks for posting this. I would not otherwise have understood it. I have ordered from the online competitors you showed, all with excellent results. Although I now live in the Northeast, Sam Ash territory, the name didn't cross my mind for online purchases, and I only recall one purchase in the Manhattan store.
Hi there! Of course you never even thought about buying online from them, they have next to zero online presence! You can’t even find them on UA-cam! Their channel is bust, they don’t sponsor any videos (that I’ve seen…) they are barely even mentioned. Thats something else they are overlooking: UA-camrs. They are the best advertisers you can have now… get them to the stores, give them some swag, pay them for an ad, have then mention you at least… but no… SA would rather keep doing business the same as in the 70s… 🤦🏻♂️ Thanks for watching and commenting!!
Hey bud, thanks for watching and commenting! I wouldn’t say my ideas would have saved the stores or even have helped but, if they didn’t listen to me I am sure they didn’t listen to other people who may have had bigger plans and better ideas either… and THOSE might have saved the stores or even made SamAsh #1!
I know not all stores are created equal but I love my local Sam Ash. They’ve been a staple in the music industry for years and it’s sad they’re closing so many locations.
Great breakdown man! Having to sell any type of “used” or “pre-owned” gear in a corporate setting like that is always especially tricky. First, you need a staff that knows their given industry well, along with having working knowledge on various manufacturing trends. Second, people and higher-ups in the corporate office need to be able to facilitate any laws/regulations/policies. In a corporate setting; this is where companies often centralize this role. Unfortunately, this is the part where the company is usually understaffed and under resourced. I understand why they have to do this, but, it’s too bad when the profits start bottle necking outside the front door. I find this is a niche market where a family business can do extremely well though dealing in used gear or merchandise.
Love music, play drums, never been to a Sam Ash store although I have heard about them. Your video is excellent for what was a down fall not for just Sam Ash but could almost be applied to so many family business trying to expand. Thank you for making this.
I worked shipping and receiving at Store 57. The biggest issue that was never talked about there was how aggressively corporate tried to push house brands. The amount of Michael Kelly guitars I unboxed was staggering and none of the ones I ever played felt half as nice as an entry level ESP or Ibanez. Samson headphones lining the walls. Not all of the house brands were bad products, but by prioritizing having entry level gear in stock we indirectly pushed everyone to drive up to Sweetwater where they have more than 2 SM7Bs in stock at any given time.
I left before that time and didn’t see that happen first hand but now that you mention it it makes a lot of sense… I remember them steering in that direction with the Carlo Robelli and Groove Percussion stuff back when I was at Ash…
I remember appying for a job at the 48th street location back in 1998. Everything was good until the manager told me about the pay, just as you mentioned, you have to go abouve the pay rate in order to collect on commissions. Also he wanted me to work 6 days a week including weekneds. He said to me "we are all musicians so every one is expected to work on weekends if needed". I actually never worked there once he told me that. I felt it could be difficult to pass that threshold weekly given the amount of salespeople they had.
The guy who was hiring says ‘we are all musicians, so everyone is expected to work on the weekends?’ That translates to; ‘I haven’t been a real musician in so long that I forgot what it really is to be an authentic musician.’ Mega music stores like these are going to continue to slowly fade away, unless they get honest with themselves, and admit that a business like Sweetwater has been going in the right direction with the better policies that they have been working with. They all have to realize that many of the musicians who apply for a sales position, can potentially have better ideas about how to advance their business, than many of the guys who are sitting around at corporate headquarters.
All things you mentioned are spot on. I remember every weekend there was an issue with someone playing… what was worse is that since management hated that and wouldn’t give you a day off “‘cause you had a gig” people would just call in sick on the day of instead of telling you in advance so you could schedule staff and meeting accordingly… and yeah, playing and instrument and being a musician, and being an active musician are very different things…
I got my '83 Gretsch kit from Sam Ash in Paramus, NJ. The service and price were better than great! My salesman, Tom Sontag was so helpful and made sure i was happy with the kit, going so far as to contact Gretsch directly about some of my concerns. I played that kit for over 30 years! I also picked up a lot of cymbals and hardware there that i'm still using. I used to travel to Sam Ash in Manhattan to buy stuff in the early days when it was the only store. It's good to hear they're not closing up.
That’s awesome! Happy to read some positive comments about Ash 😁! And good on that Gretsch for providing such great value! Thanks for watching and commenting.
I purchased an insturment and had a serious defect and my Salesman took care of it for me on the spot with a new but different insturment that I have owned over 3 years and enjoy. They even provided a free pro set up that was very very well done. Sorry to see them go. When you have issues its great to have a place to go that backs up their products.
@@PatPosse The guys at the Indianapolis store all were solid playing musicians and knew the local scene. They would have serious well - known musicians come by. They used to have about everything that you could try and I felt their quality was better than GC. But sadly I can see the changes over the last few years. The store is kept dark, you can tell the product is all low - end, the store is way too big. They still have a few of the good guys there but I don't think they will be around much longer. Guitar Center is around the corner and that store is really rough - no way I would buy an insturment off their wall. They do have some long-term guys on staff hanging on but I think GC is in trouble. Everyone I talk to thinks Sweetwater located in Fort Wayne is the way to go I have ordered from them and they are very good. With the big boxes in trouble my local guitar shop and real luthier has picked up business he is awsome and glad to see him doing well.
That’s great for him (your luthier). I agree with everything you’ve mentioned. I guess it’s just a shift in the way we do business as a society. I’d rather go to the store and pick up an axe but amps, pedals and accessories I could buy online with no problems… Btw. Did you know that some SamAsh stores actually preferred NON musicians for hire?? They claimed it was easier to deal with and they wouldn’t ask to leave for tours or ask for weekends off for gigging. Also, they would not be as interested on the stuff on the walls and counters so they wouldn’t get distracted by the shinny gear! Counterpart to that was the fact that they didn’t know a Humbucker from a single coil or P90 🤦🏻♂️.
@@PatPosseThat is so interesting - and I can see it both ways on sales people and I feel exactly as you do on insturments versus accessories like pedals.
This video was randomly recommended to me and I cannot believe I found you Pat ! I used to be a regular back in my highschool days at the Sam Ash by the palmetto and you were always so informative and very cool. When you left I would always ask the employees " What happened to pat" . Cool to see you doing youtube now .
THAT'S AWESOME!! Glad to have been helpful and that there's a fond memory of me back there!! I'm sure it was my pleasure to help you out bud! And yes, I am trying out the UA-cam thing.. I've been doing it for about 3 years.. I had my studio going, and a healthy amount of students, plus touring but then COVID hit and here we are lol. Lessons and recordings came to halt, touring was not feasible anymore so I decided to give this a shot... It's been a long, hard journey but finally a video blew up.. I don't see it pushing any of my other videos up but at least the fact that a video of mine can do well is a nice pat in the back (no pun intended lol). Are you still rocking out? I'd love to catch up and know who it is I'm talking to! look me up on IG, same name!
@@PatPosse Yeah I'll hit you up on instagram but obviously your not gonna remember me haha you always saw hundreds of people a day. But yeah of course I'm still playing guitar it's been a passion of mine for a very long time . One of my coworkers texted me 2 weeks ago on a weekend that the store was closing down and I wasn't surprised to be honest, every time I would walk in to the store there was barely any guitars hanging and lots of the walls were empty so it was inevitable. My coworker also said a tech told him that they're building a guitar center in Hialeah and that the same tech is going to move to that location. Sad to see it go but it isss what it isssssss.
I just read that on another comment! That’s crazy!! I guess GC will pick up the pieces… I just hope they make it a tiny, well oiled machine. Sam Ash #33 had a lot of potential but it didn’t have the numbers to back up its size and upper management didn’t really care to make it any better…
Very true. There are not so blind as those who will not see… Bummer though. I don’t know if I already asked you but if you ever do make it to the store, will you shoot me some pics?
The Sam Ash on Colonial Blvd in Orlando is closing, and I'm super happy about that. Every single person, except for the live sound guy, are jerks. I only buy high end gear, and I couldn't get a single person in that store to help me, except the live sound guy.
Great piece! Knew some people back in the day, who loved working there….but some the info you presented makes my think they were just young and eager. It Wes also before the expansions. However, I have heard they have excellent health benefits. 🤷🏻♂️
Great summary and history, Pat. Fascinating to hear how much goes into running a big musical instrument store. Thanks for the very interesting details and how well you explained everything. I actually bought my first serious electric guitar at the 48th St. Manhattan location in 1973 - a Gibson L6-S. I think that was the only Sam Ash store at the time, maybe.
@@PatPosseYes, I still have it, and it's still a solid beast of a guitar - certainly very well-made. It's been through a lot - we did many gigs in the late 1970's/early 1980's at lots of NYC clubs (CBGB, Max's Kansas City, The Ritz, Kenny's Castaways., Folk City, Irving Plaza, Great Guildersleeves, The Other End, and many more) several times with my old band, The Maroons. I had also loaned the guitar to my brother (Rudolph Grey) for several years, who had a NYC band called The Blue Humans, and he put it through the paces of gig life in 1980's NYC. Somehow, I got it back from him : ). My band, The Maroons had one single back, in 1979. Never got a record deal, but, looking back, that's probably why I still have my hearing! Here's a song from our single (the photo is us playing at CBGB): ua-cam.com/video/FEBvlH80V-0/v-deo.html
I bought my first guitar at their 48th st NYC store in the late 70s only a few doors from Mannys. Back in the day European friends would buy a Strat or a Les Paul there every time they were in NYC and flip it for twice the price when they got off the plane back home. They never quite got the hang of competing on the internet. Thank you Sam Ash for the old-school good deals though!
Lol I’ve done that as well 😁. There’s a great story Cesar G. (Gibson’s current president) tells about buying an Epiphone, taking it to Argentina, selling it for double and buying his first Gibson with that money on his next trip to the US! Awesome stuff.
Wow if management does not listen to this guy, they are crazy. Pat does a great job to provide an insider analysis of what's going wrong with the business and what can be fixed or improved. That's gold to a business owner, especially if they are going thru critical times. I personally like the stores, I hope the new generation of owners act quickly and not only save the business but make it even better, everybody deserves it. Good job Pat
Thank you very much!! I doubt they care about what Pat has to say... they didn't care then, I don't think they'll care now. Although, there's new people in charge now... But alas, I doubt they'll even come across this video LOL. That being said, I would LOVE to help Sam Ash out any way I can...
@@PatPosse Hi Pat, if there is a new generation of owners that want to save and improve the business, you bet they will see your video sooner or later. You seem to care for the business and you gave them a good advice with detail informaiton. Just wait and see. 🙂
I had years worth of memories hanging out at the Forest Hills Sam Ash, Queens NY...and over time would go into various stores and they looked shabby, dirty floors, lack of inventory, you could see the lack of motivation in the workers. Guitar Center stores were a breath of fresh air. Always clean with tons of gear to try out. And now with Sweetwater...how could a chain like Sam Ash survive? Great video, Pat!
Your comment makes me sad but it only proves my points. I think it just got out of hand and they weren’t able to keep up with their stores, staff and technology. I hope downsizing and the new blood being in some much needed changes to the chain!
Same here! I spent a ton of time in the Forest Hills store.... decades. So many memories. I started hanging out there as a teen back when guys like Steve Price and Alan (forget his last name, but you'd know him if I described him) were salesmen. Steve wound up playing guitar for Thor and then went on to manage the main store on 48th St (I think he was one of the managers). Coincidentally, years later I moved to Forest Hills and was in walking distance. They definitely had that... "you gonna buy it?" mentality when I first started going in there as a kid but over time they knew I was for real and welcomed me into the circle, so to speak. A couple of them kept telling me I should work there, but as much as I liked hanging out there it didn't seem like the best job. I spent even more time on 48th St, but that's a whole other can of worms and opportunities.
@@Darth.Shredder I used to tease Alan and call him Foghorn Leghorn. I think Baby Huey even came out once...he was a shredder though! I remember Steve, and Mike (Facebook friends with him).
@@ivsiguitarist LOL... so, you knew what I meant when I said you'd know Alan if I described him :). Alan was a cool kat. I also remember a Mike... I don't want to say his last name in public but it started with a "W".
Thank you for this very informative and beautiful video. Sadly my SamAsh store here in Paramus. New Jersey closed down also. I got my Gibson LesPaul Classic there back in 2012 and a lot of other stuff like amps, pedals, acoustic guitars and other accessories. 😢 we’re left with Guitar Center whose workers also seem not to care anymore. So now online is the best bet.
I'm sorry to hear that... Sounds like a great place for a small mom and pop.... There's not a lot competition apparently! Bummed they are closing out so many Ash stores, but it is what it is... GC is not known for their CC... Thanks for watching and commenting! psyched so many people liked it!!
Wow!!! Thanks for the inside scoop! I use to practically live in the old Brooklyn Kings Highway store and then the Brooklyn Flatbush Avenue store. It was exciting to hang out in the 48th Street Manhattan Store, especially during the “48th Street Heyday!!! Manny’s, 48th Street Custom Guitars etc.). Those were the days!!! ❤️🎶❤️
I’m from Philadelphia and my first experience with Sam Ash was in the 90s at the Cherry Hill NY store. Every few months they would have a drum clinic featuring one of world’s greatest drummers. I never missed a clinic! 👍🏽 They opened two more stores in the region. Eventually most of the other music stores in Philadelphia and surrounding areas closed down!☹️ Now Sam Ash in King Prussia is closing down.😕 Such is life. Well I guess I better get over there and catch some sales!!!😜
Love Philly!! Man, such is life indeed... It makes me Sad that SamAsh is closing down stores but it makes me twice as sad when a local shop closes down. Whenever I see an abandoned local shop or "out of business" signs I always think, "There goes someone else's dream"...
I’m really sad about the Manhattan store closing. We made a point to go there, even buying things we could have bought closer to home just because we enjoyed visiting it so much. The musicians who work and study in NYC must be very sad to lose their music shop.
That pay structure is horrendous. The owners should be ashamed of themselves especially since they were told what would sell in the stores (based on its market) but insisted on keeping everything cookie cutter.
A very nice, succinct, analysis.. Too bad about the SA chain, but very often over-expansion causes those types of problems. At least they (4th gen) are starting to recognize the e-business weaknesses and will hopefully address them wisely.
I was on the "genesis" crew that opened the Miami Lakes (Palmetto) Shop in 1994. We built the white walls and the basically the entire shop from the inside. It was a great shop back in the day and a destination retail experience for its time. Being family owned is always a problem as decision making is always centralized and takes forever for anything to get done. Sad to hear that it is closing. MI retail in general is shifting at great speed especially with Internet access to generate sales. If an MI establishment doesn't employ Omni channels to support sales - Money is being left on the table to your competitor. Hopefully, the new generation of Ash's can pivot in this atmosphere to turn the brand around.
Oh wow that’s awesome!!! You guys did a great job! Our Store (Palmetto and 57th) was amazing. It was huge but well distributed! I know it had been remodeled since ‘94 but still. That’s awesome… I remember asking when did that store become a Sam Ash (I remember being told it was a furniture store before) but no one gave me a sure answer. Now I know! Too bad is going away but I can’t say I’m surprised… thanks for commenting!!
I don't love the Sam Ash closures bc I live in NYC and did really like the Manhattan store at a time, but I went in there one last time the other day, and grabbed a blonde figured 335 w/ a headstock repair at an awesome price, they are very open to negotiation rn Also have one of those 90th anniversary candy apple red strats they did back in 2014 and I bought new, it's my favorite strat.
I bought my first fender p bass from Jerry Ash. He was an awesome person. I think your assessment is spot on regarding their internet approach. Their Jam sessions were a big hit for a while. The last store I visited in PA was deserted. I hope the new generations of Ashes does their homework!
Jerry was a cool cat for sure! I hope the new gen kills it and turns it around! Thanks for watching and commenting… I love to read about people who interacted with the Ash family or their experiences at the stores…
Store 33 was my second home! Speaking of tourists, I remember all the folks from the islands coming in and buying huge stock of sound equipment, instruments, Ext. Sad to see it go!
I have heard that rents in some areas are high. However, I just don’t understand why the two SA stores in Phila area are closing, I figured maybe one. Both King of Prussia, PA and the store in Northeast Philly are closing. Heading north, Edison, NJ and of course NYC. That’s a big hole that they leave from Phila are to NYC.
Customer Service killed them in the Edison NJ store - never had what i was looking for - they would say we can order it for you!!! I want it now not wait another 2 weeks!!!!
When I was 14 years old. Paul ash personally took my bass amp trade in and gave me a great price on a new amp which I still have now. The store In Brooklyn was actual called Paul ash instead of Sam ash. It must of been only owned by Paul. It burnt down in 1993 and they reopened in a new location in Brooklyn and used the Sam ash name. Only good experience at the store.
I am a Jazzmaster and Jaguar guy. Over the years I have bought a number of each. Every time I was actively seeking to make a buy, I would go to Sam Ash, and tell the sales guy what I wanted. The kid, who knew next to nothing for the most part, would try and sell me a wall (display) guitar or a Strat. I NEVER buy wall (display) guitars anywhere. Sam Ash made me decide that. One day while in a Sam Ash, I saw one of the sales kids drop an American Made Strat from about 8 feet high. Landed on the rear strap button and crashed. And guess what the sales kid does......yep, straight back up onto the hangar. At any rate, I would tell the sales guys at Sam Ash, get me 3 of whatever model it was I wanted. They would always say they could, but never did. When I spend $1k+ on an stick, I am choosing the one I want, not the only one (display) you have. Many times, Sam Ash could have made a sale on me, but never did because in my opinion, they simply did not understand what the customer expects and requires. Many of my guitars came from Wildwood, which I did not actually visit to inspect the guitar(s). But what Wildwood will do, is post pics of everything they have. And, they will send you close up pictures (a lot of them) of every inch of the guitar and serial number, so you know what you are getting, no flim-flam, no B.S. You can literally inspect the wood grain on every part of the guitar(s) you are interested in. I would hope when Sam Ash emerges from the fog, they improve a lot of things, and put the customer first.
Wow, that’s awesome. As far as Ash goes, you won’t find more than 2 (if that) of the same guitar over $1000. It comes down to having as many different guitar choices as possible within the same budget.
Great review of the Sam Ash situation. Also, in these times, don't forget that most people in general do not have the disposable income that they used to have. The drum set I sold five years ago would cost me twice as much to replace it today.
That's 100% true BUT talking to some guys in high places, Instruments are selling more than ever... It's just that SW and Zzounds are taking a huge piece of the pie and SA and GC are just not adapting to it...
Met some great people during my shopping experiences at Sam Ash, and bought such great equipment from there, but I do have to say I won’t miss the overall service. Most of them were dicks, but not all of them. To the few who weren’t, were chill and patient, and made the experience of shopping there as a musician, a comfortable and enjoyable one, especially when buying your first guitar (and I’ve bought 3 from there, a drum set I got for Black Friday w some free hardware and a free acoustic which I still have to this day), from the bottom of my heart, I want to say thank you Sam Ash 🙏🏻 you guys are what made Sam Ash a memorable music store to shop at.
My personal experience with Sam is like with any big-box music store, it’s hit-or-miss according to the location. My local Sam Ash seems to have completely indifferent staff. They’re not rude, but you’re basically on your own when you visit. I would often go in and have absolutely zero interaction with any staff. That’s definitely not a “family owned” kind of vibe, and therefore not much different than Guitar Center. At the same time, it’s good to have variety and competition, so it’s sad they’re closing down stores.
I've had that experience as well.. as a salesman it takes a while to build up the confidence to approach customers in a friendly non aggressive manner and with the staff being in a revolving door it's also hard to get to that point...
@@PatPosse It's not that hard. Customers just expect you to greet them and welcome them to the store. And if you see someone walking around alone in a department, ask if they need something. Most people just need help locating something.
I bought my first guitar from Sam Ash in White Plains in 1970. I still go there. I hope they recover from their mistakes. Tough market for everyone right now.
I bought my first keyboard back in 2001(a demo Roland FP4 that I still use), at the Canoga Park Ca store. I really appreciated the store vibe, inventory and staff. It was an inspiring place to visit.
@@PatPosse I moved out to the mid-west in 2012 and have not been back, but I have fond memories of playing keyboards at the Canoga Park CA store. It was a great place for musicians.
@@PatPosse Sadly, I live in a smal mid-west city with limited music stores (something I regret). The saving grace is that the internet has opened up great possibilities. The \true value of local music stored are underrated. I wish it was different, but you have to deal with the obsticals as best you can.
I agree! That personal in person touch can’t be replaced by a screen… and picking up a piece of gear will never be the same as looking at it online… but we gotta make do, right?
@@PatPosse yep 1 by 1 liquidation then pop goes the online too! So 😢 sad. The store in Clearwater just stocked up full too, so we hoped for a come back.
Nice video. I bought a used PRS guitar from Sam Ash online. The guitar showed up but was not the guitar in the photo. The communication at Sam Ash was great and they understood and sent me a return label so I could return it for a full refund. I live in Las Vegas NV. and I am a full time musician. We have one Sam Ash and two GC stores in town. When I need something right now I go to Sam Ash who seems to always have what I need in stock. Thanks
I live in S. Florida and I agree. I don't remember who I got my Martin HD-28 from in that battle, but people loved it. I wish I didn't have to sell it as a college student.
The inability to adapt to local markets is a problem for all large chain business. My experience working for SA before they overexpanded pre Mars, was that selling the service contract/extended warranty was very important. Note that back then some guitar brands still had lifetime or at least 5 year warranties.
100 percent!! And yeah pushing the ESP (Extended Service Plan) was annoying as hell to both the Customer and Salesman. I remember specifically one time when I was still on training I managed to sell a Marshall half stack and 2 Gibsons on the same day. I was so excited I told my manager at the end of the day (even though I knew I wasn’t getting any commission cause I was still “in training” but at least it would someone show my worth) and he was pissed because I hadn’t sold any ESPs with them… 🤦🏻♂️🤬
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Hopefully Skip's Music in Sacramento doesn't also fail after Skip passed away as they shutdown the 1st store and went to a huge store. No idea if they kept the other stores open or not.
I hope not!
End of an era but I can’t say I’ll miss it; I used to love going to music row on 48 street in NYC but my experience was that the people who worked the stores there were always rude. It was never a nice experience. So when I found that great customer experience with a smaller store (that is still around) I just started shopping there. Then the internet came along and Sam Ash just didn’t adapt.
I am glad you did. Sam Ash and GC just can't compete with the smaller stores on a human level. TBH I saw so many people come and go on my SamAsh years that it became clear that we were all replaceable. The pay was not something to write home about either but on smaller stores you might get paid the same (or maybe even less) but if you feel valued and a part of something, you do it with a smile on your face...
I loved Manny’s with all the photos on the wall. Used to see a lot of famous musicians there over the years. Made it a fun experience.
@@peterb1277 I never even got to go to Manny's 😪
@@PatPosseI live in NYC, and I went to Mannys pretty regularly from the late 80's, until they "closed". Back then it was a great experience to goto 48th Street Music Row. Eventually Sam Ash bought up most of the music stores on that block - including Mannys. From 99' until Mannys "closed" (09') they were under Sam Ash ownership.
When they moved from 48th to 34th street, that block looked desolate for years. Even though they are family run, they still shared that same corporate mentality of buying up all the competition. Ironically, now they can't make enough profit to justify keeping that flagship Manhattan "super store" on 34th street open.
Btw, I worked for both GC (07'-09') and Sam Ash (09'-11'). By then, music instrument sales were slumping, but GC and Sam Ash were too slow too adapt to the realities of on line competition, and ever increasing rents.
Music Row served a purpose back in the 70's and 80's, but even by the mid-80's a shift away from 48th St. had begun. And it never returned.
All the problems you experienced at Sam Ash are the same problems that Guitar Center has been going through for at least the last 15 years or longer. Their biggest problem was screwing their sales people and the customers. Which created a huge turn over in employees. Most people didn't stay more than a few months once they got tired of the managements excuses for the corporations crooked operations.
Totally! The amount of people I’ve seen come and go is ridiculous!
Yeah. And it didn't help that at most locations they only hired brain dead morons who can't answer basic questions, don't play an instrument, and have zero interest in music.
Retail is retail.
I’ll be the devils advocate here and say that’s the only people that applied for them jobs 😅
when i went to Guitar Center they seemed like they liked my visits and enjoyed there customers and at Sam Ash they could care less...
Brick and mortar shops are always about having things in stock. If they say to me we can get it for you, I walk and say I can get it for myself. Their main value will always be in having it today.
Exactly!!
Same here. If I can get it in stock at GC or Sweetwater, I'll go there.
Exactly. Thats why they need to have it there… that’s their only shot at your business.
I am patient enough to wait for things. Better to order something and pick it up at a store where I can take it back if I don't like it than to deal with getting stuff shipped to my house, having to make sure I am there when it gets delivered and shipping stuff back if I have a problem or I don't like something.
@@MrChopsticktech Valid point for sure, very rare these days for me that I have to ship "anything" back delivered. It is not that I would never order from a Brick and Mortar, just far more rare these days.
Sad I got my first “real” guitar (Martin D18) in 1969 from Sam Ash in NYC on music row. Still have it and play it also have the hand written receipt $250 case included.
Wow ! Thats amazing!! A piece of history right there!!
Music Row! I miss Manny's!
@@db_98765 I hear it was awesome...
wow thats incredible
That's cool. You must love that thing to pieces.
Great insight Pat, thanks man. My parents purchased my first guitar in 1983 at the 48th St store in Manhattan. It was the Japanese made Aria Pro II ZZ Deluxe in white; I was 13yrs old. Imagine waking in to church with this insane guitar in the 80's when heavy metal was considered the devils' s music. It was hilarious. I still have it. Thanks again for this post.
Thank you for that comment and for sharing that story! That rules!! Reminds me of when I used to wear cannibal corpse shirts in the 00s to a mostly hip-hop/reggeaton school in Miami lol. I’m sure we both got the same sorts of looks hahaha. That rules!
I worked there many years in 86-90 2000-2003 lots going on back then too. Pro audio never worked, stores were mess. But The Ash family were very kind, nice family.
Nice, yeah the Ash family was great. I only met one of the "kids" on the fourth generation but Sammy, Jerry and Richard were super cool.
What location were you in?
I never had issues as a customer, and I had purchased a decent amount of Pro Audio gear (for a 1-person company anyway) around 1999-2002. I guess it was location-dependent.
Totally. It depends on location, staff and even the day… we all have off days. That doesn’t make it right though…
Companies end up creating their own demise by bloated, inefficient, out of touch policies. I went into Sam Ash my first time a couple months ago just to pick up a set of guitar strings. 2 sales guys hanging around talking never once acknowledged me or asked to help. Then the Sales Mgr came out and started a sales meeting 10 ft away and I didn't want to interrupt and waited patiently while he tried to motivate his staff to make sales. Meanwhile, I'm still standing there and no one approached me or offered to help. Finally, after the meeting finished i had to go up and ASK a sales person for help so I could check out. One of the worst customer service experiences I've ever had.
That is RIDICULOUS! And having a staff meeting during open hours? 🤦🏻♂️
Sounds like the Clearwater location.
We purposely went to that store to keep them going even when SW was cheaper BUT their staff were just Not Cool and it made us sad.
They are closing. Sorry Dude.
@@edwardrichard5665 yup. There's an updated video to this topic. This video is over a month old...
Dude that was well done. Thanks. You explained it very concisely..
Thank you brother!! Some people said it was click bait so this validation is well appreciated 😁😁
Yeah. I agree. Both the content and presentation is excellent.
Thank you!! 😁😁
Very informative & appreciated view of the retail music industry.
Sam Ash is Music history (48th st) nyc.
Always sad to see things that were end up things that are real in these days . However everyone needs to keep up with the times otherwise this is what can happen.
Hope to hear they resurrect.
Btw. Nice backdrop Florida rain & I'm sure that wasn't editing ?? software.
Thank you very much!! Haha it was not added on post. It was pouring! Alas, I am in Buenos Aires at the moment (hence the newly acquired accent from listening and speaking Spanish 24/7 lol) but yeah I did remind me of rainstorms back home
I've been going to the Sam Ash on Sunset in Hollywood since 1986. I'm sad to hear it's closing. It was a happening store at the height of hair metal. I bought a lot of gear there and had my guitars worked on by some great techs.
I would have LOVED to visit the stores back then when metal was booming!! It’s hard to even find videos of that time online but I can’t help but wonder what it would’ve been like to walk the strip and just absorbe the energy and bump elbows with so many axe men!
Right across the street from Guitar Center. I'm surprised that store is closing.
That’s crazy.
I worked at Sam Ash store 02 in NY and you hit the nail on the head entirely. The “commission” structure was completely a sham. Most people in my store never made any commission. The people that did only ever saw it 1 or 2 months out of the year.
They sold it to you during the job interview as “minimum wage plus commission”, but it was really minimum wage with extra steps.
We also had mad issues with stock. A purchasing manager once told me “don’t order any PRS guitars, we owe them a lot of money. Try selling people on Epiphones and Gibsons”
There’s so much more i could say. How the extended service plans screwed over technicians, how the “family owned” nature led to nepotism, management just simply not listening, etc.
Exactly.. I see it wasn't really a matter of distance since you experienced the same issues back at store 02! I remember not stocking Gibsons for some contractual BS and the PRS shortage as well... that's not a good look on a store as big as SamAsh...
I lived within walking distance of 48th Street and shopped all the music stores on “music row”. 48th Street was convenient to a lot of the subway lines which made stopping by on my way home from work easy. The new location on 32nd street all the way over on the west side was far less convenient, so I only went there occasionally. It is hard to overstate the scale of the disastrous destruction of “music row” by the powers that be be in NYC. The cultural heart of the entire NYC band scene was cut out in the pursuit of real estate profits. Bloody shame….
Thank you so much for clearing the air about some of sam ash stores closings.❤
My pleasure! Thanks for watching and commenting 😁😁
This was a really amazing discussion of business strategies and KPI. I would love for corporate to engage all of the managers who think like you, and get them in an advisory committe to prevent this kind of stuff from repeating and growing out of control. They seem to have too many people in the wrong places, and not enough people in the right places. Keep up the updates. And good luck with that rain! Was that a hurricane? It sounded like you were in a car wash.
Thank you brother!! I appreciate the support and the positive comment... made my day! I doubt Sam Ash will come crawling back looking for old Pat but I do with them the best and I hope this is the beginning of a new plan moving forward. I'm gonna try to get in touch with some of my old peers and see what they think about this and if they have any updates to hook me up with! Thanks for watching and commenting and nope, it was not a hurricane, just heavy rain lol the water drops were huge , at least the house and car got cleaned hahaha!!!
In Florida, when it rains, it pours. Litteraly! It happens almost every day at about 2pm in the summer months. Huge raindrops! But it doesn't last long.
I live very very close to Sam Ash in Margate. He mentioned that store in this video. There is also a GC very near by too. In Coconut Creek. It's not far from Sam Ash. 10 minutes apart by car. Even faster on a motorcycle! I shop at both very often.
Peace.
Oh yeah… I remember daily showers 🤦🏻♂️ last July when I was there it rained EVERY DAY for two weeks straight…
@@PatPosse Correct!
Thank you so much for your brilliant autopsy, and analysis of the situation. As an independent promotor, Sam Ash, as well as GC have always remained supportive of my equipment expos. Any company would be lucky to have you in their employ! Loni Specter AMP SHOW, LA GUITAR SHOW- PEACE OUT!
Oh you are too kind! Thank you very much! I hope I can catch one of your expos one day 🤘🏻🤘🏻
What a great analysis. Really insightful. A reminder that businesses are often closed when the founder stays too long.
Thank you! I appreciate the positive comment! 😁
I just heard that all the stores are closing and the first video that comes up is from the perspective of the stores in my city 😂. This clears up a lot I've always wondered about how the stores were operated. I was at the miami lakes store about a month ago when they started the closing sales and im sad to see the brand go but I can't say I've had too many good times there. Trading something in was a whole day event for some reason and the guitars at dolphin mall were always tied down, and there was never anyone around in the guitar section. This also explains why when i bought an acoustic guitar there i had no choice but to buy the display model. Guitar center was always a better experience anyway and good riddance to that POS website.
I am sad to see it go but I’ve left Ash 10 years ago and from the comment section here I’ve found it’s only gotten worse… I guess it was a long time coming…
I worked sales for Ash from 1987 through 2000. In that time I worked in the Queens, NY store and I have noticed the store closing sign which is there as of today 3/23/'24. We ultimately went to full commissioned sales and I have to say, it was like giving yourself a raise as the business flourished. Ash also bought out Manny's Music on W.48th.
I also worked as a buyer and we were in the offices on W.48th Street (Music row). Ultimately we were moved to corporate in Hicksville, NY. I knew Jerry, Paul, David, Sammy, Richie and Bernice (Jerry's Wife and head of sheet music). Those were wonderful days and now three of them are gone. I can understand closing some stores and consolidating their holdings. I got plenty of gigs over the years through my association with Ash and it's a shame that the Manhattan store is scheduled for closing.
That's awesome! Is Bernice still around? (probably not...) she was also in charge of Lessons if I'm not mistaken. She was very opinionated (and mostly wrong) but I know she had our best interest at heart... same with most of the Ash family tbh. It's sad to see stores close but it might be time to condense down...
@@PatPosse Bernice passed some time before Jerry but I'm not sure exactly when. And yes, she was challenging though not in the stores much. Hey Pat, do you know Steve Price? He was the guitar manager in Queens but he went to Florida when it first opened. One last thing, my Brother in law owns property in California and he and his partners rent out space to Ash. I think it's the store in Torrance, CA. I mentioned to him about the closings and he said they were called to renegotiate the price of Ash's store rental lease.
Wow that’s cool! As far as Steve Price… I’ve heard of him, it sounds very familiar.. he might have been the Store Manager at the Margate location, store 32 I believe… if that’s the case then yes! I’ve talked to him several times.
@PatPosse Only, one store did lessons in NYC. That also hurt business
That sucks… was there any particular reason why? Maybe there weren’t any room for them… or was it a union thing? Lol
Thanks for sharing this post
I was a dept manager at store 4 Forest Hills NY 04-09.
I bought a Godin Multiac for myself Christmas 2023 from store 7 Manhattan.
Very light traffic in both stores for the last few years.
I think Bklyn is still open for now.
Sad to see my favorite music stores close.
Thank you for watching and commenting!! Glad to see at least Brooklyn survive. I am surprised at the Manhattan store closing but no business + sky high rent prices = failure.
Fantastic observations and assessment of the Sam Ash business. Everything you reviewed is applicable to every retailer in the country, musical or not. Should be used as a case study. I think you have a future career in consulting. Great job.
Thank you very much! I highly doubt it lol 🤣. I would be open to it though 😁😁.
Thanks for watching and commenting!!
Miami Lakes was my shopping store too 😢. Thank you for all your help when working there and also for all this information. I didn't know there was so much burocracy behind the scenes.
Happy to have helped!! Thanks for watching and commenting 😁🤘🏻
As an ex-employee of Guitar Center, everything you have mentioned is going on at GC as well! The smaller stores are hurting with employees that are only there to earn a paycheck but have zero knowledge of gear. They try to up-sale shit that you have no need for and also...employees that seem to have recently graduated from highschool.🤣🤣🤣
That also happens and will hurt their credibility big time… remember Best Buy trying to pull that shit? How’d that go for them? You need to have knowledgeable staff to help out and get the customer the service they need, otherwise, what’s the advantage over buying online?
True. And it seems like their stores are always short staffed. It takes forever to get anyone to help you. I have walked out a couple of times because I couldn't find someone to help me. And yeah, you are right, GC used to have knowledgeable staff. Now it seems like they hire anyone to work there.
@@nerychristian it’s hard to hire people with knowledge when the pay sucks! Another issue I had was for example: if I sold a Black Les Paul Studio, it would get replaced with exactly the same guitar. They wouldn’t send something else instead.
@@luigigunner I mean, i don't expect them to be pro musicians. But at least know what the names of the products are.
Dude you nailed it!! I had that same convo with my then Manager Dave. They would just refill the same order over and over. Always the same guitars because they were “proven to sell” but that drove people away… there was never anything new or exciting
(Lord, I had to watch this twice.)
Wow. This explains sooooooo much. I'm close to the Miani Lakes store. I asked myself all those questions. Thanks for finally clearing it up.
If the 4th gen doesn't understand that you can use the internet to your benefit, it's going to be tough.
Resolve to make that happen.
Thank you brother!! Glad to help and even more glad you enjoyed the video!! Thanks for watching it (twice!) and commenting!
@PatPosse No worries. I've passed it on to a few friends because we all had, over the years, the same questions 🤣🤣
You couldn't recommend a local guitar luthier or tech that adjusts necks, do you?
I figure it couldn't hurt to ask.
The best for you.
Thank you very much for sharing!! The good luthiers I knew are gone now… maybe check out the one on Walt Grace, I’ve heard good things but I have no experience with his work personally
I used to shop at Sam Ash in Forest Hills NY from 1992-1994. Store was filled with angry hair metal musicians that were upset because their bands were failing because grunge was taking over.I turned 18 in 1994 and got $10,000 from a lawsuit when I was a kid. I was more than happy to drop every penny at Sam Ash. I wanted a Black Tama Artstar 2, a bunch of Zildians, heavy duty stands and hard cases for everything. The prick salesman actually said " Oh, another Dave Grohl wanna be" After a few choice words back to him, me and my 10 Grand left and went to Long Island Drum Center in Flushing and made them very happy.
Good for you!! I have a similar story were I went to GC and asked for the guitar Brian May was holding on a picture (little did I know there weren't very many replicas around) and the salesman scoffed at me and said "you'll never have a guitar like that".
I've had 4 and kept the best one.
I hope he reads this one day lol
Pat!! Great video! Good to see you doing what you do. Just found out that Sam Ash is completely going bankrupt. Very sad but we all new it was inevitable. All stores are closing. And just to put the nail in the coffin, GC just opened up a new store in Hialeah. What a kick in the ass! Take care brother!
Steve-O!!!!!!! Dude, no way!! First of all, I never thought I’d get a comment from you, that rules!! Thanks for that… I would love to catch up! I heard you left a while back and I was surprised to find that out. I know how hard you worked to get to the top and I also know that once you got there it was a crap fest beyond repair… (and that you had no backing from corporate). That really sucks that SamAsh is going under… I suspected it might be but I guess I didn’t want to believe it. Apparently carrying on the legacy and its heritage wasn’t worth the effort at this point… sad times indeed.
Anyways, hit me up on IG like a man if you want! I’d love to know what you are up to nowadays!
My friend and I use to go to Sam Ash in Brooklyn in the 90s and when I got into rock music I wanted to learn how to play guitar..so Sam Ash was the place I went to get my first guitar. It was a cool place to be just to learn music and just watch other people jam.
Fast forward I work right by the Manhattan location and I was shocked to see the store closing sign. I hate seeing that especially when these stores has been around for years…but yeah Manhattan rents are high as hell and I’m not sure if the high demand for instruments are the same as in the early days…still sad to see them go but I hope they still find away to keep the name around and continue to sell and be a resource to those coming into wanting to learn music and play instruments.
Every now and then I love to go in and walk around play the piano or pick up a guitar…definitely sad to hear they closing stores…
Hey man... I would just love to have seen the stores back then!! Yeah it's pretty sad but at least I don't think they are entirely away (for a while...).
Fascinating inside view--thanks for sharing. I bought both my guitars online from Sam Ash, but bought plenty of strings and accessories from the local brick-and-mortar store, which is now closing. The one bright spot for me is that I have my eye on a couple of guitars on the wall and am hoping prices drop as the store gets closer to closing.
Hey man! Thanks for watching and commenting! A lot got edited out in the interest of keeping it concise and interesting lol. 😂 sad so many are closing 🤦🏻♂️
All very good points. I hope this is actually a sign of their plans to move forward leaner and stronger
Thanks man! Yeah, for sure… I hope this is part of a new and better strategy…
@@PatPosse yep 🤞🤞🤞
Let’s see what the new generation can do 🤘🏻
God 🙏 is gonna work it out some where and some how. Put it in God hands .
Great overview Pat....thank you...your in the loop and I appreciate the inside info. You answered many questions that I wondered about. For what it's worth I hope they see your channel ! and they will learn how easy it is to be disconnected from hands on to corporate level ! For the record most of my Big purchases have been from Sam Ash and their is a reason why. MD
Thank you very much Michael ! I am glad you enjoyed it. I hope they don’t take offense if they ever do what it lol. I’m glad to finally read about someone who really enjoys shopping at SamAsh!
Very interesting. Not surprising though. CEO's and such are often times isolated from reality and this is what happens.
Hi there... totally! I think it got too big too fast and they just couldn't keep up. It got out of hand... AND... our Regional Manager (cool dude I suppose) was NOT even from our region, he just moved down there for the gig...
@@PatPosseIt is too bad. I've found Sam Ash to be a wonderful alternative to GC
Oh, me too! I am team SamAsh all the way!!
Excellent Information and Presentation. The Local Sam Ash (Edison, NJ) is closing and that makes Guitar Center the best choice for my future Music Needs. You sound like you have a great understanding of the Sam Ash Business, I hope you are still in the Music Industry, as you appear to care as much about the Customer as the Business, which is a balance that few commit to and then it hurts both.
Thank you!!! I am not. I managed another store after in which the owner cared even less about what I had to say and gave up lol. I started focusing on my studio, my band and session work and then covid hit. While on quarantine I started doing zoom lessons and this channel. And that’s pretty much where I’m at now. Hoping to make a move at the end of the year. Having my own Music Store is a dream of mine but it’s far ahead still…
Thanks for watching and commenting!
I believe you would do well running your own Store. I know it is a large undertaking and it takes resources, but some people have a good perspective and knowledge, and that combination is quite rare and should be encouraged.
Thank you very much bud, you are too kind… I hope I can do it, I gotta take care of a couple things first and maybe then focus on that
All corporations are working hard to disconnect the consumer from both their money and the ability to get accountability from the company. They want a computer screen between you and their business.
True. Lower overhead and operative costs=more profit in lieu of customer service.
No truer words ever. Profitability without responsibility or accountability.
@@OakLawnSpeedShop Exactly. Sad though...
truer than ever now that they have price fixing - they don't even have to negotiate price.
Retail is retail. Selling instruments doesnt change that. It only makes musicians hate the industry lol
Excellent analysis. Thanks for giving us your side of the whole story.
No, Thank YOU for watching and commenting! Glad to see you enjoyed it 😁.
Great video! I worked for Guitar Center when it was privately owned and only a dozen or so stores in the early 90s. I worked in their advertising department. I always like Sam Ash more. The used gear part is the hardest blow. If you buy new gear, you don't necessarily need to play it first, but used gear its pretty critical.
Nice!! I'm, sure you got a thing or two to add to my video! I've always wondered how the Advertising Department worked on other (better advertised) music companies... At Ash it was next to null and pretty bad when they did run ads... Used Gear is definitely overlooked at Ash and from what I've gathered, they haven't gotten any better (and might not)
It would have been cool if I met you while I was at Sam Ash, I'm 100% sure I'd get the help I need. So sad that you cared too much, but not the business you worked in.
My dream is to run my own Guitar Shop. I hope that eventually happens… 😁😁
Excellent job! You have cleared up the situation for me. I have been a bit anxious since the announcement because I placed an order for a back-ordered amp right before the news came out.
Hey man! Thanks for watching and commenting! Glad you enjoyed it. Don’t worry, your amp will get to you safe and sound! Which store location did you order it in? Do you happen to know if that particular one is closing?
@@PatPosse Hey Pat. It is the Nashville store and I don't know if it is closing, but I doubt it.
I sure hope not! Nashville is Music City!!!
Had an awful interaction at the Charlotte NC store. Was using the enclosed music room to play a half stack with cash in my pocket to potentially buy. A sales person on the floor trying to sell to two parents a starter guitar and amp told me to turn it down so much it might as well be turned off. The doors were closed to the room. I bought nothing and walked out and never returned again. They favored introduction lessons and cheap gear and the quality of gear declined as did their customer service for gigging pros. I can’t say I’ll miss Sam ash.
Wow, that blows. They probably assumed that sale was a sure sale and yours wasn't. We didn't have those isolated booths but we always told people to blast it for a few minutes then turn it down. Also, we would tell everyone else to brace themselves cause it was about to get noisy!. Let 'er rip and then back to business as usual...
One thing was always stressed though, don't ever assume someone is NOT buying!!
I worked at the Franklin Mills (Philadelphia) location over a decade ago. Sales associates get paid commission, and we got paid more commission to sell the cheaper house brand drum kits and whatnot vs a Pearl, Tama or Yamaha kit. We would get our eardrums beat up daily for not selling, meanwhile the foot traffic was mainly people who had no cash or desire to buy anything musical. It was far from an ideal situation or location.
Yeah cause it was based off of GP (gross profit) and the cheap house brands had huge margins. I think GC actually paid commission on the sale total and not the items…
@@PatPosse that would have been a more reasonable way of doing things. Sell a $2000 Pearl kit and get $10 commission. Sell a Groove Percussion kit for $399 and I’d get $35 commission. I believe electronic kits like Roland had decent commission pay, but that was about it, and we didn’t get ANYONE looking to buy a $5000 electronic kit. All we got was kids wanting to come in and make a ruckus.
Yeah I remember that and having arguments with staff that was pushing the $60 Carlo Robelli Classicals (at 20 dollar commission) instead of the $99 Ibanez (that made us $4)...
I used to hang out at Sam Ash in the 70's by today's standards every guitar they had is a priceless classic now
True. It’s amazing isn’t it?
I really wanted to like Sam Ash as its closer, but the one by me gets destroyed in every way by Guitar Center. The Sam's here never has any good Rhoads, or good Vs or any guitar that they might think could get damaged. Its prob the customers fault but I have seen very few guitars above low-mid budget here for most brands except for Gibson that are very high on the wall. If you ask them for help they just tell you to grab it yourself. I almost fumbled one of the guitars but luckily no accident happened as it was too high for me. The one or two people there just don't care about helping anyone and they have such poor selection and not very competitive prices.
I don't know this might be why its shutting stores. Reverb and and online buying is also always available.
That’s sad… they might be underpaid or under appreciated… and that’s why they act like that. Then again, management might just be too lazy to care lol
Thanks for the info and quick cut editing to get to the point....very nice
Thanks for noticing… a lot of details were left out in the interest of keeping it short and concise. Especially because there was no script or even bullet points 😅 lol
Great job man. This was very informative. I used to frequent the Garden City one quite often when I was in HS, but that was many moons ago, and I’m now in N. Florida. Sadly they are closing the one closest to so we’ll only be left with Guitar Center. The customer service was always top notch at Sam Ash so I’ll miss that, but as you pointed out in this video their website is God awful. Now that I won’t have a local shop to visit I’m hoping they address that issue so I can still support them.
Hey man that’s awesome thanks for supporting Ash! (Or at least thinking about it lol). I wonder, is there any mom and pop stores around? Where in N FL are you located? I’m hoping to move back and I am looking for a city that’s NOT Miami! Too expensive and way too hot all the time…
Ps, awesome Live at Pompeii Gilmour Shot!
I brought a Cannonball Sax from that location. About 17 yrs ago. Class act back then. Sad too see the business model go under. Check out Nashville, I’m relocating this summer. Btw still have that sax as well.
Maybe you bought it from my boy Cristobal! He was awesome and knew saxes inside out!
@@PatPossecome to ST PETE. I grew up here and it is the PLACE TO BE.
Not Tampa, not Clearwater but St. Petersburg.
Lots of momsnpop stores hanging around for years.
Very well done & concise Lifetime Full Time Music Person Here This analysis should be required viewing for anyone in the music sales division of any & all companies Suerte por todas Good Luck to all!!
Thank you very much bro! you are too kind! I'm surprised at how many people enjoyed the video and took the time to comment on it to let me know they did. It exceeded all my expectations!
@@PatPosse If I come to Miami I look you up! Peace!
Sure thing! Let me know in advance as I am not always there lol. Follow me on IG for a more day to day feed 😉
What Pat's saying makes 100% sense. I have worked in similar situations throughout my career and know exactly what he's talking about. Family owned businesses can have there upsides, but a lot of them seem to suffer from the same issues. They dont listen to their employees and tend to micro manage everything. They are also out of touch with their own business and clientele, running it like they did 30 years ago. Hopefully the next generation does the right thing.
Thanks man! Definitely... it's a shame but I understand it, it's hard to give up your baby, more so if your family name is attached to it... but yeah, they need to realize that some times they just don't know better... especially when they are so out of their element. They have the means... they should hire people who know what they are doing and focus on just that instead of hiring one guy and stretching him thin with different responsibilities...
My brother told me about Sam Ash. It sounded like a cool place to window shop. It’s sad but hopefully, like you said, they’ll open doors somewhere else!
I wonder... I know rent is high in Manhattan but maybe they can move into a smaller, better laid out property...
Great job, Pat in explaining it all. Liked the history of SA too. Well done. I always enjoyed the warmer vibe at the SA stores in Manhattan, Miami and Sarasota . Sorry to see them go. Hopefully the online store will modernize and prosper. Again, very well done presentation.
Thank you very much Ken! Glad you enjoyed it 😁. Sadly, a month after I recorded this video SamAsh announced they will be closing all stores and website unless someone buys the company and name out as far as I know, that hasn’t happened yet but 🤞… I’ll definitely record something if that does happen!!
Thanks for watching and commenting 😁🤘🏻
An interesting story of a company adopting business practices unsuited to its industry, and failing to keep up with the times. Thanks for posting this. I would not otherwise have understood it. I have ordered from the online competitors you showed, all with excellent results. Although I now live in the Northeast, Sam Ash territory, the name didn't cross my mind for online purchases, and I only recall one purchase in the Manhattan store.
Hi there! Of course you never even thought about buying online from them, they have next to zero online presence! You can’t even find them on UA-cam! Their channel is bust, they don’t sponsor any videos (that I’ve seen…) they are barely even mentioned. Thats something else they are overlooking: UA-camrs. They are the best advertisers you can have now… get them to the stores, give them some swag, pay them for an ad, have then mention you at least… but no… SA would rather keep doing business the same as in the 70s… 🤦🏻♂️
Thanks for watching and commenting!!
Boy, what a mess. Like you said, no surprise this was going to happen. Thank you for the insights! Too bad they didn’t listen at the time.
Hey bud, thanks for watching and commenting! I wouldn’t say my ideas would have saved the stores or even have helped but, if they didn’t listen to me I am sure they didn’t listen to other people who may have had bigger plans and better ideas either… and THOSE might have saved the stores or even made SamAsh #1!
I know not all stores are created equal but I love my local Sam Ash. They’ve been a staple in the music industry for years and it’s sad they’re closing so many locations.
Nice! Happy to read that! What location is this?
Great breakdown man! Having to sell any type of “used” or “pre-owned” gear in a corporate setting like that is always especially tricky. First, you need a staff that knows their given industry well, along with having working knowledge on various manufacturing trends. Second, people and higher-ups in the corporate office need to be able to facilitate any laws/regulations/policies. In a corporate setting; this is where companies often centralize this role. Unfortunately, this is the part where the company is usually understaffed and under resourced. I understand why they have to do this, but, it’s too bad when the profits start bottle necking outside the front door. I find this is a niche market where a family business can do extremely well though dealing in used gear or merchandise.
I agree used gear can be a great deal of business but the way they do it it’s a bit counterproductive…
Love music, play drums, never been to a Sam Ash store although I have heard about them. Your video is excellent for what was a down fall not for just Sam Ash but could almost be applied to so many family business trying to expand. Thank you for making this.
Thank you for watching! Glad you enjoyed it… maybe you’ll visit a SamAsh in the future!
Thanks for the history & explanation, I brought my LP conga’s, various guitars & amps there🎼🎸🪘🎶
Glad you enjoyed it !
Good explanation of what's happening there. I worked at the Dolphin Mall store and had a lot of fun, even with the low pay rate.
Hell yeah! I remember you from Dolphin, I can’t deny it was great fun! When did you leave?
Guitar shops are like sporting good stores, they are always empty and its embarrassing to be there sometimes.
YES!! Especially when they are called “Dicks”! Hahaha sorry I couldn’t help it 🤣
I worked shipping and receiving at Store 57. The biggest issue that was never talked about there was how aggressively corporate tried to push house brands. The amount of Michael Kelly guitars I unboxed was staggering and none of the ones I ever played felt half as nice as an entry level ESP or Ibanez. Samson headphones lining the walls. Not all of the house brands were bad products, but by prioritizing having entry level gear in stock we indirectly pushed everyone to drive up to Sweetwater where they have more than 2 SM7Bs in stock at any given time.
I left before that time and didn’t see that happen first hand but now that you mention it it makes a lot of sense… I remember them steering in that direction with the Carlo Robelli and Groove Percussion stuff back when I was at Ash…
I remember appying for a job at the 48th street location back in 1998. Everything was good until the manager told me about the pay, just as you mentioned, you have to go abouve the pay rate in order to collect on commissions. Also he wanted me to work 6 days a week including weekneds. He said to me "we are all musicians so every one is expected to work on weekends if needed". I actually never worked there once he told me that. I felt it could be difficult to pass that threshold weekly given the amount of salespeople they had.
The guy who was hiring says ‘we are all musicians, so everyone is expected to work on the weekends?’ That translates to; ‘I haven’t been a real musician in so long that I forgot what it really is to be an authentic musician.’
Mega music stores like these are going to continue to slowly fade away, unless they get honest with themselves, and admit that a business like Sweetwater has been going in the right direction with the better policies that they have been working with. They all have to realize that many of the musicians who apply for a sales position, can potentially have better ideas about how to advance their business, than many of the guys who are sitting around at corporate headquarters.
All things you mentioned are spot on. I remember every weekend there was an issue with someone playing… what was worse is that since management hated that and wouldn’t give you a day off “‘cause you had a gig” people would just call in sick on the day of instead of telling you in advance so you could schedule staff and meeting accordingly… and yeah, playing and instrument and being a musician, and being an active musician are very different things…
I got my '83 Gretsch kit from Sam Ash in Paramus, NJ. The service and price were better than great! My salesman, Tom Sontag was so helpful and made sure i was happy with the kit, going so far as to contact Gretsch directly about some of my concerns. I played that kit for over 30 years! I also picked up a lot of cymbals and hardware there that i'm still using. I used to travel to Sam Ash in Manhattan to buy stuff in the early days when it was the only store. It's good to hear they're not closing up.
That’s awesome! Happy to read some positive comments about Ash 😁! And good on that Gretsch for providing such great value!
Thanks for watching and commenting.
Sam Ash on 34th street and in Queens are closing. I went not too long ago. They’re liquidating everything.
Damn.
I purchased an insturment and had a serious defect and my Salesman took care of it for me on the spot with a new but different insturment that I have owned over 3 years and enjoy. They even provided a free pro set up that was very very well done. Sorry to see them go. When you have issues its great to have a place to go that backs up their products.
happy to see they did right by you my dude! I’m sad to see them go too.
@@PatPosse The guys at the Indianapolis store all were solid playing musicians and knew the local scene. They would have serious well - known musicians come by. They used to have about everything that you could try and I felt their quality was better than GC. But sadly I can see the changes over the last few years. The store is kept dark, you can tell the product is all low - end, the store is way too big. They still have a few of the good guys there but I don't think they will be around much longer. Guitar Center is around the corner and that store is really rough - no way I would buy an insturment off their wall. They do have some long-term guys on staff hanging on but I think GC is in trouble. Everyone I talk to thinks Sweetwater located in Fort Wayne is the way to go I have ordered from them and they are very good. With the big boxes in trouble my local guitar shop and real luthier has picked up business he is awsome and glad to see him doing well.
That’s great for him (your luthier). I agree with everything you’ve mentioned. I guess it’s just a shift in the way we do business as a society. I’d rather go to the store and pick up an axe but amps, pedals and accessories I could buy online with no problems…
Btw. Did you know that some SamAsh stores actually preferred NON musicians for hire?? They claimed it was easier to deal with and they wouldn’t ask to leave for tours or ask for weekends off for gigging. Also, they would not be as interested on the stuff on the walls and counters so they wouldn’t get distracted by the shinny gear! Counterpart to that was the fact that they didn’t know a Humbucker from a single coil or P90 🤦🏻♂️.
@@PatPosseThat is so interesting - and I can see it both ways on sales people and I feel exactly as you do on insturments versus accessories like pedals.
@@stevedaulton9655 haha great minds think alike 😁😉
This video was randomly recommended to me and I cannot believe I found you Pat ! I used to be a regular back in my highschool days at the Sam Ash by the palmetto and you were always so informative and very cool. When you left I would always ask the employees " What happened to pat" . Cool to see you doing youtube now .
THAT'S AWESOME!! Glad to have been helpful and that there's a fond memory of me back there!! I'm sure it was my pleasure to help you out bud! And yes, I am trying out the UA-cam thing.. I've been doing it for about 3 years.. I had my studio going, and a healthy amount of students, plus touring but then COVID hit and here we are lol. Lessons and recordings came to halt, touring was not feasible anymore so I decided to give this a shot... It's been a long, hard journey but finally a video blew up.. I don't see it pushing any of my other videos up but at least the fact that a video of mine can do well is a nice pat in the back (no pun intended lol). Are you still rocking out? I'd love to catch up and know who it is I'm talking to! look me up on IG, same name!
@@PatPosse Yeah I'll hit you up on instagram but obviously your not gonna remember me haha you always saw hundreds of people a day. But yeah of course I'm still playing guitar it's been a passion of mine for a very long time . One of my coworkers texted me 2 weeks ago on a weekend that the store was closing down and I wasn't surprised to be honest, every time I would walk in to the store there was barely any guitars hanging and lots of the walls were empty so it was inevitable. My coworker also said a tech told him that they're building a guitar center in Hialeah and that the same tech is going to move to that location. Sad to see it go but it isss what it isssssss.
I just read that on another comment! That’s crazy!! I guess GC will pick up the pieces… I just hope they make it a tiny, well oiled machine. Sam Ash #33 had a lot of potential but it didn’t have the numbers to back up its size and upper management didn’t really care to make it any better…
@@PatPosse Yeah dude really sad to see it go down but can't help who doesn't want to be helped.
Very true. There are not so blind as those who will not see…
Bummer though.
I don’t know if I already asked you but if you ever do make it to the store, will you shoot me some pics?
The Sam Ash on Colonial Blvd in Orlando is closing, and I'm super happy about that. Every single person, except for the live sound guy, are jerks. I only buy high end gear, and I couldn't get a single person in that store to help me, except the live sound guy.
Sadly that seems to be the norm at Sam Ash stores according to most comments… 😔
Great piece! Knew some people back in the day, who loved working there….but some the info you presented makes my think they were just young and eager. It Wes also before the expansions. However, I have heard they have excellent health benefits. 🤷🏻♂️
Hi man, thanks!! Must have been before my time… I don’t remember any health benefits 😅lol
Great summary and history, Pat. Fascinating to hear how much goes into running a big musical instrument store. Thanks for the very interesting details and how well you explained everything. I actually bought my first serious electric guitar at the 48th St. Manhattan location in 1973 - a Gibson L6-S. I think that was the only Sam Ash store at the time, maybe.
Thank you Bianca! Glad you enjoyed it!! Killer axe!! Do you still own it?
@@PatPosseYes, I still have it, and it's still a solid beast of a guitar - certainly very well-made. It's been through a lot - we did many gigs in the late 1970's/early 1980's at lots of NYC clubs (CBGB, Max's Kansas City, The Ritz, Kenny's Castaways., Folk City, Irving Plaza, Great Guildersleeves, The Other End, and many more) several times with my old band, The Maroons. I had also loaned the guitar to my brother (Rudolph Grey) for several years, who had a NYC band called The Blue Humans, and he put it through the paces of gig life in 1980's NYC. Somehow, I got it back from him : ). My band, The Maroons had one single back, in 1979. Never got a record deal, but, looking back, that's probably why I still have my hearing! Here's a song from our single (the photo is us playing at CBGB):
ua-cam.com/video/FEBvlH80V-0/v-deo.html
NICE!!!
I bought my first guitar at their 48th st NYC store in the late 70s only a few doors from Mannys. Back in the day European friends would buy a Strat or a Les Paul there every time they were in NYC and flip it for twice the price when they got off the plane back home. They never quite got the hang of competing on the internet. Thank you Sam Ash for the old-school good deals though!
Lol I’ve done that as well 😁. There’s a great story Cesar G. (Gibson’s current president) tells about buying an Epiphone, taking it to Argentina, selling it for double and buying his first Gibson with that money on his next trip to the US! Awesome stuff.
Wow if management does not listen to this guy, they are crazy. Pat does a great job to provide an insider analysis of what's going wrong with the business and what can be fixed or improved. That's gold to a business owner, especially if they are going thru critical times. I personally like the stores, I hope the new generation of owners act quickly and not only save the business but make it even better, everybody deserves it. Good job Pat
Thank you very much!! I doubt they care about what Pat has to say... they didn't care then, I don't think they'll care now. Although, there's new people in charge now... But alas, I doubt they'll even come across this video LOL. That being said, I would LOVE to help Sam Ash out any way I can...
@@PatPosse Hi Pat, if there is a new generation of owners that want to save and improve the business, you bet they will see your video sooner or later. You seem to care for the business and you gave them a good advice with detail informaiton. Just wait and see. 🙂
That would be awesome honestly! But even if they watch it and take any of it into consideration I will consider it a win!
I had years worth of memories hanging out at the Forest Hills Sam Ash, Queens NY...and over time would go into various stores and they looked shabby, dirty floors, lack of inventory, you could see the lack of motivation in the workers. Guitar Center stores were a breath of fresh air. Always clean with tons of gear to try out. And now with Sweetwater...how could a chain like Sam Ash survive? Great video, Pat!
Your comment makes me sad but it only proves my points. I think it just got out of hand and they weren’t able to keep up with their stores, staff and technology. I hope downsizing and the new blood being in some much needed changes to the chain!
Same here! I spent a ton of time in the Forest Hills store.... decades. So many memories. I started hanging out there as a teen back when guys like Steve Price and Alan (forget his last name, but you'd know him if I described him) were salesmen. Steve wound up playing guitar for Thor and then went on to manage the main store on 48th St (I think he was one of the managers). Coincidentally, years later I moved to Forest Hills and was in walking distance. They definitely had that... "you gonna buy it?" mentality when I first started going in there as a kid but over time they knew I was for real and welcomed me into the circle, so to speak. A couple of them kept telling me I should work there, but as much as I liked hanging out there it didn't seem like the best job. I spent even more time on 48th St, but that's a whole other can of worms and opportunities.
@@Darth.Shredder I used to tease Alan and call him Foghorn Leghorn. I think Baby Huey even came out once...he was a shredder though! I remember Steve, and Mike (Facebook friends with him).
@@ivsiguitarist LOL... so, you knew what I meant when I said you'd know Alan if I described him :). Alan was a cool kat. I also remember a Mike... I don't want to say his last name in public but it started with a "W".
I worked at the Forrest Hills store from 09'-11'. (I also worked at the GC in Queens from 07'-09')
I like that they have a realistic flat shipping rate of $12.50
That IS cool! and If dropped shipped to a store it used to be free. I don't know if it is anymore...
Thank you for this very informative and beautiful video. Sadly my SamAsh store here in Paramus. New Jersey closed down also. I got my Gibson LesPaul Classic there back in 2012 and a lot of other stuff like amps, pedals, acoustic guitars and other accessories. 😢 we’re left with Guitar Center whose workers also seem not to care anymore. So now online is the best bet.
I'm sorry to hear that... Sounds like a great place for a small mom and pop.... There's not a lot competition apparently! Bummed they are closing out so many Ash stores, but it is what it is... GC is not known for their CC...
Thanks for watching and commenting! psyched so many people liked it!!
Thank you for the response. Subbed to you by the way! 😊
My pleasure and thanks for supporting !! 😁🤘🏻
Wow!!! Thanks for the inside scoop! I use to practically live in the old Brooklyn Kings Highway store and then the Brooklyn Flatbush Avenue store. It was exciting to hang out in the 48th Street Manhattan Store, especially during the “48th Street Heyday!!! Manny’s, 48th Street Custom Guitars etc.). Those were the days!!! ❤️🎶❤️
Man I wish I could back in time and just check that out and hang out there for a bit…
I’m from Philadelphia and my first experience with Sam Ash was in the 90s at the Cherry Hill NY store. Every few months they would have a drum clinic featuring one of world’s greatest drummers. I never missed a clinic! 👍🏽 They opened two more stores in the region. Eventually most of the other music stores in Philadelphia and surrounding areas closed down!☹️ Now Sam Ash in King Prussia is closing down.😕 Such is life. Well I guess I better get over there and catch some sales!!!😜
Love Philly!!
Man, such is life indeed... It makes me Sad that SamAsh is closing down stores but it makes me twice as sad when a local shop closes down. Whenever I see an abandoned local shop or "out of business" signs I always think, "There goes someone else's dream"...
I’m really sad about the Manhattan store closing. We made a point to go there, even buying things we could have bought closer to home just because we enjoyed visiting it so much. The musicians who work and study in NYC must be very sad to lose their music shop.
I am still surprised but apparently they haven’t been doing great for a long time…
That pay structure is horrendous. The owners should be ashamed of themselves especially since they were told what would sell in the stores (based on its market) but insisted on keeping everything cookie cutter.
Yeah… the “we know better” mentality…
You vid is on pace with excellent delivery. I will miss Sam Ash out her in West Hollywood California 😦😭
Thank you very much!! Glad you enjoyed it, i appreciate the positive comment 😁
A very nice, succinct, analysis.. Too bad about the SA chain, but very often over-expansion causes those types of problems. At least they (4th gen) are starting to recognize the e-business weaknesses and will hopefully address them wisely.
Thank you very much!! Yes, at least I see them acknowledging the issue and trying to do something about it…
I was on the "genesis" crew that opened the Miami Lakes (Palmetto) Shop in 1994. We built the white walls and the basically the entire shop from the inside. It was a great shop back in the day and a destination retail experience for its time. Being family owned is always a problem as decision making is always centralized and takes forever for anything to get done. Sad to hear that it is closing. MI retail in general is shifting at great speed especially with Internet access to generate sales. If an MI establishment doesn't employ Omni channels to support sales - Money is being left on the table to your competitor. Hopefully, the new generation of Ash's can pivot in this atmosphere to turn the brand around.
Oh wow that’s awesome!!! You guys did a great job! Our Store (Palmetto and 57th) was amazing. It was huge but well distributed! I know it had been remodeled since ‘94 but still. That’s awesome… I remember asking when did that store become a Sam Ash (I remember being told it was a furniture store before) but no one gave me a sure answer. Now I know! Too bad is going away but I can’t say I’m surprised… thanks for commenting!!
I don't love the Sam Ash closures bc I live in NYC and did really like the Manhattan store at a time, but I went in there one last time the other day, and grabbed a blonde figured 335 w/ a headstock repair at an awesome price, they are very open to negotiation rn
Also have one of those 90th anniversary candy apple red strats they did back in 2014 and I bought new, it's my favorite strat.
would u happen to know when the 34th st location actually closes?trying to make it to the sales haha
Those CAR Strats are killer!!
No clue.
I bought my first fender p bass from Jerry Ash. He was an awesome person. I think your assessment is spot on regarding their internet approach. Their Jam sessions were a big hit for a while. The last store I visited in PA was deserted. I hope the new generations of Ashes does their homework!
Jerry was a cool cat for sure! I hope the new gen kills it and turns it around! Thanks for watching and commenting… I love to read about people who interacted with the Ash family or their experiences at the stores…
Store 33 was my second home! Speaking of tourists, I remember all the folks from the islands coming in and buying huge stock of sound equipment, instruments, Ext. Sad to see it go!
For sure!! They were mostly pro audio but yeah, they would stock up big time!!
My uncle who lived in NYC at the time, 20 years ago bought me my first Ibanez in Sam Ash. I had so much fun in that shop that day.
Isn't that what it's all about?
@@PatPosse really is. Was magical
That's the kind of thing we can only find at local shops nowadays...
Great insight! Thank you!
Thank you for watching and commenting 😁🤘🏻
I have heard that rents in some areas are high. However, I just don’t understand why the two SA stores in Phila area are closing, I figured maybe one. Both King of Prussia, PA and the store in Northeast Philly are closing. Heading north, Edison, NJ and of course NYC. That’s a big hole that they leave from Phila are to NYC.
Wow! Thats crazy… maybe the contracts are up? I can’t justify that either but I suppose there’s a good reason behind it…
Pat, forgot about the other store in NJ, just across the river from Philly. Cherry Hill, NJ. Not sure if the hammer will fall.
😮😮. Wow… that’s nearly all the NE stores!
Customer Service killed them in the Edison NJ store - never had what i was looking for - they would say we can order it for you!!! I want it now not wait another 2 weeks!!!!
At that point we are just competing with online stores. Having it there is KEY
Wow, that was a lot of very concentrated info. Very good video. Sadly, I never visited a Sam Ash..... now I'll never have the chance.
Why not? They are only closing 18 stores… there’s plenty left to visit! 😁😁
As someone who also goes to the Miami Lakes store, i find it heartbreaking
I haven’t been back and I don’t think I’ll make it… a couple of my buddies and ex co-workers went in and said the same thing. Depressing…
The forest hills store in Queens, NY is also closing - been around since before high school. I'm going to miss them!
That’s the worst part, the experiences and memories left behind…
When I was 14 years old. Paul ash personally took my bass amp trade in and gave me a great price on a new amp which I still have now. The store In Brooklyn was actual called Paul ash instead of Sam ash. It must of been only owned by Paul. It burnt down in 1993 and they reopened in a new location in Brooklyn and used the Sam ash name. Only good experience at the store.
Oh wow!! That’s a great nugget I didn’t know about! Sucks that that was the only good experience you had… 🤦🏻♂️. But Paul Ash store… that’s awesome
I work at the Philadelphia store now and everything you mentioned is still the same. Our store will be closed by the end of May.
Im sorry to hear that bro. Any prospects for the future?
Hey Pat...new subscriber here, after watching your Boss DS-1 video today. Greetings from Ohio...keep up the great work. Cheers.
Thank you for your support brother!! Welcome to the channel!! Do you know if the Columbus and Cincinnati stores are going to stay open by any chance?
I am a Jazzmaster and Jaguar guy. Over the years I have bought a number of each. Every time I was actively seeking to make a buy, I would go to Sam Ash, and tell the sales guy what I wanted. The kid, who knew next to nothing for the most part, would try and sell me a wall (display) guitar or a Strat. I NEVER buy wall (display) guitars anywhere. Sam Ash made me decide that. One day while in a Sam Ash, I saw one of the sales kids drop an American Made Strat from about 8 feet high. Landed on the rear strap button and crashed. And guess what the sales kid does......yep, straight back up onto the hangar. At any rate, I would tell the sales guys at Sam Ash, get me 3 of whatever model it was I wanted. They would always say they could, but never did. When I spend $1k+ on an stick, I am choosing the one I want, not the only one (display) you have.
Many times, Sam Ash could have made a sale on me, but never did because in my opinion, they simply did not understand what the customer expects and requires. Many of my guitars came from Wildwood, which I did not actually visit to inspect the guitar(s). But what Wildwood will do, is post pics of everything they have. And, they will send you close up pictures (a lot of them) of every inch of the guitar and serial number, so you know what you are getting, no flim-flam, no B.S. You can literally inspect the wood grain on every part of the guitar(s) you are interested in. I would hope when Sam Ash emerges from the fog, they improve a lot of things, and put the customer first.
Wow, that’s awesome. As far as Ash goes, you won’t find more than 2 (if that) of the same guitar over $1000. It comes down to having as many different guitar choices as possible within the same budget.
Great review of the Sam Ash situation. Also, in these times, don't forget that most people in general do not have the disposable income that they used to have. The drum set I sold five years ago would cost me twice as much to replace it today.
That's 100% true BUT talking to some guys in high places, Instruments are selling more than ever... It's just that SW and Zzounds are taking a huge piece of the pie and SA and GC are just not adapting to it...
Met some great people during my shopping experiences at Sam Ash, and bought such great equipment from there, but I do have to say I won’t miss the overall service. Most of them were dicks, but not all of them. To the few who weren’t, were chill and patient, and made the experience of shopping there as a musician, a comfortable and enjoyable one, especially when buying your first guitar (and I’ve bought 3 from there, a drum set I got for Black Friday w some free hardware and a free acoustic which I still have to this day), from the bottom of my heart, I want to say thank you Sam Ash 🙏🏻 you guys are what made Sam Ash a memorable music store to shop at.
Yeah they had their fair share of both… what store location was this?
My personal experience with Sam is like with any big-box music store, it’s hit-or-miss according to the location. My local Sam Ash seems to have completely indifferent staff. They’re not rude, but you’re basically on your own when you visit. I would often go in and have absolutely zero interaction with any staff. That’s definitely not a “family owned” kind of vibe, and therefore not much different than Guitar Center. At the same time, it’s good to have variety and competition, so it’s sad they’re closing down stores.
I've had that experience as well.. as a salesman it takes a while to build up the confidence to approach customers in a friendly non aggressive manner and with the staff being in a revolving door it's also hard to get to that point...
@@PatPosse It's not that hard. Customers just expect you to greet them and welcome them to the store. And if you see someone walking around alone in a department, ask if they need something. Most people just need help locating something.
Totally! Even if they need to find the restroom lol.
I bought my first guitar from Sam Ash in White Plains in 1970. I still go there. I hope they recover from their mistakes. Tough market for everyone right now.
That’s awesome. I hope they make it work soon
I bought my first keyboard back in 2001(a demo Roland FP4 that I still use), at the Canoga Park Ca store. I really appreciated the store vibe, inventory and staff. It was an inspiring place to visit.
That rules!! Is that store still here? Have you visited recently?
@@PatPosse I moved out to the mid-west in 2012 and have not been back, but I have fond memories of playing keyboards at the Canoga Park CA store. It was a great place for musicians.
Is there any SamAsh’s where you are? Just curious. I’m sure that CA store was a fun hang!
@@PatPosse Sadly, I live in a smal mid-west city with limited music stores (something I regret). The saving grace is that the internet has opened up great possibilities. The \true value of local music stored are underrated. I wish it was different, but you have to deal with the obsticals as best you can.
I agree! That personal in person touch can’t be replaced by a screen… and picking up a piece of gear will never be the same as looking at it online… but we gotta make do, right?
They are closing all stores then closing online. I just talked to Sam Ash mangers, in Clearwater yesterday.
They are closing ALL of them?????
@@PatPosse yep 1 by 1 liquidation then pop goes the online too!
So 😢 sad.
The store in Clearwater just stocked up full too, so we hoped for a come back.
Wow that’s crazy.
Great video! I actually worked at one of the stores of Sam Ash bought out of the 90s. It was wild to see all the changes.
Nice! Which location?
@@PatPosse Tampa! I worked in the old Thoroughbred Music
Nice! I haven't been to Tampa in a minute.. Last time I was there we played the Mug so it must have been 2019... time flies!
@@PatPosse The Brass Mug! Takes me back. Cut my teeth there over the years!
Hell yeah!! Awesome venue!
Nice video. I bought a used PRS guitar from Sam Ash online. The guitar showed up but was not the guitar in the photo. The communication at Sam Ash was great and they understood and sent me a return label so I could return it for a full refund. I live in Las Vegas NV. and I am a full time musician. We have one Sam Ash and two GC stores in town. When I need something right now I go to Sam Ash who seems to always have what I need in stock. Thanks
That’s awesome! Happy to see one store doing things right lol !
I live in S. Florida and I agree. I don't remember who I got my Martin HD-28 from in that battle, but people loved it. I wish I didn't have to sell it as a college student.
Please tell me you graduated College...
Interesting stuff! I bought a bunch of stuff from the Hempstead Sam Ash between 1973 well into the early 80s. Always loved going in there.
Nice! Do you know if they are closing that store? Have you been there recently?
@@PatPosse No, out of NY for 30 years....
Gotcha!
The inability to adapt to local markets is a problem for all large chain business. My experience working for SA before they overexpanded pre Mars, was that selling the service contract/extended warranty was very important. Note that back then some guitar brands still had lifetime or at least 5 year warranties.
100 percent!! And yeah pushing the ESP (Extended Service Plan) was annoying as hell to both the Customer and Salesman. I remember specifically one time when I was still on training I managed to sell a Marshall half stack and 2 Gibsons on the same day. I was so excited I told my manager at the end of the day (even though I knew I wasn’t getting any commission cause I was still “in training” but at least it would someone show my worth) and he was pissed because I hadn’t sold any ESPs with them… 🤦🏻♂️🤬
Wow, great insight. Explains a lot. Another example of old-school values being rendered moot by common sense. Good video.
Thank you very much and yup.... frustrating to say the least...
Thanks for watching and commenting!
The mail out sales catalogs brought in lots of sales from people traveling long distance to the store .
That’s awesome I remember getting catalogs and being hella excited in the early 2000s