This movie was fantastic!! such a brilliant sequal. we cant wait till the 3rd and final movie now. "SILENCEEE!!!" - MVP Scene Want to watch 4 weeks EARLY and access our UNCUT reactions? Join us on Patreon! www.patreon.com/spartanandpudgey
For us book readers was a conflicting experience. The movie is beautiful no doubt but the script and editing was very weird. Also deviated from the books a lot in unnecessary ways. This said, I prefer Part I since it was closer to the book and also had this mystic aura and soul that Dune the book has.
I’ve been on a journey (down a rabbit hole) to understand the different houses, the Bene Gesserit, and the politics. It’s such an interesting world and the Bene Gesserit are scary and have different factions. A series based on them would be awesome, if done correctly and kept just as dark and mystical as the Dune films. I’m also excited to see Paul’s sister and how powerful she is.
The significance of Paul and Jessica being a Harkonnen is that they will not better rulers, or the saviours they claim to be. The prophecy is a lie, it's a tool for political control. Paul is knowingly unleashing a war upon the galaxy in a quest for petty revenge.
Hey guys... quick note about 43:13... the spy left behind. You leave a spy behind, to SPY. Similar to how the Harkonnen's left a guy in the walls for six weeks to try to assassinate Paul. We don't know her mission, but she did not intend to get caught. A risk she was willing to take, a sacrifice she was willing to make.
Using a shield in the desert is a death sentence. If you remember in the first movie you were told that it drives the sand worms into a killing frenzy.
Using laser weapons against a shield creates huge devastating disaster, that's why it's banned. Your house would be killed off and shamed by the other houses. Not the sandworm thing.
@@wesley.peterson Liet-Kynes clearly says in the first movie "A shield's a death sentence in the desert" "It attracts the worms and drives them into a killing frenzy" when Paul asks her why don't they just shield the crawlers. Yes I know that Frank Herbert goes further into it in the books, but I'm referencing the first movie as they should have remembered that.
I really don’t get why this always seems to elude the viewers. Pudgey and Spartan claim to have watched twice the first movie, and in the last few days, at that !!! How come it did not occur to them ?? And just as a reminder about the situation of Paul dating and loving Chani, but marrying Irulan : Jessica and Leto weren’t married ! As clearly said in Dune part 1 by Leto in the bed scene just before the harkonnens attack : “I should have married you!” That kind of situation was current in a feudal society: Leto did not marry Jessica, to maintain the possibility and hope of an alliance by mariage with the great house of Atreides. But he loved Jessica.
To clarify: Chani's tears had nothing to do with Paul's condition whatsoever. What he needed was simply a dose of the Water to shock him back to the present as he was lost exploring his new Other memories. Jessica ensured Chani's participation simply to reinforce the mythos around Paul since there was apparently a connected story/prophecy tying with her name.
@@benguensche She does not have an ego in this adaptation. I don't understand where you get that from. She has an extreme dislike for "prophecy" and the idea of not being in control of her fate. That is not egotistical. If anyone get's egotistical, Paul does when he takes on the role of the Prophecy. Granted, I will credit him, he is using it as a tool to accomplish the overall objective. He is playing the long game. But her fear that he might change doing this is completely valid. The down side her fear is stopping her from being able to trust him to stay true to himself regardless of what he becomes or is made out to be. And as far as I can tell, that is completely human. Not everyone has the strength internally to handle the situation she got put in.
@@christopherpoet458it's both. Her stated reasons are many, but she's very unprincipled in how she applies her ideals and she emotionally turns on a dime if she's offended. If she stuck around for any length of time after Paul says he'd marry Irulan, she'd realize it's 100% for politics to make for a more accepted transition of power. Just like his mother, she would have kept all his love and relational focus and power. In the book she's way more understanding and loving when Pauk takes the water instead of making a scene, throwing accusations everywhere, she had to be COMPELLED to even help Paul, and after she did she hit him... hard... after coming out of a coma. When Paul gets the atomics he's totally open with her but she immediately calls him a foreigner. She repeatedly refuses to trust him. As much as I like how this version of Chani reveals Paul as problematic to the audience, the opportunity for her to be his humanizing conscience is now gone. She's like his Lois Lane, his anchor. In the book she's the ONLY one who accepts all sides of him, as a person, and because of this she trusts him. This is the opposite. More like a fling with an angry activist.
@@christopherpoet458I think in the books at least Chani isn’t really all that fleshed out compared to the movie. She’s pretty much gung ho with whatever Paul wants to do in the book, while in the movie they really humanize her. No one wants to be a mistress, no matter how much sweet words are said to reinforce the relationship. Loved movie Chani and the change in her character.
She already is one. That's the horror about it. Both Paul and Jessica had their own personalities and history before they drank the water to pull from, but Alia as a fetus just instantly became as aware of everything with none of her own self.
Second favorite movie after this and part one combined. Perfect Shakespeare movie. This is also that, but glad y’all haven’t read the books and don’t know what’s coming. You love Paul. Can’t wait to see what you think of the next movie with that mindset…
I love that Spartan recognized that he’s conflicted about Paul and his intentions, is he and Jessica on the righteous path or not. A lot of reactors immediately hop on Paul’s side without considering that he might be the villain.
@@jwhite-1471 I totally agree. Basically, I'm happy he didn't immediately root for Paul all the way like most people do, and he (and Pudgey) thought about the full picture of the character and who was influencing him (his mom).
He is not a villain at all , of course when he gets power his decisions are not good but the thing is , like paul said , he has seen all of the possible outcomes so he already knows everything that's gonna happen and it's only bad , there is no good future, so the only thing Paul can do is to choose a "okay" future from the all the worse ones if that makes sense because it's all bad so no matter what he does it's not gonna turn any good so all he can do is to lead the fremen to a path which is atleast okay or Better compared to the other ones and thats why the holy war needs to happen regardless of the billions dying, cause if it doesn't then the humanity will go extinct so if i were in Paul's shoes or just anyone at all, they would do the same thing! I mean what other choice does he have? he already hated the concept of holy war from the beginning of the movie and even in dune 1 but when he drinks the water he sees that there is no other way So if anything Leto the Second (The God Emperor) is more of a villain than Paul
Yes, and that is what the director is trying to get the audience to understand. Because all of us who read the book, felt the Hero's journey, Harkonnen's bad and now wiped out. Happy ending. And the author was like NO. You missed the point. He wrote Dune Messiah as a cautionary tale about trusting these larger than life people. That's why so many of us were surprised at the different tone in the two books.
Gotta put some respect on Timmy’s name after this movie. Acted his damn ass off. The transformation that happens after drinking the water of life is insane, he talks differently, he walks differently, he embodies a completely different person. He would have had to act completely low key and downplay his performance up until that moment to really make it hit, and he is on fire in that meeting scene, an unbelievable presence, calling everyone out and basically declaring jihad. Really cool visual that alludes to the Princess Irulan having no choice about her own path, in the first scene we see her she wears nothing on her head to signify her freedom, then every other scene she is in she is wearing a head dress that grows more and more constricting as time goes by, eventually wearing something that resembles a complete cage by the time Paul takes her as his bride.
how would you say her face covering compares to Paul mom? Jessica is it? maybe it represents her gaining awareness and rank in the BG whereas the princess is losing that same control, losing her standing and inheritance
@@OctavianAsixthis is an interesting line of thought. In the age of knights men wore helmets to protect the head and face and it seems to me to signify male dominance via violence. So that could be another way to look at it she puts on a male persona; rightful heir to house Corino the next in line to the throne. It's also interesting from the point that in the book the emperor wore a helmet (Burseg). Denis really knows the books well.
To get off a sandworm you have to ride it to exhaustion. And that's how the Fremen measure distance. Once one worm is exhausted, they pull out another thumper to call a fresh ride. So their destination might be 20 thumpers away because they have to bring 20 thumpers for the journey
37:40 fun fact - in the book, Gurney was darker than the movie shows. All this time he thought it was Jessica who betrayed them; he didn't know it was Doctor Yueh. So when he found out that she's alive and with Paul, he almost killed her. He litreally had a knife at her throat. Paul convinced him at the last moment, that it wasn't Jessica who betrayed Leto and caused their downfall. Upon realization, he dropped the nife, dropped to his knees and started crying
Was so disappointed they didn't include this and Jamis' funeral scene. Including no Thufir! no revelation about who Liet Kynes is.... I feel like the movie was going to be something else completely, probably closer to the book but they made this movie almost so you don't have to watch part 1. They're almost like two different movies entirely, even though one says "part 1" and the other "part 2".
Yes! The Reverend Mother knew very well that Jessica was the natural daughter of the Baron-because once upon a time, she had been the Bene Gesserit assigned to secure the Baron’s bloodline.
I think the moment that really signals the transition to Paul being legitimately scary is when the random Fremen fighter tries to kill Rabban by jumping onto the thopter. She knows full well that whether or not she succeeds it's a one way trip, but she does it anyway. The way she screams "for Muad'Dib" just before she goes down is chilling, since it seems to really go against Fremen survival instincts.
Shishakli, Chani’s friend, stayed behind to buy the others time and take out as many as she could. A noble sacrifice - they really made me care for this random 😭.
@@di3486 I didn’t the first watch but I saw it theaters again the next day and she stood out more/realized how present she was so her death got me the next time.
But, like, what for? If the deaths of the enemies mattered and were an honorable cause, why did she stay behind alone? And if they didn't matter, why not live to fight another day and support the actual war effort?
You saw the stabbing! Feyd-Rautha stabbed Paul with Paul's own knife...which was the knife he got from Chani in Part One. Then he pulled it out and stabbed Feyd-Rautha with it while using Gurney's fight move from the sparring in Part One! The vision came true...figuratively! Also, remember, it is mentioned only once, but Paul cannot foresee the future when it belongs to another medium with prescience, like Feyd-Rautha, a prospect for Kwisatz Haderach (--> attack on Sietch Tabr). In the book he cannot see any of the fight and also not the outcome of the fight, which makes it spicy and nervewrecking in the book, however, he saw the Jihad happening either way, with or without him alive. In the movie they also show that he could not see this fight, however, in the movie he was able to see the very last image of the outcome of the fight when the prescience of Feyd-Rautha was gone as an obstacle to his prescience, and so, Paul knew Chani's blade and getting stabbed by it was the key to win.
Feud rautha doesn't have prescience, and in the book, the reason he cannot see the outcome of the fight, is because there are too many timelines coming together, at that point none of the prescient can see past that point, it's even commented about how the guild navigators know he's not bluffing about destroying the spice because the many outcomes of this fight, and the possibility of the spice being destroyed completely has created a focus point though which all timelines flow and no one can see past.
One of my favorite details from these movies that idk seems to be overlooked a lot is how when ships with shields get blown up, the explosion stays within the shield (which just looks sick) until it breaks the shield generator.
"...but I do see a way, there is a narrow way through..." He saw himself being stabbed by Feyd-Rautha during their fight, and that he'd *have* to be stabbed, but in the exact right spot, at the exact right time, in the exact right place, so that he wouldn't die from the fight but also throw Feyd-Rautha off his guard by making him think he's already won by landing a blow. 4D Chess.
There’s also a shot in the movie where you see Princess Irulan at the end of a very narrow hallway. Which was a really cool touch about securing the throne.
I think there's no way feyd rautha would win during a fight, given the powers Paul has...it's just for suspence. The fight would be easy for Paul, he wouldn't even need to be stabbed to win
1:02:27 From the first book: "In that instant, Paul saw how Stilgar had been transformed from the Fremen naib to a creature of the Lisan al-Gaib, a receptacle for awe and obedience. It was a lessening of the man, and Paul felt the ghost-wind of the jihad in it."
Don’t get too fixed on any one thing from Paul’s visions, such as the scene of Chani stabbing him. He didn’t understand at first, but remember, he sees all possible futures. This is why he told the Reverend Mother his dreams don’t always come to pass exactly as he dreamed it. We are often showed the possible future where Jamis is his friend and teacher instead of his mortal antagonist. Think of the flow of time like a river. If one perceives the whole of the terrain, one can both see where that river will probably flow as well as all the other ways it could flow, along with what is needs to make the river of time follow the path of your choosing. This is what Paul meant when he said he saw a narrow way. Him taking on the role of Lisan al-Gaib, using the atomic to destroy the shield wall, marrying the Princess, and even unleashing the Holy War he dreaded, these were all necessary parts in the path not only to revenge but to save the Fremen and protect Arakis.
The opening salvo of nukes was to destroy the mountain range that circles Arrakeen and provides it the protection from the worms. With the mountains breached, the worm riders could attack the city inside the city's basin.
The movie left out a quote from Lady Jessica. “ you see her standing there, so haughty, so confident. Let us hope she finds solace in her writing and books. She’ll have little else. She may have my son’s name, but it’s we who carry the name of concubines that history will call us wives”.
People always mention that quote, and while it shows just how different the ending is in the book, we also never get to read Chani's exact response in that moment. Of course book Chani is much different from movie Chani, but still, it's not like she's partying at the end of the book either. That's why Jessica has to comfort her in the first place. And she's not wrong with her statement, but in Dune Messiah we see just how fucked the whole situation between their triangle is.
@@nikolaiquack8548 her response to that quote doesn’t matter that much based on what follows in messiah + paul confirmed to her before jessica said that, that irulan wont have any kind of affection from him. Instead this ending made it seem like Chani leaves Paul for good and missed out on one of the most anticipated adaptions from the book. It’s a shame, but I’m interested to see how he’ll adapt the 3rd book based on how this ended.
You two would love the Netflix movie, The King with Timothee Chalamet and Robert Pattinson. Great acting and fighting. The Kings of England and France go head to head.
1:02:25 "In that instant, Paul saw how Stilgar had been transformed from the Fremen naib to a creature of the Lisan al-Gaib, a receptacle for awe and obedience. It was a lessening of the man, and Paul felt the ghost-wind of the jihad in it. I have seen a friend become a worshiper, he thought. Muad'Dib from whom all blessings flow, he thought, and it was the bitterest thought of his life."
1:18:20 In the book, the time between Paul meeting Chani and the battle with the Emperor was about 3 years. During that time Jessica gave birth to Alia. Also Paul and Chani had a son they named Leto. So their relationship dynamic and her expectations on their future were very different. Chani and Jessica had a mutually respectful relationship and they supported one another in helping Paul ascend to power. So many things changed but I understand why. When Dune came out the author Frank Herbert was shocked that people thought that this was just another hero’s journey type story.
Book physics: if a shield is struck by a lasgun (laser rifle), it goes off like a nuke. The Sardaukar didn’t dare activate their shields when under fire in the desert, and it wasn’t even because of the worms.
Poses the question why dont they just use laser guns all the time? Shoot them from miles away and they either explode or die if they have shield on or not?
@@pepsipwns666 its double edged, the outcome is unknwon, it could very well cause the atomic explosion not at the shielded target but the user using the lasgon, basically its unknown how it'll react and how it'll explode + politics, any atomic explosion leaves trail that will be spotted by others. Duncan actually does this once in the books where he takes an ornithopter, shields and mask it poorly in the desert, when they shot at it, it destroyed everything in the radius and since then they stopped using it in the conflict. Dennis overused the lasguns as in the first book its rarely used.
@@pepsipwns666The reaction travels back along the laser beam, detonating within the firing lasgun AND at the shield where the laser hits. You have two massive detonations that are indistinguishable from normal atomic weapon explosions. The Great Convention, which everyone in the Imperium obeys, states that using atomic weapons against humans is strictly forbidden (Paul got around this by firing his atomics at the shield wall mountains instead of his human opponents. It’s not illegal to use them to change geological features.) If you break these ancient rules, everyone in the galaxy will turn on you and wipe out your world. That’s why using laser/shield reactions as weapons is seriously avoided by the great houses. The risk that others will think you are illegally using actual atomic weapons in war is far too great.
There will be a third movie. Definitely. It is in pre production, right now. The first two films are telling the story of the first book. Frank Herbert's book was a huge, worldwide success. Praised and beloved by millions. But the author was disappointed about the conclusions of the majorly of the readers. His book was seen as a tale of a savior, who rises up to save the world. And that was quite the opposite of Herbert's idea. He originally wanted to tell a story about manipulation through faith and curruption by power. A warning about false prophets and we should never follow someone blindly...but the readers did not get it. So, in order to set things straight, Frank Herbert wrote another book: Dune Messiah. The third Dune movie will have the same name. Dune Messiah. Will this be the end? Maybe. After three movies only the stories of two Dune books will have been told...of tow books, of six Dune books, which Frank Herbert wrote 😉
Half true. He wrote the first 3 books as one book, and children/messiah were written first, before Dune1. His publisher made him split it into 3 books.
8:54 We also see Duncan use a variation of this tech in part one, while fighting his way through the palace. It's very subtle tho. After defeating a small group of enemy soldiers, one more appears at a distance and shoots one of those shield-piercing darts at him. He knocks it away, throws his dagger at the shooter to knock him off balance (when it bounces off the shield), then taps his belt to activate the anti-grav assist and jumps several meters in one leap to reach the enemy before he can recover.
this tech shows up as red lights you see on Duncan's belt(I think) and down the Barons back in the "Steamroom scene" in 1st movie. Also the chairs use them in the conference room hence no legs.
I like what is basically every reactor's shock to Feyd-Rautha killing the two girls in the movie. We were just told that he is psychotic, but the description doesn't really hit home until we watch him actually being psychotic.
The whole family does that on the regular though. Rabban kills his advisors and underlings for daring to tell him what to do, and the Baron kills his servants for fun. In the neofeudalism of the Imperium, human life has no intrinsic value except at the whim of one’s superiors and overlords.
That is something they failed to do in the first Dune. We never see Sting’s version so anything but grimace and stand around in a leather bikini. So by the time the final duel happens you are like this dude is gonna get curbed
Saw Dune 2 in theaters and watched it again when it started streaming on HBO. Loved the first movie, but for me, Dune 2 is next level. One of those movies I'll watch over and over again.
A little tidbit, Jessica speaking telepathically to the other Reverend Mother is because when they become Reverend Mother's they access their whole maternal bloodline's ancestral memory. The other Reverend mother is Jessica's mother...
I doubt this will ever be brought up in the movies though. There's only a very brief mention of Gaius Helen Mohiam being Jessica's mother in the books and in the end it's entirely inconsequential. In movie universe, I think they can speak to each other simply because they are both reverend mothers.
@@xen0bia It's never mentioned in the books that Mohaim is Jessica's mother. It's only mentioned as a likelihood in a third party encyclopaedia not written by Frank.
@@lachlanmarshall39it's a plot point in the "House" spin off books by Frank Herbert's son and Kevin J Anderson. However those books are full of other stuff that directly contradict things stated in the Frank Herbert books, and besides it just makes the universe feel small. They are moderately fun in a pulpy, low quality way, but in my opinion should absolutely not be considered canon.
The Fremen get off the worm by riding it to exhaustion and sliding off of it when it slows down or stops because it is tired. The worm doesn't like to travel on the surface. The hooks are not just designed to allow the rider to stick to the worm, but also to divaricate the worm's overlapping outer skin segments, so that the much tender inner parts can be exposed. The worm then doesn't submerge because the friction caused by the sand would irritate his soft tissues and is forced to move on the surface. They make use of two hooks because they need to be able to relocate one of them (at a time) to other parts of the worm in order to control the travel direction or to force the worm to rotate around its main axis.
Dune has been my obsession for the past few years and hands down one of my favourite movies of all time, and today is my birthday and your reaction is like a little present, especially for me yay 🎉 thank you for always giving your viewers great content ❤
Ideally the fremen would have believed in themselves and realized all they could achieve without a messiah, being the best fighters in all the Imperium, but ultimately Paul is the one to unite them and fight with them and unleash them into the universe. One of the messages of the Dune series is that tragically all people deep down seek to be lead by someone who will galvanize them down the right path. The God Emperor forcing peace upon the universe for thousands of years finally lit the fire in humanity that made them want to break free, but ultimately he foresees that they will again walk down familiar paths and seek to follow someone.
I'm disappointed in the readers who can't stop themselves from commenting on things that haven't happened yet. Let people speculate in peace. If you can't contain your enthusiasm for comparing and contrasting without spoiling, then I'm sure you could find forums to discuss it with people who are in the same situation.
@@Whiskey0880 I have read them, I just have enough sense to keep those conversations to people who also have, or actually ask. Also, some people don't read them until after the movie series is complete, if they weren't aware of the books before the first movie, and that's fine too.
9:18 "Why don't they have their shields on?" It was mentioned in the first movie (and the book) but shields of any kind (due to the intense vibration they cause) sends the worms into a killing frenzy. So turning their shields on would have attracted tons of worms.
Chani's friend stayed behind to give the rest of them time. Remember, she was very hesitant about Paul being the messiah, to begin with, but then she was turned into a believer, a devoted follower actually. She sacrificed herself
32:37 And THAT is how you introduce a villain!! I heard somewhere that Austin Butler spent 4 months in Budapest, Hungary, training with a far US NAVY SEAL to get in shape for the role!!
44:27 For any fans of God Emperor of Dune, I can't believe she organically called Paul first sighting of the golden path as "The whole Shebang". This is unbelievable I cant stop laughing.
plans withing plans, the Bene Gesserit are not alone planing things in the imperium....Space Guild, Bene Tlelaxu, Ixian, the great houses....Dune saga is HUGE.
To add to what others have said about not using the shields: a shield that is hit by a laser weapon explodes on the scale of nuclear weapons. If you don’t know where your enemy is, you avoid using shields because they may use lasers on your shields unless they’re close.
The thing about Paul is that his base personality hasn't changed, but his perception has. He constantly sees through space and time and can see the results of every action he takes. He can see the 'narrow way through', and he is performing the actions he can see will lead to the desired outcome. He can also see that although it is the only viable course of action, he will have to cause much suffering. Inside, he still has moral doubts, and he still loves Chani, but he knows the path he has to take.
After taking the chosen path he cannot move away. The third movie should stress it more and how that absolute perception destroyed Paul. He chooses to be a mortal human. But I guess that the plot about he freeing himself of fate will be left out because there will be no adaptation for children of dune, only the Messiah. The thing is, the director may change everything and point another way. I'm not even sure if we will ever see the guild navigators and have an explanation on Mentats.
@@dess234: Paul is very much a villain. That's not really a "take", it's how both the novels and films were written. He's really an archetypal tragic villain, in many ways also an anti-villain; a tragic anti-villain.
@@hoon_sol He's 100% not a villian in the books LMAO. Everyone seems to misinterpret Frank's quote and run with it. paul isn't a villian whatsoever. A villain is someone with evil motives and intentions. Nothing abt Paul's motives were evil. Trying to label Paul as a villain is honestly very disingenuous to the real message of the book lmao. A villain wouldn't be trying to stop all of this and refusing to go down a certain path. Paul spent the first and second book trying to prevent the Jihad. A villain wouldn't be trying to do damage control like Paul was doing. Did people die, yes, but people were going to die regardless of whether Paul became in power or not. Let's also remember that Paul is a child at this point in the movie still (he's only 15) with the power of prescience, being subject to hallucinogenics and so forth. He was forced to make decisions that adults probably would struggle to make themselves. He was robbed of free will once he unlocked the power of his prescience. How exactly can you try to make decisions, if you already know what's going to happen. The best you can do is damage control which is what he was doing. Paul isn't a bad person, it's more so the consequences of him. I'm not saying that paul is a hero necessarily, but he's also not a villain, that's such black and white thinking. By definition he's a tragic hero (Tragic heroes typically have heroic traits that earn them the sympathy of the audience, but also have flaws or make mistakes that ultimately lead to their own downfall). He also is a human being lmaooo. Paul isn't really in control of much since this entire plan is bigger than him.
As for him being stabbed, it wasn't because he couldn't see it, it's because he did see it. There was only 1 way to beat Fayd and yes, he killed him with Gurneys move from part 1! There's a flash of the blade in him earlier in the movie. That said, in the book, Fayd is a person that he's never seen in a vision, hence no visions, other than the blade in him, of him in the movie.
Your comment at the end about wondering if the good guys are really the right side is very insightful. Paul is an awesome protagonist, but his actions are very morally grey at times. He's aiming for a perfect future, this "golden path" that leads humanity to prosperity, but some bad things have to happen along the way to get there. Including his holy war that results in a lot of dead people. But boy it sure is satisfying to watch him avenge his father's death and put everyone else in their place!
Morally grey? He intentionalky, willfullingly orders the biggest mass murder in mankind's history. He is the villain. There is no grey, only black. And no, Paul did not see the Golden Path at the end of the original book. That comes later. The Jihad is not part of the Golden Path.
Yeah, just like @bobbwc7011 said, it's not morally grey, it's *entirely* wrong. Paul himself recognizes this in Dune Messiah, literally comparing himself to Hitler (and Stilgar adding a layer of hurt by saying Hitler's killcount was pretty weak compared to Muad'Dib's...), and he's pretty much known as a tyrant throughout the universe. But some will argue that he is a lesser evil, compared to his son... If anything, Paul is a tragic character who really never had a chance to be his own person and who could not deviate from his set path. He was always a tool of political scheming, a prisoner of religious fervor, prophecy and time itself. "To know the future is to be trapped by it."
The body shield is a Holtzman shield made from thin layer of atoms, a lasgun is similarly using atoms at their most excited level, if they collide it produces a thermonuclear reaction. Hence it's not a good idea. Lasgun-shield interactions look and act like atomic explosions, which are explicitly banned.
Chani makes him a Fremen. Doesnt matter what she does within the prophecy. Her role was larger, she's literally the one who help him come to the conclusion "father, i've found my way"
I always loved Paul's line to Chani: "I will love you as long as I breathe." At one point, he didn't breathe no more when he drank the poison. My personal head canon is that was his last goodbye as the Paul she knew and loved.
59:00, There are three character rich conversations from the book are missing from the showdown scene with the Emperor. 1) Thufir Hawat (the older chubby man from the first movie) Duke Leto’s Mentat advisor actually survived the Fall of House Atreides. The Harkonnens captured him and forced him to work for them. In secret despite being brutalized constantly, Thufir was still loyal to House Atreides. So when he found out that Gurney was still alive, he started feeding Gurney information to hurt the Harkonnen's spice trade. In this final scene, Thufir is given a poison needle to jab Paul with. Instead of betraying Paul he stabs his own hand with it. Thufir lives long enough to stand in front of Paul and address him as “My Duke”. It is a bittersweet moment for both of them as Thufir was like a grandfather to Paul. Thufir died happy to see Paul live to avenge his father and reestablish House Atreides. He had served Paul's grandfather Paulus Atreides and then his father Leto Atreides. So with his last breath Thufir let Paul know "I'm still your loyal man now and for always". As soon as Thufir dies, Paul stands up, wipes away his tears and calls out Feyd Rautha. He wanted to make sure everyone responsible for the death of his father and teachers would get it. Denis Villanueve did film this final scene but left it on the cutting room floor. Steven M. McKinley who played Thufir Hawat gave an interview about being disappointed that his work was left out of the second movie. 2) After Paul defeats Feyd, the Emperor Shaddam asks his best friend Count Hasimir Fenring to challenge Paul. Fenring is the husband of Margot Fenring the Bene Gesserit who got impregnated by Feyd. Fenring despite his mild manner appearance is the Emperor's personal hitman. Fenring is almost a Kwitzach Haderach like Paul and has been trained by his wife Margot in Bene Gesserit ways. So with all of those skills Fenring could potentially defeat Paul in single combat But when Fenring and Paul looked at one another across the throne room, they experienced a shared moment of kinship. Fenring sees in Paul all he could have become had he not been born a genetic eunuch. Because of this birth defect Fenring can't father children with his beautiful wife or any woman. Paul also sees what Fenring is seeing in that moment and conveys back to the Count not pity but brotherhood. After that shared moment, Fenring turns to his best friend Emperor Shaddam and says "No". This was the first time that Shaddam was ever turned down by Fenring and he is shook to his core. Denis Villanueve also filmed this final scene but left it on the cutting room floor. Actor Tim Blake Nelson who played Count Fenring has also given interviews about his heartbreak with being left out. 3) Paul and Jessica letting Chani know that the marriage to Princess Irulan is merely political. They explain that Paul will never spend time with Irulan, show her any passion or sire children with her. The Imperial marriage is all for show. Paul basically marries Irulan then goes home to Chani. They never mistreat the Princess but everyone knows that she is Empress in name only. David Lynch the director of the 1984 version of Dune actually filmed both the Thufir and Chani scenes and they can be found on UA-cam.
movies felt like chopped off bits weirdly put together to me tho i never read the books. there was no flow. now i see a possible reason. it is a shame because one could sense how great this could have been aswell.
@@19_meg_91 Denis never does extended or director's cut, unfortunately. He literally stated he makes only one version of the movie and that is the movie people will get to see.
I love how the visions are so unpredictable. In part one for example You can see a moment where Paul in his visions is an Emperor already during the Holy War mess, but theres Chani by his side, they both standing on a ship, watching scene from above. Then in the end of part 2 Paul takes Irulan for his wife. I cant wait for the 3rd movie. Its goin to be a book nr 2 The Messiah of Dune. Its goin to be sick !! Denis created a masterpiece. The visuals, cinematography, music of maestro Hans Zimmer... I love how monumental this picture is.
I don’t know if it’s only my perception. But in the first part the voice said Paul needs to die to be reborn, and in the next sentence it says you die if you take a life. So technically when he killed Jamis, he "died" to be reborn
From what I remember of the book, in order to ride the sandworm Paul has to pull up on one of the segments. Because the worm doesn't like how it feels to get sand under that segment it will stay on the surface while it is held open. He can just release the segment so the worm wants to dive into the sand and hop off. I'm sure it's probably as difficult and risky as hopping on.
Dune 2 was awesome and the scene where he called and rode the worm was one of the best sounding scenes I’ve ever seen in a theatre. The whole place was shaking from the bass
I liked that Spartan noticed that Stilgar had just become a fanatic servant in the end. Paul lost a friend and gained a follower - it's not a good trade.
You keep waiting for the stab but you missed that the visions were only fragments. The faces of the visions aren’t always the right people look at Paul’s vision were he is fighting in the war but it was actually Chani revealed in Dune 2
The intersection of a lasgun beam and a Holtzman shield creates what is essentially a small-yield nuclear explosion, destroying the lasgun wielder and the shielded target as well as everything in the immediate vicinity.
Chani will be his concubine. Messiah takes place 12 years after the holy war. Probably a bit longer since they sped things up and Alia isn’t born yet. Dune ends and she’s around 3 or so. They changed Chani a good bit. She doesn’t kill Paul. Remember he said he has seen that she will come to understand
Theres a few key things which should get pointed out when it comes to the personal shields and combat in Dune. Laser based weaponry (Lasguns) was very common in Dune, however it was outlawed after the invention of the personal shield. As the interaction of the Shield and Lasgun fire would cause devastating explosions. Now the Fremen do have some projectile based weapons which can be seen in the first few scenes in the film. But they are all very "low tech" and not too common in full combat due to the Holtzman shield being very proficient at blocking them. It was also mentioned in Dune Part 1 that the shields in the open desert or Worm Territory will drive the Worms into a killing frenzy, which at that point you have to hedge your bets. The films didn't really delve into the subject too much. But these are the 2 biggest reasons why the Harkonnens in the opening fight say "No shields" There is also so much to talk about when it comes to Jessica drinking the water of life while she was Pregnant. Too much for a single YT comment anyhow. But you see it on the elderly Reverend Mothers face when they found out. She dun fucked up.
Hey, I didn't notice if someone already commented on it - In the issue of not taking things literally, a bloody knife is a symbol for war, and she stabbing him is the same as Jamis stabbing him in his final vision. The point is that she will take a main part in his future fate that will lead to war. This is also true for the copter vision - Jamis says that he will show him the ways of the desert... and he does, in visions. Other than that - Your videos are wonderful, I've been binging them for a week.
"Once men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free. But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them."
@@technofilejr3401 I too feel conflicted about the missing stuff. But maybe Deniz found it necessary to cut back on the story, so non readers of the books have an easier time to enjoy the movie.
One of the core tenets of the galactic society in which the events of 'Dune' (books and movies) transpire is that artificial intelligence is evil, and that quote is one of the reasons why. That's why the story contains no artificial intelligence technology, and not much in the way of computer tech. The corollary to "Who will guard the guards themselves?" is "He who programs or trains the AIs that rule is the real power behind the throne."
@@Grumpy_Rabbit haven't read the books so idk if it's appropriate to call it contradictory but it's interesting how they have mentats AND Bene G people in universe, meanwhile they're worried abt Ai I do plan on picking up the books so no need for spoilers, I just thought you could offer guidance in terms of those themes
Loved your intro here, you guys really took the time to think about the first movie and sounds like a lot of things made more sense with the rewatch. Also agree that Part Two was even better, and not only that, it actually elevates the first one. Great reaction and discussion all around, thanks guys.
I was so excited when I saw you posted the reaction! Such a masterpiece with soooo many details. One that I found particularly interesting: At the end, you see the Fremen burning the bodys of those who passed (Harkonnen, Sadaurkar and Fremen) although their culture is to preserve all water (like in the beginning, when they harvested the Harkonnens water for their cooling systemts). Just shows how powerful religious fervor can be and how quickly it makes people abandon their core beliefs
@Spartan & Pudgey I can see path where Jaimis is training young duke-boy. When he and his mother first met fremen group, fremen said boy is young we can teach our ways, but mother needs to die. That was path where Jaimis is training him. Meaning if he wouldn't stand up and fight for her mother as she's champion, instead let mother fight herself and potentially get killed by Jaimis.
What Lady Margot Fenring did was what Lady Jessica was originally sent to do with Duke Leto Atreides, but she genuinely fell in love with him and produced a male heir to continue the Atreides Bloodline, as well as possibly giving birth to "The One"
I love love LOVE that this was all shot on location in natural light and that the effects are mostly practical with VFX used sparingly to fill in the blanks. It's so clear how much better this film looks than anything in the MCU, where they shoot in studio lighting with green/blue screens. Like the scene where Paul catches and rides the sand worm is almost entirely practical effects, you should check out a behind the scenes for that! It makes it all feel so much more real and believable, no uncanny valley weirdness.
The nuclear warheads that Paul unleashes are there to destroy the "Shield Wall." This is a rock formation that protects the city from the open desert and the worms. This is mentioned in the first film. By destroying the Wall, it makes the city vulnerable to the worms. This allows access to the Emperor's Sardaukar forces so the Fremen Fedaykin can ride the worms into battle.
1:15:26 Alia taking the water of life before birth is the abomination that Reverend Mother Mohiam was talking about. Alia already has all of the ancestral memories that Paul and Jessica can access. The Bene Gesserit call such a person preborn.
@@smashmusiqueThe fetus doesn't develop it's own personality as much. It lives in the head of its other personalities, including male ancestors, and one of these ancestors could possess her and basically throw the Bene Gesserit's plans into chaos.
LOVE your reactions. I love Paul's character, it's rare that a character impresses me this much in anything. I flew to another city to view this in IMAX for once because this film was just cinematic excellence.
The water of life is the bile of a drowning worm. I have read the books, loved the first movie, even liked the short tv series and listened to the audiobooks. But these new movies are absolutely brilliant. Can’t wait for the third 🤩👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻❤️
I don’t remember the exact quote but there is a point where Paul is thinking about Stilgar and is sad because he realized he lost a friend to a follower.
In that instant, Paul saw how Stilgar had been transformed from the Fremen naib to a creature of the Lisan al-Gaib, a receptacle for awe and obedience. It was a lessening of the man, and Paul felt the ghost-wind of the jihad in it. I have seen a friend become a worshiper, he thought. …Muad’Dib from whom all blessings flow, he thought, and it was the bitterest thought of his life.
You guys reaction is one of the best I've seen I really enjoyed rediscovering this movie through your eyes. It's a very complex story and you guys did A great job of understanding the complexities of the story. ❤ I read Dune in 1975 or 76 I was about 15 or 16. Star Wars came out in '77 I've been waiting for a movie that could capture the book since then. The book had a big influence on my life, I was at a point in my life where I questioned religion and being a good person who didn't believe in God. This story helps settle that for me. It also opened my teenage eyes to the corruption inherent in religion and all powerful people, which was the point of the book and I think this movie captures that. I have never since then put my complete faith in any powerful leader even one with the best of intentions and that I support politically. 8:58 it's not explicitly explained in the movie but the devices that let them float called repulsors in the book, will attract the sand worm. So they use it sparingly if at all. Now that the thumper has been activated and the worm is coming anyway they can freely use their repulsors. 27:24 Chini is riding Paul's worm 😉 28:06 you guys are one of the few reacting to this movie that actually get that the predictions are made up. Most people say oh it's all coming true. It was designed to come true. It was designed to be vague and easy to distort into a prophecy.
@1:02:20 PS Your quote about Stilgar going from a mentor to just another zealot minion is right on, and Paul is pretty devastated, disappointed, and hurt by it in the book, even knowing it's part of his "plan" aka the "Golden Path." “In that instant, Paul saw how Stilgar had been transformed from the Fremen naib to a creature of the Lisan al-Gaib, a receptacle for awe and obedience. It was a lessening of the man, and Paul felt the ghost-wind of the jihad in it.”
I'm both surprised and not that many people preferred the second film. It does have more action scenes, after all, and many people want that in their film experience. Myself, I was a bit disappointed. It felt rushed and disconnected, as Spartan seemed to recognise with his statements like "yesterday they wanted to kill him; today they love him", "no way, already?", and "this show builds things up sometimes and then boom, now we're here". He's also on point saying he doesn't know whether we're on the righteous side. An early complaint I had was that Paul never really failed, but now I realize that a lot of villains in films aren't defeated until the end. I don't want Paul to be a villain though! Either way, I'm sure I'll like it better on a re-watch. There's a lot I really enjoyed anyway. Like Timothée Chalamet's acting was supreme. Almost channeling Khal Drogo in his speech at the fremen council! So impressive. Killing the Baron so brusquely after he was made small by the emperor was just right.
I like how the theme that plays as Paul finishes the fight and walks to the emperor is like something from Jaws of a shark coming close to it's victim.
The problem with foretelling the future, is once forecast, by the very fact that you know the future, means you’ll make choices that change the future that you saw. The future is in flux for the seer. Frank Herbert said, that he never understood how people talk about the future. The future as if it’s a fixed destination towards which we go. He said that he believed in a future, not the future. The future is always changing. This idea is what inspired Frank Herbert’s framework for prophecy.
27:33 remember, the tents collect the water and recycle it for them to drink. So they are not wasting water they can drink up the cleaned stuff afterwards 😂😂😜😜
I was told that in the book, the Baron was killed by Alia, Paul’s sister. She was only 2 at the time. I’m kinda glad the director let Paul do the deed because that would’ve been a bit too much for the tone of the movie.
to get off a worm, In the books you usually rode a worm to exhaustion and slid off near the tail, but not at the very end of the tail because of the heat generate by the worms travel
Pudgy nailed it with the issue of “control” between the Reverend Mother & Paul-The Kwisatz Haderach is meant to be controlled, (that’s why she is so focused on the Atreides “defiance”,) because the Bene Gesserit is a political organization, à la the Catholic Church, (think about the early church in Europe and their use of messiah mythology.) From what I recall, Paul was supposed to be a daughter, and that daughter was meant to be paired with Feyd-Rautha, and thus producing the Kwisatz Haderach. That didn’t happen, as we saw. The whole “the one” stuff is a moot point. Also, y’all just saw the “narrow way,” in short, the duel w/ Feyd, (the mirror of Paul-As y’all noted in the reaction.) This is not a spoiler, but y’all are having trouble making predictions because ya don’t realize the six books cover generations. Dune Messiah, (Book 2 of 6,) is basically an epilogue to Dune, (1 of 6,)… …which is why I am so freakin’ excited to see what Denis Villeneuve is going to do because Dune Messiah is perhaps the biggest uphill battle of this series-It’s the conclusion to a story that should have felt like it just concluded. Let’s just say, Villeneuve brilliantly navigated Part Two. Remember, they just basically took out the Harkonnens (the Atreides ancestral rivals,) and the Emperor. It’s going to be very exciting to see what Villeneuve adds to Part Three. I will say, I think the Bene Gesserit series might actually be important to see prior to Part Three.
I commend you two for rewatching Dune Part One before watching this masterpiece. Shows how much you want to understand this world and get the most out of your viewing experience. As a longtime fan of the the novels and Denis Villeneuve's directing talent, I enjoy your very perceptive reactions!
This movie was fantastic!! such a brilliant sequal. we cant wait till the 3rd and final movie now. "SILENCEEE!!!" - MVP Scene
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For us book readers was a conflicting experience. The movie is beautiful no doubt but the script and editing was very weird. Also deviated from the books a lot in unnecessary ways. This said, I prefer Part I since it was closer to the book and also had this mystic aura and soul that Dune the book has.
HBO is making a tv show about the origines of the Bene Gesserit coming out later this year: Dune: Prophecy
I’ve been on a journey (down a rabbit hole) to understand the different houses, the Bene Gesserit, and the politics. It’s such an interesting world and the Bene Gesserit are scary and have different factions. A series based on them would be awesome, if done correctly and kept just as dark and mystical as the Dune films. I’m also excited to see Paul’s sister and how powerful she is.
The significance of Paul and Jessica being a Harkonnen is that they will not better rulers, or the saviours they claim to be. The prophecy is a lie, it's a tool for political control. Paul is knowingly unleashing a war upon the galaxy in a quest for petty revenge.
Hey guys... quick note about 43:13... the spy left behind.
You leave a spy behind, to SPY. Similar to how the Harkonnen's left a guy in the walls for six weeks to try to assassinate Paul. We don't know her mission, but she did not intend to get caught. A risk she was willing to take, a sacrifice she was willing to make.
Using a shield in the desert is a death sentence. If you remember in the first movie you were told that it drives the sand worms into a killing frenzy.
Using laser weapons against a shield creates huge devastating disaster, that's why it's banned. Your house would be killed off and shamed by the other houses. Not the sandworm thing.
@@wesley.peterson Liet-Kynes clearly says in the first movie "A shield's a death sentence in the desert" "It attracts the worms and drives them into a killing frenzy" when Paul asks her why don't they just shield the crawlers. Yes I know that Frank Herbert goes further into it in the books, but I'm referencing the first movie as they should have remembered that.
@wesley.peterson you're confusing shields-Laser explosions with using atomic weapons on a human population
If a laser hitsa shield it can cause a small nuclear explosion....that's pretty much why they use knives and swords.
I really don’t get why this always seems to elude the viewers. Pudgey and Spartan claim to have watched twice the first movie, and in the last few days, at that !!! How come it did not occur to them ?? And just as a reminder about the situation of Paul dating and loving Chani, but marrying Irulan : Jessica and Leto weren’t married ! As clearly said in Dune part 1 by Leto in the bed scene just before the harkonnens attack : “I should have married you!” That kind of situation was current in a feudal society: Leto did not marry Jessica, to maintain the possibility and hope of an alliance by mariage with the great house of Atreides. But he loved Jessica.
To clarify: Chani's tears had nothing to do with Paul's condition whatsoever. What he needed was simply a dose of the Water to shock him back to the present as he was lost exploring his new Other memories. Jessica ensured Chani's participation simply to reinforce the mythos around Paul since there was apparently a connected story/prophecy tying with her name.
Chani is very selfless in the books. Unfortunately for whatever reason she has a giant ego in this adaptation.
@@benguensche She has not. She is a kind Fremen woman but not a gullible fanatic idiot like Stilgar.
@@benguensche She does not have an ego in this adaptation. I don't understand where you get that from.
She has an extreme dislike for "prophecy" and the idea of not being in control of her fate. That is not egotistical.
If anyone get's egotistical, Paul does when he takes on the role of the Prophecy. Granted, I will credit him, he is using it as a tool to accomplish the overall objective. He is playing the long game. But her fear that he might change doing this is completely valid. The down side her fear is stopping her from being able to trust him to stay true to himself regardless of what he becomes or is made out to be. And as far as I can tell, that is completely human. Not everyone has the strength internally to handle the situation she got put in.
@@christopherpoet458it's both. Her stated reasons are many, but she's very unprincipled in how she applies her ideals and she emotionally turns on a dime if she's offended.
If she stuck around for any length of time after Paul says he'd marry Irulan, she'd realize it's 100% for politics to make for a more accepted transition of power. Just like his mother, she would have kept all his love and relational focus and power.
In the book she's way more understanding and loving when Pauk takes the water instead of making a scene, throwing accusations everywhere, she had to be COMPELLED to even help Paul, and after she did she hit him... hard... after coming out of a coma.
When Paul gets the atomics he's totally open with her but she immediately calls him a foreigner. She repeatedly refuses to trust him.
As much as I like how this version of Chani reveals Paul as problematic to the audience, the opportunity for her to be his humanizing conscience is now gone. She's like his Lois Lane, his anchor. In the book she's the ONLY one who accepts all sides of him, as a person, and because of this she trusts him.
This is the opposite. More like a fling with an angry activist.
@@christopherpoet458I think in the books at least Chani isn’t really all that fleshed out compared to the movie. She’s pretty much gung ho with whatever Paul wants to do in the book, while in the movie they really humanize her. No one wants to be a mistress, no matter how much sweet words are said to reinforce the relationship. Loved movie Chani and the change in her character.
Spartan: Will Alia be born a Reverend Mother?
Damn, boy. Collect your trophy. No other reactor not familiar with the novels has clocked this.🎉
She already is one. That's the horror about it. Both Paul and Jessica had their own personalities and history before they drank the water to pull from, but Alia as a fetus just instantly became as aware of everything with none of her own self.
I noticed he got that too
If you guys liked Timothée's performance in this, then you should consider watching "The King" as well 🤞🏽
That’s the First movie I watch of his and he really killed that one very underrated movie also
Great movie with a great soundtrack.
Second favorite movie after this and part one combined. Perfect Shakespeare movie. This is also that, but glad y’all haven’t read the books and don’t know what’s coming. You love Paul. Can’t wait to see what you think of the next movie with that mindset…
i always say this too!! so underrated
Yessss! I highly recommend that movie. I think they would really enjoy it
I love that Spartan recognized that he’s conflicted about Paul and his intentions, is he and Jessica on the righteous path or not. A lot of reactors immediately hop on Paul’s side without considering that he might be the villain.
@@jwhite-1471 in other words, he's a much, much, much better written Anakin Skywalker.
@@jwhite-1471 I totally agree. Basically, I'm happy he didn't immediately root for Paul all the way like most people do, and he (and Pudgey) thought about the full picture of the character and who was influencing him (his mom).
He is not a villain at all , of course when he gets power his decisions are not good but the thing is , like paul said , he has seen all of the possible outcomes so he already knows everything that's gonna happen and it's only bad , there is no good future, so the only thing Paul can do is to choose a "okay" future from the all the worse ones if that makes sense because it's all bad so no matter what he does it's not gonna turn any good so all he can do is to lead the fremen to a path which is atleast okay or Better compared to the other ones and thats why the holy war needs to happen regardless of the billions dying, cause if it doesn't then the humanity will go extinct so if i were in Paul's shoes or just anyone at all, they would do the same thing! I mean what other choice does he have? he already hated the concept of holy war from the beginning of the movie and even in dune 1 but when he drinks the water he sees that there is no other way
So if anything Leto the Second (The God Emperor) is more of a villain than Paul
Yes, and that is what the director is trying to get the audience to understand. Because all of us who read the book, felt the Hero's journey, Harkonnen's bad and now wiped out. Happy ending. And the author was like NO. You missed the point. He wrote Dune Messiah as a cautionary tale about trusting these larger than life people. That's why so many of us were surprised at the different tone in the two books.
@@xen0biaI wouldn’t even compare the two!
Gotta put some respect on Timmy’s name after this movie. Acted his damn ass off. The transformation that happens after drinking the water of life is insane, he talks differently, he walks differently, he embodies a completely different person. He would have had to act completely low key and downplay his performance up until that moment to really make it hit, and he is on fire in that meeting scene, an unbelievable presence, calling everyone out and basically declaring jihad.
Really cool visual that alludes to the Princess Irulan having no choice about her own path, in the first scene we see her she wears nothing on her head to signify her freedom, then every other scene she is in she is wearing a head dress that grows more and more constricting as time goes by, eventually wearing something that resembles a complete cage by the time Paul takes her as his bride.
how would you say her face covering compares to Paul mom?
Jessica is it? maybe it represents her gaining awareness and rank in the BG
whereas the princess is losing that same control, losing her standing and inheritance
@@OctavianAsixthis is an interesting line of thought. In the age of knights men wore helmets to protect the head and face and it seems to me to signify male dominance via violence. So that could be another way to look at it she puts on a male persona; rightful heir to house Corino the next in line to the throne. It's also interesting from the point that in the book the emperor wore a helmet (Burseg). Denis really knows the books well.
I mean just go watch Beautiful Boy
To get off a sandworm you have to ride it to exhaustion. And that's how the Fremen measure distance. Once one worm is exhausted, they pull out another thumper to call a fresh ride. So their destination might be 20 thumpers away because they have to bring 20 thumpers for the journey
I really want Thimotée Chalamet to win an Oscar for this. His speech at the war meeting was one of the best things I've ever watched.
37:40 fun fact - in the book, Gurney was darker than the movie shows.
All this time he thought it was Jessica who betrayed them; he didn't know it was Doctor Yueh.
So when he found out that she's alive and with Paul, he almost killed her. He litreally had a knife at her throat. Paul convinced him at the last moment, that it wasn't Jessica who betrayed Leto and caused their downfall. Upon realization, he dropped the nife, dropped to his knees and started crying
Was so disappointed they didn't include this and Jamis' funeral scene. Including no Thufir! no revelation about who Liet Kynes is.... I feel like the movie was going to be something else completely, probably closer to the book but they made this movie almost so you don't have to watch part 1. They're almost like two different movies entirely, even though one says "part 1" and the other "part 2".
Yes! The Reverend Mother knew very well that Jessica was the natural daughter of the Baron-because once upon a time, she had been the Bene Gesserit assigned to secure the Baron’s bloodline.
I think the moment that really signals the transition to Paul being legitimately scary is when the random Fremen fighter tries to kill Rabban by jumping onto the thopter. She knows full well that whether or not she succeeds it's a one way trip, but she does it anyway. The way she screams "for Muad'Dib" just before she goes down is chilling, since it seems to really go against Fremen survival instincts.
Shishakli, Chani’s friend, stayed behind to buy the others time and take out as many as she could. A noble sacrifice - they really made me care for this random 😭.
lol I felt nothing.
@@di3486 I didn’t the first watch but I saw it theaters again the next day and she stood out more/realized how present she was so her death got me the next time.
But, like, what for? If the deaths of the enemies mattered and were an honorable cause, why did she stay behind alone? And if they didn't matter, why not live to fight another day and support the actual war effort?
In the end, Paul's vision of burnt Chani was actually the fate of Shishakli.
@@xen0bia You mean Fate?
You saw the stabbing! Feyd-Rautha stabbed Paul with Paul's own knife...which was the knife he got from Chani in Part One. Then he pulled it out and stabbed Feyd-Rautha with it while using Gurney's fight move from the sparring in Part One! The vision came true...figuratively!
Also, remember, it is mentioned only once, but Paul cannot foresee the future when it belongs to another medium with prescience, like Feyd-Rautha, a prospect for Kwisatz Haderach (--> attack on Sietch Tabr).
In the book he cannot see any of the fight and also not the outcome of the fight, which makes it spicy and nervewrecking in the book, however, he saw the Jihad happening either way, with or without him alive.
In the movie they also show that he could not see this fight, however, in the movie he was able to see the very last image of the outcome of the fight when the prescience of Feyd-Rautha was gone as an obstacle to his prescience, and so, Paul knew Chani's blade and getting stabbed by it was the key to win.
Feud rautha doesn't have prescience, and in the book, the reason he cannot see the outcome of the fight, is because there are too many timelines coming together, at that point none of the prescient can see past that point, it's even commented about how the guild navigators know he's not bluffing about destroying the spice because the many outcomes of this fight, and the possibility of the spice being destroyed completely has created a focus point though which all timelines flow and no one can see past.
@@lachlanmarshall39 These points of convergence are always tied to beings with prescience.
@@bobbwc7011 yes, and the being with prescience that convergence point was tied to is Paul.
One of my favorite details from these movies that idk seems to be overlooked a lot is how when ships with shields get blown up, the explosion stays within the shield (which just looks sick) until it breaks the shield generator.
"...but I do see a way, there is a narrow way through..."
He saw himself being stabbed by Feyd-Rautha during their fight, and that he'd *have* to be stabbed, but in the exact right spot, at the exact right time, in the exact right place, so that he wouldn't die from the fight but also throw Feyd-Rautha off his guard by making him think he's already won by landing a blow.
4D Chess.
There’s also a shot in the movie where you see Princess Irulan at the end of a very narrow hallway. Which was a really cool touch about securing the throne.
"feints within feints within feints" as the books say
I think there's no way feyd rautha would win during a fight, given the powers Paul has...it's just for suspence. The fight would be easy for Paul, he wouldn't even need to be stabbed to win
i just assumed he was envisioning clearing a way for the sand worms as the "narrow way through". It's probably just all of the above
Foreshadowing the Golden Path...
1:02:27 From the first book: "In that instant, Paul saw how Stilgar had been transformed from the Fremen naib to a creature of the Lisan al-Gaib, a receptacle for awe and obedience. It was a lessening of the man, and Paul felt the ghost-wind of the jihad in it."
Don’t get too fixed on any one thing from Paul’s visions, such as the scene of Chani stabbing him. He didn’t understand at first, but remember, he sees all possible futures. This is why he told the Reverend Mother his dreams don’t always come to pass exactly as he dreamed it. We are often showed the possible future where Jamis is his friend and teacher instead of his mortal antagonist.
Think of the flow of time like a river. If one perceives the whole of the terrain, one can both see where that river will probably flow as well as all the other ways it could flow, along with what is needs to make the river of time follow the path of your choosing. This is what Paul meant when he said he saw a narrow way. Him taking on the role of Lisan al-Gaib, using the atomic to destroy the shield wall, marrying the Princess, and even unleashing the Holy War he dreaded, these were all necessary parts in the path not only to revenge but to save the Fremen and protect Arakis.
The opening salvo of nukes was to destroy the mountain range that circles Arrakeen and provides it the protection from the worms. With the mountains breached, the worm riders could attack the city inside the city's basin.
The movie left out a quote from Lady Jessica. “ you see her standing there, so haughty, so confident. Let us hope she finds solace in her writing and books. She’ll have little else. She may have my son’s name, but it’s we who carry the name of concubines that history will call us wives”.
People always mention that quote, and while it shows just how different the ending is in the book, we also never get to read Chani's exact response in that moment. Of course book Chani is much different from movie Chani, but still, it's not like she's partying at the end of the book either. That's why Jessica has to comfort her in the first place. And she's not wrong with her statement, but in Dune Messiah we see just how fucked the whole situation between their triangle is.
@@nikolaiquack8548 her response to that quote doesn’t matter that much based on what follows in messiah + paul confirmed to her before jessica said that, that irulan wont have any kind of affection from him. Instead this ending made it seem like Chani leaves Paul for good and missed out on one of the most anticipated adaptions from the book. It’s a shame, but I’m interested to see how he’ll adapt the 3rd book based on how this ended.
That was the last paragraph of the book if I remember correct?
Not just some random quote also. It's the last sentence of the first book. 😉
It shows that Chani in the movies and Chani in the books are not the same character 😉😉
The "silence" of Paul, is the "you should not pass" of gandalf. Epic
“Shall”. Sorry, I had to be *that* guy. But, I give you props for the awesome comparison. Love it!
Lol, not even close.
@@hoya1178 Yeah Dune is fantastic but LOTR is on a different level
@@pabloc8808cap
@@pabloc8808 😆
You two would love the Netflix movie, The King with Timothee Chalamet and Robert Pattinson. Great acting and fighting. The Kings of England and France go head to head.
That stomp by Paul might be my favourite thing in both movies so far.
The "SILENCE!" at the reverend mother is the best show of power.
Notice how the fremen just said the worm was big, but the lady tells thestory that its the biggest ever seen
1:02:25
"In that instant, Paul saw how Stilgar had been transformed from the Fremen naib to a creature of the Lisan al-Gaib, a receptacle for awe and obedience. It was a lessening of the man, and Paul felt the ghost-wind of the jihad in it.
I have seen a friend become a worshiper, he thought.
Muad'Dib from whom all blessings flow, he thought, and it was the bitterest thought of his life."
1:18:20 In the book, the time between Paul meeting Chani and the battle with the Emperor was about 3 years.
During that time Jessica gave birth to Alia. Also Paul and Chani had a son they named Leto.
So their relationship dynamic and her expectations on their future were very different. Chani and Jessica had a mutually respectful relationship and they supported one another in helping Paul ascend to power.
So many things changed but I understand why. When Dune came out the author Frank Herbert was shocked that people thought that this was just another hero’s journey type story.
"We whom the law calls concubines, history will remember us as wives." -- Jessica to Chani
Book physics: if a shield is struck by a lasgun (laser rifle), it goes off like a nuke. The Sardaukar didn’t dare activate their shields when under fire in the desert, and it wasn’t even because of the worms.
Poses the question why dont they just use laser guns all the time? Shoot them from miles away and they either explode or die if they have shield on or not?
@@pepsipwns666 its double edged, the outcome is unknwon, it could very well cause the atomic explosion not at the shielded target but the user using the lasgon, basically its unknown how it'll react and how it'll explode + politics, any atomic explosion leaves trail that will be spotted by others. Duncan actually does this once in the books where he takes an ornithopter, shields and mask it poorly in the desert, when they shot at it, it destroyed everything in the radius and since then they stopped using it in the conflict. Dennis overused the lasguns as in the first book its rarely used.
Because both die, the person shooting and the target, they both blow up @@pepsipwns666
@@pepsipwns666The reaction travels back along the laser beam, detonating within the firing lasgun AND at the shield where the laser hits. You have two massive detonations that are indistinguishable from normal atomic weapon explosions.
The Great Convention, which everyone in the Imperium obeys, states that using atomic weapons against humans is strictly forbidden (Paul got around this by firing his atomics at the shield wall mountains instead of his human opponents. It’s not illegal to use them to change geological features.) If you break these ancient rules, everyone in the galaxy will turn on you and wipe out your world.
That’s why using laser/shield reactions as weapons is seriously avoided by the great houses. The risk that others will think you are illegally using actual atomic weapons in war is far too great.
@@pepsipwns666 It destroys both the shield wearer and the shooter.
There will be a third movie. Definitely.
It is in pre production, right now.
The first two films are telling the story of the first book.
Frank Herbert's book was a huge, worldwide success. Praised and beloved by millions.
But the author was disappointed about the conclusions of the majorly of the readers.
His book was seen as a tale of a savior, who rises up to save the world.
And that was quite the opposite of Herbert's idea.
He originally wanted to tell a story about manipulation through faith and curruption by power. A warning about false prophets and we should never follow someone blindly...but the readers did not get it.
So, in order to set things straight, Frank Herbert wrote another book: Dune Messiah.
The third Dune movie will have the same name. Dune Messiah.
Will this be the end? Maybe. After three movies only the stories of two Dune books will have been told...of tow books, of six Dune books, which Frank Herbert wrote 😉
Half true.
He wrote the first 3 books as one book, and children/messiah were written first, before Dune1. His publisher made him split it into 3 books.
8:54 We also see Duncan use a variation of this tech in part one, while fighting his way through the palace. It's very subtle tho.
After defeating a small group of enemy soldiers, one more appears at a distance and shoots one of those shield-piercing darts at him. He knocks it away, throws his dagger at the shooter to knock him off balance (when it bounces off the shield), then taps his belt to activate the anti-grav assist and jumps several meters in one leap to reach the enemy before he can recover.
Yes, it is a form of anti-grav tech called suspensors (suspending gravity).
this tech shows up as red lights you see on Duncan's belt(I think) and down the Barons back in the "Steamroom scene" in 1st movie. Also the chairs use them in the conference room hence no legs.
I like what is basically every reactor's shock to Feyd-Rautha killing the two girls in the movie. We were just told that he is psychotic, but the description doesn't really hit home until we watch him actually being psychotic.
The whole family does that on the regular though. Rabban kills his advisors and underlings for daring to tell him what to do, and the Baron kills his servants for fun. In the neofeudalism of the Imperium, human life has no intrinsic value except at the whim of one’s superiors and overlords.
That is something they failed to do in the first Dune. We never see Sting’s version so anything but grimace and stand around in a leather bikini.
So by the time the final duel happens you are like this dude is gonna get curbed
Saw Dune 2 in theaters and watched it again when it started streaming on HBO. Loved the first movie, but for me, Dune 2 is next level. One of those movies I'll watch over and over again.
A little tidbit, Jessica speaking telepathically to the other Reverend Mother is because when they become Reverend Mother's they access their whole maternal bloodline's ancestral memory. The other Reverend mother is Jessica's mother...
I doubt this will ever be brought up in the movies though. There's only a very brief mention of Gaius Helen Mohiam being Jessica's mother in the books and in the end it's entirely inconsequential. In movie universe, I think they can speak to each other simply because they are both reverend mothers.
I laughed when Spartan said “I bet the Reverend Mother knows” and thought that Roxy line:
Oh. Does. She. Knows
@@xen0bia It's never mentioned in the books that Mohaim is Jessica's mother. It's only mentioned as a likelihood in a third party encyclopaedia not written by Frank.
@@lachlanmarshall39it's a plot point in the "House" spin off books by Frank Herbert's son and Kevin J Anderson. However those books are full of other stuff that directly contradict things stated in the Frank Herbert books, and besides it just makes the universe feel small. They are moderately fun in a pulpy, low quality way, but in my opinion should absolutely not be considered canon.
The Fremen get off the worm by riding it to exhaustion and sliding off of it when it slows down or stops because it is tired.
The worm doesn't like to travel on the surface. The hooks are not just designed to allow the rider to stick to the worm, but also to divaricate the worm's overlapping outer skin segments, so that the much tender inner parts can be exposed. The worm then doesn't submerge because the friction caused by the sand would irritate his soft tissues and is forced to move on the surface.
They make use of two hooks because they need to be able to relocate one of them (at a time) to other parts of the worm in order to control the travel direction or to force the worm to rotate around its main axis.
13:19 "A man's flesh is his own; the water belongs to the tribe."
Dune has been my obsession for the past few years and hands down one of my favourite movies of all time, and today is my birthday and your reaction is like a little present, especially for me yay 🎉
thank you for always giving your viewers great content ❤
Happiest of birthdays!!! 🥰 hope you have a day full of love and joy!
@SpartanandPudgey thank you so much! ❤
Greetings from Bulgaria 🇧🇬
Today is mine. Happy birthday dude, cheers
2:26 Paul is the fulcrum upon which the universe is pivoting. He is both the instigator and the observer of events.
That was a cold comment right there
@@abdulla10955 LMAO ong
@@abdulla10955 Thanks. If memory serves me right it's from the book. Paul describes himself as the "giver and the taker"
Man, Pudgy was completely sold on Paul being a Messiah right from the start. 😂
Lisan Al Gaib!!!!! Lol
Ideally the fremen would have believed in themselves and realized all they could achieve without a messiah, being the best fighters in all the Imperium, but ultimately Paul is the one to unite them and fight with them and unleash them into the universe. One of the messages of the Dune series is that tragically all people deep down seek to be lead by someone who will galvanize them down the right path. The God Emperor forcing peace upon the universe for thousands of years finally lit the fire in humanity that made them want to break free, but ultimately he foresees that they will again walk down familiar paths and seek to follow someone.
I'm disappointed in the readers who can't stop themselves from commenting on things that haven't happened yet. Let people speculate in peace. If you can't contain your enthusiasm for comparing and contrasting without spoiling, then I'm sure you could find forums to discuss it with people who are in the same situation.
Yeah they spoiled everything for me
The books have been out for years. It's not their fault you couldn't be bothered to read them.
@@Whiskey0880 I have read them, I just have enough sense to keep those conversations to people who also have, or actually ask. Also, some people don't read them until after the movie series is complete, if they weren't aware of the books before the first movie, and that's fine too.
9:18 "Why don't they have their shields on?" It was mentioned in the first movie (and the book) but shields of any kind (due to the intense vibration they cause) sends the worms into a killing frenzy. So turning their shields on would have attracted tons of worms.
Chani's friend stayed behind to give the rest of them time. Remember, she was very hesitant about Paul being the messiah, to begin with, but then she was turned into a believer, a devoted follower actually. She sacrificed herself
32:37 And THAT is how you introduce a villain!!
I heard somewhere that Austin Butler spent 4 months in Budapest, Hungary, training with a far US NAVY SEAL to get in shape for the role!!
44:27 For any fans of God Emperor of Dune, I can't believe she organically called Paul first sighting of the golden path as "The whole Shebang". This is unbelievable I cant stop laughing.
I don't think that paul actually changed, he just knew he had a role to play
plans withing plans, the Bene Gesserit are not alone planing things in the imperium....Space Guild, Bene Tlelaxu, Ixian, the great houses....Dune saga is HUGE.
I love that EVERY single reactor I've watched says "how do you get off"? When Paul is riding the sandworm 😂😂😂
To add to what others have said about not using the shields: a shield that is hit by a laser weapon explodes on the scale of nuclear weapons. If you don’t know where your enemy is, you avoid using shields because they may use lasers on your shields unless they’re close.
The thing about Paul is that his base personality hasn't changed, but his perception has. He constantly sees through space and time and can see the results of every action he takes. He can see the 'narrow way through', and he is performing the actions he can see will lead to the desired outcome. He can also see that although it is the only viable course of action, he will have to cause much suffering. Inside, he still has moral doubts, and he still loves Chani, but he knows the path he has to take.
A tragic villain indeed.
After taking the chosen path he cannot move away. The third movie should stress it more and how that absolute perception destroyed Paul. He chooses to be a mortal human. But I guess that the plot about he freeing himself of fate will be left out because there will be no adaptation for children of dune, only the Messiah. The thing is, the director may change everything and point another way. I'm not even sure if we will ever see the guild navigators and have an explanation on Mentats.
@@hoon_sol Paul isn't a villain though lmao. This take is very surface level.
@@dess234:
Paul is very much a villain. That's not really a "take", it's how both the novels and films were written. He's really an archetypal tragic villain, in many ways also an anti-villain; a tragic anti-villain.
@@hoon_sol He's 100% not a villian in the books LMAO. Everyone seems to misinterpret Frank's quote and run with it. paul isn't a villian whatsoever. A villain is someone with evil motives and intentions. Nothing abt Paul's motives were evil. Trying to label Paul as a villain is honestly very disingenuous to the real message of the book lmao. A villain wouldn't be trying to stop all of this and refusing to go down a certain path. Paul spent the first and second book trying to prevent the Jihad. A villain wouldn't be trying to do damage control like Paul was doing. Did people die, yes, but people were going to die regardless of whether Paul became in power or not. Let's also remember that Paul is a child at this point in the movie still (he's only 15) with the power of prescience, being subject to hallucinogenics and so forth. He was forced to make decisions that adults probably would struggle to make themselves. He was robbed of free will once he unlocked the power of his prescience. How exactly can you try to make decisions, if you already know what's going to happen. The best you can do is damage control which is what he was doing. Paul isn't a bad person, it's more so the consequences of him. I'm not saying that paul is a hero necessarily, but he's also not a villain, that's such black and white thinking. By definition he's a tragic hero (Tragic heroes typically have heroic traits that earn them the sympathy of the audience, but also have flaws or make mistakes that ultimately lead to their own downfall). He also is a human being lmaooo. Paul isn't really in control of much since this entire plan is bigger than him.
Probs to pudgey, the first one that noticed that Paul wanted the emperor to kiss the ring, not only the hand.
As for him being stabbed, it wasn't because he couldn't see it, it's because he did see it. There was only 1 way to beat Fayd and yes, he killed him with Gurneys move from part 1!
There's a flash of the blade in him earlier in the movie.
That said, in the book, Fayd is a person that he's never seen in a vision, hence no visions, other than the blade in him, of him in the movie.
Your comment at the end about wondering if the good guys are really the right side is very insightful. Paul is an awesome protagonist, but his actions are very morally grey at times. He's aiming for a perfect future, this "golden path" that leads humanity to prosperity, but some bad things have to happen along the way to get there. Including his holy war that results in a lot of dead people.
But boy it sure is satisfying to watch him avenge his father's death and put everyone else in their place!
Morally grey? He intentionalky, willfullingly orders the biggest mass murder in mankind's history. He is the villain. There is no grey, only black.
And no, Paul did not see the Golden Path at the end of the original book. That comes later. The Jihad is not part of the Golden Path.
Yeah, just like @bobbwc7011 said, it's not morally grey, it's *entirely* wrong. Paul himself recognizes this in Dune Messiah, literally comparing himself to Hitler (and Stilgar adding a layer of hurt by saying Hitler's killcount was pretty weak compared to Muad'Dib's...), and he's pretty much known as a tyrant throughout the universe. But some will argue that he is a lesser evil, compared to his son... If anything, Paul is a tragic character who really never had a chance to be his own person and who could not deviate from his set path. He was always a tool of political scheming, a prisoner of religious fervor, prophecy and time itself. "To know the future is to be trapped by it."
Take a shot every time Pudgey says “Oh Shit” during their reactions. You won’t make it to the end before you die.
The body shield is a Holtzman shield made from thin layer of atoms, a lasgun is similarly using atoms at their most excited level, if they collide it produces a thermonuclear reaction. Hence it's not a good idea. Lasgun-shield interactions look and act like atomic explosions, which are explicitly banned.
i believe in the books paul is only 15 so choosing an actor with that smaller build made a lot of sense
He is also described as being on the small side.
Chani makes him a Fremen. Doesnt matter what she does within the prophecy. Her role was larger, she's literally the one who help him come to the conclusion "father, i've found my way"
I always loved Paul's line to Chani: "I will love you as long as I breathe." At one point, he didn't breathe no more when he drank the poison. My personal head canon is that was his last goodbye as the Paul she knew and loved.
In the book Chani was the daughter of Liet Kynes (who was a man) the emperor's " judge of the change." Liet was also the secret leader of the Fremen.
59:00, There are three character rich conversations from the book are missing from the showdown scene with the Emperor.
1) Thufir Hawat (the older chubby man from the first movie) Duke Leto’s Mentat advisor actually survived the Fall of House Atreides. The Harkonnens captured him and forced him to work for them. In secret despite being brutalized constantly, Thufir was still loyal to House Atreides. So when he found out that Gurney was still alive, he started feeding Gurney information to hurt the Harkonnen's spice trade.
In this final scene, Thufir is given a poison needle to jab Paul with. Instead of betraying Paul he stabs his own hand with it. Thufir lives long enough to stand in front of Paul and address him as “My Duke”. It is a bittersweet moment for both of them as Thufir was like a grandfather to Paul. Thufir died happy to see Paul live to avenge his father and reestablish House Atreides. He had served Paul's grandfather Paulus Atreides and then his father Leto Atreides. So with his last breath Thufir let Paul know "I'm still your loyal man now and for always".
As soon as Thufir dies, Paul stands up, wipes away his tears and calls out Feyd Rautha. He wanted to make sure everyone responsible for the death of his father and teachers would get it.
Denis Villanueve did film this final scene but left it on the cutting room floor. Steven M. McKinley who played Thufir Hawat gave an interview about being disappointed that his work was left out of the second movie.
2) After Paul defeats Feyd, the Emperor Shaddam asks his best friend Count Hasimir Fenring to challenge Paul. Fenring is the husband of Margot Fenring the Bene Gesserit who got impregnated by Feyd. Fenring despite his mild manner appearance is the Emperor's personal hitman. Fenring is almost a Kwitzach Haderach like Paul and has been trained by his wife Margot in Bene Gesserit ways. So with all of those skills Fenring could potentially defeat Paul in single combat
But when Fenring and Paul looked at one another across the throne room, they experienced a shared moment of kinship. Fenring sees in Paul all he could have become had he not been born a genetic eunuch. Because of this birth defect Fenring can't father children with his beautiful wife or any woman. Paul also sees what Fenring is seeing in that moment and conveys back to the Count not pity but brotherhood. After that shared moment, Fenring turns to his best friend Emperor Shaddam and says "No". This was the first time that Shaddam was ever turned down by Fenring and he is shook to his core.
Denis Villanueve also filmed this final scene but left it on the cutting room floor. Actor Tim Blake Nelson who played Count Fenring has also given interviews about his heartbreak with being left out.
3) Paul and Jessica letting Chani know that the marriage to Princess Irulan is merely political. They explain that Paul will never spend time with Irulan, show her any passion or sire children with her. The Imperial marriage is all for show. Paul basically marries Irulan then goes home to Chani. They never mistreat the Princess but everyone knows that she is Empress in name only.
David Lynch the director of the 1984 version of Dune actually filmed both the Thufir and Chani scenes and they can be found on UA-cam.
movies felt like chopped off bits weirdly put together to me tho i never read the books. there was no flow. now i see a possible reason. it is a shame because one could sense how great this could have been aswell.
Here's hoping for an extended cut.
@@19_meg_91 Denis never does extended or director's cut, unfortunately. He literally stated he makes only one version of the movie and that is the movie people will get to see.
@@stylishskater92 Damn that sucks
Let's hope those missing scenes are in an extended video release.
I love how the visions are so unpredictable. In part one for example You can see a moment where Paul in his visions is an Emperor already during the Holy War mess, but theres Chani by his side, they both standing on a ship, watching scene from above. Then in the end of part 2 Paul takes Irulan for his wife. I cant wait for the 3rd movie. Its goin to be a book nr 2 The Messiah of Dune. Its goin to be sick !! Denis created a masterpiece. The visuals, cinematography, music of maestro Hans Zimmer... I love how monumental this picture is.
Not only is Vladimir Harkonnen Jessica's father, her mother is none other than Reverend Mother Helen Gaius Mohiam.
I would say Paul didn't change, he just committed to a course of action based on all the facts, now that he can see everything that happens.
I don’t know if it’s only my perception. But in the first part the voice said Paul needs to die to be reborn, and in the next sentence it says you die if you take a life. So technically when he killed Jamis, he "died" to be reborn
This is correct
From what I remember of the book, in order to ride the sandworm Paul has to pull up on one of the segments. Because the worm doesn't like how it feels to get sand under that segment it will stay on the surface while it is held open. He can just release the segment so the worm wants to dive into the sand and hop off. I'm sure it's probably as difficult and risky as hopping on.
Dune 2 was awesome and the scene where he called and rode the worm was one of the best sounding scenes I’ve ever seen in a theatre. The whole place was shaking from the bass
Yeah I saw it in IMAX and that scene and couple others had me trembling from the vibration of the epic bass/surround sound. 🥰
I liked that Spartan noticed that Stilgar had just become a fanatic servant in the end. Paul lost a friend and gained a follower - it's not a good trade.
You keep waiting for the stab but you missed that the visions were only fragments. The faces of the visions aren’t always the right people look at Paul’s vision were he is fighting in the war but it was actually Chani revealed in Dune 2
The intersection of a lasgun beam and a Holtzman shield creates what is essentially a small-yield nuclear explosion, destroying the lasgun wielder and the shielded target as well as everything in the immediate vicinity.
I couldn't wait for your reaction to Dune 2 !
Chani will be his concubine. Messiah takes place 12 years after the holy war. Probably a bit longer since they sped things up and Alia isn’t born yet. Dune ends and she’s around 3 or so. They changed Chani a good bit. She doesn’t kill Paul. Remember he said he has seen that she will come to understand
Theres a few key things which should get pointed out when it comes to the personal shields and combat in Dune.
Laser based weaponry (Lasguns) was very common in Dune, however it was outlawed after the invention of the personal shield. As the interaction of the Shield and Lasgun fire would cause devastating explosions. Now the Fremen do have some projectile based weapons which can be seen in the first few scenes in the film. But they are all very "low tech" and not too common in full combat due to the Holtzman shield being very proficient at blocking them.
It was also mentioned in Dune Part 1 that the shields in the open desert or Worm Territory will drive the Worms into a killing frenzy, which at that point you have to hedge your bets. The films didn't really delve into the subject too much. But these are the 2 biggest reasons why the Harkonnens in the opening fight say "No shields"
There is also so much to talk about when it comes to Jessica drinking the water of life while she was Pregnant. Too much for a single YT comment anyhow. But you see it on the elderly Reverend Mothers face when they found out. She dun fucked up.
Hey, I didn't notice if someone already commented on it - In the issue of not taking things literally, a bloody knife is a symbol for war, and she stabbing him is the same as Jamis stabbing him in his final vision. The point is that she will take a main part in his future fate that will lead to war. This is also true for the copter vision - Jamis says that he will show him the ways of the desert... and he does, in visions.
Other than that - Your videos are wonderful, I've been binging them for a week.
"Once men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free. But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them."
I think about that all the time. I wish Denis could have put that part of the lore into it.
@@technofilejr3401 I too feel conflicted about the missing stuff. But maybe Deniz found it necessary to cut back on the story, so non readers of the books have an easier time to enjoy the movie.
One of the core tenets of the galactic society in which the events of 'Dune' (books and movies) transpire is that artificial intelligence is evil, and that quote is one of the reasons why. That's why the story contains no artificial intelligence technology, and not much in the way of computer tech.
The corollary to "Who will guard the guards themselves?" is "He who programs or trains the AIs that rule is the real power behind the throne."
so like today... OpenAI, Facebook, Google, Meta, bla bla bla...
@@Grumpy_Rabbit haven't read the books so idk if it's appropriate to call it contradictory but
it's interesting how they have mentats AND Bene G people in universe, meanwhile they're worried abt Ai
I do plan on picking up the books so no need for spoilers, I just thought you could offer guidance in terms of those themes
Loved your intro here, you guys really took the time to think about the first movie and sounds like a lot of things made more sense with the rewatch. Also agree that Part Two was even better, and not only that, it actually elevates the first one. Great reaction and discussion all around, thanks guys.
I was so excited when I saw you posted the reaction! Such a masterpiece with soooo many details. One that I found particularly interesting: At the end, you see the Fremen burning the bodys of those who passed (Harkonnen, Sadaurkar and Fremen) although their culture is to preserve all water (like in the beginning, when they harvested the Harkonnens water for their cooling systemts). Just shows how powerful religious fervor can be and how quickly it makes people abandon their core beliefs
That Steve Carrell clip when you stumbled words was so small but hilarious. You guys are awesome.
@Spartan & Pudgey
I can see path where Jaimis is training young duke-boy. When he and his mother first met fremen group, fremen said boy is young we can teach our ways, but mother needs to die. That was path where Jaimis is training him. Meaning if he wouldn't stand up and fight for her mother as she's champion, instead let mother fight herself and potentially get killed by Jaimis.
What Lady Margot Fenring did was what Lady Jessica was originally sent to do with Duke Leto Atreides, but she genuinely fell in love with him and produced a male heir to continue the Atreides Bloodline, as well as possibly giving birth to "The One"
"It is impossible to live in the past, difficult to live in the present and a waste to live in the future."
I love love LOVE that this was all shot on location in natural light and that the effects are mostly practical with VFX used sparingly to fill in the blanks. It's so clear how much better this film looks than anything in the MCU, where they shoot in studio lighting with green/blue screens. Like the scene where Paul catches and rides the sand worm is almost entirely practical effects, you should check out a behind the scenes for that! It makes it all feel so much more real and believable, no uncanny valley weirdness.
The nuclear warheads that Paul unleashes are there to destroy the "Shield Wall." This is a rock formation that protects the city from the open desert and the worms. This is mentioned in the first film. By destroying the Wall, it makes the city vulnerable to the worms. This allows access to the Emperor's Sardaukar forces so the Fremen Fedaykin can ride the worms into battle.
No mater how many times i see that ending and hear that music i always get chills... this movie is a masterpice
1:15:26 Alia taking the water of life before birth is the abomination that Reverend Mother Mohiam was talking about.
Alia already has all of the ancestral memories that Paul and Jessica can access. The Bene Gesserit call such a person preborn.
and why is it an abomination then? it seems powerful to give a fetus the water of life
@@smashmusiqueThe fetus doesn't develop it's own personality as much. It lives in the head of its other personalities, including male ancestors, and one of these ancestors could possess her and basically throw the Bene Gesserit's plans into chaos.
LOVE your reactions. I love Paul's character, it's rare that a character impresses me this much in anything. I flew to another city to view this in IMAX for once because this film was just cinematic excellence.
The water of life is the bile of a drowning worm. I have read the books, loved the first movie, even liked the short tv series and listened to the audiobooks. But these new movies are absolutely brilliant. Can’t wait for the third 🤩👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻❤️
I don’t remember the exact quote but there is a point where Paul is thinking about Stilgar and is sad because he realized he lost a friend to a follower.
In that instant, Paul saw how Stilgar had been transformed from the Fremen naib to a creature of the Lisan al-Gaib, a receptacle for awe and obedience. It was a lessening of the man, and Paul felt the ghost-wind of the jihad in it.
I have seen a friend become a worshiper, he thought.
…Muad’Dib from whom all blessings flow, he thought, and it was the bitterest thought of his life.
You guys reaction is one of the best I've seen I really enjoyed rediscovering this movie through your eyes. It's a very complex story and you guys did A great job of understanding the complexities of the story. ❤
I read Dune in 1975 or 76 I was about 15 or 16. Star Wars came out in '77 I've been waiting for a movie that could capture the book since then.
The book had a big influence on my life, I was at a point in my life where I questioned religion and being a good person who didn't believe in God. This story helps settle that for me. It also opened my teenage eyes to the corruption inherent in religion and all powerful people, which was the point of the book and I think this movie captures that. I have never since then put my complete faith in any powerful leader even one with the best of intentions and that I support politically.
8:58 it's not explicitly explained in the movie but the devices that let them float called repulsors in the book, will attract the sand worm. So they use it sparingly if at all. Now that the thumper has been activated and the worm is coming anyway they can freely use their repulsors.
27:24 Chini is riding Paul's worm 😉
28:06 you guys are one of the few reacting to this movie that actually get that the predictions are made up. Most people say oh it's all coming true. It was designed to come true. It was designed to be vague and easy to distort into a prophecy.
@1:02:20 PS Your quote about Stilgar going from a mentor to just another zealot minion is right on, and Paul is pretty devastated, disappointed, and hurt by it in the book, even knowing it's part of his "plan" aka the "Golden Path." “In that instant, Paul saw how Stilgar had been transformed from the Fremen naib to a creature of the Lisan al-Gaib, a receptacle for awe and obedience. It was a lessening of the man, and Paul felt the ghost-wind of the jihad in it.”
19:04 The editor did Spartan dirty 😂
the editor was Spartan himself!😂
Pudgey making Stilgar noises is about the cutest thing
I'm both surprised and not that many people preferred the second film. It does have more action scenes, after all, and many people want that in their film experience. Myself, I was a bit disappointed. It felt rushed and disconnected, as Spartan seemed to recognise with his statements like "yesterday they wanted to kill him; today they love him", "no way, already?", and "this show builds things up sometimes and then boom, now we're here". He's also on point saying he doesn't know whether we're on the righteous side. An early complaint I had was that Paul never really failed, but now I realize that a lot of villains in films aren't defeated until the end. I don't want Paul to be a villain though!
Either way, I'm sure I'll like it better on a re-watch. There's a lot I really enjoyed anyway. Like Timothée Chalamet's acting was supreme. Almost channeling Khal Drogo in his speech at the fremen council! So impressive. Killing the Baron so brusquely after he was made small by the emperor was just right.
I like how the theme that plays as Paul finishes the fight and walks to the emperor is like something from Jaws of a shark coming close to it's victim.
The problem with foretelling the future, is once forecast, by the very fact that you know the future, means you’ll make choices that change the future that you saw.
The future is in flux for the seer.
Frank Herbert said, that he never understood how people talk about the future. The future as if it’s a fixed destination towards which we go.
He said that he believed in a future, not the future. The future is always changing. This idea is what inspired Frank Herbert’s framework for prophecy.
The (perhaps sad) thing is that is the opposite of reality.
@@CliffSedge-nu5fv Clarify?
27:32 Lol Pudgey. Not gonna lie I was thinking the same thing in the theater
27:33 remember, the tents collect the water and recycle it for them to drink. So they are not wasting water they can drink up the cleaned stuff afterwards 😂😂😜😜
35:12 Basically. And he has visions too, just like Paul which is why he can later fiend the place where the Fremen were living 40:08.
I was told that in the book, the Baron was killed by Alia, Paul’s sister. She was only 2 at the time. I’m kinda glad the director let Paul do the deed because that would’ve been a bit too much for the tone of the movie.
to get off a worm, In the books you usually rode a worm to exhaustion and slid off near the tail, but not at the very end of the tail because of the heat generate by the worms travel
Pudgy nailed it with the issue of “control” between the Reverend Mother & Paul-The Kwisatz Haderach is meant to be controlled, (that’s why she is so focused on the Atreides “defiance”,) because the Bene Gesserit is a political organization, à la the Catholic Church, (think about the early church in Europe and their use of messiah mythology.) From what I recall, Paul was supposed to be a daughter, and that daughter was meant to be paired with Feyd-Rautha, and thus producing the Kwisatz Haderach. That didn’t happen, as we saw.
The whole “the one” stuff is a moot point.
Also, y’all just saw the “narrow way,” in short, the duel w/ Feyd, (the mirror of Paul-As y’all noted in the reaction.)
This is not a spoiler, but y’all are having trouble making predictions because ya don’t realize the six books cover generations. Dune Messiah, (Book 2 of 6,) is basically an epilogue to Dune, (1 of 6,)…
…which is why I am so freakin’ excited to see what Denis Villeneuve is going to do because Dune Messiah is perhaps the biggest uphill battle of this series-It’s the conclusion to a story that should have felt like it just concluded. Let’s just say, Villeneuve brilliantly navigated Part Two.
Remember, they just basically took out the Harkonnens (the Atreides ancestral rivals,) and the Emperor. It’s going to be very exciting to see what Villeneuve adds to Part Three.
I will say, I think the Bene Gesserit series might actually be important to see prior to Part Three.
Me not seeing this in theaters was one of my biggest movie theater regrets. Next to not watching Oppenheimer in theaters. 💜
Dude!!!!! I saw it 6 times, 2 times in iMax. It is THE BEST movie since Return of the King 2003.
I commend you two for rewatching Dune Part One before watching this masterpiece. Shows how much you want to understand this world and get the most out of your viewing experience. As a longtime fan of the the novels and Denis Villeneuve's directing talent, I enjoy your very perceptive reactions!