Same here. I invested in the Kickstart campaign cuz I loves Suikoden and want there to be more games like it. I've played the first two Suikoden games several times each so I won't be giving Konami my money for a touched up version of them. I very much look forward to Eiyuden Chronicle's release.
@@seapeajones For sure. Konami saw the success of Eiyuden's Kickstarter campaign and big Yen signs popped up in their eyes. They are only doing this because Eiyuden Chronicle showed them there was still interest for Suikoden. If it weren't for that Konami would have let the series die forever unless there was a way to turn Suikoden into a pachinko machine. How far Konami has fallen since the glory days of the 90s.
The producers of the Suikoden I&II remaster stated that if this release is successful they would love to continue the series, so I hope every fan out there supports it so that we may get another remaster (or even a Suikoden 6?)
I will be buying suikoden over eiyuden all day. Eiyuden had its chance to deliver in 2022 like they promised and gave us bull sh** rising. Now konami is taking the glory I can't know there is a remastered suikoden and not buy it.
@@kaiser_1991 you're aware that Rising merely served as a companion game prior to the full game, which will be released this year, right? It was the final goal of their kickstarter and they reached it, so they produced that game in order to create a game based on that world, but it has little to do with the upcoming main game. They're totally different.
a handful of people working on Eiyuden Chronicle are also working on Suikoden Remaster. Most of the people that left Konami didn't leave upset. Most of them just left upset that their creations were no longer being greenlit. There's not really a competition going on here.
Yeah, Murayama has said that he left Konami simply because he didn't want to stay in one place for too long and that he was on good terms with the company. Konami even made 2 more mainline Suikoden games without him.
No new content, war, cooking (sui2) nor duel footage sucks, and clive's quest needs quality of life. It's the equivalent of Judge Judy's shiny shiny red truck ✨️. Some eiyuden footage is goofy too and the side scrollr bored me to tears.
Agreed, not a fan how they waited for the Kickstarter to be same year. I am more than happy to buy both games and hope both succeed. I been crying for these type of games to come back for years.
For those people saying 3 is the last good suikoden. I challenge you play it now together with 5. Suikoden 3 age badly compare from what we remember on our childhood. Suikoden 5 is a master piece like suikoden 2.
Zerase is the best character in V. She was so OP that she made the game easier if you kept her in party and gave her a Magic Absorb Rune. (Not to mention the magic formation where she could cast her giant meteor spell twice in a row)
Suikoden has long left this world, and that's fine. It gave me 5 mainline titles and multiple spin offs. I really don't want Konami to have anything to do with it anymore. They've long abandoned their legacy. The best case scenario is the trademark lapses and a fan buys it for dirt cheap.
I love the suikoden series, and even suikoden is one of the reasons I majored in law at university. i will definitely buy eiyuuden, but i am very skeptical of suikoden remaster because, well we all know what& who &how konami is. (Forgive me for grammatical error, english ain't my 1st language 🙏🏼)
I'll be getting both and hope for their success. There is not even the slightest doubt in my mind though that Konami never would have done this without Eiyuden's success, so Rabbit & Bear did the heavy lifting and took personal risk to demonstrate the demand and make it happen... so at this point they're the ones I really admire. I remember a Konami guy years ago who streamed Suikoden 1 and 2 trying to convince them to release them, and all they would do was release on PS3 store. But as fans this is the best of both worlds, we get to enjoy both the remasters and whole new series from the minds who created the originals!
2:49 knowing Konami they probably would never have put out these remakes if not for chronicles, and it’s not because they saw how well the kickstarter was doing, based on how we have seen Konami act in the past they are hoping to crush chronicles because “”how dear these devs try anything like this”” we know how spiteful they can be we have seen it with Hideo Kojima and with both metal gear and silent hills, I’m under no illusions that this was done for the fans because Konami has shown time and again the type of character they have.
It's not "funny" that they're coming out at the same time, it's intentional. Konami, which has a history of being incredibly spiteful to devs who refuse to bend the knee and break off (i.e. Hideo Kojima), is trying to murder this upstart of rebels while it's still in the cradle by releasing a product in direct competition of them. One that's banking entirely on nostalgia to draw suckers in, and which has a greater nostalgic value than Eiyuden Chronicles. Now, Konami doesn't have the creative minds to make new games anymore, but they do have enough tech know-how to give an old one a fresh coat of paint and sell it as a "new" and "remastered" product, so that's what they're going to do.
I love this! Can't wait, been wanting this to come back for so long. I'll never forget the day I saw a red double disk set peaking out from under some crap in my friends room oh so many years ago. Suikoden here i come.
I'm buying both, but I wouldn't be surprised if this is the end of the road for Konami since they're just hyping the remaster up for a quick cash grab. Eiyuuden is my choice between the two if I had to choose only one!
Playing Suikoden 5 due to the remasters coming out and would love to see 5 remastered ((hey one can dream right lol)), but from what I heard the Eiyuden team is helping with the remasters as well?
@@SeventhheavenDK Honestly it had the most grounded villians like Sialeeds, Gizel and his father Marcel and I actually love all the Royal Knights. I really think they took a risk with 5's villians because they were not just evil jerks and all seemed to truly want what was best for their country, just went about it the wrong way and were Misguided. Story wise I think it is my favorite.
Love for them kinda fell away? I don't know mate, I get the issues with 4 but 5? Many consider it a return to form and the 2nd best in the series. If you haven't given it a shot I recommend you do, it has a bit of a slow start but it's great.
I agree, but if we do get remastered V, then I hope they will omit the atrocious loading times. Even though it's not as bad as in S3, it's still very bad. I hated the 5~15sec for every fight. (also war combat from 5 should be much more enjoyable with a mouse, compared to gamepad)
I just wanted to point out that although both games share inumerous similarities, they are not the same game. We have to wait and see if (and how) Eiyuden can stand on it's own.
I'm getting both too. I've been wanting a pc port for a long time. Played them multiple times on the original PS1 and emulation. I'm mostly excited for what mods will come out for both Suikoden 1 & 2
I love both, I've followed the main series of Suikoden (1-5) also kind of looked at the offshoots that gave more perspective between 2-3 (the ones following minor characters like Miklotov) I love Suikoden 3 as my favorite, they did well enough with the animation, the battle system was a little choppy though but I would assume it took a lot of resources to polish... and that is why they resorted back to Suikoden V style, 4 had a nice story, but had a lot of issues like choppiness and strange animation. I think that is the reason why everything didn't look as well as it could have, even for a PS2 game. If they can finish the 27 runes story, eventually though, lol. This will allow the people who can't get the physical CD for 1 and 2 because those CD fetches a high price because of how limited it was. That would allow new fans to at least get a taste of the game will turning to other methods of playing them. If it becomes a success, it would at least revive the series so that we can get the story to conclude.
I will gladly give my money to Konami for these remasters. Maybe one day they'll remaster the rest. So I'll be buying both. It's really a win/win scenario.
I didn't knouw about Eiyuden Chronicles, that should be interesting. I've been super excited about the Suikoden renaster because I've only played the 3rd installment.
Buy both...so a chance for a Suikoden 6 are in reach. And there was no bad blood. The Character Designer of Suikoden and Eiyuden chronicle, are remasterd the Artworks for the Remaster of Suikoden 1 /2
thinking of getting both, if i have the wallet. For the collection needs from suikoden and "what's new" from Eiyuden. a big fan of jrpg shouldn't miss this.
One thing that would be neat is if they restored cut Storylines in the Remasters, like Having Georg Prime in Suikoden 1 and Zerase and Windy in Suikoden 2.
I did the kick starter a year or more ago. And yes, I am planning to get Tsuikoden 1 and 2 remasters as well. I am in the same boat Konami in my eyes fucked up excuse that language. I hope we get a rekindle of the Tsuikoden and I hope we get a whole new series as well if not I hope we can at least get a the new Eiyuden with a running series. Tsuikoden 2 is still one of the most remembered villains in game history I hope we get the same amazing feeling as back then with this new story and game.
I was enticed by Eiyuden Chronicles gameplay... and was overwhelmed with excitement when I saw the Suikoden remaster announcement. But to find out the team behind the original 1-2 are involved in Eiyuden.. It's a day one cop!
It’s not the first time Konami have done this. They released the Castlevania Anniversary Collection about a month before Bloodstained was, also released the Cowabunga Collection about 2 months after Sherdder’s Revenge. I have lost all respect for Konami.
Well it's kinda obvious that Konami started the HD remaster thing when they saw how successful Capcom's(and other publisher's) remasters and remakes were they also decided to go for it in the hopes they can get themselves a piece of the nostalgia money pie. And obviously instead of outright going for a risky remake they opted out for the safer and less costly HD remaster.
‘I think it became the number 1 most funded kickstarter’ actually number 3.. Shenmue 3, and Bloodstained had a higher backing. Nevertheless I am also a back of Eiyuden and my hype grows with every update email they send, love their focus and approach to world building. P.S the highest crowdfunded video game and one of the highest-funded crowdfunding projects overall, having raised over US$500 million is an upcoming game called Star Citizen, just for anyone interested in knowing lol.
Sooo excited for Eiyuden chronicles!! 😍 Although I still will buy the remastered suikoden 1 and 2. I love the game so much that even though I'm pissed with konami I still will buy it. 😅
Similar situation with dead space remake and calisto protocol. Both too will be released close to each other. Anyway I will be getting both suikoden remaster and eiyuden chronicles.
I'll buy both, because I love RPGs in general...but I have good expectations in Suikoden remaster just cause is coming to PC steam ...that means... possible modding world some time after... Which can make the game even better years later 😌
I am excited for both. I love Suikoden 1, 2 and 3 so much I would love to see what the team that made them will put out. They put their heart into those games and you can feel it when you play them. But I will definitely pick up the remaster because its hard trying to find an affordable copy and I lost a lot of my original games during my last big move.
I'm also a kickstarter backer! Suikoden I and V were some of my favorite games, and I want a VI, but the people who made Eiyuden Chronicles are the people who MADE Suikoden what it was. There's no way I could pass up on their game. I'll be getting both if I can, but I would rather support the people who worked hard to make the series great.
Fantastic Video! Guess I should Hold off buying Suikodoen 2 for the PS1 for 400 bucks and just get a PS5 lol. The only thing I wish that Rabit and Bear did for the new game (Heck all remasters) is Add full Anime style 2D characters. No need for pixel art of the Past! Still glad this is coming out though and can't wait to try it!
Ill get both but its a no brainer. Eiyuden has the original team to Suikoden. I was hoping that Rabbit Bear could possibly buy the rights of Suikoden some day to finish what they started (27 true runes man). The only reason Konami is even touching it in 2022/2023 is because of the hype Rabbit Bear Studios got for Eiyuden; I remember the day we found out they BURIED SUIKODEN - #Suikoden 1995-2006. I watched an Interview with Konami and they already stated they don't want to continue the Suikoden story/Same World. They want to do something different (Like Tierkreis multi-world different each game ect) I will probably get that game too if it comes but I lost all hope of anything good... its not Bear Rabbit Studios, period. I think the new Eiyuden series will takeover and be the next TRUE Suikoden game series. Suikoden IV and Tierkreis were both trash so I doubt Konami will do any better if they continue. Despite all of this I am looking forward to the Suikoden 1 and 2 Remasters, hopefully 3 after wards and Ill be happy.
1:38 so you could say it has 108 guys of sky and land. But yer I saw chronicles and was like wait a second this is pushing all my feels buttons (not knowing who was behind it at the time) and it almost interesting got added to my steam wishlist, sadly I’ll probably also get the remakes of Suikoden 1&2 as 1 holds a dear place in my heart (along with FF7) as it is responsible for me learning to read, I’m Dyslexic and not long before they had come out my school had pretty much abandoned me just saying that I was lazy and unwilling to learn (I actually found one of my yearly review cards and it says quite the opposite, it screams dyslexia but I guess it was easier to say I just wasn’t trying)I don’t know what would have happened to me if not for these two games.
It's better to support Eiyuden Chronicles as with that game we're going to get what we're being waiting for. With Suikoden only the remaster versions can be good, but any new thing is going to probably suck.
My problem with Konami holding the Suikoden series hostage based on the sales of the remaster is that Capcom did the same with Megaman 11. 4 years later, we still don't have anything close to X9 or Legends 3.
Eiyuden Chronicles may be the NEW Xenoblade Chronicles and I couldn’t be more excited at the thought of a new JRPG built off a classic. Xenoblade is built from Xenosaga. Eiyuden is built from Suikoden.
Back then, I was joking with my sister that they'll reveal something Suikoden 1 or 2 related in TGS cause Konami's being petty about Eiyuden. It actually happened and I was both confused and happy about it
Well we're in luck then because alot of people are going to pick up the remaster so I doubt it doesn't do well, so hopefully Konami will make Suikoden 6 one day as they will clearly see there is still alot of interest for these types of games, Bloodstained from Castlevania proved this, maybe Konami and the new developers (the people that left Konami to make Eiyuden Chronicle) can get together and give us Suikoden 6 or maybe a hybrid of them both!
In an interview years ago, Yoshitaka Murayama said that it was his own desicion to leave the suikoden series because he wanted to pursuit other projects and that konami always wanted him to stay, and that in the end there were no harm feelings... i saw this recently in suikosourse
We don't need to discuss anything, getting both is what any jrpg fan needs to do. Hopefully, we get Wild Arms and Shadow Hearts as well, seeing how Penny Blood and Armed Fantasia did well.
This is probably the best case scenario. While I love the suikoden games, their mythology like Castlevania kinda wrote themselves into corners. In Castlevania, they were stuck in the whole Dracula only comes back once a century bit, which forced tem to keep drilling backwards in time with retcons.(Because otherwise having people fighting dracula with fully automatic weapons turns castlevania into Contra, so they had keep the medeval weapons as part of the setting in a way that made sense.) Bloodstained has no storybased restrictions to keep it from going forward in different places and times without any issues so far. They can move to any place and time and make brand new characters without being trapped in their own mythology.They have more freedom to do things as Castlevania just too tied up with Dracula and the Belmonts mythology to where they went next was vary limited. Hence Konami even tried do a reboot becuase of how restrain their IP had become with Lord of Shadows. The whole thing probably only had a handful of games they could logially squeeze out of the series left before it all imploded on itself in some stupidly convoluted retcon. The main finale where the Battle of 1999 happens was really the only big moment Castlevania had left to explore. With Suikoden, they basically had introduce a new set of True Runes, and another landmass to have yet another rebellion take place in. They made a set number of true runes already, which limited what they could do there being 27. Like Castlevania it was all building to a grand finale, in Suikoden's case, the showdown with the Continent of Harmonia, and it's ruler Hikusaak. Suikoden 3 was last game make major headway toward this event, and like Castlevania they start drilling backwards into the timeline to extend the number of games that logically could fit into the series. They even did a spin of Tierkreis to give themselves freedom the established mythlogy by making it part of a multiverse, but it was so vague and undefined that nothing about it actually mattered. Suikoden really would been lucky make 2-3 more games in the main universe before reaching it's logical conclusion. (Without doing some really gross padding and retconning anyways.) I have held out hope Konami would atleast one day finish both it's IPs main events to their storylines, but we will see if that ever happens. So as I said in my first line, this is probably best case scenario. Developers can continue make games in the vein of the series we love without the restrictions of the previous game series baggage writing them into corners, and it may be enough to goad konami into giving us more somewhere down the line. There's no downside to this for us as players. Without the exodus of these developers Konami probably would continue to sit and horde it's IPs like a dragon and we'd gotten nothing besides more pachinko machines instead something we as fans would actually want. We can enjoy the remasters and the spirit successors as we are not even remotely close to having too much content in the same vein for each Castlevania or Suikoden. Fans are hungry for more on both fronts. I doubt we will ever reach a point of oversaturation as not like a bunch of Triple A studios are going hope on this bandwagon. If they do...have at it. I welcome all the toys they are willing give us. I just figure Rabbit & Bear and Konami will probably be the only ones in this races, and everyone wins if we support both.I own all the main suikoden games,tactics and tierkres, can welcome an excuse replay to them. I know plenty of people didn't get their hands on them back in the day, and will get see what the hype was about. This all good news that many have been waiting quite some time to hear. I wish I knew about Eiyuden Chronicle sooner, as I'd backed it for sure, but It's a day one pick up either way. My dollars were always coming to them.
I'm sorry but I don't agree with you that the writers painted themselves into a corner with Suikoden. At all. 27 True Runes, there's only been maybe about 14, 15 revealed? And some of them.- the Moon Rune or Dragon Rune to name but too - weren't featured enough not to be the 'main' Rune for a game... Heck even ones that were are still available for more stories - what about a side story following Ted for 300 years? The thing is the lore of Suikoden is specific enough to make it reward series stalwarts but open enough to literally go anywhere or do anything. You can even begin to draw in new concepts if you want... what about a steampunk country? A desert one? (Ames) A crystal one (Harmonia) There's literally no end to it... This isn't at all like Dracula whatsoever. Their only constraints are that Magic is Rune derived and, frankly, that wouldn't be too hard to retcon if they wanted to. Otherwise with the diversity of stories they've hinted at, I don't see where they can't go. Their only constraint is having 108 Stars of Destiny and even that the games haven't religiously stuck to - Tactics springs to mind - and even if they did, saying that's a problem is like saying Pokemon games are problematic because of new monsters or Final Fantasy is problematic because they have to keep inventing new universes that still include Chocobos. I don't get your opinion is really what I'm saying.
@@JeremiahEcks777 You seem to be ignoring there's still only so much land mass to have rebellions on in the world. Like how many times is the same basic story structure going happen over and over in the same world? Between running of out true runes and places have the games take place, it feels like a concept that mostly ran it's course of a showdown with Hikusaak and The Holy Kingdom of Harmonia. I envision without any major retcons they probably only made 2-3 more games as it basically was reaching it's climax without backpeddling. I'd rather have story focus on a predetermined endpoint than be milked endless till becomes unprofittable and ends in a whimper. If they want to keep it going, then come with a new story to tell. I felt like 3 was a major improvement toward shifting the focus from strictly just another rebellion and gave far more use to having a such a massive cast as having you jump between 5 different teams of characters got alot more mileage of the 108 stars. It was far from perfect, I feel like the trinity sight system was the right kind of direction for the series. They dug deeper into the mythology of things, and showed the cost of people being ageless. 4 and 5 going back in time felt like snooze button on the endgame. Is it impossible for them keep going backwards stretching out this concept....no as castlevania definitely shows you can, but I don't feel like it's good narrative choice. Tierkreis was side story that freed itself of the limits of the true runes and being a single world. Obviously being a multiverse has it's own set of issues, but they were atleast tinkering with the formula instead of just following the same exact formula we'd see for 5 games. It was clear konami was trying reboot both Castlevania and Suikoden to give themselves more space to work than the original timeline of either series gave. (Castlevania got a bit ridiculous with the number of times dracula been basically revivied and immediately murdered again to point you almost feel sad for drac, as he's mostly a mcguffin for the badguys to fight over than a character with any agency as a villain.) Sure suikoden could have retconned the number of runes(Like there's two worlds split that are connected and double the true runes and twice as many places to have wars in.) or some other means or fragmented true runes way the sword and shield runes pieces of the beginning rune. I feel like this is a concept that really only made sense happen so many times as how big is this planet, how the technology mostly the same after centuries? There's a ton of logic problems that start to crop up after a point. If you want make a sci fi or steampunk suikoden style game, just make another series as it would be too different and odd from the rest of the series. At some point you make something too divergent from the core experience, it might as well be a different game or IP. You aren't bound by any of the same baggage then. (Similar how Devil May Cry started off as Resident Evil sequel idea, but spawned into it's own thing.) So I don't agree there's unlimited places to go with this. Your choices would be largely rejected by long time fans and would milk something beyond the point of reason. Sometimes less is more, suikoden probably is better off stopping while it's ahead than twisting itself like a pretzel like the assassin creed's series have to max out the potential number of sequels you can in same setting and universe to point of insanity. Continuity eventually collaspes upon it's under it's own weight if a story gets dragged out for too long as it becomes it's own worst enemy. Suikoden is an inheritly simple concept and I'd rather end as one than see get franksteined into some mess of a story over greed.
@@Lastjustice But it's just not true, what you're saying - with all due respect. For a start it ignores that the Hikusaak saga doesn't need to be the end of the Suikoden story. It's just the end of the original story started by the original trilogy. But let's say we did Hikusaak - then in doing so a new story is opened up during it? Well that might be Jeane or Viki's story for example? And in terms of a limited number of rebellions... sure. But don't do rebellions every time. Tactics wasn't and as you suggest, Suikoden 3 was starting not to be and that was really well received! I think you underestimate what Suikoden fans would like based on the fact that the story has already been pushed considerably already. Guns via the Howling Voice Guild are a thing, the Dwarf Village and vault from Suikoden 1, some of the Sindar technology and some stuff from Suikoden 3 - as well as all these inventors running around. It wouldn't be hard to do a prequel with the Sindar and show them to be a steampunk society for example. And whilst you might suggest that it's spinning the story on it's laurels, maybe but only if you're assuming that Hikusaak and Harmonia are the literal end game. And nobody in Konami, including Murayama, ever said that. Murayama only suggested that Pesmerga and Yuber would only meet at the end of the world... and then a story where they fight outside of Gregminster happened to contradict it. Retcon! So no, I don't buy your point because I don't see the Suikoden story as bound by Hikusaak. The story of Suikoden 2 and 3 aims towards Harmonia of course but the story of Suikoden V leads towards Zerase, Jeane and the Sindar, which is also picked up from Suikoden 2. Either are legitimate ways to go. Either or both! You're also missing the point that Suikoden 3 is something like 20 years after Suikoden 1. The games have always, even at the start, spanned a whole load of time in the same world. Whilst I agree that S4 maybe didn't really go anywhere, why would more prequels or sequels have to be set within a very closed time frame? I think Suikoden fans don't mind culture and setting changes if a) the game mechanics are similar, b) there are some recurring characters and continuity and c) it's the same world. To be sure, fans of Final Fantasy 4 can also be fans of Final Fantasy 7 can be fans of Final Fantasy 10 and yet all of those worlds are very very different and tell very different stories. I know they're alternative universes but the point is that Suikoden fans, I think, as fans of JRPGs would be more than happy to experience some evolution... as long as it keeps one thing Suikoden fans enjoy - some continuity! And even then it's not a dealbreaker. Eiyuden is happening without any Suikoden continuity! But what separates that and Tierkreis or Woven Web is that those games changed too many mechanics. Comparing Suikoden to Castlevania (just because it's Konami) and Assassin's Creed isn't really valid. (Well I know you're not comparing A.C. per se and just suggesting you don't want it to be LIKE A.C. becoming stale but still, I've started talking nonsense so I'm going to finish 🤭 ). Castlevania isn't a JRPG and it's story wasn't initially it's selling point whereas with Suikoden world building and story always was. And for Assassin's Creed their problem was constant games being pumped out without any change to the formula and the games becoming increasingly buggy because creative had no time to work on them. And they also became loveless churned out nonsense. Suikoden fans don't even get one game every four years! Sometimes A.C was getting four games in one year! Do that's why they got stupid. Fatigue. Suikoden isn't anywhere near being fatigued and I just don't see why closing off one story branch from Suikoden 3 would meaning they have to end the series. It just closes one story thread off.
@@Lastjustice I DO agree with you though that I'm glad it doesn't collapse under it's own continuity. And whilst I disagree with your fundamental points it's very clear you're well reasoned, thoughtful and passionate about the series, so it's always a pleasure to speak to such a fan of the series. Whilst we might not necessarily agree with some of the finer points, glad to share fandom with guys like you. 👍
@@JeremiahEcks777 I've seen enough stories that never reach the main hook they were building toward. Such as Ogre Battle or Darksiders. (Darksiders might eventually give us the Endwar, but it hasn't happened yet.) Ogre Battle was steadily laying the groundwork toward the epic ogre battle...but given IP is in limbo, who knows if we will ever see it reach it's finale. I agree a new story can always come afterwards, just hey let's finish what we started, as I would just be happy see that come full circle. Castlevania has painfully sidestepped around the battle of 1999, Konami seem more interested in keeping stoies going indefinitely than resolving hanging threads. Suikoden really close to reaching the big finale it was going toward. Yes there's other threads going, I just mentioned Hikusaak and Harmonia It's the puppet master pulling the strings in ever game. Like how Thanos was being built up and the infinity stones since the first Avengers movie. This same kind of energy konami was building toward.(Yes there's the sindar which you could probably throw in a game devling into them in the past that ties to the present story.) It's the final crescendo where all big pay offs would happen. We'd likely see dozens of characters from the past come together for a huge battle against the main enemy that Luc showed, the circle rune as it would bring the world to stagnation if it's grip on everything continued. It was a literal prison for the whole world. He was literally willing give up everything to stop it. I could see them doing 2-3 more games in the main story without reaching the point of needless padding and squandering the chance to complete the story. I agree they can have other spin offs set in the same world as they have with tactics and the gaiden titles that were only in Japan with Nashe, as not every game needs gathering 108 heroes and someone being a true rune user. They could make couple games about the adventures of Schtolteheim Reinbach the first if they felt like it. I'd like for them to finish what they started before giving other side stories. It's been a long struggle to get this far. Sure nothing really ever ends, but I like when people wrap up the majority of their hanging threads in a thoughtful manner. This feels like the main story to tell, and if you want to start a new story after that with more a mroe flexible formula, then have at it. Konami been letting this lay dormant for quite some time, so who knows if we will ever get closure on this. I would push for that rather and tell the story they really wanted than have this peter out and stay in limbo forever.
I wish they had at least touched up the original sprites a bit... the raw PS1 pixels just look jarring and stick out like a sore thumb against the new improved backgrounds of the remaster, regardless of the charm they had in the original release. I'm curious as to what the resolution gap is between the Suikoden character sprites and the ones from Eiyuden.
Its a tactical move on Konami's part, but it feels like a subtle passive aggressive statement to not continue the series IF it doesn't do well is kind of lame (Maybe that's why the Original Team left Konami to form R&B) A classic will always be that, great, but RPGs can only be played a few times before reaching a point where we move on as we've already saved the game and became Omnipotent in levels/skills/collections. I've played Suikoden to death, and its time to move onto something new which is Eiyuden Chronicles. Rabbit & Bear just need to make it damn good, release EC AFTER the Konami remakes because everyone knows Suikoden 1 & 2 already, cause we old timers went through its magic which is perfect at that time. R&B have the advantage, new tech and updates (Can we say future add on missions/characters to further develop what we think is an already finished story like Valkyrie Chronicles with its DLCs before and EC2?)
It felt a bit akward when the Suikoden remaster was announced after Eiyuuden showed up its true potential. I mean.. Suikoden-fans where begging on their knees for years for a revival of the Series to Konami. And Konami is now like "Oh there is a similar Game showing success!? Ok, lets revive the Series and squeeze Money out of it!".. Anyway... 2023 will be an empty-wallet year in Terms of really good games
Eiyuden seems nice and everything but it isn't Suikoden, if I have to choose one (which I probably do), I would definitely get the Suikoden remaster, Suikoden 2 is one of my most favorite games ever.
both are already wish listed on steam and will be picked up day one of release with no hesitation. I still have my original copies of suikoden 1 and 2 on ps and play them often. may not like how Konami has handled things that's neither here nor there. side note eiyuden rising is a great little side game =)
I have never played a Suikoden game but when found out about Eiyuden Chronicles Hundred Heroes around 2 years ago l was filled with immense joy. Konami releasing a remaster of S1 & S2 is such a nasty situation. They purposely did this to not only drive away the old fans of Suikoden from Eiyuden but also dangling the hope of a future installment in the Suikoden franchise by basically hold its fans at gun point and saying "If you don't buy our remaster your beloved franchise will rot forever." Well I say let it rot then! It's been how many years since Konami even acknowledged Suikoden's existence and NOW they want to dig into their games catalog???I will be taking MY money to support Eiyuden Chronicles Hundred Heroes 💯 TLDR; Buy Eiyuden not the Suikoden Remasters and vote with your wallets to show Konami that you can't be forced by their hands
this is basically the same story between Dead Space and Callisto Protocol. The dev quit and making their own studio to release spiritual successor of their previous game and then Konami & EA release the Remaster/Remake of their game.
Haha, I wish I would have known they were planning on doing a remaster. I dropped almost 400 dollars for the 1st and 2nd games. Oh well, I probably would have done it anyway. The only one I'm missing is the ds Suikoden game I have 1-5 plus tactics.
3:15 , that is not exactly what konami said. They said: they would love to continue the suikoden series if the remaster is gooing well. Thats not really the same what you quotet
I'm going to be honest I don't care about the remaster I might get it just because of what game it is but I can care less if it does good or bad I'm all about the guys making the new game they should have let them do that from the beginning
The original creator of Suikoden left after Suikoden III. His reasons (stated in Wikipedia) was that it was his personal goal to stay for 10 years and then go freelance. There was none of this "the creators wanted to make another game" stuff. Hell Konami made two more Suikoden games (if you liked the first 3 you really should play 5 and give 4 a chance) Eiyuden Chronicles came about because Rabbit and Bear Studio (that Yoshitaka Murayama helped create) saw there was a desire for more Suikoden games and Konami at the time was doing nothing about the license. That's not to say there isn't any bad blood anywhere, but honestly the biggest factor for both these things existing was fan demand.
They almost certainly greenlit a remaster BECAUSE Eiyuden's kickstarted did so well. My impossible dream? Both do amazing and Konami greenlights Suikoden 6 and outsources its development to Rabbit and Bear.
I think Konami just trying to ride the trend wave of the original suikoden team's new project. Even if they work on new suikoden I believe it would just end up like the PSP game, unless they pull rabbit and bear studio to work on the game which is unlikely. Overall not that hopeful for Konami and wish the new series success.
So if Suikoden does not do well they will not make another one BUT they release it same year and maybe same Month as Eiduyen so they are making their own grave eventually. Its not just a Dick move to do so but also Stupid. i will probably buy both but i dont have hope that it will do so well, its still an old game its not like Resident Evil 2 Remake, where everything is modernized and completely reworked. I want both games to succeed but i dont have too much Hope. we will see and hope for the best tho :)
If they never continue the suikoden series can one of the team at least release a list and history of the true runes? I've waited years for more lore on those things
Konami is just fcked up, Metal Gear, Castlevania and Suikoden the new head or decision maker for Konami is just destroying the company as whoever he she is is fucked up seriously.
I love Suikoden but I don't like Konami...not anymore ever since they abandoned Suikoden. It just seems sus that they are riding the coattails of Eiyuden's kickstarter success. I love Suikoden with all my heart and it will always be something I'll cherish so will definitely support both games but not Konami entirely. If Konami delivers a Suiko 6, then I'll definitely forgive them but remasters are not enough for me to fully support them :D
In my opinion, Konami is just trying to get whatever money left by releasing remastered around the same time. They probably regret not greenlit to make suikoden again after eiyuden become #1 game funded in Kickstarter. So they ride the hype of eiyuden release to get some more money out of the remastered. Because if they really want to keep the series going again, they should remake it or make a new game with the old devs. Not remaster it. That's my opinion.
Konami announcing Suikoden 1 and 2 remaster after the hype of Eiyuden Chronicles is just scummy. AND THEN THEY HAVE THE AUDACITY TO TRY AND STRONG ARM THE FANS WITH "If this doesn't sell well Suikoden is done for". Fuck that, I'll watch Konami and the Suikoden series burn before I give Konami any of my money.
Guys guys guys. Stop bishing in the comment section. This is the official. 2>1>5>3>tactic>4. Arguably 5 and 3 spots could be interchangeable in the sense that 3rd is better in the sense that we got a rather continuation of the first 2. While 5 is superiorly done compared to 3 but its so far away in years to the first 2 its basically a different game in the same world. Now for the suikoden fans oath. Lets all promise to shun anyone who has 4 as favourite. AND shun even more those that manage to play the tierkreis and the suikoden novel 1 and 2 game. Lucky bastard. Amen.
it's not a funny situation though. Both the creators and fans of Suikoden pushed for decades for a new Suikoden, and Konami just outright ignored all of us. So, fed up, Murayama and co. made Rabbit and Bear to create a spiritual successor to Suikoden, that's what Eiyuden is. Now, after seeing what a huge success the kickstarter for Eiyuden was, Konami are putting out the Suikoden remasters for one reason only; to spite Rabbit and Bear. I mean, I'm happy that Konami are finally doing something with the Suikoden IP, but come on. A lot of the Suikoden community keep saying things like "just shut up and be happy that we're getting something", but I'm struggling to be excited for a remaster that, despite how amazing it looks, they're just rushing out the gate purely for the sake of conflicting with the release of Eiyuden.
I love both and I'll be getting them, BUT if I had to choose one out of them, I'd go for Eiyuden. Love the author, not the company.
Same here. I invested in the Kickstart campaign cuz I loves Suikoden and want there to be more games like it. I've played the first two Suikoden games several times each so I won't be giving Konami my money for a touched up version of them. I very much look forward to Eiyuden Chronicle's release.
Came to say exactly this. I think this remake may be nothing more than a nostalgia cash grab with no real interest in reviving Suikoden.
@@seapeajones For sure. Konami saw the success of Eiyuden's Kickstarter campaign and big Yen signs popped up in their eyes. They are only doing this because Eiyuden Chronicle showed them there was still interest for Suikoden. If it weren't for that Konami would have let the series die forever unless there was a way to turn Suikoden into a pachinko machine. How far Konami has fallen since the glory days of the 90s.
I would get both but my eyes is on Eiyuden first...Would get that on release
The producers of the Suikoden I&II remaster stated that if this release is successful they would love to continue the series, so I hope every fan out there supports it so that we may get another remaster (or even a Suikoden 6?)
Yep, now if we can only see a new MGS game! .....
I will be buying suikoden over eiyuden all day. Eiyuden had its chance to deliver in 2022 like they promised and gave us bull sh** rising. Now konami is taking the glory I can't know there is a remastered suikoden and not buy it.
@@kaiser_1991 you're aware that Rising merely served as a companion game prior to the full game, which will be released this year, right? It was the final goal of their kickstarter and they reached it, so they produced that game in order to create a game based on that world, but it has little to do with the upcoming main game. They're totally different.
@VandalHeart26 obviously I'm aware of that. What I'm getting at is a goal that was reached said 2022 release date and rising was trash.
I dunno s6 even have same flavor is s2 & s3 ....more so it more reflected 4 & 5
a handful of people working on Eiyuden Chronicle are also working on Suikoden Remaster. Most of the people that left Konami didn't leave upset. Most of them just left upset that their creations were no longer being greenlit. There's not really a competition going on here.
Yeah, Murayama has said that he left Konami simply because he didn't want to stay in one place for too long and that he was on good terms with the company. Konami even made 2 more mainline Suikoden games without him.
Junko Kawano works both in Suikoden Remaster and Eiyuden
I'm excited about Eiyuden but also wish Konami would continue suikoden since the story's kinda not done yet.
That's great to hear
No new content, war, cooking (sui2) nor duel footage sucks, and clive's quest needs quality of life. It's the equivalent of Judge Judy's shiny shiny red truck ✨️. Some eiyuden footage is goofy too and the side scrollr bored me to tears.
Agreed, not a fan how they waited for the Kickstarter to be same year. I am more than happy to buy both games and hope both succeed. I been crying for these type of games to come back for years.
For those people saying 3 is the last good suikoden. I challenge you play it now together with 5. Suikoden 3 age badly compare from what we remember on our childhood. Suikoden 5 is a master piece like suikoden 2.
Yep, 5 is my favorite by far.
I thought 3 sucked. 4 was OK, and 5 is a masterpiece which tops 2.
Yep, my top 1 spot always tied with Suikoden II and V!
3 was special.
I'll have to try V.
Hopefully it's on the PS5 store.
Zerase is the best character in V. She was so OP that she made the game easier if you kept her in party and gave her a Magic Absorb Rune. (Not to mention the magic formation where she could cast her giant meteor spell twice in a row)
Suikoden has long left this world, and that's fine. It gave me 5 mainline titles and multiple spin offs. I really don't want Konami to have anything to do with it anymore. They've long abandoned their legacy. The best case scenario is the trademark lapses and a fan buys it for dirt cheap.
I love the suikoden series, and even suikoden is one of the reasons I majored in law at university. i will definitely buy eiyuuden, but i am very skeptical of suikoden remaster because, well we all know what& who &how konami is. (Forgive me for grammatical error, english ain't my 1st language 🙏🏼)
Will get both. Will pay a few times over for Eiyuden cause I want to support them
Really hope they end up merging and Konami parts ways with Suikoden
I hadn't even heard of Eiyuden Chronicles, so thank you for bringing it to my attention. I'll be keeping an eye out for it!
I’m a huge fan. Getting both and hoping for more
I'll be getting both and hope for their success. There is not even the slightest doubt in my mind though that Konami never would have done this without Eiyuden's success, so Rabbit & Bear did the heavy lifting and took personal risk to demonstrate the demand and make it happen... so at this point they're the ones I really admire. I remember a Konami guy years ago who streamed Suikoden 1 and 2 trying to convince them to release them, and all they would do was release on PS3 store. But as fans this is the best of both worlds, we get to enjoy both the remasters and whole new series from the minds who created the originals!
Good devs are hard to come by, but i love it qhen they go out on their own and do what tripple A refuses to do.
@@DBFigGaming I hope Eiyuden Chronicle 100 Heros will the Start of a new Franchise...Rise was Fun too
I don't play AAA these days. Most of them are boring open world shooters or just interactive movies.
2:49 knowing Konami they probably would never have put out these remakes if not for chronicles, and it’s not because they saw how well the kickstarter was doing, based on how we have seen Konami act in the past they are hoping to crush chronicles because “”how dear these devs try anything like this”” we know how spiteful they can be we have seen it with Hideo Kojima and with both metal gear and silent hills, I’m under no illusions that this was done for the fans because Konami has shown time and again the type of character they have.
I like the idea of having another Suikoden game so I went onto steam to find it. Turns out that Eiyuden Chronicle is already on my wishlist.
It's not "funny" that they're coming out at the same time, it's intentional. Konami, which has a history of being incredibly spiteful to devs who refuse to bend the knee and break off (i.e. Hideo Kojima), is trying to murder this upstart of rebels while it's still in the cradle by releasing a product in direct competition of them. One that's banking entirely on nostalgia to draw suckers in, and which has a greater nostalgic value than Eiyuden Chronicles. Now, Konami doesn't have the creative minds to make new games anymore, but they do have enough tech know-how to give an old one a fresh coat of paint and sell it as a "new" and "remastered" product, so that's what they're going to do.
I love this! Can't wait, been wanting this to come back for so long.
I'll never forget the day I saw a red double disk set peaking out from under some crap in my friends room oh so many years ago. Suikoden here i come.
I'm buying both, but I wouldn't be surprised if this is the end of the road for Konami since they're just hyping the remaster up for a quick cash grab. Eiyuuden is my choice between the two if I had to choose only one!
Playing Suikoden 5 due to the remasters coming out and would love to see 5 remastered ((hey one can dream right lol)), but from what I heard the Eiyuden team is helping with the remasters as well?
Suikoden V to me is my second favorite Suikoden just after Suikoden 2.
SuikoV is just an excellent game.
@@SeventhheavenDK Honestly it had the most grounded villians like Sialeeds, Gizel and his father Marcel and I actually love all the Royal Knights. I really think they took a risk with 5's villians because they were not just evil jerks and all seemed to truly want what was best for their country, just went about it the wrong way and were Misguided. Story wise I think it is my favorite.
Love for them kinda fell away? I don't know mate, I get the issues with 4 but 5? Many consider it a return to form and the 2nd best in the series. If you haven't given it a shot I recommend you do, it has a bit of a slow start but it's great.
Totally agree with this. I really hope for a SuikoV remaster
I agree, but if we do get remastered V, then I hope they will omit the atrocious loading times. Even though it's not as bad as in S3, it's still very bad. I hated the 5~15sec for every fight. (also war combat from 5 should be much more enjoyable with a mouse, compared to gamepad)
I just wanted to point out that although both games share inumerous similarities, they are not the same game. We have to wait and see if (and how) Eiyuden can stand on it's own.
I'm getting both too. I've been wanting a pc port for a long time. Played them multiple times on the original PS1 and emulation. I'm mostly excited for what mods will come out for both Suikoden 1 & 2
really hoping these games and trails into reverie come out at different times cause otherwise its going to suck picking which one
How could someone not love suikoden 5? That game is arguably the best in the series
I love both, I've followed the main series of Suikoden (1-5) also kind of looked at the offshoots that gave more perspective between 2-3 (the ones following minor characters like Miklotov)
I love Suikoden 3 as my favorite, they did well enough with the animation, the battle system was a little choppy though but I would assume it took a lot of resources to polish... and that is why they resorted back to Suikoden V style, 4 had a nice story, but had a lot of issues like choppiness and strange animation. I think that is the reason why everything didn't look as well as it could have, even for a PS2 game. If they can finish the 27 runes story, eventually though, lol.
This will allow the people who can't get the physical CD for 1 and 2 because those CD fetches a high price because of how limited it was. That would allow new fans to at least get a taste of the game will turning to other methods of playing them. If it becomes a success, it would at least revive the series so that we can get the story to conclude.
I will gladly give my money to Konami for these remasters. Maybe one day they'll remaster the rest. So I'll be buying both.
It's really a win/win scenario.
I’m soooooo hyped ! I loved suikoden 1 & 2 . And I’ll be getting both games !!
I didn't knouw about Eiyuden Chronicles, that should be interesting. I've been super excited about the Suikoden renaster because I've only played the 3rd installment.
Buy both...so a chance for a Suikoden 6 are in reach.
And there was no bad blood. The Character Designer of Suikoden and Eiyuden chronicle, are remasterd the Artworks for the Remaster of Suikoden 1 /2
thinking of getting both, if i have the wallet. For the collection needs from suikoden and "what's new" from Eiyuden. a big fan of jrpg shouldn't miss this.
Kickstarted Eiyuden at the physical tier, preordered Suikoden 1 + 2. Love the people that originated these 2 games.
Where'd you pre-order?
I only played Suikoden II so I'm excited to finally play I. But looking forward to how the new series turns out. High hopes!
One thing that would be neat is if they restored cut Storylines in the Remasters, like Having Georg Prime in Suikoden 1 and Zerase and Windy in Suikoden 2.
I did the kick starter a year or more ago. And yes, I am planning to get Tsuikoden 1 and 2 remasters as well. I am in the same boat Konami in my eyes fucked up excuse that language. I hope we get a rekindle of the Tsuikoden and I hope we get a whole new series as well if not I hope we can at least get a the new Eiyuden with a running series. Tsuikoden 2 is still one of the most remembered villains in game history I hope we get the same amazing feeling as back then with this new story and game.
I was enticed by Eiyuden Chronicles gameplay...
and was overwhelmed with excitement when I saw the Suikoden remaster announcement.
But to find out the team behind the original 1-2 are involved in Eiyuden..
It's a day one cop!
Love suikoden 1, 2 & 5. Going to get both Eiyuuden & the remaster. 😄
It’s not the first time Konami have done this. They released the Castlevania Anniversary Collection about a month before Bloodstained was, also released the Cowabunga Collection about 2 months after Sherdder’s Revenge. I have lost all respect for Konami.
They don't care about fanbase, only money , which is fine but it would be nice if they throw a little something once in a while for die hard fans.
Well it's kinda obvious that Konami started the HD remaster thing when they saw how successful Capcom's(and other publisher's) remasters and remakes were they also decided to go for it in the hopes they can get themselves a piece of the nostalgia money pie.
And obviously instead of outright going for a risky remake they opted out for the safer and less costly HD remaster.
‘I think it became the number 1 most funded kickstarter’ actually number 3.. Shenmue 3, and Bloodstained had a higher backing.
Nevertheless I am also a back of Eiyuden and my hype grows with every update email they send, love their focus and approach to world building.
P.S the highest crowdfunded video game and one of the highest-funded crowdfunding projects overall, having raised over US$500 million is an upcoming game called Star Citizen, just for anyone interested in knowing lol.
Sooo excited for Eiyuden chronicles!! 😍 Although I still will buy the remastered suikoden 1 and 2. I love the game so much that even though I'm pissed with konami I still will buy it. 😅
shenmue 3 was the biggest project founded on kickstarter tho, that was an easy search on the ks website...
Similar situation with dead space remake and calisto protocol. Both too will be released close to each other. Anyway I will be getting both suikoden remaster and eiyuden chronicles.
I'll buy both, because I love RPGs in general...but I have good expectations in Suikoden remaster just cause is coming to PC steam ...that means... possible modding world some time after... Which can make the game even better years later 😌
I am excited for both. I love Suikoden 1, 2 and 3 so much I would love to see what the team that made them will put out. They put their heart into those games and you can feel it when you play them. But I will definitely pick up the remaster because its hard trying to find an affordable copy and I lost a lot of my original games during my last big move.
Suikoden I and II creators now live in Eyuden. “ Love the author non the company “.
I'm also a kickstarter backer! Suikoden I and V were some of my favorite games, and I want a VI, but the people who made Eiyuden Chronicles are the people who MADE Suikoden what it was. There's no way I could pass up on their game. I'll be getting both if I can, but I would rather support the people who worked hard to make the series great.
Fantastic Video! Guess I should Hold off buying Suikodoen 2 for the PS1 for 400 bucks and just get a PS5 lol. The only thing I wish that Rabit and Bear did for the new game (Heck all remasters) is Add full Anime style 2D characters. No need for pixel art of the Past! Still glad this is coming out though and can't wait to try it!
Ill get both but its a no brainer. Eiyuden has the original team to Suikoden. I was hoping that Rabbit Bear could possibly buy the rights of Suikoden some day to finish what they started (27 true runes man).
The only reason Konami is even touching it in 2022/2023 is because of the hype Rabbit Bear Studios got for Eiyuden; I remember the day we found out they BURIED SUIKODEN - #Suikoden 1995-2006. I watched an Interview with Konami and they already stated they don't want to continue the Suikoden story/Same World. They want to do something different (Like Tierkreis multi-world different each game ect) I will probably get that game too if it comes but I lost all hope of anything good... its not Bear Rabbit Studios, period.
I think the new Eiyuden series will takeover and be the next TRUE Suikoden game series. Suikoden IV and Tierkreis were both trash so I doubt Konami will do any better if they continue.
Despite all of this I am looking forward to the Suikoden 1 and 2 Remasters, hopefully 3 after wards and Ill be happy.
Played pt 1 and absolutely loved it.
Suikoden 1 is my favorite JRPG... I will buy the remake. While I did not have money for the kick starter.. i'll definetly buy Eiyuden Chronicle.
If anything, the remaster will help spread the word for eiyuden chronicles
It's coming to PC. I can't wait to buy it.
1:38 so you could say it has 108 guys of sky and land.
But yer I saw chronicles and was like wait a second this is pushing all my feels buttons (not knowing who was behind it at the time) and it almost interesting got added to my steam wishlist, sadly I’ll probably also get the remakes of Suikoden 1&2 as 1 holds a dear place in my heart (along with FF7) as it is responsible for me learning to read, I’m Dyslexic and not long before they had come out my school had pretty much abandoned me just saying that I was lazy and unwilling to learn (I actually found one of my yearly review cards and it says quite the opposite, it screams dyslexia but I guess it was easier to say I just wasn’t trying)I don’t know what would have happened to me if not for these two games.
It's better to support Eiyuden Chronicles as with that game we're going to get what we're being waiting for.
With Suikoden only the remaster versions can be good, but any new thing is going to probably suck.
Getting both no doubt about it.
My problem with Konami holding the Suikoden series hostage based on the sales of the remaster is that Capcom did the same with Megaman 11. 4 years later, we still don't have anything close to X9 or Legends 3.
Eiyuden Chronicles may be the NEW Xenoblade Chronicles and I couldn’t be more excited at the thought of a new JRPG built off a classic. Xenoblade is built from Xenosaga. Eiyuden is built from Suikoden.
Back then, I was joking with my sister that they'll reveal something Suikoden 1 or 2 related in TGS cause Konami's being petty about Eiyuden. It actually happened and I was both confused and happy about it
Well we're in luck then because alot of people are going to pick up the remaster so I doubt it doesn't do well, so hopefully Konami will make Suikoden 6 one day as they will clearly see there is still alot of interest for these types of games, Bloodstained from Castlevania proved this, maybe Konami and the new developers (the people that left Konami to make Eiyuden Chronicle) can get together and give us Suikoden 6 or maybe a hybrid of them both!
In an interview years ago, Yoshitaka Murayama said that it was his own desicion to leave the suikoden series because he wanted to pursuit other projects and that konami always wanted him to stay, and that in the end there were no harm feelings... i saw this recently in suikosourse
We don't need to discuss anything, getting both is what any jrpg fan needs to do. Hopefully, we get Wild Arms and Shadow Hearts as well, seeing how Penny Blood and Armed Fantasia did well.
This is probably the best case scenario. While I love the suikoden games, their mythology like Castlevania kinda wrote themselves into corners. In Castlevania, they were stuck in the whole Dracula only comes back once a century bit, which forced tem to keep drilling backwards in time with retcons.(Because otherwise having people fighting dracula with fully automatic weapons turns castlevania into Contra, so they had keep the medeval weapons as part of the setting in a way that made sense.) Bloodstained has no storybased restrictions to keep it from going forward in different places and times without any issues so far. They can move to any place and time and make brand new characters without being trapped in their own mythology.They have more freedom to do things as Castlevania just too tied up with Dracula and the Belmonts mythology to where they went next was vary limited. Hence Konami even tried do a reboot becuase of how restrain their IP had become with Lord of Shadows. The whole thing probably only had a handful of games they could logially squeeze out of the series left before it all imploded on itself in some stupidly convoluted retcon. The main finale where the Battle of 1999 happens was really the only big moment Castlevania had left to explore.
With Suikoden, they basically had introduce a new set of True Runes, and another landmass to have yet another rebellion take place in. They made a set number of true runes already, which limited what they could do there being 27. Like Castlevania it was all building to a grand finale, in Suikoden's case, the showdown with the Continent of Harmonia, and it's ruler Hikusaak. Suikoden 3 was last game make major headway toward this event, and like Castlevania they start drilling backwards into the timeline to extend the number of games that logically could fit into the series. They even did a spin of Tierkreis to give themselves freedom the established mythlogy by making it part of a multiverse, but it was so vague and undefined that nothing about it actually mattered. Suikoden really would been lucky make 2-3 more games in the main universe before reaching it's logical conclusion. (Without doing some really gross padding and retconning anyways.) I have held out hope Konami would atleast one day finish both it's IPs main events to their storylines, but we will see if that ever happens.
So as I said in my first line, this is probably best case scenario. Developers can continue make games in the vein of the series we love without the restrictions of the previous game series baggage writing them into corners, and it may be enough to goad konami into giving us more somewhere down the line. There's no downside to this for us as players. Without the exodus of these developers Konami probably would continue to sit and horde it's IPs like a dragon and we'd gotten nothing besides more pachinko machines instead something we as fans would actually want. We can enjoy the remasters and the spirit successors as we are not even remotely close to having too much content in the same vein for each Castlevania or Suikoden. Fans are hungry for more on both fronts. I doubt we will ever reach a point of oversaturation as not like a bunch of Triple A studios are going hope on this bandwagon. If they do...have at it. I welcome all the toys they are willing give us.
I just figure Rabbit & Bear and Konami will probably be the only ones in this races, and everyone wins if we support both.I own all the main suikoden games,tactics and tierkres, can welcome an excuse replay to them. I know plenty of people didn't get their hands on them back in the day, and will get see what the hype was about. This all good news that many have been waiting quite some time to hear. I wish I knew about Eiyuden Chronicle sooner, as I'd backed it for sure, but It's a day one pick up either way. My dollars were always coming to them.
I'm sorry but I don't agree with you that the writers painted themselves into a corner with Suikoden. At all.
27 True Runes, there's only been maybe about 14, 15 revealed? And some of them.- the Moon Rune or Dragon Rune to name but too - weren't featured enough not to be the 'main' Rune for a game... Heck even ones that were are still available for more stories - what about a side story following Ted for 300 years?
The thing is the lore of Suikoden is specific enough to make it reward series stalwarts but open enough to literally go anywhere or do anything. You can even begin to draw in new concepts if you want... what about a steampunk country? A desert one? (Ames) A crystal one (Harmonia)
There's literally no end to it... This isn't at all like Dracula whatsoever. Their only constraints are that Magic is Rune derived and, frankly, that wouldn't be too hard to retcon if they wanted to.
Otherwise with the diversity of stories they've hinted at, I don't see where they can't go.
Their only constraint is having 108 Stars of Destiny and even that the games haven't religiously stuck to - Tactics springs to mind - and even if they did, saying that's a problem is like saying Pokemon games are problematic because of new monsters or Final Fantasy is problematic because they have to keep inventing new universes that still include Chocobos.
I don't get your opinion is really what I'm saying.
@@JeremiahEcks777 You seem to be ignoring there's still only so much land mass to have rebellions on in the world. Like how many times is the same basic story structure going happen over and over in the same world? Between running of out true runes and places have the games take place, it feels like a concept that mostly ran it's course of a showdown with Hikusaak and The Holy Kingdom of Harmonia. I envision without any major retcons they probably only made 2-3 more games as it basically was reaching it's climax without backpeddling. I'd rather have story focus on a predetermined endpoint than be milked endless till becomes unprofittable and ends in a whimper. If they want to keep it going, then come with a new story to tell.
I felt like 3 was a major improvement toward shifting the focus from strictly just another rebellion and gave far more use to having a such a massive cast as having you jump between 5 different teams of characters got alot more mileage of the 108 stars. It was far from perfect, I feel like the trinity sight system was the right kind of direction for the series. They dug deeper into the mythology of things, and showed the cost of people being ageless. 4 and 5 going back in time felt like snooze button on the endgame. Is it impossible for them keep going backwards stretching out this concept....no as castlevania definitely shows you can, but I don't feel like it's good narrative choice.
Tierkreis was side story that freed itself of the limits of the true runes and being a single world. Obviously being a multiverse has it's own set of issues, but they were atleast tinkering with the formula instead of just following the same exact formula we'd see for 5 games. It was clear konami was trying reboot both Castlevania and Suikoden to give themselves more space to work than the original timeline of either series gave. (Castlevania got a bit ridiculous with the number of times dracula been basically revivied and immediately murdered again to point you almost feel sad for drac, as he's mostly a mcguffin for the badguys to fight over than a character with any agency as a villain.)
Sure suikoden could have retconned the number of runes(Like there's two worlds split that are connected and double the true runes and twice as many places to have wars in.) or some other means or fragmented true runes way the sword and shield runes pieces of the beginning rune. I feel like this is a concept that really only made sense happen so many times as how big is this planet, how the technology mostly the same after centuries? There's a ton of logic problems that start to crop up after a point.
If you want make a sci fi or steampunk suikoden style game, just make another series as it would be too different and odd from the rest of the series. At some point you make something too divergent from the core experience, it might as well be a different game or IP. You aren't bound by any of the same baggage then. (Similar how Devil May Cry started off as Resident Evil sequel idea, but spawned into it's own thing.) So I don't agree there's unlimited places to go with this. Your choices would be largely rejected by long time fans and would milk something beyond the point of reason.
Sometimes less is more, suikoden probably is better off stopping while it's ahead than twisting itself like a pretzel like the assassin creed's series have to max out the potential number of sequels you can in same setting and universe to point of insanity. Continuity eventually collaspes upon it's under it's own weight if a story gets dragged out for too long as it becomes it's own worst enemy. Suikoden is an inheritly simple concept and I'd rather end as one than see get franksteined into some mess of a story over greed.
@@Lastjustice But it's just not true, what you're saying - with all due respect.
For a start it ignores that the Hikusaak saga doesn't need to be the end of the Suikoden story. It's just the end of the original story started by the original trilogy. But let's say we did Hikusaak - then in doing so a new story is opened up during it? Well that might be Jeane or Viki's story for example?
And in terms of a limited number of rebellions... sure. But don't do rebellions every time. Tactics wasn't and as you suggest, Suikoden 3 was starting not to be and that was really well received!
I think you underestimate what Suikoden fans would like based on the fact that the story has already been pushed considerably already. Guns via the Howling Voice Guild are a thing, the Dwarf Village and vault from Suikoden 1, some of the Sindar technology and some stuff from Suikoden 3 - as well as all these inventors running around.
It wouldn't be hard to do a prequel with the Sindar and show them to be a steampunk society for example.
And whilst you might suggest that it's spinning the story on it's laurels, maybe but only if you're assuming that Hikusaak and Harmonia are the literal end game. And nobody in Konami, including Murayama, ever said that. Murayama only suggested that Pesmerga and Yuber would only meet at the end of the world... and then a story where they fight outside of Gregminster happened to contradict it. Retcon!
So no, I don't buy your point because I don't see the Suikoden story as bound by Hikusaak. The story of Suikoden 2 and 3 aims towards Harmonia of course but the story of Suikoden V leads towards Zerase, Jeane and the Sindar, which is also picked up from Suikoden 2. Either are legitimate ways to go. Either or both!
You're also missing the point that Suikoden 3 is something like 20 years after Suikoden 1. The games have always, even at the start, spanned a whole load of time in the same world. Whilst I agree that S4 maybe didn't really go anywhere, why would more prequels or sequels have to be set within a very closed time frame?
I think Suikoden fans don't mind culture and setting changes if a) the game mechanics are similar, b) there are some recurring characters and continuity and c) it's the same world.
To be sure, fans of Final Fantasy 4 can also be fans of Final Fantasy 7 can be fans of Final Fantasy 10 and yet all of those worlds are very very different and tell very different stories. I know they're alternative universes but the point is that Suikoden fans, I think, as fans of JRPGs would be more than happy to experience some evolution... as long as it keeps one thing Suikoden fans enjoy - some continuity!
And even then it's not a dealbreaker. Eiyuden is happening without any Suikoden continuity! But what separates that and Tierkreis or Woven Web is that those games changed too many mechanics.
Comparing Suikoden to Castlevania (just because it's Konami) and Assassin's Creed isn't really valid. (Well I know you're not comparing A.C. per se and just suggesting you don't want it to be LIKE A.C. becoming stale but still, I've started talking nonsense so I'm going to finish 🤭 ). Castlevania isn't a JRPG and it's story wasn't initially it's selling point whereas with Suikoden world building and story always was. And for Assassin's Creed their problem was constant games being pumped out without any change to the formula and the games becoming increasingly buggy because creative had no time to work on them. And they also became loveless churned out nonsense.
Suikoden fans don't even get one game every four years! Sometimes A.C was getting four games in one year! Do that's why they got stupid. Fatigue.
Suikoden isn't anywhere near being fatigued and I just don't see why closing off one story branch from Suikoden 3 would meaning they have to end the series. It just closes one story thread off.
@@Lastjustice I DO agree with you though that I'm glad it doesn't collapse under it's own continuity.
And whilst I disagree with your fundamental points it's very clear you're well reasoned, thoughtful and passionate about the series, so it's always a pleasure to speak to such a fan of the series.
Whilst we might not necessarily agree with some of the finer points, glad to share fandom with guys like you. 👍
@@JeremiahEcks777 I've seen enough stories that never reach the main hook they were building toward. Such as Ogre Battle or Darksiders. (Darksiders might eventually give us the Endwar, but it hasn't happened yet.) Ogre Battle was steadily laying the groundwork toward the epic ogre battle...but given IP is in limbo, who knows if we will ever see it reach it's finale. I agree a new story can always come afterwards, just hey let's finish what we started, as I would just be happy see that come full circle. Castlevania has painfully sidestepped around the battle of 1999, Konami seem more interested in keeping stoies going indefinitely than resolving hanging threads.
Suikoden really close to reaching the big finale it was going toward. Yes there's other threads going, I just mentioned Hikusaak and Harmonia It's the puppet master pulling the strings in ever game. Like how Thanos was being built up and the infinity stones since the first Avengers movie. This same kind of energy konami was building toward.(Yes there's the sindar which you could probably throw in a game devling into them in the past that ties to the present story.) It's the final crescendo where all big pay offs would happen. We'd likely see dozens of characters from the past come together for a huge battle against the main enemy that Luc showed, the circle rune as it would bring the world to stagnation if it's grip on everything continued. It was a literal prison for the whole world. He was literally willing give up everything to stop it. I could see them doing 2-3 more games in the main story without reaching the point of needless padding and squandering the chance to complete the story.
I agree they can have other spin offs set in the same world as they have with tactics and the gaiden titles that were only in Japan with Nashe, as not every game needs gathering 108 heroes and someone being a true rune user. They could make couple games about the adventures of Schtolteheim Reinbach the first if they felt like it. I'd like for them to finish what they started before giving other side stories. It's been a long struggle to get this far.
Sure nothing really ever ends, but I like when people wrap up the majority of their hanging threads in a thoughtful manner. This feels like the main story to tell, and if you want to start a new story after that with more a mroe flexible formula, then have at it. Konami been letting this lay dormant for quite some time, so who knows if we will ever get closure on this. I would push for that rather and tell the story they really wanted than have this peter out and stay in limbo forever.
I wish they had at least touched up the original sprites a bit... the raw PS1 pixels just look jarring and stick out like a sore thumb against the new improved backgrounds of the remaster, regardless of the charm they had in the original release.
I'm curious as to what the resolution gap is between the Suikoden character sprites and the ones from Eiyuden.
I loved playing these games growing up so i m super excited to see them available again.
also its Su-ee-koh-dehn not suey-ko-den
Its a tactical move on Konami's part, but it feels like a subtle passive aggressive statement to not continue the series IF it doesn't do well is kind of lame (Maybe that's why the Original Team left Konami to form R&B)
A classic will always be that, great, but RPGs can only be played a few times before reaching a point where we move on as we've already saved the game and became Omnipotent in levels/skills/collections.
I've played Suikoden to death, and its time to move onto something new which is Eiyuden Chronicles.
Rabbit & Bear just need to make it damn good, release EC AFTER the Konami remakes because everyone knows Suikoden 1 & 2 already, cause we old timers went through its magic which is perfect at that time.
R&B have the advantage, new tech and updates (Can we say future add on missions/characters to further develop what we think is an already finished story like Valkyrie Chronicles with its DLCs before and EC2?)
Suikoden 2 Mold my childhood and it snowball from there...And eiyuden makes my Ass move on itself ...super excited 😘😘😘
I’ll be getting both.. suikoden 2 is one of my favourite all time games
I love both but I will choose Eiyuden vs Suikoden remaster if i can only pick one
Gotta admit: that Maniac remix is kinda fire.
I never liked the song very much before hearing this version.
It felt a bit akward when the Suikoden remaster was announced after Eiyuuden showed up its true potential. I mean.. Suikoden-fans where begging on their knees for years for a revival of the Series to Konami. And Konami is now like "Oh there is a similar Game showing success!? Ok, lets revive the Series and squeeze Money out of it!".. Anyway... 2023 will be an empty-wallet year in Terms of really good games
I have never heard anyone call it suukoden...interesting. Oh and count me in for both as well!
Eiyuden seems nice and everything but it isn't Suikoden, if I have to choose one (which I probably do), I would definitely get the Suikoden remaster, Suikoden 2 is one of my most favorite games ever.
both are already wish listed on steam and will be picked up day one of release with no hesitation. I still have my original copies of suikoden 1 and 2 on ps and play them often. may not like how Konami has handled things that's neither here nor there. side note eiyuden rising is a great little side game =)
I have never played a Suikoden game but when found out about Eiyuden Chronicles Hundred Heroes around 2 years ago l was filled with immense joy. Konami releasing a remaster of S1 & S2 is such a nasty situation. They purposely did this to not only drive away the old fans of Suikoden from Eiyuden but also dangling the hope of a future installment in the Suikoden franchise by basically hold its fans at gun point and saying "If you don't buy our remaster your beloved franchise will rot forever." Well I say let it rot then! It's been how many years since Konami even acknowledged Suikoden's existence and NOW they want to dig into their games catalog???I will be taking MY money to support Eiyuden Chronicles Hundred Heroes 💯
TLDR; Buy Eiyuden not the Suikoden Remasters and vote with your wallets to show Konami that you can't be forced by their hands
this is basically the same story between Dead Space and Callisto Protocol.
The dev quit and making their own studio to release spiritual successor of their previous game and then Konami & EA release the Remaster/Remake of their game.
Getting both. Highly doubt Eiyuden will have a villain the likes of Luca Blight. Hope I'm completely wrong though
Haha, I wish I would have known they were planning on doing a remaster. I dropped almost 400 dollars for the 1st and 2nd games. Oh well, I probably would have done it anyway. The only one I'm missing is the ds Suikoden game I have 1-5 plus tactics.
Suikoden 4 needs a redo badly. I would support a complete remake that is competent.
Yeah 1,2,3 suikoden we're awesome
Hoping they also remastering Suikoden V
3:15 , that is not exactly what konami said. They said: they would love to continue the suikoden series if the remaster is gooing well. Thats not really the same what you quotet
i hope they make suikoden 2 twice as hard.
Ey-You-Den
Welp we all know how Konami is but I'll still buy the remaster to show love for the creators of Suikoden I and II.
I'm going to be honest I don't care about the remaster I might get it just because of what game it is but I can care less if it does good or bad I'm all about the guys making the new game they should have let them do that from the beginning
The original creator of Suikoden left after Suikoden III. His reasons (stated in Wikipedia) was that it was his personal goal to stay for 10 years and then go freelance. There was none of this "the creators wanted to make another game" stuff. Hell Konami made two more Suikoden games (if you liked the first 3 you really should play 5 and give 4 a chance)
Eiyuden Chronicles came about because Rabbit and Bear Studio (that Yoshitaka Murayama helped create) saw there was a desire for more Suikoden games and Konami at the time was doing nothing about the license.
That's not to say there isn't any bad blood anywhere, but honestly the biggest factor for both these things existing was fan demand.
Eiyuden Chronicle has a shark. Insta buy.
They almost certainly greenlit a remaster BECAUSE Eiyuden's kickstarted did so well. My impossible dream? Both do amazing and Konami greenlights Suikoden 6 and outsources its development to Rabbit and Bear.
That's the history and true color of Konami-- remember Kojima? MGS was lit, but you know Konami tends to be a villain for gamers
I think Konami just trying to ride the trend wave of the original suikoden team's new project.
Even if they work on new suikoden I believe it would just end up like the PSP game, unless they pull rabbit and bear studio to work on the game which is unlikely.
Overall not that hopeful for Konami and wish the new series success.
Getting both day 1 period
So if Suikoden does not do well they will not make another one BUT they release it same year and maybe same Month as Eiduyen so they are making their own grave eventually.
Its not just a Dick move to do so but also Stupid.
i will probably buy both but i dont have hope that it will do so well, its still an old game its not like Resident Evil 2 Remake, where everything is modernized and completely reworked.
I want both games to succeed but i dont have too much Hope. we will see and hope for the best tho :)
If they never continue the suikoden series can one of the team at least release a list and history of the true runes? I've waited years for more lore on those things
Konami is just fcked up, Metal Gear, Castlevania and Suikoden the new head or decision maker for Konami is just destroying the company as whoever he she is is fucked up seriously.
I love Suikoden but I don't like Konami...not anymore ever since they abandoned Suikoden. It just seems sus that they are riding the coattails of Eiyuden's kickstarter success. I love Suikoden with all my heart and it will always be something I'll cherish so will definitely support both games but not Konami entirely. If Konami delivers a Suiko 6, then I'll definitely forgive them but remasters are not enough for me to fully support them :D
In my opinion, Konami is just trying to get whatever money left by releasing remastered around the same time. They probably regret not greenlit to make suikoden again after eiyuden become #1 game funded in Kickstarter. So they ride the hype of eiyuden release to get some more money out of the remastered. Because if they really want to keep the series going again, they should remake it or make a new game with the old devs. Not remaster it. That's my opinion.
Konami announcing Suikoden 1 and 2 remaster after the hype of Eiyuden Chronicles is just scummy. AND THEN THEY HAVE THE AUDACITY TO TRY AND STRONG ARM THE FANS WITH "If this doesn't sell well Suikoden is done for". Fuck that, I'll watch Konami and the Suikoden series burn before I give Konami any of my money.
Guys guys guys. Stop bishing in the comment section. This is the official.
2>1>5>3>tactic>4.
Arguably 5 and 3 spots could be interchangeable in the sense that 3rd is better in the sense that we got a rather continuation of the first 2. While 5 is superiorly done compared to 3 but its so far away in years to the first 2 its basically a different game in the same world.
Now for the suikoden fans oath.
Lets all promise to shun anyone who has 4 as favourite.
AND shun even more those that manage to play the tierkreis and the suikoden novel 1 and 2 game. Lucky bastard.
Amen.
it's not a funny situation though. Both the creators and fans of Suikoden pushed for decades for a new Suikoden, and Konami just outright ignored all of us. So, fed up, Murayama and co. made Rabbit and Bear to create a spiritual successor to Suikoden, that's what Eiyuden is. Now, after seeing what a huge success the kickstarter for Eiyuden was, Konami are putting out the Suikoden remasters for one reason only; to spite Rabbit and Bear. I mean, I'm happy that Konami are finally doing something with the Suikoden IP, but come on.
A lot of the Suikoden community keep saying things like "just shut up and be happy that we're getting something", but I'm struggling to be excited for a remaster that, despite how amazing it looks, they're just rushing out the gate purely for the sake of conflicting with the release of Eiyuden.
...There's a Suikoden Remaster coming out?
Will eiyuden chronicle have the war battles