One of the worst mid air collisions ever. I feel bad for those kids and everyone one else. Such tragedy and so terrible for their families. May they rest in peace
What's truly sad about this is that the controller, Peter Nielson who was controlling the airspace was actually murdered by Vitaly Kaloyev, a family member of several of the victims after the accident.
One of the most soul crushing videos that I have ever seen. I feel terrible for everyone involved here. Peter made a mistake and paid for it with his life. And as many have stated, the Father carrying his Daughter's body just absolutely made me break down. May all of these poor people rest in peace.
The pilot and crew of 2937 made a mistake as well. They didn't trust their instrument's instructions and did the exact opposite of what it told them to do. This wasn't just a mistake on the part of ATC.
@@Silver87sc the pilots and crew did not make a mistake. first of all, they are told to follow ATC. second of all, a human who is supposed to be guiding two (both/all) airplanes in conflict vs. tech that could malfunction. you haven't read enough, heard enough, seen enough, experienced enough to be making this comment.
The things that hits u the most is about those pilots and last few seconds totally helpless and a father carrying her daughters body ohh man its worse than death RIP to all those lost their life in this tragic incident😢
I cried a bit... I can't even imagine what it must be like to hold your little girl's lifeless body. And there's even a whole tale behind it. The father actually tried to talk with Skyguide and get an apology, he wanted to know the air traffic's controller's name too. Instead they tried to pay him 100k+ and in exchange for the father to not hold Skyguide liable for his family's death. They also gave more money for his wife and less for the two kids.... Outraged, he tracked down the air traffic controller himself and ended up taking his life. He got 3 years in prison and when going back home to Russia was deemed a hero by the local community.
Umm, firstly, this was not a tower. Secondly, when is an ATC facility not active? There is always traffic to deal with 24 hours a day, seven days a week. It was not maintanance, it was deliberate short staffing that caused this. It is absurd to have a controller sliding his chair between two screens.
@@nickv4073 You should read more.. As they hand off the Traffic to another tower.. As they have several ways to hand off flights. Most the time they are 100 miles away. As they approach the Air Port. Then the last 20 miles they are handed off to the tower.. And you don;t shut the damn Phones or Radar down. To do maintenance on an active Controller station.. You're just asking for it. As they even said the Controller had no idea what they were doing. As he was no trained on the maintenance procedures..
@@WizzRacing Dude, towers are at airports. Nowhere else. This was not a tower. It was a Regional ATC Center. These two planes were not landing. They were not even on approach to an airport at this time. They did not even start a descent yet. They were at CRUISE altitude. Period. Secondly, they did not shut off radar. WTF? Did you not watch the video? Did you not see the two planes on the radar screen at the same altitude? The only problem was short staffing. No one was looking at the screen until it was too late.
@@nickv4073 the otherguy has no idea what he is talking about but the maintenance in this case shut off the STCA and landline, I mean shouldn’t it be communicated more clearly with the controller so he doesn’t try to call on a broken phone?
I blame the maintenance crew that shut off the air traffic controllers radar and phones, crippling his ability to do his job. And for routine maintenence that could have waited. They should NEVER put a control tower in that situation.
Fate sometimes is crude, if they didn’t go to the wrong airport these kids would still be alive and a different group of people would have been on the fatal flight.
I'm not sure the Russian flight would have been at the point of impact as it was basically a charter flight that otherwise not be necessary had the children not missed their original flight.
If you actually look at a daily plane route, there's thousands upon thousands upon thousands upon thousands of planes. They are constantly intersecting. If you look at a screen that maps all the flights, you will see how many flights are on the same paths and in the same space. It's like a traffic jam. It's not like there's five or ten planes. They are constantly really close
What are the chances that man was able to find that piece of broken jewelry and then finding his daughter's body? How many thousands of feet did that occur and over how many miles was the debris field? Almost Devine intervention. That's truly amazing, but then what heart break he must have felt and continues for the rest of his life...
he allowed his emotions to become rage and he murdered the controller. He should be in prison rotting away, but is not, hiding behind emotions. He planned it, he stalked him, and he attacked him at home, all planned. The German Police were incompetant to allow any family member to explore the crash area at all, much less unescorted. Controller's blood is on the German police.
That's why it wasn't that much of a surprise when they found passport of the hijackers on 9/11 even though people think that that's so crazy but they have found literally bolts and the bottom of the sea that belong to a plane that they needed to check to see if they were fucked-up
@@jeffreymontgomery4091time does not heal. What you're doing in that span of time is truly what make you for going on life and moved on. If you're doing nothing then nothing heal forever in all time.
I think, as both phones were down and the system was compromised… the other controller should’ve ended his break! Sure, they say it’s common practice but cmon … you’re at work, get to working!
Kinda sounds like the Maintenance crew that night are responsible for the crash and deaths. They basically took down all the tools and made inevitable…They should have had a contingency plan and took down one piece at a time, if needed, not shutting down basically all the equipment and tools.
Not human error. This was a training error in the Russian Aviation Authority. They trained their pilots to always obey the controller. The rest of the world was trained to consider TCAS as God and to give TCAS priority at all times.
@@nickv4073 At that time, there was no internation regulation as to what to do when TCAS and the controler give contradictory instructions. Moreover, TCAS was still optional inside of Russia, and you need all airplanes to have for TCAS for it to work. So it made sense that Russian pilots were trained to obey the controller, because the controller could see the traffic that pilots were not able to see, as some Russian planes did not have TCAS.
why should the atc intervene if the purpose of the tcas is to take care of potential collisions? it's like 2 systems for the same job? that's a flawed logical approach
I know that Vitaly Kaloyev was upset💔 that he lost his family in the collision🛩💥, but murdering the Air controller, Peter Nielson was just plain out wrong because he wasn’t at fault of the accident💔 it was Skyguide for their Negligence, Improper Management, and equipment😡.
Exactly. And even though Peter was found blameless, he had to live with the fact the crash happened on his watch. He was already going through his own hell. He never went back to SkyGuide after the crash.
If Icao hadn't being complacent about making firm procedures on tcas vs atc, then maybe Peter, the school children and Vitaly's family would still be alive.
@@INARMEILEHYou know, it really amazes me how people ALWAYS blaming the wrong person for the murders the other person committed. So I guess Peter should've called in sick that night huh?
That was the most horrifying video out of the whole Mayday series. All those children dead ... Although I don't condone violence, I understand that father's rage and the action he took.
This is like, IT HAD TO BE, everything aligned for this to occurred, it is just incredible how everything got in place for this to happen, IT HAD TO BE AND THERE WAS A REASON FOR IT.
YA, IT WASN'T NILLSSEN SCHMILLSONS FAULT, IT WAS THOSE BUTTWIPES THAT SHUT DOWN ALL THE SHIT HE NEEDED AT ATC, HE WAS OVER WORKED AND UNDER PAID, LIKE A LOT OF PEOPLE, AND IT'S REALLY SAD BECAUSE IF THE TRAVEL AGENT, OR WHOEVER IT WAS, WOULD'NT HAVE TOOK THEM 2 THE WRONG AIRPORT, IT WOULDN'T HAVE HAPPENED. IT WAS ALMOST LIKE IT WAS A DESTINY FOR ALL OF THEM? I HATE TO SAY IT BUT EVERYTHING ALIGNED THAT NIGHT, AND DISASTER HAPPENED. ALL THOSE POOR KIDS,
at some point, even if atc officer has only one screen to watch, another pair of planes could have collided anywhere in the world until the regulations were re-evaluated. even with no breaks and one screen, people can get tired or make unintentional mistakes at massive quantities of flights happening daily. or there could be broken phone lines from idk tree falling or whatever pick a realistic scenario from imagination.
The one who has nothing to lose is the scariest and last person you would want to provoke. I don't blame the father who killed the controller because he had lost everything when both planes collided. I am not saying the controller is not at fault, but he should had been pro-active to reject his colleague from taking a break and find someone to stand in for him temporary. The role of the ATC is to prevent cases like this to happen, if not, why need an ATC in the first place?
When the controller first noticed the two airplanes are in collission course he asked the russian aircraft to descent, while the russian aircraft's TCAS told the pilots to climb. The controller should have told the other plane to climb and he should have stayed with them until that problem was resolved, but instead he just left the screen to communicate with the other planes. The controller made a mistake in my opinion by not coordinating with the two aircraft.
The people who were still alive after the mid air collision went through hell, some probably were blown out into the sky, some where strapped to their seat while seeing a giant hole and realizing the end was near
the only two people alive 10 seconds after the collision were the crew of the DHL plane. The Tupoluv broke up at 36,000 feet, everyone on board was dead shortly thereafter.
i cant even begin to imagine such a thing, my god man, to be sitting there one minute and everything,s fine, then BAM !! you are now the pilot, basically, like you said, your in your seat where it broke ,now you are sitting in a seat that,s still connected to the plane but right at the breaking point, making you the first person at the front looking out into space everything that was in front of you, meaning the rest of the plane , is now gone, how could any person on this god forsaken planet conceive being in that seat ?? GOOD GOD IN HEAVEN , whoever it was in those front seat,s had to have lost there mind,s and passed out from the experience of being in such a position , im trying to put my own mind around this, and i cant, there are no word,s i can think of to describe such a stunt , they were at 36,000 for one thing, at that height there is no air to breathe , MT, EVEREST IS 30,110 FT. those children were at 36000 feet, nobody once the children,s plane broke apart, there air was instantly cut off , i know for a fact, that some of those children fell from the plane and did a free fall from 36,000 ft. they probably suffocated or passed out and died before hitting the ground , a person begin,s to be able to breathe a little air at around 29,000 to 30,000 ft but its very limited and hard to get a full breath at that altitude , its not until i believe around 21,000 ft. you can almost breathe normally , under 20 thousand ft. a young strong person can take a full breathe , but its still somewhat hard , once 14,000 ft. is reached, breathing can be obtained , they were over twice that 2 times 14,000 is only 28,000 ft. they we,re at 36,000 ft. MY GOD , to think of that scene, of what happened from start to finish makes me cry, for all those children and parent,s and families , complete and utter TRADGETY !!! total TRADGETY !! ill never stop thinking about this , it is by far the absolute worst thing to both the children and everyone on board that plane that night, I WISH THE PILOT,S HAD OBEYED THERE T-CAS SYSTEM,S THE PLANES WOULD HAVE PASSED EACH OTHER AND WENT ON TO THERE DESTINATION,S , S.O.B. , im sorry, please forgive me, its so frustrating , why do people put so much trust in these flying coffin,s , as long as its man made its going to be susceptible to failure and flaw,s and subject to break down , either by pilot error, or mechcanical failure or both in conjunction with each other, your always going to have airplane crashes , as long as people keep buying a ticket to get on these thing,s there going to continue to happen , case closed, but i hate it when its a bunch of children involved , if it were up to me, id smash every commercial jet liner on earth , go by ship, there pretty safe today, id rather go by ship, than fall 36,000 ft. ill take my chances in a life boat, on a jetliner you have no safety devices to use, not a damn thing , no parachute, no ejection seat,s , NOTHING, something goes wrong, your dead, the end, case closed, you dont stand a snowball,s chance in hell of surviving when these thing,s crash, im Done, thank you for your comment, it gave me a chance to vent my feeling,s and for that, i Thank You, goodnight, W.H.W. 2-16-23 WILLIAM
They all died almost instantly or lost consciousness almost instantly. You don't realize when planes fall like people aren't just awake. At that height the speed and the pressure differential will knock you out immediately and it will burst your lungs killing you before you feel anything. Not to mention the temperature is freezing and in the negative degree. The g-forces will kill you too. There's no breathable air up there. Every single one of those people was unconscious instantly if not dead
It really goes to show that it takes the lives of innocent bystanders for changes in the industry to occur. Many problems in aviation will never be addressed properly unless sacrifices are made. In this case, 72 people paid the price with their own lives for better procedures regarding atc vs tcas conflicts.
your right, it does look that way to be sure, nothing ever gets done unless people die, then just maybe something might be done about it, what does that tell you about people ? we dont stand a chance , its so sad, im sure GOD had other plans , like the people of the world reading the bible and living his words , its a split world where anything goes these days , its scary ,
If there was a God, he could have easily save them and he didn't so he's an evil piece of shit or he doesn't exist. You can't think of God when good things happen unless you're also going to blame him
The t cast system causing another large fatal accident unintentionally. This what happen sometimes when near by planes don’t follow the same directions. One listed to the t case the other the controller.
DHL pilots tried to save the plane but it lost 80% of its horizontal stabilizer and 2nd engine causing it to lose control and plunge and in 2004 Peter Nielsen as an air traffic controller was killed by a man. his name is Vitaly Kaloyev who lost his wife and 2 children on BTC 2937 hunted and stabbed to death
Strictly speaking, they couldn't. It was against Skyguide's rules, and probably some industry regulation as well, but they did it anyway. The company allowed it, against their own rules. They were complacent. On any other night, it probably wouldn't have been so bad, but with so much equipment out of order and some bad luck, it proved fatal. They should have at least called back the other guy when the maintenance staff started shutting down things.
How about hiring more chair-dancers, to hop from workstation to workstation some more, increase pain and suffering and misery because there ain't enough yet.
All those children! 💔 5 crew members/pilots in the cockpit and none of them knows that TCAS takes priority over ATC?! 🤦🏻♂️ This never should have happened.
all of them know better than you, for sure. did you not read the story fully? the were no set and stone atc vs tcas rules and the russians are expected to listen to a person who is expected to talk to both planes vs tech that can malfunction or has deficiencies. man, these people with 0 comprehension and comments.
Where was your God when they were dying. Your God either had the power to save them and chose not to in which case he's evil or he couldn't help them in which case he's not powerful or he just doesn't exist. My guess is he doesn't exist. If you are going to thank a god when good things happen than you have to be honest and blame that God for killing all those people because it was his fault if he exists
@@thickerconstrictor9037If you're going to convince us that God doesn't exist, well then you, my friend just told us humanity doesn't exist either. Unbelievers think like this because you choose not to believe. Open your eyes man. Not everyone is going to believe in the same way you believe. And remember, us humans FAILED other humans.
Cargo planes. The menace of the skies. This collision wasn't the fault of the DHL plane, but every time one of these stories involves a cargo plane I think.. Oh Damn. And I wonder what it's going to slam into. An apartment complex? Shopping mall? They always seem to wipe out in the worst way. So tragic about those children. Horrible. I have a friend who has two sons. They live in the same city and when they visit her for the holidays she insists that they take separate flights even though they can easily fly together.
This was a series of crazy incidents that occurred in conjunction and caused this hideous tragedy. But post C͏o͏vid͏w Pandemic, we have an even worse set of dangerous circumstances. Airlines adding more flights to regain lost profit, the skies are more crowded, newly hired pilots, controllers, maintenance workers and supervisors are less trained, less experienced, overworked, plus planes go longer without proper maintenance, Etc, etc. (decreased flights and pilot, maintenance, lay offs during C͏o͏vid͏ pandemic, causing them to change careers, left passenger airlines short on staff and unprepared for the eventual post pandemic public demand to travel again!) I ’ve always loved flying, but will NOT fly now. Too damn dangerous!!!!
That's exactly what Tcast was designed to do, the issue was that there was no mandate to listen to it's commands at the time and the pilots that listened to orders from the control tower had they listened to Tcast this disaster wouldn't have happened.
It's not worth feeling sorry for him. He disgraced the memory of his wife and kids when he murdered the controller Peter Nielsen by stabbing him in front of his own family.
@@matthewhahn1132And people glorified Peter's death as if he did it intentionally. So guess what, now the father is in prison for taking a husband and a father away. My heart would've went out to him, until he did what he did.
RIP To All Lost !! 😢 GOD's continued Mercy, Healing, Love, Protection & Guidance to All the Families & to those. Who's Errors set this in Motion without the Intention !!!!🙏❤💕😪
Oh please! He had the capacity to research who he was and where he lived and travel there to murder him it’s ridiculous to say he didn’t have the capacity to know it was wrong. People need to take responsibility for their actions and stop hiding behind the insanity defense. I feel horrible for his loss but it wasn’t the controller’s fault first of all and second, an eye for an eye just leaves a world full of blind men/women.
exactly, people need to be responsible for their actions and that is the people managing atc and international aviation guide. the man who murdered peter is just a broken soul.
My opinion is that the Russian aircraft is 70% responsible due to them not listening to their TCAS(Traffic Collision Avoidance System). The controller is 30% responsible because he should have been monitoring his screen more, however he is less responsible due to the unfortunate coincidences that took place
Here I critically disagree with you. You cannot shift two-thirds of the blame to the Russian pilots, while saying that the controller had "unfortunate coincidences". In Soviet (and Russian, at that time) civil aviation, the controller had the last word, since he saw the whole situation. Soviet pilots were taught to trust the controller, so in a stressful situation they listened to him. Plus, blaming everything exclusively on direct participants is an approach that leads nowhere. Soviet pilots did what they were taught, the controller got into a terrible situation, including through the fault of management, ICAO did not introduce any measures to protect against such a scenario (although there was already a similar case with DC-10 and B747 aircraft, flights 957 and 907 of Japanese Airlines, but there were no casualties and no measures were taken to standardize the use of TCAS). And please don't think that I'm in any way justifying the actions of the dispatcher's killer. He is a grief-stricken father who found himself a scapegoat. Terrible situation, no matter how you look at it.
@@Pre-flightChekist I’m saying this from a west world perspective based on what America aviation standardized even though the accident was Russian related
@@colemonroe1846 well, i understand the perspective, but must admit that i would not place blame before looking at the problem from different points of view. Well, anyhow, now you have some information on russian civil aviation school of thought! Good day to you, and good night to me -- it's 2am in Moscow and i have college tomorrow morning)
The air traffic controller was alone and without his technology. I don't see how we can expect perfection from anyone in that situation. No phone, other tech disabled due to maintenance....he tried calling for help.
I smell a rat !! ... one who doesn't like exceptional people. ...afraid they may understand too much.. or .. that they will grow to be famous and wealthy.. and therefore powerful. .... or some such elite paranoia or another. Too many Oooopses. Way too many. .. from.. the trip being offered to these particular children in the first place, which I find odd. ... I'd like to know who arranged this trip..? ... because ..then... the travel agent took them to the wrong airport..? WHAT..? .. then.. the radar isn't working...? ..and has men working on it at that time... Wha? ... and then things after other things happened... that sound fishy. Just say'n .!!
One of the worst mid air collisions ever. I feel bad for those kids and everyone one else. Such tragedy and so terrible for their families. May they rest in peace
the air traffic controller too
@@CarlitoLOL694yep
What's truly sad about this is that the controller, Peter Nielson who was controlling the airspace was actually murdered by Vitaly Kaloyev, a family member of several of the victims after the accident.
Of course Peter wasn’t fault again it was both maintenance crews get terrible mistakes of repairs on lines and phones is off
Yes I know it was terrible fateful about murder
8
@@steffaniglygoroff9408 What?
Kaloyev is a murderer by killing Peter Nielson, Nielson was blameless in the collision. Rest in Peace Peter.
One of the most soul crushing videos that I have ever seen. I feel terrible for everyone involved here. Peter made a mistake and paid for it with his life. And as many have stated, the Father carrying his Daughter's body just absolutely made me break down. May all of these poor people rest in peace.
The pilot and crew of 2937 made a mistake as well. They didn't trust their instrument's instructions and did the exact opposite of what it told them to do. This wasn't just a mistake on the part of ATC.
@@Silver87sc in West only the pilots are trust tcas any other place they should follow controller instructions
@@Silver87sc the pilots and crew did not make a mistake. first of all, they are told to follow ATC. second of all, a human who is supposed to be guiding two (both/all) airplanes in conflict vs. tech that could malfunction. you haven't read enough, heard enough, seen enough, experienced enough to be making this comment.
The things that hits u the most is about those pilots and last few seconds totally helpless and a father carrying her daughters body ohh man its worse than death RIP to all those lost their life in this tragic incident😢
That father carrying his daughter. I could not live after that.
I cried a bit... I can't even imagine what it must be like to hold your little girl's lifeless body. And there's even a whole tale behind it.
The father actually tried to talk with Skyguide and get an apology, he wanted to know the air traffic's controller's name too. Instead they tried to pay him 100k+ and in exchange for the father to not hold Skyguide liable for his family's death. They also gave more money for his wife and less for the two kids....
Outraged, he tracked down the air traffic controller himself and ended up taking his life. He got 3 years in prison and when going back home to Russia was deemed a hero by the local community.
Who the hell thinks it's a good idea too do Maintenance on an Active Control Tower?
Umm, firstly, this was not a tower. Secondly, when is an ATC facility not active? There is always traffic to deal with 24 hours a day, seven days a week. It was not maintanance, it was deliberate short staffing that caused this. It is absurd to have a controller sliding his chair between two screens.
exactly! WTF?!
@@nickv4073 You should read more.. As they hand off the Traffic to another tower.. As they have several ways to hand off flights. Most the time they are 100 miles away. As they approach the Air Port. Then the last 20 miles they are handed off to the tower..
And you don;t shut the damn Phones or Radar down. To do maintenance on an active Controller station.. You're just asking for it. As they even said the Controller had no idea what they were doing. As he was no trained on the maintenance procedures..
@@WizzRacing Dude, towers are at airports. Nowhere else. This was not a tower. It was a Regional ATC Center. These two planes were not landing. They were not even on approach to an airport at this time. They did not even start a descent yet. They were at CRUISE altitude. Period. Secondly, they did not shut off radar. WTF? Did you not watch the video? Did you not see the two planes on the radar screen at the same altitude? The only problem was short staffing. No one was looking at the screen until it was too late.
@@nickv4073 the otherguy has no idea what he is talking about but the maintenance in this case shut off the STCA and landline, I mean shouldn’t it be communicated more clearly with the controller so he doesn’t try to call on a broken phone?
I blame the maintenance crew that shut off the air traffic controllers radar and phones, crippling his ability to do his job. And for routine maintenence that could have waited. They should NEVER put a control tower in that situation.
Not peter again it was both maintenance crews
Fate sometimes is crude, if they didn’t go to the wrong airport these kids would still be alive and a different group of people would have been on the fatal flight.
There is no fate but what we make
I'm not sure the Russian flight would have been at the point of impact as it was basically a charter flight that otherwise not be necessary had the children not missed their original flight.
The most heartbreaking video I've ever watched 🥺
Frequency of ads makes it difficult to focus on the story.
Heart breaking beyond belief. The Greatest tragedy is that to lose childrens lives. Paramount grief universal.
Man this is unbelievable how 2 planes end up on the same course
it appears that they were 90 degrees opposed, but should not have been at the same altitude, regardless.
And given how quiet the airspace was compared to during the day, it's even more mind boggling.
If you actually look at a daily plane route, there's thousands upon thousands upon thousands upon thousands of planes. They are constantly intersecting. If you look at a screen that maps all the flights, you will see how many flights are on the same paths and in the same space. It's like a traffic jam. It's not like there's five or ten planes. They are constantly really close
Rip for those lost souls 😢😢😢
Feel very sorry for families
The sad thing is the father found his daughter’s bracelet at the crash site, then he found her body
I think it was a necklace. There's a movie called Aftermath with Arnold Schwarzenegger loosely based on this.
What are the chances that man was able to find that piece of broken jewelry and then finding his daughter's body? How many thousands of feet did that occur and over how many miles was the debris field? Almost Devine intervention. That's truly amazing, but then what heart break he must have felt and continues for the rest of his life...
he allowed his emotions to become rage and he murdered the controller. He should be in prison rotting away, but is not, hiding behind emotions. He planned it, he stalked him, and he attacked him at home, all planned. The German Police were incompetant to allow any family member to explore the crash area at all, much less unescorted. Controller's blood is on the German police.
he married 15 years after the tragedy. He had children, a son and a daughter
@Zara Sana Perhaps this is a case where time does heal? An amazing story either way. Thanks for the update.
That's why it wasn't that much of a surprise when they found passport of the hijackers on 9/11 even though people think that that's so crazy but they have found literally bolts and the bottom of the sea that belong to a plane that they needed to check to see if they were fucked-up
@@jeffreymontgomery4091time does not heal. What you're doing in that span of time is truly what make you for going on life and moved on. If you're doing nothing then nothing heal forever in all time.
I feel so incredibly bad for Peter. They never should have put so much work onto him. He was stuck with the burden of killing so many people.
I think, as both phones were down and the system was compromised… the other controller should’ve ended his break! Sure, they say it’s common practice but cmon … you’re at work, get to working!
Kinda sounds like the Maintenance crew that night are responsible for the crash and deaths. They basically took down all the tools and made inevitable…They should have had a contingency plan and took down one piece at a time, if needed, not shutting down basically all the equipment and tools.
From start to finish just a horrible tragedy, all around.
its clear, atc ain't for the faint of heart. tragic!
Last few words: I TOLD YOU IT WAS ON THE LEFT!
Painful and horrifying incident because of human error
Not human error. This was a training error in the Russian Aviation Authority. They trained their pilots to always obey the controller. The rest of the world was trained to consider TCAS as God and to give TCAS priority at all times.
@@nickv4073 At that time, there was no internation regulation as to what to do when TCAS and the controler give contradictory instructions. Moreover, TCAS was still optional inside of Russia, and you need all airplanes to have for TCAS for it to work. So it made sense that Russian pilots were trained to obey the controller, because the controller could see the traffic that pilots were not able to see, as some Russian planes did not have TCAS.
@@nickv4073 there was NO INTERNATIONAL REGULATION, WHAT TRAINING ERROR?! smh your thinking is error.
It amazes me that planes collide in a 3D space, I guess they are all on specific flight paths and altitudes but still.
why should the atc intervene if the purpose of the tcas is to take care of potential collisions? it's like 2 systems for the same job? that's a flawed logical approach
I know that Vitaly Kaloyev was upset💔 that he lost his family in the collision🛩💥, but murdering the Air controller, Peter Nielson was just plain out wrong because he wasn’t at fault of the accident💔 it was Skyguide for their Negligence, Improper Management, and equipment😡.
Exactly. And even though Peter was found blameless, he had to live with the fact the crash happened on his watch. He was already going through his own hell. He never went back to SkyGuide after the crash.
If Icao hadn't being complacent about making firm procedures on tcas vs atc, then maybe Peter, the school children and Vitaly's family would still be alive.
After seeing what he did, I'm glad his family is gone
Many mistakes,but the controller made the fatal one,and he paid with his life.
@@INARMEILEHYou know, it really amazes me how people ALWAYS blaming the wrong person for the murders the other person committed. So I guess Peter should've called in sick that night huh?
That was the most horrifying video out of the whole Mayday series. All those children dead ... Although I don't condone violence, I understand that father's rage and the action he took.
All the rage & the murder of this ATC will never bring any solace to that man.
This is like, IT HAD TO BE, everything aligned for this to occurred, it is just incredible how everything got in place for this to happen, IT HAD TO BE AND THERE WAS A REASON FOR IT.
Vitaly is no more a hero than Jeffrey Dahmer or Ted Bundy in my eyes.
YA, IT WASN'T NILLSSEN SCHMILLSONS FAULT, IT WAS THOSE BUTTWIPES THAT SHUT DOWN ALL THE SHIT HE NEEDED AT ATC, HE WAS OVER WORKED AND UNDER PAID, LIKE A LOT OF PEOPLE, AND IT'S REALLY SAD BECAUSE IF THE TRAVEL AGENT, OR WHOEVER IT WAS, WOULD'NT HAVE TOOK THEM 2 THE WRONG AIRPORT, IT WOULDN'T HAVE HAPPENED. IT WAS ALMOST LIKE IT WAS A DESTINY FOR ALL OF THEM? I HATE TO SAY IT BUT EVERYTHING ALIGNED THAT NIGHT, AND DISASTER HAPPENED. ALL THOSE POOR KIDS,
Yeah, this was just on your channel under a different title. Another huge fail from On The Move.
rip to all those innocent souls including so many children 😢...
After this it became a rule to follow the TCAS over the traffic controller..
So very sad
I wonder if Peter hadn't been watching two screens if this would have happened? THE TCAS situation should have been resolved and clear from day one.
at some point, even if atc officer has only one screen to watch, another pair of planes could have collided anywhere in the world until the regulations were re-evaluated. even with no breaks and one screen, people can get tired or make unintentional mistakes at massive quantities of flights happening daily. or there could be broken phone lines from idk tree falling or whatever pick a realistic scenario from imagination.
Very sad story about both planes get collisions in summer 2002
I feel sad 😢 about the plane crash and all the passengers and pilots in the twplev and the DHL plane with two pilot my heart is broken 💔😢😢😢😢
I don’t believe after cause accident make peter Nielsen get fired from airport
So very sad…..
The one who has nothing to lose is the scariest and last person you would want to provoke.
I don't blame the father who killed the controller because he had lost everything when both planes collided. I am not saying the controller is not at fault, but he should had been pro-active to reject his colleague from taking a break and find someone to stand in for him temporary. The role of the ATC is to prevent cases like this to happen, if not, why need an ATC in the first place?
Horrible take. You don’t know that he didn’t beg his coworker to stay and was ignored. You weren’t there.
Why is the sound mix in mono? 😏
When the controller first noticed the two airplanes are in collission course he asked the russian aircraft to descent, while the russian aircraft's TCAS told the pilots to climb. The controller should have told the other plane to climb and he should have stayed with them until that problem was resolved, but instead he just left the screen to communicate with the other planes. The controller made a mistake in my opinion by not coordinating with the two aircraft.
The one father felt to desire for revenge for the death of his child. Didn't solve anything. Wasn't gonna bring his child back.
The people who were still alive after the mid air collision went through hell, some probably were blown out into the sky, some where strapped to their seat while seeing a giant hole and realizing the end was near
the only two people alive 10 seconds after the collision were the crew of the DHL plane. The Tupoluv broke up at 36,000 feet, everyone on board was dead shortly thereafter.
i cant even begin to imagine such a thing, my god man, to be sitting there one minute and everything,s fine, then BAM !! you are now the pilot, basically, like you said, your in your seat where it broke ,now you are sitting in a seat that,s still connected to the plane but right at the breaking point, making you the first person at the front looking out into space everything that was in front of you, meaning the rest of the plane , is now gone, how could any person on this god forsaken planet conceive being in that seat ?? GOOD GOD IN HEAVEN , whoever it was in those front seat,s had to have lost there mind,s and passed out from the experience of being in such a position , im trying to put my own mind around this, and i cant, there are no word,s i can think of to describe such a stunt , they were at 36,000 for one thing, at that height there is no air to breathe , MT, EVEREST IS 30,110 FT. those children were at 36000 feet, nobody once the children,s plane broke apart, there air was instantly cut off , i know for a fact, that some of those children fell from the plane and did a free fall from 36,000 ft. they probably suffocated or passed out and died before hitting the ground , a person begin,s to be able to breathe a little air at around 29,000 to 30,000 ft but its very limited and hard to get a full breath at that altitude , its not until i believe around 21,000 ft. you can almost breathe normally , under 20 thousand ft. a young strong person can take a full breathe , but its still somewhat hard , once 14,000 ft. is reached, breathing can be obtained , they were over twice that 2 times 14,000 is only 28,000 ft. they we,re at 36,000 ft. MY GOD , to think of that scene, of what happened from start to finish makes me cry, for all those children and parent,s and families , complete and utter TRADGETY !!! total TRADGETY !! ill never stop thinking about this , it is by far the absolute worst thing to both the children and everyone on board that plane that night, I WISH THE PILOT,S HAD OBEYED THERE T-CAS SYSTEM,S THE PLANES WOULD HAVE PASSED EACH OTHER AND WENT ON TO THERE DESTINATION,S , S.O.B. , im sorry, please forgive me, its so frustrating , why do people put so much trust in these flying coffin,s , as long as its man made its going to be susceptible to failure and flaw,s and subject to break down , either by pilot error, or mechcanical failure or both in conjunction with each other, your always going to have airplane crashes , as long as people keep buying a ticket to get on these thing,s there going to continue to happen , case closed, but i hate it when its a bunch of children involved , if it were up to me, id smash every commercial jet liner on earth , go by ship, there pretty safe today, id rather go by ship, than fall 36,000 ft. ill take my chances in a life boat, on a jetliner you have no safety devices to use, not a damn thing , no parachute, no ejection seat,s , NOTHING, something goes wrong, your dead, the end, case closed, you dont stand a snowball,s chance in hell of surviving when these thing,s crash, im Done, thank you for your comment, it gave me a chance to vent my feeling,s and for that, i Thank You, goodnight, W.H.W. 2-16-23 WILLIAM
They all died almost instantly or lost consciousness almost instantly. You don't realize when planes fall like people aren't just awake. At that height the speed and the pressure differential will knock you out immediately and it will burst your lungs killing you before you feel anything. Not to mention the temperature is freezing and in the negative degree. The g-forces will kill you too. There's no breathable air up there. Every single one of those people was unconscious instantly if not dead
It really goes to show that it takes the lives of innocent bystanders for changes in the industry to occur. Many problems in aviation will never be addressed properly unless sacrifices are made. In this case, 72 people paid the price with their own lives for better procedures regarding atc vs tcas conflicts.
your right, it does look that way to be sure, nothing ever gets done unless people die, then just maybe something might be done about it, what does that tell you about people ? we dont stand a chance , its so sad, im sure GOD had other plans , like the people of the world reading the bible and living his words , its a split world where anything goes these days , its scary ,
19:07 DHL First Officer: descend fuck descend hard
Sad very sad not too much for the ones are gone because they are in Gods hands but for the families
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If there was a God, he could have easily save them and he didn't so he's an evil piece of shit or he doesn't exist. You can't think of God when good things happen unless you're also going to blame him
God was taking a break when it happened.
sorry, couldn't not make the joke. it's a sad world.
All the circumstances were disaster, waiting to happen.
16:59 *w h y*
no one wants this happen, it's accident. Why did he kill Peter? How could he?
blame Skyguide not Peter Nelson The Russian Pilots nor the DHL Pilots
It was my Luftkuss and Kaffeerührstäbchen!
Mea Culpa
The t cast system causing another large fatal accident unintentionally. This what happen sometimes when near by planes don’t follow the same directions. One listed to the t case the other the controller.
Absolutely Right
Absolutely wrong. Tcas didn’t cause it failure to listen to it did.
DHL pilots tried to save the plane but it lost 80% of its horizontal stabilizer and 2nd engine causing it to lose control and plunge and in 2004 Peter Nielsen as an air traffic controller was killed by a man. his name is Vitaly Kaloyev who lost his wife and 2 children on BTC 2937 hunted and stabbed to death
& was later declared a national hero when he was released from jail.
@@kim-nabi-the-butterfly you don't have children and it's obvious.
so a controller can just, "yeah mark. i'm gonna wonder off & grab a smoke." What the Heck?!
back then, yeah they could. Not anymore.
Strictly speaking, they couldn't. It was against Skyguide's rules, and probably some industry regulation as well, but they did it anyway. The company allowed it, against their own rules. They were complacent. On any other night, it probably wouldn't have been so bad, but with so much equipment out of order and some bad luck, it proved fatal. They should have at least called back the other guy when the maintenance staff started shutting down things.
thats so fucking wrong,
How about hiring more chair-dancers, to hop from workstation to workstation some more, increase pain and suffering and misery because there ain't enough yet.
and in the 20 YEARS since this incident that is exactly what was done. There are minimum staffing at the center now.
All those children! 💔 5 crew members/pilots in the cockpit and none of them knows that TCAS takes priority over ATC?! 🤦🏻♂️ This never should have happened.
all of them know better than you, for sure. did you not read the story fully? the were no set and stone atc vs tcas rules and the russians are expected to listen to a person who is expected to talk to both planes vs tech that can malfunction or has deficiencies. man, these people with 0 comprehension and comments.
May the Goddess bless them, may God keep them in Their Hands
Where was your God when they were dying. Your God either had the power to save them and chose not to in which case he's evil or he couldn't help them in which case he's not powerful or he just doesn't exist. My guess is he doesn't exist. If you are going to thank a god when good things happen than you have to be honest and blame that God for killing all those people because it was his fault if he exists
@@thickerconstrictor9037It isn't God's fault. Blame human beings, not God.
@@thickerconstrictor9037If you're going to convince us that God doesn't exist, well then you, my friend just told us humanity doesn't exist either. Unbelievers think like this because you choose not to believe. Open your eyes man. Not everyone is going to believe in the same way you believe. And remember, us humans FAILED other humans.
Cargo planes. The menace of the skies. This collision wasn't the fault of the DHL plane, but every time one of these stories involves a cargo plane I think.. Oh Damn.
And I wonder what it's going to slam into. An apartment complex? Shopping mall? They always seem to wipe out in the worst way. So tragic about those children. Horrible. I have a friend who has two sons. They live in the same city and when they visit her for the holidays she insists that they take separate flights even though they can easily fly together.
That's a pretty unfair assessment.
@@DaveInOkinawa Perhaps. But you have to admit that cargo planes seem to crash more than other planes.
This was a series of crazy incidents that occurred in conjunction and caused this hideous tragedy. But post C͏o͏vid͏w Pandemic, we have an even worse set of dangerous circumstances. Airlines adding more flights to regain lost profit, the skies are more crowded, newly hired pilots, controllers, maintenance workers and supervisors are less trained, less experienced, overworked, plus planes go longer without proper maintenance, Etc, etc. (decreased flights and pilot, maintenance, lay offs during C͏o͏vid͏ pandemic, causing them to change careers, left passenger airlines short on staff and unprepared for the eventual post pandemic public demand to travel again!) I ’ve always loved flying, but will NOT fly now. Too damn dangerous!!!!
Very Unrealistic ATC reenactment of the accident.
u would think the maker of the airplane would add radar in the planes, to ad the pilots so they didn't have to just rely on the tower.
That's exactly what Tcast was designed to do, the issue was that there was no mandate to listen to it's commands at the time and the pilots that listened to orders from the control tower had they listened to Tcast this disaster wouldn't have happened.
copy mayday
16:58
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Feel very sorry for Russian father who get broken-heart about wife and two wonderful children who perished in collision
It's not worth feeling sorry for him. He disgraced the memory of his wife and kids when he murdered the controller Peter Nielsen by stabbing him in front of his own family.
@@pomerlain8924 oooh that this happened?!
He's a murderer I'm glad that happened to his family so they don't have to see what a monster he became
@@matthewhahn1132And people glorified Peter's death as if he did it intentionally. So guess what, now the father is in prison for taking a husband and a father away. My heart would've went out to him, until he did what he did.
@@michigangirl5072oh?
NILLSSEN SCHMILLSON
Any time Russians are being evaluated, some ceazy stuff happens. Remember Chernobyl, and the submarine that sunk with 140 sailors...
This comment is irrelevant Chernobyl has nothing to do with the mid air collision
RIP To All Lost !! 😢
GOD's continued Mercy, Healing, Love, Protection & Guidance to All the Families & to those. Who's Errors set this in Motion without the Intention !!!!🙏❤💕😪
Oh please! He had the capacity to research who he was and where he lived and travel there to murder him it’s ridiculous to say he didn’t have the capacity to know it was wrong. People need to take responsibility for their actions and stop hiding behind the insanity defense. I feel horrible for his loss but it wasn’t the controller’s fault first of all and second, an eye for an eye just leaves a world full of blind men/women.
exactly, people need to be responsible for their actions and that is the people managing atc and international aviation guide. the man who murdered peter is just a broken soul.
My opinion is that the Russian aircraft is 70% responsible due to them not listening to their TCAS(Traffic Collision Avoidance System). The controller is 30% responsible because he should have been monitoring his screen more, however he is less responsible due to the unfortunate coincidences that took place
Here I critically disagree with you. You cannot shift two-thirds of the blame to the Russian pilots, while saying that the controller had "unfortunate coincidences". In Soviet (and Russian, at that time) civil aviation, the controller had the last word, since he saw the whole situation. Soviet pilots were taught to trust the controller, so in a stressful situation they listened to him. Plus, blaming everything exclusively on direct participants is an approach that leads nowhere. Soviet pilots did what they were taught, the controller got into a terrible situation, including through the fault of management, ICAO did not introduce any measures to protect against such a scenario (although there was already a similar case with DC-10 and B747 aircraft, flights 957 and 907 of Japanese Airlines, but there were no casualties and no measures were taken to standardize the use of TCAS).
And please don't think that I'm in any way justifying the actions of the dispatcher's killer. He is a grief-stricken father who found himself a scapegoat. Terrible situation, no matter how you look at it.
@@Pre-flightChekist I’m saying this from a west world perspective based on what America aviation standardized even though the accident was Russian related
@@colemonroe1846 well, i understand the perspective, but must admit that i would not place blame before looking at the problem from different points of view. Well, anyhow, now you have some information on russian civil aviation school of thought! Good day to you, and good night to me -- it's 2am in Moscow and i have college tomorrow morning)
@@Pre-flightChekist What's the point of TCAS if you don't follow it's instructions?
The air traffic controller was alone and without his technology. I don't see how we can expect perfection from anyone in that situation. No phone, other tech disabled due to maintenance....he tried calling for help.
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I smell a rat !! ... one who doesn't like exceptional people. ...afraid they may understand too much.. or .. that they will grow to be famous and wealthy.. and therefore powerful. .... or some such elite paranoia or another. Too many Oooopses. Way too many. .. from.. the trip being offered to these particular children in the first place, which I find odd. ... I'd like to know who arranged this trip..? ... because ..then... the travel agent took them to the wrong airport..? WHAT..? .. then.. the radar isn't working...? ..and has men working on it at that time... Wha? ... and then things after other things happened... that sound fishy. Just say'n .!!
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