Thank you everyone for your support and encouraging words. These are some of the stories I never knew how to tell. There’s been some hard things to accept that’s come with this process. Thank you for the education on the harmful words. I love learning and want to continue to be a better part of society. Thank you Shelise for providing the platform for people like me to get our stories out and feel heard and valued. Outside of the abuse that became so much of who we were. And to do it all so kindly. Thank you and Jonathon so so much for this opportunity! I feel seen and I couldn’t have done this without you two and your supportive following 🩵🩵💕💕
We love you, Michelle! You’re amazing and a warrior. You have touched so many with your story❤️ Part 2 is available now! ua-cam.com/video/b7HdUFFPQMI/v-deo.htmlsi=d47TbgtdS-A1dWO- As for the expression, I will say I didn’t learn until recently that it was derogatory either. I think it’s a very common utah expression. When we know better we do better but we all know you never meant any offense by it. ❤️ you’re awesome!
I just wanted to say as a father with 3 daughters, you are a remarkably strong woman, I've always believed one of the greatest gifts a father can give his daughter is for her to witness the love and respect he shows to her mother. I'm so sorry that you were robed of that and had to endure what you did. I wish you all the happiness in the future you deserve it.
I was Jesse's 2nd wife...I saw the abuse Jesse dealt to my children...even my son who is disabled got beatings. My heart aches just thinking about it because I couldn't/wouldn't stop it. 😢 Now that I am hearing all this, I'm so glad I left and took my kids with me. Jesse was and is a narcissist and all who are around him suffer.
Hi! I would absolutely love to speak with you!! If you’re open to it, please email me at cultstoconsciousness@gmail.com Your perspective would be invaluable to hear ❤️
Amazing. Please understand that you saved your kids from so much more abuse they would have endured if you stayed. You're a brilliant example, and I hope so many more wives follow in your footsteps. 👏👏👏❤️
For Michelle: please please please stop apologizing for having been forced to abuse your siblings. You were a MINOR CHILD. You were abused. Part of that abuse was being forced to behave in ways you knew were wrong- and as an abused minor, you were powerless- powerless to stop it, powerless to say no, powerless to stand up to it, and powerless to stand up for the other minors. That is the ultimate form of control- and it is NOT your job to apologize for your own abuse. Ever. Hugs. ❤❤❤
Me too. Also - true abusers don't care about the hurt they cause. It is crystal clear and shines through that Michelle is herself hurt by having to do this. It kills her inside, I can tell. She is SO brave (and smart) to share her truth and experiences. People will learn so much from hmthis about how these cults operate. Fear, guilt, mistrust and grooming. What an awful situation to put a child in, my heart goes out to you Michelle and I want to say... I see your good heart. You're a goddam warrior and you're going to have an impact on changing this. Be proud, you wonderful human being. ❤ from Wales.
Can”t agree more. Michelle is the product of abuse and IS an assume person inside and out. Obviously a strong, caring and loving individual with a voice.
She chose to share the details which is incredibly difficult, but can help so many. I’m in awe of her willingness to be open and honest so we can truly understand the depths of abuse happening at the hands of these sadistic men in the Order.
I think you’d be surprised how many men treat their wife’s and children like ****, it’s just that we don’t hear their voices.. So shocking to hear how sadistic and warped her upbringing was.
The word abuse doesn't even feel strong enough, I would call that torture. The things that man has done, similar stories are found in true crime domentaries or crime tv shows about sadistic serial killers. It's insane that there is a whole community that actually endorses that behaviour and basically supplies victims to the abusers. Thank you again to Michelle for telling your story, you are incredible and will be one hell of a police officer. They really need more people like you there. And I'm so grateful to you Shelise for providing this platform. Hearing these stories can't be easy but it is so incredibly important that they get told. Take care of yourself ❤
It blows my mind to think that people could look at the life and teachings of Jesus, a man who healed the sick and washed the feet of prostitutes, and think, "Yeah, that guy would want me to beat my toddler nearly to death because they didn't sit perfectly still for four hours of church."
That's because other parts of the Bible do encourage it. Spare the rod spoil the child.... the Bible was written by man, why anyone reads it much less devotes their entire life to what it says just blows my mind. It's been translated 10,000 times... at this point none of its true
Because ALL religion is nonsense. It is nothing but indoctrination and control. There are no gods. It is simply a way for the powerful to use and abuse and something for the weak and struggling to cling too. Gods do not exist but evil humans do in spades. Religion is brainwashing, period!
If Jesse isnt already in jail he definitely should be. The abuse described is absolutely despicable. Thanks to Michelle forher bravery. Amazing woman!!
My father used to demand that I hit/abuse my younger siblings. I was so afraid of him hurting me worse, or hurting them worse that I would comply. Knowing I wouldn’t hurt them the way he would. Even after 15+ years of no contact with our father and growing into adults, it’s made our relationship (me and my sisters) very strained. In there story I was the abuser, and even though they knew he forced me there’s a lot of complicated feelings of guilt and shame. Thank you Michelle, before today I’ve never herd of this being a form of abuse, using your children as weapons against each other. I’ve carried for so many years such complicated feelings, being ashamed, yet feeling like I also protected them.
My question is why aren't they already. This should have been stopped the minute some one found out about this abuse. I am so sorry for all the things these innocent children went through. It angers and hurts my heart to hear these stories. Please do not stop advocating for these people who have no voice for themselves.
Just came across your channel about 4 days ago and as a man with 3 daughters i have been absolutely dumbfounded by some of these stories. The strength of these women is truly amazing so many times listening to these stories I couldn't help but think of my own daughters. I have so many questions my biggest one being how this purity culture and horrific abuse is not only creating countless victims but how many predators is it also creating at the same time very curious about the psychology involved.
I highly recommend the Mormon stories podcast UA-cam channel if you’re not aware of it already. They talk about the psychology behind these types of stories as well as speaking to other people who have similar stories.
Hi! Welcome to C2C! Your daughters are lucky to have a father who actively wants to understand how to protect them more. We actually just did an entire episode on purity culture that you might find interesting I’ll link below. Thanks for watching. ua-cam.com/video/PhVZrmShT6Y/v-deo.htmlsi=JyEJZ3b8hArjySET Also, yes, John Dehlin at Mormon stories is fantastic! He’s actually a therapist in real life and has been doing Mormon interviews for 20 years.
Your Daughters are Very Lucky For Having a Dad Who Cares Deeply for them and I Love You Are So Aware of the Predators Found in Everything These Days Keep up the Great Work and Just Keep Your Eyes Open for These Evil Unhinged People As I Still Do With My Children Take Care ❤
I have never commented on UA-cam before, but this video hit me so hard I had to. I can hear it in her voice how difficult it is to share all of this trauma. Michelle, you are a beacon of resilience. I hope your load of guilt lightens because nothing you did was your fault. When it’s kill or be killed (or beat or be beat), who could honestly say they would do otherwise? Especially when it is so common? Especially when it is literally a murder and your literal life could be on the line? I am sending you so much love. You don’t know me, but you have touched my heart. Thank you for being so brave- to both save yourself and share yourself with us
When a topic becomes taboo, it leads feelings of shame. We don't have reason to be ashamed of our childhood experiences/ traumas. Silence allows abuse to continue unchecked. Shout to the world, sister!
My grandparents on my dad's side were also Mormon, but normal single spouse Mormon. My grandmother was VERY into genealogy and also stated that she had traced our genealogy to Adam. It's nice to hear that others deal with that brand of crazy too lol.
It is possible to go back to adam. Almost all royalty in europe were descendants of someone in Israel. Once you trace your genealogy to some royalty in europe you can pretty much trace that back through established Hebrew genealogy that will hook up to established biblical genealogies. It’s not going to be “father son” genealogies all the way back but you can zig zag your way back. Most of the time these lines zig zag to ephraim and from there it’s all biblical.
I was raised in a Pentecostal based cult. My step father was the preacher. He was a monster. I am 57 and still have many issues due to the abuse. So glad she was able to escape.
I was raised in abusive home where God was used as a battering ram. I learned that is not the JESUS of the bible and these evil men were using God as a form of control. The Lord hates that kind of shit. Just do t through away the truth because of bad apples using God in the worst ways
I am always amazed at how STRONG and RESILIENT your guests are, to have come from such a dark place and still show empathy, emotions and courage! Michelle is so calm, insightful, and thoughtful....imagine being coerced into abusing your own sibling, but also being able to say 'I am wrong, I was wrong for what I partake in?' Such a treasure!
The worst part is they made you and your siblings to abuse the other siblings as another part of psychological torture. You weren’t the villain in this situation you were manipulated and abused to forced to go do these things. Thank you for your bravery.
@Michelle - you have great courage to share your story. Your story is very important. The abuse you describe is horrific. I hope authorities pick this up and pursue a CA case against Jessie. All the children need to be protected. I hope this comes to pass. Sharing your story helps everyone. Also, on what to share about what happened to your siblings that you witnessed or were forced to participate in - I read an article about a man who wrote a book about the abuse he experienced growing up, which included CSA that he witnessed happening to his younger brother in another room. In response to criticism he received for “telling his brother’s story,” he answered, “what I could hear on my side of the door is my story to tell. What happened on the other side of that door is my brother’s story to tell.” Basically, we can tell what we experienced, including what we witnessed, because that IS our experience. All support to you.
This is the first time I have had to pause and walk away from an episode of C2C. I love the show. As someone with epilepsy, it was just too much to hear what happened to the sister with seizures who was accused of seeking attention. Horrifying. I will revisit later because I appreciate Michelle speaking out.
We appreciate you doing your best and supporting with comments. I would recommend checking the chapter marks and picking back up where we go into her schooling ❤️
This was a really hard and triggering watch for me. I cannot emphasize enough with you and all the children who went through years of the most severe narcissistic abuse we can imagine. I don't know what to say, I just wish you peace and love and strength and support! Lots and lots of support xx
These stories are so shocking. I can't believe how many different groups of these people there are. And in 2023. My heart breaks hearing what Michelle went through. ❤
@@zippymacadoo6336me too. There are so many innocent children and women stuck in these awful situations as we speak, and every single one deserves to be free 😔
Honestly the cops who also said her mom should go to jail too. They shamed her for marrying her uncle, something I'm willing to bet money on is she had 0 choice in that matter
I think it's important to notice the abuse cycle of forcing others to do beatings etc is the same pattern of having a child take the uncomfortable burden of denying money to families. The entire system is set up to push blame to individuals with no agency.
The sad thing about abuse is when it's all you know, it's your " normal ". It takes years to overcome that thought process. Speaking from experience, it takes some time to not only forgive yourself for what you were forced to do but also realize that you were also a victim. You are incredibly brave ❤️
Thank you for telling your story. I don’t hear about people talking about abusing others in relation to the abuse they were receiving. The abuse I am most ashamed of is what I did to my son, in fear of what is father would do to him, if I didn’t stop him from crying. As a baby I would slap him. The only way to startle him to stop. I know I was protecting him in my mind, and reality, from worse, my fear was his death. But for everything, the abuse I did to my son has been the hardest to heal from and speak about. There is so much shame when u are a part of it. And I believe that is the intent. If they can make u so afraid that you do the abuse then they can distance themselves from it, legally, mentally. Thank u! For being so brave!! I think this is much more common then most people are aware. And I think the more people who come out, maybe the tide can turn, as to the awareness of this level of trauma. Thank you for being so damn brave! ❤
The only way to stop the cycle of abuse is exactly what you and Michelle are doing. Talking about it. I applaud you. You're extremely brave to share your story too, and overcoming that fear of being judged. Society NEEDS people like you to fix generational traumas. ❤ and respect from Wales x
In a country that allows child marriage in many areas, where 1 in 3 and 1 in 7 will report sexual abuse and where the patriarchy attempts to take authority over others bodies instead of legislating their own- this family is no surprise. If in Utah- polygamy was decriminalized and other states approved child labour. The USA marketing is great- experience is a different story.
I agree..why can they keep abusing kids...why are they not investigated. If my neighbor down the street beat their kids, they would be arrested and kids taken away. There is information out that these brave people have come forward with should be enough for an investigation! This is horrible what's happening to these innocent children 😢
@@beckylund4540if you don’t see your neighbor mistreating their children you can’t report it. These communities make their children afraid of everything one outside their group. They don’t have any one to report to because they’re kept with their own groups. They rarely allow the kids out to public schools. The Order runs every thing even their own “schools”. The outside world is scary. The people outside of their group are not chosen and will cause them to burn in hell. They keep them in the bubble so they can work them at 4 years old scrubbing walls and floors earning money for their fathers.
Sometimes CPS has been involved with families, two cousins of Michelle's who have been on Amanda's channel (Jessica and Andrea) were taken into foster care a couple of times and finally taken again whe they were around 12 and 14 and eventually adopted. Others like Alison and Michelle have got emancipated so that they didn't have to go back to their families when they were teenagers. But why none of the father's are in jail for everything they've done to the kids I have no idea.
Michelle thank you sharong! Super proud of you and keep breaking the cycle! Keep fighting for a better future, and seek justice for the horrors you have seen in your life. You are inspiring!
My heart goes out to Michelle. I can hear how much pressure she feels. It is so incredibly brave that she left, that she didn’t go back to her bio family, that she is PUBLIC for the sake of her family and the kids still in the Order, that she continues to be public without the support of her siblings, etc. The last time I was in contract with my GC adult brother, he was still emotionally enmeshed with our abusive mother too. Bravery and courage like this is what is helping me through my own healing journey. She didn’t “deserve” any of the ABUSE and her story is spreading awareness and empowerment for fellow survivors of abuse 💕
Still absolutely loving your channel! You have helped so many by giving them a metaphorical megaphone, allowing their voices to be heard. And who knows how many people have been through similar things but don't feel seen until they see someone like them on your channel. Thank you for all you do. And keep up the amazing work!
Making people abuse others is a way to have a hold on them even more. Because then, they can use that to say, if you talk, you have done it yourself so you will get punished too. 🤷🏻♀️ The shame we live after going through all of that and for so many reasons. It takes so, so much courage to speak up. The judgement coming from people who don’t have a clue of how it is to go through that. Thank you for sharing your experience Michelle. You are awesome! You can be very proud of yourself. 💖💖💖
Why is Jesse not in jail for the death of the baby? I know that things in the order are very hush hush but she said the surgeon said the baby was beat the shit out of so it seems like they would have no other choice but to report what they saw.
Every interview blows my mind! Thank you for bringing the dark to the light. Sending healing vibes to all those dealing with these abusive slave/sex cults.
Slave/sex cult is the perfect way to explain these cults. Like this weird warped purity culture, pedophilia and breeding kink rolled into one hell scape of degeneracy. It HAS to be abolished.
Thank you for speaking out, Michelle. I hope this has helped you on your journey to healing. It's not easy to be raised by a monster yet not turn out as a monster, too, so you should be so proud of the work you're doing to help stop the cycle of abuse. ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Her father was a LITERAL MURDERER. These women and children were/are having to try to survive life with a murderer. This is so incredibly horrifying. He needs to be locked up, and the key thrown out.
Right how can anyone gloss over that.... sure maybe you genuinely believe in God but a human man MURDERING your BABY? And you just..... stay? Noooooooooooooo 😢
It's mind blowing how horrible these situations are and no one is doing anything about it?! Grr it makes me so angry. Thank you for sharing Michelle. ❤
Michelle, I'm so glad that you have survived. I can barely imagine your hardship, living what you described for years and years, working so much and living in fear and pain. You deserve love and peace, and I hope that you find it in all the places in your life. This episode was wild! I've never dropped my jaw so many times in the course of a single video like this. Every time I think I've heard the craziest crap, there's some new kind of horror of which we were unaware. Shelise, you had so many moments of just staring in disbelief as Michelle described awful things. I hope everyone had a chance to get some hugs and chocolate after this.
Shelise, I really appreciate your channel and for providing a space for those who escaped destructive cults to speak openly. As an educator and mandatory reporter, it hurts to hear how so many ab*sed children in cults fall under the radar of responsible, trustworthy adults, even for those attending public schools. Michelle’s story reminds me of this. I would love it if you could do an episode focusing on this topic-how can people on the outside better recognize when a child needs help?
Yes, please! I think we all need to be able to spot abuse better. The kids are taught to hide it, so without proper education, what can the average person do?
That is a really good topic. But it's not enough just to recognize it. It's also about taking action. When I was being abused as a child I did reach out to the school counselor and others, and nobody did anything about it. I told people I was being abused and the school counselor's response was that if I just behaved better then my mom wouldn't have to beat me. And he explained that he had been beaten as a child and that this was normal. I still have nightmares about my childhood.
Another really horrible thing was how the teachers enabled the bullies to do their bullying! I also have plenty of nightmares about the bullying that I went through. I was never safe, not at home and not at school. And the teachers did nothing to protect me from my parents who did nothing to protect me. When I sought help from the bullying I was told that I had to figure out how to take care of myself and solve my own problems. But anytime I was attacked and fought back then I would get in trouble for fighting. I was supposed to just let the bullies punch me as much as they wanted to without responding. Anything else and I would be in trouble. I'm not exaggerating and I'm not misstating the case. This really was the situation I was put into. And the teachers would say things like "if I didn't see it then I can't do anything about it" and of course they always had their backs turned and never ever saw anything. I often felt that they actually went out of their way to not see anything. Another thing that a teacher told me was that I had to make allowances for the person who was bullying me because they had a tough home life... But not once did she ever ask me about my home life and how badly I was being abused. But she thought that I should be extra nice and extra understanding of the person who was attacking me without provocation simply because he had a bad home life. Many many years later I am still struggling to overcome the trauma of my childhood. Frankly I don't even know how it is that I'm still alive after all that I went through. We humans need to put a stop to both child abuse and bullying because if we can't solve this problem it will destroy us.
I admire you sharing the views you had on people “complaining” or expressing needs when you first left. It takes a lot of self awareness and exploration to understand when we have been wrong and when we need to do better. I have been guilty in the past of allowing my trauma to turn me into someone I am not.
After listening to her story, it is apparent to me that child abuse is not uncommon in the Mormon community. There’s a parallel to the Ruby & Jodi story which adds an additional element of distress and concern for the larger LDS community.
Sending encouragement! ❤ Michelle is so young to have gone through so much. I'm so glad you made it out and thank you for giving them the platform so more will have the courage to get out.
Michelle, you are a powerhouse. I am completely blown away by your strength, resilience, courage, compassion, introspection. Every moment of this interview has me in awe of what you are doing in response to your childhood experiences. I hope you see all of this in yourself, and that you are giving yourself the space and grace you deserve to heal from what you’ve been through. Sending you so much love 💗
I’m pretty tough to shake but the stories of abuse from Michelle’s father really made me flinch. The fact that others in her family still haven’t left astounds me.
This episode hit especially hard. the absolute intensity of the trauma all of you went through.. i can only imagine the impact. *Michelle* - you are an absolutely *amazing* person. your advocacy is doing wonders, thank you for your transparency. these traumas are incredibly difficult to relay in session with a therapist, you unpacking some of it in front of thousands is so commendable and reveals just how strong you are. keep on!!! 🖤🖤 love and support as always!! 🖤🖤
Michelle, if I could I would reach across the miles and hug you. You are so brave to share such horrible abuse. You are so brave and you can't blame yourself for things that were beyond your control. You were forced to take part in the abuse and that is your story. Not just theirs. That is yours to share - a whole other level of abuse. I am honoured to listen to your story. Continue to share those stories to help you heal. I could hear the pain in your voice and the way you breathe when you tell the difficult stories. The worst is behind you. Hold your head high. Sending you much love.
Their breakdown of the instinctual protectiveness and intimacy inside families by training each next generation to mete out arbitrary punishments with brute force, cruelty, & isolation is diabolical, calculated, & utterly shameful.
The fact that you are this strong, this courageous, this beautiful, this empathetic, this inspirational, even though you endured unthinkable abuse shows just how special a person you are. An incredible voice for other survivors ❤❤❤
thank you sharing your story, Michelle. and it is just that, you are sharing your own and not revealing the story of your siblings. they are all intertwined, so it may be hard to determine what is yours to share and what is theirs. but you were involved, you were a victim and a witness. you were not an abuser in your own story, but a victim trying to stay alive. throughout your story, you were understanding that those whom abused you were doing it because you all saw no other option. i’m sure you will forever carry the guilt of those actions, but you were a kid in a cult, be understanding for yourself. your family can tell their stories if/when they are able, but do not stay silent about the actions you were all forced to endure in this environment because they made you the perpetrator. that’s what they want, to shame you from speaking. you are so strong, Michelle. thank you for being here
Keep speaking your truths, Michelle! 💕 Hopefully some of your siblings will start following suit. The horrific things some evil people will visit upon others simply boggles my mind.
I appreciate that Michelle and any of the guests are willing to speak up about what has happened to them and others. It takes a strong person to take responsibility and admit that you were one of the abusers. I like that all of those speaking about about any group are doing so.
Thank you Shelise for having Michelle on. I am very proud of Michelle for being so open about her story, and her awareness for how she unwillingly/manipulatively participated in others' abuse, and taking accountability for that. I've heard parts of Michelle's story from her times on her cousin Amanda's channel, and still learned more from her here. I feel like you, in that it is so hard to comprehend what she and her siblings, both full and half, have had to endure at the hands of their father, or from him through others. I love genealogy and have worked on a tree for the order, so I knew about Jesse's wives up to Michelle's mom, but am so curious about some of his later wives as well. Best wishes to you both, and look forward to the next video you have together.
I hope all this was reported to authorities and someone is in prison! My heart goes out to you and those in your family who were abused. Prayers, peace and well wishes sent your way. Respectfully
What a brave woman you are Michelle for sharing this difficult story of your childhood. No one deserves to be treated like this and no one on the outside would ever be aware if not for your bravery. Thank you for sharing. May you have nothing but peace, love, and kindness for the rest of your days.
Growing up with abuse is really surreal to explain to people who haven't. I hope you know you didn't deserve any of it and your reactions/actions were not a result of your character. You're character is who you are when you take yourself out of the abuse. Wishing you all the healing and self love ❤
I'm just starting this and truly can't wrap my head around small kids working! I can see them picking up their toys before they go to bed at night. I can see them emptying garbage when they are older, and rinsing off their dishes so they won't be difficult to wash! I can even see them making up their beds when old enough to do so. This is SO backwards, the Dad secretly playing with Toys, the kids Not being Allowed! Why hasn't the government stepped in on this Craziness?! I am so thankful to God she eventually ESCAPED! The one JOB kids should focus on, 'My' opinion, is to concentrate on their Education, Play, Have Fun, and be a kid!
I have controlled epilepsy and might be able to shed some light on this topic. So the surgery mentioned is called extensive frontal lobectomy (eFL). However it is normally only done for specific type of epileptic seizures that start in the frontal lobe. To determine this there is a lot of testing done beforehand such as EEGs and sometimes MRIs. It also is only done if the patient has a very high count of seizures, as otherwise the risks of the surgery don't outweigh the improvement of the patient life. Since Michelle's sister seemed to only have occasional seizures and may not have had the extensive testing done, she probably should not have gotten this surgery.
You’re right she didn’t have seizures often and didn’t start till she was much older. I don’t believe she should have had the procedure done but they shopped around for doctors for someone who would. I’m not sure if that was the exact procedure but it could’ve been. Thank you for the insight ❤
@@michellemichaels972 you are very welcome. Of course nobody can say for certain since we don't have the medical records but I feel bad for your sister, especially given the fact that most of your personality traits are stored in the frontal lobe. Did you notice any change in personality after the surgery? I hope she has as good of a life as she can have in this cult and her husband is at least a little bit nicer than Jesse
I found this so heartbreaking and Michelle is so very brave and I pray that she is in a safe and happy place. People don’t know what is going on behind closed doors and people need to try to break the abuse that is going on.
It is so chilling to listen. Michelle you are such a beautiful girl inside and out. Don't blame yourself for the things you have done. You were a child and just a tool in the hands of abusers, they abused your body and mind. Thank you for sharing. I am so sorry it all happened to you. I am proud of you that you were able to leave. I hope you stay safe. Please don't blame yourself. Hugs.
Michelle, thank you so much for sharing! I'm so impressed at your educational accomplishments at those young ages. That combined with your logistics in getting out then being emancipated is just wonderful.
"Well..... you make things up..." 😂 that was so cute!!! Lol so glad they got the fck out. Amanda and everyone look so much alike. I know theyre all triple and quadruple cousins but its insane you can tell who is from the order just by their looks. They all look like full siblings.
It is shameful that there are shows on tv that glorify polygamy. You are showing the real stories that need to be heard - these stories of abuse and fear and shame. This story has touched me more than almost all the other stories I have heard on this channel - Michelle showed such extreme bravery and rawness. Thank you to Michelle for sharing such vulnerable part of her life and shining some light into a dark place for all to see.
idk of a single show that glorifies polygamy, care to enlighten us? before you answer: no one thinks the Brown family is one of them. just because there’s a camera doesn’t mean things are glorified. such a fallacy at best in 2023 to say such things.
Thank you so much for being brave enough to not only get away from this horrible cult and abuse, but also being brave enough to share your story. Can’t wait to see part 2. 🧡🧡🧡
Every story that comes from what you’ve seen and heard yourself is yours to tell. When I was a teacher I saw countless continuing abuse situations, many of which ended in a child’s death, because the feelings of the previously hurt was put before the physical safety of future or current victims. People cannot act, especially law enforcement, if people are not open about their direct experiences. And law enforcement rarely act against Christian high control group regardless of its abuse extremes until public pressure becomes too loud to ignore like with Warren Jeffs.
I grew up in a (non cult) abusive household and was told the same thing. It was beyond asking "how high" when being told to jump, it was anticipating the jump before even being asked, and doing it exactly perfect. I'm so sorry that you experienced such horrific abuse.
Me looking at the thumbnail… “is that Michelle? Yay Michelle!” Lots of love to you Michelle, you are an amazing human and your advocacy for your self and others is incredible! Proof that goodness can emerge out of the most awful of circumstances ❤❤❤
Dearest Michelle. Please remember you were a child in a cult. Try to forgive yourself for not knowing any better. Give yourself some grace. What you've survived would destroy many a person.
Michelle, you survived so much. You are a strong woman. You're allowed to tell your side of your own story even when the other people involved may have a different view. I'm so glad you escaped.
Michelle you are an inspiration. So glad you found the courage to say what you have said. I hope it empowers you more and more. Thank you for coming on and shining another light on this group. And I am so sorry for what you lived thru. Your children are lucky to have such an awesome mom.
I've watched a lot of episodes of this vodcast, and I've always found things in each interview that I connected with, despite not having ever been in a cult, myself. However, this particular episode is really giving me flashbacks. My step-ahole was an abusive drunk. Despite his RARELY attending church, the phrase "spare the rod and spoil the child" was in my ear often. Being expected to not only do the things he asked or get hit, he absolutely expected me to anticipate his needs and serve them WITH ENTHUSIASM or get hit. He was big on psychological abuse as well, including shaming. He forced me to wash dishes with straight hot water. He once tried to beat me for getting car sick (one of the very few times my mother intevened). So many things that this episode brought up that I have avoided thinking about for decades. Thank you, both, for your contributions to this show and to my healing.
Thank you everyone for your support and encouraging words. These are some of the stories I never knew how to tell. There’s been some hard things to accept that’s come with this process. Thank you for the education on the harmful words. I love learning and want to continue to be a better part of society.
Thank you Shelise for providing the platform for people like me to get our stories out and feel heard and valued. Outside of the abuse that became so much of who we were. And to do it all so kindly. Thank you and Jonathon so so much for this opportunity! I feel seen and I couldn’t have done this without you two and your supportive following 🩵🩵💕💕
We love you, Michelle! You’re amazing and a warrior. You have touched so many with your story❤️ Part 2 is available now! ua-cam.com/video/b7HdUFFPQMI/v-deo.htmlsi=d47TbgtdS-A1dWO-
As for the expression, I will say I didn’t learn until recently that it was derogatory either. I think it’s a very common utah expression. When we know better we do better but we all know you never meant any offense by it. ❤️ you’re awesome!
You are such a warrior and also an absolute treasure 💖
I just wanted to say as a father with 3 daughters, you are a remarkably strong woman, I've always believed one of the greatest gifts a father can give his daughter is for her to witness the love and respect he shows to her mother. I'm so sorry that you were robed of that and had to endure what you did. I wish you all the happiness in the future you deserve it.
So brave! So much love and light inside you! The world is a better place with you in it!
You are one very brave woman. Thank you for sharing your story.
I was Jesse's 2nd wife...I saw the abuse Jesse dealt to my children...even my son who is disabled got beatings. My heart aches just thinking about it because I couldn't/wouldn't stop it. 😢 Now that I am hearing all this, I'm so glad I left and took my kids with me. Jesse was and is a narcissist and all who are around him suffer.
I cannot find words for how impressed by and proud of you I am for the bravery you found to get you and your kids out. ❤
Hi! I would absolutely love to speak with you!! If you’re open to it, please email me at cultstoconsciousness@gmail.com Your perspective would be invaluable to hear ❤️
Amazing. Please understand that you saved your kids from so much more abuse they would have endured if you stayed.
You're a brilliant example, and I hope so many more wives follow in your footsteps. 👏👏👏❤️
I hope you decide to get interviewed here. It will help you and your family, as well as others.
You were brainwashed and maybe traumabonded. How have/do you deal with the guilt from not be able to protect your own children?
For Michelle: please please please stop apologizing for having been forced to abuse your siblings. You were a MINOR CHILD. You were abused. Part of that abuse was being forced to behave in ways you knew were wrong- and as an abused minor, you were powerless- powerless to stop it, powerless to say no, powerless to stand up to it, and powerless to stand up for the other minors. That is the ultimate form of control- and it is NOT your job to apologize for your own abuse. Ever. Hugs. ❤❤❤
This is exactly what I was going to say, amen sister
Me too. Also - true abusers don't care about the hurt they cause. It is crystal clear and shines through that Michelle is herself hurt by having to do this. It kills her inside, I can tell. She is SO brave (and smart) to share her truth and experiences. People will learn so much from hmthis about how these cults operate. Fear, guilt, mistrust and grooming.
What an awful situation to put a child in, my heart goes out to you Michelle and I want to say... I see your good heart. You're a goddam warrior and you're going to have an impact on changing this. Be proud, you wonderful human being.
❤ from Wales.
I agree, in order to "normalize" abuse get the kids involved.
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Can”t agree more. Michelle is the product of abuse and IS an assume person inside and out. Obviously a strong, caring and loving individual with a voice.
This might be the worst one I've ever heard. This is hell on earth. The level of abuse is off the charts
She chose to share the details which is incredibly difficult, but can help so many. I’m in awe of her willingness to be open and honest so we can truly understand the depths of abuse happening at the hands of these sadistic men in the Order.
Wow, I’m just starting to watch it. It must be bad for it to be the worst 😢
I think you’d be surprised how many men treat their wife’s and children like ****, it’s just that we don’t hear their voices..
So shocking to hear how sadistic and warped her upbringing was.
The word abuse doesn't even feel strong enough, I would call that torture. The things that man has done, similar stories are found in true crime domentaries or crime tv shows about sadistic serial killers. It's insane that there is a whole community that actually endorses that behaviour and basically supplies victims to the abusers.
Thank you again to Michelle for telling your story, you are incredible and will be one hell of a police officer. They really need more people like you there.
And I'm so grateful to you Shelise for providing this platform. Hearing these stories can't be easy but it is so incredibly important that they get told. Take care of yourself ❤
I agree jesse sounds worse then Daniel or Amandas dad 😭
It blows my mind to think that people could look at the life and teachings of Jesus, a man who healed the sick and washed the feet of prostitutes, and think, "Yeah, that guy would want me to beat my toddler nearly to death because they didn't sit perfectly still for four hours of church."
YES!
I know - it makes zero sense. A junior high level character study should be able to tell people that Jesus wouldn't want this.
It’s more about Joseph Smith than Jesus 😅
That's because other parts of the Bible do encourage it. Spare the rod spoil the child.... the Bible was written by man, why anyone reads it much less devotes their entire life to what it says just blows my mind. It's been translated 10,000 times... at this point none of its true
Because ALL religion is nonsense. It is nothing but indoctrination and control. There are no gods. It is simply a way for the powerful to use and abuse and something for the weak and struggling to cling too.
Gods do not exist but evil humans do in spades.
Religion is brainwashing, period!
If Jesse isnt already in jail he definitely should be. The abuse described is absolutely despicable. Thanks to Michelle forher bravery. Amazing woman!!
Brave, brave, brave😢😢girl
Why is he not in jail??
The abuse that Michelle endured is beyond my comprehension. She is a very brave and courageous woman for sharing her story.
Jesus had brothers and sisters!
My father used to demand that I hit/abuse my younger siblings. I was so afraid of him hurting me worse, or hurting them worse that I would comply. Knowing I wouldn’t hurt them the way he would. Even after 15+ years of no contact with our father and growing into adults, it’s made our relationship (me and my sisters) very strained. In there story I was the abuser, and even though they knew he forced me there’s a lot of complicated feelings of guilt and shame. Thank you Michelle, before today I’ve never herd of this being a form of abuse, using your children as weapons against each other. I’ve carried for so many years such complicated feelings, being ashamed, yet feeling like I also protected them.
You’re not alone ❤️ thank you for sharing. You did the best you could and were trying to survive yourself.
sending you love ❤️
How on earth do these men manage to do the things that they do in our supposedly enlightened societies and break the law without being arrested
I said this on Val's video and i still think the same, all of those Kingston brothers should be in prison for life.
My question is why aren't they already. This should have been stopped the minute some one found out about this abuse. I am so sorry for all the things these innocent children went through. It angers and hurts my heart to hear these stories. Please do not stop advocating for these people who have no voice for themselves.
1000000% agree
Just came across your channel about 4 days ago and as a man with 3 daughters i have been absolutely dumbfounded by some of these stories. The strength of these women is truly amazing so many times listening to these stories I couldn't help but think of my own daughters. I have so many questions my biggest one being how this purity culture and horrific abuse is not only creating countless victims but how many predators is it also creating at the same time very curious about the psychology involved.
I highly recommend the Mormon stories podcast UA-cam channel if you’re not aware of it already. They talk about the psychology behind these types of stories as well as speaking to other people who have similar stories.
Hi! Welcome to C2C! Your daughters are lucky to have a father who actively wants to understand how to protect them more. We actually just did an entire episode on purity culture that you might find interesting I’ll link below. Thanks for watching. ua-cam.com/video/PhVZrmShT6Y/v-deo.htmlsi=JyEJZ3b8hArjySET
Also, yes, John Dehlin at Mormon stories is fantastic! He’s actually a therapist in real life and has been doing Mormon interviews for 20 years.
Your Daughters are Very Lucky For Having a Dad Who Cares Deeply for them and I Love You Are So Aware of the Predators Found in Everything These Days Keep up the Great Work and Just Keep Your Eyes Open for These Evil Unhinged People As I Still Do With My Children Take Care ❤
You’re an awesome father.
I have never commented on UA-cam before, but this video hit me so hard I had to. I can hear it in her voice how difficult it is to share all of this trauma. Michelle, you are a beacon of resilience. I hope your load of guilt lightens because nothing you did was your fault. When it’s kill or be killed (or beat or be beat), who could honestly say they would do otherwise? Especially when it is so common? Especially when it is literally a murder and your literal life could be on the line? I am sending you so much love. You don’t know me, but you have touched my heart. Thank you for being so brave- to both save yourself and share yourself with us
Thank you for this ❤️
When a topic becomes taboo, it leads feelings of shame. We don't have reason to be ashamed of our childhood experiences/ traumas. Silence allows abuse to continue unchecked. Shout to the world, sister!
My grandparents on my dad's side were also Mormon, but normal single spouse Mormon. My grandmother was VERY into genealogy and also stated that she had traced our genealogy to Adam. It's nice to hear that others deal with that brand of crazy too lol.
Genealogy not generosity 😊
@@lydiaj7492gotta love auto correct lol
Same here mainstream LDS raised & the level of crazy in Mormonism is astonishing!!! Grateful I'm out.
I don't think it is possible to do that. Lol.
It is possible to go back to adam. Almost all royalty in europe were descendants of someone in Israel. Once you trace your genealogy to some royalty in europe you can pretty much trace that back through established Hebrew genealogy that will hook up to established biblical genealogies. It’s not going to be “father son” genealogies all the way back but you can zig zag your way back. Most of the time these lines zig zag to ephraim and from there it’s all biblical.
I was raised in a Pentecostal based cult. My step father was the preacher. He was a monster. I am 57 and still have many issues due to the abuse. So glad she was able to escape.
I was raised in abusive home where God was used as a battering ram. I learned that is not the JESUS of the bible and these evil men were using God as a form of control. The Lord hates that kind of shit. Just do t through away the truth because of bad apples using God in the worst ways
I am always amazed at how STRONG and RESILIENT your guests are, to have come from such a dark place and still show empathy, emotions and courage!
Michelle is so calm, insightful, and thoughtful....imagine being coerced into abusing your own sibling, but also being able to say 'I am wrong, I was wrong for what I partake in?' Such a treasure!
How on earth is this internal, unregulated banking system not getting raided by FBI and IRS? Not to mention labor law violations. 🤯
Far too much "respect" for allowing religions to do whatever they want because "freedom of religion"
Let’s be honest, if they were Muslims doing this they would have been arrested a long time ago
The worst part is they made you and your siblings to abuse the other siblings as another part of psychological torture. You weren’t the villain in this situation you were manipulated and abused to forced to go do these things. Thank you for your bravery.
Absolutely. This is a shockingly abusive thing to do to a child, on top on an already horrifically abusive situation.
@Michelle - you have great courage to share your story. Your story is very important.
The abuse you describe is horrific. I hope authorities pick this up and pursue a CA case against Jessie. All the children need to be protected. I hope this comes to pass.
Sharing your story helps everyone.
Also, on what to share about what happened to your siblings that you witnessed or were forced to participate in - I read an article about a man who wrote a book about the abuse he experienced growing up, which included CSA that he witnessed happening to his younger brother in another room. In response to criticism he received for “telling his brother’s story,” he answered, “what I could hear on my side of the door is my story to tell. What happened on the other side of that door is my brother’s story to tell.” Basically, we can tell what we experienced, including what we witnessed, because that IS our experience.
All support to you.
Beautifully said ❤️
This is the first time I have had to pause and walk away from an episode of C2C. I love the show. As someone with epilepsy, it was just too much to hear what happened to the sister with seizures who was accused of seeking attention. Horrifying. I will revisit later because I appreciate Michelle speaking out.
We appreciate you doing your best and supporting with comments. I would recommend checking the chapter marks and picking back up where we go into her schooling ❤️
This was a really hard and triggering watch for me. I cannot emphasize enough with you and all the children who went through years of the most severe narcissistic abuse we can imagine. I don't know what to say, I just wish you peace and love and strength and support! Lots and lots of support xx
Thank you for your support ❤️❤️❤️
These stories are so shocking. I can't believe how many different groups of these people there are. And in 2023. My heart breaks hearing what Michelle went through. ❤
These are just the ones who escaped. That's the thought that kills me.
@@zippymacadoo6336it really is awful thinking about those that have resigned to this as normal
@@zippymacadoo6336me too. There are so many innocent children and women stuck in these awful situations as we speak, and every single one deserves to be free 😔
You've done some heavy interviews, but, this one is particularly intense. She's so strong to make her stand and let the world know her experiences.
Jesse needs to be locked away for life, for the murder of that poor baby, let alone all the other awful abuses.
Absolutely
Honestly the cops who also said her mom should go to jail too. They shamed her for marrying her uncle, something I'm willing to bet money on is she had 0 choice in that matter
I think it's important to notice the abuse cycle of forcing others to do beatings etc is the same pattern of having a child take the uncomfortable burden of denying money to families. The entire system is set up to push blame to individuals with no agency.
The sad thing about abuse is when it's all you know, it's your " normal ". It takes years to overcome that thought process. Speaking from experience, it takes some time to not only forgive yourself for what you were forced to do but also realize that you were also a victim. You are incredibly brave ❤️
This was such a wild interview, michelle is so incredibly brave. I hope her siblings can all be free soon.
💜🥰love you Michelle 💜🥰😍
❤yes!❤
And we love YOU, Amanda!❤️ see you in a couple days!
Hey doll, I hope you are doing well.
Thank you for telling your story. I don’t hear about people talking about abusing others in relation to the abuse they were receiving. The abuse I am most ashamed of is what I did to my son, in fear of what is father would do to him, if I didn’t stop him from crying. As a baby I would slap him. The only way to startle him to stop. I know I was protecting him in my mind, and reality, from worse, my fear was his death. But for everything, the abuse I did to my son has been the hardest to heal from and speak about. There is so much shame when u are a part of it. And I believe that is the intent. If they can make u so afraid that you do the abuse then they can distance themselves from it, legally, mentally. Thank u! For being so brave!! I think this is much more common then most people are aware. And I think the more people who come out, maybe the tide can turn, as to the awareness of this level of trauma. Thank you for being so damn brave! ❤
❤️❤️❤️
What a terrible situation to be in, my heart goes to you and your son 😢
The only way to stop the cycle of abuse is exactly what you and Michelle are doing. Talking about it. I applaud you.
You're extremely brave to share your story too, and overcoming that fear of being judged. Society NEEDS people like you to fix generational traumas.
❤ and respect from Wales x
It's another level of abuse to force or coerce victims to participate in the abuse. I'm so sorry. You are so strong to speak up. That is not easy.
She has such incredible composure and an eloquence that is most certainly her own. What a Queen!
Why aren’t they investigated for child abuse? The treatment of the children is criminal and should be prosecuted.
In a country that allows child marriage in many areas, where 1 in 3 and 1 in 7 will report sexual abuse and where the patriarchy attempts to take authority over others bodies instead of legislating their own- this family is no surprise. If in Utah- polygamy was decriminalized and other states approved child labour. The USA marketing is great- experience is a different story.
They weren’t ever really outside of their community. They “homeschool” so the kids can work 20 plus hours a day.
I agree..why can they keep abusing kids...why are they not investigated. If my neighbor down the street beat their kids, they would be arrested and kids taken away. There is information out that these brave people have come forward with should be enough for an investigation! This is horrible what's happening to these innocent children 😢
@@beckylund4540if you don’t see your neighbor mistreating their children you can’t report it. These communities make their children afraid of everything one outside their group. They don’t have any one to report to because they’re kept with their own groups. They rarely allow the kids out to public schools. The Order runs every thing even their own “schools”. The outside world is scary. The people outside of their group are not chosen and will cause them to burn in hell. They keep them in the bubble so they can work them at 4 years old scrubbing walls and floors earning money for their fathers.
Sometimes CPS has been involved with families, two cousins of Michelle's who have been on Amanda's channel (Jessica and Andrea) were taken into foster care a couple of times and finally taken again whe they were around 12 and 14 and eventually adopted. Others like Alison and Michelle have got emancipated so that they didn't have to go back to their families when they were teenagers. But why none of the father's are in jail for everything they've done to the kids I have no idea.
Michelle thank you sharong! Super proud of you and keep breaking the cycle! Keep fighting for a better future, and seek justice for the horrors you have seen in your life. You are inspiring!
My heart goes out to Michelle. I can hear how much pressure she feels. It is so incredibly brave that she left, that she didn’t go back to her bio family, that she is PUBLIC for the sake of her family and the kids still in the Order, that she continues to be public without the support of her siblings, etc. The last time I was in contract with my GC adult brother, he was still emotionally enmeshed with our abusive mother too. Bravery and courage like this is what is helping me through my own healing journey.
She didn’t “deserve” any of the ABUSE and her story is spreading awareness and empowerment for fellow survivors of abuse 💕
Jesse Kingston should be prosecuted for the death of that child. They talked about it on a recent episode of Secrets of Polygamy
Still absolutely loving your channel! You have helped so many by giving them a metaphorical megaphone, allowing their voices to be heard. And who knows how many people have been through similar things but don't feel seen until they see someone like them on your channel. Thank you for all you do. And keep up the amazing work!
Wow, thank you! We hope it can be helpful! Thanks for watching and supporting!
Making people abuse others is a way to have a hold on them even more. Because then, they can use that to say, if you talk, you have done it yourself so you will get punished too. 🤷🏻♀️
The shame we live after going through all of that and for so many reasons. It takes so, so much courage to speak up. The judgement coming from people who don’t have a clue of how it is to go through that.
Thank you for sharing your experience Michelle. You are awesome! You can be very proud of yourself. 💖💖💖
Why is Jesse not in jail for the death of the baby? I know that things in the order are very hush hush but she said the surgeon said the baby was beat the shit out of so it seems like they would have no other choice but to report what they saw.
Her mother told them she beat the baby. And she went to jail for it
@@issecret1- OMG, that is unbelievable & just horrific.
@@issecret1Sounds about right. How terribly sad all around.
1:05:23
I’m always amazed at Michelle’s knowledge and the fact that she got out with so many documents.
Every interview blows my mind! Thank you for bringing the dark to the light. Sending healing vibes to all those dealing with these abusive slave/sex cults.
Slave/sex cult is the perfect way to explain these cults. Like this weird warped purity culture, pedophilia and breeding kink rolled into one hell scape of degeneracy. It HAS to be abolished.
Thank you for speaking out, Michelle.
I hope this has helped you on your journey to healing.
It's not easy to be raised by a monster yet not turn out as a monster, too, so you should be so proud of the work you're doing to help stop the cycle of abuse. ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Her father was a LITERAL MURDERER. These women and children were/are having to try to survive life with a murderer. This is so incredibly horrifying. He needs to be locked up, and the key thrown out.
Right how can anyone gloss over that.... sure maybe you genuinely believe in God but a human man MURDERING your BABY? And you just..... stay? Noooooooooooooo 😢
It's mind blowing how horrible these situations are and no one is doing anything about it?! Grr it makes me so angry. Thank you for sharing Michelle. ❤
Michelle, I'm so glad that you have survived. I can barely imagine your hardship, living what you described for years and years, working so much and living in fear and pain. You deserve love and peace, and I hope that you find it in all the places in your life.
This episode was wild! I've never dropped my jaw so many times in the course of a single video like this. Every time I think I've heard the craziest crap, there's some new kind of horror of which we were unaware. Shelise, you had so many moments of just staring in disbelief as Michelle described awful things. I hope everyone had a chance to get some hugs and chocolate after this.
Shelise, I really appreciate your channel and for providing a space for those who escaped destructive cults to speak openly.
As an educator and mandatory reporter, it hurts to hear how so many ab*sed children in cults fall under the radar of responsible, trustworthy adults, even for those attending public schools. Michelle’s story reminds me of this.
I would love it if you could do an episode focusing on this topic-how can people on the outside better recognize when a child needs help?
Yes, please! I think we all need to be able to spot abuse better. The kids are taught to hide it, so without proper education, what can the average person do?
That is a really good topic. But it's not enough just to recognize it. It's also about taking action. When I was being abused as a child I did reach out to the school counselor and others, and nobody did anything about it. I told people I was being abused and the school counselor's response was that if I just behaved better then my mom wouldn't have to beat me. And he explained that he had been beaten as a child and that this was normal. I still have nightmares about my childhood.
Another really horrible thing was how the teachers enabled the bullies to do their bullying! I also have plenty of nightmares about the bullying that I went through. I was never safe, not at home and not at school. And the teachers did nothing to protect me from my parents who did nothing to protect me.
When I sought help from the bullying I was told that I had to figure out how to take care of myself and solve my own problems. But anytime I was attacked and fought back then I would get in trouble for fighting. I was supposed to just let the bullies punch me as much as they wanted to without responding. Anything else and I would be in trouble. I'm not exaggerating and I'm not misstating the case. This really was the situation I was put into. And the teachers would say things like "if I didn't see it then I can't do anything about it" and of course they always had their backs turned and never ever saw anything. I often felt that they actually went out of their way to not see anything.
Another thing that a teacher told me was that I had to make allowances for the person who was bullying me because they had a tough home life... But not once did she ever ask me about my home life and how badly I was being abused. But she thought that I should be extra nice and extra understanding of the person who was attacking me without provocation simply because he had a bad home life.
Many many years later I am still struggling to overcome the trauma of my childhood. Frankly I don't even know how it is that I'm still alive after all that I went through.
We humans need to put a stop to both child abuse and bullying because if we can't solve this problem it will destroy us.
I admire you sharing the views you had on people “complaining” or expressing needs when you first left. It takes a lot of self awareness and exploration to understand when we have been wrong and when we need to do better. I have been guilty in the past of allowing my trauma to turn me into someone I am not.
You're so brave Michelle. You shouldn't bear the blame for the cycle you were born into.
As someone who has seizures I cannot IMAGINE what she went through.
After listening to her story, it is apparent to me that child abuse is not uncommon in the Mormon community. There’s a parallel to the Ruby & Jodi story which adds an additional element of distress and concern for the larger LDS community.
Stop equating LDS with these sick off-shoots. The Church of Jesus Christ follows the teachings of Christ !
All fundamentalist groups. Watch the documentary Shiny Happy People.
@@charlenelundquist3512Christ doesn’t exist. ALL religion is nothing but cult nonsense and indoctrination!
Take off the blinders….
@@charlenelundquist3512religions are cults and DEFINITELY one that was started by some crackhead that found some stones that only he could read 😂😂😂😂
Michelle you are amazing! Coming to terms with abuse is hard but then being willing and able to talk about it takes incredible strength.
Sending encouragement! ❤ Michelle is so young to have gone through so much. I'm so glad you made it out and thank you for giving them the platform so more will have the courage to get out.
Michelle, you are a powerhouse. I am completely blown away by your strength, resilience, courage, compassion, introspection. Every moment of this interview has me in awe of what you are doing in response to your childhood experiences. I hope you see all of this in yourself, and that you are giving yourself the space and grace you deserve to heal from what you’ve been through. Sending you so much love 💗
What. A. Scam. Those men are an exquisite form of evil. Absolute control, misogyny AND abuse of children. I am so sad and angry on your behalf. ❤
I’m pretty tough to shake but the stories of abuse from Michelle’s father really made me flinch. The fact that others in her family still haven’t left astounds me.
This episode hit especially hard. the absolute intensity of the trauma all of you went through.. i can only imagine the impact.
*Michelle*
- you are an absolutely *amazing* person. your advocacy is doing wonders, thank you for your transparency. these traumas are incredibly difficult to relay in session with a therapist, you unpacking some of it in front of thousands is so commendable and reveals just how strong you are. keep on!!! 🖤🖤
love and support as always!! 🖤🖤
I would love if you interviewed one of the Jeff’s children. Rachel Jeff’s story deserves to be told on all platforms.
I’d be happy to!
Shalise has interviewed a few different people from the FLDS, including one of Warren Jeff’s wives or children, I can’t recall exactly.
Thank you for speaking up to share your experiences, everyone should know the brutal truth about what people are going through
Michelle, if I could I would reach across the miles and hug you. You are so brave to share such horrible abuse. You are so brave and you can't blame yourself for things that were beyond your control. You were forced to take part in the abuse and that is your story. Not just theirs. That is yours to share - a whole other level of abuse. I am honoured to listen to your story. Continue to share those stories to help you heal. I could hear the pain in your voice and the way you breathe when you tell the difficult stories. The worst is behind you. Hold your head high. Sending you much love.
I’m blown away by the strength and courage of this guest and the others who escape and create a better life for themselves. ❤
Their breakdown of the instinctual protectiveness and intimacy inside families by training each next generation to mete out arbitrary punishments with brute force, cruelty, & isolation is diabolical, calculated, & utterly shameful.
The fact that you are this strong, this courageous, this beautiful, this empathetic, this inspirational, even though you endured unthinkable abuse shows just how special a person you are. An incredible voice for other survivors ❤❤❤
thank you sharing your story, Michelle. and it is just that, you are sharing your own and not revealing the story of your siblings. they are all intertwined, so it may be hard to determine what is yours to share and what is theirs. but you were involved, you were a victim and a witness. you were not an abuser in your own story, but a victim trying to stay alive. throughout your story, you were understanding that those whom abused you were doing it because you all saw no other option. i’m sure you will forever carry the guilt of those actions, but you were a kid in a cult, be understanding for yourself. your family can tell their stories if/when they are able, but do not stay silent about the actions you were all forced to endure in this environment because they made you the perpetrator. that’s what they want, to shame you from speaking. you are so strong, Michelle. thank you for being here
Michelle, thank you for sharing your story. You have helped so many people with your courage and honesty! I wish you a life filled with good things!
My heart goes out to her so hard ❤ thank you for bringing us these stories.
Keep speaking your truths, Michelle! 💕 Hopefully some of your siblings will start following suit. The horrific things some evil people will visit upon others simply boggles my mind.
I appreciate that Michelle and any of the guests are willing to speak up about what has happened to them and others. It takes a strong person to take responsibility and admit that you were one of the abusers. I like that all of those speaking about about any group are doing so.
OMGOSH, Michelle you are so brave. Has anyone gone to the justice system and reported all this physcial abuse.
Thank you Shelise for having Michelle on. I am very proud of Michelle for being so open about her story, and her awareness for how she unwillingly/manipulatively participated in others' abuse, and taking accountability for that. I've heard parts of Michelle's story from her times on her cousin Amanda's channel, and still learned more from her here. I feel like you, in that it is so hard to comprehend what she and her siblings, both full and half, have had to endure at the hands of their father, or from him through others. I love genealogy and have worked on a tree for the order, so I knew about Jesse's wives up to Michelle's mom, but am so curious about some of his later wives as well. Best wishes to you both, and look forward to the next video you have together.
In my eyes, the abuse she witnessed is her story too. So she is entitled to speak about it.
I hope all this was reported to authorities and someone is in prison! My heart goes out to you and those in your family who were abused. Prayers, peace and well wishes sent your way. Respectfully
You are such a brave person to come here and be so open about what you have been through.
What a brave woman you are Michelle for sharing this difficult story of your childhood. No one deserves to be treated like this and no one on the outside would ever be aware if not for your bravery. Thank you for sharing. May you have nothing but peace, love, and kindness for the rest of your days.
Growing up with abuse is really surreal to explain to people who haven't. I hope you know you didn't deserve any of it and your reactions/actions were not a result of your character. You're character is who you are when you take yourself out of the abuse. Wishing you all the healing and self love ❤
I agree that people are allowed to express their truths even when it’s extreme.
I'm just starting this and truly can't wrap my head around small kids working! I can see them picking up their toys before they go to bed at night. I can see them emptying garbage when they are older, and rinsing off their dishes so they won't be difficult to wash! I can even see them making up their beds when old enough to do so. This is SO backwards, the Dad secretly playing with Toys, the kids Not being Allowed! Why hasn't the government stepped in on this Craziness?! I am so thankful to God she eventually ESCAPED! The one JOB kids should focus on, 'My' opinion, is to concentrate on their Education, Play, Have Fun, and be a kid!
Agreed
Michelle, you are a remarkable woman with a delightful personality. Thank you for the forthright manner in which you share your truth. Much respect!
I have controlled epilepsy and might be able to shed some light on this topic. So the surgery mentioned is called extensive frontal lobectomy (eFL). However it is normally only done for specific type of epileptic seizures that start in the frontal lobe. To determine this there is a lot of testing done beforehand such as EEGs and sometimes MRIs. It also is only done if the patient has a very high count of seizures, as otherwise the risks of the surgery don't outweigh the improvement of the patient life. Since Michelle's sister seemed to only have occasional seizures and may not have had the extensive testing done, she probably should not have gotten this surgery.
Woah. Thank you for sharing this context.
You’re right she didn’t have seizures often and didn’t start till she was much older. I don’t believe she should have had the procedure done but they shopped around for doctors for someone who would. I’m not sure if that was the exact procedure but it could’ve been. Thank you for the insight ❤
@@michellemichaels972 you are very welcome. Of course nobody can say for certain since we don't have the medical records but I feel bad for your sister, especially given the fact that most of your personality traits are stored in the frontal lobe. Did you notice any change in personality after the surgery? I hope she has as good of a life as she can have in this cult and her husband is at least a little bit nicer than Jesse
I found this so heartbreaking and Michelle is so very brave and I pray that she is in a safe and happy place. People don’t know what is going on behind closed doors and people need to try to break the abuse that is going on.
It is so chilling to listen. Michelle you are such a beautiful girl inside and out. Don't blame yourself for the things you have done. You were a child and just a tool in the hands of abusers, they abused your body and mind.
Thank you for sharing. I am so sorry it all happened to you. I am proud of you that you were able to leave.
I hope you stay safe. Please don't blame yourself. Hugs.
Shelise and Jonathan too- thanks for doing this work. Just thank you for platforming people who have been hurt and amplifying their voices.
Thanks for listening❤️
i'm enjoying seeing so many different videos about the kingston clan- every person is adding new information and context.
I’m enjoying the interviews as well! So much to uncover and understand
This is one of my all-time favorite C2C episode! MICHELLE YOU ARE AMAZING! ❤
Michelle, thank you so much for sharing! I'm so impressed at your educational accomplishments at those young ages. That combined with your logistics in getting out then being emancipated is just wonderful.
"Well..... you make things up..." 😂 that was so cute!!! Lol so glad they got the fck out. Amanda and everyone look so much alike. I know theyre all triple and quadruple cousins but its insane you can tell who is from the order just by their looks. They all look like full siblings.
My heart goes out to you Michelle! I wonder if your sister mentally affected by the surgery. I am overwhelmed with emotion for you and your siblings
It is shameful that there are shows on tv that glorify polygamy. You are showing the real stories that need to be heard - these stories of abuse and fear and shame. This story has touched me more than almost all the other stories I have heard on this channel - Michelle showed such extreme bravery and rawness. Thank you to Michelle for sharing such vulnerable part of her life and shining some light into a dark place for all to see.
idk of a single show that glorifies polygamy, care to enlighten us?
before you answer: no one thinks the Brown family is one of them.
just because there’s a camera doesn’t mean things are glorified. such a fallacy at best in 2023 to say such things.
😂😂😂😂
this relegion is about sex ,an abnormal attitude.yuksss
Thank you so much for being brave enough to not only get away from this horrible cult and abuse, but also being brave enough to share your story. Can’t wait to see part 2. 🧡🧡🧡
It’s uploading as we speak! 😁
The TW in the time stamps are brilliant. Thank you!!!
You’re welcome 😊
Every story that comes from what you’ve seen and heard yourself is yours to tell.
When I was a teacher I saw countless continuing abuse situations, many of which ended in a child’s death, because the feelings of the previously hurt was put before the physical safety of future or current victims. People cannot act, especially law enforcement, if people are not open about their direct experiences. And law enforcement rarely act against Christian high control group regardless of its abuse extremes until public pressure becomes too loud to ignore like with Warren Jeffs.
My heart breaks for these children. Michelle, you are a such a strong person. Keep going. You are brave. Thanks for sharing.❤
I love Michelle! So great to see her here!
Thank u Michelle for being vulnerable and sharing your story. It needs to be told to break the cycle!!! Sending u lots of love ❤
One child already had died. Where was CPS in all of this?
I grew up in a (non cult) abusive household and was told the same thing. It was beyond asking "how high" when being told to jump, it was anticipating the jump before even being asked, and doing it exactly perfect.
I'm so sorry that you experienced such horrific abuse.
Thank you so much for speaking up, Michelle. You are so brave and these stories are important.
Me looking at the thumbnail… “is that Michelle? Yay Michelle!”
Lots of love to you Michelle, you are an amazing human and your advocacy for your self and others is incredible! Proof that goodness can emerge out of the most awful of circumstances ❤❤❤
Dearest Michelle. Please remember you were a child in a cult. Try to forgive yourself for not knowing any better. Give yourself some grace. What you've survived would destroy many a person.
Michelle, you survived so much. You are a strong woman. You're allowed to tell your side of your own story even when the other people involved may have a different view. I'm so glad you escaped.
Michelle you are an inspiration. So glad you found the courage to say what you have said. I hope it empowers you more and more. Thank you for coming on and shining another light on this group. And I am so sorry for what you lived thru. Your children are lucky to have such an awesome mom.
I've watched a lot of episodes of this vodcast, and I've always found things in each interview that I connected with, despite not having ever been in a cult, myself.
However, this particular episode is really giving me flashbacks.
My step-ahole was an abusive drunk. Despite his RARELY attending church, the phrase "spare the rod and spoil the child" was in my ear often. Being expected to not only do the things he asked or get hit, he absolutely expected me to anticipate his needs and serve them WITH ENTHUSIASM or get hit. He was big on psychological abuse as well, including shaming. He forced me to wash dishes with straight hot water. He once tried to beat me for getting car sick (one of the very few times my mother intevened). So many things that this episode brought up that I have avoided thinking about for decades.
Thank you, both, for your contributions to this show and to my healing.
I’m so sorry to hear that. Thank you for sharing ❤️ I hope you continue to find healing and peace
Love you Michelle! Don't ever give up!