resisting emotional blackmail | when 'compassion' corrupts [cc]
Вставка
- Опубліковано 11 лип 2024
- An exploration of some mechanics behind emotional blackmail - and in invitation to all parties to step out of it.
You can support the channel at: / theramintrees
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opening quote:
We’re each entitled to stay inside our comfort zones.
We’re not entitled to expect the rest of the world to join us.
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0:00 uncomfortable effects of comfort
3:21 emotion - a double-edged sword
7:54 comfort zones
10:12 oiling the squeaky wheel
13:48 compassion vs enabling
17:32 coping with other people's coping mechanisms
23:28 rationalisation
29:00 rational mindful solutions
29:57 summary
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subtitles
Bulgarian: Djeitko
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references
Abbott, K.R. and Sherratt, T.N. (2011) The evolution of superstition through optimal use of incomplete information. Animal behaviour 82 pp.85-92
Damasio, A. (1994) Descartes' error: emotion, reason, and the human brain. Putnam, New York
Kay, A.C., Gaucher, D., Napier, J.L., Callan, M.J. and Kaurin, K. (2008) God and the government: testing a compensatory control mechanism for the support of external systems. Journal of personality and social psychology 95 (1) pp.18-35
Kool, W., McGuire, J.T., Rosen, Z.B. and Botvinick, M.M. (2010) Decision making and the avoidance of cognitive demand. Journal of experimental psychology: general 139 (4), pp.665-682
Lindeman, M. and Aarnio, K. (2007) Superstitious, magical, and paranormal beliefs: an integrative model. Journal of research in personality 41 pp.731-744
Malinowski, B. (1948) Magic, science, and religion and other essays. Beacon Press, Boston
Zajonc, R.B. (1980) Feeling and thinking: preferences need no inferences. American psychologist 35 pp.151-175
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music © TheraminTrees
Full original music tracks used in videos are available to patreon supporters who pledge at the $1 per video level.
![infantilisation | a regressive abuse [cc]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/c39F04inLJ0/mqdefault.jpg)
![infantilisation | a regressive abuse [cc]](/img/tr.png)
![living with abusers [cc]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/K4YZoNxSZNU/mqdefault.jpg)
![losing faith | my departure from theism [cc]](/img/n.gif)
Little practice of rational thought for me:
"Indoctrinating children is fine, my group is entitled to ensure the survival of it's beliefs."
"If someone refuses your ideology, you have no right to force them to adopt it. You should wait until the child can make a reasonable decision about what it wants or doesn't want to believe. You know, the fact that your group has to resort to restricting the personal freedom of children not yet knowing how to defend themselves against it to maintain itself says a lot about the nature of your group. Just the statement 'My group is entitled to ensure the survival of it's beliefs' - no, it's not. You are entitled to believe whatever you want, just like everyone else. You are NOT entitled to taking this freedom away from anyone. How would you feel if a Catholic came up to your group and said 'All of you have to start practicing Christianity now, because my group is entitled to ensure the survival of it's beliefs'? By your logic, he has a right to do that, and your group would have to listen and start practicing Christianity. And if he doesn't, you don't either."
"You have to make allowances for your father - he hasn't got your emotional control."
"Wait, could you say that again, please? A parent is behaving like a child, so the child has to behave like a parent? What else am I expected to do, make allowances for his laziness and do his job for him? Maybe I should start raising him, too. That's what parents are supposed to do, no?"
suppose yes but often dont, if you raise them they can raise you , nobody can climb a mountain if no one leaves the bottom
That last thought is priceless
Those are great thoughts. You just shouldn't make the mistake to argue with those people like that because they won't understand you, they don't want to understand you. They will certainly feel very provoked by the passive aggressive parts of your arguments, will only feel attacked will want to attack you back. Be careful!
tiddymilkguzzler ok tiddymilkguzzler
@tiddymilkguzzler Mate, not gonna lie, it sounds like you're thoroughly describing actual America's democracy. Considering how America is doing right now, especially in the recent context of the pandemic, this is literally the dumbest example of a democracy you could have ever thought of.
On the other hand, even in other countries, nothing is perfect. France for example is the champion of inequalities. But look at your argument, you're talking about governing entities to diminish the power of critical thinking, and then trying to tell us that somehow _"diViNe WiSDoM"_ is gonna fix all their problems. NO, that divine wisdom is a load of bullshit. It only damages your critical thinking. You'll end up with more cognitive dissonance which will make you more vulnerable and more dangerous, and that has been proven time and time again because of all the Christian arguments which have been debunked and all the Christian cults based on the Bible who did some outrageous things and justifying them using the Bible.
Some of you like to point out that 18th century slavery is not what is described in the old testament. Great. WHAT THE FUCK DO YOU THINK PEOPLE WERE DOING IN 18TH CENTURY? THEY USED THE BIBLE TO JUSTIFY IT!
_"As for your male and female slaves whom you may have: you may buy male and female slaves from among the nations that are around you."_
[Leviticus 25:44 ESV]
Like seriously, you're complaining that there are problems around the world and you're critiquing one of the best tools for the mind because of controlling governments, and then suggesting to fill their mind with doctrine instead. Talk about being an adult with responsibilities.
I once attended "emotional intelligence" training at work. The trainer told my colleagues and I that we needed to treat people with "unconditional positive regard" and not "deny their reality". I asked the trainer what we were supposed to do if we heard someone make a homophobic comment, because surely if we had to grant them unconditional positive regard and we couldn't deny their reality then this would mean we couldn't challenge their homophobic statements. The trainer looked shocked and appalled at my suggestion, saying that this was "obviously" an exception. I then pointed out that this wasn't "unconditional" positive regard, since there was at least one exception. She didn't know what to say.
Sounds like meditating abuse in the workplace. Absolves them of all liability for workplace abuse. One place I worked for always have safety meetings in the morning, but then also had frequent injuries. One of the workers that had injured another on a forklift was later driving that forklift the same hour he broke someone's hip. As long as you have a meeting about something you don't want to happen it might just absolve them of responsibility of action, at least that's how they'll feel..
@@DG-wr6cl the trainer seemed to think this was an exception. Plus you could be disciplined at this organisation for making such comments
@@DG-wr6cl to be honest I don’t agree with unconditional positive regard. People should be challenged when they treat others badly or hold noxious views. Maybe it has some value in therapy, but not other aspects of life. We are not this person’s therapist and it is not incumbent upon us to help them with their development. They should already know that it’s wrong and get their act together.
In principle, the idea that bigoted people should be “accepted the way they are” is like when abusers say they should be accepted the way they are in Theramintrees’ “weaponising self-affirmation” video.
Thank you for reminding me this one. I loved the concept of "unconditional positive regard" for everyone ...and . have used it all my life until very recently [ am a senior now]. The result was unconditional low regard for me from most. I am learning to be fearful of them and have been working on low/no contact to save my sanity and health. This video is a gem. Am learning.
Them work training videos are bad. So many of them have the best intentions but just go so far off the mark. Jontron has a hilarious video on the subject of work safety videos specificaly. If you share the disdain for work training videos that i have then you'll enjoy it.
In contrast to "the squeaky wheel gets the grease", in Japan they say "the nail that sticks up gets the hammer".
For anyone wondering: 出る杭(or 釘)は打たれる “deru kui (or kugi) wa utareru” is the saying.
An analogous proverb where I live is "empty barrels make the most noise", ("Tómar tunnur larma harðast").
In Brazil we say the same thing!
To me that sound more like "if you make a fuss you'll be struck down"
In my experience both is true. People who always complain get the most comfort. People who never complain get hammerd down when they do.
"Don't be rushed" is a very important one. My abusers used falsified urgency to keep me from noticing and reflecting on things rationally.
My abusers are a myriad of gangstalkers. They get handsomely paid with things like new cars for their abuse. This is a common technique that is used. They will set up a fake situation up to make you have to quickly respond before you have time to thoroughly think and feel and make a good choice. Most often, since I take the time to think and feel, I can slow that pattern down and make a choice that keeps me in more safety.
My parents are pretty emotionally immature. Not exactly abusive but definitely neglectful and dysfunctional. Rushing everything is a common dynamic.
For my mom, she is so avoidant of complicated or negative emotions that she is trying to hurry everyone past it. Indecision scares her.
For my dad, he is determined to get his way no matter what, so sitting around talking things through is a waste. He sees himself as the only rational actor and our experiences don’t matter. And he can’t stand it when my mom is emotional (which is almost always) and immediately leaves.
They are hellish to travel with and often get stuck going in loops because neither will take the time to think things through properly.
And yet they think they are a happy couple. It’s bizarre.
That's a really good observation that I didn't think about. My abusive ex never gave me time to reflect or notice when I was being taken advantage of in emotionally charged situations
This is a good one
@@dr.bandito60yeah they did gangstalk, stole my devices to monitor me and taped them, they rushed me about something I said years ago, they misinterpreted in purpose as slander and a cheater to excuse their act of spiking my intakes and the last one had loads of toxins and valium to prove that I'm an alcoholic, I tried to clarify my words then ended up as more slander and a terro...rist, then using a snake they turned it into a gay slander apostate... and poisoned me again, now they are falsely accusing me of big things using their gossip witnesses to put me to rot in jail, and in the meantime I'm trying to recover they scratched me with something, it could be HIV or rabbies, people and authorities are outside waiting to lynch me
If this channel were a class in high school, the world would be a better place to live.
How about they don't enforce religion in school instead.
Could not agree more.
Sir, I think that you're absolutely right!
@@lemsip207 considering their power, showing these videos is our best bet right now
@@lemsip207 More lessons on psychology in school is more important. You can be religious and not force it down others throats, but it just happens to be that the popular minority are very loud. Childhood indoctrination is what tends to make it spread rather than it being taught in schools.
"Comfort, what does this word bring to mind for you?"
- a TheraminTrees upload
To me, it is something I haven't experienced since I reached adulthood. It's an illusion.
Iskandar Soren Do you need help?
@@Gloomdrake Maybe. It's just a constant sense of neurotic worry. Whenever I feel I can relax, thoughts of "you should be using this time to do this or that, or talk to that person, or do this thing over here" happen. Comfort never truly comes.
@UCTcH-6SBUBSL-1plBQKzY8A I appreciate you opening up. Hope you find some solace.
@@CultOfNothoon my advice, Soren, is to write down those thoughts on a piece of paper, and make a check list out of them. Eventually, you'll have done so many of those tasks your brain wants you to do, that you can rest peacefully one day.
“You have to make allowances for your father - he hasn’t got your emotional control.”
No, I do not. I am not responsible for his happiness or actions, and it isn’t my fault he can’t control his emotions or that he doesn’t work on it. It doesn’t mean I’m heartless or that I’m not compassionate. It simply means that I am not willing to sacrifice my own wellbeing, wants and needs for the comfort of someone who isn’t willing to improve themselves.
I thought of a response for the other scenario too, but I don’t feel like writing it down. Thank you for this video! It was immensely helpful and informative.
@@someguy2016 Was thinking that as well.
@Shimmy Shai You're applying your magical thinking to someone else's life, which is addressed in this video.
@Shimmy Shai the magical thinking is your invocation of Jesus' words as though they are ones everyone should follow / carry more wisdom or knowledge just because he said them. You place them in the conversation like they are meaningful, but it is the rationalization and critical thinking about the topic that are important, and phrases pulled from the Bible pushed on others meant as guiding principles are not often helpful to the deep reflective/critical thinking required.
I will tell you now, "you have to make allowances for your father-he does not have the emotional control you do" is not about revenge, and could not be interpreted that way, especially the way it's written. It is the mother's request for the daughter to ignore the father's poor behaviour in order to maintain the pretend peace of the relationship. This comforts the mother and keeps the father blind in his comfort zone, but puts all onus on the daughter to sacrifice herself, as was spoken about in the beginning of the video.
I'm not sure where you are getting your interpretation of make allowances from. Even when you explain it, it doesn't really make sense or seems a far and strange reach to come to the conclusion of. Is English your second language?
@@someguy2016 wdym
@@lowaimnobrain the daughter should communicate to the father that he is causing discomfort and reacting poorly. The father should self-reflect on his behaviour and learn to communicate his needs in a way that is beneficial to all parties involved. If he is regularly not in control of his behaviour, then he needs to be the one to work on controlling it and that's no one's job but his own.
"Protecting abusers from rejection removes their motivation"
YES!!! THIS!!!
Meaning?
Protecting someone from the consequences of their bad behavior may feel compassionate but it shields the bad actor from a situation and emotions that may help correct the bad behavior.
@@metal_birdthank you for the context
You make me feel like I’m not crazy.
Not gonna lie that profile pick doesnt help your case lol. Although, he's quite attractive...
YOU
ARE
A
TOYYYYYYYYYYYY!!!!
Sorry, I couldn't resist with that pfp.
But you are, we're mad here Alice.
@@Tachtzehn lol
SAME OMG
Yes, these videos are helping me stay sane in this toxic household bit-by-bit.
Just remember, you're not alone
same sister
To coop with it makes it sure easier, still, you are better of leaving that toxic environment.
Remove the pain when you can.
@@antoniommav Not really, but I'm trying really hard to stay alive until I'm of age to leave.
The squeaky wheel gets the oil,... but if it squeaks too much, it gets replaced.
I've said this many times in my lifetime! Glad to see I'm not the only one!!
Sometimes it feels like there are more squeaky wheels than non-squeaky ones and that these functioning wheels are in danger of being replaced.
@@somedudeok1451 True, I suspect that may be because this analogy refers to people who are loud or pushy and therefore, get their own way. This may be because they are drawing so much attention that others can't help but notice them. Often they can be perceived as correct by the majority of the group simply because they are so vocal or forceful, and seem so confident and sure of themselves, even when they are wrong. The quiet ones who are working steadily behind the scenes, not pushing their own agenda, and getting the real work done, can simply go unnoticed. From the outset, it looks like the squeakers are the "movers and shakers" getting things done, when in reality they are just boisterous, loud, showy, attention driven, and they take all of the credit. If someone needs to be let go or replaced, a boss or leader may incorrectly choose the person who is actually doing all of the hard work but without all the fanfare. They may be falsely perceived as passive and not as valuable. By the time it is realized that true function is now gone and shine, superficial fluff, and hot air is what's left ...it is too late.
In Argentina, in relation with "the squeaky wheel gets the grease" we say "baby that doesnt cry, doesnt eat". its sadly true in so many ways
Bebé que no llora, no mama
@@lowaimnobrain it's not literally used when referring to babies, I've never seen It used like that. The saying Is used in relation to a person that wont get what they want because they arent being loud enough.
These help me process my abusive childhood and adolescence household of which I escaped a few years ago
Me too
Free at last, free at last.
Thank God almighty I'm free at last.
I escaped long long ago, and these still help. Thank you.
Totally feel you. Felt like my childhood was played out. It's been difficult, but I am trying to rewire my brain to not emulate what I was taught.
congrats. I cut my family out, then gave them another try, and they became abusers again, then cut them all out again. 3 years later im at the best ive ever been
Perfect timing!
Jehovah’s Witnesses just had their latest convention, and the last day’s program instructs followers to “reach out to inactive ones, and encourage them to return to Jehovah.” and it’s just pure emotional blackmail technics.
So lots of us ExJWs have been getting bombarded (more than the usual) by JW family over these last couple of weeks with emotional pleas to return to the cult.
So they ran out of gullible donators?
Rottenboy cahbulux there is never enough money for these disgusting and repugnant excuses for human beings
I so agree. :(
I'm a PIMO exjw rn.
I watch a lot of anti-religious stuff and apparently a significant number of exJWs have had their old indoctrination flare up due to the current pandemic. It must be horrible, I hope all concerned can get through this without relapsing. There are a few American orgs that can help, such as Recovering from Religion and the Secular Therapy Project, and channels like Telltale and John Cedars can give you a lot of information about other such groups. The latter will be most useful for European exJWs.
For anyone reading and is living in an abusive household, please leave when you can.
I left my house at 18 due to be tired of 11 years with an abusive, narcissist stepfather and an emotionally unavailable, gaslighting, and codependent mother. I cut all contact with my stepfather 2 years ago and my mother blames me for destroying the family. Everyday has its challenges and pain. But it was one of the best decisions I have ever made in my life. It allowed me to be my authentic self. You’re not a bad person for leaving an abusive and conditional family.
Do you have any advice? Like, what did you do?
@@maschaorsomething 1. I live on my own, which helps.
2. I was patient with myself.
3. I didn't relapse into the relationship, even though it was very tempting.
4. I sought therapy later. It didn't help as much as I would have liked, but it helped nonetheless.
5. My fiance is extremely supportive and willing to listen.
6. I read The Gifts of Imperfection, which helped
7. I still struggle and think about it every day. But I remind myself that I am not repressing my feelings.
8. Be weary of gaslighting. My family tried it and I fell for a few spells. With time I realized what was going on and it cemented my decision.
If I had the funds to leave, I’d already be gone. But that’s not the case. I’m not getting much help, and my only income is from SSI for my disability. I can’t work cause I’m unable to thanks to the abuse. Everything is a job for me and extremely taxing. Even things that are suppose to be fun.
IzzyLand YT 🧢👨🏾💻💡🌍 that’s a tough call. I was broke, owed money, had no education really and depressed when I left. I had a vision and went on the grind for a bit. I’m doing pretty well for myself now, but it took a lot of perseverance
I think I may be living in one. What are some of the signs I could use to pinpoint it?
My mum has weaponised my compassion against me for years. "Be the bigger person".
I wanted to cut contact with my abusive grandmother, so my mum piled on the guilt "She's 80 years old! She's in a wheelchair! Her son just died! It's about being a DECENT PERSON!!"
I find it difficult to make basic decisions, because I've always been taught that how I feel and what I want are irrelevant.
That's unfortunate.. No one knows what happened between you two, no one except for you two. And dementia aside, she probably wouldn't confess to all the wrongdoing she did you. It's natural for a person to look at what they can, her dead son, and ignore what they couldn't see, the way your grandmother treated you. It's easy for a mother to underestimate her child, and deny them the ability to defend themselves or explain their choices. Parents only manage to speak to their children, they're often not thinking about listening and respecting our judgment, perspectives and emotions.
I hope things have gotten better for you. I relate with your comment wholeheartedly. Two narcissistic parents in my family, and a compulsive liar of a brother, all of whom have acted in tone deaf, self-righteous ways to get their way. Once someone like us plays our hand, they never forget to look for opportunities to turn it on us.
I distinctly remember many, many times my older brother insulted me to prop himself up. He'd often bring up the mistakes I made literally eleven years ago. I assume it's because he knows that I believe a person should be able to laugh at their own mistakes, as it promotes a healthy mind. But I see the situation for what it is, a narcissistic child taking an opportunity to grasp at straw to make himself out to be better than me. And what's more, a narcissist, who has to go back over a decade to find a mistake I made that was situationally appropriate.
People like us are riddled with resentment. But it's because people don't give us the respect we deserve. I know what it's like to understand, but to be denied the ability to change anything.
You couldn't possibly have better timing. I just cut off my parents , and it is so freaking hard. I feel so guilty. Even though I have recodrings of the abuse, there is still a part of me ('their voice') saying to me I'm awfull. I lived a year by myself, had huge growth and improved myself in all aspects. But got convinced to move with them again because of quarentine... I regret it so much, I have already moved out again, but the impact it had...
Everything I had worked ... :'( When I saw the psychologhical flear up you used as an example, I started crying, because I even developed rashes all over my body from the incredible stress... Everybody judges me and tells me I'm cruel but they just dont know.... thank you for doing this video, thank you seriously. Just thank you i need to know im not crazy.
You are not crazy, you're strong. You'll get there again! Take care, stranger.
@@dysfunksjon thank you kind stranger :')
I had to do the same with my dad. I still get asked/told by people to try and repair the relationship and I have to explain to them "I did, 3 times. I'm done, and I'm better for it." I say this hoping to affirm your decision. If you change your mind later, that's great too - but it's up to you. It's a hard road at first, but it gets easier all the time. It sounds like you've seen parts of that.
You’re NOT crazy! You’re perfectly normal. I’ve been there be strong 💪
You’re NOT crazy! You’re perfectly normal. I’ve been there .....be strong 💪
You took my breath away with Norma and Collin's story. That's directly from my childhood. That is exactly what they did to me. I had no idea what would trigger her. One day I was talking about how excited I was for my sister who had left home to apprentice somewhere and how I'd love to do that some day and my mother threatened to throw me out on the street because I was being "ungrateful" and my father yelled at me for upsetting her. I just want to cry and cry. These comments really break me down. I see all of you, what we went through is real.
It's so much more common than we think isn't it. So many of the same patterns repeated in so many lives behind closed doors. Peace.
Yes! Me, too! I blamed my mother for most of the chaos, but my father enabled my mother!
Child: Shows enthusiasm
Religious Zealots: Abuse child for showing happiness
Religion sure is beautiful
❤️❤️❤️
I found it relatable too. Not just my family but also in friend groups..... hope you find your peace❤️
so basically you have to make the abusers say "Well Well Well, If It Isn't The Consequences of my own actions."
And you have to understand that it's very commonly not so binary and communication breakdown, comfort seeking and overload is all around you.
@@dxfifa well you see, growing up in a pretty strict household, I am at least slightly educated the ways of psychological manipulation so i understand such concepts, i was just putting my years of memeing to the test with a joke of slightly above average quality
My sister used to get upset when she noticed I was nervous when talking to her. "You're making me feel like I'm a monster!" But I couldnt help feeling nervous and scared. My therapist helped me understand thats the consequence when you mistreat someone at random for years: they would naturally fear you. My sister created the situation, I didnt.
3 Words: Not. My. Problem.
I'm autistic. One of my biggest issues is executive function. Making decisions, no matter how large, is difficult for me. A big part of that is what you said with emotional vs. rational decisions. My mind tends to go towards rational thinking far more than emotional. This is both a blessing and a curse. I agonize over things as simple as what to eat or if what I want to say is okay to say. I cope with these decisions by making "rules" to simplify the decision. For example, I don't really chose what to wear. I have four outfits that I cycle between. The decision is already made so I don't have to choose it. I also plan my meals like three days in advance and should my plans become interrupted it causes me a good deal of distress because I need to make a new plan on the spot. The good part is I'm unusually good at objective thinking. Because I have to think about every decision, I tend to be more responsible with my finances. It makes it hard to work at an actual job though since interacting with strangers goes straight into overload territory. While I can create rules for interacting with those I'm familiar with, they only really apply to that specific person. Every person's different and as such requires a new set of rules. Just going to the store or filling out a job application can be emotionally draining.
you can train what's difficult, I had similar problems and I came from not being able to talk to managing subsets of people in a busy retail environment (up to 100 directly and indirectly)... everything can be trained, communication based on logic and other values... both in workplace and in personal life... all the best
I relate so hard to everything you just said. The part at the beginning of the video, where it talks about how emotional processing can help you make quick, snappy decisions, and people without it are left in "information processing hell", I KNEW that that was me.
I'm not autistic (to my knowledge), and I rather believe that, somehow, I "chiseled" myself into this state of being impervious to manipulation, and to my own emotional whims, at the cost of understanding and trusting my emotions. Before I read your comment, I was considering writing a comment much like yours myself, because I figured that experiences similar to mine or yours might be lesser known.
I actually felt a great deal of surprise and happiness upon reading your comment, knowing that I'm not alone in dealing with this. It brought me.. comfort, if you will.
That might actually explain why I have so much trouble making simple decisions. I do have one set of clothes in multiple, which allows me to wear basically almost always the same thing. And I used to carry a dice with me, to help me make the irrelevant decisions like which pastry would I rather buy today, or which restaurant should I go to. I had never thought that my slight autism might be part of the cause.
as an autistic/adhd person with problems with executive function, these are useful tips
HI! I wanted to share the Gospel of Christ with you! I love you!
ua-cam.com/video/SLK5CdR0ojc/v-deo.html
My mother was a brutally verbally abusive woman, and physical to others, for two years, 2010-2011, she began adding to her already long standing addiction to prescription medication (which pre-2010, the prescription medication abuse, including stealing my grandmothers medication at times, including medicine she may have died without, left me to care for myself for the times where she spent hours a day sleeping, me, probably as young as 5 years old at this point, living among trash with little to no supervision as my grandmother was bedridden and my grandfather worked 81 hours a week at times) by mixing in vodka. Two years my life was a daily hell, she'd scream racial obesities, she'd beat my grandmother in front of me causing me to have to pull her off of her (I was between 12-13 during this time), I had called the police on her numerous times only for them to leave doing nothing as she hadn't physically hit me and my grandmother refused to press charges because she didn't want her daughter dying in a jail cell. My uncle who wasn't living with us at the time left his dog here and it became my dog, she was old and dying at this point, and my mother beat her with my steel toed shoes in a drunken rampage. She lived, but a few weeks later the dog passed away, we don't want to believe it was from the beating, we want to believe it was from old age. But it's not like anyone took her to the vet. The possibility still nags away at me. To this day, my grandmother, who I take care of, urges me to forgive my mother, to truly love her. Explaining how my great-grandmother was also an abusive alcoholic but my grandmother forgave her, telling me about how one of my grandmother's older brother's would molest her and her sisters and she's "forgiven" him. Forgiveness made mandatory via the worlds most well known doomsday cult. I recently had lunch with my mother, she's many years sober, a fact that a judge once tried to wave into my face during a custody hearing when I was begging to be allowed to continue to live with my grandparents and not the house my mother had (I was 16 at this point), and the judge asked "aren't you proud of the progress your mother made?" A custody battle where my mother, years sober at this point, blanketly lied to the court, and told them my Uncle (who had moved in about a year before, took my mothers former room after he lost a job) was a drug addict, exploiting the fact my Uncle was very non-social, and very shy when it came to his privacy among strangers, knowing that he'd have to submit to the same drug tests she had before and urinate in a cup while someone watched. She then threatened me into going to family counseling, telling me if I refused she'd get a court order and if I still refused I'd be sent to juvie, when I attended she railroaded me the entire time as the psychologist just agreed with her on everything and wouldn't let me speak. Then my sober mother successfully manipulated and convinced my grandmother that my grandfather was cheating on her, despite the fact he spent hours a day working and had no time to cheat, and there'd be no way for my mother to find out about this if it was happening. Which eventually caused my grandmother to enter a hysteria where she ended up falling out of bed, leaving me, a 16 year old, to call the hospital hoping against hope that I didn't just watch my grandmother fatally wound herself as her piss soaked into the carpet of the room. She constantly shoved herself in my life and once unironically told me that she "knew everything."
I had lunch with her two weeks ago with my grandfather and my mom's boyfriend. Every time I see her it fills me with dread. I remember the years of neglect, the abuse, the tearing apart of my family, the lies, the therapy (not family therapy this time, thankfully), the PTSD, the Clinical Depression, and all the other hells my mind goes through when I look back, to the point where for years any time I heard a car skid or a certain tone of voice I thought it was my mothers screams, and still to this day have spikes of anxieties that come about when something reminds me of it. But my grandparents love their daughter. My grandmother has her Christian faith to forgive her and expects me to do the same.
I play nice, I know if I didn't agree to see my mother, my mother would never speak to her parents until she needed something, again. She comes to our house for two reasons: To get her car's oil changed, and to see me. When my grandparents die, I will have nothing to speak to my mother on, and my revenge to her is that she won't know that my "love" for her was coerced and faked until she already lost the parents she abused, and then she'll lose the child she abused as well, and realize that she truly knew nothing about that child.
Fuck you mom.
Sorry for the long posting, doubt many people will read this, but I felt the need to vent.
And for those of you who may think "Well she has changed, shouldn't you at least be proud of her for that?" Do you want to know how many times she's apologized to me, or to her parents, or her brother, for the abuse she's committed? A grand total of zero times. She has never asked forgiveness, and she refuses to remember what she did. She drank herself into a blackout and when she was finally sober, she lost all memories of the abuse. My grandmother and grandfather can forgive, and love her, all they want. But my love for her is dead and gone, and I will not forgive someone who's never even attempted to be forgiven.
I know this is a year old with 0 comments, but somebody’s gotta be first!
Fuck your mom!
Respectfully-
What a terrible person she is. People who want forgiveness to be something compulsive truly make me mad. I do not understand the people who say we should always forgive so that we can move on. It's a ridiculous concept to me. They messed up and now suddenly I have to waste my energy trying to forgive? Fuck you, no I don't. To make themselves worthy of forgiveness is THEIR responsability, not mine. Forgiveness lifts the heavy weight off their shoulders, not mine, as I did nothing wrong. I will spend my energy building myself up, finding peace in the notion that I'll be forever a better person than they could ever try to be.
I think it’s terribly convenient she lost all memories of abuse. My mother did the same, although alcohol was not involved.
"That's not how redemption arcs work, Ma."
I just broke off all contact with a "friend".
Thank you.
Don't you want to think about it at least for a day or two? It seems to me that you too got emotionally bamboozled
@@catgod7924 I've been thinking about it for weeks and this was kind of the final push. Don't worry.
@@catgod7924 cat god is a classic emotional abuser trying to convince targets they are the unreasonable one.
Sometimes you gotta do what's right for you, funyarinpa
Just remember that it's with your right to not let others exploit you.
Your art style never seems to get old. It's evolved over time but still remains distinct.
It gets the point across including emotions
There is nothing more needed for the things he has to illustrate
The main part of this channel is the script anyway so the artstyle is a really well addition like a cherry on pie.
I think it is unnecessarily creepy and disturbing, may scarry off some people
@@piotrbakua4875 I got that impression at first too and now I love it.
@@piotrbakua4875 There's nothing cute about manipulation.
clear geometrical shapes charachters with low level of detail usually not moving using poses and signs near them to show emotions physical representation of psycholgical terms this is what i picked up
"God is coming soon to smite the wicked" said the emotionally brainwashed individual. Not realising the evil in their own words.
Good to see you're still uploading over a decade on, Theramin. Thanks for the insightful content.
@Goldenar bruh
@Goldenar what? Where did that come from? I mean I know his brother takes part in his animation.
Goldenar ok chad gamer joker pfp
@Goldenar Geee, you deleted your comments.
As a passing question to trees, why has qualia not uploaded in seven years?
woah the last time i was this early i was still preaching as a jehovah's witness.
not sure I get the joke, do you mean you used to wake early to go evangelizing?
@@fauxshizl idk bro i dont get my own joke now that i read it twice. Now im kinda lost too hahaha. The important thing is that im out of that cult.
@@MechMiko no worries m'lad
@@MechMiko i understood that the last Time you were this early to a video you were still a JW. Btw, congrats on not being a witness anymore!
Nah, as an ex-JW myself I get that joke. You stated it quite well.
Those "emotional short-cuts" sound like "caving just to keep the peace." Never ever do that. That's not peace, that's surrender. It diminishes you, and emboldens the aggressor. It's a lose-lose game. You can't be afraid to pick a fight, especially if one is brought to you.
There is an inner strength and karmic benefit to tolerance, and it is strategic to know what battles are worth fighting and what are worth merely rolling off your back. There is wisdom and strength in passivity, too.
@@InsightfulZen Oh I understand picking your battles. But sometimes losing a battle stings less than not suiting up for it.
@@DrownedInExile I wholeheartedly agree, but choosing what armor and weapons to use while "suiting up" is an essential part of battle strategy
its important to recognise that if you have been abusive to someone. It's excellent for you to recognise and grow beyond that pattern of behaviour and control over another person. but never expect those who you've abused to come running back to you, or you never grew in the first place
what if they abuse you and they claim you abused them?
@@cerberaodollam That’s called a false allegation, pretty popular in America today, usually used between petty couples or just petty individuals in general
"Comfort. What does this word bring to mind for you?"
My mind: "If you study a well-made banana..."
:') best comment, by far
Exactly where my mind went.
I guess this banana has no bone
You guys talking about the banana man?
Maybe you aren't but I just wanna say that I like how Rationality Rules,
after explaining what natural bananas are, said in a comedical serious manner "So, enjoy. Or else."
The banana fits perfectly in your hand! It must be the work of dog!
/S
That last hypothetical is quite literally my family at the moment. I've made the decision to move out, and informed my parents that I would be moving in with my boyfriend just over a week ago, to move in on the 13th. Now, due to my father's incredible tantrum (Threats of ruining the family, scarring him with never-healing wounds, bringing up all of my past mistakes, and calling my boyfriend's parents without permission to "convince them", calling my boyfriend and telling him that he's not "a real man" for "allowing" me to do all of this), I'm moving, but no longer living with my boyfriend. I cannot stand how my mother enables such behavior- I've spoken one-on-one with her several times, and by the end of each conversation, she agrees that there is virtually nothing wrong with me doing any of this, and that my father is overreacting/manipulating me, but then she falls back in line with him the second we end our conversations, saying that I should bend to his will because "you know how your father is, how he grew up".
It's been appalling to witness, and to experience. I'm just happy that I'm going to be getting out of here. This video came at just the right time, I appreciate you speaking about all of this- thank you. Hopefully I can remember that I do not, in fact, have to appease these controlling and manipulative behaviors in the future.
You note your mom says: "you know how your father is, how he grew up" and my first thought is "He didn't grow up, hasn't had to, and he'll be a tantrum-throwing Trump -- I mean, child until that stops working. Then he may get worse and violent or find other means to punish those who displease him." Moving out (or running away) is a real good idea. New perspectives are helpful, too.
I think, mothers like this are comforting themselves, so they feed their own children to the dragon. For me it is selfish.
I would add that a substantial time spent in the "Overload ring" can very easily shrink our comfort zone as we retreat to something that was originally familiar. Old habits and old addictions rather than newer, more productive skills.
That is so true. You end up swinging back and forth from Over Stressed to indulgence in the Comfort Zone, with little to no growth.
Few places this accomodates significant growth. Military, for example; intention is to break and rebuild. A few homeless shelters Ive been in, with support. Vast quick growth. Other than that, hard to find. Hell, even a good prison brings change quick.
My mother used to be a bit like Norma: unintentionally manipulative at times, controlling and verbally aggressive. After long discussions with her and school counseling, things have gotten better. And my dad is like Colin. I hate his interventions. They’re just awful quick fixes that disregard my feelings and needs. We are on pretty bad term right now, but at least me and my mother seem to be getting along better, and I have grown a lot as a person. That’s enough for me.
Edit: the more you talk about Colin, the more it feels like you’re talking about my dad. It’s so weird, but very interesting.
It's a common pattern and I have an idea (never a certainty) that it happens when girls are kept unaware and ignorant of life, repressed using religion in a typically double standard society. Often they are taught nothing about the religion, only bits and moral behaviour.
Then all of a sudden they face marriage and motherhood and they are like lost unpredictable angry babies at home, while they look meak and mild outside and they let other people making them feel inferior on petty things.
"Each generation, shackles the mind of the next, in inescapable service to the magical coping mechanism of a long death ancestor."
This is such a perfect description of religion.
Thank you for your videos, content like yours helped me to escape a fundamental Christian worldview.
Emotional blackmail is also frequently used against people who want to exercise their right to choose their own time and manner of death. Because apparently the comfort of "loved ones" is more important than your own goals.
there's nothing more selfish than wanting someone to endure suffering because you don't want them to end their life. You're literally taking someone else's problems and making it about yourself.
❤❤❤
Feel free to leave, but don't hold up traffic for hours if you do.
When I first discovered this channel, it shook me because of how well it described the abusive household and religion I was a part of at the time. It was actually pretty hard to watch each video because it confronted me with the reality that I was going through a lot of abuse, and also with the magical thinking I was using to cope with and justify those same behaviors.
Back then, watching one of these videos would, at least for a while, make me realize that the only thing really holding me to my beliefs was the manipulative tactics I was raised with. It was a nightmare. I remember going back and forth between seeing myself as an atheist and fundamentalist Christian as the stress from my environment got better or worse and I needed to cope more or less. Even now, I'm still amazed how well these videos describe what I was going through.
I'm so glad and thankful that you're still making these. Now when I watch these videos, instead of being agitated by the way they confront me with my surroundings, I can easily recognize what you're saying as true and I can see where each party is right/wrong in their behaviors. I can't stress it enough, that the calm and collected delivery of your points, along with the powerful illustrations, taught me so much about abuse and how to recognize it, all in a way that bypassed the defense mechanisms I had keeping myself from thinking about it.
Again, thank you for making these videos, they have really changed my life for the better. I'm not sure where I would be without them.
Thank you Dan. It's good to hear the videos helped. I'm sure many of us recognise the previous agitation and vacillations you describe. Glad you've come through ok.
I've never had to deal with that sort of stuff myself, but I can imagine how tough it must be.
You guys got my deep respect for overcoming these obstacles.
@@Depressed_Spider sounds like we went through pretty similar experiences, and you phrased this amazingly. reading it made me feel much less alone than I have in a while :)
My family used to go to the circus a lot as a child. I didn't like it and expressed it one day to my mother, she was so upset. Yet I noticed something whenever we would go, my parents were never really happy when we were their either. It took time but i realized my folks didn't ever go bc they liked it, but bc they thought I and my brother enjoyed going. So every year we went, and knowone liked it, thinking we were doing it for "another" and suspending our own happiness.
This reminds me (especially with the recent events in America) of the famous MLK quote: "I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to 'order' than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice."
In terms of disabilty advocacy, replace "White moderate" with Centrist. Though I imagine both are quite similar.
@@NathanGatten a moderate is a centrist, basically. Edit: to clarify, centrism is the principles, moderation is the method. A moderate does politics in moderation, and a centrist's ideologies are basically the average of everyone's, +/- 1 sigma maximum (most likely less, I'm just putting a strict upper bound)
Ohh, nice. Now only wait few hours, put the kids to bed, hug wife, brew some good tea and have a nice theramintrees listen in the living room, watching the trees sway in the night winds.
I can't believe I didn't discover this channel until 2020. As a fellow therapist, this, and all of the other videos hit so close to home professional and personally. Thank you so much for your great work .
Thank you. As a now-retired therapist, salutations.
TheraminTrees
Oh, you’re retired? Darn. Good for you, but I wonder how I find a therapist like you when so many are so... terrible.
@@TheraminTrees but think of all the people you aren't helping, it's so cruel to just cut them off!
@@artlessknave you can't help everyone mate.
@@adamthearmadillo8894 yes...it was a direct reference to the video. seems like it went over your head. :/
But the pastor is touching kids!
Hate the sin not the sinner.
BUT HE'S HARMING KIDS!
He's an agent of God. Whatever he's doing, God knows.
So not going to do anything about it and discouraging action about it? Ah, doesn't that sound similar to being an accomplice to a crime?
A sinner without reformation is still a sinner.
Reformation is hard though, so the sin is easier to blame I guess.
I'm more saddened about potential sinners who haven't commited the sin and yet are hated as sinners.
@@EverythingLvl Nothing like a "bigger authority" to take the blame.
Ah yes the ever so wonderful Strawman argument i mean it's not like the bible explicitly warns against false idols or anything. also love the sinner but hate the sin does not mean you aren't allowed to punish someone parents punish their children out of love all the time. Rather it means that a persons past actions shouldn't be held against them if they have properly repented for their crime.
@@EverythingLvl Men? You discounting the rape I wekt thru as a 3 year old hun? Was my mother AND her boyfriend (2nd bro's father). Human you meant. I'm certain. Cause I've been equally wronged by both sexes, for the same purposes.
I am a Tomgirl, so good luck 🤞
I really like how you broke down in 13:00 that he wasn't doing it for anyone's comfort except his own, through evasions of emotionally high moments, as I almost never see anyone talk about it. And of course, good job on the video. It was visually interactive and well worded; like always.
16:20 I would like to give my own testimony on this statement regarding abusers seeking help. Once upon a time when I was quite young, very stupid, and extremely emotional, I had someone who was very dear to me who I treated incredibly harshly. I called them my friend, but they were practically my hostage. In the moments when I was emotionally sober, they were the most important person to me in the world. But when I was angry (which was unfortunately often) I would fault them for any minor/innocuous thing that I was blowing out of proportion, frequently bringing them to tears.
Eventually, they realized what was happening and made the healthy decision to break contact with me. At the time, in my head, this was yet another thing that they did wrong just to hurt me. But in the many years that passed, I continuously reflected on everything that happened to lead to that outcome- recognizing what demons I had within myself that caused such unacceptable behavior. Since becoming an adult, I have not come even close to acting like that same beast to the friends I still have.
That person I love will never be a part of my life again- but neither will the version of me who caused them so much pain.
Had a struggle for a while until I told my wife one day...Love your daughter for which she is, not for what you think she should be. It clicked somehow and she started talking different to our daughter from that day forward. Things are so much better these days. Thank you Theramin Trees for being there over the long haul! Your words of wisdom have been with me for at least 8 years now.
The example of the daughter with same sex attraction is quite similar to my own life. When I came out to my narcissistic mother, she berated me and forbade me from coming out to the rest of the family. Later as I became more independent and had a healthy love life, I felt unable to share those aspects of my life with the family causing me to grow more and more distant from them. My mother accused me of being secretive and cold with them, and when I eventually had enough of the abuse and reminded her that I wasn't allowed to share my life with them, per her orders, she was unwilling to accept the double bind that she had put me in. Either I needed to disobey her and come out to the family, or my lack of a relationship with them was something that she was responsible for, and she was unwilling to accept either of those scenarios. Since then I've been very low contact with her.
i'll bet she knows some members will support you. She wants you isolated. Why sacrifice your relationships w/ so many people because of her. Cut her off, come out and keep whoever sides w/ you or else move on.
both my grandmother and mother shunned certain family members and everyone towed their line. I was a little could and saw it was wrong but couldn't do anything and i never understood why no one stood up to them. Reading your comment makes me understand that people just like to obey their oppressors.
@@gauloise6442 This was years ago, back in the 90s. My whole extended family is pretty toxic, so no harm with going no contact with them. One of my brothers is the only one who is somewhat healthy. Everyone else is either toxic or enabling of toxic behavior. I miss the enablers, but I can't tolerate them trying to get me to excuse the behavior of the others. I currently have a chosen family of people who love me for the person I am rather than trying to be the image of perfection that they want me to be. I came out to my mother when I was 18 and I'm now 42. It's been a long road, but I'm at a place where I don't feel trapped by my family.
She just wanted to hear you lie was all.
I only now realise, that not being allowed to show emotions of sadness or anger and strongly supressing the symptoms of my ADHD put me in overload for all my life with my parents and sister. Thank you so much ! I always felt like I was wearing a mask or a big shield to protect myself, because of the constant fights at home. Now, living alone I can reconnect to that part of my true self again and nurture it. I've been half alive since then, have been dealing with depression and a lot of awful memories. Thank you so much !
The part where the daughter having to deny her identity and act as if nothing had changed for the sake of other's comfort, and how it then pushes one into extended periods in the overload zone... man, I think that's exactly what I have been feeling. I am in the middle of figuring out so much about myself, but I just don't have the mental energy to even try anymore. The moment I do, my mind shuts off and I feel extreme fatigue, because there's always a disapproving voice in the back of my mind steering my focus away and making me feel guilty. I'm glad to have seen this video, it'll be something to bring up with my therapist this week. I can't thank you enough for all the information you compiled in such a great and digestible way, as well as the clear visuals accompanying them.
I'm glad it's helped. Hope your therapy's going well.
Just this morning I told my mom I didn't want to go to church anymore because I don't believe in God. Later on, my dad asked me to keep going so my mom wouldn't have to worry about me being an atheist. It's crazy how realistic this video is. Hopefully I can better explain my position by using your words to boost my confidence in myself. Thanks a lot!
God, that example story with norma hits home. I feel a similar way with my mother, the only difference is that i play the role of both the father and the daughters: the abused and the appeaser.
all mothers are like that.
Yeah... the cycle of abuse can rotate roles. Depending on the interaction it is quite possible that everyone in the family has played each role. That's what is really confusing and difficult... and sometimes why cutting off really toxic ties are the only option one really has.
@@t3hsis324 that feels like the option i am soon to take. A scary prospect but at this point it feels necessary.
@@thetsarofall8666 I understand why you're scared and it's a perfectly rational behavior. Look at it as a step forward in your life and your therapist is someone helping you make it. They are trained to give you an impartial viewpoint, one to help you shift your perspective for the better. You will be better for making this journey.
This is like the bullied become a bully.
In a nation like the USA where accessibility of mental health services is so limited, a channel like yours is a godsend, metaphorically speaking. Thank you for reminding me that I have no obligation to care about the feelings of people who have abused me.
I really wish it reached more people. Heck, this is the kind of stuff that should be taught to kids in high school, along with finance.
@Nosferatu Zodd actually that wouldnt be a good start for many, because they need to get detached from the abuse before they even consider maybe understanding the reasons for it. trying to do so early is one of the things that gets people back INTO the abuse, to give them just one more chance for the 80th time.
@Nosferatu Zodd yes but someone who was abused often isn't logical, particularly if the abuse lasted for a long time, or from a very early age. the abuser damages logic to maintain the abuse, and they must often build the whole logic function out of a mutated skeleton before they can even introspect at all, because they are running in that emotional comfort mode all the time, jumping from panicked repairs to panicked repairs. they need to break out of that first, and often that can only happen by cutting the disease out entirely.
@Nosferatu Zodd i wouldnt fully agree that "Nobody truly chooses to be an awful person", because a few most definitely do, but it's really, really rare. most who are awful to others do it for a reason. usually a bad reason, but there is a driver.
As an administrator in a cult survivor's group I so appreciate your efforts to compose videos across many years. They help people remove chains and stand on their own. Thank you...
Thanks Roy - and good luck with your work with survivors.
With help of this channel and my mom I was able to see the abuse I've been experiencing and shut it down by getting rid of contact. I know my father isn't the worst abuser in the world, but I don't need a puppeteer.
8 months ago I cut off all contact with an emotional abusive ex-boyfriend; he tried to lure me into staying as a part of his life regardless of his toxicity.
Eventually, a third party member Let me now that even after avoiding all contact with him he was still persuiting me and wanted to talk to me in order to fix things up or else 'neither of us would heal'
In the end; I stayed firm and I have never regretted having prevented him from ever re-entering my life. He made me physically and emotionally and I don't want to experience that ever again.
'....wanted to talk to me in order to fix things up or else 'neither of us would heal' '
-Such a common mind game. Good for you for you staying firm. This fits in nicely under a point in the forthcoming video - I'll include that phrase 'neither of us will heal'. Peace.
Found this channel a couple of years ago, and my life has changed so much for the better during that time. It’s played a large role in me breaking the cycles present within my family. Thank you so much.
Really glad you've been able to break those cycles. Peace.
His abuse ones helped me leave the church . He was describing god and asked who it sounded like. I said an abuser,then he says god. I researched it and found he was right. That's when I started to question everything.
azsli2 it was similar for me. I grew up in a very religious but also very abusive and dysfunctional home. The videos about abuse and leaving behind religion were so important in my healing process.
@@KC-vs7wp me too I grew up in church of god then quiverfull. Extreme fundamentalists
azsli2 wow, both very extreme movements (my family was just fundamentalist Pentecostal). Props for you for being able to get through the indoctrination and eventually leaving
I am autistic. My relationship with emotion has been difficult. Here is my personal understanding of emotion:
Emotion is motivation. It moves us to act. But we don't have to act on every emotional impulse. We can consider how we feel and ask if there's an appropriate way to act on it. All emotion says is "Do something." We need to use reason to decide what to do. Sometimes, the best thing to do is nothing. Experience the emotion, acknowledge it, and move on. In my experience, this idea is anathema to many. Some people prioritize passion in their lives. Dispassion unnerves them. Considering how you might act on a feeling rather than acting impulsive seems, to them, cold and calculating.
Ok that is the end.
This is great advice for me, thank you. I learned a similar technique from my counsellor called mindfulness, but meditation never really worked for me. I like the method of just applying the same concept to everyday situations, as you described. I used to think I was just naturally unemotional, but now I realise I am quite emotional inside; I just don't show it much.
I get this kind of reaction from other people too.
More than once I was described as unemotional or machinelike because I do not often react in the 'appropriate' way for the other people and always try to find the underlying logic to a topic.
Recently I had a conversation with some people about a topic that is quite often discussed in the US and apparently all people seem to have the same opinion about it, though in my area it is barely mentioned in the news. Me, being from a totally different country that has different problems and thus a different point of view to ceveral topics, asked about some of the nuances of the topic that I as a non-native speaker did not understand. As answer I was accused of being willfully ignorant and many worse things and told to show compassion, when all I tried to do was have a rational, maybe even scientific, conversation about a topic I wished to understand better.
My (Christian, conservative) father passed away just over a month ago. In the months before his death, he was vicious in his verbal abuse and his emotional blackmail, going as far as accusing me of not loving nor caring about him.
Went to therapy to try to get some help with this situation. I think I got the advice I needed at the time, as I was able to get the closure peace I needed with his passing.
Now that hes passed, I'm starting to come to terms with his emotionally abusive and manipulative ways. Definitely a very conflicting feeling of grief. Thanks for this video
I really want to thank you for these videos. You clearly know the subject very well, and are clear and articulate in your presentation.
Personally, I was raised in an extremely religious home. At the age of 24 (still not allowed to live on my own, since I was not married), I began to sense that something was wrong. I began to question my parents' authority to govern certain aspects of my life, like my decision to go to college or my choice of career. (Of course, they claimed that they prayed about it, and this is how God was leading them to "advise" me. Resisting them was actually resisting God.) At the age of 26, I left without their blessing. It was hard -- they were my family and I hated hurting them by leaving. I have many younger siblings, who were heartbroken to think that they may never see me again. No amount of reasoning or explaining my motives could move my parents. I've not heard one word of compassion, no "we understand" or "we are sorry". They have told me that I am spoiled, rebellious, and demon-possessed, among other things. Every time I tried to open my heart and reveal my feelings to them, they only search my words for ammunition to use against me. I have stopped communicating with them (fortunately, they have moved to another state, so there are no awkward encounters).
At the age of 28 I was married to a young lady from a conservative Christian family (not nearly as radical as the one I came from), and then at 29 (earlier this year) I realized that my faith in the Christian god had no basis in reality, and I became an atheist. At first, this caused a bit of strain on the relationship between my wife and myself. She has become more accepting of my new viewpoint, although she does not share it. However, she has told me not to tell any of her family, so as not to upset them. For now, I am honoring that request.
I cannot begin to express how much confidence and emotional/mental healing your videos have given me -- every single one of them feels like it is addressed to me personally. Thank you so much, and keep doing what you do! :-)
Good luck 🤞. Hope it all works out for you and your wife.
Honestly, you might have helped save your younger siblings. At some point they might start to ask themselves about the time when you left and start piecing things together. That's a BIG event that's gonna stick out like a sore thumb, should the walls ever start closing in on them.
I examined a lot of religions abd I came to the conclusion, in the case of christianity, what they live is not what Jesus said. They are abusing his words and the heart of christianity...
Yes! Your experience is a mirror to mine.
Emotion is the most potent and insidious thing religions have been able to weaponize to keep themselves going. My mother often uses the comfort excuse whenever I bring up religion's inexcusable deception, atrocious actions, and horrible mindsets. That, and people's right to believe, parents' rights over their children, and "I can't change anything". It's mentally exhausting to say the least. It makes you wonder, is this quick-fix really a mental shortcut when you have to take so many detours to stay on that path?
It's a shortcut on that moment.
Having a shortcut for one road doesn't mean a shortcut for the whole journey. It's always good to go out of your way to buy map in advance, the currency being your effort.
i want to sincerely and humbly thank you for this video on behalf of all victims of abuse. i recently ran away from home with my younger brother (he’s only twelve, i’m twenty) to stay in a shelter for abuse victims. one of the scenarios depicted in this video hit the nail right on the head for us, and after little deliberation we left home right after notifying child protective services of our domestic situation. having lived through four suicide attempts, still blaming myself and feeling like a coward, it was my brother admitting to me that he self-harmed at age nine which made me believe i was not at fault for my feelings and actions, but rather, it was our parents. this video made us take that very difficult step towards a better future. sadly, my brother has been taken away from me and placed with a temporary family while the cps conducts their assessment and investigation. i have since received psychiatric sessions, legal consultation and been prioritized for student housing. had it not been for countless incredibly brave people telling their stories of abuse, and theramintrees using his platform to reach potential abuse victims and people in proximity to abuse, i would not be alive and my brother left alone to deal with extreme emotional trauma. writing this comment can never do justice to how grateful we both are to theramintrees and abuse victims who dared to spite their abusers. from the bottom of our broken hearts, thank you.
"He could choose the comfotable safe path, but he saw that way lead ever deeper into stagnation."
I'm studying 3D modelling and animating right now, and I have gained so much respect and understanding for your visual work. You've made amazing artistic progress!
Thanks. I'm a mere dabbler in these things but I do enjoy the process. Have fun with your 3D work!
Goodness, my favourite therapist is back.
The- what?
If you didn’t know, the guys occupation is a therapist. But the comment could also being referring to the therapeutic effects these videos might bring to people
This video came at the perfect time. Thank you, Theremin.
I'm glad. Peace.
so perfect that a hour ago, my parents were emotionally blackmailing eachother. Goodie!
Perfect timing for me too
I don’t know if you realize how powerful these videos are to so many in your audience. I’m holding back tears
Religion seems so quaint, but maybe because it doesn't affect me. These days I mostly see emotional blackmail used for political ends here in the States.
You should investigate the Baha'i-Faith. You will likely find a group of very open-minded individuals.
States is in better condition- that's my observation.
Whereas Europe is in deep trouble. More or less submitting to irrationality! See the fate of Sweden, UK, France....etc.
@@truthprevails5173 Can you elaborate? As someone from Eastern Europe, it looks quite the opposite from here.
@@ThatCrazyKid0007 I agree. Eastern Europe is in a better position.
@@truthprevails5173 Alright, however I am still curious about the reasoning behind your opinion. How is Western Europe becoming more irrational, especially in the context of being more irrational than the US?
Watching your videos is liberating.
Always abandon abuser. Every. Single. Time. Get out and never look back.
My mum used to tell the family I complained about nothing and that I thought I was so hard done by, trained me well not to disagree lol, I get told by a lot of old people I was nothing but trouble, the trouble I caused came from me running away and being found wandering streets and taken back.
I do not have a life I can cope with x thanks for this x
“Compassion involves thinking about others a well as ourselves, not instead of.”
As I go through therapy and resolve old issues I've had in the past, I've come to love these videos more and more with their relation of my reality. These videos really help me out with seeing and easing my grief and give me a truthful understanding of what is left of my internal conflicts.
Thank you TheraminTrees for making these videos at what seems to be the right things I need to hear.
this is literally the only time I've ever heard the old saying of "the squeaky wheel gets the grease" in a semi-positive manner.
I usually hear it with the same intention as the old "the nail that sticks out gets the hammer"
As an Ex Jehovah's Witness, I see so much here being exercised in the religion. I do love your video and your renderings are ace.
In my own observations of people in the world, I've noticed that "comfortable" usually means "what a person is used to", and "uncomfortable" tends to mean what is new, different, outside the box, foreign and otherwise unfamiliar. So "comfort" typically means, the maintaining of consistency. Even if what someone is used to is terrible and they hate it, and what someone is not used to describes everything they claim to hope for, strive for and have goals to obtain. It becomes a self-created hell.
For me, the word comfort brings up the image of solitude; a lonely spot by a warm fire on top of a big mountain.
What a lovely image.
@@TheraminTrees It's definitely my happy place.
Solitude...what a lovely thing
Your videos help me so much in therapy, mostly because I'm an intensively visual person and sometimes my therapist will explain something to me and an image from one of your videos pops in my head, and then I fully understand. I'm very interested in psychology but since it comes from academia, a lot of psychology content is in the form of texts or conferences. Being able to put images on it is difficult vulgarization, and I'm glad you are talented at it.
I would like to add, I see the progress in the 3D, and it's so lovely
I wish I'd seen these videos long ago. Christianity (not to be understated, my angry, manipulative, vindictive pastor father) destroyed my young mind. As a result, I destroyed my family. If I'd have had a normal development, I'd not been so damn confused leading to my insane actions causing a terrible result on a woman who, regardless of her flaws, couldn't have ever reasonably lived with my own insanity or continued to love me. I'm alone now and much happier, working through my own de-conversion. But, I live with the full awareness of my own failings acted, albeit under psychological duress, in good faith, but bad outcomes. Religion is cancer. Thank god (LOL) I'm recovering from religion. Hopefully in a few years I'll have fully recovered. Thank you for your excellent work.
Thank you. I wish you well with your ongoing recovery.
Bro that story 10-12 minutes in perfectly describes why I don't speak to my mom or stepdad anymore. The fact you followed up with "the squeaky wheel gets the grease" blew my mind because that's exactly what my stepdad would say all the time
I'm currently in a "Christian" household. I put it in quotes because there doesn't seem to be (much) indoctrination or abuse. At an early age, we were taught that God was the only way to salvation, but apparently our parents weren't intensely invested in our "spiritual growth." A few times they expected us to pray, and frightening experiences like these helped to alienate me from complete acceptance before I saw Christianity as the only way. Thankfully, I seem to have been born naturally shy and somewhat careless, the latter in the sense that I don't bother with things that don't seem to have much of an impact or have a larger negative one than positive. Some other combination of nature/nurture, probably with these traits still involved (or perhaps the carelessness of a divine being who was fine with losing an easy believer?), I never had any experiences I would or did define as supernatural encounters. These combined made me never really a believer. I remember a few select times where I tried, whole-heartily, to receive a clear response from God. When they went unanswered, I wasn't bothered to keep trying unless a mistake I made was severe enough to trigger a fear of hell that lead to an appeal for salvation. These were extremely rare - I remember only three times total I attempted prayer without direct influence from a parent, one to seek God that was largely unprompted, two more in response to major hell-earning mistakes - and with no response, they got less and less common.
However, and quite ironically it would seem, now that I had broken free of my admittedly extreme shyness of my early years (sustained by being home schooled to be taught the "right" way, of course meaning memorizing a few Bible verses here and there and the things no atheist could answer about evolution, which now seem quite answerable), I realize how much I want Christianity to be true. The idea of death seems immensely frightening, and partying for infinity seems quite nice. As the evidence accumulates, and my effort to find it very slowly grows, the possibility of Christianity or any (at the very least no heaven-giving, directly personal) deity appears to shrink, and that of death resulting in oblivion, in other words, atheism, appears to grow. Despite my carelessness, or more accurately laziness, even on such an important matter, preventing me getting the full, most likely answer right now, I realize just how much I, despite never actually believing, want to believe in God. The whole religious "tolerance" thing, that appears a lot like one of these emotional blackmail things, and religious peoples' accusations of malicious intent on the part of atheists, and the general "the other side is deceiving/brainwashing you" attitude of the world, especially in the important realm of politics, also makes reasoning seem difficult and uncomfortable, although certainly manageable. My laziness/carelessness wants me to stand still and remain ignorant on what is really probably going on beyond humanity, if anything. But my relaxation of shyness and fueling of curiosity, encouraged at least a little and not punished by my probably-not(?)-abusive parents, tells me to keep looking, even if it means getting of your mental butt and doing something.
While I do not think I am the subject of indoctrination or abuse, this channel and other secular ones like it have encouraged me to keep looking for the most reasonable conclusions, not the ones that most people believe or want you to believe, and even the ones you want yourself to believe. Keep searching for truth folks. After all, "ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free." - John 8:32
Our stages in life were pretty similar, I read the whole comment. My dad was the semi religious one that half ass instilled it into the family (Mom didn’t care) but one day he came outta nowhere talkin about Satan and how he wants to consume the world and if I do bad things I’ll be tortured in hell for eternity. I asked why and he didn’t give a clear answer obviously, so I’ve pretty much said Sianara to the whole damn thing after the paranoia went away, a couple of weeks at most. I’ve always questioned anything about life so getting bs answers upsets me. I do still believe in god and Jesus, but I don’t limit myself to how he wants “his people” to live. I literally won’t pick up a bible and read it because I’d probably laugh at most of it. If Jesus will accept me after whatever happens in my lifetime, then yay! Thanks Jesus! If not, then chances are I don’t wanna be welcomed where I wouldn’t fit in anyways.
Maybe we shouldn’t be so complacent with our ignorance and figure out our own truth, but imo I don’t think it’s that important when it comes to religion tbh. I really don’t need to dig into the Bible to understand I don’t 100% fùck with what they got goin on, or even believe, but the chances of there actually being any god from a specific religion are as astronomically high as the world we live in resulting from an explosion with perfectly fine tuned settings so we can survive under just the right conditions. So I’ll just never subject my kids to that type of bs n let them think what they want lol
@@mtndewprettygud6416 When I was a child, and into young adulthood, I had a similar superficial view of Christian belief. I did not feel the need to delve into the details, and did not feel the need to investigate. Differently from you perhaps, I spent much of my childhood in countries where Christianity is a minority religion. So while my family went to church every Sunday, I was also exposed to multiple other religions, their traditions, and their beliefs. That gave me a perspective which effected how I viewed Christianity as I investigated it later in life.
There are many religions, sects, and denominations, with a wide range of beliefs, many of which are mutually exclusive. As I explored, reading the bible, and other religions' texts, I found that many made fantastic claims that most people not born into the religion do not accept. That lead naturally to a search for what evidence religions, and Christianity in particular, present us. Repeatedly I found that religions (in particular the Judeo-Christian variety) espoused the virtue of faith in the absence of evidence. It did not escape my notice however that faith could be used to justify belief in anything. That led me to explore what constitutes good evidence, the application of logic, and ultimately how to judge the validity of evidence when it is presented in defense of a religious belief. It's remarkable how the same logical facilities, and persuasive but ultimately flawed evidence, is presented as proof by proponents of many different religions. Religions that view each other as spreading false belief. For me this led to the conclusion that no religion provides persuasive and falsifiable evidence for god. Even if I were to choose one, I could not know if I was following a path to god, or away from god.
Do not lose your faith.
@@mtndewprettygud6416 Fair reply. I don't see much use in believing in religion if you don't care or don't expect it to make sense. I thank you profusely for not seriously considering indoctrinating others, but why let yourself believe in a fantasy like that? To be more comfortable? That would certainly help, but what have you to lose if you find the belief unreasonable either way? If life ends at death, however uncomfortable it might seem, why not just accept it?
I do agree that the cause of the natural, contingent universe being natural and/or contingent to not make sense, and that 'something' (italicized) should be out there that made it. Unfortunately for me, there doesn't seem to be any heaven-giving deity ready to accept me with open arms, and if something similar exists, they're quite hidden. Doesn't seem to be much use investing in a belief in a deity at all at that point if they've got nothing to give us besides temporary existence. Idc there, do what you want. Again, you're smart enough to not indoctrinate, good enough for me.
@Devon Phoenix Funny story, my grandfather thinks the JWs stopped showing up when he put the 'MURICAN flag up in his yard.
I'm a little ashamed that I have watched so many of your videos without saying this. Your videos are INCREDIBLE and have helped me so much in healing and protecting myself and my daughter. Please consider changing your channel's name to "How to bulletproof your mind" or something. :)
Thank you :)
You're welcome!
This made me feel justified to exist
so much of the dynamic of colin and his wife remind me of my mother and father. my mother is colin and my father is colins wife. i’m beginning to realize that if i do not want to be around these people, that i have to step out of my comfort zone and do things to get my life to a point where i do not need them anymore. i knew this deep down but its very helpful to hear another human being say it. i would not have had that if it weren’t for this video.
i hope my siblings are able to do the same when the time comes. they’ll have my help for sure.
thank you TheraminTrees. so much of my own personal growth can be attributed to randomly finding you in my recommendations tab. i would not be able to cope with my life had i been forced to believe that things have to be the way my parents say it does. videos like this make me feel a lot less crazy.
My parents are the Colin/Norma dynamic too, with my father being Norma and my mother being Colin. My maternal grandmother was a Norma though if she didn't get her way, she didn't explode, her weapon of choice was the silent treatment. Since my grandmother's death, my mother has slipped into using passive-aggressive manipulation as her weapon of choice, trying to force me and my sister into what mother wants. I'm willing to accommodate until she starts needling and then I refuse to engage. I'm 45. I've had too much of my life wasted for me. I don't have time for that shit anymore.
In my world when everyone fails to understand me, I started to feel bad about rational thinking. Seeing this video really made me happy that sane people exist. Thank you.
This is such a hard watch, as someone that hasn’t come out as an atheist, or as pans to many friends and all of my family.
Outstanding as ever. The idea that threatening circumstances push us to magical thinking can be seen in the decline of religion as places become more peaceful, prosperous and educated. The irony is how often a theist asks a non- believer 'What awful thing happened in your life to push you away?' Right back at you. Conspiracy theories also thrive in emotionally/economically challenging and highly divisive times: look at the US at the moment. Looking forward to your next video. Stay safe.
Please, the medias are manipulating us on the highest emotional level. All over the world. You watch this video and don't recognize how you get manipulated...
@@oOIIIMIIIOo Let him figure it out for himself when in 2030 he is like us with nothing to our name as a slave of a faceless elite. After all, they told us, gave it to us in written form and we're on that path at full speed and it's still a conspiracy theory ;)
@@oOIIIMIIIOo It doesn't change fact that some conspiracy theories also tend to be manipulative as well, reality has many colors if we filter them out we miss the other colors that might be valuable.
“We do not learn from experience... we learn from reflecting on experience.”
― John Dewey
I've been watching your content for few years now, and I can't express how thankful I am for every one of your videos.
I was raised in a Catholic family and never really questioned anything, I was living in a comfortable bubble with everything fluffy about religion ignoring all the bad stuff, but as I grow older I discovered my attraction to woman rather than man and that is what led me to questioning my bubble of comfort.
For a long period of time I was living in constant stress, fear and guilt. I was constantly judging myself for my attraction and questioning my religion.
This is when I discovered your channel, it helped me to step back form all of those emotions, being able to see all the flaws in my beliefs (which resulted in me becoming an atheist) and accepting my sexualitity. It was not an easy process but with your videos, as well as support from my friends I was able to move on.
Not long after, I was faced with another problem, do I keep pretending or tell the truth? This video reminded me of that time when I was living in over-load. For about a year I was still coming to church to satisfy my family. But living in a constant lie led me to believe that my family will never love me for who I am.
It was scary, but I decided to at least tell them about me being an atheist. Even if they perceive this as my "rebellious phase" I'm happy that they don't force me into anything. I was able to rebuild my trust with them and even though they disagree with my point of view, they respect it and acknowledge that this is my decision and that they won't be living my live.
Firstly allowing myself tho question, accepting my new pinot of view and also telling others about it with confidence was something that I've learned mostly thanks to your content. I know that I'm one in the sea of many who shared even more drastic situations than my own, I just wanted to say: Thank you so much for your work
Hey TheraminTrees,
I just want to tell you that your videos have helped me a lot in making sense of to me otherwise inexplainable behaviors of the people around me
you should start adding timestamps in the description for each "chapter" in your videos.
These videos would have done wonders on my mental health 15 years ago, when could have really used these.
A short time ago I attempted to have a conversation with my, somewhat narcissistic, mother about the way she treated my brother and I when we were young and defenceless. I don't feel it is appropriate to go into detail about the abuse, but it was mostly psychological in nature.She began with denials, quickly moved to belittling my claims and when she couldn't deny the things that I was saying, she made it a contest between what she did to us and what she had received from her immigrant parents. Then she attacked my slightly older brother for his character flaws and failed relationships (with three different types of abusers I might add), I promptly called out this flagrant distraction. She then physically removed herself from the conversation, slamming a door in my face; and when I spoke softly and calmly through the door, I believe she blocked her ears and started making sounds like a little girl. She then said that I had gone too far and told me to stop before it was too late.
Later that evening, after she had processed this transgression, I was summoned to be lectured in front of her and my father (usually a complete enabler). She claimed to be hurt by what I had said and demanded I explain myself to my father, after I did this, my father for once did not agree with her version of the situation and he payed for that later (She drove him to tears). She then ripped apart my character for 40 minutes, this was disguised as a reality check. I apparently thought I was better than them and I had no empathy, I was to be punished by having her not do anything for me ever again... (I was 17 without my license and still in school)
However, she has made this threat repeatedly whenever I have transgressed against her in the past and it usually takes about a week before she demands an apology and I fawn contrition, then she proceeds as if nothing has ever happened. Though I had thought I had gone too far and overestimated my ability to have a rational conversation with her about elements of my childhood which were troubling me, this occasion was not different in her mind and I believe she has scrubbed it from her consciousness by now as she continues with daily life, unscathed. As long as she regains control and everyone in the family gets in line and kisses the ring, everything is dandy. But she will turn on you in 5 minutes if you push the right buttons and talk about anything that matters to her ego.
My mother is liked by most around her (Though I have begun to notice cracks) and she is often a pleasant person to be around, as long as it is on her terms and you never defy her. I begin to doubt myself and think I am forming some monstrous imago of her to compensate for my own character flaws, but I am reminded occasionally when it rears its ugly head and I am sent ducking for cover.
I am ambivalent about leaving, as where I live is expensive and there is significant financial gain from sticking it out in my family home. It is not unbearable, but I know the longer I leave it, the more difficult she will make it. However once I leave, I will not be coming back, so I may as well make the most of the material support while I have it, because whilst they may have sacrificed our psychological health, my parents have always provided materially.
It is not all doom and gloom! My brother and I are on track to get educated, have meaningful careers and hopefully not repeat the mistakes of our parents.
Many many targets will recognise these behaviours. The crazy contest of who had the worse abuse; the infantile tantrums; the deflections; the triangulation, bringing in a mediator .... who'd better take the abuser's side, or else; and the sweeping away of the incident afterwards. Yep, abusers seem to believe they can smash a plate endlessly and it will always come back together. I wish you and your brother well as you bide your time before leaving for life on your own terms.
@@TheraminTrees Thank you
No idea why UA-cam recommended me this video, but I am glad I watched this video.
These videos literally turned my life around. Wondering why the people around me try twisting me around and give me an onslaught of double binds.
I feep happier while simultaneously making them hate me for being happy.
I just realized months ago when I came out as agnostic when my dad said "So you think you can do better than God right?" is a form of emotional blackmail.
Christianity has taught that no one is above God and to say yes to that question would be blasphemy.
It's a question used to incite fear, not introspection. And you know what, yea.
Given God's track record in the bible, I think a lot of people would be more qualified to be God. I don't think any healthy person who loves people would subject another person to a hellish life by enabling a devil to destroy him, if that healthy person can do something about it.
If God is perfectly willing to do this, what's stopping him from commiting all sorts of evil and still labelling himself as good?
I mean I get that cults have their internal sayings and phrases that don't make sense to outsiders, but that question just seems so nonsensical to me.
I am very glad that videos like this exist because they are incredibly informative and enlightening. Although, I always find myself worrying that the people who need to see these the most only absorb what helps their position as the victims. I think its extremely important to not only understand why other people are harmful but why you, as an individual, are as well since, as humans, we all fall prey to the same spectrum of faults.
This channel is criminally underrated
This comment is criminally underliked.
I was once a JW and these videos help me so much.....
"coping with other people's coping mechanisms", also known as "my childhood" ^w^
the keyhole compassion reminds me so much of people telling me to see my abusive dad again, or saying they think I'll want to see him someday
Trying to apply simplistic emotional shortcuts to complex situations can leave us locked in pain and ignorance.
I like that one.
PLEASE! I BEG YOU! Keep making these videos! They’ve been helping me though really tough times in my family, I still can’t leave my house! I have to stay here for at least 3 more years! And these videos are helping me.
Hugs from Brazil.