Saw your raid ranking video. Really good. I consider myself a casual but I did a bit of raiding in SB. Even though I’m casual I still like to heal/tank and dps optimally. Your guides are really good. Which data centers you play on? I’m in Chaos and Elemental.
@@monrepos1001 I actually had that initially too.. now I enjoy it way more than dps. I just feel like I know what I'm supposed to be doing and what my job is more than when I was a dps. Dps felt like I was just kinda.. present.. and tagging along
I disagree with "if you pull it you tank it" being strictly bad if a tank cant survive extra adds because his or the healers gear can't keep him alive and a dps/healer picks up extra adds and then everyone dies that helps no one and pisses of everyone sometimes ends in people getting vote kicked.
I'm going to be controversial and say that I prefer tanks with a good sense of pacing. The ones who always have sprint on cool down, pulling wall to wall, and never waiting for the party to catch up before initiating a boss are my least favorite tanks. A tank should be considerate of the party. If you have a new person watching cut scenes, let them watch and wait for them. Give that new player a good experience. If its all level synced players then and all are skipping cut scenes then go fast but never leave anyone behind. It is a team based experience and a tank should be a team player.
as a one trick healer I don't really mind single pack or W2W but what irks me is when the tank seems like he's stopping so we can kill the trash, I burn cooldowns, the DPS burn cooldowns, and then the tank just yeets off again
i agree on the cutscenes part. but far as the rest goes ... the party needs to adjust to the optimal playstyle (not the other way around). if theyre trailing far behind, this can be a good teaching moments for them to learn how the game is played (most of the time). after a few pulls they will learn that once the trash is down is time to jet again
The tank should be allowed to take it easier too though. Tanks/Healers are the limiting factor for most queues and if they always have to be on their A game they're simply not going to run those dungeons as often as they might otherwise. Their fun matters too. It is the tanks right to set pacing (within reason) and its not ok to just bully them into your pace. It's the people rushing the group (note: not the same as pulling a stray mob or two here and there) who have the biggest egos not the tanks. While it's good to maintain a growth mindset and aim to be as responsible as possible, the game is not your job and your desire to take it slow is equally as legitimate as their desire to go faster. If you're always the one having to adjust to others and not the other way around you're not getting a fair deal and that's when you use whatever leverage you have. For tanks that is simply not saving their ass every time. "You pull it you tank it bro; oh wait now my willing participation in the game matters to you again? Who knew."
It's so stupid, it's the usual god complex of tanks and DPS, they want to run ASAP as if their whole life depends on it, chill out and enjoy the gameplay no matter how repetitive it is, it's not yours exclusively ffs it's called team for a reason so don't ruin others experince for your own convenient.
@@PutraRhm I'd agree normally, HOWEVER If you have the gear to be pulling a dungeon wall to wall, there is absolutely no reason you shouldn't be doing so.
@@CrowYaeger dude the reason I said "experience" in the first place should give you a good image on what I mean by it. Not all people finished the dungeon, some are still new and want to experience the story, this is a common sense. It's not sprout's problem that these speedruners don't have friend, don't get mad when we play slow, you play in duty finder ffs which is why I said it's not an exclusive place for these selfish losers that only care for themselves, good thing many veteran know how to understand others, if others play slow, veteran will adjust.
@@PutraRhm Something needs to be clarified here. The argument you're trying to give only works on lower level dungeons, and I'd agree with you to some extent. However if you're in a endgame dungeon (Expert Roulette), 9 times out of 10 people are going to want that shit to finished asap. You can only use the "Think of the sprouts!" excuse so many times to give yourself a reason to go at a snails pace.
@@KorthGunnar of course, it's called end game for a reason. Many people just repeating the same thing on end game where bigger rewards and challanges are given, no way they even considering playing on old content other than helping sprouts since they're bored or just want to find new friends.
One time I was queueing with 2 dps friends on my dark knight, got Brayflox Hard and a sprout scholar. Me being a complete idiot ran ahead and pulled everything I could (which is a lot in that dungeon), started rolling cooldowns while aoeing, while I did have to use every single cooldown I had, we all lived through that experience. Checked the scholar's gear after, was mostly itemlevel 30 to 70, with a few 90s. Not sure if s/he was an alt of a more experienced player, but I was genuinely impressed. Then on the other side of the coin I've had 400ilvl white mages in Holminister Switch that couldn't heal me on the first couple pulls so there's that.
100% agree that if you keep wiping because the rest of the party can't keep up with the pace you're used to that's on *you* not them. Some parties are unsalvageable (skip potion ppl) but the vast majority of the playerbase is still learning the game well into lvl 70s and has no interest in being 100% optimal every run. Not adapting to that in pugs is just a waste of everyone's time.
Hm. Analyzing the healer on the first pull makes so much more sense than just super pulling/wall to walling constantly. I feel bad for some of my healers now haha.
@RJ-jams I usually do at the start of a dungeon! If they don’t respond I assume they’re comfortable healing and just super pull. Otherwise I would watch their mana and pull depending on what I see. I know how it feels as a healer because I choose to play scholar as my first job! Its alright though if we wipe as I’ll take the blame. As I feel the tank should control the pace of the party to take into account what everyone is capable of. Like if DPS is lacking, or the healer is having trouble keeping up.
@@dovaiS or maybe they just don't understand what a pull is, not all players care about tank and their cult of god complex activity of rushing dungeons, many play just to enjoy the good time eve if it's slow, many tanks and DPS are just bunch of selfish bastard, I'm just being real about it.
My favorite part of the dungeon, hands down, is when a good tank does a cautious first pull and then just thunders off doing wall-to-walls because they know I can take damn near anything they dish out. It’s so gratifying. That being said, tanking one of my first dungeons (I tanked a lot in WoW so it wasn’t completely new), the healer kept running off and bringing adds to me without asking. I *completely* disagree that this is okay. I tanked everything they brought and didn’t argue with them because I wanted things to go smoothly, but as a tank, especially as a sprout, I need to feel like I’m managing the situation, and it really threw me off.
i think the only time ive enforced the "you pull it, you tank it" rule, is when i was first leveling paladin. I was extremely undergeared during an aery run and for whatever reason the healer after i told them that i needed to stay small kept pulling large for me. The few times i tried to pull it together, would cost me an invuln and usually a death mid pull. After telling the dude to stop, i just stopped hitting anything he would try to pull to me. Sure i got berated for it, but when a tank says they cant pull large??? fucking take their word for it?? edit: this was during heavensward
I agree completely. It’s not as black and white as “whatever the healer says they can heal is correct.” Pulling big pulls still relies on the tanks ability to keep aggro with all of them and use the correct cool downs and not all tanks are comfortable doing that. I’ve been blamed for being an “ego tank” so many times just because I asked to go slower...
Sleepy Lycan Enmity really should not be an issue given that you do not have to turn off tank stance anymore. Moreover, rotating cooldowns is inconsequential if the healer explicitly states that they can handle the pulls as they’re most likely anticipating periods of vulnerability. As a person who both tanks and heals, I can firmly state the healer is the one who effectively dictates the pace. If they can keep you alive in spite of it all, there’s no reason for concern.
As a healer i do this often but if the previous pack is nearly done or if the tank is capable enough to handle the pull. Never force a pull if you dont have understanding of a tank's capabilities
Doughboy You make a solid point, but enmity is still an issue. An inexperienced tank can lose enmity to an experienced DPS very easily. My point is that everyone isn’t an experienced and confident tank. This is especially the case since class jumps have become available. I believe the pace of the party should be communicated and decided by the party as a whole not just the healer.
I play healer through two expansions so I've met tanks in majority of my dungeon and trial experiences. And I have to say that the best tanks I've ever had are the ones that are aware of their party. They pull according to party capabilities, they group mobs, use CDs, pick a spot and let em rip. It really isn't difficult but it takes awareness (and no big egos) and you will make the run so much better and faster. Like, don't run away after stopping for a few seconds. A NIN might've already dropped a ground aoe or a WHM is already halfway their Holy cast. Dodge smart so mobs aoe cones won't ever hit your party. Don't switch positions too erratically so as to not mess up your MNK/DRG positionals all the time. Its these things that differentiate a great tank vs. regular ones.
I dislike when tanks are planning to pull more but keep *pausing* for seconds along the way, so I think - ok they are stopping here - and I put out my ground AoE (when I have one) and start my AoE rotation - then they are off and running again - so now I have less CDs when they do finally stop. Some tanks seem to think the group should stay behind and finish off mobs first and then run and join them which puzzles me as dps want the packs as big as possible and I'm not here to pick up after you. My rule is I don't want to stop running till the tank stops running. When I see a tank who keeps moving and groups it all up I am very happy. Even better if they don't spin things too much for my DRGN. When I see a tank who knows her party, keeps moving, groups things up and lets me do a good dps AoE rotation it is really a pleasure.
The only time I’ve ever done the you pull it you tank it was when I was running with a friend who was new to healing and under geared and struggling. One of the dps didn’t appreciate that I was going at a slower pace and grabbed the next pack, died, complained and got chewed out by the others for being an ass.
@@flareCao If you feel like you know more then do tell me your lecture, whether my statement hit the nail on your head as a DPS or you just don't get what I mean apparently, my point is plain and simple, do you forget tank also start from a newbie that don't even know the basic and undergear? DPS act like they can handle the whole world and blame tank when they died, no matter the intention is whether it's to initiate tank to do pull or to give a sign to speedrun the dungeon, they don't even consider other people and follow Lynx's second statement. It's selfish af and not all people want to follow those kind of experience, it's bad enough if tank force others to pull, especially coming from a DPS that inherently selfish even in their utility.
"Tanks in FF14 have a huuugeee ego!" I was unaware of this "As I'm usually the tank in dungeons" until recently when I decided to lvl a dragoon for the heck of it. Oh boy! The best part is the worse their tanking is, the bigger their egos are lol! Another great video though.
I'm right there with you! I usually either tank or heal with a tank buddy and thought "people are really pleasant in this game!". Well, I was running AST and solo queued for the lvling roulette. Got Haukke Manor. The tank wasn't doing super big pulls, so I was dpsing/dealing cards while toping off his health when he got around 50% without much trouble. In the middle of a fight (before 1st boss), he actually took the time to type out "more heals less dps lol". As Lynx suggested, I took it as "Challenge Accepted" time. But, instead of keeping him topped off all the time, I decided to see how often I could let his health get as low as possible before healing him up. He never died and he kept quiet the rest of the dungeon. Hopefully that'll teach him to not get on the bad side of the healer!
@@theparodywizard677 I mean we do control who lives and who dies. But a lot of healers do get full of themselves too. I only pull that when someone is being rude to others.
definitely not defending it but i think that whole "you spank it, you tank it" mentality came from when threat and tp management were a thing in this game. all dps and healers had a way to reduce threat and if they out-geared you, and they pulled threat, someone wasn't doing something correctly. getting and holding threat is ridiculously easy in shadowbringers now, so that way of thinking shouldn't really exist anymore. this is coming from someone who's played all roles since 2.0. for new tanks, i would add the "know your toolkit" advice. pick a tank you'd like to play and learn about it to be more efficient and effective with it. drk's TBN costs the same amount of mp as edge/flood of shadow, and procs a "free" edge/flood, when it pops, so you don't need to TBN, when it's just down to 1 or 2 mobs. war's nascent flash needs a second person to cast it on, so maybe macro it, also shares a CD timer with raw intuition. vengeance does dmg back to the mobs, has to be physical dmg to proc. shake it off strips certain defensive CDs to boost the mitigation. pld's divine veil needs you to be healed to activate it (clemency or healer cast). don't be afraid to use clemency, especially if the healer is down and you and the one dps only have 10% left on the boss (i've only had to do this a few times and got all the commendations for saving the fight). gnb's aurora is a decent HoT to help mitigate dmg. they all generate resources for their job gauges differently. drk, gnb, and war generate through weaponskills, pld's through auto attacks. pld and drk also use mp, which they have weapon skills and an abilities that regen this. also, like the last part of this video, don't be afraid to get constructive criticism either, especially feedback from your healer. edit: if i forgot something, my bad. it's 4am when i typed this up...
"You pull it you tank it" if the healer is the one pulling me extras I take that as a green light since the healer clearly thinks he can heal me through it :) I'm less forgiving if the DPS are doing it. Still not letting them die, I want the dungeon done fast and letting them die makes it slower.
i 100% agree, my beef with dps doing the pulls is then i have to run around grabbing aggro instead of just having everything on me which in turn makes it slower IMO
I've done that a couple times as healer, when our tank was obviously very good and I had no problems healing, but man, it still made me feel like an asshole hahaha
I usually as a healer ask the tank if they want to pull more, cause if I know the dungeon and I think I have it under control then if the tank is comfortable then why not pull more, also if I think the tank pulls to much in a specific dungeon then I tell them to slowdown. But I never pull myself more, not purpousefully at least, but if it happens I just run to the tank like: "Hey buddy, could you help me here? Please..."
I LOVE it when a healer pulls. They're literally telling me 'You can pull more, I can handle it." I like to pull hard, pull loud and pull with the door wide open baby, these are my kind of healers!
You could say the same about DPS pulling though "You just slap your aoe buttons mr tank, I will evaporate them before your defensive ends" Im more bothered by the guy saying its all ego with the "you pull it you tank it" where it could as easily be seen as the dps or whoever going "I DGAF about your fun, enjoyment, or comfort level, i just want my rewards ASAFP so move jackass" in which case i wholeheartedly say they can go fuck themselves :)
I've always struggled with tanking, but lately, I've been feeling encouraged to improve, so the timing of your guides is awesome. The part about "you pull you tank" was especially enlightening since I always saw it as a failure on my part, so I like looking at it as a challenge. All great tips to start incorporating into my mindset! Keep up the awesome content.
That’s a wonderful mentality to have @Alexie. Keep it up, you’re going to be a wonderful tank with that mindset. If Ever on Chaos or Elemental, hit me up if you ever need a healer or DPS. I’m Einin
Biggest thing I can do for improving from this is learning to roll my cooldowns. I tend to just pop them as I need them. I do pop them consistently tho
I found this very helpful as well extremely helpful when Lynx mentioned it also in the video. I still had to ponder 🤔 it, but it made a lot of sense. Even coming from WoW as a Tank there fir many years, the experience helps in FF, yet some tactics can also be very different and a point to learn game specific tactics. I’ll be rolling some my specific cool down more.
As a dps I would never try and pull before the tank. I just don’t think it’s a smart thing to do. I would rather go through a dungeon following the tanks lead than charging through myself and killing us all, and cutting minutes off our run if the tank isn’t up to it for whatever reason. I’m not trying to say you’re wrong, just my thoughts on it.
I agree. Yet not all Tanks are the same. I just speak as a former WoW Tank of a decade plus. In the situation where you often group with a Tank in a group or specific party you come as a group member to learn that Tank play-style or some their tactics. In such a setting you will learn and know what you can do as a DPS or Healer maybe. I always say to people I regularly play with if your gonna pull anything, do a LOS pull. That’s line of sight of target with me as tank in the middle somewhere or close to it. That way I can see it the mob and try pick it up as it heads my way to you who tagged it. It’s a tactic I’m ok with as a Tank in WoW. FF can be different, but for me specifically I’m good with it if a DPS thinks for a sec and pulls a mob into my zone and I take it from there. Just know the players or tank your playing with is best I say.
@@ardentdfender4116 I get what you’re saying, but I think the default stance should be to follow your tank and not pull, because then there will be no one getting pissed or whatever. I just don’t see the point in pulling as a dps or healer, unless the tank asks you to for some reason. I just personally could not give two shits if the tank wants to pull big or small, my job is to kill them asap as a dps, or heal and dps as healer.
Another killer video, man! Keep it up & dont be afraid of longer videos. Everyone has there preferance but definitely nothing wrong with a 20-30 minute videos either. Individual quick 5 minute break downs of end game content/tank guide/mechanic guide for your channel would be awesome to see too. Another "thumbs up"!
@@NamesLynx Longer videos are totally Ok or commentary to convey knowledge from a vastly more experienced Tank to younger Tanks. Because there is so much you have forgotten that many may not know as it relates to FF14.
I'm going to get flamed for this, but here it is: Don't pull extra mobs into the tank face on your own accord. Is not about ego, is about being considerate, if you feel the tank can take more mobs, talk it with him but don't decide for him. For a lot of people tanking can be stressful and unless they feel comfortable with the job, throwing him more mobs into his face is not a nice thing to do, even if they can handle it. Specially in some leveling dungeons in which doing wall to wall pulls can often result in failures since they aren't as easy as the expert dungeons. A problem with this game is that people don't talk with each other being a social game and in situations like these communications can help a lot. Yeah, you can waste 30 seconds of a run to talk things, is ok, you will survive. So talk with the tank, guide him if necessary so you can save those precious 5 minutes of the run, but don't be disrespectful about it.
I understand where you're coming from and the idea of "tankxiety" has been around since before ffxiv. My point was directed towards those tanks that get offended or upset when people pull ahead of them, the situation you're describing is easily fixed by a tank saying at the start of the dungeon "hi i'm new / inexperienced / uncomfortable / anxious and would prefer smaller pulls to ease my way into tanking if that's okay." I'm all for being respectful and considerate, I think most people would read that and say okay no problem, and if they don't and continue to pull massive for the tank then nothing you would've done was going to stop them anyways. My issue is directed specifically towards the egotistical tanks that see themselves above everyone else. I've been tanking long enough to be fully aware that we get 100% of the blame when a mistake happens so it makes perfect sense people would have "tankxiety" until they've tanked enough times to be comfortable :)
@@NamesLynx Sadly people never speak up about how new they are or their lack of experience in the game. Especially since you can boost to 70 and fly by the seat of your pants through all the story. I personally am not a fan of people pulling for me, and will ask them not to if I'm new to a dungeon (granted this rarely happens). The big thing is that people can get carried so hard in the game they have no clue that they are playing poorly and not using any tank cds at all. If you try to tell them that, suddenly they get crazy defensive. In short dps and healers IMO shouldn't pull extra without even asking the tank if they can handle more. It takes seconds to ask them that. Just pulling for them seems rude. Communication goes so far in this game.
Great video, really does a fantastic job of summarizing how I like to tank and what's most optimal. Sometimes when my healer isn't as good/geared whatever and I need to use extra cooldowns I'll switch to mostly small/medium pulls, but then go for a large pull on my powerful cooldown timings. I feel like a lot of tanks get into the mindset of it has to be one or the other between small and big pulls, when in reality it's just situational. Extra thing I'd add is that as a tank you should be looking out for/mitigating boss tankbusters/AoE attacks when you can, and if you've got cooldowns up there's nothing wrong with just mitigating some autos. If you're not thinking specifically about saving something for the next pull then there's a decent chance you can use it to ease healer burden a bit. And while this is kind of implied in CD rotation, I just want to scream about one of my personal pet peeves: Hallowed Ground is a CD, Superbolide is a CD, and during the course of a dungeon they pretty much give you 2-3 free big pulls and should be used accordingly. Nowadays I tend to just specifically ask the tank to invuln the next pull (with Pally or GB) because it lets me do so much more DPS and most tanks won't proactively use them otherwise. And to all the Paladins spamming Clemency because they're dropping low from no heals, I'm not needing to heal you because you keep using Clemency. I'm not saying there isn't a time and place for it, but presumably if your healer isn't spam healing you and is using AoEs it's because they've got you. I feel far more safe with a healer spamming their DPSs tools then one who basically just focus heals me because I know the mobs will die faster and there will be less of a need for healing/cooldowns overall (and less risk of running out of MP), and it's usually a tell of healer comfort. Yeah, you'll wipe sometimes, but pushing your limits this way as both a tank and a healer gives the repetitive dungeon grind in this game so much more interest and depth. And as one final aside: Stand in the healer's bubble and pull mobs into the Ninja/Summoner's circle. That will make them very happy and make your life easier and your run faster. Missing AST's star heal especially can cause a wipe if they were counting on it. Sometimes it can't be helped but if you're going for a big pull try to keep moving forwards, or at least posturing like you're going to keep moving forwards, so you don't bait CDs from your party. I hope your videos really spread and help out tanks in this game. You've got awesome content man, looking forward to more. Keep it up.
I'm a main tank in XIV, and I want to say you did a very good job with this guide !! All these points you mentioned are not taught by the game but they are very important. I think in my years of playing I've seen the counter-exemple of every single points you talk about. I remember when I was leveling white mage, my first healer, when I reached lvl 50 for a roulette I ended up in Amdapor Castle. I was rather inexperienced and not super comfortable with healing yet, and I had crappy lvl 50 gear. Yet the tank decided to pull wall to wall, and after the second time he died he left the dungeon angrily. So yes, seeing how your healer handles the first pull is very important. Pulling packs of mobs one by one goes faster than pulling everything and wiping over and over again. So again good job for giving all these tips!! The one little thing I would add is part of the ego problem, and it's the aggro fighting in Alliance raids. Getting the boss provoked every 30s just makes tanking not enjoyable for me, especially when you are the one who pulled the boss but you are the one being yelled at for aggro fighting. So guys, just relax and go OT.
It's funny the amount of times I thought "Well, duh," to myself while watching this video, only to remember that I've also been tanking for about 2 years now and still can recount the times that the rando healers/dps I played with would chew me out for doing things like not using my cd's during big pulls or bad positioning, etc. I can honestly say they weren't enjoyable experiences, but they definitely helped push me into the right mentality and I'm honestly happy to say this video affirmed that for me 😊
I have been maining a Warrior for almost a year now and I found this guide to still be helpful. Using longer cooldowns first is a brilliant idea I will adjust which cooldowns I use in what order. Rotating the enemies less and dodging AOEs by moving less is also something I will work on. Thanks for the tips.
just started tanking, and this is actually super helpful. I've been going off of my impressions as a deeps main, and it's good to know some of those initial gut vibes weren't leading me wrong, lol
Thank you for advising tanks to not pull when fighting low health mobs. Had a tank do this. I spammed lucid dreaming on cooldown and got dangerous low on mp.
I’m so glad Lynx mentioned this. As a somewhat still new player to FF leveling my first time thru, I was completely CLUELESS as to how regen mechanics work both in and especially out of combat. It wasn’t until he talked about it that I learned about it and that’s important to me also as a leveling tank. There are many things like this newer tanks need to know that other more veteran players may take for granted in knowledge and knowing things.
First video I’ve watched of yours and it’s a great piece of content. Great length too, you were quick and concise and 10 minutes is the sweet spot for me. I’m a new player up through Stormblood now having played only tanks and still watch stuff like this just to get other player perspectives. I’ve grown a lot as a tank and I’d like to think I’m pretty decent at it now, going from single pulling Totorak (sorry early groups) to wall to walling most dungeons. One piece of advice that I really liked is to own up to your mistakes. You’re right that you’ll save time by not starting fights with party members, it’s served me well haha. Just adapt to the party you’re given.
i recently picked up DRK after main-ing BLM and while I am struggling with 'tankxiety', it feels so good to be able to pull of a wall-to-wall. i really appreciated this advice, and will def be taking it to heart! hoping to be geared and confident in tanking in time for 5.3.
good stuff man, one of the main reasons why my highest tank is only 60 is because of the tank pressure at high end levels. I dont wanna get far into a raid and then mess one thing up and everyone gets one shot lmao. This guide kinda helps quell the anxiety so thanks man, earned a sub.
I've literally had my head chewed off for saying everything you've said 100%. This video is really going to piss people off. I've been tanking like this for years.
love these guides, can tell tanking is near and dear to your heart. some great advice here, from a moderately experienced tank at this point, thanks for these.
Context context context. A rogue aoe pulling an extra mob is forgiveable and as a tank I can pick it up and blow some cooldowns to help healers manage a little easier. However if the dps, without warning just decides to pull extra stuff putting extra strain on the healer and the flow of the dungeon becomes a shitshow I'm sorry "You pull it you tank it" is justified. Idk where you got this "just adds an extra level of challenge" mentality from but I will not condone asshattery because some red mage is doped up on gfuel and if their heartrate drops below a certain percentage they die. Communication is key and just blindly assuming the tank is okay with extra shit being pulled is not fucking cool.
I just started my tanking journey less than a week ago . It’s a rush of adrenaline and a sense of power. But I have had many good and bad experiences with other tanks and with that I have been considerate of everyone. I try my very best to let everyone know I am learning and I wait for my party . It really helps to play all roles so you can understand different perspectives and experiences
Wish I had this video when I first dipped my toes into tanking. This is very well explained and even now I learned a bunch of stuff. I was used to the idea of a tank deciding the pace of the dungeon as well as "if you pull it, you tank it", but upon further examination, they're pretty dumb. It's happened to me quite a number of times that, as a DPS or healer, I end up stealing aggro and I don't mind as long as I can use my cooldowns and survive it. It's specially fun when we almost wipe and I'm a ranged DPS, so I just kite the mobs until they're dead or the tank comes back. If a tank is pulling one mob at a time and I know I can deal with a straggler, I'll just pull them in and tank them while I get them to the tank's AoE. I used to feel bad about this despite knowing I could handle it, because "the tank did not allow it", but I won't anymore. It's a group content and the tank is not the only one with a say. If the others are okay with it, I'll do it.
Absolutely loved it. Great job Lynx! As of me tanking dungeons, my personal habit is to use my 90s first and use smaller cds for the first pull and leave the 120s for the second pack since my 90s will be back up for the third pull and probably not vice versa (depends on how fast mobs die of course), but that’s entirely my habit anyway, great vid! Keep up the good work
Yeah, this my mentality too. In situations were you need double CDs my mentality on the second CD flips though, simply because I feel Arm's Length is stronger than Reprisal, so it makes sense to me to combine it with the weaker 20÷ reduction, as opposed to the stronger 30÷. If push comes to shove I've always got my invulnerability button anyway. Though as Pally I will tend to just straight up use Hallowed Ground as a primary CD for the first massive pack of mobs. Get that skill on CD faster since I'll be able to use it again for a mob pack before the end of a dungeon and there's no downsides to using it other than the killer CD. Superbolide I like too since it can be used a similar way but you need to make your healer aware since it's use is a bit more nuanced. I find Holmgang and Living Dead more "save for emergency" situation based though; Seems Holmgang frequently bugs out, and Living Dead is incredibly tricky to use right. With both skills you'll also still take damage too so it's not like they can always really give your healer a breather the way Sanctuary and Superbolide will.
I thank you for making these videos I’ve been a bard main for 3 years only just moving to dancer this year when I got shadow bringers and I’ve really been wanting to get into tanking
I watched this video right when I switched to Dark Knight, after putting off tanks for so long, and am now maining DK since its so fun. This vid helped me with tank mentality quite a bit, and even got me to play my dps and healer roles far better now that I've finally done tanking and understand the role, how much damage mitigation is really there, and even the section on checking gear I do even when not tanking to have an idea how well equipped everyone is and (Especially when I'm healer) how much I should focus on damage and how much I should focus on healing. Thanks for the great guide, Lynx! Haven't gotten shit for being a "bad" tank yet thanks to you and your guides!
Great tips. I started as a bard a year ago now, and just started to learn tanking four days ago as a dark knight. In many ways a tank is the antithesis of a bard, so I was really nervous to try it out. The fear of responsibility being the biggest concern. I'm still sticking to the levelling dungeons (I've run Haukke Manor so many times now that I almost actually know where I'm going), but I know I'll have to hit the endgame sooner or later. I'll remember this advice when the time comes
I loved the hints about analyzing the gear and the first pull. And you said to recognize your own mistakes I could only think how I always blame myself when my group dies lol. I believe this tells a lot about my personality
As a tank main I look up to your information and tips more then any tank I’ve come across. After watching your videos I have such a boost of motivation and confidence. Thanks bro. You’re the man.
Thank you for all these guides! I've been tanking since I came back to this game a few months ago and still have zero confidence in most dungs and raids. Your guides have been super helping!
@@amKozy Sorry for the late reply, I don''t know any tanking guides for specific fights off the top of my head but without self promoting too hard I upload most of my clears on youtube so if you want to have a basic overview of what a fight looks like from my perspective you can search through those. I didn't upload 5-7 but they are highlighted on my twitch channel if you go to my vods. I'll make a video going over my approach to new content next week, so that might be able to help you out as well.
I don’t like fast tanking but I’m still new to mmos and I know and can pull as much as I can, I find blazing over large the dungeon overwhelming. I hate when I’d tell the party I’m new and the party pulls more then I’m prepared for. It maked me panic and self conscious. Prolly gonna watch your other vid re that but I love raid tanking but if I’m not doing a dungeon with a friend, I stick to my trust for now.
Lynx Kameli I can’t help but think that raiding and dungeon use wildly different parts of my brain 🧠 haha But yeah it’s totally got me thinking how best to improve so can handle this way of playing. Might see if I can form a party finder as seems odd to just subject a roulette to my fumbles haha
i'm a new guy (still in ARR) and love the tank but was always intimidated by it. your videos have been very helpful. even with them being more "advanced" tips. they definitely help me out in lower lvl dungeons as well. thanks man. keep up the great work!!
Not yet, i had no idea my channel would grow this quickly and was intending to work on it slowly over time. Once my next video is out and i have free time I’ll work on it, so expect it to be created some time next week
Amazing guide. I've been learning to tank for quite some time since I've finished the msq and lvled my healers to 80. I always found the mentally of u pull it u tank it quite silly. It just makes runs a lot less fun. Glad I've been consistent with most of the basics listed in this video :D
tbh, this is one of the best videos I've seen for dungeon tanking. Literally every point I wanted you to bring up, you did. Such as, "Examine the gear of your group before starting to pull wall-2-wall as the healer/dps might not be able to beat the threshold, use the first pull as a test to examine the rate of the run. As a tank, don't be afraid to fail, try to go beyond what you think your limits are, try your best. If you fail, simply be like "I misjudged our collective aoe dmg output relative to our healing and dmg mitigration, apologies, will slow down gradually now, if none has any greater objections." Then move on with the next pull, if you don't attempt to go past your limits, you'll never improve as you never challenge yourself. Only improvement I'd have is to make a mention of "Arm's length" it gives a slow to anyone auto-attacking you, and slow lowers attack-speed, so less auto-attacks on you, it's NOT heavy since the tooltip doesn't explain what slow is, a lot of people make assumptions its making your movement speed slow, not your attack speed. And yes, I know, I know, this is a more advanced guide that gives you tip on how to tank *effectively* rather than "how to *tank*". But I find this specific cooldown to be quite vital to a decently run dungeon run
Randomly came across your tanking videos while searching for some tips and tricks, thanks ya for the content and il be sure to pass your name to anyone needing advice! Cheers :D
Hey man just wanted to say this video has eased my mind on tanking. I was always afraid of not performing to everyone's expectations as a tank but this video has put some of those fears to rest :) thank you
Ehi, thx for your tips and tricks. I’ve started playing as a tank three days ago (first I was dps and healing) and I find really funny play as tank. I saw many mistakes I usually do, like pull extra mobs or spinning around without caring about melee DPS and I’ll work on those. For my opinion, I don’t think the primary role of a tank is making wall-to-wall pulls and make faster dungeons. Maybe I think like this, only because I’m still at Sb’s content and maybe I’ll change my mind...probably lol. At least, now I know why a healer told me “clear the area. You can’t wait dc’d people while looking around”. Oh, I agree with you when you saying about tank’s ego!! Thanks again for all your videos about tanking!! They are really helpful!!
It's generally accepted that 2 packs is a standard pull, single packs can practically be done without heals and there's very few instances in the current lv80 dungeons where a wall to wall pull can't be done by a low item level healer. - The first pull in Akademia Anyder. - The last pull in Anamnesis Anyder. Also, it's incredibly important to properly clump mobs together and turn the pack from the party. Not only because some mobs have cleaves, but it usually keeps stray aoe from forcing the dps and heals to move. Monk just needs to put on the Twin Snakes buff, but they don't need positionals beyond that. Just make sure not to guide enemies out of things like the ASTs Earthly Star or NINs Doton.
Well glad to know I was doing that last tip really well haha. Usually more often than not if I end up getting killed in a really big pull the first thing I say is "ay you that was probably my b." and people are usually pretty chill about it.
I just started tanking and pulling a lot of mobs always scared me but this has helped me not be afraid to pull more, and even if we wipe I'll be learning the limits, thank you
It's normal to be nervous at first, especially since tanking has such a high barrier to entry. But trust me, once you get it down, people will love you for it and you'll feel like a speed demon zipping through dungeons haha
Thank you for the video! I'm very new to tanking (learning drk) and even just watching your background clips I see there's a lot I definitely need to change up! I had my first set of really poor runs yesterday which is why i started searching on how to tank, where we just kept wiping. it was a combo of pulling too many mobs, and having healers (on 3 dungeons in a row) all say they were new/ unsure how to play class so not performing too well. What made situations worse was my lack of knowing a particular dungeon well, so i'd go off trying to pick 2 lots of mobs at a time (thinking that'd be very manageable) and realizing that the second group was much larger than expected, or maybe more powerful than expected or something, so ended up for some cases, just going one room at a time. I felt SO bad about my performance as I always try to understand and pace with the party, but I guess I'm so used to other instances where people will pull mobs ahead of me that i developed the bad habit of just trying to agro everything possible before each boss fight. In the end, on each of those instances everyone was friendly and seemed to be understanding, but i definitely felt I had failed at my job. Seeing your tips like checking gear/hp of party and doing a trial pull at the beginning are absolutely things I'm going to try from now on!
Literally just picked up DRK today, and this has given me some good general tips for first time tanking. Probably should've picked WAR or something as a starting point to get used to it but, big ass swords amirite? If anyone has any other tips or something similar, don't be afraid to pop em in the comments, I'm gonna need em XD
I pretty much agreed with everything in this video with exception of two things. Wall to wall pulls because players want to get through and get out of the dungeon quickly. I disagree with this mentality because although this is a team based game it is a team effort and I cannot count the number of times ive been told (as a healer) were doing this because we dont need anything here so were just going to fly through. this road has two lanes. Personally if a tank runs off while im healing hes on his own til i get there. Second is the spank it you tank it line. While i do agree tanks have egos, they pale in comparison to the ignorance of the dps players. These yokels who go balls to the wall hitting whatever they want to pad thier dps numbers and dont care if the tank notices or not. Thing i hate most is the arrogant healers that run ahead and pull things and then whine like little girls that they died because the tank didnt pick up aggro... ok simply put you dont wanna be that statistic dipshit that died from over pulling let the tank do his damned job. This has been an issue ever since everquest and wow reared their ugly heads. Players dis the tanks for ego when the reason they got that ego was because the dps and healers made their lives hell in EVERY damned MMO
I tanked a lot during Stormblood, but fell off about a year ago. Been picking up tanking again and needed a good refresher and update for tanking in Shb. This was great for that. Thanks!
I wanted to say great tips and I agreed with the majority of the info shared. I somewhat disagreed with the ego thing. I can't speak for every player who prefers to tank. But from my perspective who play as all 3 roles, I don't see nor understand why any other roles other than the tank would want to purposely attract aggro to themselves, especially since that's pretty much one of the main purposes of the tank itself. If the tank is pulling all mobs to the wall, then I don't see any reason why it's needed for dps or healer to run ahead and pull more if the tank is on it's way to pick them up anyway. So one would probably say that a dps or healer running ahead to pull before the tank, has a huge ego as well. I don't think it's always a ego issue, I believe it's also a matter of trying not to bite off more than you can chew. And basically saying that "If you're not going to play to my or someone else's expectations, then I'm going to force you to and you should see it as a challenge", is hardly fair. While it may be okay and no problem for you, everyone learns and take on challenges at their own pace which should be ultimately left up to them in terms or how much or how fast they prefer to handle them. I personally don't mind if the dungeon goes fast or slow. When tanking, I prefer to take a few seconds at the start of the dungeon to ask if the group would prefer big or small pulls, which gives me a general idea of what everyone would be most comfortable with, rather than forcing everyone to play to my whim. I feel that as a community in final fantasy, we should do our best to try and play in such a manner that is more comfortable for everyone rather than trying to force other's into a particular style of playing.
Yes Yes and Yes I totally agree. You don't see any reason for a dps or healer to pull before tank because there really isn't one. Those who complain about the "you spank it, you tank it." are usually players who want to run wild, ignoring their roles and expect the tank and healer to account for their sloppiness without any complaints. It's NOT always a ego, it's simply a matter of playing your role. And this coming from someone who mains healer. I cannot stand it when dps continues to run ahead of the tank and pulling agro on themselves. With the exceptions of accidents or splash damage, there is no reason I should have to keep stopping to see why a dps is getting knocked around because they don't want to let the tank pull before them and stay out of trouble. I warn people twice and after that they become a sacrifice.
@@rosefire5130 Preach! I main tank myself. I don't care about players running wild or running ahead of me. My thing is let me grab agro first and then you can go as wild as you want to.
3:00 Haha yes! I was thinking the exact same thing just before you said it. I'm new to tanking but before I mained sch, so I can get a perspective from both sides.
New as a Tank in FF from WoW as a Tank there too with barely 3 days playtime in FF. Just at lvl 30 PLA. And since came across your vids just doing some search for FF i've been enjoying the vid's. Love this stuff.
9:47 OMG HUGE THANK YOU FOR SAYING THIS LOL. Im mainly a healer sometimes I encounter the wannabe egotistical elitist who is either tank or dps acting like they r top sht but then they fail to a mechanic and blame the healer. The blame game does not help you become a better player, taking accountability for your mistakes will.
Great video! I'm getting into tanking and tanking in dungeons kinda scares me, but this video definitely helped me gain some confidence. On the subject of owning your own mistakes, I have the opposite of a tank god complex lol. Every time I die, I always assume the fault lies with me haha
I'm learning tank and I'm happy I found this video. I never knew it was called wall to wall pulling, I just called it the super Saiyen pull 😆 but I'm happy you emphasized gauging the parties skill level tho because it is important. I remember one of the first dungeons I ever did last year ended badly. I main healer and it was crazy because the tank super saiyen pulled and I couldn't keep up. He was catching a big attitude with me and when I told him you're moving too fast, he said you need to keep up with me. Like dude I've only been playing for like 2 weeks. And he was moving too fast for the rest of the party too (we were all sprouts). Idk if this was bad but I ended up just healing the dps and let the tank run ahead. We all waited back as he was pulling mobs by himself and he died like 4 times before he realized we weren't supporting him. Then he left. Thankfully most tanks are very helpful and understanding and I want to emulate the same energy. But the guy sucked pretty bad
As a rule of thumb when you do a dj in ff xiv, watch the timer. A dj should take between 15 and 16mn on average(some are longer, some can go shorter), you should investigate if you have room for improvement first. Then if you feel like you have a clue about what went wrong but you have done a good job, you could get vocal about it but generally it doesn't work(I do that and I don't recommend it). Genreally lower clearspeed are due to: 1) healers no dpsing properly(it is the main issue generally, healer dps is quite notable), 2) dps players not knowing their rotations(it happens a lot), 3) tanks not pulling properly or doing their rotation. I really recommend trying to go as fast as possible, and probably use consummables if in premade as well. Leveling and grinding can be cut by a substantial margin.
I really enjoyed your video. I have only been playing FF14 for little over a year and it was my first MMO ever. I choose to main a tank, and so far the experience has been mostly good. I suffer a lot from tanxiety tho and tend to shy away from running dungeons unless absolutely necessary. I feel like being a tank your expected to lead in a way, but i don't feel like I can do that. I do like getting feedback and try to be familiar with the dungeon before going in. Anyways, liked and subscribed, keep up the good vids!
Great video! And I agree with all of your points! I do sometimes get irked when DPS runs off to pull next pack when the current pack is still alive, but I face it head on. "If we die, it's your fault. If we don't die, thank you for letting me know I am awesome!" There is that EGO!!! LOL I am hesitant to Tank extremes and Savage , even in learning parties, because I am subconsciously thinking "I don't want to waste ppl's time". But, that is more a me problem than a tanking one. I main PLD, but trying to learn DRK as well. I am no where NEAR to being Purple tank, but I still love tanking. Anyway, thank you for the awesome video! Sub'd + liked!
tbh I think the "you pull it, you tank it" mentality I gained from a friend who got me into FFXIV only really came into effect once, while I was still going through ARR-Heavensward. I'll say 'first time here' to the party but still get grilled for not pulling in dungeons that I knew nothing about at the time. (Though admittedly it has only happened 3 times in my time with the game) I'll gladly accept the challenge of bigger pulls in dungeons now, but as someone who has made a transition from Novice-Intermediate fairly recently, it helps knowing what your hard limit is when it comes to pulls before tank confidence rises. That said, a year and some change late, but I do agree with your provided lessons in tanking.
You got a great mentality. And what you said about taking it as a challenge rather than insult. That's 100% the only way to look at it or you're the trash can. This is the first game I've tanked in (always dps'd) so these tips have been really helpful. Wall to wall pulling is the only way to do it.
Several Months ago I saw this vid and still leveling as a PLD now at 65 as been playing on and off other games inbetween. This has helped me a lot! Just wanna say of the maybe 30+ FF14 UA-cam channels I watch, many more popular or bigger, none of them covers Tank mechanics, play tactics as half as good as you do. You should embrace the platform to convey what you know from high end tanking as well ranking in more vids that helps newer players like me a former WoW player learn how things work in FF. Because no other FF14 UA-camr covers Tanking like you do.
If my DPS is pulling I take it but that's not okay... They don't know my CDs or skill. I'm learning tanking. I suck at it. But if my healer pulls I'm perfectly fine with it since that means my healer is saying "Go wild... I got you."
i know this video is older. but i 100% agree with it. i always go off the first pull as a tank to see how well my healer can handle things. and then ill chose bigger or smaller pulls based off that. if i can wall to wall i will but its always dependent on my healer.
As much as I would like to agree with your comments on "you tank it you pull it" alas i cannot. As someone who started with dark knight with tanking, within the first handful of dungeons I was treated to only one group that cared for my lack of knowledge and went out of there way to help. all the others, three to be precise, would pull large mobs around me and cause wipes ( first time i had wiped in the game). I would then get called out for crappy tanking despite the fact I was still in the first few that ive done. healers and dps would ignore me and side with the others. That mentality has ingrained in me the "you pull it you tank it" not out of ego as you say but out of necessity to be able to learn my job. After a while I just went back to doing black mage and samurai dps with a newfound respect for tanks and hate for my own
that's pretty rough. I guess im lucky enough i've not experienced that kinda treatment yet, but have definitely experienced players pulling more than I can handle! Hope its not too common a thing for ya :(
That is still ego friend. Being adamant to learning how to tank your own way by doing single pulls teaches you nothing, you have to move out of your comfort zone if you want to make progress there, after all how can you figure out how to deal with a situation you activelly avoid? Also there is no such thing as justified griefing, people can report you for "you pull, you tank", no one wins from it.
Thank you, This is just what I need!! I've discussed this with my friends. My friends suggest doing the """SPIN""" is better, but I think just moving left and right is enough to avoid AOE. Couldn't agree more with you.
Omg 2:15 - finally someone is saying it! I’ve been saying this for years but nobody ever listens! Case and point - last week we ran one of the SHB dungeons - the 78 one (can’t remember name sorry the wall one) and the healer was new and myself and the other DPS were both unsynced- the PLD was unsynced and had fully 70 hear on, continued to pull loads and then continued to shout at the healer when we wiped. After I quite calmingly pointed out the healer said they was new and that wearing 70 gear in a 78 dungeon and wondering why they die after pulling big the tank proceeded to berate me and told me I didn’t know what I was doing. Been playing since day 1 launch so I know my shit lol. Very annoying. I would like to add though I’m unsure I fully agree with your comments about “you pull it you tank” section. I don’t believe there should ever be any validation for a healer or DPS running ahead to pull further aggro. The tank is a vital part of the team as are all members but maybe said tank is not very confident in themselves or their own skills. Whilst a tank should pull appropriate level for the healer/DPS on the other side of that coin a tank should only pull what they fee comfortable with. Maybe they don’t pull more as they are a bit nervous and therefore DPS and heals should never be running ahead to pull more. I have been giving some tank training sessions to a new player who had recently joined my FC. She has only been playing the game for about 2 months and wants to tank mainly. Whilst I was assisting her with tips and tricks one of the comments she made was how she was made to feel bad if she didn’t pull more. Party members would constantly ask her to pull more and also run ahead and pull aggro. I told her that she should only ever pull what she feels comfortable with. We didn’t all used to speed run dungeons when we ran them for time or whilst learning tanking so people should be respectful of that when newer players learning a tank class now. Whilst a lot of us have been playing the game for years now we need to remember the high influx of newer players still and need to be respectful and understanding that they cannot speed run in the same manner we can Otherwise amazing video :) I will be pointing the FC towards this video for her to watch
As a ninja main it is especially egregious when the tank doesn't let the aggro drop between pulls because it completely nukes my DPS because I need to be ooc to recover my mudras instantly and have a consistent rotation. All it takes is a few seconds, and it lets us pump so much more dmg at the beginning of each pull.
Think the nicest feature they added was allowing for use of Trust when trying to initially clear the dungeon. I really hope they retroactively apply this to all previous dungeons as well (sastasha and up). Lets the green leafs the chance to enjoy the scenery and take in the new mechanics before releasing them into the race track.
The one thing mentioned that I need stop being so conservative about is not using my 2min cooldown thinking I need to save it for the boss lol, when in reality I would have all my mitigations by the time we reached any boss. I'm still new to tanking too, but I love it. And want to be great at it.
Timestamps are in the description & on the video progress bar! Thanks for watching friends ♥
Saw your raid ranking video. Really good. I consider myself a casual but I did a bit of raiding in SB. Even though I’m casual I still like to heal/tank and dps optimally. Your guides are really good. Which data centers you play on? I’m in Chaos and Elemental.
I have tank anxiety but I think it's easier than healer now there is stress for you haha.
@@monrepos1001 I actually had that initially too.. now I enjoy it way more than dps. I just feel like I know what I'm supposed to be doing and what my job is more than when I was a dps. Dps felt like I was just kinda.. present.. and tagging along
I disagree with "if you pull it you tank it" being strictly bad if a tank cant survive extra adds because his or the healers gear can't keep him alive and a dps/healer picks up extra adds and then everyone dies that helps no one and pisses of everyone sometimes ends in people getting vote kicked.
I'm going to be controversial and say that I prefer tanks with a good sense of pacing. The ones who always have sprint on cool down, pulling wall to wall, and never waiting for the party to catch up before initiating a boss are my least favorite tanks.
A tank should be considerate of the party. If you have a new person watching cut scenes, let them watch and wait for them. Give that new player a good experience. If its all level synced players then and all are skipping cut scenes then go fast but never leave anyone behind. It is a team based experience and a tank should be a team player.
as a one trick healer I don't really mind single pack or W2W but what irks me is when the tank seems like he's stopping so we can kill the trash, I burn cooldowns, the DPS burn cooldowns, and then the tank just yeets off again
i agree on the cutscenes part. but far as the rest goes ... the party needs to adjust to the optimal playstyle (not the other way around). if theyre trailing far behind, this can be a good teaching moments for them to learn how the game is played (most of the time). after a few pulls they will learn that once the trash is down is time to jet again
The tank should be allowed to take it easier too though. Tanks/Healers are the limiting factor for most queues and if they always have to be on their A game they're simply not going to run those dungeons as often as they might otherwise. Their fun matters too.
It is the tanks right to set pacing (within reason) and its not ok to just bully them into your pace. It's the people rushing the group (note: not the same as pulling a stray mob or two here and there) who have the biggest egos not the tanks.
While it's good to maintain a growth mindset and aim to be as responsible as possible, the game is not your job and your desire to take it slow is equally as legitimate as their desire to go faster. If you're always the one having to adjust to others and not the other way around you're not getting a fair deal and that's when you use whatever leverage you have. For tanks that is simply not saving their ass every time.
"You pull it you tank it bro; oh wait now my willing participation in the game matters to you again? Who knew."
It's so stupid, it's the usual god complex of tanks and DPS, they want to run ASAP as if their whole life depends on it, chill out and enjoy the gameplay no matter how repetitive it is, it's not yours exclusively ffs it's called team for a reason so don't ruin others experince for your own convenient.
@@PutraRhm I'd agree normally, HOWEVER
If you have the gear to be pulling a dungeon wall to wall, there is absolutely no reason you shouldn't be doing so.
@@CrowYaeger dude the reason I said "experience" in the first place should give you a good image on what I mean by it. Not all people finished the dungeon, some are still new and want to experience the story, this is a common sense. It's not sprout's problem that these speedruners don't have friend, don't get mad when we play slow, you play in duty finder ffs which is why I said it's not an exclusive place for these selfish losers that only care for themselves, good thing many veteran know how to understand others, if others play slow, veteran will adjust.
@@PutraRhm Something needs to be clarified here. The argument you're trying to give only works on lower level dungeons, and I'd agree with you to some extent. However if you're in a endgame dungeon (Expert Roulette), 9 times out of 10 people are going to want that shit to finished asap. You can only use the "Think of the sprouts!" excuse so many times to give yourself a reason to go at a snails pace.
@@KorthGunnar of course, it's called end game for a reason. Many people just repeating the same thing on end game where bigger rewards and challanges are given, no way they even considering playing on old content other than helping sprouts since they're bored or just want to find new friends.
Analyze healer gear and first pull!! Thank you for saying it!!!
One time I was queueing with 2 dps friends on my dark knight, got Brayflox Hard and a sprout scholar.
Me being a complete idiot ran ahead and pulled everything I could (which is a lot in that dungeon), started rolling cooldowns while aoeing, while I did have to use every single cooldown I had, we all lived through that experience.
Checked the scholar's gear after, was mostly itemlevel 30 to 70, with a few 90s. Not sure if s/he was an alt of a more experienced player, but I was genuinely impressed.
Then on the other side of the coin I've had 400ilvl white mages in Holminister Switch that couldn't heal me on the first couple pulls so there's that.
And if they still blame healers after all the shit they have to put with tanks, I will choke them personally.
I always assume I'm the one at fault when I tank.
Same
When I tank, I still assume I'm doing something wrong even if the dungeon is going fine
@@ceridwenaeradwr8105 just like me lool the dungeon is going really well and still think I'm doing shit
Same here
🙋 same here
100% agree that if you keep wiping because the rest of the party can't keep up with the pace you're used to that's on *you* not them. Some parties are unsalvageable (skip potion ppl) but the vast majority of the playerbase is still learning the game well into lvl 70s and has no interest in being 100% optimal every run. Not adapting to that in pugs is just a waste of everyone's time.
Hm. Analyzing the healer on the first pull makes so much more sense than just super pulling/wall to walling constantly. I feel bad for some of my healers now haha.
It’s good to see someone reflect on their prior actions. Learning instead of getting critical of an information guide. You’re a great role model man.
Or you can ask the healer if they are good with big pulls.
@RJ-jams I usually do at the start of a dungeon! If they don’t respond I assume they’re comfortable healing and just super pull. Otherwise I would watch their mana and pull depending on what I see. I know how it feels as a healer because I choose to play scholar as my first job! Its alright though if we wipe as I’ll take the blame. As I feel the tank should control the pace of the party to take into account what everyone is capable of. Like if DPS is lacking, or the healer is having trouble keeping up.
@@dovaiS or maybe they just don't understand what a pull is, not all players care about tank and their cult of god complex activity of rushing dungeons, many play just to enjoy the good time eve if it's slow, many tanks and DPS are just bunch of selfish bastard, I'm just being real about it.
My favorite part of the dungeon, hands down, is when a good tank does a cautious first pull and then just thunders off doing wall-to-walls because they know I can take damn near anything they dish out. It’s so gratifying.
That being said, tanking one of my first dungeons (I tanked a lot in WoW so it wasn’t completely new), the healer kept running off and bringing adds to me without asking. I *completely* disagree that this is okay. I tanked everything they brought and didn’t argue with them because I wanted things to go smoothly, but as a tank, especially as a sprout, I need to feel like I’m managing the situation, and it really threw me off.
i think the only time ive enforced the "you pull it, you tank it" rule, is when i was first leveling paladin. I was extremely undergeared during an aery run and for whatever reason the healer after i told them that i needed to stay small kept pulling large for me. The few times i tried to pull it together, would cost me an invuln and usually a death mid pull. After telling the dude to stop, i just stopped hitting anything he would try to pull to me. Sure i got berated for it, but when a tank says they cant pull large??? fucking take their word for it??
edit: this was during heavensward
I agree completely. It’s not as black and white as “whatever the healer says they can heal is correct.” Pulling big pulls still relies on the tanks ability to keep aggro with all of them and use the correct cool downs and not all tanks are comfortable doing that. I’ve been blamed for being an “ego tank” so many times just because I asked to go slower...
Sleepy Lycan Enmity really should not be an issue given that you do not have to turn off tank stance anymore. Moreover, rotating cooldowns is inconsequential if the healer explicitly states that they can handle the pulls as they’re most likely anticipating periods of vulnerability.
As a person who both tanks and heals, I can firmly state the healer is the one who effectively dictates the pace. If they can keep you alive in spite of it all, there’s no reason for concern.
As a healer i do this often but if the previous pack is nearly done or if the tank is capable enough to handle the pull. Never force a pull if you dont have understanding of a tank's capabilities
Doughboy You make a solid point, but enmity is still an issue. An inexperienced tank can lose enmity to an experienced DPS very easily. My point is that everyone isn’t an experienced and confident tank. This is especially the case since class jumps have become available. I believe the pace of the party should be communicated and decided by the party as a whole not just the healer.
This is what shirk is for
I play healer through two expansions so I've met tanks in majority of my dungeon and trial experiences. And I have to say that the best tanks I've ever had are the ones that are aware of their party. They pull according to party capabilities, they group mobs, use CDs, pick a spot and let em rip. It really isn't difficult but it takes awareness (and no big egos) and you will make the run so much better and faster. Like, don't run away after stopping for a few seconds. A NIN might've already dropped a ground aoe or a WHM is already halfway their Holy cast. Dodge smart so mobs aoe cones won't ever hit your party. Don't switch positions too erratically so as to not mess up your MNK/DRG positionals all the time.
Its these things that differentiate a great tank vs. regular ones.
I dislike when tanks are planning to pull more but keep *pausing* for seconds along the way, so I think - ok they are stopping here - and I put out my ground AoE (when I have one) and start my AoE rotation - then they are off and running again - so now I have less CDs when they do finally stop. Some tanks seem to think the group should stay behind and finish off mobs first and then run and join them which puzzles me as dps want the packs as big as possible and I'm not here to pick up after you. My rule is I don't want to stop running till the tank stops running. When I see a tank who keeps moving and groups it all up I am very happy. Even better if they don't spin things too much for my DRGN. When I see a tank who knows her party, keeps moving, groups things up and lets me do a good dps AoE rotation it is really a pleasure.
The only time I’ve ever done the you pull it you tank it was when I was running with a friend who was new to healing and under geared and struggling. One of the dps didn’t appreciate that I was going at a slower pace and grabbed the next pack, died, complained and got chewed out by the others for being an ass.
Going slow because of a new player is completely understandable
THIS, DPS act like they can tank the whole area, bitch you're a DPS so stay on your lane and let the tank do the pulls.
@@PutraRhm yeah you didnt understand what Lynx said apparently...
@@flareCao If you feel like you know more then do tell me your lecture, whether my statement hit the nail on your head as a DPS or you just don't get what I mean apparently, my point is plain and simple, do you forget tank also start from a newbie that don't even know the basic and undergear? DPS act like they can handle the whole world and blame tank when they died, no matter the intention is whether it's to initiate tank to do pull or to give a sign to speedrun the dungeon, they don't even consider other people and follow Lynx's second statement. It's selfish af and not all people want to follow those kind of experience, it's bad enough if tank force others to pull, especially coming from a DPS that inherently selfish even in their utility.
@@PutraRhm nice bait
"Tanks in FF14 have a huuugeee ego!"
I was unaware of this "As I'm usually the tank in dungeons" until recently when I decided to lvl a dragoon for the heck of it. Oh boy! The best part is the worse their tanking is, the bigger their egos are lol! Another great video though.
Same. I just started learning healing and no wonder people like when I tank. Idk why people get egos.
I'm right there with you! I usually either tank or heal with a tank buddy and thought "people are really pleasant in this game!". Well, I was running AST and solo queued for the lvling roulette. Got Haukke Manor. The tank wasn't doing super big pulls, so I was dpsing/dealing cards while toping off his health when he got around 50% without much trouble. In the middle of a fight (before 1st boss), he actually took the time to type out "more heals less dps lol".
As Lynx suggested, I took it as "Challenge Accepted" time. But, instead of keeping him topped off all the time, I decided to see how often I could let his health get as low as possible before healing him up. He never died and he kept quiet the rest of the dungeon. Hopefully that'll teach him to not get on the bad side of the healer!
so that's why the party thought I was trolling when we wiped at the beginning dzameal I'm just new to tanking
@@tyrepair Ah yes, the true gods/goddesses of the dungeons...
T H E
H E A L E R.
@@theparodywizard677 I mean we do control who lives and who dies. But a lot of healers do get full of themselves too.
I only pull that when someone is being rude to others.
definitely not defending it but i think that whole "you spank it, you tank it" mentality came from when threat and tp management were a thing in this game. all dps and healers had a way to reduce threat and if they out-geared you, and they pulled threat, someone wasn't doing something correctly. getting and holding threat is ridiculously easy in shadowbringers now, so that way of thinking shouldn't really exist anymore. this is coming from someone who's played all roles since 2.0.
for new tanks, i would add the "know your toolkit" advice. pick a tank you'd like to play and learn about it to be more efficient and effective with it. drk's TBN costs the same amount of mp as edge/flood of shadow, and procs a "free" edge/flood, when it pops, so you don't need to TBN, when it's just down to 1 or 2 mobs. war's nascent flash needs a second person to cast it on, so maybe macro it, also shares a CD timer with raw intuition. vengeance does dmg back to the mobs, has to be physical dmg to proc. shake it off strips certain defensive CDs to boost the mitigation. pld's divine veil needs you to be healed to activate it (clemency or healer cast). don't be afraid to use clemency, especially if the healer is down and you and the one dps only have 10% left on the boss (i've only had to do this a few times and got all the commendations for saving the fight). gnb's aurora is a decent HoT to help mitigate dmg. they all generate resources for their job gauges differently. drk, gnb, and war generate through weaponskills, pld's through auto attacks. pld and drk also use mp, which they have weapon skills and an abilities that regen this. also, like the last part of this video, don't be afraid to get constructive criticism either, especially feedback from your healer.
edit: if i forgot something, my bad. it's 4am when i typed this up...
"You pull it you tank it" if the healer is the one pulling me extras I take that as a green light since the healer clearly thinks he can heal me through it :) I'm less forgiving if the DPS are doing it. Still not letting them die, I want the dungeon done fast and letting them die makes it slower.
i 100% agree, my beef with dps doing the pulls is then i have to run around grabbing aggro instead of just having everything on me which in turn makes it slower IMO
I've done that a couple times as healer, when our tank was obviously very good and I had no problems healing, but man, it still made me feel like an asshole hahaha
I usually as a healer ask the tank if they want to pull more, cause if I know the dungeon and I think I have it under control then if the tank is comfortable then why not pull more, also if I think the tank pulls to much in a specific dungeon then I tell them to slowdown. But I never pull myself more, not purpousefully at least, but if it happens I just run to the tank like: "Hey buddy, could you help me here? Please..."
I LOVE it when a healer pulls. They're literally telling me 'You can pull more, I can handle it."
I like to pull hard, pull loud and pull with the door wide open baby, these are my kind of healers!
You could say the same about DPS pulling though "You just slap your aoe buttons mr tank, I will evaporate them before your defensive ends" Im more bothered by the guy saying its all ego with the "you pull it you tank it" where it could as easily be seen as the dps or whoever going "I DGAF about your fun, enjoyment, or comfort level, i just want my rewards ASAFP so move jackass" in which case i wholeheartedly say they can go fuck themselves :)
Great vids Lynx. As a new FFXIV player whose never tanked in any MMO, I appreciate your perspective and I find it all super helpful. Keep it up!
I've always struggled with tanking, but lately, I've been feeling encouraged to improve, so the timing of your guides is awesome. The part about "you pull you tank" was especially enlightening since I always saw it as a failure on my part, so I like looking at it as a challenge. All great tips to start incorporating into my mindset! Keep up the awesome content.
That’s a wonderful mentality to have @Alexie. Keep it up, you’re going to be a wonderful tank with that mindset. If Ever on Chaos or Elemental, hit me up if you ever need a healer or DPS. I’m Einin
Biggest thing I can do for improving from this is learning to roll my cooldowns. I tend to just pop them as I need them. I do pop them consistently tho
I found this very helpful as well extremely helpful when Lynx mentioned it also in the video. I still had to ponder 🤔 it, but it made a lot of sense. Even coming from WoW as a Tank there fir many years, the experience helps in FF, yet some tactics can also be very different and a point to learn game specific tactics. I’ll be rolling some my specific cool down more.
As a dps I would never try and pull before the tank. I just don’t think it’s a smart thing to do. I would rather go through a dungeon following the tanks lead than charging through myself and killing us all, and cutting minutes off our run if the tank isn’t up to it for whatever reason. I’m not trying to say you’re wrong, just my thoughts on it.
I agree. Yet not all Tanks are the same. I just speak as a former WoW Tank of a decade plus. In the situation where you often group with a Tank in a group or specific party you come as a group member to learn that Tank play-style or some their tactics. In such a setting you will learn and know what you can do as a DPS or Healer maybe.
I always say to people I regularly play with if your gonna pull anything, do a LOS pull. That’s line of sight of target with me as tank in the middle somewhere or close to it. That way I can see it the mob and try pick it up as it heads my way to you who tagged it. It’s a tactic I’m ok with as a Tank in WoW. FF can be different, but for me specifically I’m good with it if a DPS thinks for a sec and pulls a mob into my zone and I take it from there. Just know the players or tank your playing with is best I say.
@@ardentdfender4116 I get what you’re saying, but I think the default stance should be to follow your tank and not pull, because then there will be no one getting pissed or whatever. I just don’t see the point in pulling as a dps or healer, unless the tank asks you to for some reason.
I just personally could not give two shits if the tank wants to pull big or small, my job is to kill them asap as a dps, or heal and dps as healer.
Another killer video, man! Keep it up & dont be afraid of longer videos.
Everyone has there preferance but definitely nothing wrong with a 20-30 minute videos either.
Individual quick 5 minute break downs of end game content/tank guide/mechanic guide for your channel would be awesome to see too.
Another "thumbs up"!
I might try and do commentary style videos that are a bit longer where i break down my thoughts & gameplay during a raid / dungeon
@@NamesLynx Longer videos are totally Ok or commentary to convey knowledge from a vastly more experienced Tank to younger Tanks. Because there is so much you have forgotten that many may not know as it relates to FF14.
I'm going to get flamed for this, but here it is: Don't pull extra mobs into the tank face on your own accord. Is not about ego, is about being considerate, if you feel the tank can take more mobs, talk it with him but don't decide for him. For a lot of people tanking can be stressful and unless they feel comfortable with the job, throwing him more mobs into his face is not a nice thing to do, even if they can handle it. Specially in some leveling dungeons in which doing wall to wall pulls can often result in failures since they aren't as easy as the expert dungeons. A problem with this game is that people don't talk with each other being a social game and in situations like these communications can help a lot. Yeah, you can waste 30 seconds of a run to talk things, is ok, you will survive.
So talk with the tank, guide him if necessary so you can save those precious 5 minutes of the run, but don't be disrespectful about it.
I understand where you're coming from and the idea of "tankxiety" has been around since before ffxiv. My point was directed towards those tanks that get offended or upset when people pull ahead of them, the situation you're describing is easily fixed by a tank saying at the start of the dungeon "hi i'm new / inexperienced / uncomfortable / anxious and would prefer smaller pulls to ease my way into tanking if that's okay." I'm all for being respectful and considerate, I think most people would read that and say okay no problem, and if they don't and continue to pull massive for the tank then nothing you would've done was going to stop them anyways. My issue is directed specifically towards the egotistical tanks that see themselves above everyone else. I've been tanking long enough to be fully aware that we get 100% of the blame when a mistake happens so it makes perfect sense people would have "tankxiety" until they've tanked enough times to be comfortable :)
@@NamesLynx Sadly people never speak up about how new they are or their lack of experience in the game. Especially since you can boost to 70 and fly by the seat of your pants through all the story. I personally am not a fan of people pulling for me, and will ask them not to if I'm new to a dungeon (granted this rarely happens). The big thing is that people can get carried so hard in the game they have no clue that they are playing poorly and not using any tank cds at all. If you try to tell them that, suddenly they get crazy defensive. In short dps and healers IMO shouldn't pull extra without even asking the tank if they can handle more. It takes seconds to ask them that. Just pulling for them seems rude. Communication goes so far in this game.
Great video, really does a fantastic job of summarizing how I like to tank and what's most optimal. Sometimes when my healer isn't as good/geared whatever and I need to use extra cooldowns I'll switch to mostly small/medium pulls, but then go for a large pull on my powerful cooldown timings. I feel like a lot of tanks get into the mindset of it has to be one or the other between small and big pulls, when in reality it's just situational.
Extra thing I'd add is that as a tank you should be looking out for/mitigating boss tankbusters/AoE attacks when you can, and if you've got cooldowns up there's nothing wrong with just mitigating some autos. If you're not thinking specifically about saving something for the next pull then there's a decent chance you can use it to ease healer burden a bit.
And while this is kind of implied in CD rotation, I just want to scream about one of my personal pet peeves: Hallowed Ground is a CD, Superbolide is a CD, and during the course of a dungeon they pretty much give you 2-3 free big pulls and should be used accordingly. Nowadays I tend to just specifically ask the tank to invuln the next pull (with Pally or GB) because it lets me do so much more DPS and most tanks won't proactively use them otherwise.
And to all the Paladins spamming Clemency because they're dropping low from no heals, I'm not needing to heal you because you keep using Clemency. I'm not saying there isn't a time and place for it, but presumably if your healer isn't spam healing you and is using AoEs it's because they've got you. I feel far more safe with a healer spamming their DPSs tools then one who basically just focus heals me because I know the mobs will die faster and there will be less of a need for healing/cooldowns overall (and less risk of running out of MP), and it's usually a tell of healer comfort. Yeah, you'll wipe sometimes, but pushing your limits this way as both a tank and a healer gives the repetitive dungeon grind in this game so much more interest and depth.
And as one final aside: Stand in the healer's bubble and pull mobs into the Ninja/Summoner's circle. That will make them very happy and make your life easier and your run faster. Missing AST's star heal especially can cause a wipe if they were counting on it. Sometimes it can't be helped but if you're going for a big pull try to keep moving forwards, or at least posturing like you're going to keep moving forwards, so you don't bait CDs from your party.
I hope your videos really spread and help out tanks in this game. You've got awesome content man, looking forward to more. Keep it up.
Great write up, and thanks for the kind words!
Another thing to remember. You can ask your healer at the start if they're comfortable with big pulls. It never hurts to communicate with them
I agree whole heatedly!
Funny enough, once a healer told me he lets tanks die that ask him this question.
I once asked a tank to pull smaller and they went one at a time and made fun of me the whole time. I ended up leaving
@@Charmed97 that person must think they're really funny *facepalm* I would have pulled
I'm a main tank in XIV, and I want to say you did a very good job with this guide !!
All these points you mentioned are not taught by the game but they are very important. I think in my years of playing I've seen the counter-exemple of every single points you talk about. I remember when I was leveling white mage, my first healer, when I reached lvl 50 for a roulette I ended up in Amdapor Castle. I was rather inexperienced and not super comfortable with healing yet, and I had crappy lvl 50 gear. Yet the tank decided to pull wall to wall, and after the second time he died he left the dungeon angrily. So yes, seeing how your healer handles the first pull is very important. Pulling packs of mobs one by one goes faster than pulling everything and wiping over and over again. So again good job for giving all these tips!!
The one little thing I would add is part of the ego problem, and it's the aggro fighting in Alliance raids. Getting the boss provoked every 30s just makes tanking not enjoyable for me, especially when you are the one who pulled the boss but you are the one being yelled at for aggro fighting. So guys, just relax and go OT.
It's funny the amount of times I thought "Well, duh," to myself while watching this video, only to remember that I've also been tanking for about 2 years now and still can recount the times that the rando healers/dps I played with would chew me out for doing things like not using my cd's during big pulls or bad positioning, etc. I can honestly say they weren't enjoyable experiences, but they definitely helped push me into the right mentality and I'm honestly happy to say this video affirmed that for me 😊
Damn, so few of your type out there that can actually critique themselves. Well said Likian!
I have been maining a Warrior for almost a year now and I found this guide to still be helpful.
Using longer cooldowns first is a brilliant idea I will adjust which cooldowns I use in what order.
Rotating the enemies less and dodging AOEs by moving less is also something I will work on.
Thanks for the tips.
Glad it helped!
just started tanking, and this is actually super helpful. I've been going off of my impressions as a deeps main, and it's good to know some of those initial gut vibes weren't leading me wrong, lol
this video really helped me with things i was doing wrong while tanking. Keep up the great job man!!
Glad I could help!
Thank you for advising tanks to not pull when fighting low health mobs. Had a tank do this. I spammed lucid dreaming on cooldown and got dangerous low on mp.
I’m so glad Lynx mentioned this. As a somewhat still new player to FF leveling my first time thru, I was completely CLUELESS as to how regen mechanics work both in and especially out of combat. It wasn’t until he talked about it that I learned about it and that’s important to me also as a leveling tank. There are many things like this newer tanks need to know that other more veteran players may take for granted in knowledge and knowing things.
2 years later this video is still helping sprouts lile me :D thanks ♡
same here. =]
First video I’ve watched of yours and it’s a great piece of content. Great length too, you were quick and concise and 10 minutes is the sweet spot for me. I’m a new player up through Stormblood now having played only tanks and still watch stuff like this just to get other player perspectives. I’ve grown a lot as a tank and I’d like to think I’m pretty decent at it now, going from single pulling Totorak (sorry early groups) to wall to walling most dungeons. One piece of advice that I really liked is to own up to your mistakes. You’re right that you’ll save time by not starting fights with party members, it’s served me well haha. Just adapt to the party you’re given.
i recently picked up DRK after main-ing BLM and while I am struggling with 'tankxiety', it feels so good to be able to pull of a wall-to-wall. i really appreciated this advice, and will def be taking it to heart! hoping to be geared and confident in tanking in time for 5.3.
Good luck!
good stuff man, one of the main reasons why my highest tank is only 60 is because of the tank pressure at high end levels. I dont wanna get far into a raid and then mess one thing up and everyone gets one shot lmao. This guide kinda helps quell the anxiety so thanks man, earned a sub.
Thank you so much for these, as a physical ranged dps main this made it so much easier to attempt tanking.
Glad I could help!
I've literally had my head chewed off for saying everything you've said 100%. This video is really going to piss people off. I've been tanking like this for years.
Subbed. Really dig how informative your content is as I’ve been a tank main for a while yet I still learn a few things here and there from you.
good profile pic
love these guides, can tell tanking is near and dear to your heart. some great advice here, from a moderately experienced tank at this point, thanks for these.
Context context context. A rogue aoe pulling an extra mob is forgiveable and as a tank I can pick it up and blow some cooldowns to help healers manage a little easier. However if the dps, without warning just decides to pull extra stuff putting extra strain on the healer and the flow of the dungeon becomes a shitshow I'm sorry "You pull it you tank it" is justified. Idk where you got this "just adds an extra level of challenge" mentality from but I will not condone asshattery because some red mage is doped up on gfuel and if their heartrate drops below a certain percentage they die. Communication is key and just blindly assuming the tank is okay with extra shit being pulled is not fucking cool.
I just started my tanking journey less than a week ago . It’s a rush of adrenaline and a sense of power. But I have had many good and bad experiences with other tanks and with that I have been considerate of everyone. I try my very best to let everyone know I am learning and I wait for my party . It really helps to play all roles so you can understand different perspectives and experiences
"if your health is low and you're in danger and the healer is not doing anything about it" hit home
Wish I had this video when I first dipped my toes into tanking. This is very well explained and even now I learned a bunch of stuff.
I was used to the idea of a tank deciding the pace of the dungeon as well as "if you pull it, you tank it", but upon further examination, they're pretty dumb.
It's happened to me quite a number of times that, as a DPS or healer, I end up stealing aggro and I don't mind as long as I can use my cooldowns and survive it. It's specially fun when we almost wipe and I'm a ranged DPS, so I just kite the mobs until they're dead or the tank comes back.
If a tank is pulling one mob at a time and I know I can deal with a straggler, I'll just pull them in and tank them while I get them to the tank's AoE. I used to feel bad about this despite knowing I could handle it, because "the tank did not allow it", but I won't anymore.
It's a group content and the tank is not the only one with a say. If the others are okay with it, I'll do it.
Absolutely loved it. Great job Lynx! As of me tanking dungeons, my personal habit is to use my 90s first and use smaller cds for the first pull and leave the 120s for the second pack since my 90s will be back up for the third pull and probably not vice versa (depends on how fast mobs die of course), but that’s entirely my habit anyway, great vid! Keep up the good work
Thank you! As long as it works then hey keep on doing it, there’s nothing wrong with having different styles of play!
Yeah, this my mentality too. In situations were you need double CDs my mentality on the second CD flips though, simply because I feel Arm's Length is stronger than Reprisal, so it makes sense to me to combine it with the weaker 20÷ reduction, as opposed to the stronger 30÷. If push comes to shove I've always got my invulnerability button anyway.
Though as Pally I will tend to just straight up use Hallowed Ground as a primary CD for the first massive pack of mobs. Get that skill on CD faster since I'll be able to use it again for a mob pack before the end of a dungeon and there's no downsides to using it other than the killer CD. Superbolide I like too since it can be used a similar way but you need to make your healer aware since it's use is a bit more nuanced.
I find Holmgang and Living Dead more "save for emergency" situation based though; Seems Holmgang frequently bugs out, and Living Dead is incredibly tricky to use right. With both skills you'll also still take damage too so it's not like they can always really give your healer a breather the way Sanctuary and Superbolide will.
started tanking today with dark knight. love it! thanks for the helpful tips. :)
I thank you for making these videos I’ve been a bard main for 3 years only just moving to dancer this year when I got shadow bringers and I’ve really been wanting to get into tanking
Thanks for putting out a video that gives some real tips instead of the same obvious ones. I learned something today.
This is an incredible guide for new players like myself. Thank you for being motivated to make this.
I watched this video right when I switched to Dark Knight, after putting off tanks for so long, and am now maining DK since its so fun. This vid helped me with tank mentality quite a bit, and even got me to play my dps and healer roles far better now that I've finally done tanking and understand the role, how much damage mitigation is really there, and even the section on checking gear I do even when not tanking to have an idea how well equipped everyone is and (Especially when I'm healer) how much I should focus on damage and how much I should focus on healing.
Thanks for the great guide, Lynx! Haven't gotten shit for being a "bad" tank yet thanks to you and your guides!
Great tips. I started as a bard a year ago now, and just started to learn tanking four days ago as a dark knight. In many ways a tank is the antithesis of a bard, so I was really nervous to try it out. The fear of responsibility being the biggest concern. I'm still sticking to the levelling dungeons (I've run Haukke Manor so many times now that I almost actually know where I'm going), but I know I'll have to hit the endgame sooner or later. I'll remember this advice when the time comes
SUCH a good video! I'm new to ffxiv and my tanking will definitely be much improved. Thank you very much sir.
As a main tank, I m sad that I didn't know about the Arm's Length use until now..I was only using it to avoid knockback.
I loved the hints about analyzing the gear and the first pull. And you said to recognize your own mistakes I could only think how I always blame myself when my group dies lol. I believe this tells a lot about my personality
As a tank main I look up to your information and tips more then any tank I’ve come across. After watching your videos I have such a boost of motivation and confidence. Thanks bro. You’re the man.
Thank you for all these guides! I've been tanking since I came back to this game a few months ago and still have zero confidence in most dungs and raids. Your guides have been super helping!
Confidence is key my friend, i believe in you!
@@NamesLynx do you have any guides you'd recommend for most raids and such? It's hard finding a consistent MT pov for everything.
@@amKozy Sorry for the late reply, I don''t know any tanking guides for specific fights off the top of my head but without self promoting too hard I upload most of my clears on youtube so if you want to have a basic overview of what a fight looks like from my perspective you can search through those. I didn't upload 5-7 but they are highlighted on my twitch channel if you go to my vods. I'll make a video going over my approach to new content next week, so that might be able to help you out as well.
I'm learning to tank atm and your videos about it are invaluable to helping me develop a good mindset for it
I don’t like fast tanking but I’m still new to mmos and I know and can pull as much as I can, I find blazing over large the dungeon overwhelming. I hate when I’d tell the party I’m new and the party pulls more then I’m prepared for. It maked me panic and self conscious. Prolly gonna watch your other vid re that but I love raid tanking but if I’m not doing a dungeon with a friend, I stick to my trust for now.
It’s normal to start slow, you don’t have to go crazy when you’re uncomfortable, just try working your way up
Lynx Kameli I can’t help but think that raiding and dungeon use wildly different parts of my brain 🧠 haha
But yeah it’s totally got me thinking how best to improve so can handle this way of playing.
Might see if I can form a party finder as seems odd to just subject a roulette to my fumbles haha
@@TammyJerkChicken People actually love joining first time parties and will definitely help you! That's a great idea
Thank you. You answered a lot of questions I had with tanking.
i'm a new guy (still in ARR) and love the tank but was always intimidated by it. your videos have been very helpful. even with them being more "advanced" tips. they definitely help me out in lower lvl dungeons as well. thanks man. keep up the great work!!
Thank you friend!
@@NamesLynx no problem, thank you!!
@@NamesLynx just curious, have you made that discord yet? would love to join it and get some more tips and tricks on being new to tanking!
Not yet, i had no idea my channel would grow this quickly and was intending to work on it slowly over time. Once my next video is out and i have free time I’ll work on it, so expect it to be created some time next week
@@NamesLynx good deal! keep up the great work.
Thank man just got through ARR as paladin and know theres alot to learn thanks for the tips. I learned alot!
Glad to hear it!
Amazing guide. I've been learning to tank for quite some time since I've finished the msq and lvled my healers to 80. I always found the mentally of u pull it u tank it quite silly. It just makes runs a lot less fun. Glad I've been consistent with most of the basics listed in this video :D
Great video and helped me a lot thanks so much :)
tbh, this is one of the best videos I've seen for dungeon tanking. Literally every point I wanted you to bring up, you did. Such as, "Examine the gear of your group before starting to pull wall-2-wall as the healer/dps might not be able to beat the threshold, use the first pull as a test to examine the rate of the run.
As a tank, don't be afraid to fail, try to go beyond what you think your limits are, try your best. If you fail, simply be like "I misjudged our collective aoe dmg output relative to our healing and dmg mitigration, apologies, will slow down gradually now, if none has any greater objections." Then move on with the next pull, if you don't attempt to go past your limits, you'll never improve as you never challenge yourself.
Only improvement I'd have is to make a mention of "Arm's length" it gives a slow to anyone auto-attacking you, and slow lowers attack-speed, so less auto-attacks on you, it's NOT heavy since the tooltip doesn't explain what slow is, a lot of people make assumptions its making your movement speed slow, not your attack speed. And yes, I know, I know, this is a more advanced guide that gives you tip on how to tank *effectively* rather than "how to *tank*". But I find this specific cooldown to be quite vital to a decently run dungeon run
Randomly came across your tanking videos while searching for some tips and tricks, thanks ya for the content and il be sure to pass your name to anyone needing advice! Cheers :D
Hey man just wanted to say this video has eased my mind on tanking. I was always afraid of not performing to everyone's expectations as a tank but this video has put some of those fears to rest :) thank you
Ehi, thx for your tips and tricks. I’ve started playing as a tank three days ago (first I was dps and healing) and I find really funny play as tank. I saw many mistakes I usually do, like pull extra mobs or spinning around without caring about melee DPS and I’ll work on those. For my opinion, I don’t think the primary role of a tank is making wall-to-wall pulls and make faster dungeons. Maybe I think like this, only because I’m still at Sb’s content and maybe I’ll change my mind...probably lol.
At least, now I know why a healer told me “clear the area. You can’t wait dc’d people while looking around”.
Oh, I agree with you when you saying about tank’s ego!! Thanks again for all your videos about tanking!! They are really helpful!!
Very informative guide!! Thank you for your knowledge and your willingness to share!!
It's generally accepted that 2 packs is a standard pull, single packs can practically be done without heals and there's very few instances in the current lv80 dungeons where a wall to wall pull can't be done by a low item level healer.
- The first pull in Akademia Anyder.
- The last pull in Anamnesis Anyder.
Also, it's incredibly important to properly clump mobs together and turn the pack from the party. Not only because some mobs have cleaves, but it usually keeps stray aoe from forcing the dps and heals to move.
Monk just needs to put on the Twin Snakes buff, but they don't need positionals beyond that. Just make sure not to guide enemies out of things like the ASTs Earthly Star or NINs Doton.
Well glad to know I was doing that last tip really well haha. Usually more often than not if I end up getting killed in a really big pull the first thing I say is "ay you that was probably my b." and people are usually pretty chill about it.
Idk if it's a youtube thing to put notches in the bar to separate timestamps, but they are handy and you do a good job timestamping.
Yea I put timestamps in the description and then they are put into the playback bar
I just started tanking and pulling a lot of mobs always scared me but this has helped me not be afraid to pull more, and even if we wipe I'll be learning the limits, thank you
It's normal to be nervous at first, especially since tanking has such a high barrier to entry. But trust me, once you get it down, people will love you for it and you'll feel like a speed demon zipping through dungeons haha
Thank you for the video!
I'm very new to tanking (learning drk) and even just watching your background clips I see there's a lot I definitely need to change up!
I had my first set of really poor runs yesterday which is why i started searching on how to tank, where we just kept wiping. it was a combo of pulling too many mobs, and having healers (on 3 dungeons in a row) all say they were new/ unsure how to play class so not performing too well.
What made situations worse was my lack of knowing a particular dungeon well, so i'd go off trying to pick 2 lots of mobs at a time (thinking that'd be very manageable) and realizing that the second group was much larger than expected, or maybe more powerful than expected or something, so ended up for some cases, just going one room at a time.
I felt SO bad about my performance as I always try to understand and pace with the party, but I guess I'm so used to other instances where people will pull mobs ahead of me that i developed the bad habit of just trying to agro everything possible before each boss fight.
In the end, on each of those instances everyone was friendly and seemed to be understanding, but i definitely felt I had failed at my job.
Seeing your tips like checking gear/hp of party and doing a trial pull at the beginning are absolutely things I'm going to try from now on!
Literally just picked up DRK today, and this has given me some good general tips for first time tanking. Probably should've picked WAR or something as a starting point to get used to it but, big ass swords amirite?
If anyone has any other tips or something similar, don't be afraid to pop em in the comments, I'm gonna need em XD
I pretty much agreed with everything in this video with exception of two things. Wall to wall pulls because players want to get through and get out of the dungeon quickly. I disagree with this mentality because although this is a team based game it is a team effort and I cannot count the number of times ive been told (as a healer) were doing this because we dont need anything here so were just going to fly through. this road has two lanes. Personally if a tank runs off while im healing hes on his own til i get there.
Second is the spank it you tank it line. While i do agree tanks have egos, they pale in comparison to the ignorance of the dps players. These yokels who go balls to the wall hitting whatever they want to pad thier dps numbers and dont care if the tank notices or not. Thing i hate most is the arrogant healers that run ahead and pull things and then whine like little girls that they died because the tank didnt pick up aggro...
ok simply put you dont wanna be that statistic dipshit that died from over pulling let the tank do his damned job. This has been an issue ever since everquest and wow reared their ugly heads. Players dis the tanks for ego when the reason they got that ego was because the dps and healers made their lives hell in EVERY damned MMO
I tanked a lot during Stormblood, but fell off about a year ago. Been picking up tanking again and needed a good refresher and update for tanking in Shb. This was great for that. Thanks!
I wanted to say great tips and I agreed with the majority of the info shared. I somewhat disagreed with the ego thing. I can't speak for every player who prefers to tank. But from my perspective who play as all 3 roles, I don't see nor understand why any other roles other than the tank would want to purposely attract aggro to themselves, especially since that's pretty much one of the main purposes of the tank itself. If the tank is pulling all mobs to the wall, then I don't see any reason why it's needed for dps or healer to run ahead and pull more if the tank is on it's way to pick them up anyway. So one would probably say that a dps or healer running ahead to pull before the tank, has a huge ego as well.
I don't think it's always a ego issue, I believe it's also a matter of trying not to bite off more than you can chew. And basically saying that "If you're not going to play to my or someone else's expectations, then I'm going to force you to and you should see it as a challenge", is hardly fair. While it may be okay and no problem for you, everyone learns and take on challenges at their own pace which should be ultimately left up to them in terms or how much or how fast they prefer to handle them.
I personally don't mind if the dungeon goes fast or slow. When tanking, I prefer to take a few seconds at the start of the dungeon to ask if the group would prefer big or small pulls, which gives me a general idea of what everyone would be most comfortable with, rather than forcing everyone to play to my whim. I feel that as a community in final fantasy, we should do our best to try and play in such a manner that is more comfortable for everyone rather than trying to force other's into a particular style of playing.
Yes Yes and Yes I totally agree. You don't see any reason for a dps or healer to pull before tank because there really isn't one. Those who complain about the "you spank it, you tank it." are usually players who want to run wild, ignoring their roles and expect the tank and healer to account for their sloppiness without any complaints. It's NOT always a ego, it's simply a matter of playing your role. And this coming from someone who mains healer. I cannot stand it when dps continues to run ahead of the tank and pulling agro on themselves. With the exceptions of accidents or splash damage, there is no reason I should have to keep stopping to see why a dps is getting knocked around because they don't want to let the tank pull before them and stay out of trouble. I warn people twice and after that they become a sacrifice.
@@rosefire5130 Preach! I main tank myself. I don't care about players running wild or running ahead of me. My thing is let me grab agro first and then you can go as wild as you want to.
3:00 Haha yes! I was thinking the exact same thing just before you said it.
I'm new to tanking but before I mained sch, so I can get a perspective from both sides.
New as a Tank in FF from WoW as a Tank there too with barely 3 days playtime in FF. Just at lvl 30 PLA. And since came across your vids just doing some search for FF i've been enjoying the vid's. Love this stuff.
Thank you, very helpful advancing my tanking skills.
9:47 OMG HUGE THANK YOU FOR SAYING THIS LOL. Im mainly a healer sometimes I encounter the wannabe egotistical elitist who is either tank or dps acting like they r top sht but then they fail to a mechanic and blame the healer. The blame game does not help you become a better player, taking accountability for your mistakes will.
Great video! I'm getting into tanking and tanking in dungeons kinda scares me, but this video definitely helped me gain some confidence.
On the subject of owning your own mistakes, I have the opposite of a tank god complex lol. Every time I die, I always assume the fault lies with me haha
Very helpful. I’m trying to become a better tank in the current expansion and this should be a good start.
I'm learning tank and I'm happy I found this video. I never knew it was called wall to wall pulling, I just called it the super Saiyen pull 😆 but I'm happy you emphasized gauging the parties skill level tho because it is important. I remember one of the first dungeons I ever did last year ended badly. I main healer and it was crazy because the tank super saiyen pulled and I couldn't keep up. He was catching a big attitude with me and when I told him you're moving too fast, he said you need to keep up with me. Like dude I've only been playing for like 2 weeks. And he was moving too fast for the rest of the party too (we were all sprouts). Idk if this was bad but I ended up just healing the dps and let the tank run ahead. We all waited back as he was pulling mobs by himself and he died like 4 times before he realized we weren't supporting him. Then he left. Thankfully most tanks are very helpful and understanding and I want to emulate the same energy. But the guy sucked pretty bad
Yea that guy sounds like an asshole. There's nothing wrong with asking to go slower, especially as a new player.
Loved this!!! Your mentality is perfect. That’s comming from a DPS player!! Gona try tanking so I’m gona watch all your videos man!! Good work!
As a rule of thumb when you do a dj in ff xiv, watch the timer. A dj should take between 15 and 16mn on average(some are longer, some can go shorter), you should investigate if you have room for improvement first. Then if you feel like you have a clue about what went wrong but you have done a good job, you could get vocal about it but generally it doesn't work(I do that and I don't recommend it). Genreally lower clearspeed are due to: 1) healers no dpsing properly(it is the main issue generally, healer dps is quite notable), 2) dps players not knowing their rotations(it happens a lot), 3) tanks not pulling properly or doing their rotation.
I really recommend trying to go as fast as possible, and probably use consummables if in premade as well. Leveling and grinding can be cut by a substantial margin.
Great vid. Just started few days ago, love ffxiv, love tanking. ;D
I really enjoyed your video. I have only been playing FF14 for little over a year and it was my first MMO ever. I choose to main a tank, and so far the experience has been mostly good. I suffer a lot from tanxiety tho and tend to shy away from running dungeons unless absolutely necessary. I feel like being a tank your expected to lead in a way, but i don't feel like I can do that. I do like getting feedback and try to be familiar with the dungeon before going in. Anyways, liked and subscribed, keep up the good vids!
Great video! And I agree with all of your points! I do sometimes get irked when DPS runs off to pull next pack when the current pack is still alive, but I face it head on. "If we die, it's your fault. If we don't die, thank you for letting me know I am awesome!" There is that EGO!!! LOL I am hesitant to Tank extremes and Savage , even in learning parties, because I am subconsciously thinking "I don't want to waste ppl's time". But, that is more a me problem than a tanking one. I main PLD, but trying to learn DRK as well. I am no where NEAR to being Purple tank, but I still love tanking. Anyway, thank you for the awesome video! Sub'd + liked!
Thank you so much!
One mistake that I did today and have tried to heal around is when a tank is going out of range. Always try and stay in range of your healer.
tbh I think the "you pull it, you tank it" mentality I gained from a friend who got me into FFXIV only really came into effect once, while I was still going through ARR-Heavensward. I'll say 'first time here' to the party but still get grilled for not pulling in dungeons that I knew nothing about at the time. (Though admittedly it has only happened 3 times in my time with the game) I'll gladly accept the challenge of bigger pulls in dungeons now, but as someone who has made a transition from Novice-Intermediate fairly recently, it helps knowing what your hard limit is when it comes to pulls before tank confidence rises. That said, a year and some change late, but I do agree with your provided lessons in tanking.
Yooo i'm at midgame as a DRK and this is such a good guide, especially as a returner. I LOVE tanking in XIV and wanna do it as best I can
You got a great mentality. And what you said about taking it as a challenge rather than insult. That's 100% the only way to look at it or you're the trash can. This is the first game I've tanked in (always dps'd) so these tips have been really helpful. Wall to wall pulling is the only way to do it.
Several Months ago I saw this vid and still leveling as a PLD now at 65 as been playing on and off other games inbetween. This has helped me a lot! Just wanna say of the maybe 30+ FF14 UA-cam channels I watch, many more popular or bigger, none of them covers Tank mechanics, play tactics as half as good as you do. You should embrace the platform to convey what you know from high end tanking as well ranking in more vids that helps newer players like me a former WoW player learn how things work in FF. Because no other FF14 UA-camr covers Tanking like you do.
If my DPS is pulling I take it but that's not okay... They don't know my CDs or skill. I'm learning tanking. I suck at it. But if my healer pulls I'm perfectly fine with it since that means my healer is saying "Go wild... I got you."
i know this video is older. but i 100% agree with it. i always go off the first pull as a tank to see how well my healer can handle things. and then ill chose bigger or smaller pulls based off that. if i can wall to wall i will but its always dependent on my healer.
As much as I would like to agree with your comments on "you tank it you pull it" alas i cannot. As someone who started with dark knight with tanking, within the first handful of dungeons I was treated to only one group that cared for my lack of knowledge and went out of there way to help. all the others, three to be precise, would pull large mobs around me and cause wipes ( first time i had wiped in the game). I would then get called out for crappy tanking despite the fact I was still in the first few that ive done. healers and dps would ignore me and side with the others. That mentality has ingrained in me the "you pull it you tank it" not out of ego as you say but out of necessity to be able to learn my job. After a while I just went back to doing black mage and samurai dps with a newfound respect for tanks and hate for my own
that's pretty rough.
I guess im lucky enough i've not experienced that kinda treatment yet, but have definitely experienced players pulling more than I can handle!
Hope its not too common a thing for ya :(
That is still ego friend. Being adamant to learning how to tank your own way by doing single pulls teaches you nothing, you have to move out of your comfort zone if you want to make progress there, after all how can you figure out how to deal with a situation you activelly avoid? Also there is no such thing as justified griefing, people can report you for "you pull, you tank", no one wins from it.
Great video! Thank you for the tips 😊
Thank you, This is just what I need!! I've discussed this with my friends. My friends suggest doing the """SPIN""" is better, but I think just moving left and right is enough to avoid AOE. Couldn't agree more with you.
Omg 2:15 - finally someone is saying it! I’ve been saying this for years but nobody ever listens! Case and point - last week we ran one of the SHB dungeons - the 78 one (can’t remember name sorry the wall one) and the healer was new and myself and the other DPS were both unsynced- the PLD was unsynced and had fully 70 hear on, continued to pull loads and then continued to shout at the healer when we wiped. After I quite calmingly pointed out the healer said they was new and that wearing 70 gear in a 78 dungeon and wondering why they die after pulling big the tank proceeded to berate me and told me I didn’t know what I was doing. Been playing since day 1 launch so I know my shit lol. Very annoying.
I would like to add though I’m unsure I fully agree with your comments about “you pull it you tank” section. I don’t believe there should ever be any validation for a healer or DPS running ahead to pull further aggro. The tank is a vital part of the team as are all members but maybe said tank is not very confident in themselves or their own skills. Whilst a tank should pull appropriate level for the healer/DPS on the other side of that coin a tank should only pull what they fee comfortable with. Maybe they don’t pull more as they are a bit nervous and therefore DPS and heals should never be running ahead to pull more.
I have been giving some tank training sessions to a new player who had recently joined my FC. She has only been playing the game for about 2 months and wants to tank mainly. Whilst I was assisting her with tips and tricks one of the comments she made was how she was made to feel bad if she didn’t pull more. Party members would constantly ask her to pull more and also run ahead and pull aggro. I told her that she should only ever pull what she feels comfortable with. We didn’t all used to speed run dungeons when we ran them for time or whilst learning tanking so people should be respectful of that when newer players learning a tank class now.
Whilst a lot of us have been playing the game for years now we need to remember the high influx of newer players still and need to be respectful and understanding that they cannot speed run in the same manner we can
Otherwise amazing video :) I will be pointing the FC towards this video for her to watch
thank you for telling people not to spin mobs to dodge AoEs, -every monk in existence
As a ninja main it is especially egregious when the tank doesn't let the aggro drop between pulls because it completely nukes my DPS because I need to be ooc to recover my mudras instantly and have a consistent rotation. All it takes is a few seconds, and it lets us pump so much more dmg at the beginning of each pull.
Think the nicest feature they added was allowing for use of Trust when trying to initially clear the dungeon.
I really hope they retroactively apply this to all previous dungeons as well (sastasha and up).
Lets the green leafs the chance to enjoy the scenery and take in the new mechanics before releasing them into the race track.
The one thing mentioned that I need stop being so conservative about is not using my 2min cooldown thinking I need to save it for the boss lol, when in reality I would have all my mitigations by the time we reached any boss.
I'm still new to tanking too, but I love it. And want to be great at it.
great vid i think this will help alot of tanks. this stuff may look simple but it took me forever to get it. this will prevent that learn time.