2022 Big Bore Adventure Shootout - Cycle News
Вставка
- Опубліковано 29 тра 2024
- We’ve come a long way, haven’t we? Adventure motorcycles, at least in the top-tier big bore (1200 cc-plus) category, can now lay legitimate claim to being the most technologically advanced motorcycles on the planet, capable of traversing any kind of terrain, on any area of the planet, in supreme comfort and certainly speed.
The biggest of the big, this category is not for beginner riders. Indeed, many riders who buy these bikes will take them on dirt roads and rocky terrain occasionally at best, with most of the riding done on paved backroads as they go in search of, well, whatever got them riding that day.
We’ve gathered the traditional three in BMW, KTM and Ducati and thrown in the homeboy, Harley-Davidson, just to give them a bit of a red, white and blue mix.
Each bike is as standard as we could get them from the manufacturers, and as close as possible to what you’ll get in the show room. Some of the bikes on test were already fitted with aftermarket/performance parts, like BMW with their Enduro Pro mode, but mostly, they are very close to what you’ll pick up.
To score these bikes as fairly as possible, we tried to compare engine, chassis, and electronics performance, as well as value for money and each rider’s overall ranking. We then averaged them together to give the final order. - Авто та транспорт
Hi, everyone,
The Triumph Tiger 1200 was not launched at the time of this test. We really wanted to get it in this test, but timing for delivery of the Triumph from Europe to the USA meant it was not possible. If you'd like to read our launch report for the Triumph Tiger 1200 range, click this link: www.cyclenews.com/2022/04/article/2023-triumph-tiger-1200-gt-rally-lineup/
Pity the test was not delayed for the Triumph...
Why Africa twin is not guys , are you even serious.
I like Adventure bikes because it's different & really efficient to what their purpose is. However, it would look even cooler without the hard casses saddlebags especially in he BMW R1250RT, BMW R1250 GS Adventure or K16000 GT, Ducati Multistrada V4s, Suzuki Vstrom 1050XT or Suzuki GSX S1000 GT, Honda Africa Twin & Honda NT1100, Yamaha Nikken & etc. Its too old shool for these new Touring/Adventure riders. They don't need those today because its too heavy & ugly. And, the space are not enough to accomodate all their stuff.
They are just more into luggage rack that can be buy in Rally Raid in UK for example. Also, bags attatachment hooks that secure the bags well. Well known tourer around the world use this because its more efficient & easy to handle.
Itchy boots & Charly Sinewan are two of adventure bikes in the world use it rather than old ugly saddlebags, especially the hard casses which is so outdated.
@@shermanc8768 When the Tiger 1200 is available, we will test it against the big dogs ASAP. That's for sure. I'm sure there will be a couple more bikes in this category when that happens, too. Which, if they're available when the other bikes are, we will also test them together. It's a logistical juggle to get them all in the same place so we're doing the best we can. Thanks for the comment and watching.
@@Neelkamaljada We chose these models based on competitiveness in the marketplace at their given specs and size and availability. The AT is a bit under-gunned across the board compared to most of these massively sized weapons. Not a bad buying choice or consideration in the market at all, and we constantly recommend AT's to many. But there's only so many bikes we can compare at once so keeping it over 1,000 cc's made sense to us.
I drove the KTM 1290 SAS through South Africa few weeks back. The trip included gravel mountain passes (beautiful sceneries), some really tough off road parts until I reached paved mountain passes and advanced serpentine paths. I cannot stress enough the enormous character of this bike, it is nothing more than a beast. Hitting the paved roads like a sports bike, the amount of torque is just mind boggling. Handling off road like a boss just makes this bike unmatched. If you like to really DRIVE the bike, you could not ask for more.
I’m not an ADV rider. I’ve rode Harleys for 20 years. Done a fair share of touring. Riding dirt bikes in my youth for several years I have been really interested in the ADV for several years. Since the KTM 1290 Adventure came on the scene I have really been liking what KTM has done with the bike over the years.
Absolutely love my new 1290 Super Adventure R. It's kinda heavy but i love it in every way possible. That thing is a beast 😁👌
Amazing to see you here loving you R🤣🤣🤣
I have the 22 pan am special and it's an absolute blast just clicked 4k miles. I've not tried the other advs. but I've been very happy. I did add a shorter aftermarket windshield. but that's it so far.
WD, and totally agree with your assessments.
tbf, and this coming from a '18 KLR-650 rider, the Africa Twin (dirt version, not DCT) would be my dream bike, without taking out a second mortgage.
I could still rail on the dirt, and some nice bags would take care of the long trips....for a gazillion dollars less. 😲
Still.......it's nice to know how the Martha's Vineyard crowd lives.
I've never had wealth jealousy.....I am a giant fan of Victoria on Nauti Style's also 😁.
The Africa Twin is a smart choice for a lot of reasons. We are especially keen on first generation models that aren't over-complicated.
They're not actually better though Joe are they - it's like how I'm not jealous of BMW/Merc/Audi drivers. I'm perfectly prepared to spend that sort of money on a Lexus, because I like my machines to work reliably. Prestige is a cancer on engineering.
Ducati's range is what kills it for me... Need the Enduro back!
Chose the 22 HD P.A.S. and don't regret it. Love it!
Really well narrated, great job thank you
I own a 2010 Multistrada now. But after several years with it I am in the market for a KTM 1290 SAR. I have thoroughly enjoyed the Multi. It's an amazing machine on the pavement, comfortable too. If my wife would dig it, I'd keep it...but, I want something savvy off-road. KTM, here I come.
sir - you are very gracious with your responses. It is impossible to make everyone happy with videos. Your video was very good, clear and informative. Greetings and respect to all from Durango Mexico 🇲🇽 and Africa twin owner
Nice comparison. For the money, I still like the Beemer as I'm mostly a highway comfort rider. All for choices are amazing, beautiful machines. I'm anxious to see the mid-sized ADV shootout in future. Thank you.
Me too but Harley maybe is better on highway
Nailed it man.
Thxs for the vídeo.
I was saving up for the t7 but now you had me having second thoughts about that KTM.
Cheers.
We appreciate the support.
The video feels incomplete without the new Triumph Tiger 1200 Rally Pro and Africa Twin.
1290 pro is in the same league,but not the Africa twin.
If they had only had a time machine..
I preferred an used Honda Africa Twins .
Cheaper , lighter weight , good fuel mileage and durability.
But if you just wanted cheap, light, durable, and fuel efficient, the Honda Grom checks every one of those boxes.
You don’t know what you’re talking about.
Honda africa twin is not light. I can guarantee that.
No matter what all tests always miss atleast 1 important competitor
As much as I love KTM I knew it was going to win. Let’s be honest, KTM has been making adventure bikes and perfecting race bikes for decades. They are the true winner.
1. Super Tenere 1200
2. Africa Twin 1100 adventure sport
Good call
@@cyclenews sir - you are very gracious with your responses. It is impossible to make everyone happy with videos. Your video was very good, clear and informative. Greetings and respect to all from Durango Mexico 🇲🇽
Great review. Thx. KTM knows dirt bikes
Should've compared the 1290 SAS model with ACC and 19in front.
No. That bike is an on road tourer.
I have a '22 SAS. It does very well for all roads, but does lack the R's offroad prowess. However, slap some wire wheels and dirt-capable tires on the S and you'd still get places that would surprise you. The stock Mitas on my S are actually not bad on gravel and rocky roads, but I wouldn't push it too hard with the cast wheels. I do think the S is the best choice for most riders. The WP suspension works so well and adaptive cruise is a great feature for longer asphalt rides.
@@Daveshotpocket so is the multistrada v4s.
@@Daveshotpocket it still has "off road" modes for suspension and engine, and its still a KTM, so it would proably be better than the rest in off road.
@@Daveshotpocket So is the Ducati. The SAS is better off road than the Ducati.
Very correctly presented, congratulations!
No sane person buys a BMW without the dynamic ESA.
Great video, thank you!
Glad you liked it!
Wow... A hot Harley. Who'd a thought?!?
It all boils down to what type of riding you will do which impacts which bike offers the most value. Most riders will do an 80-20 (if that) road/off-road split. This makes the Beemer and Pan American a better value for this type of riding.
The BMW is nowhere near the KTM in terms of riding qualities. The KTM needs to be controlled and driven while the BMW mostly drives you. For a person who loves to drive a MC properly the KTM will always be the choice. For people who just likes to cruise around (boring) the BMW will probably be a better choice.
BMW is a better bike!!
@@rickc16ktm is cheap plastic and Bad electric
Considering an adventure bike, no need for long distance so really interested in your opinion on the Experia from Energica.
I am
On my second super Duke 1290r. That motor is perfect.
Nice review 👌
I'm sure that the Duck is spectacular new but ADV is all about durability and high mileage reliability. How are the Ducks holding up over time as compared to machines like that GS-1250 and Africa Twin?
Agreed. Out of this group the GS is the clear winner for durability and reliability. However they didn’t include the modest Yamaha SuperTen 1200. That’s the secret “poor man’s” GS and arguably one of the most reliable motorcycle ever made.
3 bikes with 19 inch front and electronic suspension vs. the hardcore R version KTM with 21 inch and no electronic suspension.
S model would have been much more relevant on road and still be better off road vs. others rendering it a better win vs the R.
I would’ve ordered it but the dealer is over an hour away and my BMW dealer is only 20 mins away.
agree
Agreed. Yet the interesting thing this test shows is the clear negatives of the 21" front wheel and more aggressive suspension on road performance/comfort didn't actually hurt the bike in the rankings. It's on-road performance is so close even with the disadvantages. We are curious if the S model would have just dominated the test with improved road manners. So, maybe having the R made this test closer, actually. Again, it often comes down to availability for our match-ups.
@@cyclenews Would’ve like to see a drop/pickup test. That Super Adventure is one of the most difficult big bore ADVs to pickup, if not the hardest.
@@ryanmalone2681 the new one is better with how it carries the fuel lower.
I really like what KTM did with the 1290 SAR. Just what this class of bikes needed - a serious dirt road focus.
How is the HD price at $20623?? when msrp is 19,999 spoked wheels are 1000. , ride adjustable is also 1000 that paint job is 690..
I wish you guys held off on this until the new triumph was out
Leaving out the Triumph Tiger Rally Explorer, surprising.
it seems like it makes more sense to compare the regular gs vs the gsa. all good. how come y'all tested gsa with aluminum bags? also, the ktm super adventure s, with 19" wheels, would seem to make more sense in this comparison.
I agree....it always seems to be a comparison of the GSA to a 1290 SAR. It really should be the GS Rally (with taller suspension) compared to the 1290 SAR. the GS Rally is narrower and lighter than the GSA. I had a GSA and specifically sold it to get the Rally because I started doing a lot more offroad riding and the GSA just seemed too big physically and visually.
BMW only had this GSA available for testing and the production package included the Aluminium bags from the factory to the dealer floor.
@@daneav8 For sure, we'd love to get a GS Rally and test it against all GS' and then throw it into a head-to-head with a more serious off-road competitor like the KTM 1290. Adventure bike testing is amazing. Let's do them all!
Great video!
Glad you enjoyed it
how can you not consider honda africa twin ??
If you used a 2020 GSA why not the 2021Triumph? And I didn't hear anything about projected reliability and maintenance.
0:22 BMW falls apart lol
It was a GoPro camera falling off...probably a suction cup mount
No Triumph Tiger 1200? That's a shame, it's a real contender now
If they had only had a time machine..
I wanna see some footage of the GoPro that fell off the BMW at 0:24
How about some footage of us staring at the ground for an hour looking for it as we ride back down the road? Hahaha
Interesting. When a 1100cc Honda Africa Twin is no longer considered a Big Bore Adventure bike and is not included in the comparo... Or are these only Pavement Princesses? ;-)
If a bike can only make 95 hp with 1100cc's it's not the type of bike most people think of when they hear "big bore"
Much more than 90hp is useless offroad anyway.
@@grandiagod Claimed HP is 100, not 95. The previous generation 1000 is officially rated at 96. Likewise, that figure is probably conservative.
Honda has 1100 cc but only 100 ps. İt’s not enough to compete with others
@@grandiagod well, considering the bore of a motorcycle has nothing to do with HP but rather the cylinder diameter, and since the Honda Africa Twin has a bore larger than the Ducati MTS V4S which is in this comparison, I think people would indeed think of the AT when thinking about big bore ADV motorcycles.
I bought the Pan America and guess what... it's the best bike I have ever owned and man I've owned a lotta bikes. Forget about Harley doing their homework in ADV world. They went beyond that. Its my daily rider and the heat is really not a problem.
Great of you guy's to throw in the wildcard Harley Davidson, unfortunate that it had to take the place of an actual "big bore Adv" like the Africa and Tiger explorer. Quit watching after i read the title closely. .
We will Tiger it up when they're available. We still think the AT would get worked by the performance of this group for the macho's out there, but we can try that, too. There's still plenty to learn in here despite not including your choices above. Give it another go. Do it. Dooooo Ittttttttttt!
@@cyclenews i don't disagree that there's still plenty to be learned, but its not a real shoot out, title is a little misleading, that's all. Tomatoe Towmato
Pan america 23' what a machine!!
Agreed, too bad it was taking too long for the "British" bike to arrive from Thailand.
Wish the Super Tenere was included..I guess because the 1200 is a touch under the 1200 mark, it didn't make the cut... also, watching this in 2024.... If BMW released a new GSA... BMW, hold my stein😆
I think the camera man had it right on the Yamaha T7 chase bike.
Even a T12
Yeah, the Sucati comes with everything…except you have to pay extra for heated grips 🙄
I was excited to watch this until I found out there's no Triumph Tiger in the mix. Luckily I just bought one so I already know it's awesome. Still, it would have been nice to see how much more awesome you guys think it is than these other machines.
Hope you enjoy it!
Nice. I like it!
Thanks!
Where is the Yamaha's??
Note - the camera bike was a Yamaha T7 🙂
What? no Super Tenere?
I still don’t see anything here to drag me off of my Super Tenere.
Yamaha is rated the most reliable.
Though, my fully farkled S10 is the most boring of all the bikes I own... Its always my choice for interstate touring and nasty weather commuter.
If I had a garage fire and all 6 burned up.... Id be at the Yamaha dealer first with the insurance check for another.
Its the peace of mind... Japanese..i have a Suzuki xf 650 so i know
Good for you, man. Really good for you. I’m glad you shared that with the entire UA-cam family. Really good. Awesome.
Do any of the bikes have hydraulic lifters to avoid excessive future maintenance cost?
The H-D does...
Interesting, how can bikes that don’t incorporate hydraulic lifter technology be mentioned in the analysis as a significant item? The people reviewing these bikes are not qualified!
@@bobmorasko You should read this. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
Honda Africa Twin is for me number 1.
Motul oil synthetic will cut the heat in half on the Pan-America
Should try it
Thanks for the tip.
And the reliable one? Yamaha Super Tenere.
Shame the Africa twin wasn’t included. I’ve rode most of the bikes included and didn’t find the Africa twin any slower on the road. It’s all down to torque and it’s low rpm. Unless you’re doing over 120 mph regularly the extra hp is unuseable.
Thank you
Why no honda Africa twin?
No Honda?
supertenere 1200 is watching this while eating popcorn...
Did one piece of the BMW came oof flying at the intro?
Just kicked up a rock.
Really want a proper offroad review of the 1290S with tech pack and offroad mode suspension in the exact riding conditions shown in this video. Plenty of 1290R reviews already out. Thinking a 1290S would be a complete all-rounder bike if it can handle spirited offroad riding.
I have a 2019 SAS. I don’t know why you’d take it very far off road. It’s probably solely my limitation but it’s way too big, heavy, and expensive. I’d like to try someone else’s SAR with good knobbies for sure. Probably only once. Haha.
@@CurtisBrandt I have 14 1190 S with knobby tires that I ride mostly off-road plus 2 up city rides. Big heavy yes but the bike does it all for me without a trailer. Came with spoked rims stock. 2017 1290 series started the cast wheels on s models. New 2021 finally has off-road mode for suspension plus a ton of adjustability apparently so I want to know how well does 21 S perform off-road.
@@jonasbaine3538 You have a cool bike and I'm sure you enjoy it. These KTMs are awesome. My 2019 has off road suspension mode too, but I"ll admit I've not given it a proper workout in the dirt. I've ridden some gravel roads on 80/20 tires and that's given me enough "moments" to dampen my curiosity. It rails on the street and that's where we'll stay. Would proper knobbies make it "fun" instead of "terrifying" for me? I dunno. I'm curious what an R model would feel like but I'm done considering riding my 2019 off road. I've seen a few of the 2022s (R and S) around at the local dealer and they look wicked. I'm sure they're great.
Just bought a new 1290S and am adding KTM spoked wheels, anakee wilds for fun in the dirt. I think part of the reason there's not many reviews of off-road on the S is because it costs a lot to spec it up for off road . Spoked rims, crash bars, bash plate. None of its standard equipment like the R. The s tires are clearly road tires. The SAS suspension is reported to have much lower limits off road. Only freaks like us want to see how far an S can go off road. Everyone else buys the R.
@@srk9357 cool. Meanwhile you can get a multistrada v4s with spoked rims, radar, and electronic suspension but its 7k more. Plenty reviews of it doing just fine off-road. Think ktm missed a segment…
0.24 What fell off the BMW ?
Good to see the suzuki vstrom 1050 come out as the most honest "pavement princess" of this group.
Yep that'd be the motorcycle I'd be buying a completely untested motorcycle by a company that specializes in bikes it need a lot of maintenance. With only a few dealers scattered throughout the world
Where's the Yamaha S10?
and you recorder off board of there 700 I see... any comment on that comparison one... :)
Nice god bless
At :24, the BMW rider drops something (belonging?) from his bike !!!!!
No triumph tiger?
Looking forward to see Triumph… Africa Twin… V-Strom…
You will see them in future videos
@@cyclenews Thanks for your reply. I eagerly await 🍻
I found the pan America more comfortable then the BMW GS
Nice
I test drove a few of these options. The Pan America sold me before I left the parking lot for the test drive. KTM was my choice
It's great to see CycleNews covering the ADV segment more aggressively. Please keep in sight that this type of riding started with world-touring, not enduro racing. :^)
More to come!
Missing the beast = AFRICA TWIN>>>??
the beast,??ktm it's there .. watch your mouth...
@@bynightful lol...
Great analytical review 👍
Shame you guys didn't get a Triumph tiger 1200
For OFFROAD only i would choose the KTM, for ONROAD only i would choose the Ducati... For the PERFECT MIX i bought the R1250GS..
"perfect mix"...
aka "the average all-rounder" that does nothing perfect.
i think the 1290 SA-S (not R) is a much better option, both off road and on road, unless you are doing endless highway trips, where the GS is the king
@@dimosk7389 I did'nt like the SAS at all. Had one myself before but the older model wich I liked better... The R was better of the newer models i my opinion. The problem for me is the more bent knee angle or or would probably have bought a KTM SAR because of the price compared to the BMW. But to be honest i am thinking of the Ducati now, an absolute wonderful bike..... Just very thirsty.. 😀
@@Swedeonamotorcycle i had the same issue when i got on the new 1290...not comfortable at all for the knees, compared to my 1290 SA-T.
the multi is insanely good, but too expensive and, as you said, stupidly thirsty for a new bike.
Knox armour channel made a real world comparison and it would do about 200kms per tank, compared to 320 per tank for the 1290 on the same road!!! thats insane
Will second that...bm long distance runner and comfort and fuel consumption
I want to buy a new bike and I tested both of them. Gs1250 adv and Ktm 1290 SAS..... Ktm is very powerfull, feels not so heavy, and easy to handle....GS is mouch more comfortable, not so powerfull but still good enough, much better wind protection and better build quality. Im not a big fan of boxer engine but I think GSA will be much better bike for me ( 80 %road, and want to try some light offroad...)....but price is 25k usd for SAR with all options vs 32k for GSA with all options.....huge diference for slower bike...😖🤔
CAMERA MAN WINS ON YAMAHA T7!!!!!
T7 chase bike. My ride somehow still made it in this video 😂
Missed opportunity to beat them with a tw200. 😁
Best comment ever. We should definitely through in a wildcard entry next time like this to take the macho seriousness out of the equation. Because, let's be honest, these bikes are ridiculous! hahaha.
@@cyclenews well said. Keep up the great content.
Subtitles, please
what abt crf1100L
Why use the GSA for this comparison? Seems that the standard GS would have been a better apples to apples.
I’ll take the new Triumph Tiger - thanks anyway 😎👍
It's basically a GSA. I also would take it over a GSA.
I worry about Triumph's durability and high mileage reliability though.
So Cycle News didn't get the news that Triumph just lunched a new Tiger 1200.
Too bad Triumph Tiger 1200 wasn't here. Maybe next time
Who else here is a beginner and has only got an eye for the Post apocalyptic Monstrosity that is BMW R1200GS?
With all of these electronic riding aids there really isn't much adventure left in the Adventure bike segment.
I feel like this is missing the Africa Twin, the champion of them all. This is like Wimbledon excluding the Russian tennis player because he was going to win.
I'd take the Africa Twin over the HD simply because of it's looks and the quality. It's outclassed in the group in every other way.
The Africa Twin Is Shit I owned It and Immediately Sold It. the Throttle Response, And Comfortability was Ass And Not to mention It Feels Heavy When You start Moving, It's like you are Constantly Fighting The Bike To turn. I bought A 1290 Super Adventure And have never been Happier than Ever
Meanwhile sitting here with my T7 at half the price, 100 less lbs, and better reliability than any of them wondering what the big deal is?
Always a good option
Some people want a powerful bike for a more thrilling on-road ride 💁♂️. Considering that most people don't spend their entire trip off-road, the compromise in off-road performance due to the weight is worth it.
what fell off the GSA at 0:23 ??
no doubt, a thousand dollar bill 😏
The GoPro we didn't mount correctly.
It's a clip-on GoPro mount for a helmet chin-bar that we use for quick POV shots. I thought it was gone all day, but we went back down the same road at the end of the day and someone found it. Ha!
@@JesseLZiegler WOOT! 😀
@@JesseLZiegler glad you found it!
Missing a key bike in this shootout... Where is the Triumph Explorer?
Super tenere and the Tiger should be here. I don’t think Harley even qualifies.
Absolutely zero chance you could buy the Pan America test bike for the price you cited in the video. The two tone color is a $600 option and the Active Ride Height adds another $1200. Just adding the numbers on Harley’s website shows a price tag of $22,423 USD. This doesn’t include freight $575, surcharge $500, and prep which will vary by dealer, but will likely avg to $1000 across US dealers. My local dealer charges $1495 for prep on all new bikes.
Mine was 22k otd…
@@windtherapy99 Ditto. Just about the same.
Yeah, curious how the tiger would have done. BMW needs an overhaul - they need a 1200 with a 21 inch front wheel..tough to beat that KTM
BMW better on road, KTM better off road yet BMW 3rd, KTM 1st ??
And the BMW is under powered for its weight.. I love my Duc….