Beach Volleyball Passing - The Truth About The Platform?!
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- Опубліковано 13 чер 2024
- We use the platform in beach volleyball passing, serve receive, bump setting and defense basically all the time. Optimizing something that we use almost all the time can have huge returns, and in this video we take a deep look at what most coaches teach, why it might not be optimal for everyone, alternative solutions and also pros that use alternative solutions!
More information about the full Learn Beach Volleyball Fast passing course:
www.learnbeachvolleyballfast....
A follow-up video to this one, talking about even more platform details: • Beach Volleyball Passi...
Links to the full pictures of pros who are using alternative serve receive platform techniques:
Christian Sorum 1: pBzWN9C3ow...
Christian Sorum 2: pBzydmAaoN...
Ricardo Santos 1: pBv1cTkZpa...
Ricardo Santos 2: pBuT39Rvhq...
Eric Zaun (RIP) 1: pBml5qraHC...
Eric Zaun (RIP) 2: pBopp1BflZ...
Alexander Brouwer 1: pBm5U6fhF9...
Alexander Brouwer 2: www.brouwer-meeuwsen.com/alex...
Hendrik Mol 1: pB2g_P1Ao2...
Hendrik Mol 2: pBvCmtEIHL...
Reid Priddy: pB8KTSJYlg...
Bonus - Karch Kiraly: i0.wp.com/coachrey.com/volley...
In general, this anatomy issue seems to be less of a problem for women than men (at least in my experience), but from time to time it might be a good idea also for women. I have yet to find a picture of a pro woman using this technique in a way that I believe it is deliberate and consistent, but here is a picture of Finlands Taru Lahti-Liukkonen using a technique that might resemble something similar: pB71VzFhld...
If you happen to find pictures of more pros or other players using this technique or other interesting platform techniques, feel free to share them in the comments below, it can be helpful for a lot of people!
UPDATE: Thanks to Marcio Lucas da Cruz from the comments, here is another picture of a woman (Marleen Ramond-van Iersel) using this technique: pBxUtfN7hT... Keep sending more of them if you find them! :)
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#TheStuffProsDoButNoOneTeaches
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I have the same problem with my platform, probably worse than you even. This tip (that no coach ever figured to tell me before) could have saved me years of agony about my erratic passing, and will help me become a good passer after all. Thanks
Hahaa yes, agree, having seen your arms, you probably have even slightly worse volleyball-arm-anatomy than I do.. But so happy we have been able to influence it towards something much better still!
There was a stage in the editing process in the video where I had a text saying: "join me in my attempts to stop the spreading of "semi truths" that mislead people in their mission to become a better player?" but then decided to take it out.. But it's still a huge concern for me. So many people that coninuously keep teaching stuff that misleads some people, and never take the time to reflect if what they teach actually holds water. I am in no way immune to this, I have made plenty of mistakes and wrong assumptions in my theories throughout the years too, but I at least try to keep learning and questioning, I feel like most coaches wouldn't even want to get to better answers even if they would be out there, easier to keep it like it is no matter the consequences for the players.. 😶
Thanks for the video. Unlucky i got have a shitty plattform and every coach i had said just do the basic plattform you did in the begining. When i pointed out that my platform was not like theirs and i had massive triangles + hole everyone just said just do it. Great that i found this video. I will try out different techniques now
Thanks alot :)
You are not the only one.. It's very unfortunate, but maybe we can't expect anything else from the ones who naturally had a good platform? I don't know..! :) Glad you found your way here at least!
8:21 ABSOLUTELY completely game changer for me.. Dude, god bless you.
Hahaha, good to hear!! That's what happens sometimes! 😁
17 years of intense volleyball and still learning! Just had some really powerful insights, specially about the ideal position and angle of my arms, also about the necessary precision, since my arms are far from ideal for passing. Just invented a drill with the tennis ball, bump setting it with one arm at a time (but with the hands together), this way a make sure that both of my arms are parallel, diminishing the triangle effect of poor positioning... Thank you for all the knowledge! Abraço do Brasil!
Hahaha sounds amazing! :) It's so cool when you realize that you can take something that we all at one point probably take as simple and for granted (the platform) but then start looking at more and more details in it and all of the sudden realize that even the platform is a whole world of it's own that you can explore for hours and still have new insights about how it works! (Hahah almost getting a bit philosophical/spiritual over here! 🤓🤯😇 #theinnerjourney)
I would actually really love to see a video of your drill if you'd ever be willing to just shoot a quick phone video of it? 🤩
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast Continuing being philosophical/spiritual, as Miyamoto Musashi said: "In all forms of strategy, it is necessary to maintain the combat stance in everyday life and to make your everyday stance your combat stance." :)
I'll get a little deeper in the insight that I had because of your video. I knew that making external rotation in the shoulders is essential for stability, control, transferability of strength, etc. not just for the bump, but for all volleyball skills, but I never thought about the inclined platform (triangle effect) that is made when you don't transfer that external rotation of the shoulders also for your elbows and your wrists, making this way your arms completely parallel to each other. So, how to hold the hands in the bump doesn't matter, as long as the arms are firm together, stable, with external rotation in the shoulders, elbows and wrists, and completely parallel to each other. Since I watched your video, I particularly started holding my hands not so closed as in the traditional way, but in a much more open way, yet still with the base of my wrists together.
If you make sure that the position of the arms are perfectly parallel, I don't think that it is necessary to hold the hands in an uneven manner like you taught to make the arms closer together in your platform, as this would twist the trunk and make you lose some overall stability in your system. Having a wider platform could even be an advantage, as the ball would have some more space to hit, and since both of your arms are parallel, it won’t matter if the ball hit both arms or just one of the arms…
With this thought in mind, I developed some drills with the tennis ball, because with it the movement must be completely perfect and precise, if it’s not, the ball will fly away, not lying and showing how poor is the technique. I start setting nonstop the ball with just one of the arms, changing arms and prioritizing the worst (my left). Then, I make my bump platform and play around it, bump setting continuously with just the left arm, then with both arms (definitely the hardest way), and then right arm and going back to center, left…
When I feel that my technique is good, the real play begins. I do a controlled spike from my right arm, defend the ball straight up with just one arm (in this case the left arm), then bump set the tennis ball to the left arm, do a controlled spike with the left arm to the right arm alone defend, bump set to the right, spike, defend with one arm, bump set… BE PREPARED TO MOVE A LOT! :)
Copy here your email and I can send you a video showing you this drills. It would be awesome if you make a video about this playing alone and corrective drills!!! Technique, precision and control is the most important thing in my opinion.
@@arthurbarbosapinho Hahah first of all, amazing that someone is willing enough to write a comment this long!! :D
I need to think about the quote a little, I am actually not 100% sure I grasp what it is trying to say haha, but an integrated life where relaxation, work, play etc is kinda the same is definately an amazing way to live, maybe this is what is alluded to? :)
Soo reharding your platform explanation - interesting!
It sounds a bit like you can twist your forearms so much that the "triangles" actually disappear and you get a huge flat wide surface?
Because if that is the case, and you can make it happen quickly without too much effort, then yes, that sounds amazing! The bigger and the flatter our platform is, the better I'd imagine (as long as the ball still bounces well from it, I'll talk about this in a followup video to this one that I should hopefully get around to uploading tomorrow!). This is where the beauty comes in though, I can't twist my forearms that much so that it becomes flat! So we need different solutions, what works for you doesn't for me, what works for me might not for you! :)
We are all definately going to have advanyages and disadvantages in terms of this, like it sounds to me like you can somewhat easily put together a huge wide platform, and I can imagine that will help in the long run because of the bigger margin of error. But whatever, we all have different features we come equipped with, some have the arms, some have something else. We however all should spend some time into thinking about how to maximize the benefits of our bodies and how to minimize the disadvantages! :)
This drill sounds amazing, and I really want to try it out haha and see if I can do it! 😅 Sounds very challenging but definately learnable. Feel free to send to alex@learnbeachvolleyballfast.com ! :)
Discovered your channel some days ago and is great, but this video... this is pure gold. Saved my life in volleyball terms.
Damn.. Thank you. Really made my day. So thankful people like you take the time to let me know this kinda stuff. There is lots more to come. 💪❤
A dude standing in the middle of a rice paddy field...how relevant can that be to beach volleyball? Apparently 100%! Alex, thank you so much for this amazing and highly insightful take on teaching this wonderful sport to your " fellow bad arm, platform people". I knew the conventional instructions on how to form a platform wasn't working for me, but only now do I know why. This will absolutely elevate my game, even better, allows me to seek out solutions that I haven't even considered like this platform correction. You have just strengthen my resolve to get very, very good at this game. I am grateful!
Hahaha! Good to hear, mission accomplished! :)
Yes, there's so much about the conventional advice that just didn't work for me, and also didn't match up with what many professional players did, when I really started studying it closely.. I hope this project will become the light in the darkness one day! :)
First I was bored with you and looked forward to actual advices but now I am very thankful as you explain all these nuances everyone who started or has been playing face them every game. It's nice and thank you for your time as some guys are making easy money just showing their own practice without any details.
Big thanks 🏐
Thank you! Yes I know I do things differently and a lot of people are not in the mindset where they can see the value of it. However, I do think in the long run it is better to "convert" peoples thinking rather than give them the quick fixes that they think they need haha, so I will just keep on doing my thing, some people will see the value instantly, some people will get it after a while, and some people will never understand what I am doing, and that is fine, that's how it always is! :)
Q wet y7
Wow. I am transitioning from indoor to outdoor volleyball and I have been watching a lot of different video tutorials by different people lately. I just discovered your channel with this first video and I absolutely loved it!
I used to be a middle blocker, so of course my pass is terrible, and everyone even always tells me "you're such a bad passer, you don't even know how to grab your hands. It makes sense, you're a middle". My hands always look like that. Everyone always comes to me with the same repeated song of how I am supposed to build my platform, and it is always the same answer "I CAN'T PUT MY ELBOWS TOGETHER LIKE THAT. MY BODY IS JUST SHAPED DIFFERENTLY". Your explanation puts a little bit of reason to my irrationally weird looking platform. And yes, I am sure that there are 100 other reasons why I struggle so much with passing, but this video just made me think outside the box for a change! Thank you!
Amazing to hear!! :) Yeah, our different physiques is really a make it or break it factor in passing, similarly to tallness for blockers (meaning it is not everything but a big part for success), but one that almost noone recognizes or talks about! :)
Hope you find more videos that you'll enjoy, also way more coming up! :)
Glad that you decided to create this vid. Super happy that i can learn to improve my platform
Thanks! :) It is an important video in many ways indeed! More important stuff coming in the future also! :)
i was watching the video and put my hands in this asymmetrical position, my mind was intantly blown away, gonna really test this in my next training session, i’m really excited cause it really looks like it will help me a whole lot, thank you so much
Hahahah, I can imagine, amazing! :) I was also quite blown away when I discovered this I can tell you.. 😅 Feel free to let us know how it went!
How was it
Funny, that's how my kindergarten gym teacher taught me and I've done it ever since. And every time someone tells me to "use the right hand hold" I'm like you want me to hit it with my bones? I was so confused. It's so nice to see someone who agrees! I'm still new, so I thought something was wrong with me.
I also turn my hands down just like you to make my platform more consistent, else one arm tends to push above the other.
Glad I watched this 🤘
Hahaha that's amazing! 😅😅 Should almost send some flowers or something to this teacher, and ask him/her if there was a special reason for this teaching! 😅🧐
Really good to think independently and acknowledge every body is slightly different. Thanks for video. I like your style.
Thanks! :) Yes, in my opinion way too much of beach volleyball instruction around the world is oversimplified and dumbed down too much. I know there are good reasons for it, but at this point unfortunately some people get stuck into suboptimal volleyball for years and even decades thanks to this oversimplified advice being so widespread.. Hoping to bring some change to this! :)
That video saved me from a struggle that I thought I was doing something wrong with my platform. I’ve been trying to find a solution, experimenting with a slightly looser platform but your method seems promising, although for me it worked better inverting the hands position, holding the left arm with right.
Thank you very much for put this up to the world
Amazing to hear, that was exactly the effect I wished to create when I made the video, so many years of my own frustration could have been avoided if I had found a video like this haha.
And yes, which hand is in which hand will vary for people that's a good point, one might feel natural while the other feels very weird..! :)
Great analysis, love it. It all makes sense now!
Amazingg! 😊 Hope it helps!!
This is amazing man! Just discovering your channel but will definitely check out the rest of your content! Cheers
Amazing! Hope it helps!! :) And please do, there are some videos that I guess stick out more than others (this one is one of them), basically the ones that have a lot of views. Might be a good idea to start with those. But there is value in the other ones too just maybe not as "popular" type of value hahah. :)
This is so so helpful! Thank you so much!
I used to play beach with a friend that would lay his arms out flat and just bump his fists together. It helped keep his wrists flat which translates to the forearms being flatter, as well. He might also lock his pinkies together on a bump set to keep make it more stable and connected. It's not a "normal" platform but it really worked for him.
Interesting! So in a sense, the arms were not connected to eachother except on the bumpsets where he connected with the pinkies?
I actually talked with a friend just yesterday who had a bit of a theory that some peoples non dominant arm isn't really sufficiently moving "by itself" but rather gets dragged along the ride by the dominant arm when you connect the platform, and if this is the case it should slow down the process of putting the platform in the right place slightly. And it might be possible to train this problem away with doing some passing where you actually don't lock the hands together but move them and hold them against eachother with individual muscle power from both arms. I am actually going to play around with this just a little to see what it feels like and if I can learn something from it! :)
Thanks I’m going to try this too now
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast you're awesome bro
@@wakawaka1976 Did you try? If yes, did you learn something from it? :)
@@primetime0144 Hahah thanks! 😅
You’re a legend! Thanks so much for uploading
Hahah thank you!! Always nice when people appreciate the videos! 😁
Dude thank you! I've been struggling so much with this!
Hope it helps! And thanks for being here! :)
Great video for the "rest" of us! Kind of a mental breakthrough to realize that form isn't a one-size-fits-all. It's tricky though, because you often don't know if your problems are due to "learned" bad form, or bad anatomical form which can't be helped and must be worked around. I like how you talked about the extra effort/time delay required to project the arms flat; that's always been a huge problem for me.
Thanks! Yes haha, tricky waters to manage in many ways. Took a while before I dared to go down this route and experiment and do my own thinking, because as far as I can remember literally every beach coach I had ever had at that point, had more or less told me I'd be an idiot for not using the "standard" platform.. It's also difficult to know because passing difficulties can come from such a big variety of causes, that one can be shanking balls left and right regardless of good or bad anatomical platform or "rest of us" solution or whatever.. Anyway, hope this helps! :)
This is so helpful!
Thanks, good to hear! :)
The best video about volleyball tips i never seem!!!!!!!!! Thank you so much!!!!
Hahaha, amazing!! :) Please remember to tell your friends, the bigger this channel becomes the easier it becomes for me to create more of these! :)
Thank you for sharing something I continue to struggle with and be confused about coach advice I have received in the past. THANKS! I felt like this was a missing part of the conversation about platform formation!!!!!!!
Thanks, and so happy to hear this!
Confusion from differing advice from coaches is such a momentum killer in peoples development, and it was one of the first indicators that showed me that coaching in our sport is way underdeveloped, I had to deal tons with it in the beginning of my career and it got me frustrated.
It is actually one of the biggest reasons (there are many reasons though) why I am so into explaining the "why" of what I teach. Because honestly, I might be wrong with what I teach, every coach (at least the ones who care about getting better) has at one point had to eat up their own words and update their models of how volleyball works. However, when I don't just say how to do something but also the why behind it, it arms the player with a fuller understanding so that the day the player receives conflicting advice from some other coach, one can compare the logic of the "why" in the two theories and therefore much much easier determine which one to believe in, or build a combination belief based on different circumstances (for example "perfect passing technique" might vary depending on ball played with, type of serve and weather, so this is a place where conflicting advice often happens). Just being armed with the why of theories gives the power to the player to be able to think for themselves when there is cobflict between advice, rather than getting confused and frustrated which definately doesn't help with learning the sport faster.
In one video you have summed up the issue that has plagued me for over 20 years. Thank you so much! The illustration of the triangles is absolutely brilliant!! I will have to explore this further.
Wow hahaha, that is amazing! I was stuck too for about 4-5 years until some random experiments I ran plus I guess determination made me one day dare to experiment and do the opposite of what every coach and player I had discussed this with had ever told me..! Then it took an additional year of coaching and seeing hundreds of different platforms in action until the triangle theory model came up into my mind haha. Feel free to let me know what you discover in your experimentations! :)
Great innovation in the volleyball. Thanks for that
Thank you, hope it helps! :)
Omg thank you so much for this video I was like so frustrated that I can’t seem to pass as well as others and thanks to you I figured out why
Amazing, so nice to hear!! :) Sounds like the channel is doing what it is supposed to!
I can't believe how much this technique improved my awful receives. Thanks!
Hahaha! 😅 That's amazing to hear, definately gives motivation to making more of these! Thanks! :)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast It really has helped!
Thank you for this helpful video I am very greatful for this! My platform was cooked and I didnt know how to fix it until I watched this THANK YOU so much!!
Amazing to hear!! Hope it makes a huge difference! :)
Wow- My beach-volleyball racket was definitely broken! This tip was such a game-changer for me; it took my serve-receive to the next level. -- Thank you for the video !
Amazing! So fun to hear! :)
I think this is a much less common problem for females than males, but now that you are commenting, the nerd part of my brain is going like: "Can you take pictures of both old and new platform so I can analyze?! 🧐🤓😅", but of course that is completely up to you if you'd find it fun/interesting/valuable or not! 😂
I’ve started volleyball and had the same problem. Great video, thx
Yes, quite common especially for men..! Hope it helps! :)
Hey Alex, great video! I have big troubles with receiving/passing and always though that my problems are hidden in the low concentration+slow movement, when i did the platform while watching your video i just understood how bad is it in the reality... Already after 1h of experiments find a way to do it much better, still not sure if its gonna work long term, but knowing one more reason for my problems in this area will help me to improve for sure. Big thanks!!!
Amazing to hear someone puts in an hour of experimentation already within the first hours of releasing the video!! 🤩😍 Makes me so happy you guys out there actually care enough to do stuff like this!
The slow movement/reaction speed is definately one critical variable also (that depends on a few "sub-variables") that keeps people from reaching their max serve receive potential.. This is one of the other "huge blocks" that I had to figure out which was also not taught by a coach to me, but slowly formed after hundreds of hours of experiments, discussions, thinking sessions and practices.. 😅 So my tip is to not completely forget about that part, some people have several of these "critical mistakes" going on, which means you might have even more work to do even after the platform if you are unlucky!
I had like 5 or 6 critical mistakes going on in parallell about 2 years ago, and it was so damn frustrating because even if I felt I had figured something significant that I thought would be the "final secret key to fix my problems" I never seemed to be able to become a good passer and it was really tough in many many ways. I literally can't wait until I get around to sharing all the things I found out because I know the insane amounts of frustration and work I could have saved myself from if it had been available to me rather than working it out the hard way..! 😅
However, even if one has several issues "working in parallel with eachother", fixing the platform still pretty much always makes you a bit better, and the rest we can take care of later! :)
Omg this is amazing. I have regular volleyball arms, but your tip about turning your wrists down/out seems to have corrected an issue I have where my arms are uneven. Thank you!
Amazing!! More platform exploration/experimentation for the people! 😇🥳
Thank you, best tip ever!
Awesome, you're welcome! 😁
Great video. Just realize i have this asimetrical platform, and it works for me.
Thanks! :) And that is awesome! Let me guess: Back in the day when you developed your platform grip, you didn't have a coach telling you what to do, but you just did what felt natural and worked, and then you've done that ever since? :) (and let me know if my guess is wrong haha!)
.. thanks for the tip.. this has been my problem for years now.
Thank you! I really hope it helps you out in some way, having a bad platform is some frustrating stuff..! 🤐
Amazing! Thank you!
Hahah, hope it helps! :)
its amazing! For me it took only two weeks to chnage my platform and it already feels natural to me. Dont be shy to change your platform.
Nice!! Yes that's about what I claim also, a technique change can be done (the whole process from learning the new technique to fully natural and automatic in the game) in 2-3 weeks if one does it right. Congrats! :)
In other words: Months and years of work and thousands of reps is not needed if you know how to do it, regardless of how many coaches that will tell you otherwise.. :)
Thanks ,I have learn alot
Nice! :) Thanks for being here!
Achei muito interessante essa técnica, vou procurar executar na minha próxima partida de vôlei de praia. Show
Agradável! Isso funcionou para você?
OMG... This video is exactly what I need to watch. This is so helpful!
Thank you so much!!!
You saved my life hahaha xD
Hahahaha! 😅 Right? It is a lifesaver for us that have "bad arms" for volleyball! :)
Seems very interesting and helpful, i will give it a try
Nice! Feel free to come back and report how it went! :)
Did it work
Check in after 1month of watching this video. My volleyball skill improves tremendously now on receiving. More ball control. And i'm able to play 2vs2 and even 1 vs 2 now. Thanks.
That's just amazing! Thanks for sharing! :)
What a useful tip! I was confronted with the same anatomical "challenge" but now you have given me the solution! Thank you!!!
Amazing!! Hope it takes you a couple steps further along your journey! :)
Dod it work
Love your videos! can you make a video of what part of the hand you hit the ball and some tips in timing when hitting the ball? Love how you explain in details.
Thanks! :) You mean when attacking or when passing?
I was talking about attacking. Today I came across your video about attacking strategies; normal to Eric's way. I can't jump and spike so I'm going to try and perfect the way Eric plays. Thank you so much for your wonderful informative videos.
Has come, waiting for you to teach you how to play, new techniques, hope you update videos every week Because volleyball problems are constantly It's not just the posture that we regularly learn THANK YOU !
Yess! :) Hopefully I will be able to keep up the one video per week schedule from now on again..! It's a big challenge, especially if I want to make videos that require a lot of editing and planning (this one did require a fair bit of planning, and the animations took a long time to make..), but I will try to become smarter and more efficient in my work so that I can start keeping up with the tempo! :)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast Be strong. I will always follow your work. But now I have a lot of arm pain yesterday Jump and SPIKE the ball
@@momosinger4190 Thank you so much! It means a lot for me! :)
Ouch, hope it is just something temporary and nothing long-lasting! :)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast Wants you to make training videos for high jumps Thanks again
I have wide shoulders, very short arms, and low flexibility… this could be just what I’ve been looking for.
Hey sorry for such a late reply, I guess UA-cam never notified me for some reason! 🧐
Anyway, you sound like a good candidate for this technique hahah.. did you try it out?
I love this.
Thanks! :)
Thank you. You helped me pass PE
Buen video. Good video.
Thanks! I hope it helps! :)
I'm definitely going to have to give this asymmetrical platform a try. I've been trying to get into volleyball lately and I guess I have really weird elbows or something because they would be miles apart when I made my platform and the forearm which should've been flat was at basically a 60 degree angle and half the time I would just end up hitting one arm and the ball would fly to the side.
Trust me, you are not the only one.. This is fairly common, especially amongst guys. There might be ways to stretch to make it better for some people, but for me personally even though I have done a fair bit of stretching already, I still need to use the asymmetrical platform for best results in beach volleyball.. Try it out and see! :)
Did it work
@@user-hj8lf4ys7spersonally for me, I was struggling to angle the ball since it felt like one side had more surface area than the other so I just went back to the regular platform and put as much emphasis on recieving with the extact center of my platform
Enserio realmente me ayudaste. Porque igual considero que esa técnica de diamantes no me funciona para mí, hasta intenté con otras plataformas que yo me inventaba pero... Por suerte encontré tu vídeo :3
¡Increíble, esto es muy divertido de escuchar! Entonces, ¿ahora lograste crear una plataforma que funciona mejor para ti?
Needed this!
Awesome! You're not the only one! :) Hope it works out for you!
Thank you so much !!!
Hope it helps! :)
great job
Thanks! :)
YES YES YES. This is a fantastic video. More people need to see it and teach it! I have wide shoulders and skinny rectangular arms and for the first year learning to play I could not learn how to control a pass. Eventually like you, I came to the conclusion myself that I needed to increase the surface area of my platform. I tried a different platform (kind of a variation of the thumb grab, but more just a slight curl of my left distal phalange over my right thumb). Almost night and day I was passing with consistency.
Honestly, it is kind of common sense, if you were given two 2x4's to bump a ball up and down, how would you do it? You would lie them flat with the wide surface up! But if you were given two long cylinders, you wouldn't have to make that decision. ;)
Great video! I've noticed that I have a really hard time passing balls that moved away from me, I would track it to the right place but then it would shank off of my radius instead of bouncing off of my platform as intended. I'm only now realizing that an uneven platform may have been partially to blame
Thanks!
Very well could be the case. There can be other factors too but having an uneven platform definitely doesn't help..
My suggestion is to experiment with it, also there's a followup video to this one with even more thoughts on differenr ways to put the platform together based on your individual arm shape, might be a good idea to have those ideas in mind also when experimenting!
For me, if I use a "less good" platform, even when bumping the ball back and forth with someone causes some erroneous contacts that makes the ball go to a slightly different place than where I'm intending to put it.
This was the perfect video for me. I really want to start training with this platform. I was thinking.. maybe people that doesn’t have this problem doesn’t have long arms? Idk.. I’m just so excited to train with this new platform! Thank you so much! Hugs from Brazil
such a mad Amazing to hear! Hope it helps, and don't hestitate to comment again if it works or you have some further interesting realizations from trying the technique! :)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast I tried it, and it really helped me a lot, but my coach said I shouldn't be doing that, and said I should do the usual platform and make even more effort getting the ball into my broken platform sweet spot :( Like you said in the video, the usual platform sometimes works, and sometimes I just shank the ball. Dk what to do
@@pedrohenrique-bx4xw Haha, not surprised. I have had numerous coaches tell me that too, problem is that following their advice made me a worse volleyball player/serve receiver and thinking for myself in combination of studying some of the greatest players of the sport made me a better player/serve receiver.
Every coach probably has some value to bring, and I should absolutely not give shit to anyone I've never seen coach or met. But if I was you, I'd ask the coach if he'd also correct for example Christian Sorum who very well might be the best serve receiver out there today, or if he'd let Christian be. If he wanted to change Christian, ask for a solid explanation why. If the explanation isn't stronger than my explanation in this video (if it is stronger, please tell me!) but the coach still insists you to change to the standard grip even though it works worse for you, then I'd show him/her this video (and also this conversation we are having here in the comments section.) After that, this might sound blunt but it's my honest opinion, if your coach isn't able to come up with counterarguments that are stronger than my arguments in this video, or refuses to watch the video (which means the coach is closeminded and not passionate enough about coaching to wanting to learn more), and on top of that keeps harrassing you about using a "nonstandard platform" every practice even if you have told the coach that using this platform is your decision and you wish him/her to ignore your platform choice and but keep coaching other aspects of your game.. Then I'd actually recommend to not pay one single dollar more for that persons coaching. Never consciously pay anyone to make you a worse player, you are worth better than that.
Obrigado pelas dicas.
Espero que ajudem! :)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast Na prática ajudou sim
@@fisiolucas9 Isso é incrível! :)
I love the way you say volleyball ❤❤
Hahaha because of my accent? 😅
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast yes! It’s very charming!❤️
@@whateverusay25 Hahah! 😅 I don't think I even understand what is different with how I say it vs how someone else says it.. But now that you say this I realize some other people have commented on it, and I also see some people struggle understanding what I say (if they ask me what I do for a living and I answer for example that I coach beach volleyball, they often don't seem to register what I say, not sure if its because it's unclear or if its just such an unexpected answer! 😅)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast I think it’s just an unexpected answer because Volleyball is less popular than football. So they may not think you can do it full time. I can tell you’re a great coach! You can coach me any day! ❤️I love you videos! Especially this one, sometimes my platform is off and I’m not sure why! But angle diagram made perfect sense!
Can’t wait to try this Thursday indoor.
Love it! Give updates on how it went afterwards!
Just also keep in mind that it can both feel awkward in the beginning for a bit, and your passing might temporarily become less "automatic" for a period when you need to think about your grip while passing (thinking usually gives us slower reaction speed), so there is a risk you will shank some balls based on a different reason like actually not moving your feet or platform enough and quickly enough for a little while until the new platform technique becomes automatic. It is very easy to think that a shank is a shank, but in reality there are so many different reasons we can shank and if we don't get really good at determining the different reasons from eachother, we very easily can get confused in our analysis and come to incorrect and unhelpful (maybe even harmful) conclusions because of this.
Maybe you will be lucky and feel benefits straight away, or maybe you will have to think so much about the hand grip that you shank balls because your reaction time gets too slow.. If the later is the case, I'd give the experiment a few days at least before dismissing it! :)
Probably actually helpful to just go out and pepper a bit (with a partner or even against a wall) for the days leading up to practice, just so that you have time to get a bit more used to the grip. I guess research, anecdotes and my personal experience also points out that just thinking about this/visualizing/playing around with throughout the day also helps! :)
Learn Beach Volleyball Fast Two weeks in and it’s working out great. Thanks for the tip. Now I wish others can set me better😂
@@csebastian71 Hahaha! That's amazing, so fun to hear! :)
They say it's a sign you have reached the next level when you start encountering problems you haven't encountered before or maybe even been able to anticipate before. I guess there are 2 ways to go about it, find other players that are better setters or somehow help the players you play with set better! :)
Both strategies have their place and time and could be made long videos of! 😅 Maybe if you are lucky I have made some videos that can help people set better that one can somehow sneakily inject to the video-consumption feed of the bad setter without destroying the relationship (😅). Finding better players and getting them to play with you is probably something one could write a whole psychology book about (so many ways to go about it) and certainly something I haven't mastered fully yet but actually now that I think of it, it could be a really fun topic for a podcast episode. Maybe I can find someone who is a self proclaimed expert at the skill to discuss with, or just find someone who is super good at marketing and persuasion to talk about it with! 😅
Awesome video!
Have been thinking a lot about this myself. My arms are definitely not suitable for the "normal" way of doing it. If I do it like that, I get very steep triangles. What I do instead is to focus on having as much of a flat "plank" (as opposed to triangles) as possible by simply being very loosely connected with my hands.
I really like that you make the racket analogy. I am usually quite good at receiving, while I could attribute that to my awesomeness, the truth is that it is probably just because I have a quite broad body type, my arms included. That means that it is way easier for me to hit the ball than it is for a skinny person with slender arms. I mean it is obviously easier to hit a ball coming at you with speed correctly with a 20 cm plank than it is with a 10 cm plank.
Didn't watch the full video before I commented. But what you show in 8:35 is actually exactly what I do :D
Hahaha love it! Yes, definately bigger chances of making the ball go where it should go with more square centimeters/inches to hit the ball! :) Then there are of course also other very important variables/details to receive well as well, but having a non-broken racket will probably never hurt you no matter what you do in all the other aspects of serve receive! :)
😅. 😅
nice thanks
I hope it helps! :)
I've tried this for a month or two now and I think it has some interesting insights. I've also found that I can get similar results by turning my forearms further in than out. I basically make the two triangles get closer together.
Nice! Yes, I think the most important thing is to start questioning and exploring. Everyones arms are different, also mobility can change which over time might make various ways to put the platform together make sense.. But "making the triangles get closer together" sounds like you will be taking the ball with the more bony parts of the forearms, which has some additional benefit of better bounce for the ball which means you don't need to add energy to the ball which again means you can do smaller (and quicker) movements and still play the ball well.. Not sure if this makes sense, but basically a movement that just puts the arms in the right spot vs a movement that puts the arms in the right spot AND add power to the ball is a smaller movement that in theory can be a bit quicker and allow for faster reaction speed..
That makes sense! I actually noticed that when I turned my forearms out I did have to put in more effort to get the same bounce, but I didn’t think of it as a disadvantage until just now.
@@Siyth Yess! Although now that I read this again I realized one thing again: In my mind, in theory there should be an advantage to getting the bones clsoe together to a platform that bounces better. However, I can't say this with 100% certainty, because I have actually never experienced it (my arms can't do that) so I can't know for sure..
But if you end up experimenting and trying to notice if the "bone" platform allows you to move to the ball later because all you need to do is put the platform together as opposed to putting the platform together AND generating power, I'm all ears for what conclusions you come to! :)
Of course anatomy. Try to listen to your arma mate. Thank you 🙏 for your videos. Hello from France 🇫🇷
Thank you! Yes this one is a big anatomy one.. Thanks for watching, hopefully I'll be ready to make more of them very soon! :)
They are very good point. I have played 45 years and I have changed the way I grab my hands as the years went. I even grab my hands different ways depending of the whole situation, and automatically. Everyone has its own biomechanics and the recommendations from coaches are normally the same. Neither is right or wrong do whatever you please and make your game better. Try new techniques ... why not? Nice video Bro
That's awesome! :) Would be super interesting to hear some examples on what you do with your hands in what situations! It's really cool how quickly the body can adapt to things, like change the hand position if the ball is going towards the hands for example.. Sometimes when I play nowadays it's like I'm just observing my body doing cool stuff and I'm like wondering "where the hell did that come from?!" when some stuff happens hahah, it's so fun! :)
Hi Alex. Been wondering where you have been with new content? Could you give us a heads up? Your content is by far the best online. Thanks
Hey! Yeah the honest truth is that I have really struggled getting content done since this pandemic started, both did the restrictions hit me and my life and my ways of making a living super super bad so I basically spent months just repairing damage from that so I wouldn't lose tons more money and then after that (also during) I have honestly struggled with mental stuff from the restrictions as well. Not that I have been crazy depressed for months and months (although there were some bad moments last fall when weather and restrictions were getting worse and worse) but I have realized that making these videos takes a lot of capacity both in terms of thinking (so that I say only things that I will be able to stand up for for years to come and make really insightful videos) but also the actual camera performance. I need to be in a good state and positive about life to be able to create content with the quality I want to. And that has basically not happened enough since this pandemic started. I made a video in the start of the fall when I thought things were about to go to the better. I then made another one in december/january. Both of those times unfortunately the shitshow continued past what I had imagined possible which meant still no capacity to make videos..
Now, actually about 2,5 weeks ago something changed for me. Bali had a day called silent day, it's like a day where you can't go out and it's supposed to be for meditation and reflection. Well that was what happened I started meditating again and reflected a lot over things and that in combination with Bali nowadays being almost back to normal in terms of lack of restrictions have finally turned my mood it seems like. I finally have started feeling like in 2019 and start of 2020 and I'm slightly optimistic I'll be able to keep this mood (which opens up my capacity to create) hopefully all the way until this pandemic is over. Can't say for sure yet but I hope, I actually recorded a video last week and it should be done for release in the next few days..! :)
Wow that got long quick. Anyway thanks for checking in and thanks for the kind words. Last year has probably been the most difficult in my life and a lot of short term damage has been made, hopefully in the long term I'll make it out stronger and better than ever though.
This is pretty mind blowing, thanks for this. For the extra flat "best" platform you mention @ 10:20 I take it you don't have many situations where it's needed or have time to setup? You mention you don't even use it to bump set as the asymmetrical platform is sufficient for bump sets as well. I imagine at your level of play most of the serves will be floats and spikes fairly hard hit too
Haha right? Against what most coaches teach yet tons of pros doing it! :)
Yes so you are right, I personally never use that platform type, because the times I'd have time to put it together I haven't found a need for it, and the times I don't have time for it, well, it just works worse than what I do currently.
I basically just showed it in the video for the reason for people to get up even more imagination for their own platform discoveries. We all have vastly different arms and bodies, so maybe someone out there will find that they can create that sort of platform very quickly and effortlessly.. if that's the case, then go for it! Actually as I am writing this I am realizing that there's a chance I am just stiff in some muscle which is hindering me putting that kind of platform together, and if I stretched that muscle out I could put this even wider and flatter platform together lightning fast as well... Maybe this is another experiment (one than takes more time than just a technique change since it also involves remodeling of the body) I need to run some day in the future?
Does this make sense? I want to encourage people to experiment and discover how their own arms can make a platform as flat and big as possible when allowing themselves to not only listen to conventional wisdom. However, I'd recommend not adapting a technique that takes excessive time and muscular effort to put together because of the quickness factor.
But in a sense there are no rules. I have used this type of platform that I show in the video now for a few years and found way more success than with the conventional platform teachings, but it is entirely possible that I will one day be able to stretch and remodel my body so that I can create an even bigger and better platform lightning fast, and in that case I'll probably change to that technique! :)
And regarding the sharing to your friends comment that I saw in my notifications but for some reason can't find here (??🤔🧐): Thanks! Sharing my videos is one of the best ways to support the work I do so I can make this project into the grand vision I have for it sooner, I really appreciate all the help! :)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast I thought I double commented so I deleted the first one. Got to try this asymmetrical platform today and my passes/digs have never felt more solid and dependable. Thanks a ton! Will definitely be sharing with friends :)
@@sirownsalot13 Amazing!! So happy to hear! :)
Nice bro
Thankss! :)
It took me some time to get an understanding how to adapt it to my arms...I simply couldn’t have a platform
And once I got it...too late more or less : difficult to change a technique after 20 years of VB. This didn’t block me in my carrer cause a changed to opposite setter :) but realised that in critical points like finals. By miracle my instinct took the control and was doing really miracles. I hope 🤞 in BV since I am starting officially, I can deal with this
I just discovered your channel and I must say that you have amazing content. I make my platform by using my fist. It's working for me till now and I don't feel like changing it. I can bump a ball a bit higher by using this platform rather than using the traditional one. What's your view on my platform?
Thanks! :) Ohh interesting! My guess is your underarms are close enough to eachother to not create the problem I have and that I talk about in the video (there being sort of "problem spots" where the ball bounces irrationally.) Then my second guess is that by creating the platform with using your fist, actually your platform is sort of created by bones rather than flesh (turning the arms inwards puts a bony part where the ball touches while the more traditional platform with more outwards turned arms turns more flesh and muscle where the ball touches) which creates a harder platform that the ball bounces off better. Actually the womens national team coach for norway recommends this technique in his beach volleyball book because it then requires less effort for the ball to bounce where it needs to go and the less effort you need to put in, the later you can make your decisions which means you can be more accurate (hope that makes sense, it's in a way similar to what I talked about im either this video or the followup one on why I decided to not use a super turned out platform that actually physically is the flattest and biggest platform I can create - it takes too long and too much muscle tension to create to be efficient against fast changing float serves for example.)
As a general rule, I'd say experimentation is good, but stick to what works for you, we are all different. Maybe going to a wall for 30 minutes and trying out wall passing with every single platform technique you can think of would lead you to discovering a platform that leads to 5% better outcomes in your future passing? If that would be the case then surely it is worth those 30 mins. But maybe you realize that you cannot find a better platform technique for you than what you already use, and if that's the case, well, now you will feel even more confident in your platform choice which is also an advantage.
If your arms are close to eachother even with the fist technique so that the bony parts of your arms create a nice bouncy platform that is fast to create, I can actually see how this could be something very close to the "ultimate platform" with a combination of genetics and technique. The thing I'd be concerned about is if you are also able to play balls with control off of your hands, as this is actually more important than a lot of people realize, since the hands are both the furthest reaching point as well as something that can both change angles and add power into the ball compared to the rest of the platform. Hope this makes some sense, not always easy to describe with text! :)
Dude. Thank you.
Makes a difference doesn't it? :)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast Totally. I was just talking to a teammate about this yesterday and commented on his ability to touch forearms so he showed me a stretch to use but I don't see how I'd ever be able to touch them with my broad shoulders. I tried your technique last night and instantly improved my passing.
@@trevormadden8096 Makes sense! Yes I think stretching can give some gains for some people, but then theres anatomies that you just simply can't stretch into place.. So we then need to find some different solutions! :)
Good
Thankss! :)
Nice video. Unfortunately for me, the way my arm mechanics and shoulder width are, even the adjustment you suggested doesn't create that nice flat platform. I can work extra hard and really raise my shoulders and squeeze them, but its very uncomfortable and doesn't provide a completely flat platform even then. Personally I don't mind however, since I've found a pretty good way to set, pass, and bump even with the "triangle" elbows you speak of. I think if you practice enough you will be able to master any position/ way of setting/passing/receiving.
Interesting! Yes, some people cannot get the arms together even with what I suggest here. Often it works better forthem if they "flatten out" the arms so that basicallythe two triangles don't face eachother at all, but face straight up instead. Is that what you do?
I also do think one can do some impact on shoulder mobility with stretching, the amount of impact depending on how far from "maximum mobility" one happens to be naturally of course.
Thanks! I try this! Where are you from?
Awesome, hope it helps! :) I was born in Finland but moved to Sweden when I was 12 years old, so grew up in both places. I guess I'm Scandinavian! :) What about you?
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast Already tried! And yes, it works!
So, I am German Teacher from Kaliningrad, Russia. I have my channel about German language last 6 years. And play Beachvolleyball last 4 years - your tips and tricks are really useful - thanks a lot!
Hope to visit Scandinavian one day, its not so far from me:)
p.s. my English is not so good as German:)
Nice video, by the way where are you shoot this video? Jungle? :)
Hehe, pretty much! :) It's in Bali haha, but it is quite noisy here so had to flee out into some nature to not have a bunch of background noise in the video! :)
When are you launching the serve receive course?
Basically as soon as I possibly can.. or here's the preliminary plan:
I will sometime this year (hopefully quite soon) prelaunch either 50 or 100 spots for a "founders club", basically a group of people of early adopters of this project that will always get a stronger voice than others. Basically this "founders club" will be a relatively cheap one time payment for lifetime access to all future courses I will ever create in this project, plus that the founders club members will get to vote about which courses I should create before which ones (in the perfect world I could just make all the courses like serve receive, setting, hitting, defense etc overnight, but in reality that's just not the case and I need to choose which one to do before which..) Founders club members will also in general just have a special place in my heart haha for believing in all of this, who knows what this project will be in 20 years but if it becomes what I am aiming for then it could one day be kinda cool to be able to know one was a big part of the foundation of it! :)
So in reality what this means is that if serve receive will be a bigger wish for the founders club than other topics, then that will go down first. For me personally it doesn't really matter in which order I create thr courses, I just want to make the majority of early adopters and believers happy. I am currently working on onboarding my first employee to help me with all of this so that I can basically make more happen in less time, because the faster I can get all this content out of my head, the better..!
Not sure if that was the answer you were looking for, but as of right now that is unfortunately the case and the only way to get "direct access" is through my coaching, which is a more expensive way to make it happen, but then of course the teaching gets tailored and fit to exactly your needs so in the end there is still a chance it is the cheapest option once one considers all the time and money and circumstances that go into the whole process! :)
Hope this makes sense! And oh yeah, the email list subscribers will be the first ones to hear about the founders club launch and get the best price, so that's why I every now and then encourage people to go to my website and sign up! :)
sick
Hell yeah! 😎
Realized this too after a while playing, since i wanted a more plain platform. Always felt a bit weird doing this other technique, since the diamond platform seems to work for everyone else. Thank you for the new thoughts about sliding in to the diamond platform :).
- Beware of a nerdy reflection: do you think there could be benefits to try learning putting the hand the other way around, i mean putting the right hand under the left hand and vice verca? I just see that with the alternative technique one of the hands/arms sometimes reaches further than the other hand/arm, if it slides out of the handplatform. Which could be useful.
(Personally i believe in learning things both with the right hand aswell as the left hand, etc.).
Awesome! Yes, regarding the switching between platform types if the ball hits the hands, I think it becomes quite natural after a while, especially if you have had a period in your life earlier where you played strictly with the standard "diamond" platform.
Regarding the nerdy question...! Yess, I see your point! One arm does reach further, which in theory should or could give less range of motion when taking the ball on one of the sides for example. This, however, I think is mostly an assumption based on that your twisting abilities of the core are 100% equal in both directions, if you get better mobility/flexibility in the direction that becomes harder to reach because of the asymmetric platform, problem MIGHT be solved. And this asymmetry of core twisting mobility might even become reality automatically from just playing with an asymmetric platform over time.
Now, if we had developed our core twisting abilities to 100% of our potential in both directions, one could argue that then the asymmetric platform would make passing on one side easier than the other. I have not measured and I am just speculating here, but I believe that to reach 100% of our beach volleyball passing functionality, we don't need 100% of our core twisting potential available. Maybe we just need 75% of it on one side, which would mean we maybe need 80% of it on the side that becomes more problematic because of the asymmetric platform.. Regardless both of these are attainable because they fall well within the range of "mobility possibility" that our bodies have.
There however could be more factors to this that I am not thinking about, let me know if you think there is! Your question led me go further into this question than before so this is partially new territory of thought for me! :)
So all of that said, I have not learned the asymmetric platform in both directions, and so far I think this has been a wise decision for the arguments I laid out above. But I also do know that the body is amazing at learning things and it would probably be possible to learn to automatically put the platform together in different ways depending on which side of the body one puts it together on.
If you go ahead with the project of trying to teach your body this, please let me know the results when you have them! Would be super fun to know! I'd start with just walking around at home putting my platform together in both of the ways (actually you'd have 4 ways to put it together if you want the diamond platform solution to be a part of the repertoaire as well, left hand under asymmetric&diamond, and right hand under asymmetric&diamond) until all of them feel super natural and quick, then I'd go to a wall and pepper with the wall on both sides, making sure hands come apart inbetween every rep and form in the right way depending on which side of the body the ball is and whether it will hit the underarms (asymmetric grip) or hands (diamond platform grip.) Once this is easy I'd start doing it in more and more gamelike situations on the court, still making sure the platform type is always "correct" for the type of touch that is happening. After a while it should automatize in the body so you can stop thinking about it and it just happens automatically.
It would be a bit of work, and I am so far not convinced this work would be the best use of time for my own situation for trying to progress as a player, but would love to hear how it goes for you if you try! If you want any more thoughts or have questions about the "progression" I laid out above, let me know, I wanna support missions like this! 😅
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast . Thank you for the input. The mobility in the core is as you say an important factor for how the platform angle will be. Aswell as how far out you'll reach with a safe platform.
- I just think of the easy experiment of putting the right hand out as far as possible to the right horizontely and see which platformgrip that feels easiest (with the least effort). In my case i feel like using the asymetric grip when putting the left arm out as far as possible horisontely.
- Otherwise i would say that when using the alternative technique (not diamond) it feels like one hand is the dominant one, which is the one that will control the finemotor skills a bit more. I do believe there could be benefits to alter the grip for the nondominant arm to be able to be "dominant" and just as sensitive. However this is just thoughts, since I also believe both hands move simoultaneously and probably are controlled by the same motor neurons in the brain.
- The last thought about this, is that when needing to do really quick reactions in the game. The hands needs to be put together with one on top of the other. If youre able to get a safe grip regardless of which hands gets on top of the other , I THINK you'll have more options during the game.
- Summary: I think that in the long run there will be benefits in being able to use all 4 grips. Therefore i will start train this, with the easy wall practices you mention. Then see if i feel any noticeable change. I still believe this is such a small part of the game to focus on improving, but stil so easy to test out, so Ill get back to you about the progress ;).
@@mickeg3 Hahah amazing! Love the thought process, and the dedication, and the conclusion. I'd be right there next to you trying the same stuff out, weren't it for me already being with hands full of other volleyball experiments that I also want to run haha. But yes, definitely keep me updated! Maybe film some snippets here and there about the progression? This could become a feature video on the channel one day if you wanted to! :)
I think karch said this in a video. He mentioned one or two names that grab their pinky to really open up their platform is what he said. I think he also wrote in his book or in a video about three platforms to have for indoor. The pancake sausage platform for serve receive, I think two fists together for spikes, and I forget the third one.
Oh, interesting! I can imagine back in the days when people were just figuring the sport out, this kind of knowledge and openness to different ways of doing things was much more common. Then came sort of this "indoctrination period" where one thing (that surely works for most people most of the time but not for everyone all the time) became sort of common knowledge as "the only way", which is highly damaging to the sport as a whole I think. Anyway, you don't happen to remember where you found that video? It would be super interesting to see! I will also read more from Karches book, I have one of them but haven't found the time to read all of it yet..!
Learn Beach Volleyball Fast I will look for it in about 7 hrs. I was going to look before I posted but I had to go to work. If it wasn't karch who said it in video, I think I'll be able to refind whoever said it.
Oddly enough, I just started messing with my platform grabbing my ring and pinkie while bump setting this past week. My own experience so far is everything you've mentioned in this video, especially with serve receive.
@@tonybowen455 Amazing! Yeah no stress, do it whenever you have time! But I'd love to see it if you find it! :)
That's super cool. I'm really for experimenting and trying things and having a healthy amount of questioning going on. No coach was ever able to give me a satisfying answer on why it would still be better for me to use the "diamond grip platform" when it was clear my arms were far apart like that and balls often hit only one arm producing shanks. I changed my grip and my game transformed to something way better and way more fun. If someone will be able to provide me with a reason that stands stronger than my reasons though, I'll always be open to change my mind again. But as long as the ball doesn't change size and especially as long as we have a ball that floats as much as the Mikasa VLS300, I think those reasons will have to be quite damn big. But we will see! :)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast I like messing with stuff. So if someone says to position a body part to somewhere on the court, I like trying a few diff things to see why. I have a feeling you're the same way.
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast Time got away from me today, and I have to sleep to get up for vball before work again. I found my Sandman book, but I can't find Championship Volleyball. The three platforms were in that, but you're prob more interested in the video where the person talked about one beach player who grabbed their pinkie. I think the platforms were only for indoor. For beach everyone prob does the diamond one or some form of it, and then whatever is fastest to dig a spike.
I just found this. Is weird because I've watched it before, but never caught that he said someone grabs their left thumb with their right hand. I tried it, and it's pretty close to what I was doing with my left hand grabbing my pinkie + ring fingers on my right hand, but the thumb way feels better and I think my platform is better. I'll try it tom. Oh, I'm right handed ofc! ua-cam.com/video/wmgT_Pi91S8/v-deo.html
This is a great elevate yourself vid on karch's platform. I didn't know he used this wacky one. Maybe it's the third platform he showed in his book: ua-cam.com/video/N5TfXIrXA2s/v-deo.html
going tomorrow to practice)
Nice! Did it help in any way? :)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast I tried to use wrist adjustment but finally came to standard platform
nikiforov konstantin Nice! For most people the standard platform is the best thing, it's really just for people with "bad arms" that need the other version, but experimentation is usually good anyway, now you know! :)
Eye opener! (For weird-plattformed people like us, I guess :) )
Hahah, yes! I wish someone had taught me the contents of this video a few years before I figured it out myself.. But that didn't happen and I suffered shanks because of it, but hopefully I can help others avoid that with this video! :)
I play outdoor and have that exact platform. I also have the same platform indoor and it works for me too. Does this platform go for indoor too?
Heyy! I have no idea how I missed this comment, I guess UA-cam didn't notify me.. But anyway, here I am!
So yes, I haven't played tons of indoor volleyball myself, but I can't really see why it wouldn't be the same for indoor. If anything, the indoor ball might be the tiniest bit smaller, and pumped harder, and both of those factors make it even more critical that you get your arms close together. So as far as I can see, it should work just as well or even better for indoor, with the reservation that there could always be some factor that I have missed (because honestly I don't have ton of experience indoors!)
Did you have time to try it both indoors and outdoors in these months since you posted the comment? Any thoughts in that case? :)
I developed your same platform by myself, some coaches said I could use it while others not like you said. I was overthinking every day if my platform needed to change or not, then i found your video.
But I tend to use the traditional platform when i have to dive in order to defend a short ball cause I don't bend my elbows naturally with "our" platform, so do you?
Awesome! :) Umm, I'd say if I dive for a short ball I am more prone to take the ball on my hands (and in this case I do change the the traditional grip so I can bounce the ball up a bit extra) rather than still hitting the ball on my forearms but bending the elbows. But that said, I actually don't know what grip I use in the rare occasions where I bend my elbows and hit the ball with my forearms (never reflected over it), but trying it out in the air here at home makes me feel like it is more natural with the traditional grip because then the elbows line up with eachother.. So my guess is I actually do the same as you! :)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast thank you for the answer
@@giorgiorosson2446 Thank you! If you end up having any insights/realizations later on, feel free to come back and share them! :)
My pecs are way too developed to have anything less than two inches between my forearms.
😅😅 Hahah been to the gym alot? Can you get your arms together more if you I guess increase the angle between your arms and torso, so that your pecs don't end up inbetween your upper arms but rather under your arms? Some people say "bring your shoulders to your ears" when you create your platform, which leads to roughly the same thing.
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast That definitely helps! Lots of work to figure out how to incorporate the diamond hands and the shoulder ears into a workable platform that isn't lopsided or twisted.
It feels really stressful on my upper traps all the way through my neck--just need to get used to it?
Omg that is what i have been telling to everyone around me all the time... so for me there is 2 things that makes me frustrated .. one is that my platform is very bad. Its not flat at all ... and no matter how many tricks i do or how i position my arms .. i just cant create a flat(or even close to flat) platform :( people dont realize how much more focus and energy and accuracy i have to use to pass good serve... the other thing is with setting.. my thumb finger is very rigid wont bend back so it creates a very rigid and bad "basket" so it makes me much more difficult to handset... beacuse of my failure to create a nice "basket" with my hands... it just breaks my heart that i got bad genes for volleyball because i have these big disadvantages.. and its sad because i really have a very good ball control and talent for this sport but makes it very difficult to get to a higher level... and i just love this sport.
Damn, I feel you.
How much time/effort have you tried putting into working on mobility, basically work that would actually allow the shoulders to get into a different position for the platform, and the thumb for the handset?
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast i tried to stretch the thumb finger backwards, but i dont think it can be affected with stretching. And as for the forearm platform i tried so many positions, but still have no success with a straight platform .. i guess i have to accept my imperfect one and work with what i have :)
@@jorgpeter4384 I was thinking more about stretching the upper back (basically make sure the shoulder blades can be further away from eachother), in my experience it can make a huge difference..!
Ohh thanks i will give that a try!
Karch Kiraly dislocated his elbow as a child - result his forearms fit perfectly together - watch one of his old matches
Yes I've heard that too! Not sure I'd be willing to go as far as voluntarily dislocating my elbow to make my platform better haha, but in the end it is a fact that we have different starting points in our biology for creating a good platform.
One thing I've been thinking about is - if you play volleyball since you are a kid (before your arms are fully developed), meaning you put your platform together often also during the time you grow, will your joints etc adapt to make sure you will always be able to put your arms together well? Like will your joints be a bit more lax if you constantly stretch them during the time you grow up?
I guess I'll never get the answer, but my guess is that it should be able to have some impact actually!
Watch Jake Gibb too he really hyper extends elbows and shrugs especially when bump setting
@@vbsand5882 Yess! Actually with bumpsetting you usually have some more time to assemble your platform super super tight compared to a serve receive, I am open to the idea that for some people it would be optimal to have a different way to put your platform together for bumpsetting compared to serve receive, even though I know that's probably a very uncommon opinion..! :)
Where are you filming this?
Bali! :) Why?
Ah, i see. I'm Indonesian and find your background view somehow familiar. It has Indonesian vibe 😄
Is this Vietnam?
Not quite! :)
But doesn't that limit ur passing to only one side? For example with ur platform, it wud be harder to pass on u4 left side bc u can't turn ur wrists??
In some sense yes, for example the platform I use, my right arm is further down/stretched out more than my left which means my torso needs to open more to take balls on my left side compared to my right. At least in theory, in reality I haven't felt any problems whatsoever so my guess is that my body has adapted and has become the tiniest bit more flexible when turning to the left. Even if there would be a slight problem, for me personally with my arms I am 95% sure it would still be a better solution than using the standard platform, since then I have problems on all sides and not only on my left. But this is individual for everybody because we all have different bodies and arms. Some techniques for some people create tradeoffs, one thing gets better and another thing worse, if this is the case, then we should try to choose the technique that leads to the least amount of problems. (Note also that what creates the least amount of problems can be different in the short and long term, so we also need to know what our goals and visions are.. Hope this makes sense without an example, let me know if it doesn't!)
Did I answer your question? Not sure exactly what you mean with turn tour wrists, so I'm not 100% sure if we see the same problem with taking balls on the left side! I also think I discussed this a little bit in the followup video I made to this one. :)
Ur right, u did mention that in ur next video haha, my bad.
But for me, (more of an indoor player) I used to do the fist platform where u make a fist with one hand and cover it with the other (my right hand was a fist). But I noticed that I could get hard driven balls on my right side but not on my left (I'm also right handed so maybe coordination factors in but).
I think this problem was bc the unevenness in my grip. It didn't allow me to turn effectively turn my wrists to face forward (instead of straight upwards like with balls at the midline). So I changed to the normal platform
I kno that everyone use different platforms, but I'm curious if anyone in the indoor world uses this?
Also, I think most ppl are not able to put both of their forearms together so I'm curious why ppl still teach this. There has to be some value in it ya kno?
@@bballinbasics Good questions!
The hand on fist technique is a technique I haven't used or played around with myself, so I'm not so familiar with what it feels like. In my experience, when balls on the side of your body go upwards or even backwards instead of forwards, this is mostly a problem with how you are used to using your core in passing rather than how you grip your platform. That being said, I could see a possibility that the standard grip somehow frees you up to use your core more efficiently than the hand on fist method (for whatever reason) or maybe there is something else going on. Sometimes our bodies are so different that something I can't imagine happen with my body when changing a grip all of the sudden makes complete sense why it would make the world of difference for you once one sees your body. So I am not sure why you are having this effect, I guess one more guess is that you are less tense in your body with the standard platform compared to hand on fist and that makes your body better at adapting quickly for those difficult serves. A lot of different possibilities here.
Regarding indoor pros using this technique, if I remember right I mentioned Reid Priddy in this video, and a quick google search gave me at least one picture of him with an indoor ball and that type of platform. If this can be seen as proof or not I'll let someone else decide:
ca-times.brightspotcdn.com/dims4/default/f25713d/2147483647/strip/true/crop/1638x2048+0+0/resize/840x1050!/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcalifornia-times-brightspot.s3.amazonaws.com%2F7e%2Fed%2F98d18dc320e1485a5eaa5822932d%2Fsdut-in-this-may-25-2016-photo-u.-20160820
Then I also found a similar picture of Matt Anderson:
www.michigansthumb.com/news/amp/US-volleyball-star-took-a-break-to-restore-9156292.php (picture 4 in the picture scroll.)
Why the standard platform is so widely taught has 3 reasons I think:
1. Even if your elbows can't touch eachother with the standard platform, if your forearms are close ENOUGH for the two triangles being close enough to not make the ball start shanking irrationally (which from my experience is the case for the vast majority of female players and maybe 60% of male players), then, forearmwise there is no point in using my type of platform, it only makes the platform asymmetric which possibly leads to slightly more trouble on one side (your original question) and it makes it more difficult to pass balls that land on your hands - which leads to point 2:
2. Some balls will go on your hands, and in those cases the standard or diamond platform is perfect because there is a flat surface already in place. I created a workaround for my technique with changing to the standard platform when a ball is going to hit my hands but of course it's less work and easier to not need to do that.
3. It has been taught so long and has been the standard for so long that it has become one of those "truths" of volleyball that most people don't even question anymore. Habits can stay wayy longer than they should. If you look at the comments of this video there are a couple that played with the standard platform for over 15 and 20 years (if I remember right!), shanking balls irrationally without ever questioning their platform. I am a guy that questions and experiments a LOT but even for me it took me about 4 years of playing to realize this. When 99% of coaches say this is the best way and everything else is stupid, and they agree with eachother, most new players will simply trust that without questioning and keep spreading the same word. Which is fine, until someone has arms like mine and it keeps them from ever being happy with their serve receive...!
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast i see. really appreciate the response!
Aw this still doesn’t work for me, something must be wrong with my skeletal structure :(
Hmm.. I have discovered that certain stretches can work also. Then of course good passing also comes down to other things than only having a good platform physically. What is it that doesn't work?
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast my arms still don’t touch or get closer. I feel the resistance in my shoulders
@@naya4607 In this case you might be a more extreme case and need stretching, or one could at least explore this and see what happens.. I actually just recently started stretching mine harder and there seems to be more to gain than I initially thought..! Is it like a muscle resistance in your shoulder or more like a bone to bone resistance?
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast I think it’s the muscles near my neck and/or maybe my collar bone? I feel resistance there too
@@naya4607 Hmm.. Maybe you should try stretching a bit and see if it helps? Usually straight after an extended stretch I have temporarily better flexibility (getting the added flexibility to be permanent then requires repeated work over time), but this can then be used as a clue towards if stretching/flexibility work might in the long term (so that the flexibility becomes permanent) be a good answer to the problem.
I am of course open to jumping on a coaching call to explore this further as there's quite a bit of details that go into effective stretching to actually increase one's range of motion permanently without wasting a bunch of time, but you can also just play around with it a bit yourself and see where that brings you! :)
hey coach i know its generally said to be bad but how do you feel about using interlocking fingers on your platform? i think karch kiraly interlocks his fingers you can see in this photo i0.wp.com/coachrey.com/volleyball-blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/karch-kiraly-passing.jpg?fit=300%2C300
also, if my arms can touch at the elbows, does it matter if my arms form a more narrow v or a wide v? is one of them more optimal?
Hey!
Hmm, so if you with interlocking fingers mean this: www.dreamstime.com/interlocked-fingers-white-male-hands-interlocked-black-rustic-wood-table-close-up-top-view-man-waiting-negotiations-image144944729
Then actually my guess is that this is not what Karch is doing in the picture! It's kinda hard to see what he is doing exactly, but since two of his fingers are sticking out, my guess is that the two others are not interlocked, and that in actuality his grip is something similar to what I am suggesting people can try out if the "diamond" shape hands don't work out for them. For example this picture: farm1.static.flickr.com/6/11600946_aad5ae8b4c.jpg I think he has the same hand formation as in your picture, but from this angle I think it's even more clear what he is doing is something quite similar to what I suggest, but I of course can't be 100% sure! :)
Then regarding the V-shape, I guess you mean a V shape if you look atthe player from above? In that case, the wider your V is, the further away the ridges of your arms will be from eachother the closer to the elbows you pass the ball (which makes the geometrical moel I talk about in this video be of more effect), which I think for almost everyone will be a bad thing... Since there are so many different types of forearms out there I wouldn't be too surprised if there was someone out there that this rule wouldn't apply for because they have arms that I can't even imagine the shape of right now, but I think for the vast majority, a wider V will be a disadvantage. Does that make sense? :)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast From the pictures I've seen of Karch's passing platform, he has his lift ring and pinky finger between his right pointer and middle finger so there is one point of interlocking so I'm pretty sure he does have some of his fingers interlocked. You should be able to see it in this picture www.zimbio.com/photos/Karch+Kiraly/AVP+Toyota+Hermosa+Beach+Open/NgLRXusPIa2
If this is the case, is it ok to do or is the risk of injury (i.e. ball hitting interlocked fingers) too great to try it?
@@joshz6236 Ahh yes, that was a better picture!
I mean, there are no rules about this, so of course it is ok to do it and Karch was one of the best (although in an era with a different ball which actually could change things.)
My biggest concern with what Karch is doing is I could see it taking just a little bit longer to interlock your fingers like that vs not interlocking them like I do. Every little thing that makes you slower at putting your platform together will make you worse at reacting to those crazy float serves that can happen at least with the Mikasa VLS300 ball. Another thing I'd be slightly worried about (although this is very little) would be injury if you happen to somehow clash your fingers together and bend them if you "miss" when trying to intrrlock your fingers fast, or if there is a greater chance of injury if/when the ball hits your hands or your hands hit the sand/net sometimes.
Hmm, I guess it would also be slightly more difficult to switch from Karches hand position to the "diamond" hand position when a ball is about to hit the hands, than it is from "my" hand position to the "diamond" one.
But all in all, if what Karch does is comfortable for you, you feel you can put your platform together fast with it, it doesn't feel unsafe doing it for you and you feel you either never need to switch hand positions quickly when the ball is about to hit your hands or you can do it quickly, and you feel there is some sort of benefit (psychological or physical or something else doesn't matter) to using Karches hand position, then why not? :)
I'd say the forearms creating a good platform (this is where the vast majority of balls will bounce anyway!) is the most important thing whatever hand position you choose, and experimentation with an open mind is healthy. Why not for example try one technique for a month and another technique for another month and then see what feels best? :)
@@LearnBeachVolleyballFast Okay thanks coach! I hope things are going well with you with all this coronavirus stuff!
@@joshz6236 Yes, hope my thoughts help somehow! :) Yess, everything is relatively normal nowadays, luckily enough I had the choice and ability to go to Sweden, here it's pretty much business as normal! Hope things are going well with you too! :)
Hii bro
Yoo!
Well I’ve been wondering… “there must be something wrong with me, I can’t have my foreams parallel, it’s more of an inverted triangle”… 😂😅🤣 So yes, when i hit dead center, it’s awesome, if not, it’s awesome for the opponents… 😏
Hahaha! 😁 Always awesome for someone, right? 🙃
Gym teachers still teach lacing the fingers :/
You need a microphone on you when you are a bit away
Yess! The making of this video was actually what made me decide it's time to upgrade my equipment! I now have a wireless "lapelle" mic (the one you put on your tshirt for example), so future videos will have better sound quality! :)
2:15 is when the video starts. Sorry man, but the intro was just way too long
I see your point, but I also know that for example the racket analogy in the beginning of the video is what sticks in many players minds and really drives the point home, and therefore has a lot of value for many.. :) There are plenty of people doing less detailed, shorter (and possibly less accurate and even misleading) volleyball tutorials than me, so one can always go watch those if one has a short attention span and doesn't mind possibly getting stuck with quick maybe good sounding but false ideas that will make one play at suboptimal levels for years to come... :)
A part of the mission with this project is to fight that "quick tips that destroy volleyball careers"-effect, so therefore I take my time to explain the deeper details to those who want them, and care about them.
So to each their own, there is no right or wrong really. I totally understand the "I just want some quick pointers and not a whole seminar on physics" mentality too, I have it myself also in for example sports that I just dabble in and want to get a little better in, but don't really deeply care about. But in the end, you are pretty unlikely to see me create that kind of content for beach volleyball, even if I do constantly work on trying to make my delivery more compact and better! :)
Hii bro
Yoo!