Late 70s Ludwig Supraphonic LM400 Restoration
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- Опубліковано 24 жов 2021
- Time to restore the most recorded snare drum of all time - the Ludwig Supraphonic 5X14 LM400. This video showcases the process of restoring this neglected drum and giving it new life!
Products used:
Eagle One's Never Dull - amzn.to/3vBer1X
Blue Dawn - amzn.to/3vEB9Xa
Brasso - amzn.to/3BaT8p0
Remo Quicktech Drum Key - amzn.to/3C3iKFE
Remo Ambassador X Coated Drumhead - amzn.to/3m6tVbh
Remo Ambassador Snare Side Drumhead - amzn.to/2Za3gkG
Ludwig P88 Throw off/Butt Plate - amzn.to/3B1fcm0
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Late 70s Ludwig Supraphonic LM400 Restoration
#LudwigSupraphonic #DrumRestoration #MetalDrum #VintageDrum
Glad to to see someone loves ludwigs as much as I do! I've restored several vintage sets and found that there are a lot of car care products that work well to keep your drums shiny and clean.
Oh nice - which restoration was your favorite to finish?
I have a 1963 15” Ludwig marching snare. Sounds awesome. Classic Ludwig snare drums are some of the best sounding snare drums made.
Couldn't agree more! I have a 15" WFL marching snare I've yet to try out, though I'm sure it packs a punch. Just love the sound of vintage Ludwig
@NickCostaMusic
I have my marching snare and a normal snare set up with my drumset . The marching snare adds a heavy punch to hard rock songs.
Woah - does it have a kevlar head too?
Looks great man. I have a '78 Ludwig 5-piece that I'm currently working on after sitting in storage for 15+ years (I've owned it for 27 years in total, got it when I was 12). It came with an LM400, and although I had no idea I owned such an iconic drum when I was a kid, I always loved the way it sounded compared to my Premier snare. Supras are one of the greatest things Ludwig ever made, IMO. Everyone loves the 402's because of John Bonham, but the 400's have a sharpness/crack to them that is really unique. Great work! 👍🏻
I agree, way more direct sound. Just love how both the 400 and 402 are super versatile.
@@NickCostaMusic absolutely. The 402's definitely have their place, and I might be trying to find one to add to the kit if I didn't already have that 6.5x14 Premier. Who am I kidding, I'll probably still get one eventually. 🤣
@@AllThingsMech good thing you can find them a decent prices, too 😉
My favorite drum of all time. Great video and nice playing!
It’s a must have in any drummers collection. Appreciate the kind words and thanks for checking out the vid!
@@NickCostaMusic I have a 70s lm410 and a new lm400 and love them both
Like you're videos, like you're work. I got a 400 never leave home without it! Great sounding snare drum. Now I am going to clean it.
Right on, Patrick! There's a reason it's the most recorded snare drum of all time. Appreciate you checking out the vid, and enjoy that 400!
Great job with the video here, Nick. Thanks. After watching three other LM400 rehab videos here on YT, I am shocked at how consistently good they sound without any microphone trickery, audio production, or anything.
Pretty crazy, right?! There’s a reason they’re the most recorded snares. Just subtle EQ to clean up the microphone and good to go. Appreciate you checking out the vid, and for the kind words 🙏🏼 🥁
Great job man! Love seeing these restorations
Thank you! Comments like this are truly appreciated - helps me determine what type of content is preferred.
Great video! Made the same P88 conversion on my -77 Ludvig Acrolite. Put on new 2.3 mil hoops at the same time, that made tuning more robust.. Your restored snare sounds great, a keeper!
Many Thanks! You can’t go wrong with a new p88, and the heavier 2.3 hoops help not only control the sound, but they won’t warp like the thinner ones do.
Appreciate ya checking out the vid!
I have a Ludwig 400 snare of a similar age and condition which hasn’t been played for a long while. Your video has inspired me to clean it up as you have and use it again.
Aw yeah - that's the spirit! Such versatile drums that sound great in any tuning. Have fun with the process and reach out if you have any questions. Happy to help anyway that I can!
Supraphonic and black beauty is the best snares worldwide ! Have the same snare. Excellent sound. Nice video! Love Ludwig!!!
I agree, and also love the 6.5x14 copperphonic Ludwig released on their 110 anniversary. Those 3 are a killer combo.
Appreciate the kind words!
Great drum!!!
Couldn't agree more! Appreciate you checking out the vid
Mojo! Super good sound on it!
Not many have it, but when they do man can you tell!
Appreciate you checking out the vid 🙏🏼
Sounds great 👍
Appreciate it - supraphonic's have that ideal snare sound for sure.
Thank you for checking out the vid!
One of the 'go to' snare drums a classic. I have an early '80's model (black and white shell badge) the 'Supersensitive' version it is a great drum the only issue is positioning in a kit situation can be tricky due to the snare guards. Mine has very little of the 'pimpling' of the chrome plating often seen on older chrome Supraphonics. Nice job restoring that drum.
There's a reason they're the most recorded snare drum in history. Love the super sensitive! I usually try to position the guards at the 1 and 7 o' clock position, but yeah - I totally understand the frustration. I appreciate the kind words, and thank you for checking out the vid 🙏🏻🥁
The black and white badge snares are metal. That's why you dont have any pitting.
The Supraphonic is a chrome plated aluminum shell. Chrome doesnt take to aluminum well. This is why you see so many pitted supras.
2 totally different drums.
Man, I just got a lm400, that was new in 78, I did the exact same thing as u, I put a Remo Fiberskyn 3 Diplomat on mine, Ambassador snare side, mine also, has been upgraded to the p88 ac throw off, which is a great throw off, it sounds fantastic!! Just like urs does!! Excellent design!! Great drum!!!
Fantastic! So amazing how fresh heads can make a difference. People knock off the p88ac, but it's MUCH more reliable and sturdy than the p85.
The fyberskin 3 diplomat is pretty thin, isn't it? How are the overtones being it's a metal snare?
@@NickCostaMusic fantastic actually, I don’t use the internal muffler, but I do use one drum gel. Sounds fantastic!
@@NickCostaMusic I used to use FS3 Ambassador weight, but I prefer the thinner Diplomat, I can hear more of the drum, and if it’s too much, u can muffle it. U really can’t brighten up an Ambassador, so, it’s just my personal preference. The Ludwig WeatherMaster medium, is another one, that I like a lot, on the 400.
sick
Many thanks! What did you like most about the transformation?
Yes you are right on all the Chrome over brass Ludwig drums I’ve ever seen The letter “B” was stamped Under and behind the Tone control knob
Good to know! Appreciate the insight, Neal 🙏🏼
@@NickCostaMusic : No problem buddy, good luck!
Yo! If by now you don’t know… on the butt plate, the black plastic gasket can be removed to expose holes that DO line up with the drums hole pattern! Threads can easily be tapped in and the button plate can be applied. I’ve done it several times. Cheers!!
Yes - I saw that online after the fact! Genius design, and I appreciate you giving the tip
@@NickCostaMusic, Thank you Nick! Keep up the cool video’s!
Many thanks for the kind words and support! 🙏🏼 🥁
Good restoration video. Set aside the smugness. If a drum is well made. It's gonna sound good enough to most people.
Very true! There’s a reason why some studio drums look awful yet sound fantastic.
Appreciate you checking out the video!
I just bought one of these for $100. Lm400 1976. It is in mint condition. All orignial except for muffler knob and spring. I have them in a paper envelope with original key.
That's a fantastic find - great work! Enjoy it and hold on to all that stuff, could make the drum even more valuable in the future.
thanks!
You’re very welcome. Hope this vid gave you some insight if you ever need to clean/restore a snare. Thank you for checking out the vid!
@@NickCostaMusic indeed! I started cleaning my Supra today actually. thanks for the inspiration!
@@JulianFernandez you’re very welcome! Best of luck, and have fun.
Got a ‘76 5x14 supra..can’t go wrong
Such a killer sound, right? I prefer the 5X14 over the 6.5X14
@@NickCostaMusic I also have a 6.5 supra..I like it but I also prefer the 5”
@@ghairmichaud5765 same here - both are great, just prefer the more direct sound of the 5
@@NickCostaMusic much agreed!
Nice clean-up. Do you know of anyone who has attempted a serious restoration, as in strip-and-re-plate? Resto usually means "get it back to showroom." Any leads on steps/supplies/skills needed to get ther?
Getting a shell re-chromed is a little more complicated than a DIY project. It also costs more than what the drum is worth.
Appreciate you checking out the vid! 🥁
Great video made me want to restore mine so looking for some info or threads to follow. I've got a supra that has no badge but looks to be 69 or 70s. It's aluminium with a bit of pitting/bubbling. It obviously has has some "restoration", a p88ac throw off and the batter side rim is thicker than the snare side. The muffler has the 1" knob and the snare butt plate is the block lettering. I don't know which rim is correct and if it worth sorting a badge. It sounds great to me as it is. Any advice you can offer would be appreciated, all the posts I see seem to be years old.
Sorry for the long spiel.
Drum and bits are expensive in UK. Cheers
Usually drums of the 60s/early 70s had a lighter hoop than the traditional 2.3mm that we see today. My guess would be the top is not original, but I'd keep it that way since older 1.6mm hoops are notorious for bending - especially if you're a fan of rim shots.
If you like the way it sounds, then I'd say put some fresh heads on it, maybe new wires if the current ones are stretched out, give it a good cleaning and have at it!
@@NickCostaMusic Thanks from the reply, already have new heads and wires on order. Nothing done with badge but not worried about it. Thanks again
Of course - glad I could help. Enjoy the drum!
Drum is excellent despite the nicks and dings…sound is as new. Rims shots are great and same drum Buddy used in Germany.
Appreciate it, Vincent! Nicks and dings are very common with vintage supra's - a right of passage that gives the drum some extra mojo.
Hi Nick, I own a Supraphonic 5x14" and one of the hoops shows serious surface damage, I tried your aluminum foil method but it seems I was only flaking of more (surrounding / still in tact) material. Do you have any tip for this? And if not, you think any replacement 10-hole hoop will do?
Sorry to hear - if the chrome is flaking off, unfortunately there’s nothing to do to fix it except re-chrome it, which is expensive. A replacement hoop would do just fine. 2.3mm is modern standard and slightly thicker than vintage hoops (which were 1.9mm). If you do a lot of rim shots go with a 2.3mm, but if you want to keep the same sound, 1.9mm is the way to go!
@@NickCostaMusic thanks!
You're welcome!
The pitting isn't due to a lack of care by the previous owner. Some of these drums weren't plated very well. The pitting was an inevitability. Aluminum doesn't take chrome very well. You'll never see this level of pitting on a chrome over brass snare.
Good to know - appreciate the info!
The b for brass was stamped above the tone control,fyi.,those p 83 throw off, holes used string,2 generation,s,one had 2 holes,the other several holes,early 70,s throw off had a short lever,later one longer lever,
Appreciate the info, Arturo - super helpful! Didn't know about the lever lengths.
Please write what is the name of the product you used to clean the drum shell?
I used brasso. You can get some here - amzn.to/3wiJt2R
Thank you !@@NickCostaMusic
You’re very welcome!
You have one of the most New York faces.
Philly, actually - but hey, appreciate you checking out the vid!
Nothing like the sound of a Supraphonic. Is there no way to reduce the sight and feel of the pitting?
Couldn't agree more! Besides keeping it super clean, I'm not sure - I've heard it's just a by-product of the finishing process.
Those throw offs didn’t come with screw on butt ends for the wires. All my Acrolites and my Supraphonic are all like that.
Never knew - thanks for the insight! I still love the new p88AC - sturdier, holds tension, and works beautifully.
@@NickCostaMusic I’m actually going to switch to those after watching this video. I hate how the old throw offs are constantly moving tension. Thanks for the demo on it!
@@Cowboynudes Almost every one of the old throw offs have a bent or broken lever too. The new one is a thicc boi - so that ain't happening!
Still trying to remove pitted chrome from 7 hours ago while working on my 63'......Not fun (ouch)
Definitely - they're like splinters! Unfortunately once the chrome is pitted, the only option is to get it re-chromed. It's a right of passage - clean the shell the best you can, and let the pimples add character!
You didnt touch the badge?
Just with a little brasso
Nice cleaning :)
For the rust, try to use coke (yeah yeah, regular coca cola) on your tin foil instead of WD40, it works better, I think. That's how I remove the rusty spots on my snares :)
Good recommendation! I’ve actually done that to remove rust on tension rods. Soak em in coca-cola, put a drum key on a drill, connect the rod then wipe down with a microfiber. Rinse with water, dry, and good as new!
Is that a “new” real head? It looks like it’s been through hell
Reso *
Sure is!
@@NickCostaMusic crazy, the Evans 3mil doesn’t seem like it was nearly that floppy. 🤷🏼♂️ oh well. Drums sounds great tho
@@jamesgates7821Yeah, not sure what the deal is with it - but it did tune up easily without any problems. Appreciate ya checking out the vid!
Is it just my ears or does anyone else think the 400 brass sounds better?
Definitely a different sound, as brass is warmer with more overtones. I feel brass is more versatile, IMO.