I recently found another clue that she's alive - in the artbook. It's full of Jinx's scribbles and on the first page: "wanna know a secret?" "I am still here" and on the last "I'll be right back" "see ya!"
Yes! Also Jinx dying at the end would mean that only death can be her redemption, which would undo the point of episodes 7 and 9 - taking a leap forward means leaving few things behind / it is never too late to build something new.
I think one of the other issues at hand here is fairness. Why does Jinx get to live when so many innocents died by her hand? Why do all the other "bad" characters/characters who've done bad stuff (Maddie, Marcus, Silco) end up dead and she doesn't? There's also this idea that sacrifice is the ultimate "I'm taking my responsibilities" character development for Jinx in my mind. We're going from a troubled girl who has a hard time taking accountability ("someone put all these bullet holes in you", "well then he shouldn't have died") and just wishes to die meaninglessly, to someone who actually faces the consequences of her actions and gives her death actual meaning, that of saving her sister. That's why I think Jinx's death would have been more in line with the series. Like Walter White at the end of Breaking Bad, or Lelouch at the end of Code Geass (his death is canon for me). But at the end of the day, while my head believes she should have died, my heart is really happy she isn't.
@@krashme997 In a way you can observe death to be an easy way out for Jinx, a sacrifice which in a way is a cliche way to end a character. Marcus, Maddie and Silco never felt remorse for their actions and they would never change, unlike Jinx, who is a product of an extremelly harsh environment. Jinx was created by Powder to keep herself safe. She never cared though about actions of Silco or his vision for Zaun, she helped "him" when needed, like to watch cargo to run smoothly and defending from Fireflights or get a hexgem to show him her strength. People she killed were not innocent in her eyes - she killed Enforcers on Progress day and on the Bridge, killing Marcus among others, as she sees Enforcers as people who killed her parents. Weird as it is, since she did not plan that - all she did was for the Undercity; killing on the bridge ended the barricade put by Jayce, hitting the Council was inevitable since Silco never intended to give her up so we're back to square one, she ended thr Gray by blasting it onto Piltover - she brought back fresh air to the Undercity, saved Isha and Jinxers from Stillwater, united Zaun and brought everyone to the fight against Noxians. All of that showed her change and why she should be forgiven. As we did see what she was like in normal world of AU in episode 7... Product of environment.. Also killing Jinx is a bad idea since she is Arcanes most popular character, people would riot xD
@@krashme997 This is not a fairytale where everyone is either white or black, white of whom should win and black of whom should take a lesson. You can't call anyone purely good or bad and expect "bad" ones to lose. Caitlyn has done many bad things, too (e.g. a fucking war crime), but she got her happy ending.
What i believe is, having her die sends the wrong message, and is an incorrect developement. She did horrible stuff, killed people, having her escape punishment by just dying as a "hero" is horrible, at least for me. She(people) needs to accept her mistakes, own up to them and make them right. Having her go on a self healing journey, fight her demons is a good redemption, would make a great spinoff and it would send a better message. At least in my opinion.
This is probably the most well thought of the "jinx in alive" theorys. I may actually be able to hold tears because of this show; just wait a couple years guys(Ionia, Demacia, Noxus, and other regions)
Yeah. And I mean also its kinda obvious from the deleted scenes. If they were genuinely killing her off, it wouldn't have made sense for them to NOT include them, considering they'd be basically tying down all loose ends. Instead it's mutually beneficial for them to use the scenes retroactively/ as flashbacks for future character development and keep the finale of Arcane focused on the fight against Ambessa and Viktor. But let's call that "metagaming". The way I reached the conclusion from just the series is that Ekko broke the cycle for Jinx by showing her that Jinx has the potential to be good and that she is still just a damaged Powder in the end of the day. The reason she faked her death is because she realized that Vi was also stuck in the same cycle she was, and as long as Jinx existed in Vi's life, Vi would never really be able to move on.
@@00000005547 I sat on my chair for 7 minutes trying to make sense of this. Its also because I haven't had much time to really dig deep into the concept. I didn't realize that her "death" would almost be pointless to the actual story because of the previous 3 episodes. but I guess all we can really do now is dream right? Because Arcane is over
I def think Jinx is alive but now she's free. she's broken the cycle. I don't think it's a matter of her sacrificing herself for Vi but she did see an out; she also nearly blew herself up with Vi until Isha jumped between them. Jinx decided last minute to use her Shimmer speed to get into the vaults, but she would have been happy with the release of death. she knew Vi had Caitlin, Vander was completely lost to them now, Isha sacrificed herself, and she knows there's no way she can atone with the Pilties for all her years working with Silco and the harm she caused. it goes deeper than that as well; girl's got *a lot* of trauma. she's never been afraid of death; quite the opposite, in fact. she's always welcomed it (prob since the night she met Silco, when she inadvertently got Milo and Clagger killed with her good intentions). dont get me wrong-I love Jinx. she's my favorite. but i believe we should all have a choice to leave if we want it. it's not exactly like there are mental health services in Zaun and Piltover. between her manic delusions and ptsd, i absolutely understand where she's coming from. however, I'd be **shocked** if Riot/Fortiche killed their cash cow
Yeah, sure, yes. The themes and narrative undercurrents of Season 2 work better and become clearer if you decouple it from the themes and writicng devices of Season 1. The duality, the parallels, the matching pairs everywhere in te structure. Season 2, in very Arcane fashion, flips their own established tricks and methods and moves into something close, flamiliar, but also new. So the narrative throughlines are not dependant on the same framework as before. Also! Finally! Someone getting ever close to finding and expaining that elusive, mysterious entitiy -- the Schneeheart. Well done.
I agree that you have to view season one and season 2 as separately, narratively. I just think they are trying to do completely different things and that both succeed, it just depends on which kind of story you like more, grounded or fantastical
Makes sense that she would be at Bilgewater. That place is a pirate fortress. An outcast haven for all kinds of the disenfranchised. She’d fit right in.
@@neofulcrum5013 Especially since the Arcane original idea had Powder leave Piltover/Zaun and head to Bilgewater via an airship. But they changed it. Considering an airship at the end does fly over the sea, it could be indeed she is heading there.
@@anabrans2 I think she is on that airship to Bilgewater, because the creators mentioned all spinoffs we all heard off (Demacia,Ionia,Noxus) but they also mentioned Bilgewater. I think that we will see Jinx and Ekko in the Bilgewater spinoff since creators sead they want to continue there story.Or posibly (but I 100% belive it will happen) that we will se Jinx and Ekko in a movie.
Silco saying "I think the cycle only ends, when you find the will to walk away" is so important to this whole thing. At first, Jinx in her broken, depressed and suicidal state takes this as ending herself to be ending the problem, but Ekko convinced her otherwise. The ship at the end sailing away with Jinx possibly being in it makes so much more sense as an ending than her simply dying
There's always been this question in my mind: if Jinx does make a comeback, what is going to be her character arc? It kind of feels like we reached somewhat of a conclusion with her. My best bet would be another Vander arc, more satisfying this time. Why do I think that? 1. Vander kept some of his original design in S9 instead of fully turning onto a robot like the rest. This makes me think he did retain some of his humanity anyway, just like with Viktor when the arcane took over. 2. Vander kept moving after Viktor's death, even though all the other puppets fell apart instantly. Why, if it wasn't for another force driving him. That of the beast, maybe, but if the beast remained, why not the human as well? 3. The flashback right before(or was it after?) Jinx's explosion, in which the only character awake was Vander, so most likely from his perspective. He also did have a flashback when he recognized Vi in ep.5, so what was it this time? One could say it was just there to embellish the scene and make it more tragic, but knowing how Fortiche/Riot like to give a deeper meaning to everything beyond just esthetics, I somehow doubt it. 4. No way he died at the end. Not from that grenade. They never showed his body either, and unless they quickly gloss over it in the next spinoff, just ignoring it would be a major plot hole. He's definitely making a comeback one way or another.
I think Jinx will show up in the spinoff about Noxus-Ionia war. She probably won’t get much screen time and will return to Zaun by the end of the spinoff. Also, if the rumors about a separate Arcane spinoff focusing on its characters are true, it’s possible she’ll head to Ionia with Ekko. In that case, they might travel to eastern Ionia, far from the warzone, where some Ionian characters could also be explored. My focus on the Jinx/Ekko duo makes sense because, after s2e7, these two became super popular within the community. Plus, the Arcane showrunner has shown interest in continuing their story. I doubt Riot would miss the chance to capitalize on this, so I think we’re bound to get a couple of spinoffs in the next 2-3 years. Now, about Vander: 1. Yes, he kept part of his humanity. When Singed discusses Vander’s situation with Ambessa, he mentions that if Viktor fully heals Vander’s mind, the plan to create a monster army won’t work. I think the memories Viktor managed to restore left a permanent mark on Vander’s mind, like fingerprints pressed into his consciousness. 2. Building on that, both the beast and the man are still there. The problem is that Vander already struggled to keep himself in check, and now, with so few memories left, he snaps out of it too late-like when he falls with Jinx. In the new Arcane skin in LoL, Vander/Warwick cries when teleporting to base and seeing a blue-haired doll, which hints that he remembers Powder. 3. Yes, that flashback before the explosion is from his perspective. It shows that Vander, like any decent father, instinctively cares for his daughters. In s1e3, he saves Vi from the fire, and in s2e9, he saves Powder from the explosion. 4. He’s practically immortal. He’ll probably appear in one of the spinoffs set in Piltover/Zaun, at least as a mention in news reports about groups of torn-apart thugs. There’s a good chance Vi and Caitlyn will try to stop him.
I think this is why I find “Jinx Lives” a more satisfying ending. If she does move on and fly somewhere new, then it shows she is letting go of the past rather than succumbing to it and letting it kill her.
the only reason she went from the suicidal girl who didn't want to be a hero at all to someone totally opposite to what she's shown since the series, a hero, is her discussion with ekko, which probably lasted for days before he convinced her to be the jinx we saw at the end of the series, in a long and methodical way, she had to be given a reason to live, (even to eat), then a reason to fight for zaun, all these problems can't be solved in just a few minutes, or a few hours, and even less with a single sentence, all his sentence did was prevent her from committing suicide in ekko's presence, it's her discussion with him afterwards that's the key to her transformation, she's become literally ekko, nothing to do with what she was. Reducing her transformation to what we saw on screen is way too simplistic, it means not understanding Jinx's psychology since the beginning of the series.
I agree with you. For the record the makers of the show did write a scene with Ekko talking with Jinx and convincing her to join the fight against Ambessa. Supposedly it would have included him telling her about the good version of her he met in the other universe, them designing and building the airship and weapons, and even the two of them putting warpaint on each other, which would have been super adorable. But that scene got cut because they felt the last episode was already to long. It's an absolute crime that we didn't get to see that. Granted Jinx and Ekko's entrance in the battle was five different kinds of badass and the prep scene would have undercut the surprise, but still, like you said, we should have gotten to see the emotional catharsis that compelled Jinx to finally take on the role of hero. If Jinx ever does appear again, in one of the spin-offs they're rumored to be working then hopefully they'll use that as an opportunity to finally show us that scene. They could make it a flashback that would show the audience how Jinx has grown and where her character is now. That would be absolutely perfect.
@@vertiac an extremely important scene, fundamental to the development of jinx, the very fact that they decided to remove it for this “surprise” gives the impression that people are more interested in the superficial than in the development of the characters we've been following since the beginning, and the worst thing is that they may be right for most people, they just want spectacle without any real consistency, it's sad.
The themes and undercurrents of Season One are there. It's just that Season Two brought additional ones to the fore to explore while also working with what came before, although admittingly to me it seems Season Two was too overstuffed as a season to explore it all in a way as clearly like Season One. Still I think it's important to look at Season Two as a half of the whole show that is Arcane and see how the two seasons are two halves of a whole. Two halves of a whole that each do their own thing. Also in regards to Jinx living while breaking the cycle, she not only broke the cycle that she was stuck in but what Vi was also stuck in. Vi could never settle down and live for herself for a change, always putting others before herself; be it Caitlyn or Jinx. But she could never move on and goes into a depressive spiral when both are lost to her, resulting in a pit fighting phase. By removing herself from Vi's life, she ensures that Vi can finally live for herself and fall in love fully with Caitlyn.
Yes, fully agree! Jinx actually dying would would be really unsatisfying and would make several key moments in S2 feel useless. For example, Isha's sacrifice would be for nothing, as she saved Jinx's life, both psychologically and physically. Jinx dying would make her sacrifice 100x less impactful and beautiful. Not to mention Ekko saving Jinx and all the Timebomb fan theory. It would be a devastating kick to the balls if they just decided to kill Jinx off since it is almost guaranteed Jinx and Ekko developed a good relationship off screen. There are also of course meta-reasons why they want to keep her alive.
according to Necrit, Arcane didn't show everything. Piltover and Zaun are still the same city, not separated (yes, in arcane both cities are Piltover, politically speaking). Christian said that Renata Glasc will appear later, replacing the chem-barons that died during the series. And one important event still didn't happened: a giant explosion on the bridge that finally separates the two cities, and Zaun gets independency. So if things go well, we certanly will have another TV show that returns to these two cities.
i agree jinx is still alive, its heavily hinted. but i wouldnt make conclusion because it shows no character development. some characters dont develop, not every character needs to along their journey
I'm just wondering when Jinx will become the Jinx from the game, since Arcane is supposed to be canon. Despite Lol Jinx having all ten fingers and Caitlyn not missing an eye.
Sui slide is never the answer, and it just causes so much more pain So I'd say irl killing is a cycle too and you need to learn to heal and adapt to Trauma and build something new and safe(er) I believe that's where her story arc did conclude for the viewer I love schnee but the writers are too good to end her on a suislide ending after all the setup for her conclusion, Ekko even pointed that out for us viewers I've been saying she's alive since day one and my friends have made fun of me for copium, but that's not it 😂😂 She has to live, else they fumbled one of the best storylines in the show for a generic Disney ending or some bs
Problem. The cycle is broken already. Before the finale. The story just for the most part, doesn’t make sense. It’s just dumb. So of course, she has to live, because this just doesn’t make sense as her end point, although I don’t know where it’s going to go. However, your ending hurts Vi quite a bit, since it means she has no agency whatsoever which she didn’t have much to begin with. Jinx’s ending is, according to Christian, the only way to end things because she can’t have a happy ending. They already understand each other, but a happy ending for her in regards to Vi and Cait impossible. That’s it.
I think it was a poor choice to play Wasteland the second time. If we're supposed to understand this is a sacrifice and not an "escape", there needed to be real work done to show Jinx wants to live. It's like if this world is a Wasteland, why did you fight for it? If you're unwilling to let this world go, why should it let you go?
The song is actually longer than what we hear. Maybe it's supposed to be a hidden clue but in the last part of the song wasteland the lyrics change from "please let me go" to "don't let me go" and from "I want to try" the song ends hopefully if you listen to the entire thing. We only hear the first part in the scene but the ending is choosing life not death.
I saw people saying that the song being played again at the end is actually meant to be a reflection of vi more so than jinx and it makes perfect sense if you read through the lyrics with her in mind
I get where your coming from but I actually really disagree with this. Wasteland at the very end changes its chorus to reflect someone who finds the will to live. The song goes from repeating please let me go, to don't let me go. I think the song shows someone who is despondent and has lost the will to live but finds it again. Just look at the stanza preceding the final chorus I'm not ready to face it Don't go saying goodbye There's a beauty in changes And I wanna try Jinx wants to try and change, I just don't think she understands how. I didn't include it in the video, but I also believe that Ekko told her what happened in the AU. She leaves the prison determined to take her life because according to her "There is no good version of Jinx" but after hearing that there IS a good version of her, she decides there is another way for Vi to be happy.
@@flowchartkenYT I was aware that Wasteland has a more optimistic tone overall, and in a different version of 209, there could have been a scene where they play the other part as a sort of reprise to show Jinx's evolving worldview. But just like deleted scenes aren't canon, those more optimistic parts don't factor into the show. They chose to play the parts they played and chose to not play the parts they didn't play. And it creates a tone where Jinx is returning to the self-destructive 208 mindset she had before. To sort of deconstruct the lyrics into a thesis: "Please let me go." Why do I need to let you go? "This world is a Wasteland." Why is it a wasteland? "I know it's my fault that I'm here all alone." What? What was the point of the preceding episode then? The only way I can truly justify it to myself is that the song is diegetic both times we hear it. We know Jinx is listening to it at the beginning of 209 because we hear it playing on her phonogram as Ekko intervenes. So Jinx wanted it to be the last song she heard before she passed. Then at the end of 209, she had made the choice to sacrifice herself and her end is inevitable, so she "plays the song in her head" to try to comfort herself in her last moments. That's obviously quite sad, but it's very human to try to make peace at the end. If that's true, though, it sort of calls into question the idea that Jinx saved herself from the explosion.
@@blalmon I think they do factor into the show as in, the lyrics contribute to the canon, even the parts that are not included in the show. That is the beauty of it all imo. Take for example Isha's Song, like 99% of the audience outside of China will not understand this song or the message if you don't dive into the lyrics. Not to mention the lyrics to Ma Meilleure Ennemie, which elevates the episode to a whole new level. You said it yourself, Jinx actually sings this song to herself in a sense when she is falling with WW. But in those final moments just milliseconds before the explosion, she decides "I'm not ready to face it". Most of us agree that Jinx is actually alive because of the clues they show in the final moments of 209. The omitted lyrics is just another easter egg/clue that further emphasizes this.
I think I'm the only person who doesn't want to see Jinx in another show anytime soon, maybe never again. Like, she has her arc very well built and closed in the 2 seasons, we already saw her origin, how she is when she's at her worst and when she's stable, what she'd do in a normal life living with Isha and the AU episode, we saw her closing her arc with her sister and she had her own closure making peace with herself as well and being able to move on with her life. So I really don't need to see more of her when there are so many more interesting characters to tell their stories. Please, let Jinx be free away from our screens.
I recently found another clue that she's alive - in the artbook. It's full of Jinx's scribbles and on the first page: "wanna know a secret?" "I am still here" and on the last "I'll be right back" "see ya!"
how thats really interesting do you have a link to it?
Plus in the Artifact Edition of the book there is Jinx's handwriting saying "I live" all around the box
@@hardbasskvass597 Daamn that's cool, they are beating the glorified suislide thing with this one hahah
im currently looking through the artbook and cant find shit
@@fluffy8833 Sorry, I don't have one.
Yes! Also Jinx dying at the end would mean that only death can be her redemption, which would undo the point of episodes 7 and 9 - taking a leap forward means leaving few things behind / it is never too late to build something new.
This. You can't just kill her after giving us a glimpse of building something new in the beginning of 209.
I think one of the other issues at hand here is fairness. Why does Jinx get to live when so many innocents died by her hand? Why do all the other "bad" characters/characters who've done bad stuff (Maddie, Marcus, Silco) end up dead and she doesn't?
There's also this idea that sacrifice is the ultimate "I'm taking my responsibilities" character development for Jinx in my mind. We're going from a troubled girl who has a hard time taking accountability ("someone put all these bullet holes in you", "well then he shouldn't have died") and just wishes to die meaninglessly, to someone who actually faces the consequences of her actions and gives her death actual meaning, that of saving her sister.
That's why I think Jinx's death would have been more in line with the series. Like Walter White at the end of Breaking Bad, or Lelouch at the end of Code Geass (his death is canon for me).
But at the end of the day, while my head believes she should have died, my heart is really happy she isn't.
@@krashme997 In a way you can observe death to be an easy way out for Jinx, a sacrifice which in a way is a cliche way to end a character. Marcus, Maddie and Silco never felt remorse for their actions and they would never change, unlike Jinx, who is a product of an extremelly harsh environment. Jinx was created by Powder to keep herself safe. She never cared though about actions of Silco or his vision for Zaun, she helped "him" when needed, like to watch cargo to run smoothly and defending from Fireflights or get a hexgem to show him her strength. People she killed were not innocent in her eyes - she killed Enforcers on Progress day and on the Bridge, killing Marcus among others, as she sees Enforcers as people who killed her parents. Weird as it is, since she did not plan that - all she did was for the Undercity; killing on the bridge ended the barricade put by Jayce, hitting the Council was inevitable since Silco never intended to give her up so we're back to square one, she ended thr Gray by blasting it onto Piltover - she brought back fresh air to the Undercity, saved Isha and Jinxers from Stillwater, united Zaun and brought everyone to the fight against Noxians. All of that showed her change and why she should be forgiven. As we did see what she was like in normal world of AU in episode 7... Product of environment..
Also killing Jinx is a bad idea since she is Arcanes most popular character, people would riot xD
@@krashme997 This is not a fairytale where everyone is either white or black, white of whom should win and black of whom should take a lesson. You can't call anyone purely good or bad and expect "bad" ones to lose. Caitlyn has done many bad things, too (e.g. a fucking war crime), but she got her happy ending.
What i believe is, having her die sends the wrong message, and is an incorrect developement.
She did horrible stuff, killed people, having her escape punishment by just dying as a "hero" is horrible, at least for me. She(people) needs to accept her mistakes, own up to them and make them right. Having her go on a self healing journey, fight her demons is a good redemption, would make a great spinoff and it would send a better message. At least in my opinion.
This is probably the most well thought of the "jinx in alive" theorys. I may actually be able to hold tears because of this show; just wait a couple years guys(Ionia, Demacia, Noxus, and other regions)
Yeah. And I mean also its kinda obvious from the deleted scenes. If they were genuinely killing her off, it wouldn't have made sense for them to NOT include them, considering they'd be basically tying down all loose ends.
Instead it's mutually beneficial for them to use the scenes retroactively/ as flashbacks for future character development and keep the finale of Arcane focused on the fight against Ambessa and Viktor.
But let's call that "metagaming". The way I reached the conclusion from just the series is that Ekko broke the cycle for Jinx by showing her that Jinx has the potential to be good and that she is still just a damaged Powder in the end of the day. The reason she faked her death is because she realized that Vi was also stuck in the same cycle she was, and as long as Jinx existed in Vi's life, Vi would never really be able to move on.
@@00000005547 I sat on my chair for 7 minutes trying to make sense of this. Its also because I haven't had much time to really dig deep into the concept. I didn't realize that her "death" would almost be pointless to the actual story because of the previous 3 episodes. but I guess all we can really do now is dream right? Because Arcane is over
Really well thought out. Both parts, Jinxes and Viktor's. Thanks!
I def think Jinx is alive but now she's free. she's broken the cycle. I don't think it's a matter of her sacrificing herself for Vi but she did see an out; she also nearly blew herself up with Vi until Isha jumped between them. Jinx decided last minute to use her Shimmer speed to get into the vaults, but she would have been happy with the release of death. she knew Vi had Caitlin, Vander was completely lost to them now, Isha sacrificed herself, and she knows there's no way she can atone with the Pilties for all her years working with Silco and the harm she caused.
it goes deeper than that as well; girl's got *a lot* of trauma. she's never been afraid of death; quite the opposite, in fact. she's always welcomed it (prob since the night she met Silco, when she inadvertently got Milo and Clagger killed with her good intentions).
dont get me wrong-I love Jinx. she's my favorite. but i believe we should all have a choice to leave if we want it. it's not exactly like there are mental health services in Zaun and Piltover. between her manic delusions and ptsd, i absolutely understand where she's coming from. however, I'd be **shocked** if Riot/Fortiche killed their cash cow
Love this way of thinking about it, makes a lot more sense than other videos I’ve seen on the topic
Yeah, sure, yes. The themes and narrative undercurrents of Season 2 work better and become clearer if you decouple it from the themes and writicng devices of Season 1. The duality, the parallels, the matching pairs everywhere in te structure. Season 2, in very Arcane fashion, flips their own established tricks and methods and moves into something close, flamiliar, but also new. So the narrative throughlines are not dependant on the same framework as before. Also! Finally! Someone getting ever close to finding and expaining that elusive, mysterious entitiy -- the Schneeheart. Well done.
I agree that you have to view season one and season 2 as separately, narratively. I just think they are trying to do completely different things and that both succeed, it just depends on which kind of story you like more, grounded or fantastical
Perfect explanation 🙌
Makes sense that she would be at Bilgewater. That place is a pirate fortress. An outcast haven for all kinds of the disenfranchised. She’d fit right in.
@@neofulcrum5013 Especially since the Arcane original idea had Powder leave Piltover/Zaun and head to Bilgewater via an airship. But they changed it. Considering an airship at the end does fly over the sea, it could be indeed she is heading there.
@@anabrans2 I think she is on that airship to Bilgewater, because the creators mentioned all spinoffs we all heard off (Demacia,Ionia,Noxus) but they also mentioned Bilgewater.
I think that we will see Jinx and Ekko in the Bilgewater spinoff since creators sead they want to continue there story.Or posibly (but I 100% belive it will happen) that we will se Jinx and Ekko in a movie.
THIS IS WHAT WE NEEDED.
Thank you for this video
Well thought out, articulate, and something I totally agree with
Well thought and explained!
Jinx needs survive < Timebomb needs to survive
Great video btw ye shnee does great job with analysing the series
schnee is one of the reasons I started making arcane content. Really like his videos
@flowchartkenYT ye im always waiting for when he uploads
Silco saying "I think the cycle only ends, when you find the will to walk away" is so important to this whole thing.
At first, Jinx in her broken, depressed and suicidal state takes this as ending herself to be ending the problem, but Ekko convinced her otherwise.
The ship at the end sailing away with Jinx possibly being in it makes so much more sense as an ending than her simply dying
There's always been this question in my mind: if Jinx does make a comeback, what is going to be her character arc? It kind of feels like we reached somewhat of a conclusion with her.
My best bet would be another Vander arc, more satisfying this time. Why do I think that?
1. Vander kept some of his original design in S9 instead of fully turning onto a robot like the rest. This makes me think he did retain some of his humanity anyway, just like with Viktor when the arcane took over.
2. Vander kept moving after Viktor's death, even though all the other puppets fell apart instantly. Why, if it wasn't for another force driving him. That of the beast, maybe, but if the beast remained, why not the human as well?
3. The flashback right before(or was it after?) Jinx's explosion, in which the only character awake was Vander, so most likely from his perspective. He also did have a flashback when he recognized Vi in ep.5, so what was it this time? One could say it was just there to embellish the scene and make it more tragic, but knowing how Fortiche/Riot like to give a deeper meaning to everything beyond just esthetics, I somehow doubt it.
4. No way he died at the end. Not from that grenade. They never showed his body either, and unless they quickly gloss over it in the next spinoff, just ignoring it would be a major plot hole. He's definitely making a comeback one way or another.
I think Jinx will show up in the spinoff about Noxus-Ionia war. She probably won’t get much screen time and will return to Zaun by the end of the spinoff. Also, if the rumors about a separate Arcane spinoff focusing on its characters are true, it’s possible she’ll head to Ionia with Ekko. In that case, they might travel to eastern Ionia, far from the warzone, where some Ionian characters could also be explored.
My focus on the Jinx/Ekko duo makes sense because, after s2e7, these two became super popular within the community. Plus, the Arcane showrunner has shown interest in continuing their story. I doubt Riot would miss the chance to capitalize on this, so I think we’re bound to get a couple of spinoffs in the next 2-3 years.
Now, about Vander:
1. Yes, he kept part of his humanity. When Singed discusses Vander’s situation with Ambessa, he mentions that if Viktor fully heals Vander’s mind, the plan to create a monster army won’t work. I think the memories Viktor managed to restore left a permanent mark on Vander’s mind, like fingerprints pressed into his consciousness.
2. Building on that, both the beast and the man are still there. The problem is that Vander already struggled to keep himself in check, and now, with so few memories left, he snaps out of it too late-like when he falls with Jinx. In the new Arcane skin in LoL, Vander/Warwick cries when teleporting to base and seeing a blue-haired doll, which hints that he remembers Powder.
3. Yes, that flashback before the explosion is from his perspective. It shows that Vander, like any decent father, instinctively cares for his daughters. In s1e3, he saves Vi from the fire, and in s2e9, he saves Powder from the explosion.
4. He’s practically immortal. He’ll probably appear in one of the spinoffs set in Piltover/Zaun, at least as a mention in news reports about groups of torn-apart thugs. There’s a good chance Vi and Caitlyn will try to stop him.
I really like your take on this and I totally agree
I think this is why I find “Jinx Lives” a more satisfying ending. If she does move on and fly somewhere new, then it shows she is letting go of the past rather than succumbing to it and letting it kill her.
the only reason she went from the suicidal girl who didn't want to be a hero at all to someone totally opposite to what she's shown since the series, a hero, is her discussion with ekko, which probably lasted for days before he convinced her to be the jinx we saw at the end of the series, in a long and methodical way, she had to be given a reason to live, (even to eat), then a reason to fight for zaun, all these problems can't be solved in just a few minutes, or a few hours, and even less with a single sentence, all his sentence did was prevent her from committing suicide in ekko's presence, it's her discussion with him afterwards that's the key to her transformation, she's become literally ekko, nothing to do with what she was.
Reducing her transformation to what we saw on screen is way too simplistic, it means not understanding Jinx's psychology since the beginning of the series.
I agree with you. For the record the makers of the show did write a scene with Ekko talking with Jinx and convincing her to join the fight against Ambessa. Supposedly it would have included him telling her about the good version of her he met in the other universe, them designing and building the airship and weapons, and even the two of them putting warpaint on each other, which would have been super adorable. But that scene got cut because they felt the last episode was already to long. It's an absolute crime that we didn't get to see that. Granted Jinx and Ekko's entrance in the battle was five different kinds of badass and the prep scene would have undercut the surprise, but still, like you said, we should have gotten to see the emotional catharsis that compelled Jinx to finally take on the role of hero.
If Jinx ever does appear again, in one of the spin-offs they're rumored to be working then hopefully they'll use that as an opportunity to finally show us that scene. They could make it a flashback that would show the audience how Jinx has grown and where her character is now. That would be absolutely perfect.
@@vertiac an extremely important scene, fundamental to the development of jinx, the very fact that they decided to remove it for this “surprise” gives the impression that people are more interested in the superficial than in the development of the characters we've been following since the beginning, and the worst thing is that they may be right for most people, they just want spectacle without any real consistency, it's sad.
The themes and undercurrents of Season One are there. It's just that Season Two brought additional ones to the fore to explore while also working with what came before, although admittingly to me it seems Season Two was too overstuffed as a season to explore it all in a way as clearly like Season One.
Still I think it's important to look at Season Two as a half of the whole show that is Arcane and see how the two seasons are two halves of a whole. Two halves of a whole that each do their own thing.
Also in regards to Jinx living while breaking the cycle, she not only broke the cycle that she was stuck in but what Vi was also stuck in. Vi could never settle down and live for herself for a change, always putting others before herself; be it Caitlyn or Jinx. But she could never move on and goes into a depressive spiral when both are lost to her, resulting in a pit fighting phase. By removing herself from Vi's life, she ensures that Vi can finally live for herself and fall in love fully with Caitlyn.
Yes, fully agree!
Jinx actually dying would would be really unsatisfying and would make several key moments in S2 feel useless. For example, Isha's sacrifice would be for nothing, as she saved Jinx's life, both psychologically and physically. Jinx dying would make her sacrifice 100x less impactful and beautiful. Not to mention Ekko saving Jinx and all the Timebomb fan theory. It would be a devastating kick to the balls if they just decided to kill Jinx off since it is almost guaranteed Jinx and Ekko developed a good relationship off screen.
There are also of course meta-reasons why they want to keep her alive.
Very good video, thanks
Well duh genius, she helped create the z drive.
How I wanted to see Urgot thirsting for justice and Glask industries taking over undercity and topside. Too bad it probably won't be shown.
according to Necrit, Arcane didn't show everything. Piltover and Zaun are still the same city, not separated (yes, in arcane both cities are Piltover, politically speaking). Christian said that Renata Glasc will appear later, replacing the chem-barons that died during the series. And one important event still didn't happened: a giant explosion on the bridge that finally separates the two cities, and Zaun gets independency. So if things go well, we certanly will have another TV show that returns to these two cities.
@@carlosleite7011I hope so😔
Hey I noticed that when Jayce and Victor do their little forehead boop it forms a sitting Buddha statue lol
lol your right it kinda does
i agree jinx is still alive, its heavily hinted. but i wouldnt make conclusion because it shows no character development. some characters dont develop, not every character needs to along their journey
I'm just wondering when Jinx will become the Jinx from the game, since Arcane is supposed to be canon. Despite Lol Jinx having all ten fingers and Caitlyn not missing an eye.
2:11 Jinx pulled the pin on her grenade 4 times if you include the ending
Sui slide is never the answer, and it just causes so much more pain
So I'd say irl killing is a cycle too and you need to learn to heal and adapt to Trauma and build something new and safe(er)
I believe that's where her story arc did conclude for the viewer
I love schnee but the writers are too good to end her on a suislide ending after all the setup for her conclusion, Ekko even pointed that out for us viewers
I've been saying she's alive since day one and my friends have made fun of me for copium, but that's not it 😂😂
She has to live, else they fumbled one of the best storylines in the show for a generic Disney ending or some bs
Here is my theory: She isn't suppose to break the cycle, her tail is suppose to be a tragedy after tragedy.
Did I just find a new video essay youtuber to shout out in my next video? I think so
Problem. The cycle is broken already. Before the finale.
The story just for the most part, doesn’t make sense. It’s just dumb.
So of course, she has to live, because this just doesn’t make sense as her end point, although I don’t know where it’s going to go.
However, your ending hurts Vi quite a bit, since it means she has no agency whatsoever which she didn’t have much to begin with.
Jinx’s ending is, according to Christian, the only way to end things because she can’t have a happy ending. They already understand each other, but a happy ending for her in regards to Vi and Cait impossible. That’s it.
I think it was a poor choice to play Wasteland the second time. If we're supposed to understand this is a sacrifice and not an "escape", there needed to be real work done to show Jinx wants to live. It's like if this world is a Wasteland, why did you fight for it? If you're unwilling to let this world go, why should it let you go?
The song is actually longer than what we hear. Maybe it's supposed to be a hidden clue but in the last part of the song wasteland the lyrics change from "please let me go" to "don't let me go" and from "I want to try" the song ends hopefully if you listen to the entire thing. We only hear the first part in the scene but the ending is choosing life not death.
I saw people saying that the song being played again at the end is actually meant to be a reflection of vi more so than jinx and it makes perfect sense if you read through the lyrics with her in mind
I get where your coming from but I actually really disagree with this. Wasteland at the very end changes its chorus to reflect someone who finds the will to live. The song goes from repeating please let me go, to don't let me go. I think the song shows someone who is despondent and has lost the will to live but finds it again.
Just look at the stanza preceding the final chorus
I'm not ready to face it
Don't go saying goodbye
There's a beauty in changes
And I wanna try
Jinx wants to try and change, I just don't think she understands how. I didn't include it in the video, but I also believe that Ekko told her what happened in the AU. She leaves the prison determined to take her life because according to her "There is no good version of Jinx" but after hearing that there IS a good version of her, she decides there is another way for Vi to be happy.
@@flowchartkenYT I was aware that Wasteland has a more optimistic tone overall, and in a different version of 209, there could have been a scene where they play the other part as a sort of reprise to show Jinx's evolving worldview. But just like deleted scenes aren't canon, those more optimistic parts don't factor into the show. They chose to play the parts they played and chose to not play the parts they didn't play. And it creates a tone where Jinx is returning to the self-destructive 208 mindset she had before. To sort of deconstruct the lyrics into a thesis:
"Please let me go."
Why do I need to let you go?
"This world is a Wasteland."
Why is it a wasteland?
"I know it's my fault that I'm here all alone."
What? What was the point of the preceding episode then?
The only way I can truly justify it to myself is that the song is diegetic both times we hear it. We know Jinx is listening to it at the beginning of 209 because we hear it playing on her phonogram as Ekko intervenes. So Jinx wanted it to be the last song she heard before she passed. Then at the end of 209, she had made the choice to sacrifice herself and her end is inevitable, so she "plays the song in her head" to try to comfort herself in her last moments. That's obviously quite sad, but it's very human to try to make peace at the end. If that's true, though, it sort of calls into question the idea that Jinx saved herself from the explosion.
@@blalmon I think they do factor into the show as in, the lyrics contribute to the canon, even the parts that are not included in the show. That is the beauty of it all imo. Take for example Isha's Song, like 99% of the audience outside of China will not understand this song or the message if you don't dive into the lyrics. Not to mention the lyrics to Ma Meilleure Ennemie, which elevates the episode to a whole new level.
You said it yourself, Jinx actually sings this song to herself in a sense when she is falling with WW. But in those final moments just milliseconds before the explosion, she decides "I'm not ready to face it". Most of us agree that Jinx is actually alive because of the clues they show in the final moments of 209. The omitted lyrics is just another easter egg/clue that further emphasizes this.
Make sense
I think I'm the only person who doesn't want to see Jinx in another show anytime soon, maybe never again. Like, she has her arc very well built and closed in the 2 seasons, we already saw her origin, how she is when she's at her worst and when she's stable, what she'd do in a normal life living with Isha and the AU episode, we saw her closing her arc with her sister and she had her own closure making peace with herself as well and being able to move on with her life. So I really don't need to see more of her when there are so many more interesting characters to tell their stories. Please, let Jinx be free away from our screens.
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