Rings of Power & LOTR Balrog Comparison - 2001 vs 2022
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- Опубліковано 18 вер 2024
- Peter Jackson's LOTR have proven they will stand the test of time.
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*Note*
This is not the digitally enhanced version that came out for the 20th anniversary.
I will be making more videos on the Lord of the Rings and the Rings of Power when the show debuts.
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Original Balrog roar.... When I worked at steel mill, the flames from the burners to heat the vats size of a large bus, made similar sound. It is the roar of pure raging flame. And this of rings... just some common beast.
That's one great point. And very well played from Jackson for this sound. Balrodg are such primal creatures, the "elemental" roar is far better than any "look, i'm a big beast" roar
Iam sure that most of people that work on Rings didnt even know that Balrog should represent explosions and all this.
It sounds like a stock sound file. typical.
In LOTR behind the scenes, the sound guys dragged concrete blocks in a cavernous bunker to get the unearthly growl of the balrog. So they truly managed to create a roar that doesn't sound like an animal we would be able to identify.
Omg, every reason to glaze the originals and hate on the show
One of the things that always stood out to me was, when the Balrog in the original movies roared, it didn't sound like some generic monster. It sounded like the roar of a raging inferno. That was a great little touch, and still makes the 2001 Balrog superior, imao.
I heard that for the original balrog, to make its roar, they actually slid cinder blocks on each other.
Wow. Agreed.
New one sounds like they stood on some snails
The hot breath/heat wave visuals got me when I first saw it at the cinema back in the day. Made my nerdy bum hole quiver.
good point Lisa. Actually, i think i now prefer the 2001 balrog due to the roar alone. Very important detail.
The 2001 balrog’s snarl sounds straight out of a giant furnace, the recent one is a more generic roar. I still like the old one better
Agreed
I agree, the new one sounds like it was taken from Jurassic World or something
Yeah visually they both look near equal despite the age of PJ's Balrog. But man that generic roar just made the new one, I don't know how to describe it; like it feels less impressive. When you hear the sound of PJ's Balrog make, you just think of a raging inferno and the fact that it's almost silent feels more unique and intimidating.
Yup.
@@robertosabado4955 this the silence etc.
I always loved the sound he made when he burst into flame in 2001 - you could hear the crackle and roar and you could sense the heat coming off. Very satisfying and realistic in a way.
Agreed. I love how he stands tall and illuminates himself in flame yet it does absolutely nothing to reveal anything more of his form because he's so fully submerged in an all consuming darkness.
@@Jake-qo3mp The realistic distortion on his flames help sell that he's actually burning unlike 2022 which you can tell is a simulation.
Right! not every creature needs to sound like Godzilla...
They also made his earlier growl by grinding stones and playing that sound in the echochamber of an underground bunker.
Back in 2001, I felt heat and almost melt in the theater when the Balrog roared !
The original furnace noise was a genius move. In movies a dragon's flame never quite feels like it has the ability to melt metal, but within the throat of Peter Jackson's balrog you know any sword would turn to liquid.
Well you got to have the puny knight in armor be able to fight the crazy large dragon somehow 😂😂
Now I'm imagining if Mordor attempted forging armour and weapons in the mouth of a Balrog.
It was believed that dragon's fire might melt the One Ring, don't think they ever mentioned a balrog doing so, but I don't think they'd want to go looking for one either.
@@EricLing64 No dragon could melt the Ruling Ring, only the Dwarven Rings and Rings of Men. Its unknown if it could touch the Elven Rings.
@@zacharypurdue4584 I said might, it's not all that clear but as Gandalf says to Frodo none are left anyways. "It has been said that dragon-fire could melt and consume the Rings of Power, but there is not now any dragon left on earth in which the old fire is hot enough; nor was there ever any dragon, not even Ancalagon the Black, who could have harmed the One Ring, the Ruling Ring, for that was made by Sauron himself."
Honestly, the 2001 Balrog remains to this day the only CG monster that has conveyed 'real' heat. When he roars, close up, you can FEEL the intensity of the heat from it's mouth. It's an incredible achievement and nothing else has come close either before or since. One of my favourite all-time CG monsters.
the heated air visibly distorts the image seen through it.
also seen in the cracks of doom.
I remember feeling a little scared watching it in the theater for the first time. I had never seen anything like it before, so huge, demonic, and so lifelike. The way the whole theater shook when it roared with the sound of a huge fiery blaze is burned into my memory.
Smaug
Me too!!
I genuinely think the 2001 version looks better.
I agree. The original appears more shadow-like
That's kind of the point.
Once you've seen 👀☝ one Balrog you've seen them all 😏
@@thehornswogglehumdinger9612 yeah, that looming gloomy darkness about the 2001 version is amazing
Lol
There’s a reason Peter Jackson’s LOTR trilogy is frequently cited as the greatest films ever made. Were made in the year 2000, more than 20 years ago and they still look this god damn amazing.
Both were done by the same VFX house, Weta Digital.
@@Navin4061 It doesnt matter lmao, the team of VFX artists is COMPLETELY different. You can't just assume the same people made both things because the same VFX house made it.
@@OrdinaryApprentice99 No one is assuming the 'same' people or team made it lol. I'm saying it's still done by Weta, the best VFX house in the industry.
@@Navin4061 my bad.
That's the main reason it's so obscured.
I prefer the older roar better. It sounds like a blazing fire. The new one sounds like it belongs in Jurassic Park
You mean Jurassic World 😉
Exactlyyy now it sounds like some T-Rex or Godzilla
@@sandmann5402 Same series of films
@@jackhughes7637 How dare you...
Haha first thing I thought of was a t-rex.
Love the darkness of the original, it really captures how Tolkien describes the balrog in the novel. Not to mention that sick roar!
@n. noxti It's not that simple i'm sure a lot of people for the RoP team are fans of Tolkien he is THE seminal fantasy writer more people are fans of him than not by a large margin. I just think this show is being controlled by out of touch people who think everything has to be woke while not even understanding what that actually means and why people want better representations of minorities
bowing to everything wholeheartedly is not always the solution. Demonizing isn't either social justice is good but there has to be some middle ground and discourse because people aren't always going to agree on everything. Rn it's just a bunch of snake oil salesmen baby boomers and late gen x-early millennials with daddy issues who are so brainwashed capitalist they can't have something exist and not be commoditized. They think their woke posturing is winning over the masses but all it does is show how little they know about social issues and how people deal with them. The point is stories like LotR are important and inspiring but they appeal to specific demographics of people which is ok, it was written from a unique individual perspective in a time long ago but the messages & themes are still so poignant. It's a meaningful story that honestly instilled purpose in my life and that's because I could relate so much to all the characters on an instinctive visual level like looking at Aragorn he looks like how I wished I could look when I was older & I looked up to him so much for being so brave and heroic.
Everyone needs to be able to have something that in their lives to inspire them if they need it and the point is of social justice for film/tv media is that groups of minorities & oppressed people have been historically excluded from jobs & roles which were well deserved for a long time it was this way and it still is sadly. It was why Marlon Brando famously rejected his Oscar and sent the strong & beautiful woman Sacheen Littlefeather to deliver a speech about issues with Hollywood's portrayal of Native Americans. A large portion of the audience loudly booed her before she even really started speaking it just goes to show the bigotry and ignorance of Hollywood. She didn't even receive any apology from the academy for that until 2022 😟
@n. noxti It's basically the same thing as the original lol. I personally don't think either balrog is a good interpretation of the books.
@n. noxti They're just making it up as they go along.
Tolkien would be turning in his grave, let's face it.
Tolkien doesn't really describes them like that but i really think Peter Jackson (or film crew) Idea of a Balrog is so much awesome and good that I just accept it
@@Lin_Eileen Most accurate comment
2001 Balrog is just legendary. The roar, the presence, the intimidation. Still sends shivers down my spine everytime I watch it.
its unbelievable that 2001 balrog is so good 20 years later! Not a lot of special effects that lasts that long
Probably because you can't see that much of it through the fire and smoke.
@@bear576 yep. watch the shot of it chasing the fellowship toward the bridge, where you can see its whole body. it doesn't hold up as well as you might think
still prefer it to the new one, though
Jurassic Park.. Blade Runner
are many old movies which aged like a fine wine
Terminator 2 , Pirates of the Caribbean 2 , Matrix Trilogy , Harry Potter series etc...
Forbidden Planet, for the uttermost win.
2022 has a lot more detail,but... 2001 hides Balrog's full body in darkness, this makes it seem more huge, like it is the shadows itself. Sometimes less is more in this case, the old films were clever to use darkness and fogginess to hide blurrier textures. Nowadays I think SFX artists are a little too confident in showing off their full monster, but they will never look 100% real imo
The balgrog was shadow and flame. It wasnt a sfx choice. This is just a bad quality video you can see the full beast on the dvd.
Facts.
Actually I can see more of the Balrog in the 2001 version than 2022, when looking at these exact clips alone.
Evil cant create, it can only imitate
2001 looks alot better even after 20 years
No, because fire isn't red or saturated orange
@@ES-qy2ju What do you mean? That the new version fire is yellow and therefore better?
@@JPazer in real life the fire looks closer to the amazon version.
@@ES-qy2ju You seen a Balrog irl?
@@JPazer you dont need to see a balrog in real life -_- just to know how the fire work.
When you look really up close to these two, the 2001 balrog looks more real
amazon: we dont want copy PJ, we do our own thing
also amazon: copy as much as possible
That is what they do in order to corrupt the themes it in their image. Just like Melkor, they are unable to create a soul.
Copy as much as possible? Literally the only thing that looks like PJ trilogy is Gil Galad. You people hate just to hate, if this balrog looked different you wouldve hated it for looking different.
@@lillvesp Stop projecting Lucy.
@@lillvesp lol it's about the hypocrisy, but “you people” can understand
@@hrehi except there is no hipocrisy cus they arent copying.
Perhaps I need to re-read -- but I thought the Balrogs of Morgoth were very much a First Age thing. The Balrog in Moria had been buried for a very long time until the dwarves delved too deeply in the Third Age. I don't recall any Balrogs being discussed in the Second Age.
You are absolutely right, but Amazon doesn't give a crap about what is canon anymore. But surely I can dismiss some canon desecration for the sake of seeing a Balrog of Morgoth once more.
Prolog ;)
OR it is the first age.
@@thomashaeyen6942 it is not the first age. Rings of power is in the 2nd age
@@bloodangel19 then that balrog is not durin's bane
I think the 2022 version is cool because of the physical changes, but I must admit, the roar from the 2001 version was more fitting as it was the roar of a raging fire, but now the balrog has a roar of a generic monster
Yes man
The changes, they change everything, everyone! They love changes
@@luisduarte7917 what would you do Tolkien had not that many characters in the second age but I would hate it if they would change finrods death
Generic Balrog for generic trash corporate show
@@Kserijaro you may think that, but don't try and ruin it for others
@@emperorpalpatine9851 however likes "rings of power" is not a fan of the work, the books and the lore. ANd they have trash taste.
So they copied the Balrog...
But we can't have PJ's beautiful long-haired elves? Come on.
We also can't have white people. There's a lot of things Amazon doesn't want us to have.
Nope, best you're gonna get is a black elf with airpods and a wave check... Oh, and he's gay
That was the first thing to come to mind when I saw this.
The PJ movie Balrog, as iconic as it is, was a design purely unique to that film. It's become the gold standard for what we expect to see from a Balrog, but it still remains only a single interpretation of written description. There are other artist interpretations of what a Balrog looks like, and while they obviously share many similarities, these are not just straight up copies of the film interpretation.
*Amazon have stated that they want to make the world look and feel like middle earth, and have certainly taken queues from PJ's work, but have also made an explicitly stated effort to not just copy it, expressing a desire to create their own vision*
And yet here we have a carbon copy of a Balrog. They didn't read the passage in the book and think "how can we reproduce this for our show", they simply just pulled the design from previous works.
All that said I know it's the same effects studio who worked on both "versions", but even so *this goes against the Amazon mission statement*
I don't even really care that they copied the design, it's an iconic and cool design, but it's just another example of Amazon saying one thing and doing something else with regards to RoP.
*The 2001 version (Durin's Bane) is perfect and a masterpiece, even the sound of Balrog; it looks real.*
The 2022 version looks more like something out of a video game, in my opinion.
Amazon: "Can I copy your homework "
PJ: "Sure, but dont make it obvious."
Amazon: Makes it obvious.
Both Balrog are based on John Howe artworks, and John Howe also work on this Rings of Power series.
I will be happy if Amazon copied everything from LOTR without creating a bullshit.
@@scaryghost5721 That makes sense. Thanks for info.
@@Slawnikowic Agreed, I will take a copy paste of good things instead of some "original" bullshit
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤍
2001 Balrog looks more intimidating with all that smoke & doesn't show his full figure & doesn't sound like a constipated dinosaur like the 2022 version. I do appreciate that kept PJ's design though.
I wish they kept his design for the Elves as well
@@abelbabel8484 lol, when they decided to only use SHORT HAIR elves and yeah, black elves. no elegance at all.
@@saddocatto9245 lmao @ negrolas
The 2001 balrog has flames but it also exudes a terrifying darkness. The 2022 balrog is all flame and no darkness which detracts from the overall ominous nature it should have. Also, the 2001’s roar sounds like a massive inferno which is much more convincing than the 2022’s generic “monster” roar 🤷
The Balrog in 2022 isn’t all flames tho
@@procrastinatingpuma Of course it isn’t *literally* all flames…but, I’m not gonna argue semantics dude. You know what I mean🤘(and if you truly don’t, I doubt I could make you understand within the confines of a UA-cam comment section 👀)
The glow and shape of the eyes in the 2001 balrog looks much better too
2001 looks better. Pj's trilogy was made by such a great team that poured so much love and passion into every aspect of it. Amazon could never.
You sure that’s not just your nostalgia talking? Make sure your being objective
@@xsoundofsil3nc3x96 I definitely have great nostalgia for the movies, but I do honestly think that a lot of the pictures/from the new show look too cg-ish for me, and the costumes just don't look as good and "authentic" as the ones in the trilogy if that makes sense.
@@0oogabooga 17 academy nominations and 11 oscar wins for ROTK would say its a superior film series even today. WETA did a miracle with LOTR.
@@xsoundofsil3nc3x96 They are correct.
@@maybecole so I guess it’s a good thing that Amazon works with John Howe & Weta
2001 looks realistic, 2022 looks cheap cgi like it's video game
The whole production looks cheap to me. Everything has a very “spraypainted cardboard” look.
Evil cant create, it can only imitate
Most cgi from a couple of decades ago ( and after ) you look back and cringe, but the LOTR absolutly is not one of them. The Balrog holds up and more, as well as many other effects from that fantastic trilogy.
Its cuz Barlogs fire effects are not cgi, they had no such tech to simulate it. Its a real fire effects, captured and then tracked onto 3d model. It made it look kinda timeless
Not only did they create an exact copy visually but they made it sound worse. 20 years later and they can't make a better Balrog 🤡
I was just gonna say this. It's not supposed to be in the same cinematic world as Peter Jackson's...yet they legit copy the Balrog inch by square inch and still manage to make it worse 🤡
FYI, Both were done by the same VFX house, Weta Digital. 🤡🤡
you're just a hater
They are the same team 🤡
Pior aonde krl ?
They both look pretty good, but I kind of liked the first one as the contrast between black and the fire and smoke kinda adds to the mystery of how big it is while the 2022 version has the Embers in the black which pretty much spells out how big is is
Adding another comment. You can see the original one has some glow spots on for a second, but then most of its body vanishes like it's weaving in and out of Existance.
That’s a great thing they did because of budget, Leaving things Up to The imagination and playing with that aspect actually added to the realism and the look, also When Gandalf shoots a light from his staff to scare off the Nazgul that was a very simple trick, but very effective, it all adds to the realism of the movie, less is more if you know how to work with What you have.
This also fits in with Tolkien's descriptions of it. The balrogs aren't necessarily big gargoyle monsters, but rather a bunch of Maiar who shrouded themselves in shadow and flame; also the wings aren't really wings, as that's just how Tolkien illustrates the smoke spreading throughout the room. You can picture a fiery figure amidst a lot of smoke with glimpses of flames trying to seep through, which is what the 2001 version ends up emulating.
big agree. the darkness of the 2001 balrog makes it that much more frightening and true to the books. the 2022 balrog just reeks of a studio exec telling the VFX studio to "make it brighter or else the audience won't be able to see it 🥺"
In 2001 version you can see the air of heat on his mouth every time, he opens it (even in a distance). It looks really impressive and realistic. The 2022 version... doesn't have it. It looks just like painted in flame mouth, but doesn't feel real.
The original is better as the book describes him as kind of wreathed in shadow and flame if i remember right... so being darker was a good choice. Balrog actually didn't have wings if I remember right it also it was his shadow described as spreading out like dark wings. Been awhile since I read it tho so this is off memory.
You're entirely correct
Damn you got good memmory. 👍
I can't remember details like that when I read
I still feel like the 2001 design was a good change from the books as it made it so much more terrifying imo. Sometimes a good old massive monster is a better option.
They both look great. But I prefer the 2001 roar, I guess you can call it. Like someone said, it sounds like a furnace
It's funny, I didn't read the comments at all when I thought of it but my immediate reaction was "the roar for the 2001 version is so much better."
When this balrog showed up. It told me everything. It's a copy and paste yes, but more importantly they distinctly used the Peter Jackson version. The showrunners keep making it clear that they wanted to make this series different from the movies and source, and yet we see a Jackson balrog. Balrogs in the source had many interpretations, some more humanoid or with no wings. This only shows me that the people behind this show are truly creatively bankrupt, and do not know how to innovate.
Or they used the Jackson balrog because its imagery is iconic and awesome, and they were paying homage to the Jackson trilogy rather than dismiss it and preemptively act like the Amazon show is going to be better than the Jackson trilogy. Several times in the different teasers and trailers that have come out we've seen bits and pieces that show inspiration from the Jackson trilogy. I could be wrong, I'm waiting for the show to come out and make my final decision then, but I don't think it's creatively bankrupt to make use of something that worked so well before and that has been proven to be loved by fans and stood through the test of time. It rather seems like they're saying "our show is different, but familiar".
Oh come on. Appreciate the continuity rather than hate. These people can’t catch a break with us fans ha
@@marynazure I can appreciate an artistic endeavor to adapt material. You know, the same endeavor the jackson trilogy made. Operating on the influence of artists like John Howe and Alan Lee. This Balrog design is Howe’s. Id be immensely more interested in this series if we saw one through a different artists vision because not only would that breathe new life into concept, but also create a diverse picture of what the balrog could take shape as! My words are critical to a concept that requires criticism.
and 2001 balrog looks and sounds even better..
I disagree, I think they did it to please the fans as we have so much affection for the trilogy.
I’m not saying this just because I completely despise where the show is heading but the 2001 looks and sounds way better. 21 years later and the effects still hold up, TLOTR trilogy is a freaking timeless masterpiece in so many ways.
Just say you hate the rings of power and go.
I mean so do I so you're not alone mithrandir.
Wow! I'll never forget that moment in the cinema. I was only 9 years and had only learnt about Lord of the Rings around 1999 from my Dad. This scene and the argonath absolutely hooked me. Incredible then and Incredible over 20 years later.
Take into consideration that the concept for the 2022 version is based on the 2001 version. In 2001 they went on nothing but pure imagination. Not so in 2022.
no 😂😂 both come from the imagination of john howe
@@oremstale8558 good point
@@oremstale8558 Well technically John Howe had to originally create something unique to capture how Tolkien described the Balrog, and something that PJ sees as visually appealing. With the new one Howe already had his original design, but he decided to add more things on to it which imo look inferior to his original version.
@@yoshikagebuma7941 every set peice and character design is down to the artist's imagination. its not got anything to do woth the originality of the production.
Hardly: not only is the look wrong to the source (large man size, not giant, and no actual wings but rather spreading shadows), it's basically the same as we saw throughout much of the 70's and 80's Fantasy Roleplaying and wargaming scene: A alarge fiery horned demon with an anamalistic face. You'll find similar designs in old D&D and Games workshop stuff. Nobody found the look surprising unless they weren't aware of any of that scene or previous media.
I loved how when the OG balrog roared all you could hear was the HEAT WAVE coming out of it's mouth when the "camera" is close.
Right? It's roar sounds like a city burning down
That trembling air from the mouth of Jackson's Balrog is a pure icing on the cake. Made more than 20 years ago and still one of the most impressive CGI ever.
I noticed the camera style is also different. In PJ’s version it zooms in on the Balrog face, whilst it roars, emphasising the unique sound they achieved. Whereas Amazon’s version remains in a mid-shot removing that emphasis and uniqueness; as if they were trying to mask the sound. Quite sad really
how can you judge the camera work without seeing it in context? the scene will likely play out entirely differently from the khazad dum fight
I have to say, watching the 2001 scene never gets old, the fact that Gandalf realized it was a balrog and seeing his expression was priceless. I haven't seen Rings of power but seeing this comparison shows how much effort was put into the 2001 movie. The roar isn't generic and sounds like a powerful blaze. overall, still one of the best scenes from lotr imo
The road was unnecessary
2001 version, no comparison. When Gandalf uttered "Flame of Udun!" and "Fire will not avail you!" was absolutely riveting, you could feel Gandalf's struggle against the Balrog.
Hands down the 2001 Balrog takes the cake.. it still looks as good as ever and then crackling inferno sound of its roar is just soo unique. Sounds legitimately real..
The difference is staggering, and really goes to show that you can't rush these things. The OG Balrog was a combination of physical sculpt that was 3-D scanned, used hand-animation AND motion-capture, CG elements and layers on layers of smoke and fire video elements. They had to do it the hard way because the full-CG method wasn't possible back then. But what they did have, was all the tricks in the book, ingenuity, creative freedom, and TIME. Time is the most critical element, and this comparison perfectly demonstrates why.
The balrog in this TV show is 100% CG with real light, smoke and fire simulations and a jaw-dropping budget- and the result is... lack-luster to say the least. It's not bad by itself, but disappointing by comparison. The animation doesn't feel weighty at all, the fire simulation looks a little too bubbly and fluid, the sound design is fine but not outstanding, etc. What's depressing is that I absolutely believe that the team who made it are fully aware of these issues, but couldn't do anything about it. And I can tell why.
Everything about this reeks of modern Hollywood CG abuse: The studio thinks they can force artists to reach impossible deadlines by throwing infinite money at them. They buy all the shiniest, most cutting-edge tools, hire the best artists in the business... and order them to do a years work in a week.
The result is technically impressive but lacks the care, passion and polish these complicated shots need... the same care, passion and polish the original Balrog shots were given. These modern artists aren't inferior by any means, but they're being abused and disadvantaged by an uncaring system, and refused the ability to give it their all. So after slaving away for months to years, all their hard work ends up looking like tech-demo previz dogshit. For another example of this kind of CG artist abuse and severe mismanagement, look up what happened to CATS.
I dabble in 3D and i gotta say... The old one has less lighting and refracting, obviously, but it still holds up really well. Visually, the newer one "looks better" but I think having less detail, in the 2001 version, is how your eye would actually perceive light, instead of a super crisp image of the new one. I genuinely believe this is why CGI has gotten worse, because it doesn't represent what your eye would actually catch/see, atleast not my shitty eyes...
Modern cgi is clinical and sterile instead of expressive and dramatic
One thing that a lot of modern 3D artists seem to forget in more "realistic" productions is that you still need to mimic all of the imperfections of human sight.
A lot of the really good 3D artists I follow always say that the hardest part of the process is knowing when to remove detail and fidelity in order to mimick how a human eye or camera would see something.
An artist I follow said the following: "it might seem counter intuitive to painstakingly work on details only to add in cromatic aberrations, blur and other visual noise that will make the details harder to see, but in motion those imperfections will make everything seem more grounded and actually feel like part of the world"
This is part of the reason why this show looks so sterile, everything is pristine like it was just made, none of the wear & tear lived in aesthetic that the original trilogy captured so well.
You're right in the sense that this 2001 scene holds up - but not entirely right per se (under different lighting circumstances)
They had to use CGI creatively back then.
The scene in the original trilogy is VERY dark - other than the fact they're in moria, Durin's Bane could have been a lot brighter, firery, yadda yadda.
They chose to keep the scene dark - they used the dark to their advantage in order to prevent Durin's Bane from looking choppy as hell, since he blends in with the background. In lighter conditions, Durin's Bane would've not held up - he would've looked a lot more worse, comparable to the scene where Legolas took down the Mûmakil, but 10x worse.
If I rightly recall, Peter Jackson addressed this in one of his vlogs.
So, 2001 CGI would not compare to 2022 *in a bright setting*, but with the nature of the environment, and the creative thinking by using the dark to their advantage, blending Durin's Bane's model with the backgroud -- it definitely can.
It just shows how much they cared back then to deliver good quality scenes.
Sound wise?
2022 loses there.
This is pure bullshit dude. Right after the Moria scene the sequence continues in the Two Towers and we can see them fighting during daylight on top of the mountain and the Balrog looks great even during a super bright scene like that. Of course 20 years has passed, it's obvious that modern technology looks better but the point is that this still holds up.
@@thunderboltproductionsshpk Ah, you're talking about the fight that occurs on Zirakzigil... in the dark stormy environment that has about 15 seconds of screentime..
Sorry brother, but you'll probably want to rewatch that scene too, again, the envrionment has dark tones. It's nowhere near broad daylight, so that's pure bullshit, dude.
Not to mention the smoke radiating from the Balrog which again covers the models outline, furthermore blending it in with the stormy, cloudy environment, giving it a more realistic look.
You should delve into the subject of CGI more, it's interesting. The balrog was executed nicely in Jackson's trilogy.
Wait... an actually reasonable comment that doesn't say the obviously better looking model is totally inferior to the lotr one cuz the lotr movies=good and amazon=bad
@@inanimatemist8610 Unfortunately a lot of people have been commenting that. Glad I made your day :).
Balrog's fire effects in 2001 were not cgi....
You missed the part when they say the 2022 Balrog is gay and black.
Clearly just there for fan service by Amazon, like dropping Kirk into SNW, or the TNG crew into Picard. It's about the only thing in keeping with PJs LotR films.
U're wrong
@@victorlambert3480 How is he wrong?
wow amazon is shameless.
Why?
@@lillvesp Are you just being wilfully ignorant?
@@lillvesp They literally copied and pasted someone else's work, at least they made "their" Balrog more accurate and didn't give it wings.
@@lillvesp Nice puerile attempt to bait people into arguments 😂😂 Thanks for the laugh 😂
@@rexrogers1859 Not an attempt at all pissape, its just sp cringe people bash literally any news that comes out on this series. If the balrog looked different people would bash it for looking different. It looks simir yet a bit different. it looks good.
0:05 You know what? This is the true roar of a hellfire demon!!!
21 F*CKING YEARS!
Yep, and look how many years it took to bring total wokeness, depravity and regression into the west by these so called social justice warriors.
0:20 all his fire retracting as he slips back into the shadows, I LOVE the concept of the Balrog and these movies nailed it
I reversed the clip so he went "back to the shadow" lol
@@JohnnyFreeze92 ah dang, well I love what you did! Bwaha
I love how all creatures in lotr have unique sounds/voices. It’s always more subtle and it makes them way more intimidating and scary. For example, the way witch-king said “give up the halfling, she-elf” was scarier than most horror movies. And he talked very calmly and slowly. Not to mention those irritating high pitched screams that depict their suffering really well.
Here it’s a nice side to side comparison where they look almost the same, but the voice makes so much difference and we are immediately more drawn to 2001 version.
Peter Jackson and Alan Lee should sue them for this.
its john howes design, and he's working on the series 😂😂😂 think before you comment next time
The 2001 Balrog is still one of the finest digital effects ever put to screen. I honestly have no idea how they managed to make something look that good over 20 years ago
They used real fire on the 2001 version, that is why it looks so real even twenty years later
The 2022 version looks like a Diablo cinematic.
The 2001 version looks... more real? Definitely a mix of miniature and CGI.
Is the 2022 version full CGI? I would say so. Perhaps it's why it looks fake as &?$"
The 2001 is pure cgi as well, not miniature
@@lillvesp Ok. Well it was better done and more realistic 20 years ago than it is today with a budget 10 times bigger.
@@Stephen64138 it looks 99% the same. You hate just to hate. Its cringe.
@@Stephen64138 they modeled it out of a (giant) miniature which is why it has more textures etc the 2022 is just CGI which explains why it doesn't look as good
@@TheRodg43 Ah, that might be it. I remember a big miniature made by Weta probably from the movies making-of.
Amazing that after 20 years and numerous viewings, that scene still gives me goosebumps. Those movies were perfect, and nothing will surpass them for a very long time.
I always thought the Balrog CGI was top notch and still think it's incredible to this day. I remember watching the extra scenes on the DVDs where the CGI guy was talking about how he put 10000 distinct colors into it. He obviously poured so much love into designing that thing!
Both are pretty far from book description, but the original 2001 is god damn timeless. The sound is incredible, and the only thing I'd say the 2022 version wins on is the fire.
Even tho the 2022 version is objectively higher fidelity, it kinda just lacks the punch. Looks like a video game cutscene from what we've seen, they might do it better in the show. The 2001 still feels absolutely terrifying and grounded. So it wins.
Still think Amazon missed an oppurtunity to be more lore accurate with the design, but seems that lore is not high up in their priority lol.
I remember watching the fellowship of the ring in cinemas as a kid, the Balrog terrified me but I loved it! I loved that it’s roar didn’t sound animalistic, it sounded like power, two mountains colliding or something
I thought Amazon wasn't allowed to use design elements from the Jackson films... It's great to see the 2001 Balrog still holds up.
Another big failure from Amazon. This series won't last 2 seasons. Calling real fans of LOTR and Hobbit racist and sexist never works out. This series is the biggest waste of money ever. Get humbled Amazon.
The screech is so much more interesting and distinctive in LOTR. If you were to choose a sound that best defines heat, that is it. He sounds like a blazing furnace on maximum power. ROP sounds like a basic T-Rex lmao
Aside from the flame effects comparison, I really like that murky brown cinematic toning the original movie had. It blends everything in better and makes it look more finished. It also conveys a realistic/dusty/gritty atmosphere. The new version just looks too clean and commercialized.
I LOVE the look of the new one, mostly because it looks the same almost. Good job not trying to change what was already incredible.
I think 2001 still looks better as a whole. The smoke and details really added to its mystery. If i wanted large, mettalic winged demon i would go to warhammer's bloodthirsters. If you're gonna do a balrog, do it like the og one because that one made me shiver in my seat when i first heard it roar.
Watched all LOTR movies in theatres. I was 9 when the fellowship hit the big screen the entire Moria sequence had me on edge and I shrunk down when the Balrog showed up and roared
they both look great, really shows how amazing the 2001 was and still is though!
The Balrog in Fellowship feels like it has a lot of weight to it, an feels very solid. Not easy to acomplish with CGI, no matter the era.
Whats also crazy is the 2001 Balrog had to make their own design. They were adapting a book (unless there was like an Alan Lee painting of it), whereas RoP just copied the 2001 design
2022 doesn't even looker better, just brighter and a bit sharper imo, but 2001 is still insanely good
Copy---->Paste.
And something was lost in the copy... the original was darker and more menacing from what we have seen
Although still looking good, the sudden stiff animation of the "scream" for the new one made it look generic like something I'd see in a video game not a serial worth a billion dollars honestly, the way the 2001 Balrog's head shakes and tilts slowly up and down and side ways for a few seconds due to jumping high and landing on its feet thus breaking the fall made you feel the true weight and size of this terrifying friend coming out of the dark helping it look more intimidating, add to that the realistic blackish textures and somewhat dim red fire that made its hide look like burnt coal especially with the little bits and details sticking out here and there, the new one looked like a very good graphics cgi rendered fire demon boss from a video game at best with extremely unrealistic and poor looking yellow glowing fire, also the horns of the OG one were thick enough but didn't look disproportionate to its head, the new ones look way too thick / squarish and unrefined, and lastly the roar itself as others have said before for the 2001 one it was something unique and completely unheard of before, like what we were hearing was the sound of its sizzling hot hollow interior like something you'd hear if you put your ear close to a lava pit, the new one just sounds like a movie monster scream, clearly indicating that the producers for this show while trynna capture the OG feel didn't truly get what the original trilogy was aiming for. This is my honest and completely unbiased opinion.
I think what makes the 2001 Balrog so good to this day is that it's made so that the beast is hidden in its own darkness which highlights the theme of what this evil creature is. The only features that you get of it are highlighted by the flames. And as other people have highlighted, the roar of the newer one sounds lake a cave troll whereas the other sounds like its so loud it almost cannot be registered.
The 2001 Balrog sound was sourced from dragging a cinder block across a hardwood floor, there's a reason it's so raw
When balrog said "its balrought time and balrought everyone in the cave" in LoTR 2022 such magnificent reminiscence nostalgia we have
The thing that fascinated me most about the balrog in moria, was how it was released. For the dwarfes involved it must have been considered a bad day at work!
Old one looks and sounds better. New one’s ok. Too bad most of it is gonna be a bunch of forced _WoKe_ trash that shits all over the source material.
??
Thanks uploader it will stand the test of time, the sound design was epic on the original because its the sound you would expect.
When the balrog lit itself on fire at 0:10 did its face change ?
Looks like it after zooming in
Both are impressive, even by 2022 standards. But of course, we cannot ignore how the trilogy was decades ahead of its time in every field.
very cool thank you for this. i think they both look amazing
You could almost feel the heat emanating from the 2001 Balrog's maw as it let out that very distinct otherworldly roar. The 2022 version feels like a little generic something I've heard from Godzilla, King Kong, Pacific rim or some big monster movie from the past 10 years.
2001 looks more believable
The new one, the eyes, the way it’s animated, make the cgi more noticeable.
Not to mention the roar is vastly better in 2001
If You are curious why the older one looks better (or is it just my opinion?) - it's because when they where making LOTR in 2001, there was no possibility to render fire on computer (at least not on that scale), so they had to actually film the little flames separately for hundred times and then put it digitaly on the Balrog model. It was hard and costed a lot of time but in the end we can see real fire on the screen. While in 2022 version it's just another full CGI render where the whole fire is fake. It looks nice but one can feel that there is something fake and artificial in it.
I love them both. That variation - having the fire light up the horns - looks awesome
So do I!! You can gell he is not the same individual as Durin's Bane, because he has fire in his horns, on his forehead (that triangular flat region between his horns and above his face), and his horns curl downard a second time. This is *NOT* Durin's Bane, it's a different individual. I like to think of him as the nigh-twin brother of Durin's Bane. It's good to see a *second* Balrog on screen!!
Thank you. I KNEW they fukd up the sound. The Fellowship Balrog is pure inorganic sound effects, which makes it the BEST. It is genius editing to get the Balrog roar from just rock sounds. The Rings of Power Balrog has the same 'ol hodgepodge of animal sounds mixed in to make a road....just like everything else in hollywood.
HOW DOES THE NEW ONE LOOK WORSE !?
The ”roar” cuts out the music, the same technique used in lotr’s battle- scenes. Just awesome
Since everyone was talking about the roar (which I prefer the original)
I made a short video comparing it to the cave troll and a T-Rex ua-cam.com/video/Cxr2ANICVT4/v-deo.html
Yea 0:10
2001 for me all day and night - The roar is just absolutely terrificly done for the original, and makes Balrog sound like something far greater than just another beastie. Generated by scraping bricks over wood with the crackling of fire I do believe!
The 2000's version is showing its age, but still looks impressive. One of my favourite fantasy creatures ever. For the 4k edition of the trilogy, they had to retouch the digital effects. Was this clip taken from that edition?
This was actually taken from the Original, that was upscaled to 4K by a UA-camr.
ua-cam.com/video/CeKoqX-Ub8U/v-deo.html
So it is not the touched up version, and still looks great!
@@JohnnyFreeze92 they took visual effects to the technological limits of their time and even invented some new technologies. A true milestone in cinema history.
@@matiasdevaglia4541 Yeah, the making of the LOTR is almost as good as the movies themselves.
2001 - sounds like a creature born from fire, out of this world, scary and magical
2022 - lion says rOaRrRr
The 2001 Balrog is more frightening for me personally. Maybe because it's a mixture of realness and CGI?! My unconsciousness is telling me that the 2022 Balrog is fake and not convincing. That's why it's hard for me to take it seriously. Also they definitely ruined the lighting for the new Balrog. It's too much light and not sinister enough.
The fact that the original movies were done in lower resolution means that everything kinda blends together in terms of fidelity making balrog look more realistic in comparison to actors.
Amazon: Does things differently
People: Oh my God, this is a travesty, why do they have to make everything different! The Peter Jackson movies were so much better, why can't it be like them!!!! This is ruining Tolkien!
Amazon: Shows something straight out of the Jackson continuity
People: Oh my God, Amazon is creatively bankrupt, now they're using familiar designs! This show is going to be a disaster, Tolkien is destroyed!
😂 sooo damn right 😂
First of all, people are upset not because Amazon is doing something differently in regards of the PJ adaptations. They're upset because Amazon is doing something differently in regards of Tolkien's very own writing, the source material.
Second. Amazon has been saying in interviews and articles that they want to distance themselves from the PJ adaptations and that and I quote "We don't want to simply make a prequel". However their actions are saying anything but. Sure art designs will look familiar and it would be stupid of them to not bank on nostalgia. Especially since John Howe is working with them. But it's not good if so far nostalgia is their only strongest selling point and their actual original designs are falling short and can't live up to the expectations of fans. In summary when people say that Amazon should be like PJ's adaptations, what they mean is that they should have the same high standards that PJ had for his films. Everything in Peter Jackson's films had passion behind them, more specifically the passion for Tolkien. Amazon has passion alright. Passion for a product and passion for a vessel to push their politics and ideologies onto people.
Facts
@@robertosabado4955 yup exactly, Amazon has the same passion Warner Bros had when forcing Jackson to make the Hobbit Trilogy, all they care about is money.
The whole show is just a fan service! That's why we see Galadriel warrior princess, hobbits (harfoots my ass),
wizards, black elves and dwarves, and now a balrog and palantir!
They don't care about the lore! They just thought about what characters, concepts and events made the original film trilogy famous, and re used them in their own make-up version of Tolkien for profit and in telling THE MESSAGE.
I am astounded how good the 2001 version looks. Way better than the mdern day one too.
Give me 2001 that's care that thing has care and attention to detail. The sound the way the flame and the body moves. Perfection
It's a bit weird to me that the rings of power make such an effort to distance themselves from the Peter Jackson movies, yet still heavily borrow the same visual imagery for the Balrog. Almost like they recognize that someone did something about as well as it could be done, and decided to incorporate that in their product. The issue is that while they're fine with stealing visuals, they seem intent on just ignoring or flat out changing the lore and history behind those visuals.
the 2022 version sounds like a trex from jurassic park, 2001 sounds like a balrog
When the new one roars I'm expecting John Hammond to pop out saying "Welcome to Jurassic Parc!", it sounds like a fucking t-rex with a sore throat.
The sounddesign of that 2001 when he ,,raws" and its just this HEAT ....thats the best Part they did such an amazing job