@@nitzeart yes i could see dropping 12 back into kids. But 13 and 18 are still very very different ages as far as maturity and comprehension. It’s a period of rapid growth and development and ya just doesn’t give enough guidance as to which books are appropriate for someones age because its too varied. Obviously people can read whatever they want and content warnings on the back would be appreciated but ya needs some major overhauling imo
@@bulletbeau9300 maybe it's just that I wasn't that different at those ages, I was pretty mature and analytical even at 12 and I still like middle grade and children's books to the day so for me 12-18 is the same haha. When life began changing a lot for me was for college and my 20s. THAT is different. I think the best solution would be to have a system like the movies/TV from G, PG, PG-13 R, etc. Because at the end of the day YA is more of a marketing thing than a guide for consumers on what is age-appropriate. I think that would be more helpful, and it might also help for adult books that are too graphic and have trigger subjects but for some reason the publishers don't tell you any trigger warnings.
I just turned 21 and while I read A LOT of books when I was younger, for the past couple of years I just haven't had the time for it. And I've been wanting to get back in to reading fantasy so this video was something I really needed because while I love YA books, sometimes I can't really relate to the characters or get into a book as much if the characters are too young or have very "teen" problems. Also this is the first time I've seen someone recommend Blood Heir and it's one of my favourite books ever. The 3rd and final book came out this year and I'm so excited to finally pick it up because I loved the first 2 books
Teen librarian here. I agree with everything you said. I read the first two books in the Aureleon series and I struggle with recommending it to teens because of the pacing and themes but it never occurred to me that it could be adult. I think there are several YA authors who write YA for adults who read YA such as Laini Taylor, Maggie Stiefvater, and Robin LaFevers and I will die on that hill-LOL. I like YA but sometimes it's hard to find a good fantasy so I started reading adult and I'm not having much luck but I've never read Blood Heir. Since I agree with everything you said, I'll read that one. Thanks for the rec.
This video was fantastic. I loved your explanations. As a reader I love the new adult genre because it feels like it really represents where I’m at in life.
I wanted to thank you for your recommendation for fireborne : my husband was looking for a book to read, so I offered him the trilogy and he absolutely loves it (he even cried at the end).
I think the best solution would be to have a system like the movies/TV from G, PG, PG-13 R, etc. Because at the end of the day YA is more of a marketing thing than a guide for consumers on what is age-appropriate (genres are just for marketing really). I think that would be more helpful, and it might also help for adult books that are too graphic and have trigger subjects but for some reason the publishers don't tell you any trigger warnings. Because that has happened to me before, where I encounter certain graphic subjects I was not warned about. How nice it would be to see an R label on certain books, with the warnings it often comes from, that tell you what sensitive subjects you might expect, what are the explicit things depicted on text and you don't have to be asking around or go into a book with no warnings. That way, also, some advanced young readers can safely read books marketed under "adult" but have no sensitive topics (for example mistborn), basically a pg-13 rating
WHY ISNT NEW ADULT A REAL THING LIKE THIS and just a smut genre!! its so frustrating. I love fantasy but im aging out of YA and i'm still not fully into adult, its kind of simultaneously too boring and too complex like I am not quite there yet reading level wise or adult cares of the world, character relations etc. But most YA fantasy is just feeling not quite complex enough. Adult gets more creative with the magic and world. So I as a 24-25 year old have just been STRUGGLING to find the books this huuuuge gap. Thank you for these recs and this conversation!!!
There are so many middle grade book that are Ina series that evolve to young adult and further into their series they evolve to this new genre. It makes sense.
I love the addition of New Adult. Now, let me put out there that I'm 48 years old with a 15 yr old non binary child and a husband who is about 5 yrs younger and also an avid reader so this discussion is awesome. I think that the YA and NA (new adult) age rangers are a bit too broad but I 100% recognize how difficult it might be for authors and publishing houses to closer define those age ranges. My husband and I met when he was a mall cop and I was an assistant for a mall Waldenbooks. :) As a former bookseller and a mother, and someone who read above her "age appropriate" books (and my husband has read above his "age appropriate" range as well) I do find the YA and NA (New Adult) genres to be muddy. I feel like 30 is Adult. Period. at 30, we have been at the adulting game enough to be 'ADULT'. However, do we love our middle grade , YA, and NA? Yeah we do! Some of us are parents reading those genres to find books we think our kids might love and some of us are kids at heart. However, the Genre system is more of a marketing thing so when adults purchase books and book series in the Middle Grade, YA, or NA age range, it does make it more difficult for them to set a genre. I think it should more up to the authors and not as up to marketing and sales.
Even if there isn’t a “new adult” caregory as such what I appreciate is reviews like yours that highlight whether a YA title feels more adult - despite being considerably above the YA age group I do read YA from time to time especially with so many fantasy titles in this category so it’s good to know which ones feel a bit “older”…it helped me a lot when deciding whether to get into the grisha books from shadow and bone…not surprisingly…I didn’t!
I’m not sure what age range they market it for, but Kristin Cashore’s Graceling series seems like it would be new adult to me. I love a good exploration of the aftereffects trauma and Bitterblue is especially good at that.
I like the idea of having new adult. To me it seems like it would help new readers figure out what they like. If only publishers could think about DA MONAY a little bit less though... lol
I think the books of Adalyn Grace fit this category quite well. The writing style is very YA imo, but the things that happen are probably better for slightly older readers, like 17/18 up or something.
Oh. Wow. I loved Rage of the Dragons. I had never thought of it as a Shonen. But that makes a lot of sense. The main character does fit the Shonen archetype.
I feel like New Adult should just be Young Adult and Young Adult should be Teen. I feel like 20+ Is Adult you're just a young adult. Being an older teen 16-19 is still a teen reader. Although like you said a 13yo and a 19yo don't have the same tastes. I've just never liked the terms for the age ranges.
I know when I told my uncle what Young Adult was, he immediately had the same reaction as what you’re describing. He was confused about age range bias because he thought, “Aren’t you a young adult?” 😆
I like the idea of New Adult in terms of style and maybe language used in the writing. Sometimes I've gotten a book for YA that read much too young and I would have enjoyed the story if it had more grit. On the other hand I wouldn't want an author changing the story they've worked on for sales alone. Bit of a catch 22. Then again I just read an adult book where they talk like teenagers( which I cannot stand).
At first I was kind of against the term 'New Adult' but I've found that I actually like it as the middle ground between YA/Teen and Adult because some titles do straddle the line between. Also, my TBR list got just a little bit longer.
I will say, this is perfect timing... I am reading Kingdom of the Cursed which is considered YA, I expect love and affection and angst.... But I was reading it this morning and ... I started blushing 😂😳
tbh, whenever I hear/read talk about age ranges for books, I think of Mitch Hedberg saying, "every book is a children's book if the kid can read." I mean, I guess I'm for new adult, I just kind of wish there were a better terminology for it. new adult, to me just sounds awkward. though, I say this as an old adult so it could just be that I'm not hip with the happenings of today's new adults. ps. hip is still a word that's used right??? :p
Do you have any suggestions of fantasy romance books where the female MC is 20 or older? I’m kind of sick of seeing the only ones I can find being 16-18 year olds with much older men.
I think content warnings would alleviate the need for 'age range' categorization. We have them for other media, just make it part of the info page. 😁That along with the blurb, the genre and the cover presentation should be more than enough for target audiences. JMO
Hi! Currently reading Strange the dreamer, so full of wonder! I'm loving it. Reading doesnt have to be an expensive hobbie, thats what public libraries are for. About the topic... well, new adult was born from those contemporary campus romances thet included sex scenes, so, for me, new adult is always going to be related to that, lol. But it is ok to know what age are the protagonists of the book you want to read. I remember when i picked up Twilight thinking it was adult, what a disappointment! 🤣 (But i enjoyed anyways).
I question a little even the split between young adult and adult, so I think I'm mildly opposed to new adult as yet another category. I mean half of the young adult readers are adult, so maybe we should just realize that this is in fact media consumed by adults? If you think of things like TV shows, movies, video games, etc. while there can be ratings like R or TV-MA or ERSB-M or AO to generally "protect" kids from sex or violence, I don't think we separate those things by topic beyond that. I'd rather see the things we talk about be more like is it a "good" or "bad" execution, is it character-driven or plot-driven, is it of a more literary/purple prose or is the prose more straightforward and clear, does the world building seem wholely new and creative or feel more like a set historical period, is there lots or action or not much that happens, is the book optimistic and happy or depressing and broody, etc. To me those sort of categories and topics are more interesting than intended ages. Also if there are intended ages, I'd recommend they be more overlapping than distinct. I.e., maybe YA is 12-20 and new adult is 16-25 or the like (or maybe YA is 12-112 and NA is 16-116 and it is really much more about the lower limit than the upper limit, more similar to PG/PG13/R from the movie rating system).
I definitely think they should have a new adult range because I think, like you said, some YA books are written for a bit older audience but not necessarily completely adult. Then some adult books are written a bit younger but still contain some adult content where they can't be considered YA
I think also another problem is that adult readers are still frequently reading YA for the pacing, writing style and even tropes. Therefore YA is becoming increasingly more adult and less and less appropriate for actual young teens
I just found out that John Greens books are being banned in places,especially in schools and most likely the ones banning them aren’t reading them…banning books is stupid. Read more banned books!
I love you and your content so much and I always appreciate your thoughts and the way you present things but I have to argue here that shadow and bone is higher end YA … the darkling literally commits genocide and mass murder. Threatens and manipulates people… and gifts Genya as a sex slave to the king essentially. He knew she would be r*ped by the king and he sent her to work there anyways. And it’s discussed in the book on page so again I just have to disagree that I would consider it higher side of YA for the content. The writing style may seem “easy” or juvenile but I don’t think the content is juvenile in any way… which is why they aged up the characters for the TV Show so they could delve farther into the dark themes without it feeling out of place for the age of the characters
Those are great points! Maybe my perception is due to the kinds of things I read as a kid, like Number the Stars (this is of course not fantasy) where things involving the Holocaust are discussed. But the content you mentioned is definitely very heavy and I can see why it would be seen as older 💗
@@ebnovels I definitely think darker topics have a place in YA and I do think shadow and bone does a good job discussing them in the age group but I definitely would recommend it to a 17/18 year old before I ever recommended it to like a 12/13 year old lol basically that’s all I meant- That it’s on the higher end of YA bc of the content!! 💗🙏🏻
I thought this was a video about new books that are adult lol. Don't think 'new adult' is really a thing. From everything I heard it was a DOA concept.
I’m for it but i think the age range for ya needs to be adjusted. 12-15 should be teen. 16-20 should be ya. 21-25 can be new adult
Those are way tk many for me. I would get confused hahaha but I like the spirit. At least part tee 13-18 from ya/new adult 18-25 or something
@@nitzeart yes i could see dropping 12 back into kids. But 13 and 18 are still very very different ages as far as maturity and comprehension. It’s a period of rapid growth and development and ya just doesn’t give enough guidance as to which books are appropriate for someones age because its too varied. Obviously people can read whatever they want and content warnings on the back would be appreciated but ya needs some major overhauling imo
@@bulletbeau9300 maybe it's just that I wasn't that different at those ages, I was pretty mature and analytical even at 12 and I still like middle grade and children's books to the day so for me 12-18 is the same haha. When life began changing a lot for me was for college and my 20s. THAT is different.
I think the best solution would be to have a system like the movies/TV from G, PG, PG-13 R, etc. Because at the end of the day YA is more of a marketing thing than a guide for consumers on what is age-appropriate. I think that would be more helpful, and it might also help for adult books that are too graphic and have trigger subjects but for some reason the publishers don't tell you any trigger warnings.
I do totally agree about Mistborn being good for both YA and Adult readers. It really does bridge the gap between the age ranges for sure.
I just turned 21 and while I read A LOT of books when I was younger, for the past couple of years I just haven't had the time for it. And I've been wanting to get back in to reading fantasy so this video was something I really needed because while I love YA books, sometimes I can't really relate to the characters or get into a book as much if the characters are too young or have very "teen" problems. Also this is the first time I've seen someone recommend Blood Heir and it's one of my favourite books ever. The 3rd and final book came out this year and I'm so excited to finally pick it up because I loved the first 2 books
Teen librarian here. I agree with everything you said. I read the first two books in the Aureleon series and I struggle with recommending it to teens because of the pacing and themes but it never occurred to me that it could be adult. I think there are several YA authors who write YA for adults who read YA such as Laini Taylor, Maggie Stiefvater, and Robin LaFevers and I will die on that hill-LOL. I like YA but sometimes it's hard to find a good fantasy so I started reading adult and I'm not having much luck but I've never read Blood Heir. Since I agree with everything you said, I'll read that one. Thanks for the rec.
Thanks for what you do as a librarian!
This video was fantastic. I loved your explanations. As a reader I love the new adult genre because it feels like it really represents where I’m at in life.
I wanted to thank you for your recommendation for fireborne : my husband was looking for a book to read, so I offered him the trilogy and he absolutely loves it (he even cried at the end).
Ohh, that’s awesome! I’m so happy he liked it 😄
I love what New Adult did to me as a reader. It was a stepping stone from ya to adult.
I think the best solution would be to have a system like the movies/TV from G, PG, PG-13 R, etc. Because at the end of the day YA is more of a marketing thing than a guide for consumers on what is age-appropriate (genres are just for marketing really). I think that would be more helpful, and it might also help for adult books that are too graphic and have trigger subjects but for some reason the publishers don't tell you any trigger warnings. Because that has happened to me before, where I encounter certain graphic subjects I was not warned about.
How nice it would be to see an R label on certain books, with the warnings it often comes from, that tell you what sensitive subjects you might expect, what are the explicit things depicted on text and you don't have to be asking around or go into a book with no warnings. That way, also, some advanced young readers can safely read books marketed under "adult" but have no sensitive topics (for example mistborn), basically a pg-13 rating
I'm new to Booktube, so I very much appreciate the breakdown of the New Adult discourse at the beginning of the video. Thank you!
WHY ISNT NEW ADULT A REAL THING LIKE THIS and just a smut genre!! its so frustrating. I love fantasy but im aging out of YA and i'm still not fully into adult, its kind of simultaneously too boring and too complex like I am not quite there yet reading level wise or adult cares of the world, character relations etc. But most YA fantasy is just feeling not quite complex enough. Adult gets more creative with the magic and world. So I as a 24-25 year old have just been STRUGGLING to find the books this huuuuge gap. Thank you for these recs and this conversation!!!
There are so many middle grade book that are Ina series that evolve to young adult and further into their series they evolve to this new genre. It makes sense.
I love the addition of New Adult. Now, let me put out there that I'm 48 years old with a 15 yr old non binary child and a husband who is about 5 yrs younger and also an avid reader so this discussion is awesome. I think that the YA and NA (new adult) age rangers are a bit too broad but I 100% recognize how difficult it might be for authors and publishing houses to closer define those age ranges. My husband and I met when he was a mall cop and I was an assistant for a mall Waldenbooks. :) As a former bookseller and a mother, and someone who read above her "age appropriate" books (and my husband has read above his "age appropriate" range as well) I do find the YA and NA (New Adult) genres to be muddy. I feel like 30 is Adult. Period. at 30, we have been at the adulting game enough to be 'ADULT'. However, do we love our middle grade , YA, and NA? Yeah we do! Some of us are parents reading those genres to find books we think our kids might love and some of us are kids at heart. However, the Genre system is more of a marketing thing so when adults purchase books and book series in the Middle Grade, YA, or NA age range, it does make it more difficult for them to set a genre. I think it should more up to the authors and not as up to marketing and sales.
I always find Laini Taylor an interesting case, because in the US they're shelved in YA, but in the UK they're shelved with the adult books!
Even if there isn’t a “new adult” caregory as such what I appreciate is reviews like yours that highlight whether a YA title feels more adult - despite being considerably above the YA age group I do read YA from time to time especially with so many fantasy titles in this category so it’s good to know which ones feel a bit “older”…it helped me a lot when deciding whether to get into the grisha books from shadow and bone…not surprisingly…I didn’t!
Fantastic video✨🌺I can really see the love and passion for reading! The emotional aspects are so important
I’m not sure what age range they market it for, but Kristin Cashore’s Graceling series seems like it would be new adult to me. I love a good exploration of the aftereffects trauma and Bitterblue is especially good at that.
I really want to read that series!
@@ebnovels I really loved it, and there’s a new one coming out in November!
I like the idea of having new adult. To me it seems like it would help new readers figure out what they like. If only publishers could think about DA MONAY a little bit less though... lol
Hahaha, da monay rules all 😅
Not loading for me. Anyone else?
Same 😕
same
I think the books of Adalyn Grace fit this category quite well. The writing style is very YA imo, but the things that happen are probably better for slightly older readers, like 17/18 up or something.
Oh. Wow. I loved Rage of the Dragons. I had never thought of it as a Shonen. But that makes a lot of sense. The main character does fit the Shonen archetype.
I feel like New Adult should just be Young Adult and Young Adult should be Teen. I feel like 20+ Is Adult you're just a young adult. Being an older teen 16-19 is still a teen reader. Although like you said a 13yo and a 19yo don't have the same tastes. I've just never liked the terms for the age ranges.
I know when I told my uncle what Young Adult was, he immediately had the same reaction as what you’re describing. He was confused about age range bias because he thought, “Aren’t you a young adult?” 😆
I like the idea of New Adult in terms of style and maybe language used in the writing. Sometimes I've gotten a book for YA that read much too young and I would have enjoyed the story if it had more grit. On the other hand I wouldn't want an author changing the story they've worked on for sales alone. Bit of a catch 22. Then again I just read an adult book where they talk like teenagers( which I cannot stand).
At first I was kind of against the term 'New Adult' but I've found that I actually like it as the middle ground between YA/Teen and Adult because some titles do straddle the line between. Also, my TBR list got just a little bit longer.
I think New Adult is good to bridge that gap between YA and Adult. Ahh i really need to get Fire Bourne I keep meaning to 😅
Most of the "new adult" I've read recently is dark academia. Examples: Ninth House; Babel.
I will say, this is perfect timing... I am reading Kingdom of the Cursed which is considered YA, I expect love and affection and angst.... But I was reading it this morning and ... I started blushing 😂😳
tbh, whenever I hear/read talk about age ranges for books, I think of Mitch Hedberg saying, "every book is a children's book if the kid can read." I mean, I guess I'm for new adult, I just kind of wish there were a better terminology for it. new adult, to me just sounds awkward. though, I say this as an old adult so it could just be that I'm not hip with the happenings of today's new adults. ps. hip is still a word that's used right??? :p
Do you have any suggestions of fantasy romance books where the female MC is 20 or older? I’m kind of sick of seeing the only ones I can find being 16-18 year olds with much older men.
I want to read Daughter of the Moon Goddess so badly 🥲
I hope you enjoy it!
I just realized all of my favorite books either have been categorized as new adult, or are on this list.
One can always count on you for good recommendations 😊
I think content warnings would alleviate the need for 'age range' categorization. We have them for other media, just make it part of the info page. 😁That along with the blurb, the genre and the cover presentation should be more than enough for target audiences. JMO
Hi! Currently reading Strange the dreamer, so full of wonder! I'm loving it.
Reading doesnt have to be an expensive hobbie, thats what public libraries are for.
About the topic... well, new adult was born from those contemporary campus romances thet included sex scenes, so, for me, new adult is always going to be related to that, lol. But it is ok to know what age are the protagonists of the book you want to read. I remember when i picked up Twilight thinking it was adult, what a disappointment! 🤣 (But i enjoyed anyways).
Not everyone has access to libraries due to lack of transportation or distance, so I always try to keep that in mind!
So strange the video won't work on this just the audio.
Ok but I am allowed to read any range right
I question a little even the split between young adult and adult, so I think I'm mildly opposed to new adult as yet another category. I mean half of the young adult readers are adult, so maybe we should just realize that this is in fact media consumed by adults? If you think of things like TV shows, movies, video games, etc. while there can be ratings like R or TV-MA or ERSB-M or AO to generally "protect" kids from sex or violence, I don't think we separate those things by topic beyond that. I'd rather see the things we talk about be more like is it a "good" or "bad" execution, is it character-driven or plot-driven, is it of a more literary/purple prose or is the prose more straightforward and clear, does the world building seem wholely new and creative or feel more like a set historical period, is there lots or action or not much that happens, is the book optimistic and happy or depressing and broody, etc. To me those sort of categories and topics are more interesting than intended ages.
Also if there are intended ages, I'd recommend they be more overlapping than distinct. I.e., maybe YA is 12-20 and new adult is 16-25 or the like (or maybe YA is 12-112 and NA is 16-116 and it is really much more about the lower limit than the upper limit, more similar to PG/PG13/R from the movie rating system).
Have you ever checked out the Cradle series by Will Wight?
No, but I have the first one!
I definitely think they should have a new adult range because I think, like you said, some YA books are written for a bit older audience but not necessarily completely adult. Then some adult books are written a bit younger but still contain some adult content where they can't be considered YA
Love these book recommendations definitely will check them out👻🍂🍁🎃🎃🎃👻👻🍃👻🍂🍁🎃🎃📖📖📙📚📚📚📙🍁🍁🍂👻🍃🍃🍃👻🍂🍁🎃🎃🎃🍁🍂🍂🍂🍃👻🍂🍂🍁🎃🎃🍁👻👻👻📙📖👻👻🍃🍃👻🍂🍁🎃🎃
SO EXCITED!! 🍃🍃🍃🍁🍁🍁🍁🍃🍃🍁🍁🍃🍃🍃🍁🍁🍂🍂🎃🎃👻👻👻👻👻🍃🍃🍃🍁🍁🍂🍂📖📚📙📙📙📚📖📖📚📚📙📙📙📚📚📚📙📙📙📙📚📖📖📖📖📚📙📙📙📚📚📖📖
I just want content warnings on books and maybe themes explored.
New Adult? A bit convoluted I think. YA(safe) or Adult and leave it at that, IMO.
You like Abercrombie?
The Rage of the dragons sounds amazing so cool 👻👻🍁🍁🍁🎃🎃🍁🍁🍃👻👻👻🍃🍃🍃🎃🎃🎃🍁👻📖📖🍂🍂📙📙🍂📖📖🍂🎃🎃🍁🍃🍃👻📚📚📚🍃🍃🍁🎃🎃🎃🎃🍁👻📚📖🍂📙🍂🍂
I think also another problem is that adult readers are still frequently reading YA for the pacing, writing style and even tropes. Therefore YA is becoming increasingly more adult and less and less appropriate for actual young teens
I just found out that John Greens books are being banned in places,especially in schools and most likely the ones banning them aren’t reading them…banning books is stupid. Read more banned books!
Good morning Elliot hope you have a great day xoxo 😚 📖📖📖🍁🍃🍃🍃🍁📖📚📚👻👻👻📙📚📚📚📖🍁🍁🍃🍂🍂🍂🎃📙📙👻👻👻👻📙📚📖🍁🍁🍂🍂🍂🎃🎃🎃🎃🍃🍃🍁📚📙👻📙📙📚📚
I love you and your content so much and I always appreciate your thoughts and the way you present things but I have to argue here that shadow and bone is higher end YA … the darkling literally commits genocide and mass murder. Threatens and manipulates people… and gifts Genya as a sex slave to the king essentially. He knew she would be r*ped by the king and he sent her to work there anyways. And it’s discussed in the book on page so again I just have to disagree that I would consider it higher side of YA for the content. The writing style may seem “easy” or juvenile but I don’t think the content is juvenile in any way… which is why they aged up the characters for the TV Show so they could delve farther into the dark themes without it feeling out of place for the age of the characters
Those are great points! Maybe my perception is due to the kinds of things I read as a kid, like Number the Stars (this is of course not fantasy) where things involving the Holocaust are discussed. But the content you mentioned is definitely very heavy and I can see why it would be seen as older 💗
@@ebnovels I definitely think darker topics have a place in YA and I do think shadow and bone does a good job discussing them in the age group but I definitely would recommend it to a 17/18 year old before I ever recommended it to like a 12/13 year old lol basically that’s all I meant- That it’s on the higher end of YA bc of the content!! 💗🙏🏻
I thought this was a video about new books that are adult lol. Don't think 'new adult' is really a thing. From everything I heard it was a DOA concept.
Blood Heir sounds amazing book I can’t wait to read it 📙📚🍁👻👻👻🍁📚🎃📙📙🍁👻👻🍃🍂🍃🍃🍁🍁📚📙🎃🎃📙📚📚👻👻🍁📚📚🎃📙📖📖📖🍂🍃🍃🍃🍂📖📖🍂🍃🍁🍁📚📙🎃🎃🎃🎃