@@fullm3taljacket It's objectively the best performing 1-10 on the market. Better glass than the competition , the disappearing razor bezel that everyone loves from the 1-6 sfp models, and the only 1-10 with actually daylight bright illumination. If price is not an issue, I'd take a razor gen III over the competition any day all day long. Where it falls down is price. Vortex has hiked the price on these 2-3 times over the last 5 years while the competition has been releasing comparable offerings for 30-40% less. If I cared about price (and I do) I'd take the eotech vudu 1-10 @ $1200-1300 on sale and just deal with the fat bezel, the annoying fact that the entire rear of the optic turns, uncapped turrets, and the useless illumination. Jury is still out on the new trijicon 1-10.
@@FocusTripp the razor gen III SHOULD be evaluated as basically a slightly better vudu 1-10 (about equivalent glass, except daylight bright in a better housing) but 30-40% more expensive (ouch)
I love when people say things like "I would never buy a 1-4" or insert whatever absolutist statement, when the reality is 95% of them probably don't even shoot. They just buy stuff and play in their living room.
Everybody knows FOV is overrated! Why have a good FOV and good magnification at realistic combat ranges when you can get too much magnification and restricted FOV that doesn’t add anything but sounds really cool?
I just wouldn't buy a 1-4 since I can get a 4x fixed optic thats superb. 1-6 and 1-8, however, is reasonable to me. Also for context I like piggybacked red dots, so I don't actually care about 1x all too much.
My Primary Arms 1-6 has been going strong since 2015. Holds zero, and have thousands and thousands of rounds through it. Dropped off a cliff, drug through the dirty and launched off the back of a Razr.
@@FocusTripp I don't think you were even being remotely dismissive or disrespectful to the autist lol, and even if you were, who cares, that's the show: you guys talking about this stuff whether you agree or not
I work at one of the PSA locations and we actually do supply rifles to several local police stations in SC idk how many over the entire state but local to my store I’ve seen atleast 2-3 different departments order 12-15 of them. I think it’s mostly for training cause most of the departments around here have a set list of rifles they allow for actual patrol use. But I’m not a cop and different departments are run differently so I’m not 100% sure.
I’m skeptical of any 1-8x or 1-10x LVPO. Just too much compromise when it comes to reticle and glass characteristics. Stick with 1-4x or 1-6x. If you need more magnification, get a 2-10x scope.
You can get some really good 1-8s. The credo/vcog have some amazing glass, but you're paying for it, and the arken Ep8, is outstanding, especially considering the price
@@feetoorourkeI’m definitely thinking about getting the arken. For $1200 less than the primary arms and eotech vudu, I can buy enough ammo and range time to get comfortable with the kl box reticle
#1). At only 20 oz and under 8.5”, the Gen 2 March 1-10 “Shorty” has a Dual Focal Plane Reticle & Manual Parallax Adjustment. 2). Vortex AMG 1-10 “Shorty” 3). PA PLXc 1-8 (FFP)
a couple note on the March 1-10: March actually made a a special mount for the gen 1 that had a 30mm back ring and 34mm front The gen2 version (which is what is pictured on the tier list) has a 34mm tube all the way so you can use commonly available mounts, it also has pretty fancy locking turrets and a stronger scope body than the original version and yes I have seen pictures of JGSDF Howa type 20's with the gen 1 March 1-10
Maybe I'm splitting hairs, but I'd like to see you do these tier lists on best to worst in levels. Like 100-500$ so to speak. Best budget LPVO's, best budget red dots etc. What do you think kind sir?
We need a barrel tier list Criterion Centurion Noveske Proof Stainless/Carbon Daniel Defense Geissele Krieger Barlein Wilson Combat Ballistic Advantage Etc ..................
I’d love to see a side by side comparison of all these tested from a bench rest from 100-800 yards with a variety of ammo. That’s asking a lot though, that would be a difficult test.
@@DrunkDrynasty it also would tell you basically nothing because barely anybody in the gun community actually cares about tracking performance/durability data and sharing it with others/collating/compiling it in any coherent or contiguous way. I just barely got into guns as more of a hobby instead of just a thing that I own and go shoot once week, and I'm pretty disturbed by how slow, erratic, low-tech, and low-skill the gun community at large is, including aftermarket manufacturers, accessories manufacturers, and even firearm manufacturers themselves. Every other high-tech hobby or community I'm involved in is so much better at implementing technology from other fields or disciplines to improve their own field, and so much better at cooperating with each other, making publicly accessible databases, keeping track of important information or empirical data, or just organizing info in general. Gun community feels like it's 95% people who have no idea what they are talking about at all and they don't even TRY to understand these things at a deeper level, so now I gotta be the one who has to go fix a lot of this stuff because my brain can't take it lol, I can't believe we have access to so much data and people are constantly trying to do 'tests' to evaluate things, and then have no system, no protocol, no method.
Genuine question, where have you heard of bent op rods by PWS? I have one of their MK113 Alphas and I can’t find anything on Reddit or by googling. Just curious.
PWS are low key S tier and just not well known yet. I have an alpha LT as well as a mk114 mod 1 and mk111 mod 1. They are some of the best performing weapons I’ve ever used, and I’ve used some really great weapons. Would I take one over an HK 416? No. But I would take one over the majority of rifles out there. It takes something like an LMT / HK / Radian to outclass them in my opinion. The long stroke piston system is phenomenal.
Having run the Swampfox Arrowhead 1-8x for a couple of years now… I think it’s definitely in the “poor king” category. You can get it on sale for less than $270. Nothing is really beating it at that price.
Hope you don’t mind me asking but How do you like it?? I just ordered the vector continental 1-6 fiber with the throw lever for $320 shipped and waiting for it to arrive. I’m really curious about how it compares to the Vortex Venom 1-6… wondering about the durability and 1x performance between the two
@ I’m pretty pleased with it however I haven’t used a lot of lpvos. Clear glass and simple effective reticle and red dot like fiber is fast. However starting to want to get into those higher magnification 2-10s. However 90% of cases it fits the bill
@ thanks for the reply! Any fisheye at 1x or is it pretty flat? From other reviews it was implied that it was flat, I’m sure that they were being honest but I still question how honest since there’s a financial incentive for them through affiliate programs
Did the Burris RT6 make it in here? I'm showing up late as always. Edit: I found it at 1:12:25. Ha i love these super long lives. "Top of Poor King" Top Ramen. I've seen this LPVO do well in the field.
Like for the like God, comments for the comment throne! Very sorry to hear about the loss. I'm actually really glad y'all did this because it helps out with my search to replace my (gifted to me) PA 1-8 sfp. While it's mostly serviceable, the glass is not great and I absolutely HATE chevron reticles. A buddy of mine just found the Vector Continental non fiber 1-6 for around 300, but I may have to give the Arkon a look too.
I have the AMG 1-10. It's basically a shorter razor gen 3 with better glass, particularly at the top end. The razor will noticeably darken at above 8x whereas the amg doesn't. The reticles are the same so if you don't like the razor you won't like the AMG. For a 556, particularly something shorter, I think it's a great optic. If your plan was to use it for a DMR role but you still wanted an LPVO, I'd probably go with an ATACR for finer point of aim.
Have you gotten behind the Gen 2 March 1-10 shorty?? It’s got a dual focal plane reticle and manual parallax adjustment… I’d love to see a CDOES comparison video between the Vortex AMG and March 1-10 shorty (Gen 2).
There are so many credo and accupower 1-6s, that it's basically apples to oranges for most of them. You have some that are SFP with the 1-8 reticle, you have FFP with the 1-8 reticle, you have SFP with the delta stryker 1-6 reticle, etc. Some with fiber illumination, some with etched illumination. Some reticle styles only offered in mil and some in MOA and some in BDC. IMHO, the only trijicon 1-6 worth getting is the credo HX 1-6 SFP BDC with the LED optic illumination. Basically a better version of the vortex PST and PA nova and on par with the Delta Stryker HD 1-6.
False equivalence. The way it be, it makes it harder than necessary to engage targets at 300m+, when the optic is a massive force multiplier at those longer ranges
The px4i from steiner is down to 600 dollars. Would that change your value to performance ranking on yhe optic? And would you strongly consider that scope? Thank you.
Idk what problems you’re having with the Atacr battery life. I hardly ever need the illumination on unless I’m shooting on the move and I have yet to change the battery in just about a year.
Almost every single LPVO will be better clarity and usefulness at 80% of max mag then 100%. If you use the optic in varying scenarios this makes more sense. Hence having your holds only work at max mag kind of really sucks in real world stresses.
@ maybe if you’re squeezing the max magnification out the tube diameter and lens diameter, but if the max magnification is conservative for the tube diameter and lens diameter that shouldn’t be true.
I got an early brn-180 lower with the out of spec rear pic rail, had to beat a Lage stock adapter onto it with a mallet. Worked fine with other 1913 stocks tho.
no kidding? Any downside besides the weight of a heavy priofile barrel? I’ve always wanted the receiver set actually and a pencil or thinner profile barrel modified to work by D-Wilson or somewhere similar that’s capable
I prefer lvpo's over other optic setups. I have a Swampfox Arrowhead 1-6 on my 300blk and a Arken 1-8 on my 14.5" 5.56. Like them both and they work for my needs. Was really impressed with the Arken and will probably be buying more from them in the future
So I was just offered a TA31 with the Red Crosshairs reticle for $800 and a TA11 with green Crosshairs for $950. I can probably talk him down on both. And he's offering Larue Tactical mounts for half off. Should I just buy one or both of these instead of buying an LPVO? What do yall think?
The Vortex AMG 1-10x shorty mentioned at the start, ‘The Texas Predator hunting Podcast’ channel here on UA-cam, did a video on it 5 months ago. Titled, Wade’s Holy Grail LOVO
Usmc combat vet here, imho lpvo is just a fad , for a defensive carbine ill take an eotech Exps3-0. For a hunting/target rifle 16-20in just get a 2-10 or 3-9 , why would i want a 19oz scope with max 6 magnification when i could have 10x for less weight , less money and have better glass. For me lpvo solved a problem that didn't exist and created more failure point on a rifle designed for defensive use.
March LPVO enjoyer comment below: 43:26 In regards to march's fragility, their X line is 34mm, which is basically a 30mm, but with 2mm of thickness added on all sides. The only thing fragile I have found on my FX1.5-15 is the turret caps can be dented somewhat easily on the capped models. The Dual focal plane design is the future and their DR TR-2B reticle is by far my favorite reticle I have used, with the only thing lacking is the nuclear bright dot (but it is still more than bright-daylight visible). The parallax on the F models can be a little touchy, but that's just a physics barrier as of this time. I do wish the turrets were a little smaller on all sides as it has the MPVO issues with backup RDS mounting. I prefer the 1.5-15 over the 1-10 as I find the 1.5 to still be plenty usable at closer rangers (see mini acog and PA 2x enjoyers) and the 10x is very usable, but you get the extra 50% max magnification for the times where you just want to stretch it out a little more. The light transmission and eyebox is quite nice as-well at the 8-12x as you are getting that 42mm objective. In regards to the 1-10, if you get the FX model, it is a straight 34mm tube, so you will have little issue finding a mount that will work (like from reptilia or burris or monstrum). You can get 3 different types of turrets with these. Pop up locking turrets like the credo and arrowhead, capped turrets, and their shuriken locking turrets. Also at shot2024, they teased the idea of going with a Vcog style of scope mounting, which I personally am a big fan of and will probably get one to replace my march 1.5-15 or get it in a 1-10. Depending on how lucky you are, you can find the march LPVOs from 18oo-28oo depending on what model you want. I got my FX 1.5-15 new for like 245o IIRC from a dealer. From what I have heard, one of the Japanese military issued optics is their regular (not F or X) 1-8. If you make it over to MI, you are more than welcome to run it. As of this time of posting, there is not a single other optic on the market that I would replace my 1.5-15x with IF I want a LPVO as it does everything I want and the massive list compromises it has is acceptable. (And no, it doesn't compete with top tier 4-16s like the nightforce atacr in terms of performance.) I still run my elcans and acogs and AEMS with vortex micro 3x, and even dabble with my other LPVOs (like my credo/accupowers, arrowhead 1-10s, and others), but as a magnification whore, who values size and weight, there is no one who comes close to competing. Fun fact, the March FX1.5-15 is shorter and lighter than the Trijicon Credo 1-8.
I witnessed the recoil of an AUG destroy a Kahles 1-6x after a few hundred rounds. Been concerned with LPVO durability ever since and that's not considering the other things I don't like about them. I'm personally on the prism/red dot combo team.
His reviews are the current pinnacle of quality. There are other really good reviewers, this channel being one, but for my 2 cents, his are the best. He doesn't just refuse to pull punches, he throws bombs...and optics.
I ordered the razor gen 2 and the nova slx at the same time to compare.... I returned the vortex due to weight and the glass was not much better.... maybe at distance on 6x id notice a big difference but inside 100 yards I couldnt see the difference and the nova was so much nicer due to weight
I’ve been thinking about trading in my genII-e razor HD 1-6 for a PA PLXC. I feel like the PLXC is what the NF NX8 was trying really hard to be. Also, isn’t the razor gen III 1-10 a 34mm tube?
hey my friends, I would like an LPVO 2, there are two to choose from.... Eotech 1-10-28 Vudoo or the PRIMARY ARMS PLxC 1-8x24 FFP m/ACSS Griffin MIL M8 Can you tell me which one is better and maybe explain why, unfortunately I don't know much about it, thank you :) Warm greetings from Germany
The vortex Razor gen 3 is a 34mm tube and seems to be top picks for most people that add it to a comparison video when it comes to glass quality, not to sure why you guys rated it so low
For building infiltration/strike team type folks, I think those lower power ACOG's make a lotta sense. It's hyper-niche, and I don't think average people should buy them
I got a little carried away on the memorial day sales, I got a Sig MSR 1-8 for $350 and a tan Vudu 1-10 for $1410, got them both in, the Sig MSR field of view on 8x is horrid, the Vudu is def one of the nicest LPVO's on the market.
Finally what I’ve been waiting for. Thinkin about the VUDU. Hopefully it comes out ok Finished the vid. Nice to see the VUDU goes hard. Lookin at the 1-8 or 1-6 tho probably
I have, and really enjoy the Vudu 1-8 SFP. Top notch 1x and usable illuminated center dot in most conditions. 8x has a small eye box, but that’s probably the main trade-off. I’ve seen it on Battlehawk for ~$880 ish. It’s 5.56 bdc btw.
putting the nx8 over the razor is wild.....i've owned the atacr 1-8 and now have the razor 1-10 and honestly i prefer the razor. I like the diopter, throw lever, illumination dial and the glass at 1x better, however the center dot on the atacr was better and the illumination was better. i do wish the razor had a zero stop but not a huge deal. i could see the argument for putting the atacr over the razor for its durability and to some the feature set wins out on it and MAYBE the vudu from a value perspective but to put the nx8 above the razor is absolutely wild to me, especially considering you can snag a razor for 2k spending only a few hundred more than a nx8 getting a better optic thats only 5 ounces heavier....
Schmidt & Bender 1-8 cc is the best lpvo hands down it just costs you your left nut…also the newer khales 1-8 is really good, besides they have terrible reticles
2.6mm exit pupil on that Atibal is crazy man, that's such a foolish thing to make lmao. That's either some serious hubris or its brilliant understanding of their true audience: people who will baby their rifle all the time and just wanna have something crazy like this for bench shooting
Jon encouraged me to create this; Give if you want, Pray if you can. It's been especially hard on my daughters.
www.givesendgo.com/GCTQ1
Excuse if the times aren't 100% accurate as a highpoint but enjoy.
6:06 ATACR 1-8x24mm F1
10:08 NX8 1-8x24mm F1 Capped
15:04 Helos BTR gen 2 1-10x28 ATMR4 SFP
17:52 ATIBAL HYBRID12 1-12x32 SFP Gen 1
25:38 Continental X10 1-10x28
29:04 Trijicon Credo 1-8x28
34:49 EOTECH Vudu 1-10x28 FFP
36:47 Arken Optics EP8 1-8x28 LPVO FFP
42:33 March-F 1-10x24 (insert model name here)
56:05 Kahles K16i 1-6x24i
59:21 Primary Arms PLxC 1-8x24 FFP (SLX ranked at 1:18:00)
1:05:04 Vortex Razor HD Gen III 1-10x FFP
1:12:20 BURRIS RT-6 1-6x24mm
1:15:12 SIG SAUER Tango MSR 1-6x24 30mm SFP (Tango6T pictured)
1:19:40 Vortex Strike Eagle Gen II
1:22:40 Trijicon VCOG
1:32:34 Vortex viper pst gen ii
1:35:19 Steiner P4xi 1-4x24
1:41:29 Swampfox Tomahawk
Legend
MANY THANK ON YOU BRUDDHA
You are S tier
Thanks so much for thisb
Thank you!
Condolences to the cohost on the passing of his family member.
“My soul is for sale” geez the tribe is getting a little extreme 👀
Vortex HD III 1-10x is 34mm tube not 30mm. It was criticized on the tier list for having a 30mm tube.
Still not objectively good
My bad
The new IOR is 40mm main tube… they started the LPVO trend…same glass as S&B too from the same factory
@@fullm3taljacket It's objectively the best performing 1-10 on the market. Better glass than the competition , the disappearing razor bezel that everyone loves from the 1-6 sfp models, and the only 1-10 with actually daylight bright illumination. If price is not an issue, I'd take a razor gen III over the competition any day all day long. Where it falls down is price. Vortex has hiked the price on these 2-3 times over the last 5 years while the competition has been releasing comparable offerings for 30-40% less. If I cared about price (and I do) I'd take the eotech vudu 1-10 @ $1200-1300 on sale and just deal with the fat bezel, the annoying fact that the entire rear of the optic turns, uncapped turrets, and the useless illumination. Jury is still out on the new trijicon 1-10.
@@FocusTripp the razor gen III SHOULD be evaluated as basically a slightly better vudu 1-10 (about equivalent glass, except daylight bright in a better housing) but 30-40% more expensive (ouch)
Real men know that the best LPVO is a basic bitch Japanese made Tasco from the 1970s-80s you can get at a gun show for 20 dollars.
When people tell you who they are, listen.
I love when people say things like "I would never buy a 1-4" or insert whatever absolutist statement, when the reality is 95% of them probably don't even shoot. They just buy stuff and play in their living room.
Everybody knows FOV is overrated! Why have a good FOV and good magnification at realistic combat ranges when you can get too much magnification and restricted FOV that doesn’t add anything but sounds really cool?
I just wouldn't buy a 1-4 since I can get a 4x fixed optic thats superb. 1-6 and 1-8, however, is reasonable to me.
Also for context I like piggybacked red dots, so I don't actually care about 1x all too much.
To judge an etched reticle optic on its battery life is beyond me. Just my .02
I kinda agree.
My Primary Arms 1-6 has been going strong since 2015. Holds zero, and have thousands and thousands of rounds through it. Dropped off a cliff, drug through the dirty and launched off the back of a Razr.
March Gang Gang! I've been rocking the 1.5-15 DFP for about 6 months now, it's a kick ass scope.
I just loss my mother-in-law last month, my condolences. I was here caregiver, I feel horrible for you.
Sorry for your loss brother.
John not realizing the Vortex Razor III is also a 34 mm tube feels awkward.
If you're just gonna gonna disregard/dismiss all of the cohosts opinions why even have him on?
We are going to disagree on things, that's the point?
@@FocusTripp I don't think you were even being remotely dismissive or disrespectful to the autist lol, and even if you were, who cares, that's the show: you guys talking about this stuff whether you agree or not
Some friends just argue about everything lol. It's weird but it's a thing. I have a few like that.
@@FocusTripp You misread disregard/dismiss as disagree.
I work at one of the PSA locations and we actually do supply rifles to several local police stations in SC idk how many over the entire state but local to my store I’ve seen atleast 2-3 different departments order 12-15 of them. I think it’s mostly for training cause most of the departments around here have a set list of rifles they allow for actual patrol use. But I’m not a cop and different departments are run differently so I’m not 100% sure.
Arming the gestapo hah
The first 20 seconds is hilarious. 😭😂
It summarizes guntube nicely
That video was put up like 4 hrs before this. He clipped that fast af 😂
how was the razor gen 2 or gen 2 e not on this list? that was the gold standard for like ten years until the PLXc came out.
Razor > PLXc
@ I agree but people love “muh magnification.” ipsc rifle world shoot and pcsl championship were both won with a gen 2 e 1-6.
That vortex 1-10 mentioned at the start looks like the optic adopted by UKSF on their KS-1 rifles.
It is
I’m skeptical of any 1-8x or 1-10x LVPO. Just too much compromise when it comes to reticle and glass characteristics. Stick with 1-4x or 1-6x. If you need more magnification, get a 2-10x scope.
You can get some really good 1-8s. The credo/vcog have some amazing glass, but you're paying for it, and the arken Ep8, is outstanding, especially considering the price
Agreed.
I love my 1-4x
Absolutely right
@@feetoorourkeI’m definitely thinking about getting the arken. For $1200 less than the primary arms and eotech vudu, I can buy enough ammo and range time to get comfortable with the kl box reticle
#1). At only 20 oz and under 8.5”, the Gen 2 March 1-10 “Shorty” has a Dual Focal Plane Reticle & Manual Parallax Adjustment.
2). Vortex AMG 1-10 “Shorty”
3). PA PLXc 1-8 (FFP)
Based
a couple note on the March 1-10:
March actually made a a special mount for the gen 1 that had a 30mm back ring and 34mm front
The gen2 version (which is what is pictured on the tier list) has a 34mm tube all the way so you can use commonly available mounts, it also has pretty fancy locking turrets and a stronger scope body than the original version
and yes I have seen pictures of JGSDF Howa type 20's with the gen 1 March 1-10
Maybe I'm splitting hairs, but I'd like to see you do these tier lists on best to worst in levels. Like 100-500$ so to speak. Best budget LPVO's, best budget red dots etc. What do you think kind sir?
Why is the vortex venom 1-6 not in this list?
How about a MPVO list next?
Maybe, I have much less experience with them.
@@FocusTripp get Brass and Hop on a video with you
We need a barrel tier list
Criterion
Centurion
Noveske
Proof Stainless/Carbon
Daniel Defense
Geissele
Krieger
Barlein
Wilson Combat
Ballistic Advantage
Etc ..................
I’d love to see a side by side comparison of all these tested from a bench rest from 100-800 yards with a variety of ammo. That’s asking a lot though, that would be a difficult test.
@@DrunkDrynasty it also would tell you basically nothing because barely anybody in the gun community actually cares about tracking performance/durability data and sharing it with others/collating/compiling it in any coherent or contiguous way. I just barely got into guns as more of a hobby instead of just a thing that I own and go shoot once week, and I'm pretty disturbed by how slow, erratic, low-tech, and low-skill the gun community at large is, including aftermarket manufacturers, accessories manufacturers, and even firearm manufacturers themselves.
Every other high-tech hobby or community I'm involved in is so much better at implementing technology from other fields or disciplines to improve their own field, and so much better at cooperating with each other, making publicly accessible databases, keeping track of important information or empirical data, or just organizing info in general.
Gun community feels like it's 95% people who have no idea what they are talking about at all and they don't even TRY to understand these things at a deeper level, so now I gotta be the one who has to go fix a lot of this stuff because my brain can't take it lol, I can't believe we have access to so much data and people are constantly trying to do 'tests' to evaluate things, and then have no system, no protocol, no method.
I wonder how many of them are made by bear Creek 🤔
@@bobbye7353More like FN. Bear Creek can barely make their own product. They aren’t doing work for any reputable company.
No Vector Continental? Where would it place?
I have one and I love it. I’d put it up against the Vortex Viper and Vortex Strike Eagle.
It's in here, my opinion is high c low b.
I wish FocusTripp would have included it; given he reviewed it in the recent past, and spoke highly of it amongst other budget options.
@@ericschumacher5189 it's in there, we definitely talked about it
@@feetoorourke Thanks; I must have missed it.
Genuine question, where have you heard of bent op rods by PWS? I have one of their MK113 Alphas and I can’t find anything on Reddit or by googling. Just curious.
No1 has ever heard of this because it never happens.
PWS are low key S tier and just not well known yet. I have an alpha LT as well as a mk114 mod 1 and mk111 mod 1. They are some of the best performing weapons I’ve ever used, and I’ve used some really great weapons. Would I take one over an HK 416? No. But I would take one over the majority of rifles out there. It takes something like an LMT / HK / Radian to outclass them in my opinion. The long stroke piston system is phenomenal.
Having run the Swampfox Arrowhead 1-8x for a couple of years now… I think it’s definitely in the “poor king” category. You can get it on sale for less than $270. Nothing is really beating it at that price.
Great video man. Still using my vector 1-6 fiber from your recommendation. Got last Black Friday for 300 I believe
Hope you don’t mind me asking but How do you like it?? I just ordered the vector continental 1-6 fiber with the throw lever for $320 shipped and waiting for it to arrive. I’m really curious about how it compares to the Vortex Venom 1-6… wondering about the durability and 1x performance between the two
@ I’m pretty pleased with it however I haven’t used a lot of lpvos. Clear glass and simple effective reticle and red dot like fiber is fast. However starting to want to get into those higher magnification 2-10s. However 90% of cases it fits the bill
@ thanks for the reply! Any fisheye at 1x or is it pretty flat? From other reviews it was implied that it was flat, I’m sure that they were being honest but I still question how honest since there’s a financial incentive for them through affiliate programs
@ compared to like a pa slx 1-6 it’s pretty flat but like I said I’m not some expert whose used nf or leupolds(yet)
@ thank you!
If you don't mind me asking, what software are you using to do the tier list with the pics?
Is the new Vortex AMG 1-10x24 the same as what’s on the KS-1 (new British SOF rifle)?
Yes
Did the Burris RT6 make it in here? I'm showing up late as always. Edit: I found it at 1:12:25. Ha i love these super long lives. "Top of Poor King" Top Ramen. I've seen this LPVO do well in the field.
Like for the like God, comments for the comment throne!
Very sorry to hear about the loss.
I'm actually really glad y'all did this because it helps out with my search to replace my (gifted to me) PA 1-8 sfp. While it's mostly serviceable, the glass is not great and I absolutely HATE chevron reticles. A buddy of mine just found the Vector Continental non fiber 1-6 for around 300, but I may have to give the Arkon a look too.
I have the AMG 1-10. It's basically a shorter razor gen 3 with better glass, particularly at the top end. The razor will noticeably darken at above 8x whereas the amg doesn't. The reticles are the same so if you don't like the razor you won't like the AMG. For a 556, particularly something shorter, I think it's a great optic. If your plan was to use it for a DMR role but you still wanted an LPVO, I'd probably go with an ATACR for finer point of aim.
Have you gotten behind the Gen 2 March 1-10 shorty?? It’s got a dual focal plane reticle and manual parallax adjustment… I’d love to see a CDOES comparison video between the Vortex AMG and March 1-10 shorty (Gen 2).
@@evanacey1414I have not but would be very interested to see a side by side. I've read the glass is good on those but the reticles are meh.
Where did you get the new razor?
@@connormckay9429 Eurooptic package with Daniel Defense. Sold the rifle.
Focus Tripp, what is your choice out of the poor king category, or your ranking from top to bottom?
There are so many credo and accupower 1-6s, that it's basically apples to oranges for most of them. You have some that are SFP with the 1-8 reticle, you have FFP with the 1-8 reticle, you have SFP with the delta stryker 1-6 reticle, etc. Some with fiber illumination, some with etched illumination. Some reticle styles only offered in mil and some in MOA and some in BDC.
IMHO, the only trijicon 1-6 worth getting is the credo HX 1-6 SFP BDC with the LED optic illumination. Basically a better version of the vortex PST and PA nova and on par with the Delta Stryker HD 1-6.
I came here looking for this, it is my LPVO of choice and it is *chefs kiss
marines aren't dialing their turrets mid ambush 🤣
HurrDurr...if marines don't need it mIdAmBuSh neither do you!
Why are they getting ambushed
False equivalence. The way it be, it makes it harder than necessary to engage targets at 300m+, when the optic is a massive force multiplier at those longer ranges
Any thoughts on the Zeiss Conquest V4 1-4x24?
The px4i from steiner is down to 600 dollars. Would that change your value to performance ranking on yhe optic? And would you strongly consider that scope? Thank you.
Funny list. Ive had most of these and the march 1-10 is the best one ive ever had.
Ever tried the SAI 1-6?
@@stevennewman4778 negative
Have you been able to review the Athlon Ares ETR 1-10x24?
ETA on the ODG version yet?
Idk what problems you’re having with the Atacr battery life. I hardly ever need the illumination on unless I’m shooting on the move and I have yet to change the battery in just about a year.
1:12 - I have a 10.5 LWRC m6 piston upper I got for like 700$ off GB as a police trade in, and to my surprise it groups awesome.
DAMN you clipped that QUICK😂 bro😂 lol i was so disappointed but yet not surprised JB said that
Does the SCO VCOG have marked turrets bc i was strongly considering getting one
That I am not sure.
Sorry about the lose.
But how can you make a tier list of things you haven’t used in person or tested hands on?
Based
Why would you use your BDC holds at anything other than your maximum magnification?
Almost every single LPVO will be better clarity and usefulness at 80% of max mag then 100%. If you use the optic in varying scenarios this makes more sense. Hence having your holds only work at max mag kind of really sucks in real world stresses.
@ maybe if you’re squeezing the max magnification out the tube diameter and lens diameter, but if the max magnification is conservative for the tube diameter and lens diameter that shouldn’t be true.
I'll die on my EP8 hill. But I'm poor so there's that
Vortex razor 1-6 gen 2e still very good 1x and 6x. Beautiful glass. So why not on the list?
Honestly I forgot...
Did I miss something or did you skip the Razor?
Also how come no Schmidt & bender pm2 dual cc 1-8x?
Is there a reason why I don't see more optics with like 1.5-6x/7x/8x, or 2x-6x/7x/8x
because having a 1x is very desirable. A lot of those scopes died out.
@@FocusTripp Ah I see. I'm so used to shooting with prism scopes with fixed magnification levels so I guess I've just gotten too used to not using 1x
thoughts on a PA 1-10*28 SFP for a 13.7 6.5 Grendel for distance upto 800yards
Where did you find the sig tango msr for $260?
Probably PSA. They had them on sale for awhile
$230-250 now, I would buy the vortex venom 1-6 for $250 if that's what you want to spend.
I am still stuck on the 1-6 razor gen2e
good option.
I got an early brn-180 lower with the out of spec rear pic rail, had to beat a Lage stock adapter onto it with a mallet. Worked fine with other 1913 stocks tho.
Reptilia makes 35mm LPVO mounts for pretty good price, Leupold also makes good 35mm mounts
I want That LMT in the beginning!
No you don't
no kidding? Any downside besides the weight of a heavy priofile barrel? I’ve always wanted the receiver set actually and a pencil or thinner profile barrel modified to work by D-Wilson or somewhere similar that’s capable
I wish lpvo labels were used instead of lil baby images. Unusable.
Noted
yeh seriously I can't see shit on here lol
I prefer lvpo's over other optic setups. I have a Swampfox Arrowhead 1-6 on my 300blk and a Arken 1-8 on my 14.5" 5.56. Like them both and they work for my needs. Was really impressed with the Arken and will probably be buying more from them in the future
I want PA to revamp the GLx 1-6. ACSS Aurora with really good glass. 34mm. Around $800.
So I was just offered a TA31 with the Red Crosshairs reticle for $800 and a TA11 with green Crosshairs for $950. I can probably talk him down on both. And he's offering Larue Tactical mounts for half off. Should I just buy one or both of these instead of buying an LPVO? What do yall think?
You have to be willing to have that fixed mag and a super tall dot.
How about a Schmidt and Bender 1-8 Dual CC?
The Vortex AMG 1-10x shorty mentioned at the start, ‘The Texas Predator hunting Podcast’ channel here on UA-cam, did a video on it 5 months ago. Titled, Wade’s Holy Grail LOVO
The Sai-6 is slept on, not even a mention, it's at least as good as a Razor if not better.
Usmc combat vet here, imho lpvo is just a fad , for a defensive carbine ill take an eotech Exps3-0. For a hunting/target rifle 16-20in just get a 2-10 or 3-9 , why would i want a 19oz scope with max 6 magnification when i could have 10x for less weight , less money and have better glass. For me lpvo solved a problem that didn't exist and created more failure point on a rifle designed for defensive use.
March LPVO enjoyer comment below:
43:26 In regards to march's fragility, their X line is 34mm, which is basically a 30mm, but with 2mm of thickness added on all sides. The only thing fragile I have found on my FX1.5-15 is the turret caps can be dented somewhat easily on the capped models.
The Dual focal plane design is the future and their DR TR-2B reticle is by far my favorite reticle I have used, with the only thing lacking is the nuclear bright dot (but it is still more than bright-daylight visible).
The parallax on the F models can be a little touchy, but that's just a physics barrier as of this time. I do wish the turrets were a little smaller on all sides as it has the MPVO issues with backup RDS mounting.
I prefer the 1.5-15 over the 1-10 as I find the 1.5 to still be plenty usable at closer rangers (see mini acog and PA 2x enjoyers) and the 10x is very usable, but you get the extra 50% max magnification for the times where you just want to stretch it out a little more. The light transmission and eyebox is quite nice as-well at the 8-12x as you are getting that 42mm objective. In regards to the 1-10, if you get the FX model, it is a straight 34mm tube, so you will have little issue finding a mount that will work (like from reptilia or burris or monstrum).
You can get 3 different types of turrets with these. Pop up locking turrets like the credo and arrowhead, capped turrets, and their shuriken locking turrets. Also at shot2024, they teased the idea of going with a Vcog style of scope mounting, which I personally am a big fan of and will probably get one to replace my march 1.5-15 or get it in a 1-10. Depending on how lucky you are, you can find the march LPVOs from 18oo-28oo depending on what model you want. I got my FX 1.5-15 new for like 245o IIRC from a dealer.
From what I have heard, one of the Japanese military issued optics is their regular (not F or X) 1-8.
If you make it over to MI, you are more than welcome to run it. As of this time of posting, there is not a single other optic on the market that I would replace my 1.5-15x with IF I want a LPVO as it does everything I want and the massive list compromises it has is acceptable. (And no, it doesn't compete with top tier 4-16s like the nightforce atacr in terms of performance.) I still run my elcans and acogs and AEMS with vortex micro 3x, and even dabble with my other LPVOs (like my credo/accupowers, arrowhead 1-10s, and others), but as a magnification whore, who values size and weight, there is no one who comes close to competing. Fun fact, the March FX1.5-15 is shorter and lighter than the Trijicon Credo 1-8.
Nah
@@jurpo6 No U
1:42:10 i feel you. I bought the Arrowhead 1-10x years ago and kinda wish i had gotten the 1-6x.
I witnessed the recoil of an AUG destroy a Kahles 1-6x after a few hundred rounds. Been concerned with LPVO durability ever since and that's not considering the other things I don't like about them. I'm personally on the prism/red dot combo team.
Deltathiryfour is legit.
His reviews are the current pinnacle of quality. There are other really good reviewers, this channel being one, but for my 2 cents, his are the best. He doesn't just refuse to pull punches, he throws bombs...and optics.
I ordered the razor gen 2 and the nova slx at the same time to compare.... I returned the vortex due to weight and the glass was not much better.... maybe at distance on 6x id notice a big difference but inside 100 yards I couldnt see the difference and the nova was so much nicer due to weight
Luv the rt-6 wish the horseshoe was thicker and the daylight brightness is only usable on like settings 8 +
LED LPVO illumination isn't something we should depend on.
I’ve been thinking about trading in my genII-e razor HD 1-6 for a PA PLXC. I feel like the PLXC is what the NF NX8 was trying really hard to be. Also, isn’t the razor gen III 1-10 a 34mm tube?
It is I misspoke. I feel like the PLXC is better in almost every way.
that’s great to know. I’ll definitely be upgrading to a plx-c at some point then.
hey my friends, I would like an LPVO 2, there are two to choose from.... Eotech 1-10-28 Vudoo or the PRIMARY ARMS PLxC 1-8x24 FFP m/ACSS Griffin MIL M8
Can you tell me which one is better and maybe explain why, unfortunately I don't know much about it, thank you :)
Warm greetings from Germany
Hey there! size, weight, and cost the PLXc is better, that's the one I would go for.
@@FocusTripp thx bro :)
Griffen has 35mm mounts for under $200 but they are 1.45"ish height.
That's not terrible.
The vortex Razor gen 3 is a 34mm tube and seems to be top picks for most people that add it to a comparison video when it comes to glass quality, not to sure why you guys rated it so low
For building infiltration/strike team type folks, I think those lower power ACOG's make a lotta sense. It's hyper-niche, and I don't think average people should buy them
Nova, Venom or EP-8?
Both good, depends on how far you are shooting.
I got a little carried away on the memorial day sales, I got a Sig MSR 1-8 for $350 and a tan Vudu 1-10 for $1410, got them both in, the Sig MSR field of view on 8x is horrid, the Vudu is def one of the nicest LPVO's on the market.
Delta Stryker 1-6 is really good. Viper PST gen 2 but not heavy af
ahhh
Vortex razor gen 3 has a 34mm tube
last gen KISS Primary Arms, best LPVO ever made because it was $150 with a mount, it LPs AND even VOs
Finally what I’ve been waiting for. Thinkin about the VUDU. Hopefully it comes out ok
Finished the vid. Nice to see the VUDU goes hard. Lookin at the 1-8 or 1-6 tho probably
No xp on the lower mag versions.
I have, and really enjoy the Vudu 1-8 SFP. Top notch 1x and usable illuminated center dot in most conditions. 8x has a small eye box, but that’s probably the main trade-off. I’ve seen it on Battlehawk for ~$880 ish. It’s 5.56 bdc btw.
@@Myrcene damn that’s a good price too. Thank you
a Strike Eagle for 250 with mount should be in the Poor King segment, I think. Hard to beat.
Brownells 1-6 MPO routinely goes on sale with a mount for under $300 and it whoops the Strike Eagle in glass quality and build quality.
@@rifleshooterchannel208 I own both , gen2 S.E. has better glass, replaced both with LEUPOLD mk3 HD
@@Quintana88 Mk3 is sick. But the SE looks like it has its objective lens smeared with petroleum jelly compared to the MPO.
Better than the Arken?@@rifleshooterchannel208
Delta Stryker 1-6???
LPVO video without the LPVO man ? Brass facts
putting the nx8 over the razor is wild.....i've owned the atacr 1-8 and now have the razor 1-10 and honestly i prefer the razor. I like the diopter, throw lever, illumination dial and the glass at 1x better, however the center dot on the atacr was better and the illumination was better. i do wish the razor had a zero stop but not a huge deal. i could see the argument for putting the atacr over the razor for its durability and to some the feature set wins out on it and MAYBE the vudu from a value perspective but to put the nx8 above the razor is absolutely wild to me, especially considering you can snag a razor for 2k spending only a few hundred more than a nx8 getting a better optic thats only 5 ounces heavier....
I hope no one takes the first minute of this video seriously. It was obviously sarcasm.
The vortex viper pst gen 2 has never sold for $150 and it isn't fiber optic illuminated
S Tier could be stuff Schmidt & Bender, Tanget Theta, zero compromise, Khales,
I have a gen 3 strike eagle ffp and I can confirm that it is in fact not exceptional
I can’t do these long form stream or videos.
Schmidt & Bender 1-8 cc is the best lpvo hands down it just costs you your left nut…also the newer khales 1-8 is really good, besides they have terrible reticles
Trijicon accupoiny 1-4 has spoiled me in terms of 1x performance to the point the 1-6 vector continental felt unforgiving.
Psa already had a lpvo. It was just a rebranded lucid and instead of a blue reticle it was red. It was my first lpvo. It was also trash.
tike.
@@FocusTripp tike?
The vortex razor 1-10 is 34mm not 30mm.
2.6mm exit pupil on that Atibal is crazy man, that's such a foolish thing to make lmao. That's either some serious hubris or its brilliant understanding of their true audience: people who will baby their rifle all the time and just wanna have something crazy like this for bench shooting
I might get one to make fun of them.