DID I RUIN my Les Paul?? - Fretboard Staining with India ink + Minwax Pen
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- Опубліковано 30 чер 2024
- Here goes nothing! This video you're along for the ride as I explore fretboard staining to darken the rosewood board on my Custom Shop Gibson Les Paul!
Timestamps:
0:00 Intro + background
1:50 Products used overview
3:23 Epiphone test dummy
6:15 Assessing the starting point
8:00 Protecting inlays?
8:45 Sanding
10:30 Naptha cleaning
11:13 India Ink - first try
15:11 24 hour review
16:25 Removing excess ink
20:00 India Ink - round 2
21:54 Minwax ebony pen test
23:10 Sanding then Minwax
24:07 Comparing India Ink vs added Minwax
27:42 Minwax round 2
29:14 18 hour review
34:03 First outdoor review
34:50 Minwax round 3
37:00 F-one oil final step
38:03 BEFORE AND AFTER!!
38:54 Final thoughts + 3 week review
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Update 3 months later:
I've played this guitar quite a bit since doing the video, including several long sweaty gigs and I've had zero dye show up on my fingers. I still don't think it got as dark as I would have liked, but at least it's not rubbing off 🙂🙂
Nice information!, i may give it a try!
I tried ink and water based dye, but they both rubbed off. This was pau ferro wood, which is hard and oily.
So I switched to spirit based dye, which worked. Use methylated spirits to clean the binding etc, as nothing else will shift it.
Thanks for sharing ;)
Waterproof leather dye makes much more sense...especially if it is a dye containing some solvent that will penetrate the oils in the fingerboard wood. As I'm sure you've never heard anyone complain that they black leather color rubbed off...it is unlikely that such dye would rub off of the fingerboard.
I’ve noticed several guitar players experimenting with wood dying and staining. They often experiment with household materials, leather dyes, or Home Depot wood care products. It might be helpful to know that amateurs can easily acquire and use the same quality of materials as professional luthiers and wood workers. For enhancing or altering the color of wood, aniline dyes are the gold standard. They are formulated specifically for coloring wood. They come premixed in commonly desired colors, and can be mixed to any personal wishes. They have to be purchased from a wood working supply business. Lee Valley sells them, as well as StewMac.
That´s exactly how we do it in Brazil, ''anilina'' in our language, inexpensive(about 2 dollars a small bottle) and it can dye any wood color to almost any other color, even lighter rosewood to full black ebony!
Interesting I’m going to try it
Man you did an outstanding job on that. That ended up at the exact level of darkness I consider perfection. Nice job and thanks for posting this!
A vast improvement! Thank you for posting this!
I’m definitely going to try this method on my Troy Van Leeuwen and get the rosewood closer to what classic RW should look like!
Very glad you did this because I would not have the patience to try it myself! HUGE improvement. Looks especially good in the outdoor pics
Thanks!
Props for putting the time into doing this. I think it looks great now. Any darker would've been too much IMO. I think its meant to stay as it is. Nice work!
I dig it! It definitely looks more high end and vintage correct with the darker board.
I'm so stoked that you did this. I've always wondered if dying the fretboard was an option. Might have you do some of mine, lol! :)
Ha! What guitars do you have left?
@@YeatzeeGuitar 😂😂😂
I’ve sold most of the expensive ones. Only one I’ll keep is the Dave Grohl. After years of analysis the best guitars seem to be in the $1-2.5k range. They play and sound great without the huge price tag. Example: PRS Standard 22’s and Swamp Ash Specials from the late 90s to mid-2000s.
You did an amazing job ! Love it !
your video is super well done. thanks for doing it, and it looks great. I cant help to think full black like some says ebonized would look even better. but I am not seeing it in person so I might be wrong.
Was contemplating this recently. Thanks for doing the legwork!
Good luck if you go through with it! Just take your time and sand well
Thanks for sharing your experience. I'm about to do something similar on a Sterling bass.
Great video. Best I’ve seen with darkening the rosewoodfretboard. Well done. question. If you were doing this again, after the sanding and prep how many coats of India ink, and then Minwax, would you do knowing what you know now?
definitely richer look with minmax pen stacked over India ink. great job!!! I have to do a guitar that is coming my way because it will have a way to light rosewood fretboard.
Real appreciate you making this video, I've wanted to dye my r9 neck for quite sometime, but just been real nervous to do it😅
Same! I was on the fence for literally years, but decided to give it a whirl finally and record how it went. My guitar is already pretty beat up so less scary than a clean one for sure
@YeatzeeGuitar especially on a customshop..that takes guts😄
@@jordantee2383 Because it's a lifer I've played a lot I become less precious about it. Still took me time to do it, but I knew I wanted to do some research and also document it all for others :)
My 2018 Historic R9 has a board that is slightly darker than his is now after the ink application. I would not want it any darker because then we are talking looking like ebony.😱😁
I've learned my lesson, when it comes to collector guitars, collector cars or any collectible, you gotta keep them as stock as possible if you ever want to resell or keep as an investment, anything modified or altered to the point where it can't be reversed will substantially kill your profits lol.
Good thing I didn't buy it as an investment piece then! It's gigged, it was never going to be a collectible.
@YeatzeeGuitar yep, if it's a guitar for your own pleasure and enjoyment, making it your own or personalizing it is always fun. But like I said, the collectors world is ruthless, especially the Gibson crowd, that community probably has some of the most diehard purist snobs lol
@@seblo8462 I mean I'm gigging my 1 of 1 made to measure 54 custom Les Paul so obviously I don't care much about that stuff haha
Awesome video and great result. I got the board on my Gibson LP almost black with this product. I cleaned the board with lighter fluid to dry out any oil and applied several coats over the course of a week to achieve my desired result
Nice! I wish mine took more stain, it seemed to hit a wall and accept no more
@@YeatzeeGuitaryou need to lightly sand the board to make it more receptive to the stain
@@tfejulienewmar did ya watch the video? 😉
@@YeatzeeGuitar lol
No doubt about it that it looks so much better! I would consider this a definite WIN! 👍
I really did not care for the original light color.
I've tried india ink and minwax before. Similar to you, I tested on a more inexpensive guitar (I used a b-stock harley benton) and then used what I learned on my Gibson. The Les Paul I dyed the fretboard on had a baked maple board (Classic Plus from 2011) and the minwax ebony did a pretty good job darkening it up.
Nice! Yeah I would have definitely done that to a baked maple board LP. Bet it looks way better now!
The result looks amazing! Just a quick question, esp. for someone looking to try the M2M route - did they not allow you to choose the fretboard when you put in your order?
Thanks! I am the 2nd owner, but you can pick dark rosewood however it's completely subjective and luck of the draw. Similarly you can spec lightweight mahogany, but you can still end up with a mid 8lb guitar.
@@YeatzeeGuitar Oh! That makes a lot of sense now. One more question - I see at my local lumber shop that they have black dye/stain. Did you try that on your test guitar and if so, do you mind sharing the differences you found between using dye vs stain vs ink? Thanks a bunch!
Hi Yeatzee, I'm curious to know how it is going after 6 months. Have you noticed some lightening of stain? Do you think it will be necessary to apply the ink at some point?
Nope, looks exactly the same and nothing ever came off on my fingers
Thank you very much!@@YeatzeeGuitar
I think it depends on the lp. I definitely like a darker fret board on a gold top. I have a classic seafoam green with swirly maple and the fret board is a little on the brite side but I kid of like how the wood gain goes with the guitar.i was thinking of darkening it though. I just dont want to stain the pearl inlays.
I'm wondering if you would have been able to achieve same or better results with just the Minwax pen... It definitely looks better. I've been debating whether I should do something similar to one of my import guitars with a walnut fretboard. Thanks for the video!
Yeah in my testing shown in the beginning of the video the minwax did not stain as well as the india ink so I figured it'd be better to do the india ink as the base and add the pen ontop if needed. Ymmv, different wood might react differently. Good luck!
Some rosewood naturally has streaks in it. Interestingly I saw a video online in the UK yesterday, and the wood used was a test strip. Looked like the naptha ebony stain formula was not the one they liked best. The one that was more red- like was my fave. I was referring to the light laurel orange fretboard as too light. I'm ok with Rosewood as is on my Epi Les Paul since it is not too light in color. Q: is Americana gel wood stain any good?
Honestly the F-ONE oil was the star of the show. Seemed to make anything you put it on look amazing.
It's a great product!
Looks better. I used a Sharpie on mine, came out great!
😳 Wow!
Is it necessary to cover the inlays with scotch tape ??
How do you think it came out? Have you tried this yourself, and if so what were your results like? Let's hear it 🙂
Yes, I have done this. I used very dark brown leather dye on my LP. It was just too light!
@@matthewf1979 Nice! I considered going that route, then I learned I guess fiblings or whatever changed their dye and the modern black is totally different with a slight purple hue so I opted to go this route. How'd it last for you?
@@YeatzeeGuitarI degreased the fingerboard 3 times before I applied the dye. It sucked right in and made it a lot darker. After I cleaned everything up, I applied a couple very thin coats of Tru-Oil to keep the stain in. It still looks like rosewood too.
That’s how manufacturers keep dyed ebony from coming off too easily. The Tru-oil really darkens to wood too.
@@matthewf1979
Yeah, I've been considering using boiled linseed oil on some of my fretboards, not just for looks, but also there's a lot of 'stickiness' with my finger tips on some pao Ferro/indian laurel boards. And I don't mind a finished maple fretboard...
@@ruffryder13 Use Tru-oil. It dries nearly instantly with super thin coat. I wipe some on and wipe it off. Do it 10 times throughout the day and it’s ready to go the next day.
If you got extra jumbo frets your fingers aren't really rubbing against the wood anyways, buuut alcohol based wood dyes will give you better results as far as color and durability. They will make more mess to your bindings and inlays, which you will have to clean up with rubbing alcohol or shaving.
I don't know about the new Epiphones but the 2 LP I had (both 2018, one a Pelham Standard and a Honey plus top) had a plasticy feeling coating on the fretboard I could never get completely off. After a catastrophic end to the Pelham's life I can say the "wood" which was supposed to be laurel seemed to be almost a synthetic or hybridization of wood and something else. Even in the center of the board it had that slick fake feel. Maybe your board was legit and I think it turned out well but I'd never have been able to use one of my Epis for a test because the wood was so different than the real rosewood on my Gibson.
Interesting!
Naphtha, Vinegar and Steel wool. Next day one coat of Fiebings. Clean up the binding and slightly scuff the dried dye. Apply coat two of Fiebings and it’s nearly ebonized. You kept removing all of your hard work with the buffing and removing the pigment. Also, after second coat, not one hint of black dirtying cloths or fingers.
I just did one with Fiebings. Cleaned it, taped off the neck, wiped it on with a cloth and then immediately wiped excess off. Turned a streaky rosewood fretboard almost black immediately. Super simple it took all of 10 minutes.
Brand new bottle? I heard the new stuff can get a purple hue to it. Let me know after some heavy playing if it comes off on the fingers or not
@@YeatzeeGuitar Just got it today, no purple hue. It's a bolt on neck so I have been carrying it around for a bit and pretending to play while watching some videos and nothing has come off.
@@MadAlhazred Well that's good to hear! The reports of it having a bit of a hue turned me off pretty quickly. Maybe I'll buy some just to check out. I think typically the dye can come up when there's some moisture (sweat), but who knows I have no first have experience with that stuff just what I did here. It's been rock solid through many long gigs, but it's not as dark as I would have liked.
They didn't let you request a dark fretboard on a "made to measure" guitar?
Not sure if they'd do that or not, I didn't order it.
I usually use linseed oil, and it beautifully darken my fingerboard and it stay dark after years, even though I only use it a bit every strings changing.
Yeah I use F-one oil on all of my rosewood board guitars, it does help but it's pretty minor in comparison to doing this
Yes it’s worth doing, “believe it or not” l did it on both of my Gibson Les Paul’s, Same Method …. First time on my 60th Anniversary R9, the fretboard was so light it bothered me had to do it and the second time “wait for it” on my Murphy Lab R9 2021, not that my Murphy Lab really needed it but what the heck l did it anyway “No Regrets” lm happy as Larry Now and by the way your Goldie looks the Business Now “Perfect“ well done for giving it a go and for the rest of you who are on the fence line, if your happy looking at your light fretboard “Really” Just Do It …….
Nice!! Love it
what did you use to darken yours?
Monty's Montypresso relic wax is made for that very job. Made by Matt at Monty's guitar pickups in England.
Yeah it's not quite the same thing, would barely darken the board in this case. It's VERY minimal in that regard.
Have you actually used it? MONTYPRESSO wax is the most overhyped crap ever. Straight up doesn’t work. That stuff is a total waste of money and doesn’t work.
Good result
That in my opinion , that is perfect. Pure black ebony would look like shite mate. Now it looks like Brazilian rosewood. Great job I think. Ebony black works nit be great. It's perfect just like that. Going to so my guitars here in Niagara Falls , Ontario
4:30 tighter wood grain on that area? So won't take the stain as much.
A little bit crazy? Yes...but I get it lol. I was never as into the 60's Gibson brazilian boards because they tend to be lighter. The best looking board I've ever encountered is on a '53 Les Paul I own. The perfect piece of rosewood which absorbed the right amount of oil, moisture & polish from 70 years of playing. There is an amazing look to that particular example. My other '53 LP doesn't look as good & both older & later guitars I own also don't stack up. But there is something that just looks a bit cheap to me on a lighter board. Makes no difference tonally of course but it still is not as appealing.
My gold tops, not Gibson, already have a somewhat black fretboard. I bet they would take the stain great. Hmmm
While it doesn't look like what we ideally want, it definitely looks better than the stock board you have.
For sure, much better imo
YES .
Why sand at all since it's an open pore wood? Also, I wonder what black shoe polish would look like?
Open pore wood doesn't negate the need for sanding to get better stain :) People use shoe polish all the time, but I've heard the newer stuff ends up slightly purple-ish so I decided to try something else.
Anything is better than soaking the fretboard in oil every week!
I think the stains look great
Soaking it in oil every week?! Huh? You're only supposed to oil the fretboard like once a year or something. 🤣
every week? why.
@@christineblack4654 I've heard it's best to do it daily in the winter!
better method is using steel wool left in vinegar and just let it ebonize like a rusty nail in an old board. that turned out ok still.. but try the vinegar method it inverts the darks for lights on many woods
What does that do with the plastics and frets?
@@YeatzeeGuitar nothing. Harmless. Might polish the frets
I’ve used Monty’s espresso with good results.
You have to be careful allowing oil, etc. sitting on the fretboard for very long. The chemicals can seep between the frets and loosen the glue.
@yeatzee I know you have done it already. But a few layers of boiled linseed oil ( it has a nice dark vintage yellow tint to it. Works great. And it won’t stain the binding or inlay. My 98 Les Paul. Has a very dark rosewood Brazil look. Steel wool the board. Or a white Brillo pad. It’s like the 0000 steel wool. But not as messy. Go side to side up and down the wood and frets. Then Finish it going with the grain to get any scratches out. Can be used on the board and frets.
Cleans the frets good too. Add it. Let it soak in. Wait About ten mins. If you see dry areas. Between the time. Add more till it’s even. And all soaked in. Whip it like you were doing till the rag is clean. Do it about three times. The first time. And then two three times a year after . And you will have a beautiful chocolate brown with good dark streaks. Or done over the years. It will almost be an ebony look. My fretboard was very light when I got it like yours. Now I have shops when I bring it in. Thinking it is a B rose board. Nice dark and even. As well not a messy. And will not mess the finish up. Or again the inlays. Oh and it’s just great for keep the bear wood from drying out. You can also get a silver clean cloth from a jewelry store. To really polish the frets to a mirror shine. Like see the string on the frets.
The big thing is rub that oil in with a lot of friction and a little force. To heat up the board. To get it to really soak in. And it’s safe for rosewood and ebony. As well the bridge on an acoustic guitar. It also works on any bear wood. You can also finish it off with some minwax paste finish. To kind of almost seal it in. Just again apply with steel wool or a white Brillo pad. I leave the wool in the can when i close it. So it is always ready to use. Again rub it in fast and with a little force. So the heat will really soak it in the wood. Really gives it the kind of a dull shine vintage look.
You can even do the lighter fluid. To get any residue left behind. I just apply the oil with kitchen towels. I should make a video of that. But you did awesome man. Try that the next time you change strings. And you will be amazed of the results. Never use lemon oil. It’s the best trick I ever learned with polishing or finishing raw wood. The wax paste. Will also kind of seal it. All So sweat and grime won’t really build up as well. As the wax acts like a water proof barrier. Oh and a little linseed oil goes a long way. I have been using the same bottle for about 10 years. You can get a small jar of it at hobby shops.
I’m telling you. It’s the best. Easy and clean to do. I don’t even have to use gloves.
An if you want to get weird with it. You can technically use anything with mineral oil. Again. Just make sure to buff till the rag is clean. This also makes the fretboard feel silky smooth too. Oh and in the future. Don’t use anything under 800 grit sand paper. If you really want to clean a dirty fretboard. 400 is way to aggressive. You can also use a buffing nail file to polish the frets. And round the neck binding. For at that played in feel.
Oh and if you use the white pad on the back of the neck lightly. Then a guitar polish. After. It will give it a played in fill. If lacquer finish get sticky when you play and it get sticky feeling. Just polish the neck to a dulled mate finish with the pad. Then guitar polish till it shines back up. It will give it a satin feel on the back of the neck.
Lots of great info, thank you! Ive heard of people using boiled linseed oil, but always I context of it being the same basically as any other fretboard oil people use which hydrates the board but doesn't change the color
I’ve done this with leather dye, dark brown and black. It works, but it might be too much for you now.
Would have loved to try feiblings, but apparently their current stuff is very different from their old stuff and is nowhere as good.
@@YeatzeeGuitar did not know that. I guess once my bottles run out I’ll find something else.
I dont get it. you sanded over scotch tape? and it did nothing to the tape? plus I cant beleive you used an exacto on your fretboard.
...?
Leave it natural wood. 😮🙏🇬🇧🌈♥️
ill do a lot of experimenting, let you know how it goes, i head if you soak the fretboard in black tea it adds tannins, then if you let steel wool sit in vinegar for about 2weeks it makes a black stain that makes woods darker based on tannin content of wood. the black tea lets you raise the tannin content of wood, so you use the tea mixture before the vinegar mixture. here are some examples ua-cam.com/video/kTFO4jHglSc/v-deo.html ua-cam.com/video/QVRJesbZHPM/v-deo.html
Well, that's one way of doing it, I guess.
You don’t see very much of your fretboard when you are playing, it mostly faces forward 🥴🙏🌈🇬🇧♥️
In my opinion. Yes you did. Dunlop 65 would of made the board look natural after a few applications. Sorry.
Unfortunately that's not the case, it's had years of frequent fretboard oil applications.
@@YeatzeeGuitar Gotcha. I actually had fantastic results with Dunlop 65 on my 2017 Gibson after 3 applications In about a year. All wood is different I suppose. I thoroughly enjoyed your video and your courage to tackle such a challenging project not knowing what the outcome would be . Props. Play the heck out of that Les Paul in good health for years to come. Cheers!
You do know wood oxidises over time right? So to a drying oil like Tung or Linseed. IMO this is a fake fix to a master piece. If it was mine I would always know it was bodged rather than grew old. Sorry for the bummer comment.
😂 🥴👍
You do know you don’t get an award from the “Purist Fairy” for “Keepin’ it real” right? But you do win the “Pretentious Internet Douche-Of-The-Day” award. 😂🤣
My honest 2 cents; I think the original finish looked better than the refinished.
However, the guitar still looks great and, it's your guitar so if you're happy with it, that's what matters most.
I'm typically partial to ebony and other darker finishes but I liked the way this gold top looked originally. Either way, solid work!
would i do this on an expensive LP? No way. Am I doing it on my Gretsch electromatic... absolutely
It didn't stain the binding?
I imagine if you left it on there it could
I think the neck looks great, but you should stain your fence. lol
It's still Rosewood not Ebony
Indeed.
jimmy page's les paul has a light fretboard, nothing wrong with it
Fair!
I get the obsession with making a les paul look like your favorite vintage one with a dark board, but as a woodworker I much prefer lighter rosewood. The lighter figure adds more interest.
The stain came out really nice though, and I know how satisfying it is to tweak that one last thing on your favorite guitar to make it perfect!
I've never heard this take in my life. Every one I know wants a darker board and not Pau Ferro or light rosewood.
@@sichuancowboy I know, I'm just talking about it from a woodworking perspective. Most of my clients would rather have a wood with contrast and variance than just a solid color for furniture pieces. Totally get that it is not the "in" look for fretboards though.
looks nice. before and after shot gives me trogly vibes,
😂 😅🫡
I like dark rosewood as much as anyone and im all about mods, the guitar must feel yours. But in this case...if you shell out CS level money, you better make sure the fretboard and everything else is just the way you like it, am i being unreasonable? Ive seen dark rs around still, last time on a new Tribute, so it isnt someting unatteinable.
Totally understand that sentiment, but this guitar is special and took me years to find. It's a m2m, under 8lbs no chambering, with an R8 TH neck and lightly aged from factory. I've played a lot of custom shop Les Paul's, this is my favorite of them all 🙂
While i get what you are saying try to see it this way, suppose everything about the CS guitar is perfect for you BUT
has a fingerboard that just is not dark enough? Do you pass on the whole CS guitar for that one small thing or do you darken the board yourself? you see what i am saying here? If he had went with another CS with a already real dark board would it still have the neck he likes? or the weight? or the neck feel?
Yes exactly! I have a new 2023 R8 that is perfect every other way, but the fretboard has pale areas. I'm going to dye that also. I mean, I have played other historics with very dark and perfect fretboards, but they have been dull otherwise. So, I'll rather take a perfect soundin, feeling and playing guitar and fix this aesthic aspect myself. @@YeatzeeGuitar
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... So you didn't watch the video..
Looks so fake after
😂 k
The guys leave the fingerboard black taking away the beauty of the wood because it can look like Brazilian rosewood, nonsense
Ruined. Looks fake like a Chibson
😂 🥴👍
Have to agree, there was nothing wrong with it before. Now it looks unnatural. @@YeatzeeGuitar
Whatever dude… You’d blow your neighbors dog to own this guitar.
This was a 40 minute video that could have been condensed to about 15 minutes seriously im not investing that much time.
Timestamps my guy.
Rip binding nibs
Long gone