Fixing the Notorious MACK Camel-Back Suspension
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- Опубліковано 4 гру 2021
- With every suspension you learn different tips and tricks on how to handle these monstrous springs. With leaf springs pushing into the 400-500 Lbs range it might take a bit more creativity. This is how we handle these monsters with the least amount of effort possible.
Plus we get to play around with my largest air gun old "Red Thunder"
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I appreciate how you turn down the audio on your end when using the impact to avoid the watcher having to constantly play with their sound. Thank you.
This.
I actually turned the volume back up when he used the impact I like that sound reminds me of high-school.
Shut up
The ease with which that second leaf broke tells me that truck will be back soon for some more springs 😅
Yeeep
Yea why wouldn't you replace the whole stack instead of taking all that time to clean springs that are worn out ???
@@tree9851 monieeeeeeee
@@tree9851 someone has to pay for that new stack, you wanna do it?
@@dimrocksosabby2553 buy it now or buy it in a couple days? A week? A month? Then you get to pay for all that labor over again while the truck is down yet again. Wow that sounds much cheaper than just doing it right the first time.
I love shop stuff as a locomotive mechanic for 15 years I appreciate the work that is involved in these repairs and the fact that you are a great editor because you control the volume on your side so my ears stay on my head. The videography was great, all around the content was great so I thank you for the content, the ride along and the time it takes to create, edit and UL these for me to enjoy thoroughly.
PS the reason you can handle the CP impact is you are a gozilla and have the drive and determination to do it, I understand this all to well... :) Peace out sir!!!
When that second one broke I couldn't beleaf it.
I'll see myself out.
I was going to recommend to leaf it right there.
Good video keep it up. Have you ever seen the channel Pakistani truck it’s amazing how they keep those trucks on the road with there limited resources.
@@macmckenzie1242 gimme a break.
I'm just gonna split now.
Really, I'm just gonna cut my losses.
I kinda like how they were leafing through the stack...😁... ok nevermind
...badum-tsss....
I can attest to how heavy the camelback springs are. My dad and his brothers had a trucking company and they only used Mack R-600's. Around 1977 or 1978 when I was 5 or 6 years old they had two camelback springs sitting on an old warehouse cart in the shop. The cart had two wheels at the back and two stands at the front to hold it up. You backed a two wheel dolly under the front and then pushed the dolly handle down to raise the cart off it's stands. While holding onto the handle you could then pull the cart around the shop. I found a dolly and managed to lift the front of the cart and started pulling the cart and springs around the shop (the total weight was probably 1000 lbs, I was pretty strong for my age). I pulled the cart around for a while until I got tired. One of my dad's drivers then helped me lower the cart as the handle on the dolly had a nasty habit of flying up very fast as you lowered it. For my size it would have delivered a frightful upper cut to my chin. To me this was a completely normal thing to do. Today a fully grown man would probably be required to take several hours of dolly/cart safety training before being allowed to do what I did. All I got was my dad saying "don't let that fucking handle hit you in the chin". Ken
Maybe fifteen minutes, using a cautionary tale, would suffice.
@@chucktaylor4958 you know how drama queens are.
@@sir-richard4172 yes. I know. Sometimes the ‘school of hard knocks’ is the most effective way to learn a hard lesson.
Sounds like my dad. Grand dad and uncles.
Mom says my guardian angels are old and grey headed.
Why is everyone so touchy about safety. Get broken glass or metal shavings in your eyes and you'll likely where safety glasses.
I've been digging your channel. As a retired diesel mechanic, I miss the work, but suspension work, not so much. LOL! Suspension work can be pretty interesting at times, especially figuring out different ways to tackle each job, depending on the truck's body configuration, and things getting in the way. I subbed!
Welcome aboard!
Driving a DM 800, I have never replaced the camel backs, but I sure have broken them. Every winter the trucks would go into the shop and rebush the rear ends. As I recall, the truck was down for 2-3 days. The trucks were the bane of the truck shop.
Changed and repaired lots of these. Part I hated the most was air hammering the “concrete” out of the clamshells.
Yup. Like 5 lbs of it jammed in each side.
Never thought one could break that setup. I drove one. I called it Bone Crusher.
That's funny. One of my dad's Macks, an R-600 with camelback springs was called Bone Shaker.
Holy smokes, that impact was colossal!
I didn't know there is such a thing as 1 1/2 drive impact gun.🤔
Yep, Chicago Pneumatic's line of impacts go up to 2-1/2" Anvils (CP6240-T120). At that torque level (and weight) though, you need two handles (and 75CFM of air). It weighs about 132 lbs with a maximum reverse torque of around 18,440 Ft-lbs. The modern equivalent for what sir is using in the video looks like a CP6120-D35H 1-1/2" Anvil Impact with a maximum reverse torque of 3500 ft-lbs. It weighs about 35 lbs. Today they go for around 4-6,000 US dollars and need 52 CFM at 90PSI to be driven correctly.
And i didn't know that a socket of that size costs $400 😱 Damn lol
I just seen a 2" impact, it had its own cradle and trolley you'd wheel it around.
Thank you for sharing your experience and knowledge. Heavy dangerous work .very professional.
5:26 'Old Red Thunder!' - the light and shadow was perfect. 10/10 cinematography.
I like that you showed us something I’d never seen.
Appreciate the information…. Was a mechanic for 24 years and when I got my CDL I thought wrenches were a thing of the past. NOPE! The beam on a camel back broke on me yesterday and I have no idea what caused that. Live and learn! Great video!
I’m having my trunnion replaced right now in my 2005 Mack granite I told them to replace the springs due to over the years the steel gets weak and now watching that spring crack in half I made a good decision I enjoyed watching your video
Make sure they use the automann aftermarket trunion they install slot easier than the OEM ones.
@@simcoespring
Mo
just found your channel.
I work in a spring ship too.
so many things make me laugh.
the breaker blowing.
more springs broken and then you thought. and the sparks in the glove
haha
that 1 1/2 impact is sick defiantly want one but I'm sure it's stupid expensive
The stupid expensive part is correct. Lol
9:36 Hulk over here…. Damn, snapped the leaf like a corked baseball bat!
That was cool, I once had a chance to work in a trailer repair/maintenance shop but it didn't turn out. Love the work though even if it's heavy and hard. Thanks for sharing
Didnt happen or didn't "work out" ?
We had a 4 to 1 Torque Multiplyer wrench so when you put 100lbs ,it put out 400 lbs of torque for those old Mack's
Yeah it’s called a longer bar
Used to use one for crank balancer bolts on some Deutz engines.
They had some obscene torque number, usually like 250-300 foot pounds and give it like a 750 degree turn.
Really insane and it took some ass to get it done.
@@imgeet939 Actually it has gears inside
Thanks for the quality of video and audio. I learned something and like the channel. keep it up.
Keep making the videos my new friend ! Thank you ! ❤️😎
I work in I.T at a trucking company, always get jealous when I see you Diesel techs playing with the big boy toys.
Another super cool video! Looks like a physical business, very interesting too!
Heavy work and a heavy gun but you lads make it look easy.
You did a great job!!
Boy you guys make the job look easy!👌😎👍
It would have been an easy one if that 2nd leaf wasn't snapped....cost me a day to get more parts in
Very experienced with the cutting torch , split second flame adjustment !
I worked in the refuse industry for over 25 years and did plenty of these. We usually used a 4x multiplier and torque wrench so the proper torque would be applied.
Nice short cut technique, thank you.
You guys are amazing with the torch. I need to cut some metal for my around the house chores and I use a hack saw. And saw and saw and saw. I wish I had enough chores to justify owning a torch.
Just found your channel. Thanks very much - interesting and informative.
Thanks for watching!
You make it look easy!!!😊
Very good job 👏
Ground Zero comes first before ALL JOBS very well done there 👍🙌 it's fun using BIG air tools making it the so easy to tighten or loose thxz for the experience you got from your father
😂 great strong man act, are you Superman?
I remember a mate, from the 1970's, purchased a G88 Volvo. First thing that he done was to remove the Volvo 6 rod, and put a Mack Camelback under the back end. He went from a 180 International towing 2 20 foot single axle trailers on a single axle dolly, to this truck with a tandem drop deck and a 444 international, reversed steered, with a Robot brand mast on it, for brick cartage.
The tractor was a lot of fun to operate!!! Sadly, the tractor was lost in a bushfire in January 2020.
You do good work bro
You need to weld something on that I beam to fit in-between the steel rails on the pit.
That air gun is an absolute beast. Like something for working on mining trucks.
Great video. Hopefully some time soon you will have one on replacing the rubber pads or maybe even a trunion. Amazed at how clean you guys stay. I always went home looking like the tin man from all of the anti seize...
hehe, I don't actually like getting dirty, however I don't mind if it is necessary.
I know it's dangerous work but it looks fun too, good job
Nice shop setup, that pit is a must-have for the suspension work.
I wouldn't want to do suspension work without it.
I have changed many mack springs and it usually doesn't work out mixing springs new with old also we always check or replace box rubbers and spring saddle bushings
He does it so the customer has to come in more ofter thus more money. Shame really.
When screwing cut ubolts out had tough ones, where nuts would unscrew from cut bolts, add washers n screw back on ,pullsn twists at same time
I really think I’d enjoy this work.
I bet Impact Sockets to fit that 1 1/2” Driver are hard to find!
Impressive brother..
By far one of the best setups for heavy duty off road trucks, now not so much airbag and lockers are better
My dad drove tri axle dump trucks for years from mine to plant and he swears by the Mack camel back as being the best
I thought you needed a nice beer belly to hold a tool that big. 😆 Good job.
That leaf splitting just means that truck will be back soon, very soon
Delib done that way by this guy.
No problem, just weld that broken leaf back together and it will be good as new.😂 I was surprised to see you repair that pack with a couple of new leaves. I would have thought you would just replace the whole pack. Man I'm so glad I found your channel! I love big tools (my favorites are the BFH and the firesaw/wrench), big trucks and appreciate the big balls of the guys that work on them! Keep up the good work and please keep posting these awesome videos!
We fix or replace depending on what the customer orders.
Buy American....You cannot successfully weld spring steel as it is a high carbon steel and the leaves are heat treated, Welded leaf springs will break right next to the weld because it burns the carbon from the steel and makes them real brittle, spring steel has to be able to give to be springs !!!
I’ve done quite a few camelback spring jobs. I always changed the entire pack as just changing failed leaves usually resulted in the other old leaves failing later.
Not a hard job with all the right tools, but a brutal job to have to do out in the bush and torquing the u- bolts by hand with a monster sized snipe.
I also did numerous centre pivot bushings and end pads on the lighter camelback suspensions and would do a 38000 or 40000 pound bushing job over a 44000 pound or heavier suspension bushing job.
U always do both sides
I have never had much success with replacing an individual leaf in a stack. New leaf has different flex rate than the old.
@@michaelbender2493 This is probably for Commercial Vehicle Enforcement : If a vehicle is found in serious violation, it can be taken out of service. Removing an unsafe vehicle from the highway that is out of compliance reduces the risk of collisions due to critical item component failures such as steering, suspension, frame or brake parts that have failed or a failure is imminent.
@@DontCryAboutIt On this rig in the US, yes. FMCSR states that drives and trailer tires require 2/32 tread depth in all major tread grooves, and 4/32 on steers.
@@Group_Anonymous Noe Schitt Sherlock
11:30 Dry cut saw works like a hot knife through butter. Best investment to my shop ive made in years
U Make it look easy as lad 🤙🏻
I like those air jacks.
i replace d the springs on my mack r six hundred one look was enough for me so took springs and truck to king springs down the coast they did change over fantastic back on road. in..a few hours
thanks
I enjoy your videos. I used to drive with a Hendrickson suspension. It was very harsh .And was curious about this mack setup. I am curious why you , along with other you tube channels , do not put blaster on any of the fastener threads before the impact gun ?
Dirt falls off of dry parts. Wet them and you've made a grinding paste.
@@btwbrand so clean it when it comes off lol
you make it look so simple
"RED THUNDER!! I mean big red." 😂🤣
Got some country boys doin country boy stuff boy
Idk why but this was so cool to watch
It's good he caught it in time
I love your job
Any hand rails for pit when not occupied? Thanks for the video. Pete
For that clean up have you thought about getting a needle scaler like Isaac, IC Weld or Kurtis, CEE. I bet it would help.
Yes i want the springs 😁 but i guess sending then to Norway would cost more the the steel alone 🙈😆
yah, international shipping is insane.
@@simcoespring yep 🙈
they make FANASTIC blades too, and hand/hammer forged sword blades out of ultra heavy duty steel springs is always have been a favorite of mine
those jacks on that c channel looks like Sketch with Stretch!!
At least that second broken leaf didn't take out a car on the road.
Man that's some good steele
excellent!
Excelente video saludos desde Venezuela 🇻🇪🇻🇪🇻🇪 colega qué buen trabajo
1-1/2" Chicago Pneumatic start at 4,174.20 US Dollars for a Max Torque of 2875 Ft. Lbs
Unit with a Max Torque 3600 Ft. Lbs runs 5,036 US Dollars.
At the high end, unit with Max torque 5900 Ft Lbs runs 6,957 US Dollars.
One place I worked has a 2-1/2" drive impact. Required two air sources. We used it to remove 6-1/2" nuts.
Same suspension system installed on my 2 1/2 ton Deuce and a Half military truck.
6:06 - I was wondering why clockwise. But, I (think) I see you do that purposefully to grab the bolts. Cool.
We tighten them to suck them down. If you loosen them sometimes the nuts will just spin off and the little stump will still be stuck in the housing.
@@simcoespring Do you guys have a needle scaler? I think that would speed up your rust removal process. They are great tools!
@@mattdillon4398 I was thinking the same thing.
Shoutout to the only guys on UA-cam wearing the proper PPE for the job. Hahah
Does it extend the life of the leaf springs to have lubricant between the leaf springs?
@Simcoe Spring Service ever thought of trying to use a air needle scaler to remove the rust and dirt from the springs rather than beating on them
absolutely, my last one died and I need to buy a new one. Looking for any suggestions on make and model that I can try out.
We ran RD's and DM's transporting crude oil and when we broke a spring we replaced the spring packs, trunnion bushings and the rubber pads at the ends of the springs all at the same time. A nasty job you only wanted to do once. The U bolts torqued at 1250 ft/lbs if I remember right. If you didn't get everything tight the axels would kind of "walk around" and the drivers would come in
and complain about the front end being messed up.
I think you just helped me diagnose an issue with my pickup. Came with replaced springs in the back, sure enough..the U bolts were scarily easy to loosen with a freaking short half inch drive ratchet….
@@tacomas9602 Glad it helped!
That 1 1/2 inch impact is around 5k today! Doh! Can I ask what size tip you use on your cutting torch and if they are heavy preheat? I've never seen such a fast preheat when cutting metal with a torch. You wield that torch light a surgeon.
Liquid wrench love it
i would have replace both complete spring packs , as well as the pivot shaft bushings , and to apply red n tacky between each leaf to smooth out the suspension
My last job in a shop was replacing the whole trunnion. We had a total of 12 macks that always needed work. Even though we brought them in every 2wks for service. Running in and out of sand plants took a toll on them. Constantly changing the elephant pads on those suspensions as well. I don't miss it one bit
We started using the aftermarket trunion stands so you slide them up from the bottom instead of splitting the frame rails. Fastest one we changed out was in 1 day with 3 guys. Never doing that again. Always taking my time after that.
@@simcoespring
Yea the one I put in was a PAI trunnion
I wanna know where you got those frame pump jacks from!
my blue ones where purchased in 1986, the red ones purchased in 1997. both companies are gone.
My grey jacks I use are made by "Grey" and they are beasts, 11,000lbs capacity each I believe. They can lift just about anything.
I just did 2 Camelbacks myself here lately. The first truck, I took the caps off the trunion rod and the nuts that hold the trunion on the shaft came out when the cap came off. Cut out the stands and put in one that you install from underneath. Not really sure how I feel about the design but the stand was definitely more stout than the older ones. The worst part of the whole job was torqueing the U-bolts to 1,700 ft lbs with nobody to help. It was definitely a learning experience for a first timer
usually when those nuts come off freely like that the bushings and maybe even the shaft can be worn out. changing out those shafts are a brutal job.
@@simcoespring - Years ago i worked at a Mack dealer. We used to cut the trunion tube between the stand legs then pressed them out. The new trunion tube would be covered in dry ice overnight the pressed in the next morning. I don't miss doing them today!
@@kmadamsable same! I was the guy who got to go get the dry ice. 2 hour drive each way... the only vehicle they would give me was a box van. Would drive with the windows down year round even in winter so I wouldn't suffocate.
@@simcoespring The first truck I did, there were no threads, they were wore smooth. I couldn't find anyone who was able to just replace the shaft so replacing the entire trunion stand was the next option. Mack dealer said they were so backed up it would be 2 months to get the job done and that was if they could get the parts. After doing the first one, the second one was a breeze.
What about painting the leaves and some anti seize on the u bolts,new centre bolt?????
Where do you get your leaf springs from I cant find any local for my truck, it's only an f250
As a self-taught hobbyist mechanic, I've always wondered, when disassembled, if putting some type of thin film of wheel bearing grease or graphite between the spring suspension leaves of a truck would make the ride smoother or less harsh? There is no inter-leaf friction with a coil spring and the shock absorber handles the suspension compression/rebound just fine.
adding grease won't change the ride the if you want a softer ride get offroad stocks made for your truck,
back in the 1930s they actually painted the leaf springs with grease and wrapped them in canvas cloth. It worked fairly well back then, however they now use a different type of steel 5160 and you should keep the dry. getting oil or grease on the steel will actually decrease the life expectancy and ruin the steel. Every time I have a oily spring and a dry spring, the oily spring is broken.
@@simcoespring probably from less friction with more flex
@@simcoespring that makes sense in my average joe brain oil or grease may allow the piece to "squeeze" more than the others instead of acting as one like it should
99-06 fords have steering box leaks from the factory. The leaking fluid would kill the driver side spring. It changes the composition of the metal.
The fact that other leaf broke that easily is shocking.
Needle scalier for removing the loose rust and dirt / mud from your leafs. No clouds of garbage flying through the air and you don't need to swing a hammer. Takes off all pockets of rust and exposes problem areas your hammer will not strike.
mine died a few days before this video, do you have any brand/style recomendations
Do you use a new center bolt every time , hard to see
I love Steel!
What's that monster gun weigh?
Great video brother greetings from the United states virgin islands in the carribbean us territory st.thomas I am a new subscriber to your channel I am a journeyman heavy Equipment mechanic my dad taught me most of what I know so far he passed away in 2019 I have learned a lot from your channel and this is very educational thanks for this informative video keep them coming now I know how to replace those spring leaves on those Mack Trucks thanks again and God bless
Glad you enjoyed it. It is hard for me to bring out long form content like this because we are so busy. I will keep trying to make videos on how we remove and re-install suspension whenever I get the opportunity.
Hey if you are short a leaf do what they do in Pakistan. Weld it back together, grind it a bit, soak it in some salt to put a little aging rust on it, and send it out the door. Don't worry about heat treating as it won't last much more than a mile anyway, but the customer will just think it is a new break and bring it back for another repair. Win/win. 😁
Hey brother, but a pneumatic needle scaler, it'll clean those springs much faster. They work great for weld slag, would be awesome for road grime.
mine blew the guts out of it in about 6 months. can you recommend a brand that is any good. I don't want to waste my money again.
@@simcoespring Ingersoll Rand 182 series is what I have. They're in the $350-$400 range, it's their industrial line. The IR-125 is less expensive, but still a very good pro consumer grade pneumatic needle scaler.
They also have chisel scalers, but honestly if I needed one of those I'd just put a chisel point in my air hammer and turn the regulator down.
@@crabmansteve6844 cool i'll look into that in the new year...just blew 300 bucks on a battery charger. last one died yesterday
Twisted wire wheels would work good too.
@@simcoespring No joke Harbor Freight has one that has out lasted 2 IRs. I'm going on 3 years with mine and it's run at 155 psi. New needle sets are $20 USD. I think I payed $60 on sale.
A descaler might work good for cleaning the springs.
yes I'm currently looking for a New/Good one, my last one died a few days before this video was shot.
It looks like the second smallest leaf has a crack just to the right of the left u-bolt 13:41.
My back will never be right from doing countless sets of these damn things
Also was a favorite thing of mine to do, to get a new guy yo torch the u bolts and watch them about shit their pants when it popped