Yeah, I got into this game because I saw footage of old carrier gameplay. Was very disappointed when I finally unlocked one and it just had shitty guided missiles.
Updated Defensive AA Fire "If activated before the planes enter the extended AA range, prevents them from spotting any ships/planes" Explains why or what you were experiencing with your Philadelphia Experiment reference.
The funny thing is, all Wargaming had to do to fix CV 2.0 was make it so the attack flight doesn't replenish lost fighters and change the spotting mechanic to radar only, and they would have solved the majority of the frustrations from playing against CV's....But nope, they decided to completely overhaul CV's a second time and give us CV rework 3.0....
Thanks TT - that was a very clear explanation. One thing you didn't mention was speed control has gone. The concept that several 50,000 ton ships 400 yards in front of you suddenly disappear yet you can see the sea perfectly is pure cartoon and has no place in WOWS. (It's not only the specific ship you are attacking that disappears). Maybe they will balance it by having the heal consumable do the same for planes. Then there will be invisible planes attacking invisible ships....
So if CV get manual secondaries now… how good are the German CVs going to be considering they’re known for the secondaries already… especially Graf Zeppelin?
from what I understand, the largest guns on a CV are the guns you can shoot, so I'm interested in seeing how graf was affected. Kaga may be fun too, what with the 8 inch guns and all.
10:04 If ships had DFAA activated BEFORE CV strikes, they create something ppl call "Blind effect" so CV player can't see that ship while it's DFAA still going on, that's one new mechanism for those ships not a bug.
I like some changes, and some I don't. Either way as a CV main, i think it's a step in the right direction. Sure, the island campers can Dfaa and hide for a short duration, but at the cost of having their teammates get targeted instead.
THX for a very good explanatory video. To be honest, I'm not positive at all about the changes. CV are invalidated IMO, and I won't grind or purchase new ones. Feels very frustrating.
@@trashtier Aiming is catastrophy of its own currently, at least with rockets and bombs, so I'm not satisfied with the status. Same goes for CV like "Aquila" with their low HP - planes. How to fix that issue when attacking planes can't be replenished? Throw her and others in the trash? Lots of open questions IMHO.
I think they can fix the problems one by one. I played with the new patch today and was able to make effective attacks without using recon mode at all.
The more they complicate the mechanics, the more they reinforce the advantage of a good CV player vs a new one. Just like in the old RTS days. A veteran player will decide which team wins by a huge margin
This is what gets me, the whole point of changing RTS was to increase the player numbers for CVs and reduce the impact of skill. For better or worse, they did that with the current CVs, but this seems like they are reversing the situation. So what happens when it tanks again and good players are swaying the match hard once again? Do they then go back and rework it for the...what fourth time?
@faynk.6247 there's a difference between a good player swinging an outcome and what was going on with CVs back then. A good DD player may give you a better chance of winning but even the best players can't swing a clear difference in teams without serious effort or the enemy making mistakes. If the enemy had a significantly better CV, you lost. There was no question about it. The rest of the team was there to be pounded, and it didn't matter how good they were. It's somewhat concerning that we're seeing that level of gap potentially coming back. Already seeing skilled CV players do seriously nasty things in the ships already. 72k damage on a BB with torpedo strikes from a midway with one squad in 1 min, for example, is being shared about. From one of the twitch live streams of the test.
Looks like a complete trash. The one change that could be done - remove spotting by fighters, that would ease life for the DDs and subs. But this change makes CVs a useless trash.
Ok i think this new cv rework is a net loss, and thats comming from someone who hates cvs, the secondary change is probably the best one here, all they had to do was give them minimap spotting only and it wluld have been fine
Great video on those new mechanics I overall see those changes as negative as it will complicate the CV-surface ship interaction (feel those mechanics are way more complex) and also CV will be affected to very different degrees (FDR will probably still drop the 2 planes in most case for example where a hakuryu will struggle to get the 2 torps drop). Also curious of seing how they will balance russian CV will the 1 attack squad Once against I well like WG do weird change instead of choosing the simple one : minimap spotting and pilot panic in case of defensive AA
i honestly hate the new changes as a cv main and if this is what its gonna change to we need at least two things shorter preparation times and plane replacement during attack runs for downed planes you give me those two things and perhaps it will work!
After the new patch, I started to think differently about plane replacement. If you have 3 attack planes in a 12-plane squadron, you lose one and deal damage with two planes, but the entire squadron waits in recon mode without taking damage. I think this could be a fair trade.
This is so ridiculous. How to ruin cvs gameplay. All the complaining players will have what they want now. Great benefit for dds tho, gonna switch to that class !
It is too early to make a definitive judgment. For example, in today's patch, Hakuryu torpedo count was increased from 2 to 3. Instead of 18K dmg attack, it will be able to attack with 22.5K dmg. Also, life is not easy for DDs. Manual secondary ones are especially very effective. It is difficult to detect DDs, but it has also become difficult for them to destroy CVs.
@@trashtier How will Béarn perform? I love that ship because it melts DDs. It wasn't tested yet, but the low attack squadron numbers (2) and lack of vision to hunt DDs would make that CV pretty weak.
@@saulmedeiros8836 There's a few CVs that may be hit by this, especially if they have low attack sizes or low plane totals in general. Not to mention planes that need to be exact with their shot placement, like AP rockets or Loewe's bombers. Rockets in general may be harder to use not since you not only have to contend with the lead of the machine guns but also the spotting issue and the time it takes to change stances. Especially for the ones with a long lead time like say, graf's.
YAY dds can now decently hide from CVs. bad news they can no longer hunt cvs as those manual fire secondaries with that wildly long range will kill you. I imagine graf zepplin players licking their lips right now.
from what I understand, only the largest guns are manual, so not as OP as it could be perhaps. I wonder if they are still as accurate in comparison to the other CVs though.
I agree, but the biggest advantage will be the FDR. With high HP, attack planes can easily drop, while a large squadron will stay safely at high altitude. They need to do a big nerf to balance FDR.
I hadn't even thought of that, doesn't the T10 have smol guns? That could be insane to go up against as a DD. You also don't have to worry about a lot of the new mechanics since you only have one drop.
Dfaa dazzle is a little too much in my opnion but overall altough it feels a little strange to use to me its almost a buff just yesterday i could do 4 turn around attacks on a worchester with midway dive bombers no way in hell could i do that currently in game
Imagine if cv's needed to pay as much attention as the avg surface ship. I don't see auto DC and auto ASW on normal ships. This is the most boneheaded way to balance the most op part of cv's (spotting), instead they introduce 3 extra mechanics that you have to deal with.
Looks like russian cvs will be the less impacted by this change, as they drop the whole load in one run. These changes are pretty stupid imo, you just go from takeoff- attack, to takeoff-recon-attack? You get the travel mode, but the planes arent replcaed while attacking, greatly reducing damage output
they planning to apply to all CV, but this is still test on public server that why only 3 kind CV only available for testing, i think still far away for implement to our live server because there still change and balance more and more to this CV mechanism.
Whelp, they've F.A. and will F.O. how easy it was to frack up CV mechanics to oil the squeaky wheels (moaning and groaning players) and probably causing CVs to be a very rare ship to see in any game. I'm so glad I quick this monumentally screwed up game. The easy fix for this was to increase the AA readiness on all ships by 50% added to the existing readiness value and increasing the effectiveness by 25%. Then bring back the old mechanic of panicking pilots when Defensive AA was activated. Nope can't do that, WG's actions here are exactly what Scotty told Kirk about complicated plumbing...
The test mechanics are very different. It is possible to dock a CV with 80mm deck armor to the edge of the island and play like Wooster using only the guns. It takes time to discover many different things and develop new playing styles.
click delete It was a long time ago. I have a video about RTS CVs. Current CVs are very innocent compared to this. ua-cam.com/video/2TV3emHuyH8/v-deo.html
Click and delete, lol. Clearly never seen us old RTS CV players in action where we could take out swathes of ships with good RTS planning. @@neishark1735
@@trashtierAt least RTS Cvs require much moẻ strategies and management, as well as interaction with surfaceships (how spec AA cruisers back then were really a threat; CVs can control fighter to really protect teamates rather than spotting merely;...) I cannot understand why some people, including WG ignore the fact that nowadays CVs do not belong to this game
They destroyed the submarine shotgun mechanics in the game, now they killing the CVs too. xD This game, is such an experience... Whats the point of this? Why just why? Other ships(especially destroyers) can still fckin shotgun anyone with torps but they killed the submarine and CVs now... Absolute joke.
They could have changed the aircraft spotting, removed plane regen and given a few as a flat reserve... instead of making this convoluted mess. I played both the Cv and the cruisers and it's not exactly great on neither side Cv can travel anywhere without a problem and the cruisers cannot shoot at the lingering reserves in the sky, and that doesn't sound fun when facing future Fdr Torps are just really strong now with turning while dive bombers are.... laughable
Là 3 giai đoạn: -Travel mode: cả phi đội không spot địch được, chỉ nhìn thấy địch bị spot bởi đồng đội; bay với max speed; AA tàu địch không bắn được nhưng Fighter thì vẫn bắn -Recon mode: Tóm tắt thì như gameplay hiện tại nhưng bị giới hạn thời gian, spot địch được; cả AA lẫn Fighter địch đều bắn được -Attack mode: Như hiện tại nhưng, ví dụ mỗi đợt tấn công của bác là 3 cái máy bay, thì nếu 1 cái máy bay bị bắn là không thể thay thế bởi máy bay khác trong phi đội. Nói cách khác, nếu cả 3 cái máy bay đó bị bắn hạ thì đợt tấn công đó coi như bỏ và quay về Travel mode lại Cái cơ chế mới này gián tiếp nerf sức mạnh của tụi ung thư bầu trời, trừ một số CV có dạng tấn công cả 1 phi đội như CV Liên Xô chẳng hạn
all of this conveluted garbage just to avoid adding minimap spotting... all of these changes are terrible, for CVs and surface ships. it objectively makes the game worse for everybody.
The philadelphia experiment was a success lol you nailed it.
I miss the og mechanics
Yeah, I got into this game because I saw footage of old carrier gameplay.
Was very disappointed when I finally unlocked one and it just had shitty guided missiles.
Updated Defensive AA Fire "If activated before the planes enter the extended AA range, prevents them from spotting any ships/planes" Explains why or what you were experiencing with your Philadelphia Experiment reference.
The funny thing is, all Wargaming had to do to fix CV 2.0 was make it so the attack flight doesn't replenish lost fighters and change the spotting mechanic to radar only, and they would have solved the majority of the frustrations from playing against CV's....But nope, they decided to completely overhaul CV's a second time and give us CV rework 3.0....
Thanks TT - that was a very clear explanation. One thing you didn't mention was speed control has gone.
The concept that several 50,000 ton ships 400 yards in front of you suddenly disappear yet you can see the sea perfectly is pure cartoon and has no place in WOWS. (It's not only the specific ship you are attacking that disappears).
Maybe they will balance it by having the heal consumable do the same for planes. Then there will be invisible planes attacking invisible ships....
Do we control the ship's secondary weapons ourselves? I can't imagine Hakuryu and Graf Zeppelin. This is very very powerful
So if CV get manual secondaries now… how good are the German CVs going to be considering they’re known for the secondaries already… especially Graf Zeppelin?
from what I understand, the largest guns on a CV are the guns you can shoot, so I'm interested in seeing how graf was affected. Kaga may be fun too, what with the 8 inch guns and all.
graf zeppelin and nakhimov is going crazy on her secondary gun
@@KurniawanUA-cam Graf could be meh actually, she will only use her 150mm guns not together with 105mm
Secondary build Hakuryuu here I come!
10:04 If ships had DFAA activated BEFORE CV strikes, they create something ppl call "Blind effect" so CV player can't see that ship while it's DFAA still going on, that's one new mechanism for those ships not a bug.
I like some changes, and some I don't. Either way as a CV main, i think it's a step in the right direction. Sure, the island campers can Dfaa and hide for a short duration, but at the cost of having their teammates get targeted instead.
Great video! I think these new mechanic need some more adjustment but surely it brings possitive change
thanks, I agree with you that a lot of adjustments are needed.
THX for a very good explanatory video. To be honest, I'm not positive at all about the changes. CV are invalidated IMO, and I won't grind or purchase new ones. Feels very frustrating.
My view is that it's just the constant spot that's lost. There's not much difficulty finding and attacking targets right now.
@@trashtier Aiming is catastrophy of its own currently, at least with rockets and bombs, so I'm not satisfied with the status. Same goes for CV like "Aquila" with their low HP - planes. How to fix that issue when attacking planes can't be replenished? Throw her and others in the trash? Lots of open questions IMHO.
I think they can fix the problems one by one. I played with the new patch today and was able to make effective attacks without using recon mode at all.
@TT so do planes get spotted when at cruising altitude? Or is it any altitude?
any
The more they complicate the mechanics, the more they reinforce the advantage of a good CV player vs a new one. Just like in the old RTS days.
A veteran player will decide which team wins by a huge margin
This is what gets me, the whole point of changing RTS was to increase the player numbers for CVs and reduce the impact of skill. For better or worse, they did that with the current CVs, but this seems like they are reversing the situation. So what happens when it tanks again and good players are swaying the match hard once again? Do they then go back and rework it for the...what fourth time?
Every class have that problem. For example good DD can also change the outcome of a match.
@faynk.6247 there's a difference between a good player swinging an outcome and what was going on with CVs back then. A good DD player may give you a better chance of winning but even the best players can't swing a clear difference in teams without serious effort or the enemy making mistakes.
If the enemy had a significantly better CV, you lost. There was no question about it. The rest of the team was there to be pounded, and it didn't matter how good they were. It's somewhat concerning that we're seeing that level of gap potentially coming back.
Already seeing skilled CV players do seriously nasty things in the ships already. 72k damage on a BB with torpedo strikes from a midway with one squad in 1 min, for example, is being shared about. From one of the twitch live streams of the test.
Looks like a complete trash. The one change that could be done - remove spotting by fighters, that would ease life for the DDs and subs. But this change makes CVs a useless trash.
Ok i think this new cv rework is a net loss, and thats comming from someone who hates cvs, the secondary change is probably the best one here, all they had to do was give them minimap spotting only and it wluld have been fine
Now, I can guess the secondary weapon of the nakhimov in action... It will have a Smolensk DPM?
Great video on those new mechanics
I overall see those changes as negative as it will complicate the CV-surface ship interaction (feel those mechanics are way more complex) and also CV will be affected to very different degrees (FDR will probably still drop the 2 planes in most case for example where a hakuryu will struggle to get the 2 torps drop). Also curious of seing how they will balance russian CV will the 1 attack squad
Once against I well like WG do weird change instead of choosing the simple one : minimap spotting and pilot panic in case of defensive AA
i honestly hate the new changes as a cv main and if this is what its gonna change to we need at least two things shorter preparation times and plane replacement during attack runs for downed planes you give me those two things and perhaps it will work!
After the new patch, I started to think differently about plane replacement. If you have 3 attack planes in a 12-plane squadron, you lose one and deal damage with two planes, but the entire squadron waits in recon mode without taking damage. I think this could be a fair trade.
Damn, now the current attack aircraft get the AA damage, not the aircraft isnt in the attack mode
This is so ridiculous. How to ruin cvs gameplay.
All the complaining players will have what they want now.
Great benefit for dds tho, gonna switch to that class !
It is too early to make a definitive judgment. For example, in today's patch, Hakuryu torpedo count was increased from 2 to 3. Instead of 18K dmg attack, it will be able to attack with 22.5K dmg.
Also, life is not easy for DDs. Manual secondary ones are especially very effective. It is difficult to detect DDs, but it has also become difficult for them to destroy CVs.
Dd's get countered by every class except BB's, you really don't know what you're talking about
@@trashtier How will Béarn perform? I love that ship because it melts DDs. It wasn't tested yet, but the low attack squadron numbers (2) and lack of vision to hunt DDs would make that CV pretty weak.
The game will be harder for all DD hunters because recon mode is limited to limited time.
@@saulmedeiros8836 There's a few CVs that may be hit by this, especially if they have low attack sizes or low plane totals in general. Not to mention planes that need to be exact with their shot placement, like AP rockets or Loewe's bombers. Rockets in general may be harder to use not since you not only have to contend with the lead of the machine guns but also the spotting issue and the time it takes to change stances. Especially for the ones with a long lead time like say, graf's.
All they had to do is to just include only minimap spotting for planes, WG is just clueless on fixing their stuff
Wonder if they fixed hidden menace
How do you think this will affect balance ?
I enjoyed to play indomitable cause of sling shot, and this update is the worst, seems to be like I won't play wows anymore
YAY dds can now decently hide from CVs. bad news they can no longer hunt cvs as those manual fire secondaries with that wildly long range will kill you. I imagine graf zepplin players licking their lips right now.
I prefer current mechanics
You got dazzled by DAAF, that was what happened
most huge problem is SS
this mechanism makes SS stronger i think
this mechanism only perfect for soviet CV + nakhimov has smolenks maingun.
Hope they don't nerf recon mode, or CVs will become pretty bad.
After rework
Every cv on the game is hybrid now 😅
@@admiralfu7220 Imagine if they keep hybrid ships with current plane mechanics?
Think Graf Zeppelin is gonna be op after the rework? Since she got alot 2nds
How about Kaga with 20 cm guns..
from what I understand, only the largest guns are manual, so not as OP as it could be perhaps. I wonder if they are still as accurate in comparison to the other CVs though.
hey don't forget nakhimov, her has smolenks maingun as her secondary lol
@@KurniawanUA-cam and Haku, man she has 3 Harugumo straps in her sides
sec gun 15.6 km lol
It feels so stupid, at least they need to ramp up the dmg with this
imagine playing tier 6 CVs now 😂
Blind mechanic is trash, need to be removed
So this balans made Ussr CV is the beast ???
I agree, but the biggest advantage will be the FDR. With high HP, attack planes can easily drop, while a large squadron will stay safely at high altitude. They need to do a big nerf to balance FDR.
@@trashtier and imagine now we can build German CV with all main ( secondary ) gun ... LOL
As a Graf Zeppelin fan, I must say that I am enthusiastic about the secondaries
@@trashtier FDR got already 2 big nerfs, damage output and planes with less health. In attack mode, she could lose both attacking planes.
I hadn't even thought of that, doesn't the T10 have smol guns? That could be insane to go up against as a DD. You also don't have to worry about a lot of the new mechanics since you only have one drop.
Dfaa dazzle is a little too much in my opnion but overall altough it feels a little strange to use to me its almost a buff just yesterday i could do 4 turn around attacks on a worchester with midway dive bombers no way in hell could i do that currently in game
Imagine if cv's needed to pay as much attention as the avg surface ship. I don't see auto DC and auto ASW on normal ships. This is the most boneheaded way to balance the most op part of cv's (spotting), instead they introduce 3 extra mechanics that you have to deal with.
Sooo, i think this change make the cv have high mechanic gameplay maybe
Interesting, here I am testing the uninstall button.
Looks like russian cvs will be the less impacted by this change, as they drop the whole load in one run.
These changes are pretty stupid imo, you just go from takeoff- attack, to takeoff-recon-attack? You get the travel mode, but the planes arent replcaed while attacking, greatly reducing damage output
only tier 10 will able to use secondaryes weapon?
I think all CVs can use it according to their own strengths.
they planning to apply to all CV, but this is still test on public server that why only 3 kind CV only available for testing, i think still far away for implement to our live server because there still change and balance more and more to this CV mechanism.
It's still need time bar
Rather than making this change, Wargaming might as well remove the aircraft carrier from the game.
Removing aircraft carriers from a World War II naval combat game is an admission that the company is incompetent.
Instead of reworking cvs 300 times, they could have balanced the old rts CVS. They never even tried. @@trashtier
Whelp, they've F.A. and will F.O. how easy it was to frack up CV mechanics to oil the squeaky wheels (moaning and groaning players) and probably causing CVs to be a very rare ship to see in any game. I'm so glad I quick this monumentally screwed up game. The easy fix for this was to increase the AA readiness on all ships by 50% added to the existing readiness value and increasing the effectiveness by 25%. Then bring back the old mechanic of panicking pilots when Defensive AA was activated. Nope can't do that, WG's actions here are exactly what Scotty told Kirk about complicated plumbing...
The test mechanics are very different. It is possible to dock a CV with 80mm deck armor to the edge of the island and play like Wooster using only the guns. It takes time to discover many different things and develop new playing styles.
Con estos cambios MVR sera completamente inutil...
Incoming crying CV players who now have yo actually play the game.
All the crybaby island camping surface ships got their wish finally
Oh no... Now the CV players cannot click and delet any ship they want :(
click delete It was a long time ago. I have a video about RTS CVs. Current CVs are very innocent compared to this. ua-cam.com/video/2TV3emHuyH8/v-deo.html
@@trashtier I know that. Today CVs are still ultra cancer. And them being nerfed is one of the best thing that can happen to the game.
Click and delete, lol. Clearly never seen us old RTS CV players in action where we could take out swathes of ships with good RTS planning. @@neishark1735
@@trashtierAt least RTS Cvs require much moẻ strategies and management, as well as interaction with surfaceships (how spec AA cruisers back then were really a threat; CVs can control fighter to really protect teamates rather than spotting merely;...)
I cannot understand why some people, including WG ignore the fact that nowadays CVs do not belong to this game
#BringBackRTS
They destroyed the submarine shotgun mechanics in the game, now they killing the CVs too. xD This game, is such an experience... Whats the point of this? Why just why? Other ships(especially destroyers) can still fckin shotgun anyone with torps but they killed the submarine and CVs now... Absolute joke.
What are the devs thinking? Planes are used as recon since ww1. Now you remove it. Stupid.
They could have changed the aircraft spotting, removed plane regen and given a few as a flat reserve... instead of making this convoluted mess.
I played both the Cv and the cruisers and it's not exactly great on neither side
Cv can travel anywhere without a problem and the cruisers cannot shoot at the lingering reserves in the sky, and that doesn't sound fun when facing future Fdr
Torps are just really strong now with turning while dive bombers are.... laughable
This is the biggest shit I ever seen...
có bác nào giải thích cho tôi hiểu không, lú quá
Là 3 giai đoạn:
-Travel mode: cả phi đội không spot địch được, chỉ nhìn thấy địch bị spot bởi đồng đội; bay với max speed; AA tàu địch không bắn được nhưng Fighter thì vẫn bắn
-Recon mode: Tóm tắt thì như gameplay hiện tại nhưng bị giới hạn thời gian, spot địch được; cả AA lẫn Fighter địch đều bắn được
-Attack mode: Như hiện tại nhưng, ví dụ mỗi đợt tấn công của bác là 3 cái máy bay, thì nếu 1 cái máy bay bị bắn là không thể thay thế bởi máy bay khác trong phi đội. Nói cách khác, nếu cả 3 cái máy bay đó bị bắn hạ thì đợt tấn công đó coi như bỏ và quay về Travel mode lại
Cái cơ chế mới này gián tiếp nerf sức mạnh của tụi ung thư bầu trời, trừ một số CV có dạng tấn công cả 1 phi đội như CV Liên Xô chẳng hạn
Ngoài ra, toàn bộ pháo phụ của CV thành pháo chính khi bác ở chế độ tàu, và lại thành pháo phụ khi ở chế độ máy bay
@@Defender_Shikikan CV bị neft rồi, chơi bọn máy bay dễ rụng thì xem như toan, mà chắc CV liên xô lại lên ngôi
This is bs for cv player
New mecanical is shit! 🤦♂
all of this conveluted garbage just to avoid adding minimap spotting...
all of these changes are terrible, for CVs and surface ships. it objectively makes the game worse for everybody.