ECHOPLEX EP-3 vs BELLE EPOCH DELUXE Full Comparison by Louis Malagodi
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- Опубліковано 15 лип 2024
- Shoot out between the Maestro Echoplex EP-3 and the Catalinbread Belle Epoch Deluxe, does the Belle Epoch Deluxe sound like the real thing? We'll look at the repeats and the pre amp in a few different ways. Does it 'Van Halen' though?!
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0:00 Introduction + Tests run through
1:46 Clean
2:51 Delays After Overdrive
3:34 Delays Before Overdrive
4:18 Delays Into Distorting Amp
6:19 Pre Amp Quick Comparisons
7:32 Test issues, differences discussion
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Gear used:
Fender 60's Stratocaster
Edwards Les Paul Custom
EVH Striped Series Bumblebee
TC Electronic Polytune 3
TC Electronic Ditto Mini
Analogman Prince Of Tone
Modded Boss GE-7
MXR Flanger Reissue
Maestro Echoplex EP3 '75/'76
Catalinbread Belle Epoch Deluxe
Suhr SL67
Suhr Reactive Load IR
Ownhammer IR's
This is the best comparison video I have ever seen between an echoplex and a belle epoch deluxe. Super helpful and insightful. Thank you for sharing!
This is one of the best gear comparison videos I've ever seen.
Wow, this review was much appreciated and pushed me make the purchase 4 years after these were introduced. My BED arrived today. Unplugged the input and output of my Echoplex EP3 and put the BED in its place, set the levels and the initial impressions are that I can't tell the difference (minus some of the EP-3 noise artifacts). I've tried so many echoplex in a box, various EP-3 preamps paired with various delays and just got burned out by whole ordeal that I stopped looking years ago. Love that they recreated the exact circuit (including the magic pre-amp) running at 22 volts minus the digital delay line. Extremely convincing and so close to the real thing. Double thumbs up.
This was fantastic 👏 I really enjoyed hearing all of this
great video man! keep it up
Very awesome and very detailed Demo / nice job on the VH clips - my ears and brain have those VH tones drilled into my DNA since 78 - there is a reason Eric Johnson has the smaller Belle Epochs on his pedal board
Thanks for the example of EVH, EVH and really knew how to use the Echoplex, and phaser.
Great comparison. Cheers!
The delays sound great
But the playing is great also!
That’s how you do a comparison demo - thanks Louis! I’m going BED instead of original EP-3
Excellent content bro, keep it coming!!!
New video coming soon!
Very great demo!!!!
Very scientific review. lots of work for sure. Awesome job.
Great demo, and great playing! subbed.
Thanks Roy
This video is so underrated! You've done an amazing job! BED is in my shortlist of delays I'd like to have, hands down the best sounding tape delay in my opinion. Just not sure if I want a tape delay first or a drum delay (probably Boonar or CB Echorec). As another option it may be a combo of both in Strymon Volante, but I'm afraid it might be more tweaking than playing
Echoplex 1: 1:47
BED 1: 2:19
Echoplex 2: 2:03
BED 2: 2:35
Echoplex 3: 2:15
BED 3: 2:47
Great comparison ! I'm picking my Belle up tomorrow!
Enjoy! also very fun using it with an expression pedal
Well done. Would have liked to see the settings but well done. I have the BED anyway but good confirmation .
Very nice comparison! Love my BED but was considering buying an original Ep3, but that was before watching this video. Of course the EP3 has that mojo, but it needs steady maintenance whereas the BED is plug and play and sounds super close.
Awesome comparison!
Thank you bro!
Thanks for this very informative video ! I understand better why Eric Johnson uses a Belle epoch on stage ! Great playing by the way !
Thanks Eric, I know EJ used the first version of the Belle Epoch but I haven't seen him using the Deluxe, maybe he has? I'd like to hear what he thinks of the Deluxe. I had the original Belle Epoch too which was awesome, I think the Deluxe pre amp is slightly brighter.
Yes mate! Great vid. Definitely something magic about the EP but it’s very close. You can tell you’ve just had the EP serviced too, real clean repeats compared to most demos I’ve seen 😂
Very close man, I think the repeats would be more down to the age of the tape. I don't actually know how old this tape is but they didn't change it when servicing it and it was put in by the previous owner. From the sounds of it, its pretty new.
Catalinbread folks (Howard) really nailed it with that pedal. I have their oil can delay- Adineko and their flanger- Zeropoint. Both pedals are killer sounding and musically useful. Now I want this one! Great vid dude!
Howard was fired from the company some time back.
@@0megalul309 super unfortunate because he's an amazing engineer and i loved his designs especially, though i don't know who else does their pedal designing tbh
My favorite pedal.
Best to get the Deluxe.
I have the BED & it’s awesome , but I’ve added the EpochPre which just adds an awesome EP3 flavor to my always on tone.
The BED already has the preamp on at all times. So thats two ep preamps at once! Crazy
I don’t understand
Why not just leave the BED on all the time?
There's a dip switch internally of the BED that lets you decide if you want the preamp on all the time.
Great stuff mate. Interesting that you concluded that the BED was a little darker. I don't have the world's best ears, but to me it sounded a little brighter.
Thanks, ha, this the second comment saying this. I think I'm hearing the Belle Epoch has less top end and more upper mids possibly.
@@LouisMalagodi yeah, that's certainly possible. Just goes to show that everyone hears things differently.
I second the brighter even a bit metallic to my old ears. EP-3 is still king in my book it just has that extra something that is so pleasing to my ears. And his EP-3 is obviously in top form.
GREAT comparison video! Do you happen to know the settings you used on the BED for the "into high gain amp" (Van Halen) part?
Tom Scholz of Boston uses an Echoplex for his "Hyperspace Pedal". Theres some videos featuring it. If you want, youtube "hyperspace pedal blues" to really hear what it can do.
This was well done. Been looking at one of these BEDs. When was your BED made and are you still enjoying it it?
I can’t tell the difference honestly. Sometimes the belle epoch has a bit more front end and didn’t sound darker to me. It just seems to jump out a little better in the mix. Maybe 🤔 because it’s coming through my phone speaker. I have a belle epoch and it’s definitely an amazing pedal.
4:19
5:15
I think I'm going bite the bullet and buy the the deluxe to see if I can finally replace a pair of ep-3's which has been a 25 year goal ;) Some people hate the EP-3 preamp but this is the magic sauce when plugged into a 4 hole Marshall. Instantly changes the character and feel of the amp in a way that is hard to pin down but when its not there, you know its missing!
would you mind sharing your experience if you already got the Belle Epoch Deluxe?
Great comparison. Does the Belle Epoche Tape Echo perform as well as the BED and can you replicate the end of EVH Eruption with both? Great guitar playing BTW.
I believe that octave drop was done by a modded (25K Ohms "Echo Delay" pot) Univox EC-80A .
Great video. I’m lucky to have two EP3s, an EP4, BED, BE, Dunlop EP-103 and just bought a Starlight. In isolation I thought the Starlight was closer to an EP-3 but even with the preamp toggled on in the app I’m finding it brighter than all of the others. Have you tried a Starlight yet?
I haven't, I moved away from Echoplex style delays with preamps etc. as they seem to make noise in parallel rigs and professionally I now always use parallel rigs and need Midi functionality. Starlight looks interesting but no analog dry through means it won't work with my setups.
Waiting for the Belle Epoch Super-Deluxe with Tap Tempo and at least 4 Presets. C'mon Catalinbread . . . you guys are so close. You can do it. Great demo. I do agree. The BED sounds slightly darker. The airy top end on the Echoplex is unmatched. oNe LovE from NYC
That’s too funny I was literally just saying that 5 minutes ago before I read your post
No need for tap tempo
My BED stays on all the time. I don’t really even use delay. Just to fatten up the sound.
Do they ‘feel’ the same to play? Would you be happy with the Belle Epoch over the Echoplex if they are essentially the same?? So did you sell the Echoplex and keep the BED?
What is the best expression pedal to use with the belle epoche deluxe in your opinion? Is it the dunlop x series? Thanks.
I use the Nektar NX-P. Cheap and works great!
I am thinking of buying the BED or Strymon El Cap….but I want to use the delay in the FX Loop…do you think the BED is suited for this,or just running into the front of an amp???….great playing and sounds…it’s hard to judge from a UA-cam video,but it sounded like the EP-3 was more 3D…bigger sounding…
Hi Scott, yeah honestly I'd say El Cap would be better for a loop because there's no pre amp colouration. The BED may cause issues in an FX loop due with the amount of level it can take and the output impedance, its a faithful recreation of the whole Echoplex package and its simply not designed to go in the loop. If you want more of the whole Echoplex sound you could go with MXR Pre amp in front of the amp and the MXR echoplex delay in the loop. That would be wicked! Cheers
@@LouisMalagodi Thanks!!….never thought about the MXR thing….that would be cool…
@@scottpeters4401 you could also theoretically use something like the EHX tri parallel mixer to run the delay full wet and the mix in what you need. That's what I do with delays and reverbs in my effects loop to keep them under control and avoid coloring my preamp too much.
@@Diax1324 that’s a great idea…I have a parallel mixer(GigRig Wetter Box)..I use it to create a dry path for my Eventide…never thought of using it on a delay..
BED all the way IMO. Great comparison: audibly, scientifically and technologically.
When you were doing the preamp comparisons I swear the Epoch sounded brighter each time so I was surprised to hear you say it was darker.
To my ears the Belle Epoch was darker in very top end, it possibly has more upper midrange too. So close!
I have some hearing loss so maybe I’m just hearing those upper mids and nothing higher 😆
@@LouisMalagodi Agree 100%.
So which pedal do you prefer?
I think the real echoplex has magical sound and its amazing but Belle Epoch is so close. Form factor and reliability are huge for me when touring so overall its a win for Belle Epoch!
Nice. Belle Epoch definitely has the magic. And just imagine, this EP-3 is newly serviced. One in rough condition wouldn't sound as good.
All the beautiful modulation sounds tape echoes are loved for come from the machines when they are NOT in perfect shape actually. Running a new tape on a recently serviced machine would be way more hifi than most people want from a tape delay
@@G.GordonMiditheres an adjustment to make it sound less perfect
@@looking_33An Echoplex has a setting to make it sound worse? Not that I’m aware of
@@G.GordonMidi the belle epoch does. and the echoplex basically does too, an old tape
@@looking_33 The setting on the BED is just pitch modulation. That’s not really simulating a tape machine any more than a Memory Man is or any other delay with an LFO to modulate pitch of the repeats.
The adjustment on an Echoplex is old tape? So you “adjust it” by using the tape for 6 months? 😂
There is magic in the EP3 preamp that cannot be duplicated. It adds dimension that is very obvious when you are in the room playing through it. I have tried about 5 different EP3 preamp pedals and none come close. Playing an echoplex EP3 in front of a Marshall plexi is a spiritual experience.
The BED preamp is the exact same circuit as an EP-3 including voltage and impedance so hmm.
@@hoover728 no actually it’s not
@@chrisjones8977 lol ok
@@hoover728 No disrespect to you but I own a Belle Epoch Deluxe and a Maestro EP3 and there is a big difference in sound. Nobody would like to find a modern day EP3 preamp more than me. I refuse to take my echoplex out of the rehearsal room for fear of damage or theft. I know the BED is supposed to have the same parts and that may be so but there is a difference in sound.
@@hoover728 My apologies if I came off rude.
Wow on monitor headphones it’s not even close. EP-3 all the way. Anyone not hearing a difference needs better listening devices. It’s significant IMO
the belle epoch is known to have a preamp in it that has character, correct?
Yes, a subtle boost in low mids and high mids
bellypoc :)
The BED is great until you listen for the top end. It just sucks enough of it to dull your guitar tone and in comparison to a real EP3 it sounds good as compared to holy fucking great. If it had that high end back it would be everyone's go to pedal because it would rule.
I somewhat agree but the high end roll off is part of the sound, I think it's due to the EP3's high output impedance which the BED also does. You can mitigate this by placing a buffer or buffered pedal straight after the BED.
No contest
Please elaborate, as they sound almost identical to me.
It is a contest..the BED is wicked..
Bumblebee Into Dirty Amp sounds SO MUCH like a single coil to me when you engage the phaser.... And it sounds really, REALLY bad to me. Like overwhelmingly bad. I'm so confused because everything else sounds incredible. Weird.
Kind of funny how everyone makes a big deal about the famous preamp tone of the Echoplex, but in this demo, both the tape unit and the pedal seem to make almost no difference to the bypassed tone. Certainly not enough to deserve all the raving that people have done about it.
I have a real plexi, and it's really hard to find something to boost it when it's at 10, the ep-3 does it so well in a musical way. With loud marshalls I've found to actually hear what's happening you really have to be in the room with them.
Yeah, dragging that echoplex around on tour would be an ache in the arse.
Agreed, I would never even attempt it!
If you've ever owned one they are not built that sturdy and would have to babied on a tour.
The one in this video must have really been taken care of.
... No EP3 out there sounds exactly the same. You need to take the tape in to any consideration. That said, I love the EP3..... I’ve had it since it was new. I’ve been through ups and downs with it. Many times it just didn’t work when I needed it. I’ve had artifacts from old playing , show up in the strangest of times. It comes and goes ! Like a Phantom. Anyway , I still love it. I do have one of the first Belle Epoch Deluxe’s . I’ve heard , since Howard ( the designer) got screwed over, that they’re a bit different , because he took the code with him. ( good for you Howard !! ) The BED does everything I want and more. It always works , no artifacts , no more worrying , no more dealing with crap tape. I love it ! I have other echo pedals that are good too. The BED is the best EP3 replacement...
I don’t think it was a question of current BEDs being different because Howard took the code, it was that they’re unable to modify the code because of how it was written. So current ones should be exactly the same as they’re just replicating from chip to chip.
Yeah they will all sound slightly different depending on the available components at the time of production. Also this EP3 has been serviced (by Charlie Chandler's) and presumably they used modern production components where they needed to, and then there's drifting component values. I think the tape age will be the biggest factor on the repeats, I believe the tape mine has was fairly new, it wasn't changed in the service and had been put in by the previous owner. The repeats were very very close to the BED. I don't know but I wouldn't expect the BED circuit has changed since Howard left, surely the same schematic would have been used throughout production otherwise it would have needed a new circuit design.
@@LouisMalagodi Not having first hand knowledge, I can’t dispute anything. What I have heard, Is that there’s something that Howard took with him, that makes all of the BED’s since he’s left different. YMMV.. 😳
@@LouisMalagodi ... Regarding Your EP3.. You may have this info. I have a picture of the printing on an EP3 chassis of the Tape that should be used on an Echoplex . Hope it helps..It Reads - USE 3M #152 TAPE ONLY ..
The Belle Epoch sounds digital. It’s too clear. The Van Halen riff sounded much more authentic on the original echoplex.