On The Errors of Pentacostalism (aka Charismatic Movement)
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- Опубліковано 7 лис 2013
- "And there appeared on them parted tongues as it were of fire, and it sat upon everyone of them: and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost..." In our times there seems to be much confusion, even within the Church, over what has come to be known as the Charismatic Renewal or the Charismatic Movement, sometimes called Pentecostalism. This movement is a false spirituality which originated outside of the Catholic Church and has numerous negative effects on the Faith, ultimately causing the weakening or loss of the Faith altogether. To comment please visit www.reginaprophetarum.org & remember to say 3 Hail Marys for the priest
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I like to listen to your sermons. Where are you located?
@@mariacortez5931 Combination of many priest around different parishes I believe.
The Eucharist is a physical consolation. Please explain how that is not also a risk for us to rely on physical consolation.
Can you put a video about Neocatechumenal Way,please. Thank you.
I was involved in a Charismatic Catholic Community Covenant for about a year. I never heard a Catholic prayer in that entire time. I did hear many speak in tongues and thought it was contrived. There were many good people involved in it, genuine people but I felt uncomfortable in it. I found it controlling. They wanted 10% of out earnings and to commit 4 or 5 nights a week to their various groups and meetings. Eventually the guy who ran it kicked me and my family out saying he were not commited and thus had shown we had made the decision to leave, we had not, we were still discerning if it was for us. He was a psychologist and was good with words. I didn't progress spiritually whilst with them but once I left I started praying the Holy Rosary everyday with my family and that led me to daily mass and brought about a real change. I will never join anything like that again, instead I will pray the Holy Rosary everyday and receive Jesus in the Holy sacrament of the Eucharist. God Bless you all.
A covenant community, or any other type of formal religious community, are "controlling" by nature. It's quite natural to have that reaction. A community with strict rules and practices is not for everybody. I don't mesh well with that sort of thing either, so I can relate.
If it was a Catholic community, then I don't know what you mean by not hearing a Catholic prayer that whole time. They would certainly be celebrating Mass and participating in the sacraments. Perhaps you mean they didn't use formal/memorized prayers in other settings such as prayer meetings, but rather preferred spontaneous prayers. Nothing wrong with that as long as traditional prayers are not neglected entirely. Part of the charismatic milieu is to rely on spontaneous prayers in group settings.
The gift of tongues is a genuine and powerful gift of the Spirit. It can be "contrived" if, perhaps, people are being taught that everyone must have it and so they are attempting it whether they are experiencing the real thing or not. Some teach, not that everyone must, but that everyone can - and with this they are referring to "prayer tongues" (used in private and corporate prayer, but not to stand out) versus the public manifestation of a single speaker which is followed by an interpretation. If a person prays for a long time asking for the gift and attempts to practice it, but never experiences it in an edifying way, then it's fine to acknowledge that and not continue.
What critics miss about the gift of tongues is that you do have to actually open your mouth and speak for it to manifest. You can squash it because you have free will and God is not going to take over your body like a puppeteer without your consent. In the cases of people who have an undeniable and powerful experience right away, they experience it as a prompting of the Spirit which they cooperate with, and then there is a rush of power with the words coming out. It's an experience of being in God's presence and worshiping Him and praising Him spontaneously in another language. This bypasses the conscious mind, but in your spirit you sense the power and majesty of God. It is the Holy Spirit together with your spirit. It's quite amazing. Not all experiences are super-powerful and overwhelming though. Some are more low key.
Another thing critics miss is that the same person might have many powerful, deep, contemplative, explosive, etc., experiences of tongues, and then not have the same experiences later. It's not always an event, and this is why some might perceive that it is "contrived" for whole groups of people to be always "speaking in tongues." This is where it pays to listen to people who have experience. Paul says that we have control over it. In context, he's talking about the public manifestation of a single person speaking out what amounts to a prophecy in tongues in a group setting. This is true, but from my experience, it is very difficult to squash it. You have to do so to maintain right order, but the manifestation is so powerful (for me) and so urgent that I can barely contain it. If another person is speaking as I experience the prompting reaching its peak, then I know they are not being led by the Spirit in that moment. In a gathering where these gifts are free to operate, the Spirit does lead people and orchestrate what is happening, so people should not act on their own. If I have to squash it, then it is a somewhat painful and sad experience. I hate that because it's stifling the Spirit and there is both a physical and spiritual consequence. If I get to release the message in tongues then it is incredibly satisfying, edifying, fulfilling. It leaves me in a peaceful contemplative state where I am basically "out of it" (not ecstasy, just very still) for the duration of the meeting.
I would never do this on my own. It would be absurd to do such a thing on one's own initiative. I'm not capable of it and have no desire to do it. This is an actual prompting - a spiritual and physical experience which starts slow and then builds to a peak, and leaves no room for doubt. You do feel like an instrument at that moment, but a willing one. You get tremendously blessed by it. It's incomparable and leaves you "in the Spirit" for quite a long time. This is what happens to me if its a public manifestation of prophecy. The private "prayer tongues" may not, and often don't, reach anywhere near this level of intensity. It is more of an aid to prayer and less of an event. It's easy to do if you had originally a powerful experience of tongues, because you understand it and you don't necessarily
expect something overwhelming every time you just want to pray out loud. So
this is where people might struggle for a while or might end up confused, or might end up convinced that they simply don't have this gift and won't get it. So, yeah, it might seem "contrived" because some/many are not getting it or are not
getting it in a way that's easily discernible. Some struggle and keep trying, and eventually conclude that they got some phrases that seem to repeat over and over. Fine, if it works for them. If the person is genuinely seeking God and open to the gift, it's okay to test it out for a long time and see what happens. Bottom line is that a Christian is normally going to be able to figure this out for themselves. They will know over time whether they are receiving prayer tongues or just spinning their wheels. It's okay not to get it, or even not to seek it or want it. But it is available and God gives these gifts for a reason.
The public gift of tongues, as I explained, is different, and should not be accompanied by any doubt, or "trying," or any willing it into existence. It has very little to do with the mind or will at all. It is a strong prompting by the Holy Spirit that manifests physically as well as spiritually. You don't have to guess or wonder about it. If you are naturally fearful of speaking in groups - and especially of speaking in tongues, of all things, in a group - then the fear will diminish as the
prompting increases. Then there is no fear or apprehension at all when you "release" it and speak out because you experience joy and consolation at God's presence within you. This is certainly what the disciples experienced on Pentecost. Both the experience and the fruit of it are undeniable. Of course, no experience of spiritual gifts is either necessary or sufficient for holiness, but they are a big help nonetheless, and they should be desired and sought because they are good and are meant for the building up of the individual believer as well as the Body of Christ.
It is necessary, however, to seek baptism in the Spirit and the gifts in a setting where this is believed and practiced. That's why there are charismatic prayer groups and courses and retreats and such. Not that it can't or won't happen elsewhere, but generally speaking God acts where He is allowed to act and expected to act. This holds true for healing and miracles. Recall that Jesus could not perform miracles in a town where there was too much unbelief. The Apostles could not do exorcisms at first because the lacked the experience, knowledge, confidence, faith, etc. Discipleship is a key aspect of any authentically Catholic spirituality. You have to learn from those who are experienced and knowledgeable - the "masters" so to speak. Skeptics and critics are not going to give you the true insights into these things because they are on the outside looking in and just don't know any better.
you made the right decision to leave and turn to the Rosary and Holy Mass; these and only these can lead you to God and bring you through happiness. Thank you for sharing your experience. please keep saying your Rosary everyday; it is a powerful prayer
that was my experience too. I found them arrogant and ignorant of scripture. theyjyst want manifestations of the spirit and boost themselves as men of God.
Praying in tongues is demonic. God warned us about vain repetition, funny how many of these people say that Catholics have repetitive prayers (rosary).
Keep saying the rosary daily, going to Mass and Confession. That is the way to stay close to God.
MyImmaculateQueen // I’m sorry to hear that you had that experience. As a Charismatic Catholic, I certainly don’t believe that one needs to be more invested in the community than one is able to. Also, we should be seeing objective progress and fruits and virtues and holiness from any true participation in the Spirit. I’m afraid that when people focus too much on the externals, whether it’s in the Liturgy or in the Charismatic meetings, while neglecting the internal, spiritual life of loving God and neighbor that one can be and will be led astray.
I am glad that you found where God would have you. He wants you in Mass, and receiving Him in the Eucharist, and praying the Rosary is wonderful. May God bless you too.
My sister brought me back into the Catholic faith and it was into charismatic, at first it was great and finally judgmental and Pharisees like and I left after 7 months and went to TLM.. very happy here
God's will. Glory be to him. 👍🏻
Just go and follow Jesus. Jesus is God's son. Accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior and repent of sins.
I was once a Pentecostal who is now Catholic
90snostalgicgal alleluia!
Sad
I'm on my way to joining you. Came out of Hillsong. And it's not 'sad', Sobbie Sunny, it's quite liberating. Pentecostals, or all protestantism in general for that matter is not true Christianity.
Neither is Roman Catholicism.
I CAME out of it. My family are still in it. My dad wants nothing to do with it because of all the child abuse. My gran who is 94 can be very miserable and fights with my sister all the time. My family always fights on Christmas. Huge divorce rate. Catholicism never set them free. The Jesus on the stations of the cross never helped them. Mary never. Not one hail Mary or act of contrition or novina.
Yes Hillsong is following lies and deception but the Roman Church is not the real way to forgiveness of sins. Jesus said 'you will know the truth and the truth will set you free'. Read the word of GOD especially the original text and languages Greek and Hebrews and the LORD by the Spirit will open your eyes. Blessings.
Leaving the One, True Church is a sure way to damnation. However, if your family is looking for a "perfect" church on Earth, then they will be sorely disappointed. However, the Catholic Church is the True Bride of Christ and the only Church that can deliver salvation to men through its husband, Jesus Christ Himself.
I used to be a (heretical) 'Oneness' Pentecostal. But the Grace of God delivered me from that false-doctrine Church.
ex-NFL fane
me too.. this video really hits home. I love my Catholic faith.
ex-NFL fan and DoTell1: Can you tell me what brought you out of Oneness Pentecostalism? For one thing, I love learning about others' faith journeys; but mainly, I have a friend about whom I'm very concerned because he is a Oneness Pentecostal. So what was it that opened your eyes to the falsehood of the Oneness Pentecostal doctrine?
Jared Hartwell Give her a book by Patrick Madrid Surprised By Truth or Rome Sweet Home by Scott Hahn. Welcome home. Pax Christi.
Pray, fast & wait say your rosary for her,. say your mass intentions for her conversion.
ex-NFL fan, Praise be to the Lord Jesus Christ, amd the Holy Spirit for giving you the sweet, divine grace that relieves us of our blindness.
We're Catholics, why oh why would we embrace something that comes from protestantism?
Because the Vatican II council changed mostly everything in order to get as many Protestant conversions as possible. 6 Protestants helped create the New Mass in 1969.
Agree!!
What, specifically, do you find wrong from Vatican II? It has been my experience that most detractors either were trad Caths prior or misunderstand the teachings.
@@frankpontone2139 Who were the 6 Protestants?
@@RumorHazi You're gonna want to tag him in your question.
Simply put, it is Catholics wanting to be Protestant, but don’t want to leave the church, as millions have. I was one who did leave my Catholic faith, for “experience”. I returned over 25 yrs. later!! It is chaos “outside” of Catholicism. 🙄
I have had this disease and am in the process of recovery. Glory to God.
What did it do to you?
@@hermanblitzphos5161 I cannot blame other people for my errors. I can only say that by following such practices I was led first into the sin of vainglory and then into other more shameful sins. The charismatic movement doesn't discern God as the Saints suggest doing (St. John of the Cross, for example). Instead, it encourages a person to interpret an ever widening stream of 'messages' as possibly being God's voice. The result is that both the devil and the prideful imagination run riot in the life of the person, and God's voice is inevitably drowned out, because God's voice is generally the 'still, small voice'.
@@jasonbernard5468 you know there are fake churches and real right? Real churches do the miracles and read and trust bible fully. I’m sorry for what you experienced but please grow closer to Jesus
@@hermanblitzphos5161 i9op8opppopp
@@jasonbernard5468
Oh. So glad you made it back. 🙏
I went to a Charismatic Catholic mass once. It seemed odd to me. I attend TLM now and my faith has grown immemsely. However, I will say that Fr Mark Goring, a priest in the CCR, is very devout and holy.
I am a cradle catholic and attended various non denominational churches most were charismatic, some baptists. They all have elements of charismatic sentiments, even baptists. I was always trying to find Jesus in these churches. It wasnt until going back to mass that I found our Lord, body blood soul and divinity.
Fr. Goring is a heretic who spews his ridiculous, shallow videos on a daily basis. He is friends with a false prophet: Matthew Kelly, who claims to speak DIRECTLY with God the Father. Does the fact that Kelly is a multi-millionaire have anything to do with their bond? Goring also believes in the obvious long con of Medjugorje where the "seers" claim to see the Holy Virgin on an on demand basis, like streaming video. Medjugorje has been denounced by reasonable, faithful priests and bishops for decades. The fact that you claim Goring is "holy" reveals a total lack of discernment.
Father Mark is getting more Traditional all the time.😅 His Life is center Ed around thé Mass. He has a very prayer based schedule.❤
I accidentally went to a Pentecostal Mass one Saturday. I was expecting a regular quiet Mass. People were yelling out during the Mass and homily. The priest dancing around the altar. I left in tears. No way is that from God. I’ve learned that when it becomes about the people worshipping instead of the One worshipped, get out fast!
And how do you know it’s not God? Do you see the inside of people’s hearts as God does? To see if they truly worship God or not.
@@Neta4Christ Since you are a Protestant, perhaps you should refrain from telling a Catholic about what constitutes a proper, reverent, dignified Mass. Catholics believe this type of liturgy is what God prefers. You can believe what you like. You may want to consider: the following: "You have heard ask and you shall receive but you receive not for you ask for that which will feed your passions." St. James. Since Luther threw out the book of this apostle, along with six others, you may not know it. Catholics KNOW that a dignified, quiet, reverent and holy Mass has 2000 years of Tradition behind it, starting with the apostles. No charismatic can prove that his babbling in gibberish or "words of knowledge" come from the world, the flesh, the devil or the Holy Ghost. We listen to our Church fathers, read the AUTHENTIC Bible that we compiled in the fourth century, and heed the words of St. Paul to adhere to the Gospel that comes from God, not men. Before the infestation of "charismatics" in the early 1960's, a demonstration of their behavior in a Protestant assembly may well have resulted in excommunication. In earlier ages, they may well have been burnt as witches. The priest proves his argument. You simply react with your personal beliefs and preferences.
lol grow up.
@@Neta4Christ The Lord told the woman at the well that God is to be worshipped in spirit and in TRUTH. The truth is that the Protestant heresy of charismatics infested the Church in the 1960's. If you fail to perceive that the professional hucksters: Matt Fradd, Scott Hahn, Ralph Martin make $$ from self-promotion, vainglory and promotion of FEELINGS, it is because you CHOOSE NOT TO. No charismatic kook can prove that his babblings or "words of wisdom" come from the world, the flesh, the devil or the Holy Spirit. Heretic means "one who chooses." I pray to hear and obey the voice of the Holy Spirit but I would NEVER claim to be full of the Holy Spirit, that's BLASPHEMY. You are not filled with the Holy Spirit and neither are your charismatic heroes.
@Eddard Tyrsson I know what mass is.
Sola Scriptura has unleashed so much chaos upon the world.
It's a textual Rorschach exercise. "Tell me what you see in this text."
@@seriouscat2231 very good quip - haha - like it
I think what it is with a vast majority of professing Christians in the world is like it could have been for me.
I was never raised in a church but had become an avid reader at an early age. In high school I came across the new testament and attempted to read it. I found it hard to understand, confusing, and seemingly contradictory to the point to where I would have needed someone to tell me what salvation involved. But I didn't pursue it at the time. Most do and build a foundation of all their future interpretation of what the scriptures mean on Catholic and protestant teachings.
Five years later I visited a Pentecostal church, was baptized in the Holy Spirit and spoke in tongues. I didn't even know it was called speaking in tongues until someone told me afterwards.
I arrived home later and decided to read a little from my Bible before bed. When I opened it I was amazed. Suddenly it had taken on much more depth and I felt the Spirit I had recieved guiding me and teaching me the meaning of what I was reading.
@@seriouscat2231 A complete disaster for humankind, spiritually, scientifically and intellectually.
@@robertnieten7259, there's a problem. You are not being guided and your understanding has not increased. This is the problem with Gnosticism. You get the feeling that you understand and that you are being guided, when in reality you are just being fooled by the experience.
I was involved in a charismatic group for ten years starting in my youth. It seemed great at first with tonnes of external signs from both God and men showing that I was loved. Over time however much of this was shown to be superficial, insincere, and basically just hype. I became burnt out from all the noise and was no longer moved by the hypnotic tactics - which made me seem like I was not open to God. Once you are a has been, since in their eyes you should have known better, you end up to them as a lost cause. They tolerate your presence but secretly hope for you to leave. This is the reason why these groups have such high turn over rates.
Years later in seeking something more rooted in tradition and sincere, I was glad to find traditional Catholicism with all its bells and whistles - noisy when there's a reason, and quiet when it's supposed to be. I feel much more grounded.
So you base things on feelings still
@@matthewashman1406 Not really. Our feelings are fleeting. I remain Catholic because it is built on the Chief Cornerstone, Christ Himself. If I only relied on feelings then I never would have become Catholic. It is a whole package deal.
To put it in simple form. "PRIDE." Very dangerous for human being.
Pride oh yes, and the Catholic church is one of the most guilty of this sin!! Because you think you are the only ones going to heaven!!
@@allysonflowers7496 Yes pride is judging the whole Catholic church as prideful for believing that salvation come from Christ, assured through the Catholic Church when in actual fact Christ instituted the mass and the church with St. Peter the Apostle as the head as the first leader. The Creed of the Catholic Church is also a declaration of love for God and a commitment to do God's work, for the salvation of souls. Thus, this belief that those not in the Catholic Church are not assured heaven is not to condemn others but to tell Catholics to work for the salvation of souls. We can't go round claiming salvation by imagining we have faith alone. Our faith in God seriously needs to be worked on before it will move mountains or before it will let us walk on water. 😁
@@nickash5 great reply. I will write this in my journal for future reference. Thank you.
This is really good content. I was super charismatic, but I think my guardian angel protected me from being involved in many things with the renewal. There are too many people laying hands and and speaking in "tongues" where I'm from. These people have bad things attached to them as I haven't seen much good come from their prayers. On the contrary, other manifestations have taken place, no healing or reconciliation has taken place, and others present are spiritually attacked. I'm all for father putting the message to run away from these things!!!
bonifamanlover i agree.
Ridiculous intemperate and imprudent comments.
MillionthUsername justification?
I got out in 1990...
The amount of evil spirit attacks
While I was in , was astronomical.
Actually being physically beaten
And strangled....one night was
The last straw.
Took along time to detach from the evil things...even today I'm still in recovery.
Yes, run, flee, itsfull of demons
My Catholic Parents became "Charismatic Catholics" in Seattle, Washington from the Leader of the Charismatic Movement himself, once from Southern California and relocated to the Episcopal Church in the Pacific Northwest. It was the straw that broke the Camel's back of my Parents struggling Marriage. His name was Dennis Bennett.....our entire Family was engaged in this Ecumenical "Neo-Pentecostalism". My Mother went full Pentecostal and became Anti-Catholic, while my Father denounced this and remained a Faithful Catholic. They divorced in 1976.....all because they entered Dennis Bennett's Episcopal Renewal Ministries!
This Divorce took my Siblings to Pentecostalism and Bad Spirituality and Marriages. I became a Pentecostal Anti-Catholic because I was removed from the Church after First Communion and never knew the Fulness of the Truth. I eventually went to College and University, where I was ordained.
I left Protestantism because I knew Koine Greek and studied the Koine Greek LXX and NT.....then the Apologists and Fathers. I became Eastern Orthodox, and after some years I and My Wife and Eight Children returned to the Church as Byzantine Catholics. The first thing I shed was Pentecostalism (Charismania) as a Protestant.....it made me question everything. It is a LIE! It is Neo-Montanist Heresy and Heterodoxy.....and most Catholics who become Ecumenical Charismatics are drawn away into full Protestant Pentecostalism.....FACT! Look at Latin America!
This Homily is SPOT ON!
Kenneth Huffman thanks for your testimony. I am from Seattle and Charismatics are everywhere amongst most very devout Catholics that I know. I’ve had some exposure to it, having reconverted from being a New Ager. Naturally, was drawn to it for a while, but I had some concerns about it all along. I’m not so sure it’s a good thing, though ppl I’ve met who are drawn to it are very sincere. Many of them much more diligent in prayer than I am. I’m surprised to hear that so many ppl actually leave the Catholic Church bc of this.
Thank you for you're authentic testimony, so important for a lot of us who are confused and concerned about this matter. It is a most striking and convincing point which should be understood immensely.
Thank you for your opinion.
Same here.. Alot of bad spirits in it.
@@michaelshelbyedwards, I think many confuse spontaneity with sincerity. One is spontaneous when he is moved by purely internal reasons. One is sincere when he fulfills the social obligations of his role or position. A Catholic should aim for sincerity, but the Pentecostals and Charismatics are actually about spontaneity. It occurs in the sense that if you do random or nonsensical things then it's assumed that you are being guided by some spiritual reality.
Why did you leave orthodox?
Protestantism swings on a pendulum of emotionalism and rationalism.
Catholicism swings on the axe of Roman paganism
Not completely true, my friend. That would describe Pentecostal ism but not protestants as a whole. Many of users actually very studius is imply studying proper context of scripture.
@@BenjaminSharkey Protestants do not have proper context of scripture, it is impossible for them to have proper context because they do not have the authority to interpret scripture.
Protestants claim that scripture interprets itself, or that they pray to God and they receive the proper context from the Holy Spirit, but this is obviously not true because otherwise they would all have the exact same interpretation since truth does not contradict.
The fact is every time a Protestant disagrees with another Protestant, they take the Bible and decide for themselves what it means and start a new church. This is why there is over 50,000 different denominations of Protestantism. They can't all be right, they cannot all have the correct context and interpretation.
Only the Roman Catholic Church has the correct understanding of the context of scripture, this is because only the Roman Catholic Church has the authority to interpret scripture. This is why the Church's teaching on scripture has never changed, because truth cannot change.
If you want proof from scripture itself that only the Roman Catholic Church has this Authority, I will give it to you.
Matthew chapter 16 verse 18
"And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of Hell will not overcome it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”
Jesus is obviously founding his Church and putting Peter in charge. Peter was succeeded by Pope Saint Linus, he was succeeded by Pope Saint Clement, all the way till today in an unbroken line of popes. This is why the Roman Catholic Church is the one true Church and the only one with the Authority from Jesus himself, because only we can trace ourselves to Peter.
Furthermore Jesus did not hand us the Bible, he gave us the Church and put Peter in charge, and the Church wrote and compiled the Bible. It is a Catholic book.
Martin Luther came along 1500 years later and decided anyone can interpret scripture for themselves. Obviously that has resulted in endless divisions, because no Protestant agrees with each other 100% on the context of scripture, and they never will, because they do not the context of scripture, and they never will, because no one has the authority to interpret scripture other than the successors of Peter and the apostles in union with him.
Every Protestant is their own Pope, deciding for themselves how to interpret scripture. Each one have to reinvent the wheel for himself.
Protestants will protest and point out that the Pope and Bishops are sinful men, therefore they can make mistakes and so how can they interpret correctly?
The pope and Bishops in Union with him can interpret correctly without error despite being imperfect and sinful men, because Jesus is God, and since he is God, he has the power and authority to grant the men he put in charge infallibility so despite their imperfections and sinfulness, they are protected by the Holy Spirit from error when interpreting scripture. This is how the gates of hell do not Prevail against his Church, that he founded, and put Peter in charge of.
I will pray that you come home to the one true Church.
@@Steve_Milo I appreciate what you are trying to do but I don't subscribe to the many beliefs and practices of Catholicism. I could go into detail why but I do not gelueve it would serve any constructive purpose. If I may critique how you responded though, the way you word things sounds very cultish. In fact, the way you describe the catholic church and claim how protestants dont have context of scripture is exactly how the apostolic pentecostal church ropes people in. It's a very cultish tactic and anyone who has undergone any kind of spiritual abuse will instantly be turned off from anything that sounds remotely similar or legalistic. Blessings
@@BenjaminSharkey If you have been abused spiritually (I'm guessing by rude people throwing insults) then that is outside my control and I am sorry it happened to you. It does not excuse you from failing to use logic and reason to understand the Truth. Truth does not contradict and is by its very nature legalistic. It is a singularity and unaffected by emotions or even a person's willingness to believe it or not.
You can say the way I sound is cultish, but your premise is obviously wrong because that would mean I am making an authoritative argument, or an emotional argument, when in fact I am using logic and reason.
I have proven that the Catholic Church is the one true Church founded by Christ himself with the words of Jesus himself. If you believe Jesus is God as he claimed to be, then therefore you must accept what Jesus dictates.
Clearly Jesus founded one Church and put Peter in charge in Matthew 16:18, and logically if Jesus is God (He is) then He has the power and authority to do this and logically if an all powerful God can do all things like create the universe from nothing, then He certainly can chose who He wants to lead His Church.
You claiming I'm using a 'cultish tactic' is being intellectually dishonest and a straw man argument, furthermore this is proven by your failure to address the logical conclusion that if Protestants can get the correct interpretation of scripture, then why do they keep splitting up into new denominations every time they have a disagreement over the context of scripture?
Logic and reason dictates that if God given authority is not needed to correctly interpret scripture, then protestants can correctly interpret scripture and agree on its context, because truth does not contradict itself.
Obviously Protestants do not agree with each other on the context of scripture and keep splitting apart into different denominations every time they have a disagreement over the context of scripture. Therefore protestants cannot correctly interpret scripture and understand it's context, otherwise they wouldn't split up.
This is why Jesus, using his divine power and authority, gave us Peter, the man who has the authority to interpret matters of faith, morals, and scripture without error.
Only the Catholic Church has succession to Peter, therefore only the Catholic Church founded by Jesus himself can tell us what the correct context of scripture, and you cannot do it by yourself proven by the obvious fact that there are over 50,000 denominations of Protestantism because they do not agree on the context of scripture.
I hope you come home to the Church. I will keep praying for you.
Charismatic movements are dangerous. I used to go to pentecostal church where I received "gift" of speaking in Tongues. My life didn't change, I struggled with sin and reading bible and praying, but oh well! I could speak in Tongues which church was saying is the most important gift of the Holy spirit...St Paul was right saying if someone will walk in church seeing all you babbling in different Tongues won't they think you're mad? Because truly it looks mad and out of control, no God's spirit in there
It’s demonic transferring of the kundalini spirit to you or other devils that have attached to you , through going into these filthy temples.
That’s why you struggle with the things of God.
How are you today ?
Same happened to me, real struggle with bible reading and prayer etc aftet being deceived by these cults.
I have always been turned off by those huggy/feely groups. My instincts were right. Their behavior appeared so unseemly----more like Benny Hinn than Fulton Sheen....
Exactly
I know what you mean, hermajesty52!
Where I live outside the USA there's too much singing at Mass to begin with, waving of hands and singing at "Hallelujah"" and "Holy, holy, holy...", and some characters start swaying from left to right, really "getting into it". There's a decent little band and singers so I suppose the priest thinks, let's make good use of them. I'm a returning Catholic after years of being a holy-day Catholic. Hard to swallow the changes. Some Churches are less lively than others of course. The Masses on TV, on three channels here, have none of this business.
Thankfully born Roman Catholic- it is a great gift after all - I have generally found Charismatics a bit hard to take. I have nothing against their way, but I cannot honestly carry on like that. I am no introvert nor am I a tedious scold. I like nice music and participating, I just do not have it in me to go over the top like they often do. I like how Belloc put it; “Wherever the Catholic sun does shine, there’s always laughter and good red wine. At least I’ve always found it so, Benedicamus Domino!” 🙂
@EUCHARISTforLIFE Amen Catholic Charismatics are still better than Pentecostalism.
I was baptised Catholic and pulled from The Church at age 4 and raised Assembly of God. I never really liked the church nor did I like the charismatic manifestations. However, it is pressured to receive. Very pressured. Finally, nearly a decade ago I did "receive" and other than an emotional "I did it!" and honeymoon period, I soon became disillusioned and wary of it. For one thing it is taught that it is a language, but I did not sound like I spoke a language, nor did it sound like others I have heard. I was told it was "baby talk" and the more I did it the more it would evolve into mature tongues. Why would the Holy Spirit speaking in me and through me need baby talk? The other thing that upset me greatly was I had no idea what I was saying! Not even an inclination! If I don't know what I am saying, how do I know I am rightly praying?! That really disturbed me. I gave it up. I left the AG church and refuse to go back. Beyond the tongues there were other issues and spiritual abuses. There are good, loving people in the AG church and they do love Jesus, preach the Gospel, and baptise in the Trinity, but I can never go back.
Paul said we pray in the Spirit in a mystery unto God, so you would not expect to intellectually grasp what is not subject to interpretation.
This AOG church that you attended were very blindsided theologically. They were not mature. They were legalistic. This church still carry the effects of embracing anti-intelectualism Fundamentalism early in their history of the AOG.
My dad is a protestant pentecostal, please pray for his conversion :(
The rosary will help. Your dad will be in my prayers.
I am reminded of something a priest said during the St. Ignatian spiritual exercises he hosted: "Seek the God of consolation, not the consolations of God."
As a Reformed Baptist I agree with you guys the Charismatic movement frustrates me greatly. It attracts the youngsters because it is all about feeling and emotion and very little sound doctrine. I was not in the movement but went to a few conferences as a young teen.
I was a part of catholic charism and I found it diabolical. I was demanded to tell the" hands on" prayer group my sins. No one knows my sins except God and my secrets are not for devils. The catholic charismatic movement causes much disobedience among its members. God bless you in your Baptist faith.
Ok Linda, did someone bother to tell you this is NOT Catholic teaching? Did you watch the video??
LindaBkrWms wait, don't get mixed up. The priest knows one's sin in the Sacrament of Confession
The priest acts In Persona Christi, which literally translated means "in the person of Christ". He hears the sins as he was instructed to do, however, it is Christ who forgives sin. In order to be absolved of sin there must be true repentance, a contrite heart, and a sincere desire to avoid it in the future. THAT is Catholic teaching.
GSRider amen!
While praying the Glorious Mysteries a thought came to me "They began to speak in tongues, as the spirit gave them utterance". The gift was given to them to help with evangelizing the gentiles who spoke different real languages not gibberish.
Our English word " tongues" in the original Greek, that the new testament was written in, is singular not plural and means " another language" and " a language". So in Acts ch.2 when the believers recieved the Holy Spirit it actually reads, " .. and they began to speak in another language as the Spirit gave them.utterance and ".. and they began to speak in a language as the Spirit gave them utterance.
The miracle for the men In the crowd wasn't that the apostles were miraculously speaking in their native languages but that they were all speaking in one spiritual language and the men miraculously heard what they were saying in their native languages.
What you say is correct..But Paul speaks of a different gift where he seems to say "speaking in tounges" is not in a language known to man but to God. It may sound uncommon, but let's be careful not to blaspheme the Holy Spirit.
1Cor14:2 "For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to people but to God. Indeed, no one understands them; they utter mysteries by the Spirit."
@@therighteousrighthand There are two operations of speaking in " tongues":
1) The initial evidence that a believer has recieved the Holy Spirit ( in every case )and the born again believers' private prayer language for self edification
2) The gift of speaking in " tongues" to be operated in an open church setting and always to be accompanied by a believer with the gift of interpretation of " tongues" for the edification of a church gathering.
It is the same one spiritual language with two operations.
@@robertnieten7259 The evidence that a "believer" has received the Holy Spirit is whether they have received the Sacrament of Confirmation. Faith is facts, not feelings. The greatest mystical Saints warn that dependence on feeling good in prayer is a sign of spiritual malnourishment. The phrase "self-edification" sums up big problem in the charismatic movement. It's a performance, done so a person can feel good about themselves, indulge in a little spiritual pride, and focus on self rather than on God. No good angel would ever guide us to do these things.
@@gray_mara I'm sorry but according to scripture the only evidence given immediately upon a believer recieving the Holy Spirit is speaking in ' tongues"
Acts ch 2,10, and ch.19.
There is no sacrament of ordination mentioned in the Bible. We have to use the scriptures alone as our guide on how to be saved not the writings of anyone no matter how high they are regarded.
We are listening to the truth. Praised be Jesus
I can't handle the charismatic movement in the RC church. Its entirely self serving and becomes a distraction from what is truly important.
The thing is, many people come in through heresies and either remain in the heresy or later go on to find more well founded teaching. Any form of excitement or sentimentality will have its followers. It's too bad that some people attempt to make St. Thérèse into an icon of Quietism or presumption. There was much penance, sacrifice and suffering in her life, voluntarily embraced. She did not just hang around there, smiling and dreaming and being an eternal little girl. Also, saying that the Holy Ghost is "in one's soul" sounds quite off, even dangerous. I mean, you have the true one God in three persons, where the Holy Ghost is the Love that the Father and the Son, also Goodness and Truth have for each other.
Now if one wishes to make a man, that is his flesh into a god, he first starts with the pure fact of existence. This often happens by replacing Christ the Truth with Christ as some kind of pure fact of existence, by reducing Him into the simple act or fact of salvation or atonement or forgiveness. Then the temporal man himself will become the truth of his own existence. From there follows the "third" of this counterfeit trinity, where man's sentimental love for his material and social existence is called or referred to as the spirit. And this spirit really does emanate from one's soul.
The Charismatic movement is a counterfeit spirituality in so many ways, both historically, doctrinally and metaphysically that the more you learn about the true one, the more you will find new levels and even dimensions of falsity in it.
I left the Assemby of God Church about 6 years ago and quit speaking in tongues about 5 years ago. I am heading into the Catholic Church, but keep waffling. I realize, listening to this, that I still am basing my religious walk on Pentecostal mindsets, especially when it comes to abandoning religious exercises because I don't feel things.
It's a process
I speak in tongues when led to, and go to daily mass... It all begins to integrate the more you read the saints. lol.. They all had charismatic gifts (healing/prophesy etc)
The teachings of St John of The Cross in this video are now being used to teach many Charismatic Catholics in the world, to prevent them from infected by heresy and backsliding.
The Catholic Charismatic community in Canberra are different. They are led by the humble and devout Missionaries of God's Love which comprise of Priests and religious Brothers. You would be very unlikely to hear anything uncatholic preached in public or in private. They have a great love for the Sacramental lives of the lay faithful. God bless them. If the Catholic Charismatic communities were approved of for deliverance prayers by the late and great and holy exorcist Father Gabriel Amorth then they ought to be trusted if no available exorcist in ones diocese. RIP Father Gabriel Amorth
I called it Tradismathic. That's a great one. A lot of teaching of tradition and a lot of sacramental lifes
I agree. I go a parish with the Missionaries of God’s Love in Melbourne Australia. They are the best!
I was asked by a Catholic charismatic woman if I was charismatic and I said no, she told me "then you aren't Catholic". So no I do not wish to belong to such a group.
The "Charismatic Renewal" is what's not Catholic. This garbage never existed in the Church until the 1960s
Saint John Of The Cross was right! The Christian faith and the Christian experience is not about signs and wonders, but instead
it is about fellowship, and communion, with our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ!
Mar 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
Mar 16:18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
Mar 16:20 And they went forth, and preached every where, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.
Act 3:1 Now Peter and John went up together into the temple at the hour of prayer, being the ninth hour.
Act 3:2 And a certain man lame from his mother's womb was carried, whom they laid daily at the gate of the temple which is called Beautiful, to ask alms of them that entered into the temple;
Act 3:3 Who seeing Peter and John about to go into the temple asked an alms.
Act 3:4 And Peter, fastening his eyes upon him with John, said, Look on us.
Act 3:5 And he gave heed unto them, expecting to receive something of them.
Act 3:6 Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk.
Act 3:7 And he took him by the right hand, and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength.
Act 3:8 And he leaping up stood, and walked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, and praising God.
Act 3:9 And all the people saw him walking and praising God:
Act 3:10 And they knew that it was he which sat for alms at the Beautiful gate of the temple: and they were filled with wonder and amazement at that which had happened unto him.
Act 4:29 And now, Lord, behold their threatenings: and grant unto thy servants, that with all boldness they may speak thy word,
Act 4:30 By stretching forth thine hand to heal; and that signs and wonders may be done by the name of thy holy child Jesus.
This priest is anti-Christ. He is leading you away from Biblical teachings towards Roman mysticism.
Any Pentecostals ever cast out devils?. There lies the proof.
@@mathewjoseph5987 not the ppl themselves, but Jesus has driven out many demons through the prayers of Pentecostals yes. It is not the exorcist who drives out the demons, but the power of the Holy Spirit. Even Catholics working specifically in exorcism & deliverance will not deny it - Mark 16:16-17 applies to all the baptised in Christ Jesus. Baptism (according to the RCC) doesn't have to be a Catholic Baptism to be valid, but just has to fit the requirements as written in the Bible (" *Person's name*, I baptise you in the Name of the Father, and of the Son, & of the Holy Spirit" whilst either pouring water on the head or immersion in water).
@@mathewjoseph5987, the problem here is that the supernatural life of faith and Spirit is what Lk. 10:27 says and all these things are only contained in the Catholic Tradition. The Bible does not explain anything thoroughly, because it was never intended to. There was always the Church and the Tradition for that.
The Pentecostals have none of that. In other words, their movement or the Charismatic movement actually has never had anything to do with the Holy Spirit. They're just faking different kinds of manifestations and then sorting that stuff into categories.
All the miracle and manifestations that the Charismatics like to quote from Bible had a purpose and a meaning that was recognized and understood by the witnesses. It is because of Pentecostals and Charismatics that people now find natural to think that the sheer absurdity or strangeness or suddenness of something means that something powerful or spiritual is taking place. Pentecostalism is the ultimate trashing and confounding of everything they lay their hands upon (pun intended).
Most former Catholics I know ended up being Protestants after being exposed to the charismatic movement. it's not my cup of tea. I attended a couple times and I observed how emotional the people were, some of whom were hysterical. The preachers were something else.
lol
I think this presenter and these commenters are emotional or hysterical. I would not be surprised if they drove people from the Catholic Church in droves. Not my cup of tea, these people.
I recall a study which looked into the "talking in tongues" claims of Charismatics and determined that the variations in phonemes, their distribution and repetition proved that their was *no way* it could be an authentic language.
Whilst I am sure people do genuinely receive this Charism, the majority of people we encounter who do this are doing it for attention. This is why Peter in 1 Cor 14:27-28 calls for an interpreter and "If there is no interpreter, the speaker should keep quiet in the church and speak to himself and to God."
@@kelly4187 The other problem with speaking in tongues is the flagrant misunderstanding of the premise. St. Peter spoke in tongues on Pentecost, according to the Acts of the Apostles, but what many fail to recognize is that he was speaking Aramaic himself, while those who didn't understand that language heard it in their own native tongue (Egyptian, Latin, Greek, etc.). Like you say, the so-called speaking in tongues of the charismatics is gibberish.
For the record, I believe this priest speaks truthfully. I have been witness to the charismatic renewal at the Catholic University where I work. It frightens me deeply. Like others, I observe an overabundance of emotion and a lack of true faith. People are singing Protestant songs in the chapel for adoration, replete with theological inconsistencies and fallacies, and in some cases even screaming the words out. It's a cacophony of noise in a place that should have an air of solemnity and sobriety to it. True communion with God in adoration is only possible through silence. The Masses are just as terrifyingly noisy. The truth is, the solemnity and sobriety of traditional forms of worship are more effective in fostering the correct attitude of prayer. They lead one to humility gently. I am an altar server at the Latin Mass in the local parish. Every day that I serve, I am struck with the awe of being so close to the altar and hearing when no one else does the words of Consecration. It is not lightly that I acknowledge how unworthy I am to be there. To be Catholic and to receive Christ in the Holy Eucharist is a privilege. Any other outlook misses the mark.
John Paul Hare I like what you wrote because you have exposed the Renewal for what it is. God bless you ☦️🙏📿💕
If you build your house on charismatic signs and wonders, then what happens when those signs are shown to be fake or fraudulent? House collapses. Thats why Pentecostalism weakens the faith imo.
... the Satan comes like an angel of light ...
I love St John of the Cross.
Unfortunately most of my family is Pentecostal with my uncle being a preacher. Only three, including myself, are truly Catholic in the entire family. It is a great sadness for me
Pray the rosary and the 7 sorrows. The Blessed Mother will lead your family back.
I will pray for their conversion today.
i will also pray your family sees the Light.
Thank you, Father, for this homily. Thank you, Sensus Fidelium, for sharing. I have been waiting a very long time for a holy priest to talk about this subject.
Read your Bible.
This is not of God.
God does not call his people to speak their opinions but to speak the good news of His son Jesus.
For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus,
Everyone needs to call and pray to Yeshua (Jesus) only.
@@Neta4Christ Shut up.
@@trishahukins9343 lol
Can’t. God created me to speak. Truth hurts doesn’t it.
@@Neta4Christ God also created you to shut up. That's why you have two ears and one mouth. So you can listen twice as much as you speak. Take the good advice and shut up.
@@trishahukins9343 hmm did God created you to be rude? I speak what is in accordance with the word of God the Bible as God wants us to. Not what people make up. If it’s not biblical it’s Not God.
3 For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4 They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.
2 Timothy 4:3-4
Galatians 1:8, NIV: "But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God's curse!"
Read the word and live.
God bless.
I grew up as an evangelical Protestant. It was an odd experience. I always believed in Jesus and wanted what was real. Wouldn’t you know it, by God’s grace I became Catholic. The Bible lead me to the Church. I figured out that the Eucharist had to be Jesus’ body and blood or Jesus was crazy. For many years I was able to remain Protestant because I said to myself at communion time what Jesus said. How your faith is, so it shall be unto you. As much as that was true, it didn’t make the evangelical symbolic Eucharist the body and blood of Jesus.
I am eternally grateful to our Lord for delivering me from true darkness by bringing me to the Catholic faith. Viva Christo Rey!
But your LOGO next to your name is still HIPPI- false hippie peace reverted cross- time to change it.
I was introduced to the charismatic when my Dad passed away 30 years ago. I was searching for peace and God. So I am thankful that I was able to find a charismatic community where my faith and love for God grew. I have developed a personal relationship with God and Jesus. I began to have prayer time, etc. As I listen to God in my prayers, as I grow older and deeper in my faith, the charismatic community seems lacking in something. To make the long story short, now I am longing to attend a Latin Mass which I haven’t done. I am now learning about living in the Divine Will and loves to read about the saints and mystics of the Holy Catholic Church. I am back to the tradition of the catholic church and I am now a devotee of our Blessed Mother. When I was in the charismatic movement, I was not close to the Blessed Mother but I believe God showed me the right way to Him.
I was involved in the Charismatic Renewal in the mid-80s to mid 90's. I will say it played a big role in the renewal of my faith. My experiences could not have been further from anything described in this homily. Today, I am much more orthodox in my Catholic practice but I do not regret the time I spent in the Charismatic renewal. I met many good, faithful Catholics and good priests, who remain good, faithful Catholics to this day.
absolutely.. my experience too.
In the 1980-90's the Catholic charismatic movement in USA were infected with heresies like sheperding movement and legalism. Thank God the magisterium had acts decisively, now we have better and healtier Catholic charismatic movement under the watchful guidance of local bishops, their priests, and episcopal conferences all around the world. The diocesan and national services committes are the result of such guidances by magisterium, preventing newer heresies creep in.
So what made you leave & become more traditional?
I’m a Protestant convert. When Christ sanctified me at baptism, I felt it the way you’d feel anything that is real. It was the realest thing that ever happened to me and it changed me. Made me whole.
I beliive in one Baptism for the forgiveness of sins, not weekly "baptisms in the spirit".
In Pentecostalism its like you have to prove you're part of their Cult every time you attend a new Church lol. Move towns and attend a new Church and the Pastor will give some sermon about the Prodigal Son calling you forward to repent of your sin and relay the foundations of your faith despite Paul telling us that equates to crucifying Christ again
It's not another baptism or another sacrament. What is called baptism in the Spirit is when a baptized/confirmed person asks to be filled with the Holy Spirit for a deeper conversion and for the receiving of the charismatic gifts. This is the grace of baptism and confirmation "renewed" or "deepened" or "experienced" or however you want to put it. Many people have not been properly disposed toward what they received objectively in baptism and confirmation. That is due to poor teaching, poor preaching, poor parenting, poor Christian communities, etc.
There are numerous examples in Scripture of people being filled with the Holy Spirit. It happened on Pentecost. It happened when people were baptized and anointed. It happened when people prophesied. It happened in prayer when people saw visions. It happened when people were inspired to preach. There is at least one example where they asked someone, "Didn't you receive the Holy Spirit when you were baptized?" and he didn't even know about the Spirit, so he was prayed over again and he received the Holy Spirit. That means something. It's not just words. The man was a believer but had not experienced the infilling of the Spirit. They fixed that by laying hands on him. Please read Acts and Corinthians as they have a lot of info on this topic.
Some of us need to call on the sacramental grace we received because we may not be fully converted or fully aware of what God can do and wants to do in us. It is unlikely that a person will receive the charismatic gifts if they are not aware and/or don't ask. And the best way to ask is in a place where people accept and practice these gifts. Everything that is available to the believer is not always known or easily grasped. A person has to be disposed toward receiving in order to manifest certain graces and gifts. The Christian life requires prayer, seeking, finding mentors, learning, discipleship, etc. You can't know or experience everything all at once. You have to learn from others.
It is the right of every Christian to be filled with the Holy Spirit. There is no reason at all, should God will it, that it cannot happen weekly, monthly, periodically, whatever, as needed. It is an experience of intimacy with God, and so it is a wonderful thing. It is a consolation. It's a renewal. It's a deepening of faith. For some it's the first time they have a conscious and participatory individual experience of God's love. Yes, it's the dreaded "personal experience."
People may not be aware that God wants them to experience such things or that it can be so instantaneous or rapid. Many of the saints had these experiences, but you don't need to spend 50 years in a cave praying 18 hours a day in order to be filled with the Spirit or to perhaps experience charismatic gifts. This is part of the package that is often overlooked simply due to the times that we live in and the paucity of good teaching and spiritual experience. It's not being taught or expected, so people are unaware, skeptical, afraid, and not knowledgeable about it.
Ideally, when an adult or young adult is confirmed, they have already been prepared extensively through the family and the parish/school/priests/bishop to receive the infilling of the Spirit and the expression of the gifts, but reality is much harder than the ideal. Now, we know from sacramental theology that baptism and confirmation, when performed validly, confer grace and "mark" the person. The person is sealed with the Holy Spirit, but may not experience this or understand it subjectively, internally, etc. it may not bear the fruit intended if good instruction and examples in Christian life are missing. That's okay because as Catholics we also know that our whole life is a conversion process and that we must become holy and draw nearer to God continually. The grace of baptism and confirmation is available to us at all times. But if people don't know this or if belief in it has been dormant all these years or simply grown cold, they can get stuck in a rut in the spiritual life which is just sort of having checked off the sacraments, not entering into the full experience of grace available. The Church teaches the same about the grace of Confession or Eucharist. A person rightly disposed, knowledgeable, expectant, asking, seeking, etc., can have profound rapid conversion and spiritual growth suddenly through receiving the sacraments like they never did before. The grace of sacraments we receive once such as baptism, confirmation, matrimony, hold orders, can be suddenly manifested in a person in a subjective way not experienced before because they were previously ignorant or ill disposed, or whatever.
This is what "baptism in the Spirit" is getting at. We ask God to renew or deepen or release or apply or tap into (all these terms are fine) those graces of Christian initiation by filling us now with the Holy Spirit in a conscious way because we are disposing ourselves now in a way we perhaps missed before. This is not anything new. A Christian, at any time, may seek God in a new, deeper, more conscious, more expectant way. Every time we do this, we could be in for a major change and major growth. But "baptism in the Spirit" specifically refers to the infilling of the Spirit we see in Scripture in the early Church and in the lives of the saints which results in a noticeable awakening, quickening, conversion - however you want to label it yourself - and also disposes one to receive the charismatic gifts.
The key to understanding this phenomenon of baptism in the Spirit is to pair the Church's sacramental theology with her teaching on free will and being disposed toward grace, actively cooperating with God in order to bear fruit. Also throw in the fact that we cannot be actively disposed toward and cooperating with what we are ignorant of, and you get the whole theological picture. Grace + knowledge + expectancy + disposition + seeking/asking + the proper milieu to allow something to happen = something happening. Often it's "Wow! Something happened!" Many of us did not have the profound experience of grace at confirmation and we don't remember our baptism. We grew up in homes that were perhaps quasi-Catholic and had sub-prime teachers, instructors, priests, bishops, and few if any living examples of Christian saints knowledgeable and experienced in the spiritual life. We did not expect to experience the infilling of the Spirit when we were anointed because we were not taught. But it's never too late to seek and ask for this.
If this is true then why have zero Saints written on this or why have no Church fathers taught this? The answer us because there was no such thing as "baptism in the spirit" or any of this Pentecostal movement until the 60's. It's heresy that stems from protestant influence and it should be ignored or ended.
The problem is the doctrines are so random, for example if you go to a fundamental baptist church or southern baptist church, you know what they are going to teach. If you walked into a Pentecostal church you could start flipping a coin on doctrines because they will be all over the place.
Pentecostal beliefs - one church says you must speak in tongues to be saved, another church says you don't need to speak in tongues to be saved, one says you must be water baptized to be saved, another says you don't need to be water baptized to be saved, one says you must celebrate Christmas and Easter with us, another says Christmas and Easter is pagan and we don't celebrate it. one says we have church on the Lord's day Sunday and then also on Wednesday, one says we have church on the Lord's day Saturday and then also on Tuesday. one has a monitor with a notebook checking out women's finger nails and toe nails for polish and if they find a tiny left over bit, proving you have been wearing it all along and trying to use remover to get it off before the church, your name is taken down in the notebook and reported and the pastor will see you after service, you will be reprimanded, and perhaps even a sermon dedicated to you next week when the preacher calls you out as a Hellbound child of Satan, other Pentecostal churches would never treat people that way. Some Pentecostal churches are against the poor and have a dress code of suits and ties, and we don't want people who wear jeans and hanes T-shirts because you are too poor and you have sinned against Exodus 3:5 which is the dress code (Iv'e seen churches use Exodus 3:5 take off thy shoes you're on Holy Ground and apply it to the church building as Holy Ground and the shoes as meaning the dress code, some churches of Christ do this) and again there are Pentecostals churches which would never throw people out for being poor or wearing a hanes pocket T-shirt.
So the doctrines differ dramatically from Pentecostal church to church.
And there are churches out there whose members will tell you go home, grab some rope, throw it over a tree limb and die you are reprobate garbage and God wants you dead, there are churches which in fact will tell you that if you do not agree with them. This is the reason while some people start out as believers and then become unbelievers because they say you people are crazy and I can't deal with this.
What kind of wackadoo "church" gets bent out of shape over nail polish? I'd flee that kind of church faster than you can spell cat.
I left church (since returned) after an encounter with charismatic catholics when I was 18..it left me in a turmoil when I couldn't "speak in tounges and rest in spirit"
It denies suffering and the cross we must all carry as he has ordered to attain Salvation
I still remember the day I said something similar about charismatic movement within the Church... I almost got lynched when I quoted a few lines from St John of the Cross.
Probably because you were using the same irrational smear tactics that this presenter was using. Marxists and anti-Catholic bigots use the same tactics. They cannot present a rational argument to save their lives. Don't imitate them.
@@MillionthUsername, noo. It's the Charismatics who are the anti-intellectual lynchmob with their fuzzy thinking, manipulation of words and bad temper. You only need to doubt them and they will lose it. I have a problem that most of the young Catholics I know are into Medjugorje and some youth meetings they frequented but which now have stopped were charismatic.
@@seriouscat2231 More ad hominem.
@@MillionthUsername, who cares? You are the biggest keyboard warrior here anyway.
Wow
Amem father, thank you for blessing sermon. God bless us all.
Mat 23:9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
This guy is not your father.
@@josejuan6585 1 Corinthians 4:14, NIV: "I am writing this not to shame you but to warn you as my dear children."
My Catholic Women’s Bible study has gone over to the Charismatic Movement. They seem to value emotionalism and it seems like a lot of ego to me. I sadly left the study after 24 years.
Anyone who doesn't acknowledge Matthew 16 18 Isaiah 22 19 the line of authority Jesus set up John 20 Jesus set up confession breathing on his apostles giving them his authority to forgive sins. John 6 51 55 Eucharist all sects I was a Baptist are protestants protest against Pope authority they are not in Church Jesus set up they don't obey all of Jesus commands Jesus says if you love me you will observe my commandments.
ella hope amen
I used to attend a charismatic parish... the priest and people mean well... but it's not for me. I think the saints had it right. I follow the traditional ways of the Church.
Prayer is communication with God. Going jibber-jabber-jibber isn't communication with God or anybody else. If you want a spiritual something that is beautiful and extraordinary, don't jibber-jabber-jibber---turn to our Good Lord and Savior Jesus Christ in the Holy Eucharist.
Praying in tongues is certainly prayer and therefore communication with God. speaking in tongues neither diminishes prayer or keeps one from the Eucharist. It leads to very deep communion with God. conversions are deep and lasting when people experience the working of the Spirit in their lives.
It’s gibberish uttered by prideful fools 😡
Mar 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
So apparently if you are a believer you WILL speak in tongues. If you don't speak in tongues you are not a believer.
Speaking in new tongues? How does the Church define speaking in tongues? It’s not made up gibberish. Besides it’s
@@praytherosaryforpeace1204 i agree... i think this whole "heavenly language" crap protestants came up with is a whole bunch of baloney. i used to go to a protestant church and the preacher would always start spouting gibberish while singing the christian pop music; recently I looked at the streams they have on youtube now and the preacher hasn't "spoken in tongues" once. Makes me wonder...
The Voice inflection kills me
Kinda plastic.
This is helpful to understand the charismatic movement. I accompanied a couple of Catholics to a charismatic conference years ago. Such things make me real uncomfortable because they seem so fake. The first day, the Priest and about 200 people were standing in a small school gym or lunchroom. He began speaking something, (assumed to be tongues) and walked among the people and they seemed to join in. As each one began uttering, he nodded, as if to say "yes, you got it." I didn't know much, but knew that one cannot learn to speak in tongues. I walked right out! It all seemed phony, and the next day, I tried to ignore things. I've of the people I was with said to me, "you are a charismatic because you've been Baptized." It creeped me out.
I was raised a Baptist, and had converted to the Catholic Church a few years before this incident.
I was creeped out because I don't think Baptism is for that. The charismatic movement, to me, misrepresented and abused the idea of spiritual gifts.
In my youth, someone took me to a charismatic meeting in a church and I was totally disturbed by it and left. Divine providence saved me from this deeply deceptive movement that so many Catholics are caught
Very interesting. Thanks for presentin St.John of the crosses words. I grew up in charismatic catholic circles (in a traditionally catholic country- I guess catholic charismatics are different here than in the US) It got me personally into the faith of my ancestors, and I learned to pray the rosary there. I also learned about the importance of
regular confession and even got a little FSSP catechism book. But we also sang loads of hillsong songs with texts that don't fit our catholic beliefs. I got recommended books by Joyce Meyer and other confused people, and they were very much into he whole Medjugorje movement. (which if not bad is at least very imprudent imo) It was just a very mixed bag. I am grateful that those people led me on the way of faith, but ultimately it was just to much emotional pressure for me. I was not feeling God's consolations and I was so dependend on feelings that my faith couldn't hold up in the face of temptation. So I left all together. It took me some time to understand that I can't deny that God is real. I am very grateful for the good model that my grandparents gave me. I think young people need knowledge about their faith and role models much more than experiences at youth conferences and "healing masses".
Thank you for posting this. Fr. Ripperberger (sp) which is very true. The holier God wants someone to be the more hellacious their life will become. How true that is. Sadly our relationship with God should not only be based on emotions and only love Him when He gives us things. It’s not until you get knocked down so far the ONLY way is up. As always free will helps you go either way. Get up and follow Him knowing you both love each other. Or stay down and be dragged down further. Btw (satan) loves when you stay with him. Don’t let him have that victory. In stead no matter how many times you fall let God help you up. Jesus taught us to persevere!!!! Let’s be like Him for better or worse. God Bless
Thank you for your reminder about Father Chad Ripperger’s word. I do tell my prayer friends, if your life keeps going smoothly then something is wrong. When obstacle comes, embrace it then you will recognize the love of God. I personally dislike the word “feel”.
@@tonyale749 this is why the apostles thanked and rejoiced when God would allow the suffering. I actually brings abt Go’s glory into view for others. People just like in the book of Job don’t understand a true deep deep down faith. I always pray for them to find it. It also says in Hebrews it think it’s in Hebrews. That God also disciplines those He loves. I’m glad you know this kind of faith sister. 🕊💜🕊
God bless
@@jellybelly7629 that is why when I suffer, people feel sorry for me. I told them, “no, God loves me!” They laughed, don’t think they believe me. Thank you to you sister.
@@tonyale749 at first I never understood how to love suffering until I went through it myself. It is a weird concept to get used to but once the Holy Spirit”explains “ it to you. It’s like your eyes start to open to a new kind of love for God. I don’t know if you have experienced dark night of the senses (oh the hurts) but the one that almost (killed my heart) is when He takes you through the dark night of the soul. There is a book written by St. John of the Cross . Very dry read but helped me through it. And of course my priest. If God starts this process for you know your not alone. It’s a level of purification not everyone gets. And not something you can “ask” for but suffering but a beautiful one. When I’m going through anything I always offer it up for the salvation of souls. God bless
@@jellybelly7629 right on. I lost my baby daughter through cancer. Very painful process but I am still here. Yes, God prepared me for that stage and worked with me ever since. Yes, I do understand God’s love and received so many graces that others don’t. I have become closer to God ever since she went with God. I pray more rosaries, went to more adorations, attend more masses. As long as we believe in him, he will show us how powerful he is. I surrender to him.
Dr. Ralph Martin wrote an article that is much more balanced that this, He wrote: "While not intending to write a balanced and comprehensive positive theology of the charismatic workings of the Spirit for the sake of
others John does deal with them in the Ascent III, chapters 30-32. In this Book of the Ascent John is dealing with how the will can become attached to genuine goods in a way that blocks progress to union with God. In these particular chapters he’s dealing with the reality of supernatural goods and how the will can become attached to them, the fifth of the six classes of goods he discusses. So even though his purpose in writing is to focus on possible dangers he does assume the reality and usefulness of the charismatic gifts of the Spirit (following the Thomistic terminology he calls them gratiae gratis datae) and specifically cites the charismatic gifts of 1 Cor. 12: 9-10 as the type of workings of the Spirit he’ll be discussing." (Ralph Martin, Charismatic and Contemplative: What Would John of the Cross Say?)
Follow Dr. St. John of the Cross 🎉❤
These are good points.
The music and consolations can become addictive, which is where the danger lies.
BRAVO!!! Perfect as it could be!
Thank you so much for putting this out to give words to what many of us thinking.
I have attended Pentecostal conference and it was the spookiest experience I’ve ever had. Baptized as Eastern Orthodox, I’ve been praying in Catholic Church for 3years yet haven’t converted. After leaving their HIGHER CONFERENCE I thanked God such thing never took a place in The Catholic Church I attend. Turns out even The Pope encourages such practices. You might think I don’t have Holy Spirit within me and that’s why I can’t see the truth Charismatics hold.. but I’ve been praying to God asking him to reveal the truth to me.. My feelings haven’t changed.. every time I remember what I saw there I break down and cry uncontrollably out of fear.. At this point I’ll go back to my roots which is Orthodoxy.. I don’t think any true Orthodox will let such thing take a place in CHURCH!! God bless.. all the best
You are absolutely correct! Orthodoxy is the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic faith once delivered to the Saints! This sort of thing would never, and will never occur in the Orthodox Church. "The Gates of Hell will not prevail..." God be with you!
Why do people still fall for this trash its like fast food gospel spiritually unhealthy and dwarfing a person walk
A very good and devout MD I know went to a Charismatic Catholic meeting and she said she felt the presence of the devil.
Could this movement be similar to what happens in "non-denominational (and i use this term loosely) churches?"
Thank you for this teaching /explanation Father!
Well said Father and God be praised. Amen!!
The best test for knowing which spirit is operating on a soul is by reciting the Hail Mary prayer, the beautiful prayer covering the salvation mystery succinctly. If one cannot (with his whole mind) say this prayer, he is nowhere near to the true Faith, which only leads to salvation.
Once there was this prayer meeting in one of my church parishioner's house. They were praying over me by pushing me so that I fall down. I did not want to fall down and hurt my head. I immediately took out my rosary whenever I saw them making people fall down. It was really scary. I then realised it was part of the Charismatic movement.
This was so good! I was cringing at my own guilt in seeking signs and wanting to "feel" special. In hindsight I invented miracles/signs in my head that I convinced myself were true. I had to laugh at myself and repent while watching this. Thanks for enlightening me!
good teaching. i have always been wary of this "speaking in tongues" and other manifestations. i like the teaching that by rejecting such emotionalism and possibly fake outpourings, then God, in His Divine Mercy, will take us even closer to Himself.
Being filled with the Spirit is not "emotionalism," nor a "fake outpouring." Speaking in tongues, along with the other charismatic gifts, are part of the heritage of Catholic spirituality from the beginning. There is no need to be afraid.
Go to any video of people speaking in “tongues” and turn on the captions. It’s pretty funny.
Speaking in 'Tongues' has nothing to do with the Charismatic MVMNT. SEE the real RC Church's teaching on the REAL Gift of Tongues . Perhaps Fr. Ripperger.
Thank you for this video and teaching on the teaching of St. John of the Cross concerning lying signs and wonders in the Catholic Church, a.k.a. the Catholic Charismatic Renewal. Thank you so much.
Read the Early Church Fathers protestants have there Bible from Catholic faith monks painstaking copied apostles letters. Protestants don't have whole scripture. 7 books are missing in Old Testament. Rosary is life of Jesus found in scripture. Jesus ten commandments his prophecies Mary prophecies Isaiah 7 14 Gen 3 15 Luke Rev 12 We do not worship Mary Gods commandment do not worship graven images God was speaking to Jews. There neighboring worshiped idols sacrifice children to them. Later on God told Jews make a Sherephim and Cherubim God instructs them how to make and where to put these heavenly Angels. Jesus God Almighty redeemed all Mankind a Statue of him to be honor so we recall how he suffered and dieded for us is no sin. The world has statues of presidents or important men like Martin Luther. Do you have pictures of your family? Do you worship them? Neither do I worship Mary the Mother of God she is honor. Saints Do you ask some one to pray for you? Have you read the transfiguration? Moses was speaking to Jesus. Jews pray for the dead today. Maccabees speaks of this. Men who lived before apostles Mary many more are in Heaven read Rev. they give our prays to God.
Your historic view of the Roman catholic church seems biased. As some priest will admit the truth if you know it and will also agree with you with your biased view on history as well. If you don't know any better.
Ticunda world her historic view of roman catholic church is not biased and never been biased..its the truth and thats your so called priest who admits they are not true catholic in faith. Its protestantism by faith and many priest nowadays are like that
ella hope
Well said ! Let's pray for our holy catholic church and the protestants, that they wake up and go back to the true blue holy catholic church.
Thank you for this teaching father, the more I hear you, the more I understand why we call our priests father.
This is so important
God Bless you Fr
Excellent presentation. I needed this, thank you.
Praise be to Jesus for this homily! Lord have mercy on us-lead and guide us to the path of righteousness and for the sake of your sorrowful passion have mercy on us; give us discernment that we may know what is true and holy.
A few years ago a friend of mine invited me to a "christian ceremony". I was not very convinced, but she was adamant and I didn't want to hurt her feelings so I went. At some point, they started to sing move as if they were on a trance or something. Suddenly, people just started mumbling -sounded like a baby learning to speak. The whole thing was awkward and uncomfortable . The next day she explained to me that they were all "speaking in tongues". 😳
Has anyone actually read the CCC on this ? Then you would see for yourselves that the charisms of the Holy Spirit the least of which speaking in tongues is indeed legitimate. Try CCC 2003 on for size.
I voluntarily went once with my dad. He likes to play music with his cousins but he is more traditional than them. He doesn’t really participate he just plays the guitar. Well the convention was being held at my old high school so I felt comfortable there but I did not like what they were doing. I chose to stay in the back to talk with my dad and cousins, when they weren’t playing, and not participate in anything. I just didn’t like what the priest was saying and how he was saying it. It looked so foreign to me and I didn’t feel like he was genuine about babbling with the Holy Spirit....none of them. I just left...
"Since the Second Vatican Council ..." That explains everything, doesn't it?
Vatican ll is as legitimate and protected by the Holy Spirit as are all the ecumenical councils of the Catholic Church. Or did Jesus abandon his Church? (See John 14 and 16).
@@alexchristopher221 but many interpretations of V2 documents are at least questionable..time will tell...Church likes Time, it gives many answers...
@@alexchristopher221, the events and the contents of Vatican II disagree with you. It both had some parts of the form of an actual council, but also officially rejected such authority, and then claimed a different kind of authority that is not possible within the historical Church. The texts are full of heresy and actually found a new religion that's not Catholic or even Christian. The Holy Spirit does not force anyone to listen or magically cause a good outcome to anything. The right question to ask is: Did the Church abandon Christ?
Let me speak of my own experience. Early in my conversion I was involved in charismatic prayer groups. in my first charismatic prayer group when i was "baptized in the Spirit" my immediate response was an eruption from my lips saying "Thank you Jesus" and was constantly lead to all things Catholic. Even things that I didn't realize until years later were traditional prayers. For example when coming into the presence of the Blessed Sacrament I, particularly at consecration, I felt prompted to say "my Lord and my God". I think it is unfair to throw out the baby with the bathwater. There are spiritual dangers (even Saint Paul warned against them) but it is equally dangerous to call the works of God the works of the Devil. More discernment would have been prudent before giving this homily in such a way.
+ThanksStJoseph I am not sure you have realized the gravity of the objection this priest makes. If this form of "spirituality" leads people to the Church, you should see almost all the Pentecostals and other Protestant movements that adopt this spirituality to be inside the Church. But we do not see that and to the contrary, we even see Protestants who just become more and more hostile to the Catholic faith and adopt errors. That is a death blow of an argument toward those who say this is a valid "spirituality". It is an utter failure of a spirituality because it cannot even get most people into the Catholic Church and seems to make them more stubborn in their own errors. This is what the priest points out and that alone is a death blow to any argument that anyone might want to propose as a defense of this spirituality as being nice and valid.
So if you were lead to the Catholic Church, it is incorrect to identify it with this spirituality. It simply does not follow given the evidence. If anything, the evidence suggests that God lead you to the Church despite the obstacle you had placed by entering the Charismatic movement.
Note that this is also without considering the works of St. John of the Cross that were cited in this video. In any case, your assertion that the priest hasn't discerned the issue enough is incorrect. In fact, given the abundant evidence of failure in regards to this spirituality, one does not really need a whole lot of time to figure out that this movement is not really from God.
Perhaps you would be surprised at how effectively Satan counterfeits God's grace and leads folk astray.
These are the hardest types of testimony's to deal with.
Absurd attempt at argument. Completely batty and illogical. You are claiming that since PROTESTANT Pentecostalism/Charismatic movements do not lead PROTESTANTS to the CATHOLIC Church, then that means that the CATHOLIC charismatic movement is not a "valid spirituality"? What a joke. This is like saying that Bible reading among Protestants doesn't lead them to the Church, therefore Bible reading must not be valid. Or substitute any other thing Protestants do/think/believe which they do because they are in some sense Christian that Catholics also do/think/believe in a similar way. Does that make it invalid? Because it's not leading them to the Church? Well, they gather together to pray. We do that. They baptize. We do that. They fast. We do that. So now, according to your faux argument, we should not pray, fast, baptize, or gather together, as we have proven that these things are invalid since they don't lead Protestants to become Catholics! You are engaged in the silliest of fallacies. I'm sure there's a name for it too. Look it up. Guilt-by-association, probably fits. Perhaps poisoning-the-well. I guess it's arguable the exact type of logical fallacy you are using, but in any event it's embarrassingly stupid.
I guarantee that the charismatic renewal has led more people to the Church than you can count. I am one of them. I have known certainly hundreds of people for whom this is true. I have been around thousands whom I did not know personally, and it's a safe bet that it's true for them as well. I have only become a stronger Catholic since. In my mind, dozens of people come to mind right away who are writers, preachers, ministers, apologists, priests, etc. They're all fiercely Catholic and constantly defend and explain the Faith to others and are involved in all sorts of work for the Church.
You people keep mentioning St John of the Cross and you try to falsely insinuate that he somehow rejected the charismatic gifts. I read him - a long time ago - and I don't recall any such thing. You are certainly twisting whatever cautions he may have relayed about testing visions and other spiritual manifestations or whatever into something completely different - which seems to be your aim here - that is, to either deny the gifts and the infilling of the Holy Spirit, or to impugn those who, like the Church herself, accept these gifts and practices and phenomena as genuinely coming from God. No one says that nothing should be tested, so you cannot claim that you are only offering sound advice or something. Clearly you people are not doing anything that benign. You are engaged in what seems to be a fully conscious effort of maligning and demonizing people for something completely innocent, orthodox, accepted, normal, etc.
No one is forcing you to adopt a specifically charismatic spirituality. No one is telling you that you must speak in tongues or anything like that. You people are engaging in gratuitous and mindless attacks for no good reason at all. You are causing division and leading people to erroneous conclusions with no basis in fact. This presentation and this comment section are highly irrational and prejudicial, adopting smear tactics and employing self-congratulatory, self-righteous rhetoric while accusing others falsely. You are also on the verge of some very serious sin when you claim, insinuate, imply that the good things of God are "not of God."
I will quote you: "In fact, given the abundant evidence of failure in regards to this spirituality, one does not really need a whole lot of time to figure out that this movement is not really from God."
This is crazy talk. What "abundant evidence of failure"??? You are rambling on, illogically, about how Protestants do not become Catholics. What the hell does that have to do with the charisms or Catholics being filled with the Spirit? Nothing.
It boggles my mind how people like you completely ignore a person's testimony and their whole life as if it doesn't matter. This makes you just like the rabid anti-Catholic bigots who also do nothing be smear, lie, and present the most ludicrous attempts at "argument." Perhaps you do not understand this, but this is another area where you are on the verge of very serious sin. You're telling me and others that what we have known and experienced of God is "not of God," that our testimony about God is "not of God." If this comes from Catholic-haters, that's one thing, but the fact that you people claim to be Catholic is especially disconcerting. This is colossal hubris married to gross ignorance at best. At the worst, it's a deliberate attempt to deny the works of God, to harm innocent souls, falsely accusing them of trafficking with the devil, or perhaps being so spiritually negligent or congenitally impaired that they cannot tell the difference between God working in them, the devil working in them, or their own flesh working on them. All of these cockeyed pronouncements or insinuations are lies and calumnies. They are insulting and degrading to the people making them as well as the people they are aimed at. They evidence a complete lack of charity and knowledge of God.
ThanksStJoseph please accept the fullness of the Catholic Faith
In Pentecostalism its like you have to prove you're part of their Cult every time you attend a new Church lol. Move towns and attend a new Church and the Pastor will give some sermon about the Prodigal Son calling you forward to repent of your sin and relay the foundations of your faith despite Paul telling us that equates to crucifying Christ again. Regardless they will shun you like a Heathen unless you go forth and be saved in their eyes lol
Uh, no. Totally wrong.
Thank you for this!
Believing in Jesus & His TEACHINGS is the 1st STEP towards "KNOWING" Jesus in your HEART..."Trust in The Lord your God" and His spirit will flow in you "KNOWINGLY"...No need for public manifestations and showmanship but "KNOW" the Lord in the quiet of your room AND Feel His Presence...To "KNOW" Him is to LOVE Him and the very same LOVE will flow from you to others SEEKING to "KNOW" Him...That is The Spirit of God...you will "KNOW" when you experience the PRESENCE of The Spirit around you and WITHIN you!!! Amen
I fully agree with the speaker here.
"We should flee from Pentacostalism... it is filled with dangers of the worst kind, namely, the diabolical"
Well said.
Amen!
The Charismatic Movement sounds as if it is by pride
Someone reach out to me, to know more about the CCR. What I said was exactly the opposite.. You would just see poor people in our groups. That's why Lord is our Only richness, because we don't have much wise, powerfull or brilliant people. He has great mercy with the poor and the sinners.
In fact, He wants us to be able to discern the signs of our time. Jesus never did any miracles just for entertainment, but everyone was astounded with him, not just healings but all kind of miracles. The Holy Spirit gave Him all the gifts, and Jesus himself gave the apostles the gift of healing and power over spirits. And they clearly serve our Holy Father with them.
Fr. uses quite the inflection in his tone of voice, so without even listening to his words you know how he feels about this subject. I would love to sit down & speak with him about the renewal. I do agree with the majority of what he says. Although there are exceptions but the dangers are there!
The information he relays is so important. Awesome content and im grateful for it! That said, if I used that tone of voice in relaying life giving content to my kids they couldn't receive it. There is a sing-song condescending tone that he uses that is so distracting. Heartbreaking to maybe lose listeners due to that.
I listen to Fr Ripperger and I agree with most things he says. But not all of it. 'Cessationism' (the doctrine that spiritual gifts such as speaking in tongues, prophecy and healing ceased with the Apostolic Age) is a heresy. 'And these signs shall follow them that believe: In my name they shall cast out devils. They shall speak with new tongues...They shall lay their hand upon the sick: and they shall recover. (Mark 16:17-18). If anything, the issue is why Catholics are not using charismatic gifts in a world brainwashed by modernism and science so that that the ones away from God might believe. So, I'd make a clear distinction between the Charismatic movement within the Catholic Church and the Pentecostals in the Protestant churches. I'm also in favour of the Latin mass, but I've noticed that those who are obsessed by it, it's because the way they make them feel aka this is the true original mass, anything less won't cut it. On another note, I've also noticed that those who reject approved private revelations and the apparitions of Our Lady in Lourdes, La Salette, Fatima, Akita etc., both priests and lay people, it's because they either lack faith or they're scared of any talk of the current evil state of the world and the concept that God is going to chastise the world if humanity does not repent. Fortunately, Fr Ripperger is well aware of it.
So GOOD to hear the truth!!!
Please pray for me and for my godmother Diane and for all of our families and friends and neighbors...for conversion and holiness and healing...
although very insightful I do wonder what about those apparitions of the Blessed Virgin Mary. I get it although they are good which is a way of delivering the right message but should we dismiss these things or keep them in the back of our head or acknowledge them and pray about it? kind of contradicting. just need clarification.
LISTEN, re tongues; if you don't understand whats coming out of your mouth then why say it??
Praying for charismatic gifts will invariably lead you to receive them...unknown source can be the devil. Praying for things like tongues and prophecy is ultimately for one's OWN glory and felt experience, rather than that of God. Which is why the Devil gets ahold of so many who pray for "gifts" like this.
Right!
When I returned to Catholicism, I attended a bible study/prayer meeting. I heard that the Charismatic Movement BEGAN at 2 Catholic Universities. I've since learned that is not really correct. Pentacostalism already existed, and Patty Mansfield had admitted that they were given a bible and a Protestant paperback, The Cross and the Switchblade. So even the Catholic experience had Protestant beginnings.
What do you mean? That is not true. Do you know when the Protestant reformation took place? Do you know the Catholic Church came about? Obviously no. Please retrace your steps by going back to history and you will have your answer. I would have given you the answers but I believe you need to do just that so as to enrich your faith further as you unmask the beauty and mystery of our faith. Catholicism is just so amazing. Once you start digging into history, you shall never stop. Like I always say. We will never exhaust the Truths of the Catholic faith even unto death coz there is just too much to cover hence we shall know everything once we cross on the other side, to our Eternal destination. Dig in! You will love the ride into history and beyond. Amen
I do understand what is being said here. Never meaning to talk bad about a Priest but I also come and had my conversion through the Carismatic movement in the diócesis of Stockton. I do see the dangers in receiving gifts like speaking in tongues, and in receding gifts of healing and other gifts that ARE TRULY given by GOD. Pride can build. You have to constantly stay discerning and cleaning yourself out and letting God keep using you as a channel. God bless the CATHOLIC CHURCH, we have fallen in love with the Eucharist and Mother Mary.
"Personal felt experience" sounds very similar to the spiritual consolations mentioned in Ignatius's rules of discernment. Do you have a video condemning spiritual consolation?
My experience in the charismatic group, a.k.a. prayer group, was a show of who is the most endowed, in one hour of a meeting. I confess openly and already to a priest, that during those days I felt worthless that The Holy Spirit did not pour His graces upon me. Then it moved to envy of those who spike in tongues.
I am so thankful to God that The Holy Spirit, through the Immaculate Heart of Mary enlightened me to refuse to go.
Yes I felt entitled. I am so sorry Lord. You have mercifully forgiven me.
May this help others like me. Praise be to God.
*attends Extraordinary Form and Charismatic adoration*
*recognizes they are both beautiful and fruitful parts of the life of the Church*
*doesn’t try to act like they are mutually exclusive*
Now, I will say, in the area of the Liturgy, the Charismatic Movement has no place. It’s unfitting, it’s disrespectful to our Lord as we unite ourselves to His Passion, and makes it harder for us to recognize the Mass is our union to Calvary.
I don’t think, though, that adoration must be absolutely a solemn experience. Silence is absolutely important, don’t get me wrong, there is great fruit to it, but there is also great fruit to Charismatic adoration. Are there dangers? Well, yeah, but there’s always dangers in the life of prayer. This is in no way way specific to Charismatic Adoration.
As someone who has spent about 3 years debating with myself on whether or not Charismatic adoration and the likes are appropriate, this is the conclusion I have drawn. I was once fully against the idea, but I do believe now that that is a useless fear. I am not some ‘youth group kid’ or something who doesn’t know any better; this is the conclusion I have drawn on the matter.
Excellent point on the necessity of balance in adoration! It's an argument I've long made at the Catholic college where I work, and from which I graduated. It's sadly fallen on deaf ears. Silence is the lynchpin; without it, everything falls apart. I like that the truly Catholic songs for adoration are capable of leading one more deeply into prayer, but I've always held that beyond a certain point, they actually become distracting. Up to that point, which is admittedly abstract and not quantifiable, I'm fine with tastefully sung hymns and songs in adoration. This, by the way, comes from a Trad. I serve the Latin Mass regularly still, and I absolutely love it.
Nicely put. Similar experience here
I left the Baptist faith to go to the charasmatic movement. Praise the Lord, I went right back to the Baptist Faith. I found that sound doctrine, however dry it may seem to many, is far more precious and important than feeling and enthusiasm
My sister told of a Holy Spirit revival at a parish near her house. Upon hearing this I got a bad feeling in my stomach like this doesn't sound right. They had an exorcist there and fainting rooms.
We all want to experience Gods presence but desiring experiences over trusting God is where all manner of unbiblical and blashemous practises enter into the church.
The first real decision as a Christian I had to make was between oneness Pentecostals and trinitarian baptists. I needed baptized, I knew I needed baptized, but which way to go. I was directed towards the trinitarian baptism, which was my first step towards the Catholic Church. Literally the last place on earth I ever thought the Holy Spirit would lead me. Gods funny that way.
I’ve heard many Pentecostals end up at the Catholic Church, for exorcisms.
what is the faithful catholic position to take, regarding life teen International?